View Full Version : UK Politics Thread
Jimbuna
11-12-18, 06:50 AM
Yea I was watching the news and noted you could have done better than that Jezzer.
He also wore the smallest poppy possible.
Jimbuna
11-12-18, 06:50 AM
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46170530
Lots of flapping in the wind, are we in for a roller coaster week or was it all fake news. :hmmm:
Fake news.
Negotiations over the UK's departure from the EU are "now in the endgame", Theresa May says.
Addressing the Lord Mayor's Banquet in the City of London, the prime minister said the talks were "immensely difficult", but the sides were working "through the night" to make progress.
"This will not be an agreement at any cost," the PM added.
She is under pressure from both sides of the EU debate as she tries to seal a deal in time for Brexit in March.
Both sides want to schedule a special summit of EU leaders at the end of November to sign off the withdrawal deal, but time is running out.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46188790
Listening to the radio today and the general public is fast loosing faith in our politicians and the EU's over this brexit mess. I lost faith years ago in this shame lot.
60,000 sign Sky News petition to make TV election debates happenhttps://news.sky.com/story/50000-sign-sky-news-petition-to-make-tv-election-debates-happen-11510556
Not moving very fast, I have seen petitions reaching that mark in day weeks and a couple of months but this one is so slow. This tells me people are not that interested and the whole thing will probably be rejected by the petition committee.
I am against it, leaders debates are a total wast of time and money. :yep:
Jimbuna
11-13-18, 06:39 AM
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46188790
Listening to the radio today and the general public is fast loosing faith in our politicians and the EU's over this brexit mess. I lost faith years ago in this shame lot.
I wasn't aware the public ever had all that much faith in them to begin with.
Jimbuna
11-13-18, 06:40 AM
https://news.sky.com/story/50000-sign-sky-news-petition-to-make-tv-election-debates-happen-11510556
Not moving very fast, I have seen petitions reaching that mark in day weeks and a couple of months but this one is so slow. This tells me people are not that interested and the whole thing will probably be rejected by the petition committee.
I am against it, leaders debates are a total wast of time and money. :yep:
It should be left to the leaders and their parties to decide.
I wasn't aware the public ever had all that much faith in them to begin with.
True, due to the Brexit mess it has gone down to a new low.
Jimbuna
11-13-18, 06:46 AM
Boris Johnson is calling on his former cabinet colleagues to stage a mutiny over Theresa May's Brexit plan - but he admits "it will make little difference".
Writing in The Daily Telegraph, Mr Johnson says the PM is "on the verge of total surrender" to Brussels and her proposals are "a recipe for continued strife".
https://news.sky.com/story/boris-johnson-theresa-may-on-verge-of-total-surrender-to-brussels-11552147
I actually agree with him for once.
Jimbuna
11-13-18, 06:48 AM
Wages rose at the fastest pace in nearly a decade in the three months to September, Office for National Statistics (ONS) figures show.
Compared with a year earlier, wages excluding bonuses, rose by 3.2% - the biggest rise since the end of 2008 and up slightly on the previous quarter.
However, the ONS warned that real wage growth was below the 2015 level.
The unemployment total went up for the first time this year, rising by 21,000 in the same period to 1.38 million.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46193571
Wages are rising but so is unemployment.
I actually agree with him for once.
Don't you mean a second time or is it a third? :hmmm:
I am not reading this thread to find out how many. :haha:
Boris using his noodle for a change. :03:
Wages are rising but so is unemployment.
And the valve of the pound drops.
https://www.lloydsbankinggroup.com/Media/Press-Releases/2014/lloyds-bank/value-of-the-pound-in-your-pocket-declines-by-over-90-since-1973/
Value of the pound in your pocket declines by over 90% since 1973
06 March 2014
£1 million in 1973 would provide same spending power as £10.5 million today
A pint of milk has increased by 667% in 40 years
£100 in 2053 could be the equivalent of £311 today
Jimbuna
11-13-18, 07:42 AM
Don't you mean a second time or is it a third? :hmmm:
I am not reading this thread to find out how many. :haha:
Boris using his noodle for a change. :03:
Go on, you know it makes sense.
Jimbuna
11-13-18, 07:43 AM
And the valve of the pound drops.
https://www.lloydsbankinggroup.com/Media/Press-Releases/2014/lloyds-bank/value-of-the-pound-in-your-pocket-declines-by-over-90-since-1973/
Where's the valve in a pound then? :hmmm:
Pot noodles were half price in ASDA yesterday :yeah:
Go on, you know it makes sense.
:haha: :haha: :DL
Jimbuna
11-13-18, 10:47 AM
A "small number of outstanding issues" stand in the way of a Brexit agreement, Downing Street has said after Theresa May updated her cabinet on the talks.
There remains "optimism on both sides", government sources have said, as negotiations continue in Brussels.
But Trade Secretary Liam Fox told the BBC "difficult discussions" were still going on about the Irish border issue.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46188790
All should be revealed shortly....shouldn't it? :hmmm:
PANIC!
Premier Foods has said it intends to stockpile raw materials in the run-up to Brexit as fears grow over gridlock at UK ports.
The firm, which owns Bisto, Oxo and Mr Kipling, said it was taking steps "in the absence of certainty over the arrangements for the UK's departure from the EU".https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46191729
https://s.faketrumptweet.com/jofxiw6z_6po88r_uep1e2.png
Jimbuna
11-13-18, 11:07 AM
Didn't see one pot noodle in that basket.
Jimbuna
11-13-18, 01:11 PM
UK and EU officials have agreed the draft text of a Brexit agreement in a significant breakthrough for the talks.
A cabinet source told the BBC that the document has been agreed at a technical level by officials from both sides after intensive talks this week.
Leading Brexiteers, such as Boris Johnson and Jacob Rees-Mogg, have urged the cabinet to reject the draft agreement - which includes commitments over citizens' rights after Brexit, a proposed 21-month transition period after the UK's departure on 29 March 2019 and details of the so-called £39bn "divorce bill".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46188790
Having watched the news breaking on tv less than an hour ago I thought both Jacob and Boris, yes Boris gave stirling responses on live tv and I'm with them on their stances.
May's days could be numbered.
https://media.makeameme.org/created/maystay-has-sold.jpg
Jimbuna
11-13-18, 02:20 PM
Boris Johnson branded the Brexit deal, which has been “agreed at a technical level” as “utterly unacceptable”. The former Foreign Secretary, who was responding to reports of what the deal might include, added the deal would not be the “right way forward”. He told BBC News: “We have to be pretty careful, but, this has been well-trailed, this has been a chronicle of a death foretold for some months now.
“I think effectively this is pretty much what Olly Robbins and Sabine agreed a few weeks back anyway.
“We are going to stay in the customs union on this deal, we are going to stay effectively in large parts of the single market, and that is vassal state stuff.
“For the first time in a thousand years, this place, this Parliament will not have a say over the laws that govern this country.
“It is a quite incredible state of affairs, it will mean that we are having to accept rules and regulations from Brussels over which we have no say ourselves.
“It is utterly unacceptable to anyone who believes in democracy, it is not the right way forward.”
He demanded that Cabinet ministers resign TONIGHT over the Brexit deal before May has even presented to them, calling for ministers to get tough on May.
Sky News correspondent Kate McCann wrote on Twitter: “Boris Johnson tells me he wants to see Cabinet resignations tonight over Brexit deal. Calls for them to get tough - now is the time.”
Boris Johnson, who resigned over the Prime Minister's Chequers plan, also told the BBC the UK has not been able to protect the “precious union” with the proposed deal.
He added: “I don’t see how you can support it from a democratic point of view. I don’t see how a Unionist can support it. And I don’t see how you can support it if you believe in the political-economic freedom of this country.”
Mr Johnsson also claimed the deal was "making a nonsense of Brexit so I hope the Cabinet will do the right thing and I hope they chuck it out".
https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1044897/Brexit-news-deal-UK-EU-Theresa-May-Boris-Johnson-BBC
Catfish
11-13-18, 02:24 PM
If only Mr Johnson would have been at the helm, all this time :hmmm:
Jimbuna
11-13-18, 02:27 PM
If only Mr Johnson would have been at the helm, all this time :hmmm:
Well I'm certainly no fan of his but he's certainly coming to the fore now that the chips are down.
I'm sticking with my original prediction that a last minute deal will be struck but I'm certainly not in favour of the present deal on offer should the current predictions prove accurate.
Catfish
11-13-18, 02:44 PM
What is the current deal then. I have no idea. The problem is Ireland, since day one. I have the impression that the problem is brexit itself, not the negotiators. You cannot sit around a blue lake and talk it into being green.
Jimbuna
11-13-18, 02:47 PM
The current deal is pure speculation atm but if what Johnson and Mogg are stating turns out to be correct then it will place the UK in a worse position than she is currently in and that in itself would be undemocratic and totally unnaceptable.
WELCOME TO STEED'S CRYSTAL BALL PREDICTIONS FOR THE NEXT 24 HOURS.
PM May will not stand down or be pushed to go.
Not one cabinet minister will step down
PM May will get it though the HoC.
:)
What is the current deal then.
Don't know yet but what is known its 500 pages long.
I am sick and tired of Boris Mog and all the rest bleating like sheep and not getting off their fat arses doing something about it.
Typical politicians strutting around like peacocks on the media stage.
Catfish
11-13-18, 03:58 PM
So no one knows how or what the deal is, but the deal is bad, because .. what? Because Johnson says it? I am trying very hard not to get more cynical, or sarcastic.
It does not matter whether soft or hard brexit, that England and the whole UK will be bader off trade-wise than before is not exactly rocket science.
On behalf of Catfish
OH SHUT UP!
:03: :) :haha:
Skybird
11-13-18, 06:11 PM
I still cannot imagine a solution to the Irish question acceptable to the EU that would not be at the cost of the UK, and I still cannot imagine a solution acceptable to the UK being agreed to by the EU.
If now the EU did agree to this deal, it means it must be messy for the UK.
I expect to learn the deal hollows out the very idea of Brexit. And maybe that was the plan from all beginning on, I never trusted May. I expect to learn that the UK is worse off than before with this.
In other words: I expect to learn that it all is just a ridiculous farce whose authors try to get away with it. And that the EU is the big victor in this.
I expected more drive and resolve from Britain when all this started over one and a half years ago. Apparently I overestimated it. Well: I learn the lesson.
Most likely there is a wishy-washy wording on Ireland and a temporary solution but with open ends that silently will simply be handled like becoming a final solution. Same business than before, just with the UK having lost even more influence and rights. If the people let Mayget away with this, than they indeed deserve nothing better than this. Storming Downing Street and burning it down in self defence, sounds more legitimate every second.
Catfish
11-14-18, 03:09 AM
^ since you care so much for "individuality" and the "suppressed", may i remind that Ireland was against a brexit, as was Scotland.
I can't see the EU to be the "victor" without England or the UK taking part in international trade decisions of the EU, when it comes to advice, negotiating and common sense.
@Steed :haha: ok
Skybird
11-14-18, 03:59 AM
Different to some other examples, the Northern Irish also voted for staying with the UK. At least Jim said so - if you remember, I asked him on right this just a week ago or so. Must be in this thread. Look it up.
When they say they do not want to separate from the UK, why should the Northern Irish people have the right to overrule the referendum'S majoirty for Brexit?
If the Irish say they want to separate, they have my support (like I also said before about the Scottish), I only insist that they carry their own burden and do not let their bills paid by us.
No people or govrnment has the right to enforce its rule on another people that does not want to be governed by them. Not the Spaniard and Catalonia. Not the Brits and Scotland, Norther Ireland. (Not the Bavarians/Lower Saxons/etc etc, and Germany). Such a right can never be a right since it is a most serious violation of natural human rights. It means owning people, and that is called slavery.
Catfish
11-14-18, 04:13 AM
^?
Different to some other examples, the Northern Irish also voted for staying with the UKNorthern Ireland: Remain in EU 55,8 percent; leave 44,2 percent.
https://www.bbc.com/news/politics/eu_referendum/results
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/sep/21/northern-ireland-peoples-vote-brexit
"England will not agree to any deal which results in Northern Ireland being treated differently from the rest of the United Kingdom."
I wonder how Mr Johnson would solve this. My take is he cannot, and he does not want to. Insult and smear and criticize, and run away when responsibility calls. Leave the mess you yourself created to others, and then criticize them again when they try to make the best of it.
Even if they called your bluff, and lies. God-awful.
Jimbuna
11-14-18, 06:13 AM
WELCOME TO STEED'S CRYSTAL BALL PREDICTIONS FOR THE NEXT 24 HOURS.
PM May will not stand down or be pushed to go.
Not one cabinet minister will step down
PM May will get it though the HoC.
:)
A high chance of being wrong on all three.
Jimbuna
11-14-18, 06:15 AM
I am sick and tired of Boris Mog and all the rest bleating like sheep and not getting off their fat arses doing something about it.
Typical politicians strutting around like peacocks on the media stage.
Oh but they will....like voting against the deal in the HoC.
Jimbuna
11-14-18, 06:16 AM
So no one knows how or what the deal is, but the deal is bad, because .. what? Because Johnson says it? I am trying very hard not to get more cynical, or sarcastic.
It does not matter whether soft or hard brexit, that England and the whole UK will be bader off trade-wise than before is not exactly rocket science.
Agreed but so will the EU.
A no deal is not good for anyone.
Jimbuna
11-14-18, 06:55 AM
Brussels will “retain all the controls” over swathes of British regulation under the Brexit deal struck by Theresa May, EU negotiators have told member states.
A leaked diplomatic note from a meeting between Commission officials and ambassadors from the EU’s 27 countries reveals how Brussels views the “level playing field” rules signed up to by the prime minister.
“We should be in the best negotiation position for the future relationship. This requires the customs union as the basis of the future relationship,” deputy chief negotiator Sabine Weyand said, according to the note seen by The Times newspaper.
“They must align their rules but the EU will retain all the controls. They apply the same rules. UK wants a lot more from future relationship, so EU retains its leverage.”
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/eu-says-it-%E2%80%98will-retain-all-control%E2%80%99-under-theresa-may%E2%80%99s-brexit-deal-leaked-note-shows/ar-BBPH1cm?li=BBoPWjQ&ocid=mailsignout
Most worrying if true and hopefully the death knell for May.
WELCOME TO STEED'S CRYSTAL BALL PREDICTIONS FOR THE NEXT 24 HOURS.
PM May will not stand down or be pushed to go.
Not one cabinet minister will step down
PM May will get it though the HoC.
:)
A high chance of being wrong on all three.
Looking good on my first point and no ministers depart by 7:50pm then that will be two out of three. We will have to wait for my third one.
I see no angry faces on the Tory front bench but I do see them on Labour's front bench.
Jimbuna
11-14-18, 07:15 AM
Wait for the Cabinet meeting this afternoon and let us see if and how many resignations there are.
Most importantly, if she loses another Brexit Secretary (Raab) that will probably make her position untenable.
HEY A TORY GAVE MAYSTAY A VERBAL PUNCH IN PMQ'S! :o
Wait for the Cabinet meeting this afternoon and let us see if and how many resignations there are.
Most importantly, if she loses another Brexit Secretary (Raab) that will probably make her position untenable.
It has to be big beast(s) not the shrimps. :03:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zp6SwvJak2Y
Time to bring back this classic. :)
Jimbuna
11-14-18, 07:26 AM
I see no angry faces on the Tory front bench but I do see them on Labour's front bench.
Says the man who claims not to have a tv :doh:
Says the man who claims not to have a tv :doh:
SkyNews on the Internet you sexy old sod. :haha:
Jimbuna
11-14-18, 07:41 AM
SkyNews on the Internet you sexy old sod. :haha:
https://i.imgur.com/k9Sc0h9.gif
Jimbuna
11-14-18, 08:55 AM
Just five or so minutes away from the Cabinet meeting at 1400 GMT and I'll predict at least two resignations but couldn't say who.
https://us.123rf.com/450wm/andrewgenn/andrewgenn1609/andrewgenn160900063/62636132-b-w-illustration-of-a-starter-looking-at-his-stopwatch-and-about-to-shoot-gun-to-start-race-.jpg?ver=6
BANG
Here we go..:)
Skybird
11-14-18, 11:19 AM
^?
Northern Ireland: Remain in EU 55,8 percent; leave 44,2 percent.
https://www.bbc.com/news/politics/eu_referendum/results
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/sep/21/northern-ireland-peoples-vote-brexit
"England will not agree to any deal which results in Northern Ireland being treated differently from the rest of the United Kingdom."
I wonder how Mr Johnson would solve this. My take is he cannot, and he does not want to. Insult and smear and criticize, and run away when responsibility calls. Leave the mess you yourself created to others, and then criticize them again when they try to make the best of it.
Even if they called your bluff, and lies. God-awful.
They cannot have both, staying with the UK and staying with the EU.
Catfish
11-14-18, 12:12 PM
They cannot have both, staying with the UK and staying with the EU.
Did anyone tell them? :hmmm:
"Wenn das der Führer wüsste."
Skybird
11-14-18, 02:37 PM
I'm getting a feeling that May is realising that she is toast. Think this "deal" :har: will not pass, not in HoC, and probably not in cabinet as well. My expectations are currently shifting fast towards snap elections.
They explained some details of it on main news his evening. The Brits would have lost all their marbles if accepting this. As a German commentator put it 20 minutes ago in the Tagesschau: "The EU left the British with only this choice: either a future very close to the EU, or an exit with chaos." And as I said from all beginning on: this was always all the EU ever was about. No mutual success, but either EU domination: or punishment of the UK. You do not turn your back on the wonderful EU without getting retaliated against, for revenge. Hurt narcissism and all that. Roots very deep in human psyche.
From a British point of view as I would define it, this "deal" :haha: is absolutely unacceptable.
Finally, time to let go all illusions. This was forseeable.
Skybird
11-14-18, 02:39 PM
And wile I wrote the above, news come sin the cabinet passed it. And not a single resignation (today). I am surprised.
I am still absolutely sceptical about the HoC tomorrow.
I wonder how much personal career preservation was behind the ministers' decision as their motive.
Skybird
11-14-18, 02:43 PM
And correction again: now the news says "several" ministers plan their resignation in protest. (Johnson Little already did earlier last week).
Bleiente
11-14-18, 02:46 PM
And wile I wrote the above, news come sin the cabinet passed it. And not a single resignation (today). I am surprised.
That's because they do not read your comments and instructions. :03:
:har:
Skybird
11-14-18, 02:54 PM
The House probably does. ;)
Skybird
11-14-18, 04:53 PM
Reuters and Sky News report that "up to 10" ministers voted against the "deal":rotfl2: and may retreat in the near future. The cabinet has 20 ministers.
10 of 20. Victory looks different, imo.
Forget my third prediction that was a long shot if it took place today. So I was right, PM May is still here and not one cabinet minister stepped down.
So the PM got it though with the cabinet and its reported around 10 of them very upset.
So the next 24 hours will be the big test, will those letters go in calling for May to go? Will any heavy weight cabinet ministers resign? That aside it looks like the deal is going to fail getting passed and no doubt Labour will call for a general election.
https://storify.com/services/proxy/2/DVTizXj9XJNR-aDdLIVfUw/https/storify.com/services/proxy/2/qIvaax9t-TuFT6gu9yWmgQ/https/storify.com/services/proxy/2/F2CoWpJ2k5cPqVwesMlVOg/https/d2kmm3vx031a1h.cloudfront.net/C8AGaO9TI1iWTdPBPRQj_Metro.JPG
DUP leader makes May aware of concerns in a 'frank' meetinghttps://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-eu-nireland/dup-leader-makes-may-aware-of-concerns-in-a-frank-meeting-idUKKCN1NJ36O
I would say there is 75% chance they will not vote for it.
No jim...:hmmm:
Jim must have hit the bottle. :03:
Jim will be back tomorrow posting his farewell as he sets out for Mexico. :)
CRUNCH DAY FOR MAY
The news so far..
Brexit Secretary Dominic Raab has resigned
Work and Pensions Secretary Esther McVey has also quit
Earlier, Junior Northern Ireland minister, Shailesh Vara, resigned in protest at the deal
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-politics-46200010
Raab is the first big beast to go!
McVey light weight minister but a damming resignation letter!
Penny Mordaunt could be next but she is lightweight minister.
It will take the home and foreign office ministers to cause damage.
Smart money is on staying in the EU once May fails to get it though the HoC.
Anne-Marie Trevelyan has quit as a parliamentary private secretary...
Jimbuna
11-15-18, 06:09 AM
Forget my third prediction that was a long shot if it took place today. So I was right, PM May is still here and not one cabinet minister stepped down.
So the PM got it though with the cabinet and its reported around 10 of them very upset.
So the next 24 hours will be the big test, will those letters go in calling for May to go? Will any heavy weight cabinet ministers resign? That aside it looks like the deal is going to fail getting passed and no doubt Labour will call for a general election.
https://storify.com/services/proxy/2/DVTizXj9XJNR-aDdLIVfUw/https/storify.com/services/proxy/2/qIvaax9t-TuFT6gu9yWmgQ/https/storify.com/services/proxy/2/F2CoWpJ2k5cPqVwesMlVOg/https/d2kmm3vx031a1h.cloudfront.net/C8AGaO9TI1iWTdPBPRQj_Metro.JPG
One of my main concerns is that this situation could well be paving an easy route into No10 for Jeremy.
Jimbuna
11-15-18, 06:13 AM
Brexit Secretary Dominic Raab has resigned
Work and Pensions Secretary Esther McVey has also quit
Earlier, Junior Northern Ireland minister, Shailesh Vara, resigned in protest at the deal
Chequers all over again but this time easily predictable.
Jimbuna
11-15-18, 06:19 AM
Thus far the sad sorry mess is not surprising when you consider May was always a remainer but one thought not mentioned on here yet.......what if there are enough Labour rebels prepared to vote for this deal.....remember, Corbyn has always been anti EU and as matters stand, May is doing a fine job at giving him the public support he would need to get into power.
Bearing in mind May said "No deal is better than a bad deal" then adding a third option of No Brexit right at the death, perhaps it is time she was ousted and renegotiations were commenced and failing that, a no deal Brexit would be the obvious outcome? :hmmm:
Labour is to focus on pushing for a general election than giving a hoot about us the voters what we want and that is no we do not want one. I do not believe May will go down the no deal road if she fails to push her plan. I would not be surprised in the end we stay in the EU as the voters are sick of it all now.
Brexit minister Suella Braverman resigns, another lightweight.
Sterling has fallen sharply after Cabinet ministers Dominic Raab and Esther McVey quit over Prime Minister Theresa May's draft Brexit deal.
The pound fell more than 1% against the dollar to $1.2798 and dropped more than 1% against the euro to €1.1313.https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46219038
The Casino is open place your bets.
Jimbuna
11-15-18, 06:55 AM
Labour is to focus on pushing for a general election than giving a hoot about us the voters what we want and that is no we do not want one. I do not believe May will go down the no deal road if she fails to push her plan. I would not be surprised in the end we stay in the EU as the voters are sick of it all now.
Brexit minister Suella Braverman resigns, another lightweight.
All these lightweights eventually add up to a heavyweight.
Jimbuna
11-15-18, 06:57 AM
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46219038
The Casino is open place your bets.
Hence investing in fixed interest rate bonds :smug:
Jimbuna
11-15-18, 07:50 AM
Ashen-faced European diplomats haunt the corridors of Brussels. No rest for them until Sunday 25 November - the day of the "seal the deal" Brexit summit between Theresa May and EU leaders.
So what do they have to do between now and then?
Diplomats from the 27 EU countries must now pore over 585 pages of the draft Brexit withdrawal agreement with lawyers to ensure all will be to each government's liking.
If a problem is identified, it will need to be transmitted to the team of Michel Barnier, the EU's chief Brexit negotiator, as early as this Friday or Saturday.
The 27 member states (and Theresa May) also still have to agree what should be in the political declaration on the future EU-UK relationship.
This part of the divorce treaty is not legally binding - but it is symbolically important. At the moment the text is solely made up of a series of bullet points and headings. So the pressure is definitely on, leading up to the 25th.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-46216853
Looks like an interesting week and a half ahead on both sides of the Channel then.
May is....
https://i1.wp.com/www.mancreview.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/keep-flogging-a-dead-horse-2.png
WHY IS SHE SAYING WE ARE LEAVING THE EU IN FULL?
No one is buying that. :damn:
Jimbuna
11-15-18, 08:18 AM
Jacob Rees-Mogg hints at May no confidence letter to the 1922 Committee.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w9ULAJAI16I
Jimbuna
11-15-18, 08:20 AM
WHY IS SHE SAYING WE ARE LEAVING THE EU IN FULL?
No one is buying that. :damn:
Only the party faithful and I suspect they are decreasing in numbers with each passing hour.
BREAKING NEWS
Mog writes the letter of no confidence
Corrected
That is my media career over....Lets go down the pub.
Jimbuna
11-15-18, 08:26 AM
CONVENIENCES :haha:
Mog looks cool. You got to give it to him he is cool headed but will he throw his hat in the ring if the leadership challenge is on?
If this happens Labour will go all out for a general election.
Skybird
11-15-18, 08:49 AM
It gets reported over here, referencing to Press Association, that Rees-Mogg indeed goes after May's head.
I seem to recall his name from earlier this year. They said he is a hope of the coservative, the coming new leader of the consevatives. And he is very pro-Brexit.
And yes Steed, its difficult to imagine how a man can look any more British than he does. :)
Jimbuna
11-15-18, 08:56 AM
I'm wondering if May knew she was on a mission impossible and thereby accepted the fist odeal offered.
The referendum saw off Cameron and she is nowhere near as capable.
I'm wondering if May knew she was on a mission impossible and thereby accepted the fist odeal offered.
The referendum saw off Cameron and she is nowhere near as capable.
Just a short sighted power hungry do it my way ding dong.
WORST PM TO DATE! :yep:
If she survives this then we are stuck with her.
Catfish
11-15-18, 09:02 AM
It gets reported over here, referencing to Press Association, that Rees-Mogg indeed goes after May's head. [...].
A living fossil, sure to bring England forward. God help you. :o
Jimbuna
11-15-18, 09:07 AM
A living fossil, sure to bring England forward. God help you. :o
Totally agree....a step back into the previous century :yep:
I think Mog has ruled himself out the running. Speaking of running as in jogging where is Boris?
Jimbuna
11-15-18, 09:26 AM
It's not so much a case of where is who? but more a case of who is prepared to take a sip from the poison challice?
REUTERS -
Breaking News:
Rehman Chishti says he is quitting as vice chairman of the Conservative Party
More to follow.
BREAKING NEWS
PM May to hold press conferance today at 5pm UK time.
BREAKING NEWS
Gove wants to renegotiate Brexit - Telegraph reporterhttps://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-eu-gove/gove-wants-to-renegotiate-brexit-telegraph-reporter-idUKKCN1NK27P
BREAKING NEWS
Sky sources: Michael Gove has been offered job of Brexit secretary but says his price for doing it is to re-negotiate the deal
LONDON (Reuters) - Money markets no longer expect the Bank of England to hike interest rates in 2019, as investors slashed their bets on monetary tightening after Dominic Raab resigned on Thursday as Britain’s Brexit minister. https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-boe/boe-rate-hike-in-2019-now-unlikely-money-markets-suggest-idUKKCN1NK146
Bet MayFluff will keep pushing record number in employment even as the pound goes down bills go up.
Jimbuna
11-15-18, 11:03 AM
More to follow.
Of that I have no doubt.
I am handing over to jim now as I need a coffee break. :haha:
Back at 5 for MayFluff.
Jimbuna
11-15-18, 11:09 AM
I am handing over to jim now as I need a coffee break. :haha:
Back at 5 for MayFluff.
Don't bother I'm too busy dealing with messages of concern regarding multiple posting frequency, better known as spam :06:
^Now now that is not productive to say that about the highest poster of all time. :03:
Well MayFluff has spoken and is determine to go down in denial.
Looks like she lives another day so we will have to see what Friday holds. I feel we have seen all the action for now and wait for the vote.
Jimbuna
11-15-18, 05:39 PM
Looks like she lives another day so we will have to see what Friday holds. I feel we have seen all the action for now and wait for the vote.
Agreed, I'll PM you tomorrow. Time for one or three wet ones.
Jimbuna
11-16-18, 06:32 AM
Michael Gove has ended speculation about whether he would follow fellow Brexiteers out of the cabinet in protest at Theresa May's Brexit deal.
The environment secretary won't be quitting because he wants to work with colleagues to "ensure the best outcome for the country," a source said.
Mr Gove reportedly rejected an offer to make him Brexit secretary after Dominic Raab's exit.
The PM has said her Brexit agreement is "truly the best deal for Britain".
The BBC understands Mr Gove said he would only accept the job of Brexit Secretary if he could try to make changes to the negotiated deal - something Mrs May and EU leaders have made clear is not possible.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46230281
I don't trust this guy, he is the 'stalking horse' and one of the possible replacements to May.
Fancy a read here you go..
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/withdrawal-agreement-explainer-and-technical-explanatory-note-on-articles-6-8-on-the-northern-ireland-protocol
I don't trust this guy, he is the 'stalking horse' and one of the possible replacements to May.
I believe he was the first to be knocked out last time and I suspect hes not going to do that again.
Jimbuna
11-17-18, 06:17 AM
Amber Rudd back in cabinet as work and pensions secretary
The Return of the Jedi.
Stephen Barclay appointed Brexit sec...
Nothing other than a front man...we all now know who gas been carrying out all the negotiations.
Skybird
11-17-18, 08:56 AM
It seems that five ministers try to blackmail May to change the Backstop rules, threatening to step down if she fails to see these changes implemented.
Considering that the existing Backstop rule draft puts the UK helplessly at the mercy of the EU - what an insane position to agree to! - , I think according changes indeed are a must.
I also reject the idea of the EU beign the legal instance that oversees it. When the UK has left the EU, it is no EU member, but the court is a body exclusively responsible for internal issues of the eU that arise by problems with or over the EU laws and EU treaties regulating relatiosn and cooperations betwene emeber states. How this court could claim to also wanting to administrate EU non-members, always has been beyond me. After Brexit, EU institutions have no say on UK policies anymore, period. And Northern Ireland then is no EU member, but for the time being a member of the UK (as long as they do not separate).
Finally, what does it tell us abut the durability and fundament of the peace agreement of the Irish factions if they cannot maintain peace due to a customs border again with the Republic of Ireland? I woudol conclude from that that tribalis still is th edomiant feelign then, and the peace sooner or later would have ended anyway.
Some Irish groups and their stubborn history-fixiated mentality indeed have to finally adress their attitude of mutual provokations with marching season and all that primitive boasting and posing and flouncing around like cocks watching their hens. Its so hilarious. And so much fallen out of time. Appeasing all that just by spending them money is no lasting fundament for a lasting peace at all. The change must be in the hearts and minds, not just in the wallets. As long as they do not understand that, as long I will refuse to take them any serious, or even just as adults.
Jimbuna
11-17-18, 09:56 AM
Those five ministers, Michael Gove, Liam Fox, Andrea Leadsom, Chris Grayling and Penny Mordaunt have more chance of getting bit on the bum off a cabbage than persuading May to conced any ground.
I sincerely hope I am wrong though.
Skybird
11-17-18, 10:33 AM
So let her run aground. Who cares for her anyway. I still cannot see that this deal in this shape it is in passes the House. Its a "Chaosbude", yes, but if mathematics do not betray me...
Jimbuna
11-17-18, 10:46 AM
https://i.imgur.com/cfud2sA.jpg
I hear some guy up North has sent May a letter calling for her to step down due to price rise on King pot noodles. :hmmm:
Not me I'm in the deep south. :)
Jimbuna
11-19-18, 01:44 PM
Brexit withdrawal agreement - what it all means.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-46237012
Brexit withdrawal agreement - what it all means.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-46237012
The UK will need to abide by all EU rules, but will lose membership of its institutions.
Boris would say....GET STUFFED!
Work and Pensions Secretary Amber Rudd has agreed to listen "very carefully" to concerns over universal credit, conceding the system "can be better".https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46265558
And this is the women who fluffed up at the Home Office, don't hold your breath people.
The DUP has failed to back the government on a number of amendments to its Finance Bill. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-46269685
The begin of making it hard for May. :hmmm:
ExFishermanBob
11-20-18, 04:32 AM
Some Irish groups and their stubborn history-fixiated mentality indeed have to finally adress their attitude of mutual provokations with marching season and all that primitive boasting and posing and flouncing around like cocks watching their hens. Its so hilarious. And so much fallen out of time. Appeasing all that just by spending them money is no lasting fundament for a lasting peace at all. The change must be in the hearts and minds, not just in the wallets. As long as they do not understand that, as long I will refuse to take them any serious, or even just as adults.
Amusing it is not.
I suggest you have a read:
Northern Ireland for Beginners and English Cabinet Ministers (http://blogs.lse.ac.uk/politicsandpolicy/northern-ireland-for-english-cabinet-ministers-and-other-beginners/)
Catfish
11-20-18, 06:01 AM
I like the final paragraph, though it is of course only a summary of the well presented "rest":
"The case for ‘special status’ for Northern Ireland rests on the reality that Northern Ireland is, and always was, different.
Those who argue that giving Northern Ireland special status would strengthen the case of the Scots who want their own special status and a closer relationship with the EU, need to explain why Scotland should not have that right.
Scotland, like Northern Ireland, voted to Remain. Brexit is an English obsession.
Those who wish to maintain the existence of the UK state would be better advised allowing for and facilitating the real differences that exist between the UK’s component parts than in trying to force an Anglo-centric uniformity on everybody else.
Of course, it would help if they knew just a little bit more about Scotland and Northern Ireland. Here’s a clue: Finchley is in England, not in Northern Ireland or Scotland."
Ahem lol :yep:
Jimbuna
11-20-18, 06:08 AM
Who has written no confidence letters against Theresa May?
Here is a list of MPs who have publicly said they have submitted letters:
1 Andrea Jenkyns, MP for Morley and Outwood, confirmed to Sunday Politics Yorkshire back in July that she had sent a letter.
2 Andrew Bridgen, MP for North West Leicestershire, submitted his five days later, saying the EU negotiations had "deteriorated into a state of complete capitulation"
3 Philip Davies, MP for Shipley, joined the letter writers of July, telling his constituents the Chequers plan was unacceptable, adding: "It is with much sadness that I have to say that I also lost trust in her to deliver the referendum result"
4 James Duddridge, MP for Rochford and Southend East, submitted his letter at the start of October, saying the Conservatives needed a leader that believes in Brexit and that "blind loyalty" was not the way forward.
5 Anne Marie Morris, MP for Newton Abbot, told Newsnight she had written her letter on Wednesday.
6 Laurence Robertson, MP for Tewkesbury, became the first of a long list to confirm his letter on Thursday, announcing it on BBC Radio Gloucestershire.
7 Jacob Rees-Mogg, MP for North East Somerset and head of the influential European Research Group of Brexiteer Tories, was next with his letter.
8 Nadine Dorries, MP for Mid Bedfordshire, confirmed she had submitted her letter but said on Twitter she had done so "some weeks ago"
9 Simon Clarke, MP for Middlesbrough South and East Cleveland, confirmed he had sent a letter after a meeting of the European Research Group on Thursday.
10 Steve Baker, MP Wycombe and former Brexit minister, confirmed to BBC sources his letter was in on Thursday.
11 Henry Smith, MP for Crawley, confirmed his no confidence letter on Thursday in a separate letter to the prime minister.
12 Maria Caulfield, MP for Lewes, told the BBC on Thursday that she had sent her letter the previous evening.
13 Sheryll Murray, MP for South East Cornwall, tweeted her letter on Thursday, saying her decision was due to fishing policy and the Northern Ireland backstop.
14 Lee Rowley, MP for North East Derbyshire, told ITV on Thursday he could not accept the Brexit deal and had submitted a letter.
15 Martin Vickers, MP for Cleethorpes, told the Bristol Post on Thursday that he had submitted letter when Chequers first was produced earlier this year.
16 Peter Bone, MP for Wellingborough, told Newsnight on Thursday that he had sent in a letter.
17 Adam Holloway, MP for Gravesend, posted a picture on his Facebook account on Thursday saying the country needed leadership.
18 Mark Francois, MP for Rayleigh and Wickford, said to BBC News he will submit his letter "in the next 24 hours" - he confirmed he had on Friday.
19 John Whittingdale, MP for Maldon, confirmed to Nick Ferrari on LBC on Friday morning that he had submitted his letter.
20 Ben Bradley, MP for Mansfield, confirmed to BBC sources on Friday that he had sent his letter in October.
21 Chris Green, MP for Bolton West and Atherton, tweeted he had written his letter on Friday, citing his displeasure over the deal.
22 Marcus Fysh, MP for Yeovil, is also reported to have submitted a letter, saying on Twitter the "deal the PM has proposed is not in the national interest and cannot be regarded as leaving the EU".
23 Zac Goldsmith, MP for Richmond Park and North Kingston and former London mayor candidate, has submitted a letter of no confidence in Theresa May, writing in the Daily Telegraph that the PM "won't change course".
24 David Jones, MP for Clwyd West and a former Brexit minister, is widely reported to have submitted a letter and is on Conservativehome's list of those calling for Mrs May to go.
25 Sir Bill Cash, Conservative MP for Stone and veteran Eurosceptic, told BBC Radio Stoke the current deal doesn't fulfil promises.
26 Philip Hollobone, Conservative MP for Kettering, told BBC Radio Northampton that he sent a letter in on the day David Davis resigned, four months ago.
Skybird
11-20-18, 06:30 AM
From ExFishermanBob'S link:
"Another important part of the Agreement deals with the key constitutional issue. Northern Ireland remains a part of the UK for as long as a majority so desires. Should that seem to have changed, a referendum will be held to give the people the choice between remaining in the UK or joining a united Ireland. Northern Ireland is thus conditionally part of the UK."
However, the big inherent self-contradiction:
"The Agreement also created North/South institutions connecting Northern Ireland and the Republic (the North/South Ministerial Council) and linking the Republic and the UK (the British-Irish Council). Such institutions obviously blur the distinction between the UK and the Republic as much as they do the border between Northern Ireland and the Republic. The core of the Agreement was thus a blurring of all sorts of borders. It represents a form of post-Westphalian sovereignty in which the distinction between being an Irish or British citizen, whether within Northern Ireland or within these islands, was more symbolic than of any practical significance."
You cannot eat the cake and keep it. You cannot stand on both sides of a line. You cannot stay and wanting to leave at the same time.
It seems a majority of the Northern Irish want to stay within the UK, And that another majority wants no Brexit. But inside the UK, the Irish no-Brexit voters were a minority only.
They have to chose what now they want. Staying with the UK, leaving to be an independent actor inside the EU, or going together with the Republic (if the latter agrees to that)? If I were the Republic, I would check the fiscal numbers of Northern Ireland very very carefully. Lessons learned from german reunification. Be careful of what you want.
Justb arguing that one wants to stay in the UK but that no brexit should be there, that is demanding that the UK- wid ereferendu majority should obey the will of the referendum minority.
And letting votings and referendums be repeated as often as neede duntil somesobdy gets the outcome he wants, is no good idea, but an eroding of the principle idea behind having majority decisions.
If the Irish want to separate from the UK, I'm fine with that. I only insist that they can pay for their"independence" then by themselves, and can economically maintain themselves. The other nations around must not want to come up for their deficits and costs.
I say the same about the scots. I say the same about the Catalonians. And I give neither London nor Madrid any right to claim that they can rule about people aganst their will if these peopel do not voluntarily subordinate temselves to such a ruling. Becasue that then would be one people claiming the right to possess and own another people. We call that slavery, and imperialism.
-----
The Gibraltar issue is cooking up again. The spaniards threaten to veto any Brexit agreement on behalf of the EU. The majority of people living in Gibraltar want to stay ith the UK. Madrid once again has absolutely no case here. I find this authoritarian and nationalistic posing of Madrid ove rCatalonia and Gibraltar increasingly annoying. If I were them, I would instead voluntarily give up Spanish claim for the Northafrican enclave at Ceuta. Its a wide open flank regarding migration. Spain better should withdraw behind the street of Gbraltar to use this waterway as a natural defence line.
Skybird
11-20-18, 06:33 AM
Who has written no confidence letters against Theresa May?
Here is a list of MPs who have publicly said they have submitted letters:
1 Andrea Jenkyns, MP for Morley and Outwood, confirmed to Sunday Politics Yorkshire back in July that she had sent a letter.
2 Andrew Bridgen, MP for North West Leicestershire, submitted his five days later, saying the EU negotiations had "deteriorated into a state of complete capitulation"
3 Philip Davies, MP for Shipley, joined the letter writers of July, telling his constituents the Chequers plan was unacceptable, adding: "It is with much sadness that I have to say that I also lost trust in her to deliver the referendum result"
4 James Duddridge, MP for Rochford and Southend East, submitted his letter at the start of October, saying the Conservatives needed a leader that believes in Brexit and that "blind loyalty" was not the way forward.
5 Anne Marie Morris, MP for Newton Abbot, told Newsnight she had written her letter on Wednesday.
6 Laurence Robertson, MP for Tewkesbury, became the first of a long list to confirm his letter on Thursday, announcing it on BBC Radio Gloucestershire.
7 Jacob Rees-Mogg, MP for North East Somerset and head of the influential European Research Group of Brexiteer Tories, was next with his letter.
8 Nadine Dorries, MP for Mid Bedfordshire, confirmed she had submitted her letter but said on Twitter she had done so "some weeks ago"
9 Simon Clarke, MP for Middlesbrough South and East Cleveland, confirmed he had sent a letter after a meeting of the European Research Group on Thursday.
10 Steve Baker, MP Wycombe and former Brexit minister, confirmed to BBC sources his letter was in on Thursday.
11 Henry Smith, MP for Crawley, confirmed his no confidence letter on Thursday in a separate letter to the prime minister.
12 Maria Caulfield, MP for Lewes, told the BBC on Thursday that she had sent her letter the previous evening.
13 Sheryll Murray, MP for South East Cornwall, tweeted her letter on Thursday, saying her decision was due to fishing policy and the Northern Ireland backstop.
14 Lee Rowley, MP for North East Derbyshire, told ITV on Thursday he could not accept the Brexit deal and had submitted a letter.
15 Martin Vickers, MP for Cleethorpes, told the Bristol Post on Thursday that he had submitted letter when Chequers first was produced earlier this year.
16 Peter Bone, MP for Wellingborough, told Newsnight on Thursday that he had sent in a letter.
17 Adam Holloway, MP for Gravesend, posted a picture on his Facebook account on Thursday saying the country needed leadership.
18 Mark Francois, MP for Rayleigh and Wickford, said to BBC News he will submit his letter "in the next 24 hours" - he confirmed he had on Friday.
19 John Whittingdale, MP for Maldon, confirmed to Nick Ferrari on LBC on Friday morning that he had submitted his letter.
20 Ben Bradley, MP for Mansfield, confirmed to BBC sources on Friday that he had sent his letter in October.
21 Chris Green, MP for Bolton West and Atherton, tweeted he had written his letter on Friday, citing his displeasure over the deal.
22 Marcus Fysh, MP for Yeovil, is also reported to have submitted a letter, saying on Twitter the "deal the PM has proposed is not in the national interest and cannot be regarded as leaving the EU".
23 Zac Goldsmith, MP for Richmond Park and North Kingston and former London mayor candidate, has submitted a letter of no confidence in Theresa May, writing in the Daily Telegraph that the PM "won't change course".
24 David Jones, MP for Clwyd West and a former Brexit minister, is widely reported to have submitted a letter and is on Conservativehome's list of those calling for Mrs May to go.
25 Sir Bill Cash, Conservative MP for Stone and veteran Eurosceptic, told BBC Radio Stoke the current deal doesn't fulfil promises.
26 Philip Hollobone, Conservative MP for Kettering, told BBC Radio Northampton that he sent a letter in on the day David Davis resigned, four months ago.
22 still missing? 48 needed, yes? I wonder why that is so? I thought the rebellion would be more powerful by now?
Jimbuna
11-20-18, 10:48 AM
Me too but the real battle will commence if as expected, a commons vote rejects the deal and Brexit gets called off.
I hear Spain has rejected the brexit deal. Well that's a rap....:hmmm:
Jezzer is getting ready for his move to No.10 as the Tory's rip themselves apart and the DUP look like calling it a day.
Jimbuna
11-21-18, 07:13 AM
Stumbling blocks remain over UK access to the EU single market, access to UK waters for EU boats and Gibraltar.
A group of MPs have been reprimanded for playing football in the chamber of the House of Commons.https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-46289456
Well done ladies best thing for that dumb dumb shouting shop. :)
The government borrowed far more than analysts expected in October, the first figures to be published since Philip Hammond's Budget last month show.
The deficit rose to £8.8bn from £7.2bn last year, marking the biggest October figure for three years, and well above the £6.1bn forecast.https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46287887
Looks like spend spend is back in town maybe. Nov/Dec figures will be interesting to see if it goes back down or up.
Theresa May's support agreement with the Democratic Unionist Party (DUP) to keep her minority government in power is not dead, Arlene Foster has said.https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-politics-46296659
Hope or more money only time will tell.
Jimbuna
11-22-18, 07:03 AM
The EU and UK have agreed a draft agreement on their future relationship, paving the way for a Brexit deal to be finalised this weekend.
The political declaration - outlining how trade, security and other issues will work - has been "agreed in principle", the European Council says.
London and Brussels have already agreed the draft terms of the UK's exit from the EU on 29 March 2019.
Theresa May will make a statement to MPs later on Thursday.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46300247
I still don't see Brexit getting passed by Parliament and even more worrying is the fact that the PM is now making mention of a non Brexit.
Skybird
11-22-18, 07:59 AM
The EU court shall continue to oversee EU laws. But the point of Brexit is that in principle EU laws shall no longer apply to the UK. Why this effort then to have the EU court involved? It sole role is to monitor issues regardig EU-internal laws and adminstration conflicts. Its an internal club gremium, no international (beyond EU) gremium.
I think since long that May always has seen it as her task to prevent Brexit while doing it in a way that she gets away with this ignorration of the referendum. She was against Brexit before the rferendum, right? And over night she changed from Paul to Saul? Tomorrow morning I will wake up and suddenly be a millionaire!
The Brexit process shall be torpedoed - I think this has been the hidden agenda from all beginning on.
Catfish
11-22-18, 09:07 AM
^ That is strange, as far as i know brexit was mostly for 'patriotic reasons', aka border control.
"The prime minister has a better grasp of political reality than either the hard Brexiters or Tory remainers. Theresa May’s Brexit deal is almost exactly what the UK voted for."
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/nov/19/theresa-may-brexit-deal-political-reality
If the deal will be cancelled by the UK parliament.. i still propose that Johnson, Farage and Bannon make the hard brexit. Then it is at least clear who has been responsible all the time, for the following mess.
Skybird
11-22-18, 09:54 AM
Exit means exit. Leave. End. Escape. Letout. There is no alternative meaning of the term. A bit of exiting and a bit of staying, no. Exit means exit. You're either in, or out.
Anyhow, I still cannot see how May gets this through the House.
P.S. I just read Der Spiegel. They write about the 26 pages draft: "Anyone who reads the paper might think that the British wanted to join the Union instead of leaving it." :har:
No, May never was the right figure to see Brexit through. She has been the infiltrator that sneaked in to prevent it. And all her manouvering is only meant to help her getting away with it.
Jimbuna
11-22-18, 10:29 AM
I think since long that May always has seen it as her task to prevent Brexit while doing it in a way that she gets away with this ignorration of the referendum. She was against Brexit before the rferendum, right? And over night she changed from Paul to Saul?
The Brexit process shall be torpedoed - I think this has been the hidden agenda from all beginning on.
No, May never was the right figure to see Brexit through. She has been the infiltrator that sneaked in to prevent it. And all her manouvering is only meant to help her getting away with it.
Good points and those I have a tendancy to agree with but should they become reality then that will be the end of May and the Tory party for years to come. Then heaven forbid, enter Corbyn and the loony left.
Either way the UK would be no more.
May lusted for power and nothing more, clearly she was the better candidate but not for Brexit as she has been exposed for meddling when Davis stepped down a few months ago. The whole thing is a bloody mess thanks to May and her...ITS MY WAY OR THE HIGHWAY.
Career politicians are the worst politicians as they just don't care.
Bleiente
11-22-18, 02:49 PM
So the EU says Germany and France are heading, GB is like Rome just "history". :03:
Skybird
11-22-18, 03:09 PM
So the EU says Germany and France are heading, GB is like Rome just "history". :03:
??
Not certain I understood what you mean here, but if you think the UK and the decline of Rome compare, I would recommend to you to read this
https://www.amazon.de/Auf-dem-Weg-ins-Imperium/dp/3944305450/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1542917134&sr=1-1
to understand that a comparison of the Roman change from Republic to Empire and the contemporary EU either turning into an autocratic empire as well or degenerating even further into a cultural trifle busy with self-deconstruction and intellectual self-perversion, is the far more appropriate comparison. The parallels are stunning. The perverting of cultural key values back then as well as today, for similiar reasons, is stunning as well. And desillusionising. We endlessly relativise and accuse oruselves, until we have no more underatabndign for who we are and why we should even want to defend out identity.
But the others who are our opponents and all too often our rivals and even enemies, do not suffer from this chronified degenerative process, and know damn well who they are and where the tolerance end and why they want what has been ours which we now have decided to no longer defend. It needs not much imagination how this confrontation must necessarily end, and it will be no good end for Europe any way.
I compare the EU to the Titanic. Arrogance claims it is unsinkable. Incompetent decisions on the bridge lead it into the self-destroying event, at too high speed. Inappropriate design of the rudders prevent greater flexibility and manouverability to repair the fatal deicisons. Absence of friends prevent rescue operations in time. But the ship band plays until the end. And the end will be a civil war between the rich and poor passengers, and riots at the too few rescue boats, before most people just jump into the dark cold water.
Heil Merkel im moralgetränkten Siegerkranze! She has maximised the German vulnerabilities and dependencies, and has done essential construction work and preparation for the EU turning into an empire, necessarily, in a last bid to escape the maelstrom that it has created all by itself.
Friedrich August Hayek: "Few are ready to recognize that the rise of fascism and Nazism was not a reaction against the socialist trends of the preceding period but a necessary outcome of those tendencies." And: "It is indeed probable that more harm and misery have been caused by men determined to use coercion to stamp out a moral evil than by men intent on doing evil."
Jimbuna
11-23-18, 06:19 AM
Theresa May is to appeal to the public to back the UK's proposed Brexit deal as Spain demands last-minute changes on future decisions over Gibraltar.
The PM will take to the airwaves to make the case for the agreement, which is opposed by Labour and many Tory MPs.
The terms of withdrawal and declaration on future relations are expected to be signed off by member states on Sunday.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46312909
Sounds like an act of desperation to me. I'd like to see this whole mess over with asap before she gives anything else away, presuming of course there is anything else left.
Catfish
11-23-18, 06:53 AM
Apart from May, does England have a negotiating position? :hmmm:
Jimbuna
11-23-18, 08:14 AM
It wouldn't appear so but the threat of rejection by Parliament and a no Brexit will probably bring someone out of the woodwork.
I wonder which rock Boris is hiding under? :hmmm:
Sounds like an act of desperation to me. I'd like to see this whole mess over with asap before she gives anything else away, presuming of course there is anything else left.
Well you do have a model aircraft collection. :)
UKIP leader Gerard Batten has defended his decision to hire Tommy Robinson as an adviser and says he had saved the party "from oblivion".https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46308160
What a load of crap!
UKIP will be flooded by right wing loons driving away normal people. Batten is the biggest dumb ass leader of UKIP to date. :doh:
Jimbuna
11-24-18, 08:49 AM
Quickest way to turn everything toxic.
Boris is back, that is too say he's in NI giving a speech right now at the DUP conference.
Talking big but as norm no action.
Skybird
11-24-18, 10:01 AM
Talking big but as norm no action.
Sometime I wonder whether politicians when they were kids took course at school in doing so. They practice this skill so masterfully and naturally.
-----
I wonder what May has sold away this time to appease the Spaniards?
Sometime I wonder whether politicians when they were kids took course at school in doing so. They practice this skill so masterfully and naturally.
-----
I wonder what May has sold away this time to appease the Spaniards?
100% :up:
BREAKING NEWS
Good news from Spain they are now OK.
Jimbuna
11-24-18, 11:07 AM
Not a bad speech actually but is it too late in the day?
Catfish
11-24-18, 02:28 PM
A speech, the evening before the final decision.
Had he done that before, someone could have demanded some action in time from him. This "courage" comes at no charge.
On the other hand, Johnson seeing someone like Trump rule a country.. "If this rambling boob can run the country, why shouldn’t I?"
Deeply democratic :O:
And now...
Nigel Farage bids to topple UKIP leader Gerard Batten over Tommy Robinson role
The former UKIP leader is calling for a vote of no confidence in Gerard Batten after his appointment of the far-right figure.
https://news.sky.com/story/tommy-robinson-becomes-adviser-to-ukip-leader-gerard-batten-11560682
Well if UKIP has more loony right wingers then you have no chance Nigel. You and the rest should leave and let UKIP die in its stupid agenda.
Jimbuna
11-25-18, 06:06 AM
A speech, the evening before the final decision.
Had he done that before, someone could have demanded some action in time from him. This "courage" comes at no charge.
On the other hand, Johnson seeing someone like Trump rule a country.. "If this rambling boob can run the country, why shouldn’t I?"
Deeply democratic :O:
Could well be true :yep:
The first part of the surrender process has been agreed.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-46334649
Only Parliament can save us now and I have little confidence in them.
If this is a such a great day why is PM May writing a open letter to everyone asking to back her and this deal? :hmmm:
Jimbuna
11-25-18, 06:44 AM
Desparation!!
Desparation!! That had crossed my mind.
Hope their is a reply option as I would say...Time to use traitors gate again and take you to the tower.
Two years ago when leave won the vote I did not jump up and down with joy I became worried that we would be sold down the river and that day has become true. Some of my mates called me a pessimist and saying this is a great day, they are not saying that anymore.
Jimbuna
11-25-18, 08:07 AM
Brexit vote will be honoured, says Diane Abbott.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46315250
Obviously an expert on matters like this :doh:
Brexit: Your simple guide to the UK leaving the EU.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-46318565
Diane Abbott
That reminds me of her police blunder and speaking of the police, jim what do you think of the new tactic against scooter crime?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfAn8fsghec
Skybird
11-26-18, 05:20 AM
^ Good tactic to teach criminals that they have all reason to be afraid. Criminals must learn to fear their victims, and that they can not trust that their personal wellbeing is rated higher than enforcing the law and preventing escape.
It should however always be done with active video recording so that officers know that if they exaggerate it when going for the "kill", they could be held responisble for using excessive force.
---
"Die Welt" writes: "If Prime Minister Theresa May passes her now agreed deal in the House of Commons, the British will remain closely tied to the EU for years - as non-members without a say, however, and with a status of beign reduced to a powerless vasall."
"The Times" writes (retranslated from the German translation): "MEPs who reject Mays deal are actually in favor of a second EU referendum. YThey should first ask themselves if they really want that - and if it would lead to a different outcome. "
I wonder whether the fear of chaos and no deal nevertheless will make MEPs going with May, since they fear no deal more than this bad deal - even if they do not agree with a super-soft, EU-cozy Brexit at all. The past two years should have been used to prepare the UK for a hard Brexit - and literally skippin all that negotiating from beginning on. That was what I had on mind two years ago: to make sure one has a real exit, and prepares as best as one can for that. Instead, plenty of time was wasted and now no acceptable deal is there. Going with this deal is so seriously negative and to the British disadvanatge that it equals the signing of a declaration of unconditional surrender - with all future trump cards in the hands of the EU, regarding future negotiating (Backstop and the like).
We have a proverb in German: Wer A sagt, muß auch B sagen: he who said "A", also has to say "B" (in for a penny, in for a pound? I am not certain on this phrase) Thats what anti and soft Brexiteers seem to have no understood until today.
Jimbuna
11-26-18, 06:02 AM
That reminds me of her police blunder and speaking of the police, jim what do you think of the new tactic against scooter crime?
Love it....poetic justice as far as I'm concerned and Sky sums it up brilliantly with the following from #8644
Good tactic to teach criminals that they have all reason to be afraid. Criminals must learn to fear their victims, and that they can not trust that their personal wellbeing is rated higher than enforcing the law and preventing escape.
It should however always be done with active video recording so that officers know that if they exaggerate it when going for the "kill", they could be held responisble for using excessive force.
That tactic would have helped me back in 90 during a high speed chase of a motorbike TWLA (Taken Without Legal Authority).
Up real close and the twunt thought breaking suddenly would force me to reciprocate, he was right but I was astride a traffic calming measure (speed bump) and had little front wheel traction therefore colliding with the bike and knocking the rider onto the ground.
No dash cams in those days so I was totally reliant on the statement of my partner and very fortunate to have one also from a nearby pedestrian.
Still got me suspended from driving for a month before the investigation cleared me of any wrongdoing though https://i.imgur.com/VqT1tCI.gif
Skybird
11-26-18, 06:28 AM
Now proven: telepathic Skybird can read minds!
Jimbuna
11-26-18, 06:32 AM
Now proven: telepathic Skybird can read minds!
https://i.imgur.com/8oSNQrp.gif
I agree it's like the 1970's.:)
About time these punks got some pay back.
Skybird
11-26-18, 11:30 AM
Numbers' Dance:
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-46239782
The math simply does not work.
Jimbuna
11-26-18, 12:15 PM
Numbers' Dance:
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-46239782
The math simply does not work.
In addition to the above I have been watching Parliament Live on tv (it is still ongoing as I type this) and the grilling the PM is getting from Members of ALL persuasions makes it even more obvious she is flogging the proverbial 'dead horse'.
Much to her credit though, she is sticking to her guns....so much so I suspect she may well be painting herself into a corner and ultimately, her downfall.
Theresa May's Brexit deal is "doomed" and must be renegotiated, ex-defence secretary Sir Michael Fallon has said.https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46356353
HOW?
The EU has made it clear as a crystal ball that is it no more talks job done.
Jimbuna
11-27-18, 09:09 AM
The next former Cabinet Minister to go public.
Theresa May's Brexit deal is "doomed" and must be renegotiated, ex-defence secretary Sir Michael Fallon has said.
Sir Michael launched a scathing attack on the proposed EU agreement, saying it was the "worst of all worlds" and the PM's future was "up to colleagues".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46356353
Beat you to it jim. :03: :haha:
SKY poll
Would you support a Brexit debate between M&C?
Yes 66%
No 34%
I would not it will be just the usual slanging match.
Catfish
11-27-18, 09:42 AM
"The question on the brexit paper was so vague as to be meaningless.
Nobody saying "but what about..". The existence of a single market has come as a surprise to many. The question of the Irish border was not raised. The cost of leaving was never mentioned.
A more honest question would have been "Do you dislike foreigners?"
:03:
Jimbuna
11-27-18, 10:34 AM
^ Good tactic to teach criminals that they have all reason to be afraid. Criminals must learn to fear their victims, and that they can not trust that their personal wellbeing is rated higher than enforcing the law and preventing escape.
It should however always be done with active video recording so that officers know that if they exaggerate it when going for the "kill", they could be held responisble for using excessive force.
https://i.imgur.com/mDhrYvm.jpg
Politicians from nine countries reacted angrily to the absence of Facebook founder Mark Zuckerberg at a hearing today.https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-46357359
Far too busy harvesting personal data and selling it to the highest bidder...$ CHING CHING.
Brexit: Theresa May denies 'giving up' on better dealhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46363879
Well some one has to think the impossible is possible. Unlike the rest of us who can see this deal stinks.
Jimbuna
11-28-18, 07:09 AM
All forms of Brexit will make the UK worse off but Theresa May's plan is the best available, says Philip Hammond.
Treasury analysis suggests it could leave the size of the UK economy up to 3.9% smaller after 15 years, compared with staying in the EU.
But a no-deal Brexit could deliver a 9.3% hit, the new estimates say.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46366162
One of the PM's few supporters comes to her aid as she tries to persuade the public to instruct their MP's to vote for her terrible Brexit deal.
Catfish
11-28-18, 08:09 AM
What exactly is the "terrible brexit deal"? :hmmm:
"Terrible brexit" will probably be more exact.
England will not have much say in European matters after any brexit, i guess this should be understood?
So May wants to keep England /the UK (probably to soothe Ireland and Scotland, and keep England competitive) in the single market.
The latter is obvioulsly being seen as "treacherous" by the Brits?
It is also not seen as possible by the EU, since the initial and only reason for the existence of the EU is access to the single market by its members without currency and customs problems, and a free ware and scientific exchange.
So you want to leave, but keep all advantages. Apart of a smell of cherry-picking this is most probably not possible. If the brexiters demand this they are delusional. If they say that May "wrecks" their brexit by trying to keep the UK having access to the single market they are just dumb.
I have some good advice for those big mouth brexiters: Do it yourself!
Jimbuna
11-28-18, 08:42 AM
Personally, I believe the main dislikes of said deal (during the transition period) is the ECJ will continue to have the final say, it will be nigh on impossible to conduct trade deals with other countries and the real big one is the Backstop arrangement for NI.
Catfish
11-28-18, 08:48 AM
Thanks :hmmm: Will have to read through this 'backstop' thiss evening, i admit i don't quite understand it, or its implications.
Whatever, Ireland was the #1 problem from day one of a "brexit". How do the brexiters want to solve this?
Jimbuna
11-28-18, 09:22 AM
Thanks :hmmm: Will have to read through this 'backstop' thiss evening, i admit i don't quite understand it, or its implications.
Whatever, Ireland was the #1 problem from day one of a "brexit". How do the brexiters want to solve this?
That is the million dollar question....there are a great many differing views/opinions out there.
My own is that I don't want the UK to simply crash out with no deal at all because we are allies and friends of Europe and its individual countries.
I'd far rather a compromise was reached otherwise great damage will be done to the economies of each others countries.
What that compromise should be? I couldn't honestly say but hopefully the politicians will work something out that is mutually beneficial to us all.
Irish backstop explained:https://www.ft.com/content/f18fda2e-bc0b-11e8-94b2-17176fbf93f5
Skybird
11-28-18, 12:00 PM
Just worth to say: the leave of the UKs economic power from the bloc equals a situation as if the 18 smallest economies of the bloc would leave alltogether.
Maybe this illustrates how insane the whole conception of the EU today indeed is. I do not know one historic example where a union of so tremendously diverse economic weights has ever worked over a noteworthy ammount of time. And if Germany after three decades still cannot equalise the situation and dysbalance regarding East and West German federal states after reunification, how realistic is it to asume one could acchieve that with many more actors involved and on a continnetal level, and with much great space for national egoisms playing intrigues and abuses?
Damn. Planned. Economies.
Skybird
11-28-18, 12:11 PM
What exactly is the "terrible brexit deal"? :hmmm:
"Terrible brexit" will probably be more exact.
England will not have much say in European matters after any brexit, i guess this should be understood?
With May deal the UK indeed has not much to say - but must stay obedient to EU legislations and regulations, and cannot negotiate new bilateral trade agreements with anyone outside the EU block, I seem to recall. It looses all rights, but keeps all duties, and for this even needs to pay many billlions of Euros as a farewell bill.
Without a deal it still has nothing to say,of course (its no member then anyomore) but must not keep EU laws and regulations, can internationally negotiate as it wants (which it cannot do under May's deal), and it most likely will not pay any divorce bill at all.
The status of the UK being a submissive, paying vasall without any say on any matters could be extended as long as the EU wants, if the backstop option gets pulled by the EU. This will be decided on by the EU court, and England shall have no say on that as well.
From an English position, this deal is suicidal and insane. Its a total and complete surrender and puts England completely at the mercy of Brussel.
Insane and suicidal, are the words to keep on mind here. I must meet the UK in the future with great contempt if it agrees to such a desaster, I'm sorry to say. I would find it most disappointing, or better: desillusionising if the UK agrees to this.
Honestly said, as the UK I would pull the intel and security card and threaten to coimnpletely switch off any intel exchange programs. The UK intel sevrice is a major player surpassing kost European powers in thsi regard, and the rest of Europe benefits muich more from the capaicty mof thegnopsib services than theEnglish benefit from feedback from the continent. In times of cyberwarfare, Ialamic trerrorism, Russian new ways of atypöicvla warfare an dChinese econo9mic spiu9onage, this isa a very tough card to play that cannot be iognored. I would also threaten to leave the NATO block.
Its now high time tos tart playing real hard and brutal - like th eEu did form all beginning on. All that soft sweety whispers and hopes paid off for nothing. Lets get top the facts, and the fact is that the EU has used its power to all extenct, has not made any seriosu concession and now threatens to pull the UK completely over thr table. And May, this carricature of a thinking mind, even bends over and lets everythign happen, calling this the best option of all. By history, i have a very different image and impression of the English mentlaity and poride, but maybe I live as somebody who has fallen out of time.
Let the Germans pay for all this, they are dump enough to do so and it makes them happy and allows them to feel that they are collecting heavenly scoring points for the afterlife. The more self-sacrificing they can be, the better they feel.
Catfish
11-28-18, 03:14 PM
In the referendum neither side said that Leave meant leaving the customs union or the single market - quite to the contrary. :hmmm:
Boris Johnson said he had mentioned it via twitter, but he lied.
Skybird
11-28-18, 03:20 PM
:/\\!!
Catfish
11-28-18, 03:29 PM
Government accused of scaremongering over migrant NHS fraud (https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/migrant-nhs-fraud-european-health-insurance-card_uk_5be0d4d8e4b09d43e3220496?guccounter=1&guce_referrer_us=aHR0cHM6Ly90LmNvL1dYQjZPcW1GT28&guce_referrer_cs=HW4W2sP5p1sqVs256tPm2w)
Comments are best, as always..
"Donald Trump could not have done better. Of course politicians who tell the truth do not last long but there is a difference between £712.56. and 19 million that even a Tory should be able to notice. Perhaps they need a new Maths teacher at Eton."
I wonder how the real card-abuse stats are here. But as said, facts don't matter anyway in our post-factual times.
Jimbuna
11-29-18, 07:21 AM
With May deal the UK indeed has not much to say - but must stay obedient to EU legislations and regulations, and cannot negotiate new bilateral trade agreements with anyone outside the EU block, I seem to recall. It looses all rights, but keeps all duties, and for this even needs to pay many billlions of Euros as a farewell bill.
Without a deal it still has nothing to say,of course (its no member then anyomore) but must not keep EU laws and regulations, can internationally negotiate as it wants (which it cannot do under May's deal), and it most likely will not pay any divorce bill at all.
The status of the UK being a submissive, paying vasall without any say on any matters could be extended as long as the EU wants, if the backstop option gets pulled by the EU. This will be decided on by the EU court, and England shall have no say on that as well.
From an English position, this deal is suicidal and insane. Its a total and complete surrender and puts England completely at the mercy of Brussel.
Insane and suicidal, are the words to keep on mind here. I must meet the UK in the future with great contempt if it agrees to such a desaster, I'm sorry to say. I would find it most disappointing, or better: desillusionising if the UK agrees to this.
Honestly said, as the UK I would pull the intel and security card and threaten to coimnpletely switch off any intel exchange programs. The UK intel sevrice is a major player surpassing kost European powers in thsi regard, and the rest of Europe benefits muich more from the capaicty mof thegnopsib services than theEnglish benefit from feedback from the continent. In times of cyberwarfare, Ialamic trerrorism, Russian new ways of atypöicvla warfare an dChinese econo9mic spiu9onage, this isa a very tough card to play that cannot be iognored. I would also threaten to leave the NATO block.
Its now high time tos tart playing real hard and brutal - like th eEu did form all beginning on. All that soft sweety whispers and hopes paid off for nothing. Lets get top the facts, and the fact is that the EU has used its power to all extenct, has not made any seriosu concession and now threatens to pull the UK completely over thr table. And May, this carricature of a thinking mind, even bends over and lets everythign happen, calling this the best option of all. By history, i have a very different image and impression of the English mentlaity and poride, but maybe I live as somebody who has fallen out of time.
Let the Germans pay for all this, they are dump enough to do so and it makes them happy and allows them to feel that they are collecting heavenly scoring points for the afterlife. The more self-sacrificing they can be, the better they feel.
Spoken like a true Brit :yep:
If this gets passed then Maybot will be unstoppable.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46384207
I'm on a tablet and the sod will not highlight the news bit. :wah:
Catfish
11-29-18, 09:18 AM
Spoken like a true Brit
Ok I have listed all those words Skybird uses to discredit, which often enough are based on Farage's, Trump's and Bannon's (false) claims and rhetorics:
".. not much to say.. stay obedient.. loses all rights.. keeps all duties.. needs to pay billions, submissive.. paying vasall [Johnson/Farage speak b.t.w.].. England shall have no say.. suicidal and insane.. total and complete surrender..puts England completely at the mercy of Brussel.. contempt.. a disaster.. most disappointing.. desillusionising.. hopes paid off for nothing..EU has used its power.. threatens to pull the UK completely over thr table.."Hate speech? Delusional? "Patriotic"? Not one word about how absurd the whole brexit idea was, how the populistic right betrayed the people to get their agenda through. "Spoken like a true Brit" indeed. You can have him lol
With May deal the UK indeed has not much to say - but must stay obedient to EU legislations and regulations, and cannot negotiate new bilateral trade agreements with anyone outside the EU block, I seem to recall. It looses all rights, but keeps all duties, and for this even needs to pay many billlions of Euros as a farewell bill.The UK will not have much to say with or without May. Brexit means clearly no say in European matters after this. If the EU is wise enough it may still listen to England's opinions and advice, but it is not longer mandatory. The smaller not-quite-in-the-EU-states will have to look for other factions.
Again, the EU was formed to have trade agreements within or outside of the EU. England can do this, but it will have to be more competitive then.
"It loses all rights", this is so idiotic. Of course it does. No club member, no say in the club.
And England will still have to accept international law and duties (not the EU's fault), something the EU has softened within its range of power. Life outside is harder, of course. This is why the EU was created.
Someone leaving the EU costs the EU money, and it has to make up for the evaluated loss, yes. A contract that was voluntarily signed by the UK and which is binding. If Johnson or Farage forgot to mention that, along with losing access to the single market with their brexit, again: It. Is. Not. The. EU.'s fault.
Without a deal it still has nothing to say,of course (its no member then anyomore) but must not keep EU laws and regulations, can internationally negotiate as it wants (which it cannot do under May's deal), and it most likely will not pay any divorce bill at all.England can negotiate internationally, of course. But regarding trade with the EU it has to keep to certain conditions and regulations, and also to customs reintroduced by their own willing. This also means no selling of chloride chicken (like in the US), and it means a lot of certain safety regulations, which have been in existence long before the EU or England's joining. This is completely self-evident, or do you think Europe will buy an electric device that is unsafe, and cannot be given back due to a missing product guarantee (or vice versa)? Again what the hell do you expect?
If England gets out without deal and without paying, i guess this will leave a mark. If they do not respect treaties, why should anyone have trade with them? Of course, there's the second financial Empire which will always stay afloat. Unfortunately this does not incorporate the wellbeing of the common citizens.
The status of the UK being a submissive, paying vasall without any say on any matters could be extended as long as the EU wants, if the backstop option gets pulled by the EU. This will be decided on by the EU court, and England shall have no say on that as well.The UK will have to pay for the amount that the EU would get for a year, if the UK stayed. Treaty. This is neither unfair nor unrealistic. Because all those EU projects (like e.g. rebuilding Manchester with EU money) has to be planned in advance, speaking of months and years. Such projects involving long-term planning and money cannot simply be stopped, or cut dead.
From an English position, this deal is suicidal and insane. Its a total and complete surrender and puts England completely at the mercy of Brussel.
If it is "suicidal and insane", (which I doubt, as I explained above; also the sky will not fall) it would have been a good idea to think about it before believing Farage, Bannon or Trump.
Insane and suicidal, are the words to keep on mind here. I must meet the UK in the future with great contempt if it agrees to such a desaster, I'm sorry to say. I would find it most disappointing, or better: desillusionising if the UK agrees to this.
Oh, you are so "sorry". So what is your proposal, without breaking treaties? Break them?
Honestly said, as the UK I would pull the intel and security card and threaten to coimnpletely switch off any intel exchange programs. The UK intel sevrice is a major player surpassing kost European powers in thsi regard, and the rest of Europe benefits muich more from the capaicty mof thegnopsib services than theEnglish benefit from feedback from the continent. In times of cyberwarfare, Ialamic trerrorism, Russian new ways of atypöicvla warfare an dChinese econo9mic spiu9onage, this isa a very tough card to play that cannot be iognored. I would also threaten to leave the NATO block.
The BND or the French services, along with "a few" others are not as bad as you think. If certain services do not make it into the headlines all the time it is probably not a bad idea. Do you believe in James Bond movies? If or how MI6 acts is of course important, but why should brexit severe those ties? Such information interchange among western nations is above all petty trivia, and in international interest.
Leave the NATO and also have no say there anymore? :hmmm: Bad idea like brexit.
Maybe Europe will come to grips now and create an own army that is capable of something. Like the EVP project back then, which was undermined by France, and.. England.
Its now high time tos tart playing real hard and brutal - like th eEu did form all beginning on. All that soft sweety whispers and hopes paid off for nothing. Lets get top the facts, and the fact is that the EU has used its power to all extenct, has not made any seriosu concession and now threatens to pull the UK completely over thr table. And May, this carricature of a thinking mind, even bends over and lets everythign happen, calling this the best option of all. By history, i have a very different image and impression of the English mentlaity and poride, but maybe I live as somebody who has fallen out of time.
The EU has a standfast negotiating position since day one of brexit. All of the EU leaders have made perfectly clear what brexit means. If some people in England were delusional of what happens and what brexit means for England, it is high time to be confronted with reality.
Let the Germans pay for all this, they are dump enough to do so and it makes them happy and allows them to feel that they are collecting heavenly scoring points for the afterlife. The more self-sacrificing they can be, the better they feel.
Oh please, speak for yourself.
Skybird
11-29-18, 09:29 AM
Corbyn's ideas on what there can be for an altenative Brexit in core points already has been ruled out by the EU, and it is this kind of attempted cherry picking where already May went rock bottom. Has he already been in winter hibernation in the past 18 months that he did not note it and repeats this old stuff?
Jimbuna
11-29-18, 10:20 AM
Corbyns 'achilles heel' on the subject of Brexit is the fact he has always been anti-EU and has voted against his own whip/alongside the Tories on this and similar matters on over 200+ (I forget the exact figure) occasions during his time in Parliament.
skidman
11-29-18, 11:23 AM
Someone leaving the EU costs the EU money, and it has to make up for the evaluated loss, yes. A contract that was voluntarily signed by the UK and which is binding. If Johnson or Farage forgot to mention that, along with losing access to the single market with their brexit, again: It. Is. Not. The. EU.'s fault.
A simple truth which the former rulers of the waves usually fail to consider. All in all the most elaborate post in this thread for a long time. Congrats.
Dirk Gently
11-29-18, 11:45 AM
After watching what's happened in the wake of Brexit, it's pretty evident that EU isn't the cozy, nice benevolent union we've been lead to believe. So the right thing to do for everyone is to leave the EU and let it stand as a testament of failed human social experiments.
One could obviously add numerous of anti democratic quotes from EU-leaders but I suppose you already know. For example Juncker's anti democratic opinion is pretty solidly documented on the internet in terms of official statements and in You Tube videos.
Catfish
11-30-18, 03:55 AM
Oh please. Norway is not even a full member of the EU.
https://www.politico.eu/article/norwegian-pm-uk-cannot-cherry-pick-eu-membership/
" ... On the type of deal that Britain can expect from Brussels, Solberg said the government would not be able to pick and choose which parts of EU membership would suit it best, adding that the process of Brexit is “frustrating.”
Solberg warned just days before the Brexit referendum in 2016 that the U.K. would not be happy in a model such as Norway’s.
“We do agree with the EU that you cannot be cherry-picking,” Solberg said.
“Norway is outside [the EU], but we are inside the single market … We do accept that decisions on the four freedoms are done in Brussels.”
“You can’t just opt out of one of the freedoms,” she added.
Skybird
11-30-18, 07:14 AM
The EU should only be about economic cooperation. But it wanst to melt a coordinated one culture and one identity, thats why the single market thing gets linked to the four freedoms as if the one has much to do with the other. But it hasn't, thats an opportunistically maintained myth to use it as an alibi to claim more central power for the big continental planned economy.
In princple one could say the EU is about creating a Europe-wide Belgian kingdom.
Dirk Gently
11-30-18, 10:09 AM
Oh please. Norway is not even a full member of the EU.
Which is relevant.. why?
https://www.politico.eu/article/norwegian-pm-uk-cannot-cherry-pick-eu-membership/
" ... On the type of deal that Britain can expect from Brussels, Solberg said the government would not be able to pick and choose which parts of EU membership would suit it best, adding that the process of Brexit is “frustrating.”
Solberg warned just days before the Brexit referendum in 2016 that the U.K. would not be happy in a model such as Norway’s.
“We do agree with the EU that you cannot be cherry-picking,” Solberg said.
“Norway is outside [the EU], but we are inside the single market … We do accept that decisions on the four freedoms are done in Brussels.”
“You can’t just opt out of one of the freedoms,” she added.
The whole point is that EU wants to make everything difficult for non members to force membership.
Skybird
11-30-18, 07:12 PM
UK pulling out of Gallileo GPS.
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-46407249
The mentiond costs and cash flowback so far and that it was already calculated into the EU divorce bill, caught my attention.
Jimbuna
12-01-18, 07:04 AM
Here is the stalking horse should PM May fall.
However, prominent Brexiteer and cabinet minister Michael Gove has defended Mrs May's plan, writing in the Daily Mail that leaving the EU is under "great threat" if the deal is rejected by MPs.
Catfish
12-01-18, 08:16 AM
UK pulling out of Gallileo GPS. [...]
only in german, not quite sure what it means even as a german
http://scienceblogs.de/alpha-cephei/2018/06/09/brexit-means-galilexit/
"Der Zugriff auf den PRS-Dienst ist laut EU-Verträgen den Ländern des Europäischen Wirtschaftsraums vorbehalten, zu denen neben den EU-Mitgliedsländern selbst auch Norwegen und Island zählen."
"According to EU treaties, access to the PRS service is reserved for the countries of the European Economic Area , which include Norway and Iceland in addition to the EU member states themselves."
"Die britische Regierung konnte sich jedoch bekanntlich bisher weder für das norwegische noch für das eidgenössische Modell entscheiden, und daraus zog Airbus nun Konsequenzen und kündigte Ende April an, sein Werk von Portsmouth in ein anderes europäisches Land zu verlegen"
"However, as we know, the British government has not been able to choose either the Norwegian or the federal model and Airbus has now taken consequences and announced at the end of April that it would relocate its plant from Portsmouth to another European country"
They say they had to do it (june 2018 already) because of Norway and.. Switzerland.
:hmmm:
english Google translation, hundreds of flaws but...
https://translate.google.com/translate?hl=de&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fscienceblogs.de%2Falpha-cephei%2F2018%2F06%2F09%2Fbrexit-means-galilexit%2F
The minister who resigned over Theresa May's Brexit strategy says another referendum may be the only option if MPs reject the deal.https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46413370
I am beginning to think if the HoC rejects her deal we will be staying in the EU. Even our dumb lot of MP's would not risk a clean break on WTO rules. But saying that who really knows.
Catfish
12-01-18, 02:54 PM
Which is relevant.. why?
Because Norway cannot leave, when it is not a fully-fledged member. I know you have your own difficulties with the swedish border.
The whole point is that EU wants to make everything difficult for non members to force membership.
The EU's purpose regarding economy has been to ease trade among its members, because it is harder and more difficult outside of such an agreement. And this has primarily not much to do with the EU, but with international (read: non-EU) law and the World Trade Organization.
Why and how trade is harmed out of the EU can e.g. be read here:
Brexit: What the Hell Happens Now? (https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B01M74JXK5/ref=dp-kindle-redirect?_encoding=UTF8&btkr=1)
Click on "look inside", just the first page.
https://i.imgur.com/XeNU8h2.jpg
A more affectionate view on brexit and article 50 is here (mind you: swearing, strong words and so on).
Brexit article 50 (http://emmaclarke.com/brexit-article-50/)
More here:
Which EU law are you looking forward to losing? (https://www.lbc.co.uk/radio/presenters/james-obrien/which-eu-law-are-you-looking-forward-to-losing/)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E6_6z1ZJ_0s
Jimbuna
12-02-18, 07:27 AM
May heaven preserve us :doh:
Schroeder
12-02-18, 07:29 AM
May heaven preserve us :doh:
I wasn't aware Theresa had her own heaven. :doh:
:O:
Jimbuna
12-02-18, 07:39 AM
I wasn't aware Theresa had her own heaven. :doh:
:O:
It never crossed my mind :haha:
Jimbuna
12-02-18, 09:10 AM
Brexit: Labour threatens no confidence vote.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46416591
Now I'm starting to get worried.....should Corbyn by some cruel twist of fate manage to sneak into Downing St.
Now I'm starting to get worried.....should Corbyn by some cruel twist of fate manage to sneak into Downing St.
Don't Panic the Tory MP's will not back it, the fear of Jezzer in power will stop Labour's power grab.
NEWS JUST IN
PM May backs the police on their new tactics as posted here, good she got one thing right.
News just in...Jim is put in charge of the new flying squad. :03:
Jimbuna
12-02-18, 09:31 AM
I'd certainly be better at it than Diane Abbott
'Knocking people off bikes is potentially very dangerous': Diane Abbott faces furious backlash after she criticises Scotland Yard's tactic to ram moped gangs.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6437385/Police-hit-Diane-Abbott-criticises-ramming-moped-gangs.html
I'd certainly be better at it than Diane Abbott
Time she was carted off to the funny farm. :doh:
'Arguable case' government committed contempt over Brexit legal advicehttps://news.sky.com/story/arguable-case-government-committed-contempt-over-brexit-legal-advice-11571059
This should be interesting to see how this pans out.
Catfish
12-03-18, 04:12 PM
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-latest-final-say-peoples-vote-one-million-petition-no-deal-a8600056.html
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-latest-final-say-peoples-vote-one-million-petition-no-deal-a8600056.html
Means nothing as the government has said there will be no more referendums. And Labour is far more interested in getting a general election.
In other news UKIP is determine to be the new far right party under this moron.
UKIP leader Gerard Batten has survived a vote of no confidence held by the party's National Executive Committee.https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46422821
Jimbuna
12-04-18, 08:16 AM
Prime Minister Theresa May is preparing to sell her Brexit deal as she opens five days of debate in the Commons.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46435128
https://i.imgur.com/tZRqYpq.gif
Prime Minister Theresa May is preparing to sell her Brexit deal as she opens five days of debate in the Commons.
https://38.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m9t31sX4ER1qgcra2o1_500.gif
WAKE UP WAKE UP....
Skybird
12-04-18, 10:34 AM
"Attention. This is Crystal Palace. We are closing the mountain. You'll have to hurry. After the gates have closed, nobody gets in or out."
:D
Anyway, the German Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung (FAZ) on an analysis of the British military and intel power and its hard-to-overestimate relevance for the security structure of Europe. The UK should have used this to simply set up some blackmailing threats indeed. And who knows, maybe it did, and Brussel was simply to disconected form realities as if it would see the relevance of it indeed, while being friends with all world and all that...
In English.
https://www.faz.net/aktuell/politik/ausland/how-the-uk-strives-to-maintain-military-balance-of-power-in-europe-after-brexit-15903791.html
Food prices could rise between 5% and 10% if there is a disorderly Brexit, the Bank of England governor, Mark Carney, has warned.https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46439969
Hey thicko, they are always rising dumb dumb. :doh:
BREAKING NEWS
Government Ministers have just been found guilty of contempt of Parliment.
Yes 311
No 293
Majority 18
Jimbuna
12-04-18, 01:25 PM
"Attention. This is Crystal Palace. We are closing the mountain. You'll have to hurry. After the gates have closed, nobody gets in or out."
:D
Anyway, the German Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung (FAZ) on an analysis of the British military and intel power and its hard-to-overestimate relevance for the security structure of Europe. The UK should have used this to simply set up some blackmailing threats indeed. And who knows, maybe it did, and Brussel was simply to disconected form realities as if it would see the relevance of it indeed, while being friends with all world and all that...
In English.
https://www.faz.net/aktuell/politik/ausland/how-the-uk-strives-to-maintain-military-balance-of-power-in-europe-after-brexit-15903791.html
That is quite an insightful article Sky :yep:
Jimbuna
12-04-18, 02:28 PM
Didn't expect this but not really surprised.
Nigel Farage has quit UKIP, saying the party's leader Gerard Batten seems to be obsessed with Islam and ex-English Defence League leader Tommy Robinson.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46448299
Didn't expect this but not really surprised.
Well Done. :yeah:
About time he got out of that loony right wing hate party. Gerard Batten is a disgrace and so is UKIP NEC voting to keep this scum bag in power after a vote of no confidence failed to remove him.
Jimbuna
12-05-18, 06:17 AM
There is a risk MPs could "steal Brexit from the British people" if Theresa May's proposed deal is rejected, a senior cabinet minister has warned.
Liam Fox said there was "natural Remain majority" in Parliament and any attempt to overturn the 2016 referendum vote would be a "democratic affront".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46450227
Corbyn must be rubbing his hands with glee.
Skybird
12-05-18, 11:05 AM
This is rich. Although I am not surprised by the findings in the legal report, and have mentioned its core findings myself already before, its something different again to have it laid before one's eyes black on white. That May tried to hide these implications from parliament, is not just contempt fopr the parliament. In my book it oversteps the thin red line to conspiracy and high treason.
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-46451970
Conspiracy, high treason, nothing else. Obviously May works for the EU. Which is no surprise, if you consider her stand before the referendum.
:arrgh!: There were times when state representatives lost their heads for much less. Sometimes I miss the good ol' rites and habits.
Corbyn must be rubbing his hands with glee.
Now that report has come out in full and the response from the deputy leader of the DUP calling it devastating it looks clear PM May days are on thin ice. Without the DUP vote next Tuesday I just can not see how May is going to get brexit passed.
I don't see us going to WTO rules by walking out outright, I would say we are going to stay in the EU. This could save May's bacon for now, saying that I would say a internal vote against her will bring her down around a year before the general election.
Tuesday vote will be a interesting 48 hours for May.
Skybird
12-05-18, 05:49 PM
I put my money on early elections. But I do not have an idea what their outcome will mean for Brexit or non-Brexit.
Dreamdancing in the past 18 months, and continuing to do so when thinking she could get away with that legal report. You cannot accuse her of not being consistent.
I put my money on early elections.
PM May's ace card old Jezzer could be enough to prevent one. The fear of Jezzer and his front bench in No.10 could keep May in power for now.
Skybird
12-06-18, 04:57 AM
But what else could happen after Brexit deal rejection in the House, if not new elections? It would equal a no-confidence vote, the government would be at an end (although maybe in a Merkelian interpretation of "end").
But what else could happen after Brexit deal rejection in the House, if not new elections? It would equal a no-confidence vote, the government would be at an end (although maybe in a Merkelian interpretation of "end").
Well all sorts things have been popping up in the news like....
we tear up Article 50 and stay in the EU.
The EU gives us a even longer time...What that is not sure.
Both those two above came from the EU.
There is or so..
Norway and Canadian ideas back on the table.
As for the vote of no confidence which Labour and the SNP could push hard if the Brexit vote is lost for the government. The Tory MP's would back May to the hilt as she is the lesser bitter pill to swallow. The last thing they want is for that vote to win leaving a door open for Labour. As for the DUP I bet they will get paid off for their vote.
PM May will still have 21 days to come up with something new if she looses, what that will be who knows.
Just spotted this..
The Democratic Unionists will back Theresa May's government in any vote of no confidence should her Brexit deal be rejected, its Westminster leader says.https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46461880
Jimbuna
12-06-18, 07:22 AM
The chickens are coming home to roost :hmmm:
Brexit vote: What could happen next?https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46393399
Jimbuna
12-06-18, 10:54 AM
Theresa May says she "is talking to colleagues" about their concerns over the Northern Ireland "backstop" ahead of a crucial vote on her EU deal.
She suggested MPs could be "given a role" in deciding whether to activate the backstop, which is designed to stop the return of a physical border.
But she told the BBC there could be no deal with the EU without it.
No 10 has said the Commons vote will go ahead on Tuesday, despite claims it could be delayed to avoid defeat.
And in another development, the European Court of Justice said it would deliver a ruling on Monday on whether the UK could unilaterally cancel Brexit by reversing Article 50 - the day before the MPs' crunch vote.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46463326
Too many conundru,s to overcome me thinks.
The leaders Brexit debate is off, first BBC now ITV. :yeah:
Skybird
12-06-18, 05:06 PM
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46393399
Well, I had all those theoretical options on the list, but realistically, and if going by a.) the rules outlined from the beginning on, and b.) realism, there is just the fact that the government is at an end. Anything else is unrealsstic, or a bending of the rules. Which of course is the daily bread in politics, thats why you do not trust it.
If one honours that referendum, takes the EU by its word, sticks to the previously outlined rules, then there cannot be a second referendum, the EU will not negotiate and make greater concessions, and there cannot be a second vote (you do not senmd them vpt9ng until they are tired and give you what you want, that is not the idea behind such votes, but is the explicit abuse of the idea).
Leaves you with leaving with no deal, which is realistic, or the government getting the boot. In case of leaving with no deal the goivenrment still must be held responsiboe for not having negotiated more successfully, which maybe was impossible indeed sinc ethe EU was out to crack the UK anyway, or for the fact that the dela implied the total surrender of the UK and trying to sell this is a victory to the Breitish people, which is a lie and simply: betrayal. Which leads me to concluding in this scenario the government as well is at its end, and must be fired.
Fire it anyway, becasue their attempted coup of hiding the legal report borders, as I said, conspiracy and treason. For this alone the government must be fired already.
Want some wise words from a German? Andreas Brehme, football world champion 1990: "Haste Scheiße am Fuß, haste Scheiße am Fuß."
Jimbuna
12-07-18, 07:05 AM
Well, absolutely no surprises here. I can now foresee the possibility that Brexit will be cancelled and the downfall of the PM :hmmm:
A government bid to find a compromise to win over rebels before the Commons Brexit vote has run into criticism.
A Tory backbench amendment - understood to have No 10's backing - offers MPs more of a say over the contentious issue of the Northern Ireland backstop.
DUP leader Arlene Foster dismissed it as "legislative tinkering" while Tory Brexiteers said it was "desperate".
Many MPs have expressed concerns about the backstop, aimed at preventing a "hard border" on the island of Ireland.
It would mean Northern Ireland staying aligned to some EU rules, which many MPs say is unacceptable.
The UK would also not be able to leave the backstop without EU agreement.
Cabinet ministers are travelling around the UK on Friday as Theresa May continues to seek support for her Brexit deal.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46477036
Skybird
12-07-18, 07:19 AM
Well, absolutely no surprises here. I can now foresee the possibility that Brexit will be cancelled and the downfall of the PM :hmmm:
And I think this has been May's plan since 18 months. To make it such a bad deal that nobody would complain if the referendum gets ignored. Its also what the EU always has been planned for: to make it such a bad deal that the Brits would finally agree to not respect their own referendum. Mind you, all concessiosn were made by the UK. Not a single one, not a single single single one by the EU - NONE. Thats what negotiating from a position of weakness is like. TBH, I think the whole negotiating joke should have been skipped unilaterally by the UK. And I think back in 2017 I already said so.
Conspiracy prevails. Its politics, mind you. Its easier to kiss a rattlesnake without getting bitten. I know why I despise these crooks so fullheartedly. They pull you down to their low level, and then beat you with experience (Mark Twain).
Jimbuna
12-07-18, 07:22 AM
And I think this has been May's plan since 18 months. To make it such a bad deal that nobody would complain if the referendum gets ignored. Its also what the EU always has been planned for: to make it such a bad deal that the Brits would finally agree to not respect their own referendum.
Conspiracy prevails. Its politics, mind you. Its easier to kiss a rattlesnake without getting bitten.
You could very well be correct Sky :yep:
I wonder if May is in any way related to Chamberlain :hmmm:
https://i.imgur.com/CjTK7Mb.jpg
I hear the government's chief whip has said the government is facing a impossible task and will most likely loose the vote next Tuesday.
Jimbuna
12-07-18, 11:17 AM
Time to commence the scare mongering tactics?
Dover and other Channel ports face disruption for up to six months if the UK leaves the EU without a deal, ministers have said.
The warning comes after analysis of likely traffic flows, if customs checks are delayed.
It is regarded as a worst-case scenario but the public sector is being asked to rewrite its contingency plans.
Lorries carrying medicine could get priority at ports and planes used to fly in drugs, ministers said.
The PM's claim that the alternative to the withdrawal agreement she has negotiated with the EU is a no-deal Brexit, has so far failed to convince many of her own MPs.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46480374
Time to commence the scare mongering tactics?
PROJECT WE'RE ALL DOOMED!
Get a life you morons.
Jimbuna
12-08-18, 07:53 AM
Amber Rudd says Plan B options plausible :hmmm:
The UK could pursue alternative options if Theresa May's Brexit plan is rejected by MPs, Work and Pensions Secretary Amber Rudd has acknowledged.
Mrs Rudd told BBC Radio 4's Today programme she still supported the PM's plan - but "anything could happen" if it did not get through on Tuesday.
She is the first cabinet minister to publicly float the possibility of "plausible" alternatives.
Ms Rudd said it could be "chaotic" if Mrs May's deal is rejected.
She said a so-called "Norway plus" option or another referendum would both be possibilities in such a situation.
Norway plus would mean the UK remaining in the European Economic Area (EEA).
Ms Rudd described it as a "plausible", but not a "desirable" option for a Plan B. She also said she was not certain it could be done.
But she said the deal Mrs May reached with the EU last month was the "best option".
"What we need is a compromise deal - that's what the prime minister has proposed," she said.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46490642
We all know MayBots silly plan will fail, so in the 21 days to come we need a new better plan.
Sharkstooth
12-08-18, 12:20 PM
I propose a reunion meeting at HMS Belfast to discuss. :D
Hiya Steed!
Catfish
12-08-18, 12:47 PM
I propose a reunion meeting at HMS Belfast to discuss. :D [...]
Hey Sharkstooth, long time!
I second that meeting, i will not disuss anything but just be there and drink and Salute you all :()1: :D
Sharkstooth
12-08-18, 12:52 PM
Oi Cat!
Im truly planning a trip across the pond...May 2019.
Would be a grand reunion no?
👠
Catfish
12-08-18, 12:55 PM
oh i never met you in person, but you were quite active on the forum, looong time ago :salute:
ExFishermanBob
12-08-18, 03:46 PM
Saw this on the webtubes, made me laugh a lot. Can only imagine the voice
"Good afternoon. I wish to discuss joining EFTA."
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dt1OztnXcAAy6KF.jpg
Jimbuna
12-09-18, 07:11 AM
With two days to go until the crucial Brexit vote, the prime minister has warned MPs they face "uncharted waters" if they reject her deal.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46497531
This womaqn must be a true psychic :doh:
This womaqn must be a true psychic :doh:
Vote yes for the government
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/c/cf/Norman_Bates_in_%22Psycho%22_%281960%29.jpg/250px-Norman_Bates_in_%22Psycho%22_%281960%29.jpg
The vote is on....off....delayed...off...on...delayed...on.
TUESDAY 7PM MayBot faces her biggest defeat in history! And I'm at work..:wah: not fair not fair. Watching the re-run news is just not the same as live news.
UPDATE
Government to make a statement 3:30pm today.
Sources think we are going to remain in the EU.
STEED thinks the government is a sham.
Skybird
12-10-18, 07:46 AM
EU court says the UK could cancel Brexit unilaterally without needing EU members' permission first.
How generous! :D
BREAKING NEWS
Tuesday vote is now delayed!
MayBot's master plan kicking in...DELAY THE VOTE CANCEL THE VOTE STAY IN THE EU. :hmmm:
Theresa May is to make a statement to MPs at 15:30 GMT amid reports Tuesday's vote on her Brexit deal is being delayed.https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46509288
EU court says the UK could cancel Brexit unilaterally without needing EU members' permission first.
How generous! :D
Nothing like a wide open door. :03:
Skybird
12-10-18, 09:13 AM
Nothing like a wide open door. :03:
As long as the doors swing one way only. They call it a fish trap.
The theft is happening live and unhidden now, is in action. The referendum will be stolen.
Jimbuna
12-10-18, 12:40 PM
As long as the doors swing one way only. They call it a fish trap.
The theft is happening live and unhidden now, is in action. The referendum will be stolen.
I suspect you may (no pun intended) be right.
Jimbuna
12-10-18, 12:54 PM
Bercow speaking a bit of sense for a change...
Commons speaker John Bercow has urged ministers to give MPs a vote on their plan to abandon Tuesday's vote on Theresa May's Brexit deal.
He told MPs that bringing arguments over the deal to a "premature and inconclusive end" without a vote would be seen as "discourteous" by many MPs.
It would be "respectful and mature" to allow MPs to express a view, he said.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46511390
Maybot has blown a fuse, if she still thinks this is the best deal for the UK why delay the vote. All she has done is to seal her fate, more letters going in rejecting her leadership. Jezzer inching closer to a general election which could see him in power!
This is nothing more than a wild thinkable..( I may remember the word I had planned to use here, or I may not)
After having read, listen and seen a lot about Brexit and EU
I got this picture.
EU is a drug, an addict which almost every politicians in Europe and most of it's citizens can't be without.
This could be why many of the English politicians in every party is nervous(are against this brexit-deal) ´cause in the near future they will not have the pleasure to enjoy this EU-drug.
Back to real politic
Markus
Jimbuna
12-11-18, 06:28 AM
Theresa May is meeting European leaders and EU officials on Tuesday for talks aimed at rescuing her Brexit deal.
She is holding talks with Dutch PM Mark Rutte and Germany's Angela Merkel after postponing a Commons vote on the deal.
The UK PM has said she needs "further assurances" about the Northern Ireland border plan to get backing from MPs.
European Commission President Jean-Claude Juncker said the EU would not "renegotiate" the deal but there was room for "further clarifications".
The prime minister is understood to be seeking legal guarantees that the UK will not be trapped in the Northern Ireland backstop plan indefinitely.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46515743
Looks like the final throw of the dice then the pantomime season can come to an end.
The EU has said once again...NO MORE TALKS TAKE IT OR LEAVE IT OR STAY IN THE EU.
Maybot's true colours have come to the front a power mad bitch who wants too stay in power!
We have no functioning Parliament we have no opposition and no government. What we got is a Parliament that is stagnating a opposition lusting for power and a government that is not running the country. Brexit has turned the whole place in to a giant kinder-garden of nappy wearing politicians to busy screaming at each other.
As it stands democracy is dead.
Skybird
12-11-18, 10:15 AM
May's credibility, trustworthiness is non-existent.
To be fair, she never has had a chance to reahc any othe routocme wiht the Eu than there now is. She may have silently agreed with that in order to torpedo Brexit, or she may have not, it does not matter: fatc is nobody and no other prime minister ever would have had a realistic chance to reach more thna there is, and what there is, is nothing.
May's failure lies not in fighting a battle that always was completly impossible to win. Her failure lies in trying to mock the intelligence of the public, tio hide very serious imolications on the legal side of the drfat deal, to mislead the parliament and now obviously trying to save her seat in the prime minister's office. As I explained some days ago, her failures lies in behavior and decisions that overstep the thin red line to treason and conspiracy with the EU, against the UK.
Her failure was not thjat the battle she volunterred (!) for was unwinnable from all beginning on. The neU was and is, what it is, and any other outcome than what ther eis now in draft deal, would have been a stellar surprise to me. There are strong and growing anti-EU movements in France, Netherlands, Denmark, Poland, Estonia, Lithuania, Latvia, Czech Republic, Hungary - to prevent a successful British precedence that illustrates that a life without and outside the EU is possible, always has been the leaidng dirctive behind Brussel brutal "negotation" tactic which consited of jst one plan: "No." No to all and No to everything, all power has to stay with the EU, unconditionally. One can negotiate about how to word it and how to call it in name - but that is just names for deceiving people, it has no real relevance, and certainbly no legally binding relevance. Now they want to agree on a good will apper - which again means nothing, absolutely nothing, has no legal relevance at all.
Its all a waste of time and energy. Britain should have cut ties already many months ago, even unilaterally. After all, exit still means exit, and not staying inside and staying outside at the same time.
May makes a pitiful carricature of office now with her compassion-for-May tour, live on European stages these days. She could as well try to bring Jericho'S walls to fall by kneeling and crying before them.
For reaosns of credibility of the poltical class and system, ther emust be new elections to get rid of May, and then a brutal new govenrment simply cutting ties, basta. By now, however, any Brexit will be far more damaging to britian that I think originally it would have needed to be if the Brits would have cut ties unilaterally already 12, 18 months go, in a surprise first strike, inclduing a temporary full halt to all financial business from and to the UK. Calling for tough game and then not playing it tough, is stupid. Good deeds soon will find their revenge. States - and international state alliances - have no friends. They have interests. Everybody seems to be drunk and done over all this sentimental friendship talking. The successful states in the present are howeever those that refuse to play kind and friendly. Russia. China. Trump's USA. Economical South Korea, Vietnam, Singapore. Survival of the fittest - that includes not just races and individuals, it also is true for nations. And the West gives a pitiful, ridiculous sight.
Skybird
12-11-18, 10:16 AM
We have no functioning Parliament we have no opposition and no government. What we got is a Parliament that is stagnating a opposition lusting for power and a government that is not running the country. Brexit has turned the whole place in to a giant kinder-garden of nappy wearing politicians to busy screaming at each other.
As it stands democracy is dead.
Is this the Germany thread?
Jimbuna
12-11-18, 02:04 PM
One Tory MP who supported the PM's deal told me they didn't have a clue what was happening now. "We're rewriting the pantomime," they added. Another pondered: "The Conservatives made this muddle - who is going to fix it?" One minister concluded things were at "breaking point".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46515743
Well, whatwill it be....BREXIT without a deal or the UK to remain in the EU?
Either way, May is finished.
Jimbuna
12-11-18, 02:55 PM
Brexit vote: What could happen next?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46393399
Tory Brexiteers are increasingly confident they have enough support to trigger a no-confidence vote in Theresa May as party leader.https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46532747
It could be true, we could see in the news tomorrow Maybot's days are over.
Catfish
12-12-18, 02:33 AM
^ and then all will be so happy :haha:
Good for Boris and Nigel to run away in time.
Jimbuna
12-12-18, 05:54 AM
It is now official, May will face a confidence vote tonight.
I've a sneaky suspicion she will survive unless one of the prominent leaders of her opposition are prepared to pick up and drink from the poisoned chalice and put themselves forward for her job.
What an awful bloody choice that would be :hmmm:
UK Prime Minister Theresa May will face a vote of confidence in her leadership later on Wednesday.
Speaking outside 10 Downing Street, Mrs May said: "I will contest that vote with everything I have got."
She said a new prime minister would have to scrap or extend Article 50, the mechanism taking Britain out of the EU on 29 March, "delaying or even stopping Brexit".
Conservative MPs will vote from 18:00 GMT to 20:00 GMT.
A result is expected an hour or so later.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46535739
SKY News sources say she will win well.
Anna Soubry MP made me laugh, she said these 48 odd were not democratic. Ready for this? Here goes......They should be purged from the party! That seems to me not democracy you stupid woman.
Jimbuna
12-12-18, 07:06 AM
Purged from the party and in doing so further raising a majority currently at -10 to -50+.....political suicide.
Corbyn and the fear of him getting the keys to no 10 will or should be her saving grace.
Old Jezzer is hitting back today and MayBot is ducking and diving with her same old worn out statements as normal. Maybot hits back right at the end with her old gem.
Jimbuna
12-12-18, 07:17 AM
The Song Remains the Same
Leader of the SNP has ask will we get the vote next week? Maybot ducking the question as norm.
The big question is will Brexit happen?? :doh:
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