UK Politics Thread

[Jimbuna]

Rather interesting to see the results of a post debate poll on who won the debate last night.

The poll of 13,000 gave it to Boris 52% to 48% the same result as the EU referendum coincidentally.

[STEED]

Rather interesting to see the results of a post debate poll on who won the debate last night.

The poll of 13,000 gave it to Boris 52% to 48% the same result as the EU referendum coincidentally.

Polls are a load of dribble.

I saw one putting Boris on 82 seats majority. :haha: :har:

As if..:03:

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/HsxJqNGk/78861404-2655390504544776-5083415891593396224-n.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[STEED]

https://media.makeameme.org/created/hook-line-and-e02ce79465.jpg

General election 2019: Reddit says UK-US trade talks document leak 'linked to Russia'https://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-trending-50695558


Reel in the nameless one. :haha:




https://media.makeameme.org/created/vote-for-the-4200080715.jpg

[Jimbuna]

Russia is now the scapegoat for any political wrongdoing in the West.

[Jimbuna]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJB9JlZYZmU

[Jimbuna]

I suppose this one was inevitable.

https://i.postimg.cc/WbLWSxhx/Untitled.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
https://i.postimg.cc/dt2WfnC3/Untitled2.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Jimbuna]

These buggas are coming in quicker than I can copy them :o

https://i.postimg.cc/BQnLWnLF/Untitled.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
https://i.postimg.cc/nhsXzS1c/Untitled2.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[mapuc]

Your Labour party is in opposition to the government and do as other parties around the world, gives lots and lots of promises and point fingers at the government.

But how well did Labour do it, when they was in charge of the country ?

Markus

[STEED]

Your Labour party is in opposition to the government and do as other parties around the world, gives lots and lots of promises and point fingers at the government.

But how well did Labour do it, when they was in charge of the country ?

Markus

https://www.bing.com/images/search?view=detailV2&ccid=YGy1fkSd&id=B8B04E6A746CBB25BA70F7900FCC7EFC389E99C4&thid=OIP.YGy1fkSdZzyFZY1KQhsTAwHaDi&mediaurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.markpack.org.uk%2Ffiles% 2F2016%2F10%2FLiam-Byrne-there-is-no-money-left-note-790x378.png&exph=378&expw=790&q=labour+note+there+is+no+money+left&simid=608034409138881486&selectedindex=0&ajaxhist=0&vt=4&eim=1,2,3,4,6,8&sim=11

And if they win this time with Marxism well and truly at the helm then it will be game over

[JU_88]

labours collective mantra contains some of these gems:



Infinate money for public services via tax hikes and over borrowing.

Equality of opporutiny doesnt garrentee equal outcome so forced equity is justified.

infinate mass immigration is completley sustainable (hence why said public services will need said infinate money)

White people are all privaleged and oppressive unless they study unconsious bias.

Rich people and sucessful companies are generally got there by stealing from /exploiting society

Gender is social construct. men are only physically stronger because they were encoraged to do sports, while women were excluded.

Anybody can be socialised to be anything you want them to be.

Scananavia is socialist

Hugo Chavez is did nothing wrong - its all Americas fault.


But .... free broadband yay! :up:

[Jimbuna]

https://i.ibb.co/3pNxYTr/Untitled3.jpg (https://imgbb.com/)

[Jimbuna]

https://i.ibb.co/jJ2WjKk/Untitled.jpg (https://ibb.co/tLtx1fp)
https://i.ibb.co/v3V1CY1/Untitled2.jpg (https://imgbb.com/)

[STEED]

EVERYBODY WHO VOTES LABOUR WILL RECEIVE £10,000 IN SPENDING MONEY FREE, YES WE SAID FREE. ALL YOU HAVE TO DO IS VOTE LABOUR AND THE MONEY IS YOURS

[JU_88]

If they did that ^ I might actual vote for them, every man has his price y'know. :Kaleun_Cheers:
Then again - im sure they would seize it back though taxes as soon as they came in to power :D

[mapuc]

I have access to BBC World Service on my radio(DAB)

I hope I also can access one of your public channels like BBC 1 or 2
(on my computer) I guess I will be meet with some text unable broadcast outside UK.

Markus

[Jimbuna]

John McDonnell will promise to deliver a Budget to "end austerity", in a speech setting out Labour's priorities for its first 100 days in government.

The shadow chancellor will also vow to get "money moving out of Whitehall and the City" if Labour wins the election.

And he will detail plans for "democratic control" of newly nationalised water and energy firms.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50704546

And the band played 'Believe It If You Like'

[STEED]

I have access to BBC World Service on my radio(DAB)

I hope I also can access one of your public channels like BBC 1 or 2
(on my computer) I guess I will be meet with some text unable broadcast outside UK.

Markus
You need a BBC licence, sorry a TV licence as these thugs have clamped down even on pensioner's who will loose their free TV licence next June. Bloody Bias Crap over paid bums bringing you brainwashing crap all year around and getting people locked up for watching a few seconds of their pressure's crap.....

Shall I go on? :03:

[STEED]

Jim is voting labour, the post is unmodified. :haha:

[STEED]

General election 2019: Why is it so hard to know who to vote for?

Not yet made up your mind how to vote on Thursday? You're not alone. Three days before the election, many voters are struggling to find a party that offers what they want.https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50637620

THE NHS
All of them treat the NHS as some kind of point scoring football giving them the right to bang on how well the NHS would be in their hands. This is BS as all of them have failed the NHS

BREXIT
I no longer give a dam because I do not believe it will ever happen, just move on and forget it.

TRUST
None what so ever, all the mainstream party's are liars just look at all the lies they have spouted in the last few weeks.

MONEY
As the old saying goes what the government gives to you in one hand they rob you with the other.


I urge you all do not vote for the Con/Lib/Lab. Rock the boat and sink these three by voting for some one else.

[Jimbuna]

Jim is voting labour, the post is unmodified. :haha:

Have you taken your medication today? :hmmm:

[STEED]

Have you taken your medication today? :hmmm:
:har: :har:

If labour wins I get all the medication free under the sun. :sunny:

And laughing gas. :haha:

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/zvXwgTJj/tumblr-opue91k-WMa1v439qzo3-500.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/sfvt5Qwn/Untitled.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
https://i.postimg.cc/BZkRpSzJ/Untitled2.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Skybird]

Interesting buttons.


"Show me xyz in your area." A thinking man would have labelled them "show me xyz in my area."



Will we see the beginning of the decorbynization of the UK tomorrow? Else Labour would need to sell Corbyn certificates to fight the pollution and force it down.

[Jimbuna]

Interesting buttons.


"Show me xyz in your area." A thinking man would have labelled them "show me xyz in my area."



Will we see the beginning of the decorbynization of the UK tomorrow? Else Labour would need to sell Corbyn certificates to fight the pollution and force it down.

True that.

These emails are starting to come more and more as we near Thursdays voting day.

[JU_88]

Tuesdays one will be a picture of Corbyn with his cap in hand,

Wednesdays one will be a bunny with a AK47 to its head.


"Last chance to chip in Comrade, you wouldnt make us hurt a bunny would you?!"

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/BvqNqkj8/ELWo-SFf-Ww-AMa-Tij.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[JU_88]

Silly man, Instead of promising endless freebies all he had to do was say, 'yeah well we'll get brexit done too' and he'd be neck and neck with Borris probably.
But instead he answers the brexit question like:
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-fmsKdL7UuQA/Tja4HDFAMbI/AAAAAAAAABo/p4AFwBowVuM/s1600/dia2.gif

[Jimbuna]

Billionaire John Caudwell goes head-to-head with Labour's John McDonnell.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/world-europe-50691677/billionaire-john-caudwell-goes-head-to-head-with-labour-s-john-mcdonnell

[Jimbuna]

Just in, somebody is working late tonight then.

https://i.postimg.cc/CLPqScQm/Untitled4.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
https://i.postimg.cc/T3vXL6Fw/Untitled5.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Jimbuna]

Boris Johnson has said the possible abolition of the BBC licence fee needs "looking at".

Speaking at a rally in Sunderland, the prime minister questioned how much longer funding a broadcaster out of "a general tax" could be "justified".

Ministers have agreed the licence fee will stay in place until at least 2027, when the BBC's Royal Charter ends.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50718366

Sunderland eh?

He's wasting his time and breath because nobody in Sunderland has one :)

[mapuc]

This week our Danish news channel have a half hour about the upcoming British election.

There was to thing I noticed in today's episode.

1. Our politicians lack morale.
Saw a clip where the leader of Labour toke advantage of a little 4 years old boy who could not get a bed in the hospital. He tried to gain political points by this.
(His party will not do any better)

2. There seems to be a disagreement in the Labour party about this Brexit thing
and many who use to vote Labour are going to vote Tories.
The reason for this, was to get the Brexit done.

Markus

[JU_88]

Politicians will use children in publicity stunts, nothing new there.
Labour is mostly pro remain, as its a left wing mix of progressive liberal lefties & neo marxists who are basically all pro remain by default, pro mass immigration, pro expanding government and public services. etc there are a minory of the old gaurd lefties, workers party types who are pro leave, but not many of them. Its hardly a 50/50 split, Labour will still probably win most seats in the metropolitian areas where they always do well. But they have long since alienated most of the working class they used to represent. They get alot of support from migrant communities, Young voters, hippies and educated well-to-do middle class types.

The Conservatives are now the right leaning moderate party, who are basically pro free markets and privatisation, their policy is basically get brexit done and busniess as usual. They are not offering any kind of radical change at all.
but they are more equaly divided along the lines of brexit and remain. But they are going with the leave platform because they know that alone is probably the winning ticket. So they are now headed up by soft brexiteers more or less.
They are the party of least resistance, in that they'll just do what ever they think is most popular to stay in power. these days they dont really have a very strong stance on anything in particular. (they used to be alot more staunchly right wing though) Now they get support from the Rural areas and small towns and working class folks as well as wealthy elites /oligarchs, busniess owners etc)

[Jimbuna]

Senior politicians faced questions on housing, climate change and trust from an audience of young people in a Question Time election special.

The election debate also saw exchanges over Brexit and the possibility of another referendum.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50722313

Good on them, it made interesting viewing.

[JU_88]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8MlfY-H841U

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/G2mbbTmY/2w84uj.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Jimbuna]

Good on them, it made interesting viewing.

Under-30s Question Time: The Highlights. It gets even better.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/election-2019-50726000/under-30s-question-time-the-highlights

[STEED]

A Cruel and Unusual Election, Animation 2019

:haha: The summing up of the LD's was spot on. :har: :up:

[Jimbuna]

Just in and the tone is beginning to get a little more desperate.

https://i.postimg.cc/L4P587k8/Untitled.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
https://i.postimg.cc/5NM0Y3pq/Untitled2.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[STEED]

Under-30s Question Time: The Highlights. It gets even better.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/election-2019-50726000/under-30s-question-time-the-highlights

THE LABOUR PARTY IS THE LOONY PARTY, YES I SAID LOONY PARTY SO STUFF YOUR PC CRAP UP YOUR......:O: :O: :O: :O:

BARKING MAD LOONY PARTY THROWING MONEY AROUND TO GET VOTES HOW CRASS IS THAT!

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/NFxwr1fp/2ez8yv.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Skybird]

Hey...! Somehow I was convinced that election would be today...

[Jimbuna]

And still they keep on coming.

https://i.postimg.cc/0yjLjF6B/Untitled.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
https://i.postimg.cc/jS1B7cPd/Untitled2.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
https://i.postimg.cc/R0nyQtL1/Untitled4.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
https://i.postimg.cc/B69yhvmr/Untitled5.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Jimbuna]

Now this could well be true because it is a well known fact Steptoe is not supported by a growing number of Labour MP's.

Labour's Jonathan Ashworth has apologised to his party after criticising Jeremy Corbyn in a secret recording by his Tory activist friend.

In a recording leaked to Tory-supporting website Guido Fawkes, Mr Ashworth is heard saying he did not believe Labour would win the election.

Mr Ashworth has insisted he was "joshing around" in the conversation.

The conversation appears to have been recorded over a week ago and Mr Ashworth said: "The reason this has come out today is because the Tories know the crisis in the NHS is ruining their campaign and we've got babies - babies - on the front page of the Daily Mirror unable to get a bed."

Mr Ashworth named the friend he was speaking to as former local Conservative Association chairman, Greig Baker, and he did not deny that he made the remarks.

In the recording, Mr Ashworth appears to refer to an unsuccessful plot to oust Mr Corbyn, instigated by some of his MPs in the aftermath of the EU referendum.

"People like me were internally saying 'this isn't the right moment' but I got kind of ignored," Mr Ashworth is recorded as saying.

On Labour's election chances, Mr Ashworth is heard saying: "I've been going round these national places, it's dire for Labour… it's dire.

"I'm helping colleagues, banging on about the NHS for them but it's awful for them, and it's the combination of Corbyn and Brexit… outside of the city seats…it's abysmal out there…they can't stand Corbyn and they think Labour's blocked Brexit."

On the recording, Mr Ashworth is asked: If Mr Corbyn "got in would he be as bad as I suspect?"

"I don't know, on the security stuff, I worked in No 10, I think the machine will pretty quickly move to safeguard security, I mean the civil service machine. But it's not going to happen. I cannot see it happening."
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50726592

[Jimbuna]

In relation to the comment made bold above about babies unable to access a bed in hospital read the story from yesterday linked below.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50717606

Now, surprise surprise.

https://i.postimg.cc/g2M4X09V/78640643-2606832979396635-1185769676479660032-n.jpg (https://postimg.cc/cvnfP0LC)

[Jimbuna]

Ever wondered why I, amongst a great many others refer to him as Steptoe the Tramp?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wZsYvkTw4Rg

[Moonlight]

@Jimbuna, an interesting assessment of the situation by an unknown person who apparently was not there at the hospital when that image was taken.

I, or anyone else could have posted that same image with an explanation refuting his allegation that that bed was not empty.

The fact is that my 255 yrs old granny 15 times removed was in that bed next to that child eating cheese and drinking prosecco while watching another re-run of Star Trek 89.
Do you see how this disinformation thingie works now, if it can't be verified don't trust the source, he can't verify that what he wrote is true and neither can I.

Matt Hancock the health secretary has spoken with the hospital management and no denials have been forthcoming from him, so we can take the original story as a true account of what happened and everyone else's version as a pile of garbage.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50717606

[JU_88]

you can pick anything appart, if you look for problems. Like all them 9/11 conspiricy people, 'look the planes wing dissapears in this frame of video' proof it was a hologram! - or it could be that aluminium is shiney and reflective.....


Basically If it fits my narrative it must be legit, if doesnt then its fake.

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/Wz7g14rZ/Untitled.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
https://i.postimg.cc/Xvy5yLd4/Untitled2.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[STEED]

In relation to the comment made bold above about babies unable to access a bed in hospital read the story from yesterday linked below.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50717606

Now, surprise surprise.

https://i.postimg.cc/g2M4X09V/78640643-2606832979396635-1185769676479660032-n.jpg (https://postimg.cc/cvnfP0LC)When I see this sort of thing I move on and have no feeling about it anyway. I distrust social media to much fake news that swamps the real news.

[STEED]

Ok time for the big three...

I think LibDems will loose seats and so will Labour. I am not saying to who as that will all come to light over the weekend under the microscope.

I think bojo will win with a majority upto 25 seats but I will not rule out another hung parliament.


COMING SOON WILL STEED BE VOTING?

THE ANSWER IS ON THE WAY....:yep:

[Jimbuna]

JUST IN: A day before the election and the begging for money continues.

https://i.postimg.cc/nL0wWHM3/Untitled.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
https://i.postimg.cc/0QjHRLwP/Untitled2.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[STEED]

STAND BY FOR STEED.....

MORE TO COME...

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/gJMjr6j3/78697511-2714387668626876-7900765664397230080-n.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Skybird]

High time that this exercise in skull curettage gets done with. I've started to miss May. The pills I took brought no relief.

[Jimbuna]

High time that this exercise in skull curettage gets done with. I've started to miss May. The pills I took brought no relief.

https://i.postimg.cc/NF43Q10w/440154751d5922693cbcf73a9dd10c8f.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[STEED]

At almost the eleventh hour well near as dam it buried under a pile BS and lies from the LibDems scum I found.....

A leaflet from at long last my Independent Candidate, I read it and after much much thinking I can say that......


STEED WILL BE VOTING FOR MY INDEPENDENT CANDIDATE

Because this candidate was down to earth and made no big promise, what a breath of fresh air.

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/DwWMNV1h/f4fc90b6b7195e48c056445224e5df2a.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[STEED]

Jim relax with the anti labour posting I am voting Independent. :03:

Chill old bean you don't need to tell me how bad labour is.

:haha: :)

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/Bv0BBRgM/32qwrk.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[mapuc]

Two things in this posting
1
If I should take what our news channel show us from UK and your ongoing election as the truth
Then:

None of UK citizens are interested in leaving EU.
None of UK citizens are going to vote Tories, and some are not going to vote Labour.
(The last few days Danish TV have interviewet many British people on the street and I have so far not heard any of them saying like "Have to leave EU" and/or "I'm going vote for Boris/Tories")

2.
What would you consider to be
The worst case scenario(s) ?
and
The best case scenario(s) ?

Markus

[STEED]

VOTE INDEPENDENT

VOTE INDEPENDENT




DO NOT VOTE FOR LIARS, THE CONSERVATIVES AND LABOUR AND LIBDEMS HAVE TOLD A PACK OF LIES.

[mapuc]

^ Do you mean the British people should vote independent and not follow the news and what all you party leader say how to vote ?

Or

Is there a party in UK with that name ?
(tried to search for such a party with no success)

Markus

[STEED]

^ Do you mean the British people should vote independent and not follow the news and what all you party leader say how to vote ?

Or

Is there a party in UK with that name ?
(tried to search for such a party with no success)

MarkusIndependent candidates are not attached to any political party's so they do not tow the party line as they are freelance independent free from the dogma liars of the mainstream party's.

[JU_88]

Two things in this posting
1
If I should take what our news channel show us from UK and your ongoing election as the truth
Then:

None of UK citizens are interested in leaving EU.
None of UK citizens are going to vote Tories, and some are not going to vote Labour.

Markus


:o thats some...interesting 'reporting'..... to say the least.

[Skybird]

Mapuc, your Swedish media seem to go a similar way like many of our German ones: mixing wishfuk thuinking and opinion with reporting the real thing, and turnign the news into a propaganda show. All hail the EU regime and its rightful claims and policies! Tar and feathers for those who want to tack instead of tick! This continent is widely gleichgeschaltet, according to the EU.

[Jimbuna]

:o thats some...interesting 'reporting'..... to say the least.

Seconded :yep:

I'm still undecided which way to vote. I know the sitting Labour MP personally and can't/won't vote Labour. I've no idea who the Tory candidate is because none of the parties knocked on my door this time round, nor did I receive any campaign leaflets.

So that narrows it down to two, Independant and Brexit.

Time will tell.

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/d37Qstyt/Untitled.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
https://i.postimg.cc/FFqsPcMf/Untitled2.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Jimbuna]

Borderline harassment in my opinion.

https://i.postimg.cc/4yT5QnQm/Untitled.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
https://i.postimg.cc/BbcCYsmN/Untitled2.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[ikalugin]

Could you destroy/nulify the ballot?

[Jimbuna]

Yet another but too late I've already voted.

https://i.postimg.cc/J0xTqgcf/Untitled.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
https://i.postimg.cc/RVCpFSv4/Untitled2.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/yNd4Mmb4/79688969-2510249249229876-443028848699768832-o.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

:har:

[Jimbuna]

Off out now so this should be the last nuisance mail I read before the election result is announced.

https://i.postimg.cc/fTwHqwP1/Untitled.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
https://i.postimg.cc/RVXgjk5h/Untitled2.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Mr Quatro]

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/live/2019/dec/12/general-election-2019-uk-live-labour-tories-corbyn-boris-johnson-results-exit-poll

at some polling stations people have been turning up in such large numbers as to generate very long queues. People have been waiting half an hour or more in some places to vote. This is not normal, and may turn out to be a signal that something unexpected is about to happen

[mapuc]

368 Mandates to the Tories and only 191 to Labour

What a surprise if this exit polls stand.

Which it hardly do.

Markus

[Skybird]

In Brussels they must hate what they see.

[Jimbuna]

368 Mandates to the Tories and only 191 to Labour

What a surprise if this exit polls stand.

Which it hardly do.

Markus

You'd better believe it :)

Early indications are an 86 seat majority for Boris and a clear vindication for calling a snap election.

[Jimbuna]

In Brussels they must hate what they see.

They share a large portion of the blame for what could be about to happen in the eyes of many Brits.

[STEED]

Please please lets see labour crushed into the pigs swill dirt. And from the ashes rises a brand new moderate labour that has thrown off the shackles of Marxism and that vile momentum and good riddance to the nameless one.


News in on LBC Swinson could loose her seat, SNP have got a good 90% chance to win it. Oh please lets have double joy please.

[mapuc]

I'm sitting and watching the Danish news channel and throughout the night they are broadcasting live from the British election(no I'm not going to stay up all night)

about a half hour ago, one of their reporter visit Labour where they have their election party(maybe not the correct word)

She interviewet some maleperson.

Can't remember every word he said. But the words I do remember, made me wonder.

He said " Corbyn went from hero to zero over night"

Now I wonder-If this polls stand will the top and others important people in the labour party demand Corbyn being keelhauled ?

Markus

[Jimbuna]

I ponder on one question should Labour fail drastically: It is a long held Labour tradition that after a general election defeat the leader makes way for a new one. Will this happen this time or will Momentum hang on to the power they currently have after decades of trying and protect Steptoe?

Only time will tell.

[Jimbuna]

I'm sitting and watching the Danish news channel and throughout the night they are broadcasting live from the British election(no I'm not going to stay up all night)

about a half hour ago, one of their reporter visit Labour where they have their election party(maybe not the correct word)

She interviewet some maleperson.

Can't remember every word he said. But the words I do remember, made me wonder.

He said " Corbyn went from hero to zero over night"

Now I wonder-If this polls stand will the top and others important people in the labour party demand Corbyn being keelhauled ?

Markus

We cross posted Markus but in answer to you I suspect there will be an internal civil war between the left and right wing factions meaning the Labour Party will be the loser whichever way it goes.

[STEED]

I ponder on one question should Labour fail drastically: It is a long held Labour tradition that after a general election defeat the leader makes way for a new one. Will this happen this time or will Momentum hang on to the power they currently have after decades of trying and protect Steptoe?

Only time will tell.
It be the rallying call to the moderates their time has come to don the armour and lop off the head of the nameless one. This is their hour they must act on it.

[Jimbuna]

It be the rallying call to the moderates their time has come to don the armour and lop off the head of the nameless one. This is their hour they must act on it.

The moderates as you refer to them are hopelessly outnumbered at the present time.

[STEED]

The moderates as you refer to them are hopelessly outnumbered at the present time.
What is left for them, they tried the big give away. Abolish tax, free cigarettes and beer and a free third car, no one is going to fall for their crap anymore they are finished and they know it.

[mapuc]

We cross posted Markus but in answer to you I suspect there will be an internal civil war between the left and right wing factions meaning the Labour Party will be the loser whichever way it goes.

Thank you for the answer.

I guess they also will "investigate" where it went wrong and with my little knowledge about parties who have lost big time in an election...they will blame others for it.

Second.

SNP can forget everything regarding a second referendum-if Tories win with this majority.(said on Danish tv)

Markus

[STEED]

Early news on my seat the vote is very close and could swing to the LibDems. Oh no this is bad if this happens. Result due from 4am onwards, I will be asleep some of us have to go to work you know.

[STEED]

Right I am off to bed so its down to jim to post like a mad man as the results come in. I will be back Saturday will my views on outcome of this election.

[Jimbuna]

Early news on my seat the vote is very close and could swing to the LibDems. Oh no this is bad if this happens. Result due from 4am onwards, I will be asleep some of us have to go to work you know.

Cry me a river :)

[Jimbuna]

Thank you for the answer.

I guess they also will "investigate" where it went wrong and with my little knowledge about parties who have lost big time in an election...they will blame others for it.

Second.

SNP can forget everything regarding a second referendum-if Tories win with this majority.(said on Danish tv)

Markus

It is looking like the SNP will increase their number of seats which will mean that in their view it is more likely the Scottish people will be seeking independence.

[ikalugin]

So, did anyone blame Putin yet?

[Kapitan]

Well it is done conservatives have a majority well above the 326 needed as it stands at 0730 GMT

Con 363
Lab 203
SNP 48
LD 11
DUP 8
OTH 14

2 Seats to declare

[Skybird]

Corbyn says he is not to lead the party into another campaign, but refuses - so far - to step down immediately, saiyng he wants to contribute moderating a chnage in the party.

Political drivel for: "I need time to clean and hide the traces of my crime".

Will Abott leave, too? Hell, that woman is so repugnant even if not opening her sound escape hatch.


Declaration of Brexit is a clear thing now, no doubt.



And after January the real difficult work begins. Until here it was just the easier part. Overture.

[JU_88]

So, did anyone blame Putin yet?


Not yet :P
But I would expect the argument from the more unhinged momentum types "that it 'because of neo liberal Blairite racsist ninja sabateurs' or (god help us) 'we clearly didnt go left enough' < the cognitive dissonance in that one is really quite amazing! :o
On a serious note though, its sad that some of the Labour MP's unseated last night were actually some of the better and more level headed ones and not the London bubble Momentum weirdos who actually run the party now.


This is what happned in a nut shell.


Conservatives to the working Classes:

"While we will probably fail to deliver it, please tell us what it is you want and we''ll maybe try and do it..... sort of.


Labour to the working Classes :

This is what WE think you SHOULD want. WE insist it must be done this way and you MUST like it, or you're a bad person!

[Jimbuna]

Can't say I'm overly surprised by the election result but I admit anything could have happened.

Quite pleasing to see the list of those who became traitors to their party and those who elected them to serve under said party. (Mirror link below but regardless of what anyone might think of the source, it is accurate).
https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/what-happened-labour-tory-rebels-21088627

I'm wondering what Momentum will do regarding choosing a successor to Corbyn because they certainly won't want to lose their grip on the running of the party.

Much will depend on that choice but I believe they are prepared to remain being a party in opposition if it means they control it.

[Jimbuna]

One more thing, Sturgeon is sure to see the SNP successes last night as a green light for IndyRef2.

This came in last night just twenty minutes after the voting had closed.

I wonder if that will be the end of it all now.

https://i.postimg.cc/4NkNWYw5/Untitled.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
https://i.postimg.cc/VLqspzVc/Untitled2.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[STEED]

Well it has happen first time in history the LibDems take my seat! :o

I think what happened here was clearly a protest vote against the former Conservative MP, as this area at general election time is 99% Conservative. I'm sure the Conservatives will win the seat back as this LibDem is barking mad.

On the upside Adolf Swinson lost her seat. :haha:

[STEED]

Jo Swinson will step down as Liberal Democrat leader after losing her seat to the SNP by 149 votes.

Ms Swinson, who started the campaign saying she could become the next prime minister, gained 19,523 votes compared with 19,672 for the SNP's Amy Callaghan in Dunbartonshire East.

Sir Ed Davey and Baroness Sal Brinton will be acting co-leaders for the party, now she is no longer an MP.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50771123

:har: :har:

[Jimbuna]

Well it has happen first time in history the LibDems take my seat! :o

I think what happened here was clearly a protest vote against the former Conservative MP, as this area at general election time is 99% Conservative. I'm sure the Conservatives will win the seat back as this LibDem is barking mad.

On the upside Adolf Swinson lost her seat. :haha:

What constituency are you in?

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/SKMmLq85/77142651-10220014049518427-2644392835658285056-n.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Jimbuna]

What constituency are you in?

Doesn't matter, that will have been Daisy Cooper and your Independant would be Jules Sherrington.
https://i.postimg.cc/PJ3GsFYY/512x512bb.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Skybird]

And it occasionally happens that a German commentator has something like this to say about Brexit:


https://translate.google.de/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.focus.de%2Fpolitik%2Fausland%2 Fgastbeitrag-von-gabor-steingart-sieben-missverstaendnisse-zum-brexit-die-man-den-deutschen-als-fakten-einreden-will_id_11454943.html


In other media however the reinterpretation of the outcome, despite the clearness of the result, already is being driven with a passion. It cannot be what should not be - and if it ihappens nevertehless, at least the violator of the wanted ideology is more or less openly wished a bloody punishment for this heresy. "Congratulations, Brits! We wish you the worst of all futures, so that you end up well-taught in the future!"



British voters are hereby promoted to the rank of "offender".:Kaleun_Salute:
We have had now TWO referendums about Brexit.

[Skybird]

Questions remain however about the Scotts. Will they seek to split? And will the Northern Irish seek to unite with the Republic?


I also wonder whether the huge majority means that Johnosn must not pay as much attention to radical Brexiteers, making him signing a softer deal with the EU. Would be kind of perplexing and anti-intuitive.

[Jimbuna]

BREAKING NEWS

https://i.postimg.cc/Hk02r8vP/Untitled.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[STEED]

Election results 2019: Brexit Party 'killed Lib Dems and hurt Labour' - Faragehttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50766123

Really.:hmmm:

[STEED]

My low point of the results
Head bangers here voted for a nutter whom would be better suited in extinction rebellion.

My high point of the results
Nicola sturgeon caught on camera celebrating Jo Swinson losing her seat.


What were your lows and highs? :)

[JU_88]

Im just happy we said no to what is basically radical socialism out of blind empathy - dressed as 'social democracy' to make it more palatable.

Im not going to apologise for not wanting to live in Venezuala :P


I take no joy in seeing peoples hopes and dreams shattered even if I dont agree with them.
I feel kinda bad for Corbyn and Swinson, and Im sorry that their respective ideologies blinded them to reality.


Their are many in the Labour Party that know exactly what's gone wrong, But the momentum Zelots cant see it and they never will. All they will take away from this is thats its all everyone elses fault.
the Tories / far right / the Murdoch rags / brexiteers / neo liberals / Blairites / Moderate lefties / Trump / Israel / Russian bots / The corperations/ Internet trolls etc
and that the solution is that they Should double down and go even further left. Like any radical, they will never take any responsibility or self reflect.


I can see more of the old gaurd and moderates getting booted and bullied out of the Labour Party in the months and years to come, because Momentum are calling the shots now.
We are at the point that they should just change the official Party name from Labour to Momentum, because thats what it has become.
I'm not sure Labour can be salvaged. I hope it can though, because we NEED a sensible and stong opposition party to the Tories. And one that actually bloody listens instead of just moral preaching.
It was the Brexit election.

The Tories won because (for once) they listened and were reluctantly willing to compromise. Labour lost because they would neither clarify or budge and just tried to change the subject. They simply couldnt do what was being asked of them because it was in conflict with progressive values and neo marxist dogma.

The Conservative goverment is basically 10 years old and its been quite a car crash, at this point in time Any other Labour Goverment should have been able to wipe the floor with them.

[Kapitan]

Wait I don’t like this result can we have another one

[mapuc]

Well if anyone was in some doubt whether the British people want to leave EU or not. They do not have to doubt anymore.

Markus

[JU_88]

Well if anyone was in some doubt whether the British people want to leave EU or not. They do not have to doubt anymore.

Markus


No because you will still get the Remain argument that if you add Labour, SNP and Libdem votes together you get a remain majority. :P
Its never so easy or simple :03:

[FeatsOfStrength]

Labour, Conservatives, Brexit or No-Brexit there doesn't seem to be anyone doing anything serious about the issue of British assets being sold wholesale to China. It's treated as though they are some free-market foreign venture capitalist investors, who consider the UK to be a "good investment", when in reality any money spent on foreign assets by Chinese businesses is more to do with securing the geo-political goals of the Politburo than to wanting to invest in our country in good faith. They don't spend a penny without taking their long-term totalitarian strategy into account, and it's not aimed at promoting Freedom & Liberal Democracy.

After Brexit I imagine this issue will only get worse, not that it's not an issue within the EU already, but at least there was some protection in being a part of a unified block. I don't see Brexit as "Independence" I see it as opening the door to more acrid foreign influence, that to some extent EU regulations (often touted as being red tape regarding bendy bananas) protected us from.

No one thinks long term any more, all the politics in our country provide are empty promises and short term returns.

[Moonlight]

My low point of the results
Head bangers here voted for a nutter whom would be better suited in extinction rebellion.

My high point of the results
Nicola sturgeon caught on camera celebrating Jo Swinson losing her seat.


What were your lows and highs? :)

High point.
There were 2 of them, Jo Swinson losing her seat to the SNP and Chucky egg Umunna's political career in tatters.

Low point.
Caroline Flint losing her seat, one of Labour's better MP's me thinks, but even she was turning to the dark side at times. :yep:

[Skybird]

Labour, Conservatives, Brexit or No-Brexit there doesn't seem to be anyone doing anything serious about the issue of British assets being sold wholesale to China. It's treated as though they are some free-market foreign venture capitalist investors, who consider the UK to be a "good investment", when in reality any money spent on foreign assets by Chinese businesses is more to do with securing the geo-political goals of the Politburo than to wanting to invest in our country in good faith. They don't spend a penny without taking their long-term totalitarian strategy into account, and it's not aimed at promoting Freedom & Liberal Democracy.

After Brexit I imagine this issue will only get worse, not that it's not an issue within the EU already, but at least there was some protection in being a part of a unified block. I don't see Brexit as "Independence" I see it as opening the door to more acrid foreign influence, that to some extent EU regulations (often touted as being red tape regarding bendy bananas) protected us from.

No one thinks long term any more, all the politics in our country provide are empty promises and short term returns.
Wait until the Americans start to pull you over the table. The lil boy in the White House already sits in the starting block.
Not as if I do not think the Brits could not realise and prevent it. Its just whether the government even wants it, spoiling some of its already sold illusions that way. The US has the longer lever here. Britain may need to learn to say No to the costs for their "special relationship".


Wanting less, managing own ressources moderately. Low tax regime to rival the high taxing schemes of the EU. Finding allies outside the circle of the usual suspects, I would hint at India, as one example. And resosting to get closely bound again to the EU by any EU special trade deal" that binds the UK to tight EU regulations once again.

[Jimbuna]

Wait until the Americans start to pull you over the table. The lil boy in the White House already sits in the starting block.
Not as if I do not think the Brits could not realise and prevent it. Its just whether the government even wants it, spoiling some of its already sold illusions that way. The US has the longer lever here. Britain may need to learn to say No to the costs for their "special relationship".


Wanting less, managing own ressources moderately. Low tax regime to rival the high taxing schemes of the EU. Finding allies outside the circle of the usual suspects, I would hint at India, as one example. And resosting to get closely bound again to the EU by any EU special trade deal" that binds the UK to tight EU regulations once again.

I admit that is one of my concerns but Boris now has a substantial majority and is safe in the knowledge he has the support of the majority of the UK population, for now anyway.

[Jimbuna]

Jeremy Corbyn says he did "everything he could" to get Labour into power and will not "walk away" until another leader is elected.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50784811

You most certainly did and a sizeable majority of the UK population are extremely grateful for your efforts :)

[Jimbuna]

Nicola Sturgeon says Boris Johnson has "no right" to stand in the way of another Scottish independence referendum after an "overwhelming" SNP election victory.

Scotland's first minister said the result "renews, reinforces and strengthens" the mandate for Indyref2.

During the campaign, the prime minister said he would reject any request to hold an independence referendum.

But Ms Sturgeon said it was "the right of the people of Scotland".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50779724

No flies on Nicola, she is quick off the mark to start what will most probably be the next political hot potato.

I'll say this right from the off....give her the referendum she wants so much but not until she agrees to two conditions...
1) You need to find an alternative currency to the pound sterling because that is underwritten by the Bank of England.
2) You pre-agree what percentage of the national debt you would take with you.

[Skybird]

I'll say this right from the off....give her the referendum she wants so much but not until she agrees to two conditions...
1) You need to find an alternative currency to the pound sterling because that is underwritten by the Bank of England.
2) You pre-agree what percentage of the national debt you would take with you.
3. You will self-maintain your economy and currecny and community needs.
4. You wil ask EU for membership only if you prove to be a net contributor , not another hungry mouth at the table that the few of us have to feed and have to endlessly pay for.


You are not a sovereign nation if you depend on others for your mere survival.


If these conditions are met, I'm fine with whatever the Scots want. I am just not willing to pay for their wishes. But they are free to find ways how they could pay for their wishes themselves.

[August]

Yeah that's right, because good results have always come from following the advice of a German! :roll:.

Seriously congratulations to the UK. I wish nothing but the best for your nation and your people.

[Jimbuna]

4. You wil ask EU for membership only if you prove to be a net contributor , not another hungry mouth at the table that the few of us have to feed and have to endlessly pay for.







I think they would then say they are being discriminated against on the grounds there are already quite a few members who are not net payers :)

[Mr Quatro]

Does this election results mean "No free internet" :D

[mapuc]

Those Danish politicians who are not so happy when it comes to EU have sent congratulations to Boris and his party.

Those Danish politicians who are for EU.
Have said things like

"Looks more of an opt-out of Corbyn than an option on Brexit and Boris. Poor the many British who, most importantly, want to be part of the European community"

Markus

[FeatsOfStrength]

Wait until the Americans start to pull you over the table. The lil boy in the White House already sits in the starting block.
Not as if I do not think the Brits could not realise and prevent it. Its just whether the government even wants it, spoiling some of its already sold illusions that way. The US has the longer lever here. Britain may need to learn to say No to the costs for their "special relationship".


Wanting less, managing own ressources moderately. Low tax regime to rival the high taxing schemes of the EU. Finding allies outside the circle of the usual suspects, I would hint at India, as one example. And resosting to get closely bound again to the EU by any EU special trade deal" that binds the UK to tight EU regulations once again.

the UK is already within the US's sphere of influence and has been since the Second World War, i'll be honest with you Trump and his trade deal doesn't worry me at all, if it ends up being absolutely one sided and aimed at exploiting the UK, well Trump will be gone before long and Trade deal's can be re-negotiated. When enough assets are sold off though to foreign investors, at what point is the UK still the UK and not a Chinese asset?

I also don't think Trump quite understands that his trade tariffs on China, production of items affected have literally been bypassed by sending products/resources to satellite factories in other Asian countries when already over 90% assembled and then traded with America with no tariffs. The real harm he has done is placing them on countries such as India, Brazil, the EU etc, turning the previous Republican policy supporting Free Trade on it's head and further reducing the US's geo-political position, and prompting nations to look towards China.

And the UK is one of the worst for prostituting it's assets to the highest bidder, done under both Conservative and Labour governments, people worry about selling off the NHS to the US, but we've already started (https://www.northumbria.nhs.uk/contract-signed-for-multi-million-pound-partnership-between-uk-and-china/) selling it to China. There is NO political party in the UK that really wants the the country to be independent in a way that is not just a facade.

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/BbGrxNVD/78734939-565830617299654-3994774001409851392-n.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[STEED]

Does this election results mean "No free internet" :D

Yep no free internet and all those goodies labour tried to bribe us with. Still on the upside public wifi is still free. :03:

[STEED]

DAY 1

NO BUSINESS

DAY 2

NO BUSINESS

DAY 3

SN CABINET RESHUFFLE

DAY 4

JR CABINET RESHUFFLE

DAY 5

CHRISTMAS HOLIDAY



JAN 1ST
NEW YEAR BOOZE UP
JAN 2ND
HANG OVER
JAN 3RD
STAND BY FOR ACTION!

[Jimbuna]

The modern Labour party? Representing the working man :doh:

https://i.postimg.cc/ht7MWY1q/80192290-2559977134050316-2201664965381718016-n.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/52YpWtM0/79319107-2511687119086089-877714044822224896-o.jpg (https://postimg.cc/5XJ8wbyd)

[FeatsOfStrength]

https://i.imgur.com/FKX1BuU.jpg

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/ht2kGvJq/80513716-452538422342320-1140979275025874944-n.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Jimbuna]

John McDonnell has said that he will not be part of the shadow cabinet of Jeremy Corbyn’s successor as Labour leader, saying: “I’ve done my bit.”

The shadow chancellor suggested that there will be a broader clear-out of Labour’s upper ranks, telling ITV News: “We will all go now. The new leader will come in place and appoint the shadow cabinet.”
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/labour-john-mcdonnell-stand-down-corbyn-leadership-frontrunners-a9246771.html

GOOD RIDDANCE!!

[mapuc]

I had some thoughts surrounding the result of the election, I was wrong though.

So please enlighten me.

What was the British voters telling your politicians by giving:

Tories a majority 365 seats

Labour a major defeat 204 seats

SNP 48 seats

LibDem 11 seats

I did not the rest DUB, Sinn Fein a.s.o.

Markus

[Kapitan]

I think what the British wanted was a stable clear cut government that would break the deadlock and had a clear goal.

What Corbin had done was create a movement based around his ideas, yet when it come to the key issue of Brexit he was hesitant, he said he would honor the referendum, then he said we must have a peoples vote.

Boris on the other hand has said we will get brexit done he has not left that line, and people can see he has done a lot to try and honor the referendum and has some integrity and does what he says.

I just feel the British people wanted something clear, they were fed up with the stalemate over brexit, they were fed up with politicians scoring cheap points, fed up with the situation in parliament.

the non clarity has affected us financially for 3 years vote for corbin and get more of the same? or vote for boris and at least a clear solution to the stale mate.

If you wanted to know yes i voted conservative.

[Mr Quatro]

Markus

England was simply saying "PU to EU" :D

[FeatsOfStrength]

I think what the British wanted was a stable clear cut government that would break the deadlock and had a clear goal.

What Corbin had done was create a movement based around his ideas, yet when it come to the key issue of Brexit he was hesitant, he said he would honor the referendum, then he said we must have a peoples vote.

Boris on the other hand has said we will get brexit done he has not left that line, and people can see he has done a lot to try and honor the referendum and has some integrity and does what he says.

I just feel the British people wanted something clear, they were fed up with the stalemate over brexit, they were fed up with politicians scoring cheap points, fed up with the situation in parliament.

the non clarity has affected us financially for 3 years vote for corbin and get more of the same? or vote for boris and at least a clear solution to the stale mate.

If you wanted to know yes i voted conservative.

I come from a Labour voting background, all my friends, family voted Labour. I spoiled my card this time around as I didn't think there was any point in voting for either of the parties as our democracy has been reduced to a battle between personality cults. I fundamentally disagree with political parties as entities, there's no way anyone who has their own opinion of issues can be railroaded so easily into Labour or Conservative in my opinion. I'd rather have independent candidates running on their own platforms.

I've been saying ever since Jeremy Corbyn was voted in as leader of the Labour party that he's not electable in this country, I had a grim satisfaction watching the social media posts of friends who were so deep in their echo chamber that they actually thought there was a chance of him becoming PM. Anyone who has spoken to people should have known the result was inevitable.

Jeremy Corbyn's biggest failure was his inaction on Brexit, that said I seriously doubt that Boris will "Get Brexit done" in the next few months, or that anything he does whilst he's in office will be for the benefit of most people in the UK. I also doubt that after Brexit we will be anymore independent than when inside the EU, once we get around to negotiating new trade deals with foreign super powers as we will be in a poor bargaining position, desperate to sign any one-sided agreement to stop our economy tanking.

In the long term i'm not saying it will necessarily be a bad thing, but in the short term I think there is going to be a lot of economical pain and suffering for most people in the UK.

[STEED]

On the upside there will be no more.....

'Oh, Jeremy Corbyn!' chant...

That really bleeped me off hearing that cringe dire tripe.


Moving on to the results here in my seat it seems there are very few of us who saw what the mainstream party's have become, only 130 odd voters voted independent . I can say I did not vote for liars and BS of those mainstream party's and all those lies they told. I congratulate all those whom voted Independent.

[Jimbuna]

Wigan MP Lisa Nandy says she is "seriously thinking" about running to be Labour leader.

[Jimbuna]

I've been saying ever since Jeremy Corbyn was voted in as leader of the Labour party that he's not electable in this country, I had a grim satisfaction watching the social media posts of friends who were so deep in their echo chamber that they actually thought there was a chance of him becoming PM. Anyone who has spoken to people should have known the result was inevitable.



Pretty similar to how I saw it.

I was a party member for over two decades, voting for Andy Burnham as the replacement for Ed Miliband and Tom Watson as deputy leader.

I resigned the day after Corbyn was elected for all the usual reasons regarding his beliefs and sympathies that have previously been adequately recognised all over the country.

Thus far I have never voted Tory but anything has to be better than Corbyn/Steptoe.

[Jimbuna]

Boris Johnson’s adviser Dominic Cummings would have challenged the EU referendum result as “invalid” had Vote Leave lost the Brexit campaign.

According to documents seen by the Observer, the prime minister’s chief aide told the UK’s data watchdog that he would have contested the result because UK elections are “wide open to abuse.”

In an email sent in 2017 to the information commissioner’s office, Cummings, the former head of the Vote Leave campaign and architect of Johnson’s stunning election victory, said: “If we had lost by a small margin I would have sought to challenge the result as invalid.”

The UK voted to leave the EU by the slim majority of 52% to 48% in the 2016 referendum, with many Brexiters subsequently attacking the losers as “Remoaners” who refused to respect democracy. On Friday, Cummings openly criticised “educated Remainer campaigner types” for failing to understand the country and “driving everyone mad”.
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/dominic-cummings-if-leave-had-lost-brexit-vote-id-have-queried-result-as-invalid/ar-AAK7Yig?li=BBoPWjQ&ocid=mailsignout

As if we've not already experienced enough turmoil.

This could have went on and in if the election result hadn't been so decisive.

[STEED]

Wigan MP Lisa Nandy says she is "seriously thinking" about running to be Labour leader.

The rumoured front runner is....

https://www.cityam.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/11/GettyImages-1170428559-960x640.jpg

[Jimbuna]

^ Probably what I'm thinking also, especially as she is a female or so it is rumoured :)

[MGR1]

Pity the SNP have done so well up here (:down:) but getting rid of Swinson is something of a silver lining.:yeah:

Now, the big question for the Tories is how to counteract the SNP within Scotland itself. This boils down to one big question, which, if they find an answer, will go a long way to solving the problems they have north of the border:

How do you fix a problem like Glasgow?

Glasgow is the main trouble spot for them - 41% of Scotland's population lives there and in the surrounding constituencies along the Clyde Valley.

The Central Belt as a whole contains 71% percent of the Scottish population.

Mike.:hmmm:

[Jimbuna]

Scotland "cannot be imprisoned in the union against its will" by the UK government, Nicola Sturgeon has said.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50799613

Sturgeon is going to milk this for all it is worth.

[mapuc]

Have another question. This time it's related to Scotland.

Which type of benefit does Scotland have today as a indirectly member of EU(As a part of the UK)?

What are Scotland hoping to gain by being independent and a member of EU ?

Markus

[Skybird]

What are Scotland hoping to gain by being independent and a member of EU ?

Markus
In brief: getting more money from the EU than they have to pay in. Also, they are export-heavy to the EU, a leave from the EU market will hit them.

The history between the English and the Scots is such that Scotland also is quite different from England. They never saw themselves that much as part of a union with the English, more as a victim, dominated by the nEnglish. Historically at least, in the past, that is true. Just a few days ago there was somewhere a good editorial on that in a German newspaper explaining it.

But in the end, its about the money.

[STEED]

One of the very very few that did not go mad following the bandwagon of loons.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UzDX2M0HpCE

[Moonlight]

^The Labour party had their best candidate before she lost her seat and that was Caroline Flint, it wouldn't be that daft of an idea to have Dan Jarvis as her deputy either. Make Flint a dame in the dissolution honours list and let her run the party from the House of Lords, and then she can appeal to the Labour voters to have that Momentum menace and any left winger MP booted out of the party.

As for those two clowns Richard Burgon and Rebecca Long Bailey, I think that the pair of them had a personality bypass operation at birth and, Rebeccas' best described as Momentum and Corbyns' Barbie doll pin up.

[STEED]

I agree Caroline Flint would have been their best and probably only candidate worth voting for a leader of the labour party.


Another rumour in Jess Phillips could be standing....:haha:

[STEED]

Who will be Labour's next leader?https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-50781341

Is that possibly the best they have. Please tell me this is a dream.

:nope:

[Reece]

^ Probably what I'm thinking also, especially as she is a female or so it is rumoured :)
:har: Yes looks like she has a set!! :D

[JU_88]

Being the only major party that's not yet had a woman leader, while at the same time being the party that suppoedly pushes gender equality the hardest - They will 100% pick a woman to replace corbyn.

Man or woman I dont care, lets just hope its some one half sane. people Laugh at the prospect of Jess Philips, but honestly even she would be an improvment at this point.

[Jimbuna]

Being the only major party that's not yet had a woman leader, while at the same time being the party that suppoedly pushes gender equality the hardest - They will 100% pick a woman to replace corbyn.

Man or woman I dont care, lets just hope its some one half sane. people Laugh at the prospect of Jess Philips, but honestly even she would be an improvment at this point.

Anything, even a monkey sporting a red rosette would be an improvement at this point :):03:

[JU_88]

I reckon if Labour continues to be overun by Momentum and the Tories let down their new constituences in the north,

its invenitable a new moderate left wing workers party (with out all the middle class cultural self loathing and intersectional dogma) will have to be formed.

[STEED]

people Laugh at the prospect of Jess Philips, but honestly even she would be an improvment at this point.

BIG GOB OF THE YEAR! :haha:

She is far from being suitable for the position of Labour leader, just see her as Prime Minister and watch the nightmare unfold. :o :o


I am now edging towards what jim said now, the moderates have done sod all to kick that mad dog and his followers out. It looks like Momentum is here to stay and rule the Labour party with an iron fist.

GAME OVER.

[STEED]

The government plans to ask MPs to vote on Boris Johnson's Brexit bill on Friday, Downing Street has said.

The PM's spokesman said the government planned to start the process in Parliament before Christmas in the "proper constitutional way".

The Withdrawal Agreement Bill is the legislation that will enable Brexit to happen - the UK is due to leave the EU on 31 January.

It comes as the PM prepares to address his new MPs in Westminster.https://www.bbc.com/news/election-2019-50811026

Friday you say, better get a bag of popcorn in.

https://media.makeameme.org/created/im-back-baby-0abeefdf7c.jpg

[Jimbuna]

Really looking forward to the first PMQ's on Wed 8th January 2020

[Jimbuna]

A Brexit activist who was "obsessed" with former MP Anna Soubry has been jailed for harassing her.

Amy Dalla Mura, 56, was found guilty after a trial of repeatedly targeting the ex-Independent Group for Change MP earlier this year.

Dalla Mura then also stood as an English Democrat candidate in Broxtowe, Nottinghamshire, against Ms Soubry.

Chief magistrate Emma Arbuthnot said Dalla Mura "showed an obsession and fixation" with the politician.

She was jailed for 28 days.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-50814959

I may not be a fan of Anna Soubry but this type of behaviour must be stamped out.

[Jimbuna]

A Brexit activist who was "obsessed" with former MP Anna Soubry has been jailed for harassing her.

Amy Dalla Mura, 56, was found guilty after a trial of repeatedly targeting the ex-Independent Group for Change MP earlier this year.

Dalla Mura then also stood as an English Democrat candidate in Broxtowe, Nottinghamshire, against Ms Soubry.

Chief magistrate Emma Arbuthnot said Dalla Mura "showed an obsession and fixation" with the politician.

She was jailed for 28 days.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-50814959

I may not be a fan of Anna Soubry but this type of behaviour must be stamped out.

[Jimbuna]

Coming to a cinema near you soon...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cniomva_8j8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RMARn0sd9Ig

[STEED]

Dalla Mura then also stood as an English Democrat

https://media.makeameme.org/created/dumbassyou-know-it.jpg

[STEED]

Really looking forward to the first PMQ's on Wed 8th January 2020

https://media.makeameme.org/created/no-more-pmqs.jpg

[Jimbuna]

Boris Johnson prepares shake-up of government machine.

Dominic Cummings, the prime minister’s chief adviser and a fierce critic of Whitehall, is driving the planned changes to the government machine, which will take place after Britain leaves the EU on the scheduled date of January 31.
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/boris-johnson-prepares-shake-up-of-government-machine/ar-AAK9jMx?li=BBoPWjQ&ocid=mailsignout

No doubt the battle plans have already been drawn up.

[STEED]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vmz3sVFISLE

[Jimbuna]

https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=2640664&postcount=12160

[STEED]

https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=2640664&postcount=12160

I already beat you to it. :haha:
https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=2640553&postcount=12147



The new one is different watch it, it goes further in why labour is a mess.

I've watched it twice now and if these MP's put there names forward for the leadership then labour is doomed to stay on the opposition benches for another 5 years on top of this 5 years and may be another on top of that.

The cult of corbyn has spat on the labour leave and said up yours you gits we know better while backed by Momentum. And if labour so much as puts one of these corynites into power as leader then have have learnt nothing.

[Jimbuna]

Not just Labour.

https://i.postimg.cc/qvj7BrVC/80528929-10218523944522078-9006881242477494272-n.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Jimbuna]

First time this has happened in a good while.

Boris Johnson is carrying out a limited reshuffle of his government after urging newly elected Tory MPs to "change our country for the better".

Simon Hart has been named as Welsh secretary, replacing Alun Cairns, who quit at the start of the election.

And Nicky Morgan stays as culture secretary, despite standing down as an MP. She is taking a peerage and will sit as a cabinet minister in the Lords.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50816908

[STEED]

The first 5 minutes covers his view on what happen and the rest is about 2020 and the government.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I3grOfZ7518


Another take on the election, they are going to do a more detailed one later.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eXjs0B-yqwM

[STEED]

So we all know why Labour failed so here is my view on the LibDems.

I believe this stems from the EU elections where they did well, they seemed to think that result would transferred over to the general election. Oh dear how wrong can you be, people always vote in different ways at different elections so why did they think they could do it.

Well they just stayed on the roller coaster and getting a buzz from it. So what went wrong was electing Jo Swinson as there leader oh come on this women clearly was not leadership material but they failed to see it.

Passing that motion scraping article 50 was a slap in the face for democracy and finally Swinson strutting around thinking she was going to be prime minister in the early part of the campaign. She slipped up in interviews showing her weakness and failed to win her own seat that fell to the SNP.

Unlike Labour there is a slim chance the LibDems will learn their lesson but they are a long way from the days of Paddy Ashdown. And if they hope to put Swinson in the House of Lords shows they have a very long way to go.

[JU_88]

If there is one way to get a kicking and half from the UK voters, its arrogance.


Brexit = Remain arrogantly assumed they would win
They lost by a narrow margine


2017 Election = Tories arrogantly thought their seats were safe and draughted a horrible manifesto, while they still formed a majority with DUP, they took quite a beating.


And of course Lib Dems in 2019, Swinson got way too big for her boots with the 'lets just scrap brexit' policy,
plus it turned out the more people saw of her on the telly, they less they liked her. And the Libdems were caught blatantly lying a few times on the campaign trail.

[Jimbuna]

If there is one way to get a kicking and half from the UK voters, its arrogance.


Brexit = Remain arrogantly assumed they would win
They lost by a narrow margine


2017 Election = Tories arrogantly thought their seats were safe and draughted a horrible manifesto, while they still formed a majority with DUP, they took quite a beating.


And of course Lib Dems in 2019, Swinson got way too big for her boots with the 'lets just scrap brexit' policy,
plus it turned out the more people saw of her on the telly, they less they liked her. And the Libdems were caught blatantly lying a few times on the campaign trail.

I believe there are almost unprecedented lessons to be learned by all parties this time round....1) Don't take the electorate for granted and 2) Don't let your backside write cheques your mouth cannot cash.

[Jimbuna]

The government is to add a new clause to the Brexit bill to rule out any extension to the transition period beyond the end of next year.

The post-Brexit transition period - due to conclude in December 2020 - can currently be extended by mutual agreement for up to two years.

But an amended Withdrawal Agreement Bill the Commons is set to vote on this week would rule out any extension.

Critics say this raises the chance of leaving the EU without a trade deal.

But senior Cabinet Minister Michael Gove insisted both the UK and the EU had "committed themselves to making sure that we have a deal" by the end of 2020.

He also promised Parliament would be able to scrutinise the Withdrawal Agreement Bill "in depth".

Shadow Brexit secretary Sir Keir Starmer said the move was "reckless and irresponsible" and he argued that Prime Minister Boris Johnson was "prepared to put people's jobs at risk".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50818134

Too early to say if this is a wise move or not but if there is goodwill and the negotiations are carried out in an open and transparent manner between both parties it just might work.

[Jimbuna]

Emily Thornberry warned privately in September that Labour's election chances would be hampered by taking a neutral position on Brexit.

Speaking at the party's conference, for a BBC film being broadcast on Tuesday, she said she was worried about Jeremy Corbyn saying he "didn't have a view" on the biggest decision facing the UK.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50817406

Nothing quite like a bit of self preservation aided with damage limitation...."Look, this election outcome was none of my fault"

[Jimbuna]

UK unemployment fell to its lowest level since January 1975 in the three months to October this year.

The number of people out of work fell by 13,000 to 1.281 million, Office for National Statistics (ONS) figures show.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-50820280

[STEED]

UK unemployment fell to its lowest level since January 1975 in the three months to October this year.

The number of people out of work fell by 13,000 to 1.281 million, Office for National Statistics (ONS) figures show.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-50820280

I do not believe these figures as the benefit system is so harsh the second a person is sanctioned the second they are off the figures. I am not saying they are a total lie but they are not totally truthful.

Bumped into someone i knew the other day who has mental health issues and claims benefit told me he is always being sanctioned for reasons i found ridiculous and stupid.

[Jimbuna]

Well, you like everyone else are entitled to an opinion.

[Jimbuna]

Postie just delivered this christmas card. I won't post the inside because it contains pictures and contact details of the three ward councillors.

Both national and local parties seem to be hell bent on getting my support again.

https://i.postimg.cc/jd4wJ1vs/Untitled.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Skybird]

Adding to Jim's earlier post:


https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/dec/16/boris-johnson-will-amend-brexit-bill-to-outlaw-extension


Hehe. That bill could have been by me. :shucks:

[Jimbuna]

Adding to Jim's earlier post:


https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/dec/16/boris-johnson-will-amend-brexit-bill-to-outlaw-extension


Hehe. That bill could have been by me. :shucks:

He has a comfortable majority in which to do it as well.

[Jimbuna]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N6wCRM2OpbQ

The chickens came home to roost :haha:

[MGR1]

More turmoil for Labour?

Is Scottish Labour's position on independence changing? (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-50808996)

Senior Scottish Labour figures back second referendum as party grassroots discuss future (https://www.commonspace.scot/articles/14983/senior-scottish-labour-figures-back-second-referendum-party-grassroots-discuss-future)

If I remember correctly, Keir Hardie (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keir_Hardie) was in favour of Home Rule for Scotland (and Ireland) but that was more in line with his belief in International Socialism, not nationalism.:hmmm:

As a small history lesson, here's the reading for the Government of Scotland Bill, 1913 from Hansard: LINK (https://api.parliament.uk/historic-hansard/commons/1913/may/30/government-of-scotland-bill).

A BBC Scotland article about the bill from 2014: LINK (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-29048884).

Moving onto current discussions, here's Douglas Fraser's (Business/economy editor, BBC Scotland) latest article:

What role could the economy play in indyref2? (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-50822431)



A combination of Brexit and heightened expectations of another Scottish independence referendum have brought economic arguments back to the fore.
Some arguments will be familiar from 2014, but important factors have changed: the rest of the UK is no longer 'the status quo' option.
Choices made at Westminster would force an iScotland into stark choices between its biggest market, to the south, and a European future. But do the economic arguments matter?

Brian Taylor's (Political editor, BBC Scotland) latest article:

Analysis: A mandate for Scottish independence? (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50780096)

The issue of mandates has a venerable pedigree in Scottish politics. Venerable, but not always clear and sharp.
During a previous period of Scottish Labour frustration, the late Donald Dewar briefly flirted with the suggestion that the Tories had no mandate to govern Scotland, given their relative lack of MPs north of the border.
It swiftly occurred to the astute Mr Dewar that this was not an argument which sat at all easily with a Unionist perspective. It was duly dumped in favour of another more straightforward push for devolved self-government.
At the core of the Dewar dilemma there was a philosophical and psephological problem.
By challenging the Tory mandate, he was positing an argument based upon the presumption that Scottish voting held unique and unchallenged sway.
A supporter of the Union will always argue - must always argue - that the Scottish perspective sits within and alongside the concerns of that wider UK electorate.
Mike.:hmmm:

[Jimbuna]

General election 2019: Defeated MPs set for £2m 'golden goodbye'
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50826472

Disgraceful!! :nope:

[Jimbuna]

Hoyle re-elected Commons Speaker as MPs return.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-50828196

Certainly can't be any worse than the last incumbent.

https://i.postimg.cc/sDvyW7R2/79469010-2515704865350981-5643284695606099968-o.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Jimbuna]

Labour "pursued a path of almost comic indecision" over Brexit during the election and "alienated both sides of the debate", Tony Blair has said.

In a speech in London, the ex-PM said he believed the party could have kept much of the vote in traditional Labour areas under a different leadership.

The situation was "made impossible by failure to take a clear position and to stick to it", Mr Blair said.

"The result has brought shame on us. We let our country down," he added.

Jeremy Corbyn told MPs on Tuesday that he "took responsibility" for Labour's worst electoral performance, in terms of seats won, since 1935.

He has said he will stand down as leader "early next year".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50829352

I should imagine Blair took great delight in sticking the boot in and love him or hate him he is well qualified being one of if not the most successful Labour leaders in the parties history.

[Jimbuna]

Sir Keir Starmer has told the BBC he is "seriously considering" standing to be the next Labour leader.

The shadow Brexit secretary said Labour has "a mountain to climb" following its general election defeat.

Another potential contender Yvette Cooper said she would "decide over Christmas" about whether to stand.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50834286

I don't rate his chances on the grounds he is not far left enough for Momentum who continue to have a vice-like grip on the party.

[Jimbuna]

Oh boy, what I would have given to have been present at that meeting.

Jeremy Corbyn faced "fury" from Labour MPs as they confronted him for the first time since Labour's disastrous election result.

He was challenged by backbenchers and those who lost seats in a meeting struck by "collective depression" after leading the party to its worst result in decades.

Jess Phillips, who is tipped as a potential successor to Mr Corbyn, emerged to say "it was no worse than it always is" and recalled "a couple of people being supportive".

She read a text from Melanie Onn - who lost Great Grimsby for Labour to the Tories - about how she had been "let down by the leadership and the frontbench".

Veteran Labour MP Dame Margaret Hodge told reporters "on the whole it was fury, despair, miserable and I just felt that the top table had corporate amnesia".

Mary Creagh also told Sky News that after losing her seat of Wakefield to the Conservatives she confronted Mr Corbyn in parliament.

She said campaign bosses were choosing where to send activists based on candidates' "ideological purity and their closeness to the leadership - rather than on the basis of whether or not they were in a position to help form a Labour government".

Lucy Powell, another Labour backbencher, told Sky News "everyone was really down" and that the room was full of "collective depression".

And MP Wes Streeting tackled Mr Corbyn for reportedly claiming Labour had won the argument.

"You don't win the argument and lose the election - not just lose the election but crash to the worst defeat since 1935," he told Sky News afterwards.

Addressing the group of 203 Labour MPs, it is understood Mr Corbyn apologised for last week's result and said "I take responsibility".

He blamed the Conservatives and news organisations for managing to "persuade many that only Boris Johnson could 'get Brexit done'".

"We must now listen to those lifelong Labour voters who we've lost," the Labour leader said. "I believe that Brexit was a major - although not the only - reason for their loss of trust in us."

He reiterated his plan to stand down when a new leader has been elected by party members, and Labour MP Lloyd Russell-Moyle said "not one person said go right now".
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/fury-and-collective-depression-corbyn-confronted-by-labour-mps/ar-BBY62U2?li=BBoPWjQ&ocid=mailsignout

[Jimbuna]

I'm sure many on here will remember this guy crashing in on many a live televised interview outside Parliament.

A political activist known as “Brexit man” has decided to stop protesting after two years in the wake of the Conservative Party's landslide election win.

Steve Bray had become a well known figure outside Westminster for his persistent call to “stop Brexit.”

But, after heckling MPs, journalists and Leave voters since September 2017, Mr Bray ended his protest after last Thursday's general election result.

Prime Minister Boris Johnson campaigned on a platform of “getting Brexit done”.

As Mr Johnson returned to Parliament on Wednesday, Mr Bray said: “The fight goes on but our future campaigning will be about holding government to account and when the proverbial s*** kicks in, we will look into how we can get back into the EU," according to the Metro.
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/newslondon/brexit-man-steve-bray-finally-quits-protesting-after-conservative-partys-general-election-win/ar-BBY7lLs?li=BBoPWjQ&ocid=mailsignout

https://i.postimg.cc/v8Ns4Y3W/1-Screenshot-2018-11-15-140338.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[STEED]

^Yea lazy sod, get a job.

Fed up with that loud mouth fart from day one. Naff off to the EU Parliament and clean their toilets.


And now lets get :haha: at the news of...

Shadow foreign secretary Emily Thornberry has become the first MP to officially enter the race to replace Jeremy Corbyn as Labour leader.

https://www.bbc.com/news/election-2019-50834286


I MAY NOT STOP....:har::har::har::har:


Oh I am laughing at these far left loonies popping up on the news declaring the nameless one is great and cool and rebuilt Labour and did so well....Oh man these fools are so in never never land.

[Jimbuna]

By my reckoning the next leader will probably be a woman but not Thornberry, perhaps a younger contender.

[STEED]

Just listening the radio and some one from "stop the war coalition" want a more radical far left leader for labour as the nameless one was to central! I nearly choked on my drink laughing. :haha:

[STEED]

https://media.makeameme.org/created/i-will-do-4527e7a545.jpg

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/bJrfNrSS/79156304-2452915001649014-1939808046364491776-n.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Jimbuna]

The government's Brexit bill will enable more British judges to depart from previous rulings of the EU's top court, Downing Street says.

The PM's spokesman said the Withdrawal Agreement Bill would expand this power to courts below the Supreme Court.

He added this would ensure judges at lower courts would not be "inadvertently" tied to the rulings "for years to come".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-50840595

I was wondering if something along these lines might be on the cards.

'Lessons learnt' and all that.

[Jimbuna]

Shadow foreign secretary Emily Thornberry has become the first MP to officially enter the race to replace Jeremy Corbyn as Labour leader.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50834286

https://i.postimg.cc/90BhmQGv/80703923-2516618388592962-3145690144158253056-o.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Reece]

^Yea lazy sod, get a job.

Fed up with that loud mouth fart from day one. Naff off to the EU Parliament and clean their toilets.


And now lets get :haha: at the news of...




I MAY NOT STOP....:har::har::har::har:


Oh I am laughing at these far left loonies popping up on the news declaring the nameless one is great and cool and rebuilt Labour and did so well....Oh man these fools are so in never never land.

Good post STEED you should get a medal for that! :up:

[Catfish]

"The government's Brexit bill will enable more British judges to depart from previous rulings of the EU's top court, Downing Street says."

I take it the first change will be workers rights. And i do not mean foreign workers or immigrants. Longer working times, less money. Financing brexit has to come from somewhere.

[Jimbuna]

The Tory manifesto pledged no decrease in workers rights.

[Jimbuna]

Scotland's first minister has called on the UK government to negotiate a transfer of powers to Holyrood to allow another referendum on independence.

Nicola Sturgeon said there was an "unarguable" mandate for a new vote after her SNP won 48 of Scotland's 59 seats in last week's general election.

She said a document containing her arguments and draft legislation will be sent to the UK government today.

Prime Minister Boris Johnson remains opposed to holding another referendum.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-50843024

I'm not sure how this will eventually pan out but as I have said consistently 'Allow them their referendum and if the vote for leave wins they should understand they cannot use the pound sterling and they should also prior agree to taking with them a pre-agreed share of the national debt'

[Catfish]

A manifesto and a pledge to get votes, by the Tories just of all. Good luck to see that happen.
Whatever, the fight will happen in England, not in Brussels.

[Jimbuna]

Only time will tell Kai, as things currently stand Boris has been given a large majority by the electorate so must be given the opportunity to prove himself.

[Jimbuna]

The Queen has set out the Conservative government's agenda for the year ahead, following last week's decisive election win.

Legislation to take the UK out of the EU on 31 January was among more than 30 bills being announced during Thursday's State Opening of Parliament.

Other measures included guarantees on extra health service funding and longer sentences for violent criminals.

PM Boris Johnson says he wants to unite the UK and "level up" opportunity.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-50842124

My initial impression is that there is a lot in it but it will be of benefit to the country if it is carried through (more detail contained within the link).

[STEED]

Rather boring and totally missable without Denis Skinner cracking a joke at Black Rod. Just no point to it anymore..:zzz::zzz:

[mapuc]

I envy you.

After Brexit your parliament can make laws and do not have to take EU into consideration.

Like. There is a majority for law xxx but due to EU it will not pass the Parliament.

Like here in Denmark.

There is a majority to ban Round-Up for private use, but due to EU the Danish government can't make a ban.

Markus

[MGR1]

I'm not sure how this will eventually pan out but as I have said consistently 'Allow them their referendum and if the vote for leave wins they should understand they cannot use the pound sterling and they should also prior agree to taking with them a pre-agreed share of the national debt'

Careful, Jim - if that were to be the case then the UK's Gold Reserves and Gilts would be up for negotiation as well. A potential independant Scotland would be entitled to have a percentage of UK national assets, including those.

Besides, the SNP would spin it to their advantage - no need to give them any more free ammunition than neccessary. It would also make the pro-UK side's job that much harder.:hmmm:

Mike.

[STEED]

Second hat into the ring...

Shadow Treasury minister Clive Lewis has become the second MP to officially enter the race to replace Jeremy Corbyn as Labour leader.https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-50861140

Over to jim...

[Jimbuna]

Careful, Jim - if that were to be the case then the UK's Gold Reserves and Gilts would be up for negotiation as well. A potential independant Scotland would be entitled to have a percentage of UK national assets, including those.

Besides, the SNP would spin it to their advantage - no need to give them any more free ammunition than neccessary. It would also make the pro-UK side's job that much harder.:hmmm:

Mike.

Quite possibly but I'd be prepared to take the chance and call their bluff.

[JU_88]

"The government's Brexit bill will enable more British judges to depart from previous rulings of the EU's top court, Downing Street says."

I take it the first change will be workers rights. And i do not mean foreign workers or immigrants. Longer working times, less money. Financing brexit has to come from somewhere.


I think the Tories understand that their majority (particularly in the north) was conditional, if they damage workers rights or NHS etc, it will not go unoticed or unpunished.

Plus the likes of Boris and Mogg SHOULD have learned buy now that Less money for workers = Less consumer spending and worse economic output & less tax revenue.
Its pretty much agreed accross the political spectrum now that austerity doesnt work.

We will see if they remember that, if they do - good, if they dont they will quickly get the boot in some of those shiney new consituencies.

The Cons have made some very concrete promises this election cycle, while they may forget them - the electorate wont.

Most of the public knows the tories can be real 2 faced weasels, so we'll be watching them ;)

[Skybird]

Its pretty much agreed accross the political spectrum now that austerity doesnt work.


Unfortunately it is not understood that endlessly inflating the debt burden does not work either but systematically reduces the degrees of freedom a state has for action. The worse the money, the more clever the theories, said Hayek, meaning that the excuses for the bad money become increasingly creative. Meanwhile, the debts first start to cover and suffocate everything like ivy and fungi, and then are tried to be tackled by expropriating the tax payer more and more.

Modern money theory is one of the biggest intellectual suicide attempts I have ever witnessed. Piketty is old communist wine in new bottles. Giving credit to one, needs somebody else waiving consumation before. One can only lend what somebody else owns and is willing to lease away for some time. Maastricht is dead, state financing by central banks is common. Currency without material security backup is madness. Notes are no money. Politicians shall never, never, never be trusted so much that you leave them controlling the money. NEVER.

[ikalugin]

Managing growth in demand (ie migration) may work better than managing growth in supply (ie via funding) as the growth in funding (both absolute after accounting for inflation and relative to the GDP) over the past decade did not help it.


https://www.ifs.org.uk/uploads/images/election2017_images/bns/bn201_fig1.jpg

[STEED]

Next week as norm old STEED will be doing my look back on 2019 and look forward to 2020 in my usual sinicle witty banter way. :03: :haha:

[JU_88]

Unfortunately it is not understood that endlessly inflating the debt burden does not work either but systematically reduces the degrees of freedom a state has for action..


Its much like living on credit cards and loans, it works for as long you can pay off the interest. Technically so long as you can do that, you never need to pay it back.
Is it wise? obviously not.
We are probably not ever getting out of that one with out a complete global debt collapes of some kind.
If, how and when that would happen is impossible to predict. Wouldn't take much to set it off though at this point.

Agree it is remarkably short sighted of people of an already heavily indebted nation to applaud government policies offering more 'free stuff', because its not, and they, their children or their grand children will pay for it one way or another in the end.

[Jimbuna]

Its much like living on credit cards and loans, it works for as long you can pay off the interest. Technically so long as you can do that, you never need to pay it back.
Is it wise? obviously not.
We are probably not ever getting out of that one with out a complete global debt collapes of some kind.
If, how and when that would happen is impossible to predict. Wouldn't take much to set it off though at this point.

Agree it is remarkably short sighted of people of an already heavily indebted nation to applaud government policies offering more 'free stuff', because its not, and they, their children or their grand children will pay for it one way or another in the end.

That is now foremost in my mind since the arrival of my first grandchild :yep:

[Jimbuna]

MPs will vote later on whether to back the prime minister's plan for the UK to leave the EU on 31 January.

The EU (Withdrawal Agreement) Bill would also ban the government from extending the transition period - where the UK is out of the EU but follows many of its rules - past 2020.

Boris Johnson said it would allow the UK to "move forward".

Opponents say the bill leaves the UK's future uncertain, and agreeing a trade deal with the EU could take many years.

But the government insists one can be in place by the end the transition period.

The result of the Commons vote on the bill is expected at about 15:00 GMT.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-50854323

No prizes for guessing which way the vote will go, I only hope it is carefully thought through aided by meticulous planning.

[STEED]

Printing money and debt go hand in hand they are married to each other, they need each other.

Bojo's big push this afternoon, will he produce his big bouncing brexit baby? The bookies say you got no odds on a asteroid strike on Westminster or a alien ship landing on the Westminster lawn. Sounds like Bojo will do it.

[Jimbuna]

I know someone who definitely couldn't.

https://i.postimg.cc/k4WwYQdr/80710573-756256261521184-508035661215825920-n.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Catfish]

Unlike the last picture this one is real.

https://i.imgur.com/ON4WH2gl.jpg

[STEED]

I rather bojo than the nameless one with his wreckless spending plan.

[Jimbuna]

Reading and responding to the above deletion: I've lived in mainland Europe and I can assure you our NHS is still better than that of our European 'cousins' and also the envy of the world.

[Catfish]

And I seriously doubt that.

[Jimbuna]

MPs have backed Prime Minister Boris Johnson's plan for the UK to leave the EU on 31 January.

They voted 358 to 234 - a majority of 124 - in favour of the EU (Withdrawal Agreement) Bill, which now goes on to further scrutiny in Parliament.

The bill would also ban an extension of the transition period - during which the UK is out of the EU but follows many of its rules - past 2020.

The PM said the country was now "one step closer to getting Brexit done".

Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn told his MPs to vote against the bill, saying there was "a better and fairer way" to leave the EU - but six of them backed the government.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-50870939

I reckon we will be seeing a lot more of this in the near future.

One of those Labour MP's was my town representative surprise surprise (bhased on how she has voted regarding Brexit in the past).

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/VkBB0LsW/12821475-1692927480962061-7727462372002402618-n.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Jimbuna]

General election 2019: What's it like to lose your seat as an MP?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50712756

[JU_88]

I reckon we will be seeing a lot more of this in the near future.

One of those Labour MP's was my town representative surprise surprise (bhased on how she has voted regarding Brexit in the past).


6 Labour MPs actually voted for it despite Corbyns plea (the bill that just passed)

[Moonlight]

12 Tory MPs didn't vote for the bill, it'll not be the last time he'll come up against such dissent. :o Maybe Boris needs to give them a backhander to remind them to toe the party line in future. :O:

[Jimbuna]

Labour leadership: How wide will the debate be?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-50872700

[Jimbuna]

This article adequately sums up just where Labour are at the present time in my humble opinion.

Labour: anger, recrimination and bitterness mark fresh battle for party’s soul.
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/labour-anger-recrimination-and-bitterness-mark-fresh-battle-for-partys-soul/ar-BBYeL1x?li=AAnZ9Ug&ocid=mailsignout

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/BbygFyB0/15-12-19-Morten-Morland-Sunday-Times.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[JU_88]

It doesnt matter, the Left is so broken it needs a serious rethink. (If they have any one left who is still allowed to actually think :P)

Who ever replaces Jezza will be basically more of the same for now, the simple reason is the Left by default ostracises anyone who doesn't conform to its now cult like values, for them its no longer a difference of opinion its 'you are a bad person if you think otherwise'.

Their mantra is now constantly pointing out all the bad it sees in people, society, culture and the nation. Greedy, stupid, racist, <insert>phobic, etc' While claiming to be the moral puritans with a 'better way' to fix it all. What was once used in a more subtle liberal way to appear noble, tollerent and progressive has now become arrogant, codecending and spiteful.
You cannot persuade people to vote for you when you give the impression you dispair in / despise them.

Anyway they are stuck now, they cannot win back the working class / Northen vote and keep the Middle class / student vote. Because the two are at odds. If they adopt the values of one they will be rejected by ther other.
They will have wait for either Milenials to grow up or for late boomers to die out. But even then they have a problem: Generation Z -while the right wing Controls Goverment and Economics (areas so remote from the life of an average teenager)
The left still broadly controls main stream culture and academia. So for Generation Z the Left has become the perceived dominent culture 'the status quo' in school and pop culture -And young people generally like to rebel against the status quo and create their own thing. I dont know how they miscalulated that when 20 odd years ago the right died the very same death.

If Trump wins 2020, i think thats will be final nail in the coffin for 'Social Justice' left of this past decade.

[Jimbuna]

It doesnt matter, the Left is so broken it needs a serious rethink. (If they have any one left who is still allowed to actually think :P)

Who ever replaces Jezza will be basically more of the same for now, the simple reason is the Left by default ostracises anyone who doesn't conform to its now cult like values, for them its no longer a difference of opinion its 'you are a bad person if you think otherwise'.

Their mantra is now constantly pointing out all the bad it sees in people, society, culture and the nation. Greedy, stupid, racist, <insert>phobic, etc' While claiming to be the moral puritans with a 'better way' to fix it all. What was once used in a more subtle liberal way to appear noble, tollerent and progressive has now become arrogant, codecending and spiteful.
You cannot persuade people to vote for you when you give the impression you dispair in / despise them.

Anyway they are stuck now, they cannot win back the working class / Northen vote and keep the Middle class / student vote. Because the two are at odds. If they adopt the values of one they will be rejected by ther other.
They will have wait for either Milenials to grow up or for late boomers to die out. But even then they have a problem: Generation Z -while the right wing Controls Goverment and Economics (areas so remote from the life of an average teenager)
The left still broadly controls main stream culture and academia. So for Generation Z the Left has become the perceived dominent culture 'the status quo' in school and pop culture -And young people generally like to rebel against the status quo and create their own thing. I dont know how they miscalulated that when 20 odd years ago the right died the very same death.

If Trump wins 2020, i think thats will be final nail in the coffin for 'Social Justice' left of this past decade.

Very well laid out Francis and in support of your post.

https://i.postimg.cc/8k0Qwzy1/17-12-19-Patrick-Blower-Telegraph.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

:O:

[STEED]

I can assure you our NHS is still better than that of our European 'cousins' and also the envy of the world.

Sorry to say I have to differ with you jim, my father had a rotten time in hospital and it has left a mark on him. I have never seen him in such a rotten state that is going to take days for him to get back to any kind of normality.

Envy of the world I just will not except that as the NHS is a bloody mess thanks to years and years of under funding. Speak to a few doctors and they may say what has been said to me, they all believe we are a few years from privatisation of the NHS. That is in the region of 10 to 15 years.

The NHS is trying hard but without the proper funding it's a battle they can not win. I made an appointment to see my GP two weeks ago and I still have another four weeks on top of that to wait. Six bloody weeks is just so bloody wrong on all level's. NHS is starved of money and doctor's nurse's.......

[Catfish]

^^ two posts further north:
I posted that withour further explanation (sry having a difficult time).
I have lived in England for some time, though i admit this was only up to 2004. Seldom needed myself, helped some friends driving them to doctors etc. The doctors were always friendly and helpful despite me being a bloody foreigner, but the doctor's offices, the equipment and the availability of certain medicine was pure 1960ies and left a lot to be desired. It was better in London, but even there..
Compared to doctors and offices in Italy, France or Germany there can be no question where the medical support is more advanced.

That said, the idea of a free National Health Service is great and worth keeping, even if Americans would call this socialism (OMG!!).
If it can be financed stick to it by all means. Compared to other countries worldwide (including the USA) the english system is indeed better, imho.

[Jimbuna]

When a sitting MP loses their seat it happens very publicly, standing on stage with the other candidates as the results are announced - but what happens to the people working behind the scenes?

When an MP is not re-elected, their staff - in Parliament and in their constituency - are also made redundant.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-50869679

Just a gentle reminder that the election result often affects more than just the MP.

[STEED]

Look no further than what sits on the opposition front benches for the answer. And from there you will see what needs to be done, better hurry up the hard line loony left is digging in.

[Skybird]

https://translate.google.de/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.focus.de%2Fpolitik%2Fexperten% 2Fgastbeitrag-von-klemens-joos-boris-johnsons-hard-brexit-trick-wird-am-ende-nicht-funktionieren_id_11482716.htmlBrexit Prime Minister Boris Johnson has received a lot of criticism for his idea of ​​simultaneously stipulating in the exit law now introduced in Parliament that the United Kingdom will end negotiations with the EU Commission by December 31, 2020 at the latest. Wrongly, I think. Because Johnson knows only too well that a contractual Brexit is de facto impossible. It was always clear to him that there was either a hard Brexit or no Brexit. This also explains why he has persistently refused to rule out a Brexit without a succession plan in recent months.
This coincides with the view that I have long held: as a EU member state, full sovereignty under international law can in fact only be returned today with a hard exit. Because the EU member states have been so closely intertwined politically and economically since the Lisbon Treaty - a kind of basic law of the EU - that a contractually regulated exit with the consent of all EU countries is theoretically still possible, but not in reality.


About the guest author

Dr. Klemens Joos is a lecturer at the Faculty of Business Administration at the Ludwig Maximilians University in Munich (https://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&rurl=translate.google.de&sl=auto&sp=nmt4&tl=en&u=https://www.focus.de/regional/muenchen/&xid=17259,1500001,15700019,15700186,15700190,15700 256,15700259,15700262,15700265,15700271,15700283&usg=ALkJrhglfcH4O8uA5K1Y4WahrcziEtRZmw) . Joos is also the founder and managing director of the internationally active EU policy and management consultancy EUTOP in Munich.

[Jimbuna]

I'll maintain my steadfast belief in the NHS thanks.

[Jimbuna]

Ex-Labour leader Ed Miliband will sit on a panel of party figures to review its general election failure.

Labour Together, which describes itself as a network of activists from all traditions, is setting up a commission to "map out a route back to power".

It says the panel will view attempts to pin the blame on a single cause, such as Brexit or Jeremy Corbyn's leadership, as simplistic and wrong.

Members, focus groups in heartlands, and defeated candidates will get a say.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-50888060

Why Ed? He was a total failure previously himself.

[MGR1]

To be honest, IF Labour are to make some form of recovery my own recommendation would be for them to concentrate on England and Wales only and stay out of Scotland. The SNP have very much stolen their slot (and the vast majority of their former voters) on the political spectrum up here.:hmmm:

Mike.

[Jimbuna]

To be honest, IF Labour are to make some form of recovery my own recommendation would be for them to concentrate on England and Wales only and stay out of Scotland. The SNP have very much stolen their slot (and the vast majority of their former voters) on the political spectrum up here.:hmmm:

Mike.

I doubt the left of the party will allow any lessons to be learned. As I have said in the past, they are not totally committed to running the country but the party itself is a totally different matter.

[MGR1]

Maybe so, but for a healthy democracy we both know that you have to have a viable opposition and Labour are the only current choice south of the border. Perhaps something else will evolve in the fullness of time but at the moment what we in the UK mainland have is a series of hegemonic one party states - the Conservatives in England, the SNP in Scotland and, to a lesser extent, Labour in Wales.

Any opposition activity is going to be at that level, pitching the component parts of the UK against each other until and unless natural opposition groups form within those same components.

For my own part I would prefer Labour to abandon Scotland completely - one, their now superflous, and secondly, because of the sheer amount of damage their stupidity and corruption has caused up here.


Mike.:hmmm:

[Jimbuna]

My preference would be proportionate representation but we both know neither of the two largest parties would be interested in seeing that come about.

[MGR1]

My preference would be proportionate representation but we both know neither of the two largest parties would be interested in seeing that come about.
So very true.

I'm still surprised that the SNP are still supporting PR as it's actually against their interests for Westminster elections as they'd loose a lot of MP's. Mind you, they do have to deal with the hybrid D'Hondt method (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Additional_member_system) that the Scottish Parliament is elected with.

Under those circumstances it's mildly amusing to see the Scottish Tories being against PR for Westminster as they'd actually gain MP's, but they do have to toe the UK Conservative line.

Mike.:hmmm:

[Jimbuna]

Boris Johnson should honour tradition and make ex-House of Commons Speaker John Bercow a lord, his successor has suggested.

Sir Lindsay Hoyle said the prime minister should maintain the more than 200-year-old convention.

Mr Bercow has so far been denied ennoblement after fury from the government over his perceived Brexit "bias".
https://news.sky.com/story/commons-speaker-sir-lindsay-hoyle-urges-pm-to-give-john-bercow-a-peerage-11893118

I had high hopes for Sir Lindsay Hoyle but now I'm beginning to doubt them.

[Moonlight]

^ It seems like every announcement or decision House of Commons Speaker Sir Lindsay Hoyle makes that goes against your's or the Tory parties wishes makes his head worthy of the chopping block.
Refusing to award Bercow a peerage would be an act of political spite, I knew the Tory party were capable of it but I didn't know you were Jimbuna, until now that is.

[Jimbuna]

^ It seems like every announcement or decision House of Commons Speaker Sir Lindsay Hoyle makes that goes against your's or the Tory parties wishes makes his head worthy of the chopping block.
Refusing to award Bercow a peerage would be an act of political spite, I knew the Tory party were capable of it but I didn't know you were Jimbuna, until now that is.

Please be kind enough to show my opinion about 'every' announcement Sir Lindsay Hoyle has made.

Furthermore, 'doubting' one comment or opinion is a far cry from making 'his head worthy of the chopping block'

Your choice of words not mine.

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/j2L9T7hd/81513108-2521820101406124-4267463205904711680-o.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[ikalugin]

Allegedly there is a law in the works which allows 5 year sentences for not providing encryption keys to the state for the encrypted data.


The catch, allegedly, is that the encrypted file does not even need to exist, random noise can be interpreted as an encrypted file, or you can be accused of hiding it in other normal files via stenography.

[STEED]

OK let's get this over with, yes it is a bit early but i do not care so here goes. Well what a rollercoaster year 2019 has been, the big three has almost lost all their leaders starting with the ousting of May by Boris then Swinson lost her seat at the election and in hours stepped down as leader, the nameless one suffered a defeat at the election and will not step down until next year, typical of that thing.

So we started the year with a coalition then Boris takes over and plunges that into a minus 40 odd give and take then the election went ahead and now Boris rules the roost. So what is there to look forward to in 2020?

Nothing at all as i see it, Boris is king and can do what he wants. Local elections will be interesting in May and after that well sod all, brexit will be a hard as both sides will play hard ball. If the SNP gets its way and wins the referendum then i will say bye bye and let them get on with it, they will be another millstone around the neck of the EU asking for more than they put back into it.

As for the Labour I do not believe a moderate centralist will win just a clone of the nameless one. The LibDems stand a better chance learning their lesson but who will get the job no idea, and on that note i am done here and probably will not post until the local elections.

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/T3xNPFdD/16-12-19-Ben-Jennings-Guardian.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[STEED]

As i said above folks i am not going to be around much from here on as i have decided to tell the internet get lost you are not controlling me anymore. So unless anything big happens in the world of UK politics i am off for a while and will swing by around the time of the local election's and then the end of the year.

So see you all in 5 months time. :)

Time for soup and a good read. :03:

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/BvzJ7d9y/17-12-19-Christian-Adams-Evening-Std.jpg (https://postimages.org/)