UK Politics Thread [Archive] - Page 42 - SUBSIM Radio Room Forums

Jimbuna

06-19-19, 05:05 AM

This is a good article by Beth Rigby, political editor of SkyNews.

It has unofficially been going on for months in restaurants and bars across Westminster, but this week the Conservative Party officially fired the starting gun on the race to replace Theresa May and the pace is ferocious.

Ten candidates, five campaign launches on Monday, three on Tuesday and two today. By Thursday afternoon it's pretty likely that perhaps four of those at the back of the pack will have dropped out. And, of the six likely to make it through to next week, one - Boris Johnson - is miles ahead.

Today Mr Johnson will finally come out of his bunker and launch his campaign. There is nervousness in his team; he comes with arms full of personal and political baggage. He is unpredictable and often ill-disciplined. He is a politician with an uncanny ability to self-destruct.

His supporters are right to worry, given the rich seam of past mistakes and misdemeanours to mine when it comes to Mr Johnson.

In 2008, he admitted taking cocaine; he has a colourful personal life and as a politician he has come under heavy criticism for loose language. As foreign secretary he brought further woe to the jailed British-Iranian mother Nazanin Zaghari-Ratcliffe after incorrectly telling MPs she had been teaching journalism in Iran - a claim seized upon by the Iranians to extend her incarceration. More recently, he compared veiled Muslim women to letter boxes and bank robbers and said police spending on historical child sex abuse investigations was money "spaffed up a wall". I could go on.

So while he is the front runner, there are many hurdles to clear on his way to Number 10. How Mr Johnson handles the scrutiny in the coming days will be critical. As one cabinet minister wryly told me this week: "The only person who can beat Boris is Boris. He has 10 days to avoid going nuclear and blowing himself up."

STEED

06-19-19, 05:10 AM

^I just been reading another one by her.

Beth Rigby, political editor
More polarised and pessimistic than we have been for decades. Those were the findings of a probe into our national mindset revealed by top pollster Deborah Mattinson over the weekend.

Her polling discovered an "astonishing lack of faith" in our political system, with less than 6% of the population believing their politicians understand them. Three quarters of the 2,000 people polled say UK politics is not fit for purpose.

https://news.sky.com/story/sky-views-a-closed-shop-youll-get-your-say-on-boris-johnson-soon-enough-11744513

Too bloody true.

Jimbuna

06-19-19, 05:13 AM

Now the horse trading begins.

Tory leadership: Stewart considering 'combining forces with Gove'
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48688703

STEED

06-19-19, 07:03 AM

Ian Blackford laid into Boris at PMQ's about his racist comments. Clearly trying to damage Boris but at best nothing more than a minor dent.

Jimbuna

06-19-19, 09:20 AM

Bye bye Rory then possibly Sajid.

STEED

06-19-19, 01:59 PM

Tory leadership candidates so far (Updated)

Boris Johnson 98%
Jeremy Hunt 65%
Michael Gove 30%
Sajid Javid 5%
(% is my predictions so far)

ROUND FOUR KNOCKOUT 6PM THURSDAY..

DANGER ZONE
Sajid Javid
Michael Gove

Jimbuna

06-20-19, 04:51 AM

Sajid will drop out next making it an interesting contest between Hunt and Gove to be one half of the final two.

Hunt will go through and be beaten by Johnson.

Hammond will resign to be replaced by Sajid as Chancellor and we can all live happily ever after until the failure of Johnson to strike a new deal with the EU and the Tories will be toast at the next general election.

Not sure what will happen then for Steptoe because Farage and his minions will play a big role in who gets the keys to No10.

Jimbuna

06-20-19, 05:07 AM

More than 25 Labour MPs have written to Jeremy Corbyn to urge him not to go "full Remain" as the party reviews its stance on another Brexit referendum.

They warn another referendum would be "toxic" and empower the "populist right" in many Labour heartlands.

They call on the leadership to abandon their pursuit of a "perfect deal" and to back an agreement by 31 October.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48694223

The problem her for Steptoe is the fact that despite him being a lifelong Brexiteer the above are on 10% of his party which like the Tories are majority remainers.

Jimbuna

06-20-19, 07:09 AM

Sajid will drop out next making it an interesting contest between Hunt and Gove to be one half of the final two.

As predicted, Sajid is out.

STEED

06-20-19, 07:12 AM

Tory leadership candidates so far (Updated)

Boris Johnson 99%
Jeremy Hunt 50%
Michael Gove 55%
(% is my predictions so far)

ROUND FIVE KNOCKOUT 6PM THURSDAY..

Wow Gove is second after round four, well this will be interesting for tonight.

DANGER ZONE
Jeremy Hunt
Michael Gove

Jimbuna

06-20-19, 07:26 AM

Johnsons backers are already plotting for revenge on Gove.

Jimbuna

06-20-19, 09:48 AM

^ Could be they'll give a few votes to Hunt thereby denying Gove a second place and entry into the final postal ballot.

mapuc

06-20-19, 10:41 AM

Ain't it very exciting isn't it similar to watching the world cup in Football.

I presume it must be very nailbiting for you

Markus

STEED

06-20-19, 12:11 PM

Tory leadership candidates so far (Updated)

Boris Johnson 99%
Jeremy Hunt 1%
(% is my predictions so far)

Well there you have it, Bojo one step nearer to being the next PM.

The only good thing is Boris will seal his fate and it will all come crashing down. But that will result in a general election before the year is out.

STEED

06-20-19, 12:18 PM

Ain't it very exciting isn't it similar to watching the world cup in Football.

I presume it must be very nailbiting for you

Markus

It's like watching a train wreck in slow motion unfold. :o

Skybird

06-20-19, 01:24 PM

As a foreigner, Hunt and Gove where the only names I could make at least a little sense of, beside Johnson. I would have expected Gove to go into the finals, but well.

MGR1

06-20-19, 01:50 PM

Conservative Home's devolution "expert" on that YouGov poll of Tory party members:

Henry Hill: This week’s polling highlights devolution’s threat to the Union (https://www.conservativehome.com/thecolumnists/2019/06/henry-hill-this-weeks-polling-highlights-devolutions-threat-to-the-union.html#idc-cover)

What I find are the two best comments from either viewpoint:

“Such an approach has an obvious problem, in that it requires those parts of the Union from which said fiscal transfers currently flow either not to think about it or, if they do, to adopt a much more existential (and therefore, highly asymmetrical) attitude towards the UK. Quite why the transparently mercenary attitude of the devo-maxers should engender such depth of feeling is, shall we say, non-obvious.”

I voted for Unionist parties consistently until this year. I bear no ill-will to my fellow Brits, and indeed the majority of my own family are English born-and-bred. I value the common history and common values which I have, for most of my life, believed to be at the heart of British national life.

And then I read statements like the one above and I have to ask: why are fiscal transfers necessary? Why are Scotland (and Wales and NI and Northern England) less economically successful, after centuries of direct control from London? If the answer is that Scotland is simply lazy and profligate, then I can hardly blame England for wanting rid of us. However, after over 300 years of Union, mostly governed from London, it is also valid to question the efficacy of that governance if it leaves swathes of its people subservient and dependent on the largesse of other regions.

For me though, this question has never been enough to loosen my attachment to my british heritage. And devolution certainly didn’t make me want independence. What has done so is Brexit. I grew up being told (and believing in my bones) that Scottish independence was illogical and destructive, a retrograde obsession with blood-and-soil. And yet, having voted for the British Union in the last Scottish referendum, I have witnessed the English nationalists successful campaign to remove us from Europe, preferably on term which are most destructive to all involved.

How is it possible to blame devolution for splitting the Union, when it is the Brexit debacle which has given rise to the most potent questions which harm the Union: Why is English nationalism good, but Scottish nationalism bad? And why should Scotland be content to be a junior partner in the British Union if England is not even content to be a leader of the European Union? and

I would mildly suggest that the reason why many in England see the Union as disposable is that England has been seen by Westminster, from the late 90s devolutionary process onwards, as disposable. Not the slightest glimmer of recognition that equity in representation and self-determination might be factored in for England.

Worse still, from Prescott through Osborne, HMG’s policy has been to subdivide England into regional, manageable, administrative units. Being ignored is irksome but being attacked by means of divide and rule by HMG is cause for heightened displeasure.

Feeling included is rather important to joint enterprise. Feeling excluded leads to resentment and then paying for that exclusion to the exclusive advantage of inner London and the Celtic periphery leads to the indifference as revealed in the lead article. Where lies English loyalty to the Union? It’s a reciprocal process and HMG would seem to be oblivious to the consequences of its inactions.Food for thought.

Mike.:hmmm:

Catfish

06-21-19, 01:59 AM

How is it possible to blame devolution for splitting the Union, when it is the Brexit debacle which has given rise to the most potent questions which harm the Union: Why is English nationalism good, but Scottish nationalism bad? And why should Scotland be content to be a junior partner in the British Union if England is not even content to be a leader of the European Union?:03: The oncoming sounds a bit negative, but i actually read some stuff about what England did before and during the colonial times, in Scotland.
And i have nothing against England, it just somehow tends to forget certain parts of its own history.

Scotland, your bloody foreign neighbours on the continent have never understood it. From England's subduction of scottish 'tribes' (not that England was so much more advanced at that time, or the countries of Europe for that matter), to England actually destroying any effort of Scotland to improve as a nation, the deforestation for building the english fleets, letting hords of sheep grazing the now empty landscape keeping any effort to reforest down, the disappropriation of scottish land owners, the displacement of people from their ancestral ground and heritage by destroying their economical base.. "all in the best interest" of course.

A lot of Scots had to move to England, became traders e.g. with tea or such (certainly depending on the english market now, and supporting it), while the people who stayed tried to make a living in a kept-down economy, some by smuggling, constantly under pressure by english customs and military. True until 1900 anyway.

And now brexit, this is really the topping.. Emphasis on We :haha:

https://i.imgur.com/vrhbP3Hl.jpg

Catfish

06-21-19, 03:43 AM

What is true is that english nationalism damages the union :hmmm:

"[...] there is genuine bafflement among English people when the Scots apply the same arguments as Brexiters used to justify leaving the EU to justify Scottish independence.[...]"

https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/brexit-scottish-referendum-english-nationalism-damaged-union-for-good-a7635796.html

Buddahaid

06-21-19, 04:00 AM

It's just isolationism on a different focal lens and it is always a relevant position. Who will gain and who will diminish? Usually everybody loses save for a few prime actors who reap wealth from the struggle. Socialism is just another way of distributing wealth with no better outcome than capitalism. Who is your champion for the day?

Jimbuna

06-21-19, 04:36 AM

Jimbuna

06-21-19, 04:54 AM

Boris Johnson and Jeremy Hunt will go head-to-head to become Conservative leader amid claims tactical voting led to Michael Gove's exit from the race.

Mr Johnson's team has denied such tactics - but at least one backer suggested some MPs may have switched votes to end Mr Gove's campaign.

Mr Johnson and Mr Gove fell out during the 2016 leadership contest - which saw Theresa May become prime minister - when Mr Gove abandoned Mr Johnson's bid to be leader to launch his own.

After Thursday's results, some of Mr Gove's supporters claimed Mr Johnson's backers may have voted for Mr Hunt to eliminate their candidate.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48714673

You know how the saying goes...'Karma can be a bitch'

STEED

06-21-19, 05:04 AM

So now we wait for the grass roots Tories to put Dumbo-Bojo in to Number 10 and it looks like they will. Taken in by Bojo's high wire act and falling into a stream these fools are going to put that buffoon of a clown in power, our only hope is the French invade us.

This morron has a short attention span, you can just see it he goes over to the EU and within a few minutes bashing his chest and swinging from the lights while growling!

Yes folks we can all look forward to a general election where the Terrorist supporting hound wins or the Lib and Brexit! We are screwed well and truly.

Jimbuna

06-21-19, 05:17 AM

our only hope is the French invade us.

Or Macron finally closes the curtains but then revoking Article 50 would probably become a reality.

ikalugin

06-21-19, 06:22 AM

Fortunately UK executive is answerable to the UK people and their parliament has full legislative rights.

Jimbuna

06-21-19, 06:30 AM

Quite a busy/intersting period for the Tories :hmmm:

Mark Field has been suspended as a Foreign Office minister after grabbing a female Greenpeace activist at a black-tie City dinner.

Mr Field has said he regrets confronting Janet Barker and marching her away as protesters interrupted a speech by the chancellor.

He said he had been "genuinely worried" she may have been armed.

Ms Barker said she would not make a complaint to police but the MP "should go to anger management classes".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48718725

A by-election will be held in Brecon and Radnorshire after 10,005 people signed a petition to remove the constituency's Conservative MP, Chris Davies.

Mr Davies had been convicted of a false expenses claim in March.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-politics-48720176

STEED

06-21-19, 06:50 PM

^who cares, all the action is round bojo's gaff. Sounds like a bit of S&M was going on as bojo shouted out spank me you hot bitch. :o

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48721211

Jimbuna

06-22-19, 05:43 AM

Could also be the beginning of a smear campaign in an attempt to even up the odds.

Jimbuna

06-22-19, 05:47 AM

Looks like the UK and EU share similar electoral problems.

A summit of 28 European Union leaders has failed to reach agreement on who should take on the bloc's top jobs.

The talks, held in Brussels, continued until the early hours of Friday morning without candidates being finalised.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-48706193

STEED

06-22-19, 05:58 AM

More Greens Brexit Far right/Left have rocked the EU boat and this is only the start. I hope they give the traditional EU pigs a hard time. :03:

Catfish

06-22-19, 03:47 PM

Nigel Farage after his incorrect facts about Ireland and EU on live TV
"incorrect facts", is that like "alternative truths"?

https://www.indy100.com/article/nigel-farage-brexit-ireland-eu-claire-byrne-live-tv-rte-one-watch-video-8752246

Old news i know, but heartening to see a light in the whole mess.
"Why on earth has the BBC not been doing this?"
Because no sane person can bring up facts and evidence as quick as Farage produces his lies. Well known tactic, just babble on and steam-roll all others.

Bilge_Rat

06-22-19, 06:22 PM

^who cares, all the action is round bojo's gaff. Sounds like a bit of S&M was going on as bojo shouted out spank me you hot bitch. :o

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48721211

Looks like a put up job to me, a bit too convenient "concerned neighnours" calling police.

JU_88

06-23-19, 02:50 AM

That or they were drunk and he spilt some wine on her sofa.....
Either way it was a nothing burger - Much like his leader ship will turn out to be.

BossMark

06-23-19, 03:35 AM

So it looks like 160,000 idiots will put a complete idiot in power god help us..latest odds from skybet

Boris the bufoon 1/6
Hunt the runt 7/2

STEED

06-23-19, 05:13 AM

The Bojo incident clearly was the work of liberal neighbour's trying to cause him a issue. Which proves how stupid they were as it did nothing but raise his profile even more.

And by Wednesday it will be forgotten, don't get me wrong i'm not defending bojo i'm just pointing out the results and if anyone wants to have another try get it right and present damming evidence that will force him out.

Jimbuna

06-23-19, 05:56 AM

Looks like a put up job to me, a bit too convenient "concerned neighnours" calling police.

Precisely :yep:

Mind you, he is making it easy for his detractors.

Jimbuna

06-23-19, 05:58 AM

So it looks like 160,000 idiots will put a complete idiot in power god help us..latest odds from skybet

Boris the bufoon 1/6
Hunt the runt 7/2

More chance of FCB selling up and RAFA staying.

MGR1

06-23-19, 09:37 AM

More chance of FCB selling up and RAFA staying.

I take it that's a football reference? If it is, I can't stand "fitba" so it goes over my head.:03:

Why is it, for a supposedly "communitarian/collective" country we Scot's generally suck at team sports.....:hmmm:

Back to politics:

Tory tensions over keeping the UK intact (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-48729801) by Glenn Campbell, Chief political correspondent, BBC Scotland.

Just how committed is the Conservative Party to keeping the UK together?
That might seem an odd question to ask of a party that is properly known as the Conservative and Unionist Party.
The clue is in the word Unionist, right?
Yes, but the party's commitment to leaving the European Union is in potential conflict with its commitment to keeping the UK union intact.
That's not always obvious when you listen to some leading Conservatives.

Usual noise from Sturgeon:

Hunt and Johnson 'out of touch' with Scotland. (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-48722640)

The Conservative party leadership race proves that Scotland is on a "different political path" to the rest of the UK, according to Scotland's first minister.
Jeremy Hunt and Boris Johnson are going head-to-head to become the next Tory leader and prime minister.
Both men say they are prepared to leave the European Union without a deal.
At the Royal Highland Show, Nicola Sturgeon told BBC Scotland both candidates were "out of touch" with mainstream opinion in Scotland.
Actually, they're out of touch with the whole of the UK, my dear, not just Scotland.:doh:

Mike.

Jimbuna

06-23-19, 09:41 AM

Football, UK Union and Out Of Touch.....all agreed as far as I'm concerned :yep:

MGR1

06-23-19, 09:55 AM

Scotland, your bloody foreign neighbours on the continent have never understood it. From England's subduction of scottish 'tribes' (not that England was so much more advanced at that time, or the countries of Europe for that matter), to England actually destroying any effort of Scotland to improve as a nation, the deforestation for building the english fleets, letting hords of sheep grazing the now empty landscape keeping any effort to reforest down, the disappropriation of scottish land owners, the displacement of people from their ancestral ground and heritage by destroying their economical base.. "all in the best interest" of course.

A lot of Scots had to move to England, became traders e.g. with tea or such (certainly depending on the english market now, and supporting it), while the people who stayed tried to make a living in a kept-down economy, some by smuggling, constantly under pressure by english customs and military. True until 1900 anyway.

Something of a simplification, Catfish.:03:

The core is quite true, but what many seem either to ignore or simply don't know is that Scotland's own social elite has to bear a great deal, if not most, of the blame. The majority of the rapaciousness inflicted on Scotland's population was for the most part carried out by that part of society. When you look back, it's pretty obvious that the wealthy did very well out of the Union and the Empire. The poor, who made up the majority of the Scottish population at that time (the Upper and Middle classes were tiny in comparison with England) rather less so.

To give an example, Scottish engineering firms, particularly those engaged in building railway equipment, always submitted lower bids for contracts than their English competitors. They could do this as they simply didn't pay their "company servants" (to use the terminology of the time) as much as the firms in England did for the same work. Hence you had so much economic migration from Scotland to England.

If the English ruling elites can be blamed for anything, it's simply not paying closer attention to the ticking time bomb that their Scottish allies were inadvertantly priming.:hmmm:

Mike.

Jimbuna

06-23-19, 10:02 AM

Boris Johnson’s poll ratings have suffered a major slump following the loud altercation with his girlfriend, as voters say his private life does matter in the race for No 10.

The favourite’s lead among Conservative voters has more than halved since the incident on Thursday night – and rival Jeremy Hunt has snatched the lead among the wider public.

But the survey, for The Mail on Sunday, found that Mr Johnson's lead among Tory voters as the man who would make the best prime minister has more than halved, from a 27-point lead to just 11.
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/politics/boris-johnsons-poll-leads-vanish-as-loud-altercation-with-partner-deals-major-blow-to-tory-leadership-bid/ar-AADigl6?li=BBoPWjQ&ocid=mailsignout

I reckon we're going to witness a lot more up and down movements as the campaign progresses.

Jimbuna

06-24-19, 09:23 AM

Former deputy prime minister and Labour veteran John Prescott has been admitted to hospital after suffering a stroke, his family has said.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48745868

A bit of a feisty character at times but someone who always gave me the impression during our conversations that he believed in what he said.

Speedy recovery John.

Jimbuna

06-24-19, 09:27 AM

Sky News has said it will be forced to cancel a debate between the two men vying to be the next Tory leader unless Boris Johnson agrees to take part.

The broadcaster hoped to be the first to stage a head-to-head debate between Mr Johnson and his rival Jeremy Hunt.

But it said Mr Johnson had "so far declined" its invitation and the event would not go ahead without him.

Mr Hunt said it was "incredibly disappointing" and risked "cheating" the country out of a "proper contest".

He said the next prime minister would not have the popular mandate to take difficult decisions on Brexit and other issues if they were not prepared to face scrutiny now.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48744724

If the clown isn't careful his whole campaign could implode on him.

STEED

06-25-19, 07:10 AM

What is all this bloody hoo-ha over a picture of bojo? Who gives a toss for crying out loud has the news media gone mad in this country. In the name of sanity who gives a bloody toss, I'm more interested in how he plans to run the country not some bloody picture of bojo and his bird sitting outside around a table who gives a...........

Jimbuna

06-25-19, 07:18 AM

Boris Johnson has admitted he would need EU co-operation to avoid a hard Irish border or crippling tariffs on trade in the event of a no-deal Brexit.

In an exclusive interview with the BBC, the favourite to be the next PM said: "It's not just up to us."

But he said he did "not believe for a moment" the UK would leave without a deal, although he was willing to do so.

Asked about a row he'd had with his partner, he said it was "simply unfair" to involve "loved ones" in the debate.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48751527

First remnants of something sensible from him thus far.

Jimbuna

06-25-19, 09:52 AM

It would appear the charm offensive has finally started.

Boris Johnson has responded to criticism of his Tory leadership campaign by undertaking a succession of media and public appearances.

The favourite to succeed Theresa May as prime minister told Talk Radio Brexit would happen on 31 October "do or die".

In an apparent change of strategy following attacks from his rival Jeremy Hunt, Mr Johnson met members of the public in a walkabout in Surrey.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48756819?intlink_from_url=https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk&link_location=live-reporting-story

I should imagine his staff have him on a well scripted tight leash.

Jimbuna

06-26-19, 05:10 AM

Not tight enough apparently :)

Speaking on Talk Radio on Tuesday, the frontrunner to replace Theresa May was asked by the interviewer, Ross Kempsell, what he did to relax.

Johnson replied: “I like to paint. Or I make things. I have a thing where I make models of buses. What I make is, I get old, I don’t know, wooden crates, and I paint them. It’s a box that’s been used to contain two wine bottles, right, and it will have a dividing thing. And I turn it into a bus.

“So I put passengers – I paint the passengers enjoying themselves on a wonderful bus – low carbon, of the kind that we brought to the streets of London, reducing C02, reducing nitrous oxide, reducing pollution.”
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/mesmerising-boris-johnsons-bizarre-model-buses-claim-raises-eyebrows/ar-AADrAqi?li=BBoPWjQ&ocid=mailsignout

STEED

06-27-19, 04:37 AM

Bloody disgrace but what do you expect from a raging anti-semite steptoe allowing one of his mob back in.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48778129

Jimbuna

06-27-19, 06:15 AM

Hardly surprising when you take into consideration the fact he is a personal friend and supporter of Steptoe.

Jimbuna

06-27-19, 09:25 AM

Ninety Labour MPs and peers have criticised the decision to readmit MP Chris Williamson back into the party.

They expressed "hurt and anger" at the ruling and said Jeremy Corbyn must withdraw the party whip.

The Derby North MP was suspended after saying Labour had "given too much ground" in the face of criticism over anti-Semitism in the party.

Eleven frontbenchers, including deputy leader Tom Watson, are among those criticising the ruling.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48790803

I doubt Steptoe will even bat an eyelid.

STEED

06-28-19, 03:58 AM

STEED

06-28-19, 04:02 AM

Jeremy Hunt has urged Tory leadership rival Boris Johnson to "be straight with people" about what a no-deal Brexit would mean.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48794093

I would say that goes for both of you as both of you are clueless on what to do.

Jimbuna

06-28-19, 04:52 AM

^I hear its up to 121 now but as you say jim that raging anti-semite steptoe would rather have tea with terrorist organisations. The once proud labour party now nothing more than a shadow of what is was.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48790803

The first audience question on last nights Question Time was to ask if Chris Williamson should have been allowed back and all five of the panel said 'NO'

Jimbuna

06-28-19, 04:58 AM

Theresa May 'looking forward to being backbench MP'
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48797835

I wasn't aware she had any other choice if she wasn't going to quit like Dave and Tony did.

Jimbuna

06-28-19, 05:46 AM

The suspects in the Salisbury Novichok attack should be "brought to justice" and Russia must stop its "destabilising activities", Theresa May has said.

The PM spoke to the BBC before she met Russia's President Putin at the G20 summit for one-to-one talks on Friday.

The UK believes two officers from Russia's military intelligence service, the GRU, were behind the poisoning of former spy Sergei Skripal and his daughter Yulia, in March 2018.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-48795720

STEED

06-28-19, 05:49 AM

^More chance Trump will dye his hair pink.

MayBot looks like she rather not...

https://e3.365dm.com/19/06/1600x900/skynews-theresa-may-vladimir-putin_4704252.jpg?bypass-service-worker&20190628102801

Anyone for cold fish?

Jimbuna

06-28-19, 09:12 AM

Theresa May has refused to promise unconditional support for her successor's Brexit plan.

Asked if she would back whichever Brexit outcome the next prime minister achieves, including a no-deal Brexit, she said that amounted to agreeing to "whatever happens in future".

Jeremy Hunt or Boris Johnson will be announced as the winner of the Tory Party leadership race on 23 July.

Both men have said they would try to renegotiate a deal with the EU.

Speaking to journalists on her official flight to the G20 summit in Osaka, Mrs May said: "It is important that we deliver a Brexit that is good for the British people.

"It will be up to my successor to take this forward. To find the majority in Parliament that I was not able to find and to deliver the decision of the British people in 2016."
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48787708

Should be interesting to see which of the two she will be backing.

Jimbuna

06-29-19, 06:03 AM

French police were last night accused of cashing in on British holidaymakers ahead of Brexit by bombarding them with speeding tickets.

Gendarmes made 104,031 requests to the DVLA for details of drivers as the UK was due to leave the EU in March.

This is around two and a half times the 42,824 made the previous month, a Freedom of Information request shows. Just three requests were made in January.
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/brexit/british-holidaymakers-are-being-bombarded-with-speeding-tickets-amid-claims-french-police-fear-it-will-be-harder-to-rake-in-fines-after-brexit/ar-AADzFs0?li=BBoPWjQ&ocid=mailsignout

Absolutely pathetic if true :nope:

Catfish

06-29-19, 06:15 AM

^ not much sympathy from me since England does the same. London is scattered with video cams some weeks after visiting you suddenly get requests to pay for all kinds of (often made up) driving 'violations'. Objections not possible.

Jimbuna

06-29-19, 06:35 AM

This is around two and a half times the 42,824 made the previous month, a Freedom of Information request shows. Just three requests were made in January.
This is the most telling element for me.

STEED

06-30-19, 04:33 AM

Prime ministerial hopeful Jeremy Hunt has said he would consider withholding some of the UK's £39bn EU "divorce bill" in the event of a no-deal Brexit.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48814944

Both of them making empty threats, sorry pandering to the grass root Tories.

Jimbuna

06-30-19, 07:05 AM

I'd ask each of them the one simple question...."If as you state you are going to take the UK out of the EU even if a majority in Parliament for said measure can not be achieved, how exactly are you going to do this"?

Jimbuna

06-30-19, 07:09 AM

Jeremy Corbyn has called for an inquiry after a newspaper reported two civil servants had said he was "too frail" to lead Labour or become PM.

The Times said it was briefed by two senior civil servants with suggestions the Labour leader may have to stand down over supposed health issues.

Mr Corbyn has called it "a farrago of nonsense" and "tittle tattle".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-48813656

Never mind his health, I'd be questioning his sanity :haha:

STEED

06-30-19, 03:39 PM

Any MP that supports terrorist organisations is unfit to be a MP, how the heck steptoe got the job just shows the labour party has gone down a blind dark alley under him. And how the heck Parliament will not act just shows how corrupt and bloody minded they have become.

STEED

07-01-19, 06:01 AM

Steptoe has been given a blow from both LibDem leadership candidates on SKY debate, both will not work with steptoe if Labour wins a general election. This has now made it harder for steptoe as he will need to pass the magic line to form a government on his own. Both LibDems feel steptoe has taken Labour to the far left and on that I agree with them.

Jimbuna

07-01-19, 10:20 AM

Jimbuna

07-01-19, 10:23 AM

Jeremy Hunt has said he would decide by the end of September whether there is a "realistic chance" of reaching a new Brexit deal with the EU.

The Tory leadership contender said he would deliver a provisional "no-deal Brexit budget" in early September and then give the EU three weeks.

He vowed to abandon talks after that if there was no "immediate prospect" of progress and move to a no-deal footing.

His rival Boris Johnson has vowed to leave "come what may" by 31 October.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48819260

The question remains unchanged...."How will you deliver a no deal Brexit" ?

kraznyi_oktjabr

07-01-19, 01:37 PM

The question remains unchanged...."How will you deliver a no deal Brexit" ?Maybe I'm missing something (I haven't followed the circus lately) but what you mean with "delivering no deal Brexit?" I aave understood, that October 31st Brexit date is written into legislation and therefore only thing Bojo has to do is to ensure that the Parliament does not amend that law. At the moment I don't believe that either candidate has realistic chance in sweet talking EU back into negotiation table.

Jimbuna

07-01-19, 01:38 PM

Hammond says Tory leadership candidates must 'be honest' over spending plans.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48832080

I doubt either of them understand the true meaning of the word :hmmm:

Jimbuna

07-02-19, 09:21 AM

Brexit Party MEPs turned their backs during the EU's Ode To Joy anthem, while Lib Dem MEPs wore yellow "Stop Brexit" T-shirts on the first day of European Parliament.

Brexit Party leader Nigel Farage said his 29 MEPs were "cheerfully defiant" and made their "presence felt".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48839829

It has begun.

Jimbuna

07-02-19, 09:23 AM

Chancellor Philip Hammond has signalled he would be prepared to vote against a no-deal Brexit in Parliament, claiming it could cost the UK up to £90bn.

Leaving the EU without a legal agreement would be the "wrong" policy and cause a huge "hit" to the public finances, he told MPs.

He said it was "highly unlikely" he would still be in his job after Theresa May stands down next month.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48841908

Yes, highly unlikely indeed.

STEED

07-02-19, 05:55 PM

It has begun. Both Brexit and LibDems acted like twits, in the case of brexit why did they just not sat there like some others i noted.

Catfish

07-03-19, 01:26 AM

[...] Brexit Party leader Nigel Farage said his 29 MEPs were "cheerfully defiant" and made their "presence felt". [...]

The brexiters turned their back when the EU hymn was being played.
Nigel Farrago, I guess this is all he lives for, to present himself.

https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2019/jul/01/nigel-farage-furious-over-tv-show-assassinating-neil-fromage-year-of-the-rabbit :haha: (https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2019/jul/01/nigel-farage-furious-over-tv-show-assassinating-neil-fromage-year-of-the-rabbit)
Nigel being furious, what news. This jer.. gets way too much coverage.

Jimbuna

07-03-19, 05:58 AM

The brexiters turned their back when the EU hymn was being played.
Nigel Farrago, I guess this is all he lives for, to present himself.

https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2019/jul/01/nigel-farage-furious-over-tv-show-assassinating-neil-fromage-year-of-the-rabbit :haha: (https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2019/jul/01/nigel-farage-furious-over-tv-show-assassinating-neil-fromage-year-of-the-rabbit)
Nigel being furious, what news. This jer.. gets way too much coverage.

Yes, he is certainly something of an odd ball.

STEED

07-03-19, 11:20 AM

Brexit party join the LibDems Greens and the SNP....

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48847542

Sorry while the Cons and Lab rule the roost there will be no change as the current system works well for them. :03:

JU_88

07-04-19, 03:32 AM

Jeremy C.. I mean Hunt Is open to lifting the ban on fox hunting.
Why are the Tories so determined to shoot them selves in the foot with this one every election? :haha: They must have some posh mates badgering them to legalize it or something.

@Steed, check this mornings headlines, Lib Dems and Brexit Party have over taken Labour in the polls.
https://news.sky.com/story/labour-falls-into-fourth-place-in-new-opinion-poll-11756313
I smell a Con/BP Coalition coming.

Jimbuna

07-04-19, 05:48 AM

Jeremy C.. I mean Hunt Is open to lifting the ban on fox hunting.
Why are the Tories so determined to shoot them selves in the foot with this one every election? :haha: They must have some posh mates badgering them to legalize it or something.

He said "[Hunting] is part of the countryside. And we have to recognise that in terms of the balance of the countryside. You know, it's part of our heritage."

I'd be saying "So was highway robbery and the drowning of women to determine if they were witches or not". So why not bring them back as well"?

ikalugin

07-04-19, 06:50 AM

Journalists from Zvezda "borrowed" the schematic from here:
http://militaryrussia.ru/blog/topic-708.html

STEED

07-04-19, 08:22 AM

Journalists from Zvezda "borrowed" the schematic from here:
http://militaryrussia.ru/blog/topic-708.html

Not sure what this has to do with UK politics but hey as its dull at the moment gives me time to learn Russian so i can read the link. :)

STEED

07-04-19, 08:24 AM

Jimbuna

07-04-19, 09:01 AM

The two Tory leadership candidates have been challenged to bring forward plans to tackle the social care crisis in England if they become prime minister.

A committee of peers has called for an immediate £8bn cash increase and a move to a free, NHS-based system.

Jeremy Hunt has pledged more council funding and an opt-out insurance system for people to save for future care.

Boris Johnson says more money should be found, with policy worked out according to a cross-party plan.

Meanwhile, councils say the government's delayed plans on elderly care should be published by September at the latest.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48855645

The social care issue is the only one that is greater than Brexit so it will be interesting to see what 'promises' are made.

ikalugin

07-04-19, 10:10 AM

I derped by posting it in the wrong place. This was about the curious schematic being mentioned in relation to the recent Russian submarine fire.

Can the mods please move it? :(

MGR1

07-04-19, 10:47 AM

Oops:

Brexit is the priority even if UK splits, Nigel Farage tells Robert Peston (https://www.itv.com/news/2019-07-04/brexit-is-the-priority-even-if-uk-splits-nigel-farage-tells-robert-peston/)

Now we know. For Farage it appears that Brexit may actually mean Engxit, from both the EU and the UK....

Rather makes sense, actually. In his pre-EU election hustings in Edinburgh he actively courted Eurosceptic pro-Indy types for whom independence means independence (Guardian article from the time):

Scotland won't be independent within EU, says Farage (https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/may/17/nigel-farage-attacks-snps-claims-about-post-brexit-scotland)

I wouldn't say I'm a diehard Unionist (too many negative connotations - sectarianism for starters) but I think this highlights the disconnect between general public opinion in England, for whom the Union would be nice, but don't believe in forcing the home nations to stay together, and Unionists in both Scotland and Northern Ireland, for whom the Union is sacrosanct and shall never be broken for any reason.

Not sure how that can be dealt with.:hmmm:

Mike.

Catfish

07-05-19, 01:30 AM

Farrago would be nothing without project fear (immigration) or the subsequent brexit.
His whole claim to power is based only on this.

How anyone can expect any other visions or future plans is beyond me :doh:

JU_88

07-05-19, 02:21 AM

Jimbuna

07-05-19, 05:53 AM

Chancellor Philip Hammond has told the BBC he and other MPs will "find a way" of blocking a no-deal Brexit.

He told Radio 4's Political Thinking Podcast he would personally oppose leaving the EU without a legal agreement on 31 October.

He warned Theresa May's successor as prime minister not to "sideline" MPs, saying this would be "shocking".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48874144

Whether you support his viewpoint or not it would appear the chancellors days are numbered.

Platapus

07-05-19, 10:21 AM

JU_88

07-05-19, 01:55 PM

Serious question for our Brit members.

How big of a deal is the private christening ceremony for Archie?

I am wondering if the media is manufacturing a big deal out of this just to have a big deal to report.

I've not heard much about it, but then i skip over anything about the royals. because unless one of them has died, i don't consider it news.

Like the Dad who took his son to a MickeyD's and got a parking fine....
...Not news

Or the Woman who took her sons Pink T shirt back to the shop because
her husband hated it
....Not news.

Opinion Pieces from the Guardian are fun to read though - just to watch our preachy 'woke' cosmopolitan middle class overlords drown them selves in their own narcissism.
piece after piece on how every facet of the world revolves around race and gender and why you are probably a terrible person.
..... And yet they still cant comprehend why their ideology is slowly dying.

STEED

07-05-19, 04:21 PM

As a Republican all I want to see the end of the royals, lords, dukes, dames and all the bloody rest of them. Not forgetting bloody career politicians and the bloody BBC and the EU. :)

JU_88

07-05-19, 04:58 PM

I don't wish death on the BBC but I don't agree with the way they are funded.

its been clear since around 2012 that The EU is going to fail in the long run,
people say it just needs some reform but I doubt it can be reformed. Its model and ambitions are too rigid.
And plus the Kind of reforms needed to appease its growing skeptics would render its existence pointless anyway.

You only need to see that clip of Guy Verhofstadt screaming about member states refusing to relinquish further powers over to the Union, to realize its toast.
Seeing someone throw a tantrum like that, tells you they have already lost.

STEED

07-05-19, 05:33 PM

I hope what I know from pensioner's around here have said the BBC can drop dead next year is reprocated up and down the land. Serve the bloody PIG BBC right, what are they going to do? Prosecute pensioner's that will go down well.

STEED

07-06-19, 04:02 AM

Some Conservative members have been issued with more than one ballot paper to vote for the next party leader and prime minister, the BBC has learned.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-48890803

So what!...

I bet the voting papers look like this...

CONSERVATIVE LEADERSHIP ELECTION 2019

Boris Johnson

Jeremy Hunt

Jimbuna

07-06-19, 04:52 AM

As a Republican all I want to see the end of the royals, lords, dukes, dames and all the bloody rest of them. Not forgetting bloody career politicians and the bloody BBC and the EU. :)

For someone who purports to hate the BBC so much, isn't it a little ironic you visit their site and use their material so much?

Jimbuna

07-06-19, 04:55 AM

Some Conservative members have been issued with more than one ballot paper to vote for the next party leader and prime minister, the BBC has learned.

One party insider estimated that more than a thousand voters could be affected.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-48890803

I can here the wheels of a post election result investigation grinding into motion already.

STEED

07-06-19, 05:00 AM

For someone who purports to hate the BBC so much, isn't it a little ironic you visit their site and use their material so much?

You don't trust SKY. :O:

I had a visit from some one acting on behalf of the BBC asking me do I own a TV? No I have a monitor for watching my DVD's and he said I was breaking the law! He demanded to come in, he was acting like a verbal thug in my book and I told him to go away and get a warrant. I get nasty letters whom can not get in their thick skulls I'm not breaking the law but the BBC thinks I am.

About bloody time the BBC got its money from adverts.

https://www.tvlicensing.co.uk/faqs/FAQ15

PS. Just to add its gone quite for a few months but I know they will try it on again sooner or latter.

STEED

07-06-19, 05:31 AM

Tory leadership latest: Philip Hammond leads group of 30 Tory MPs planning to stop no-deal Brexit

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/07/05/tory-leadership-latest-news-boris-johnson-jeremy-hunt-hustings/

Of course he will as a remainder and knowing his job could be on the line Hammond has nothing to loose by muddy the waters.

Jimbuna

07-06-19, 05:35 AM

You don't trust SKY. :O:

I had a visit from some one acting on behalf of the BBC asking me do I own a TV? No I have a monitor for watching my DVD's and he said I was breaking the law! He demanded to come in, he was acting like a verbal thug in my book and I told him to go away and get a warrant. I get nasty letters whom can not get in their thick skulls I'm not breaking the law but the BBC thinks I am.

About bloody time the BBC got its money from adverts.

https://www.tvlicensing.co.uk/faqs/FAQ15

PS. Just to add its gone quite for a few months but I know they will try it on again sooner or latter.

As soon as I've finished reporting on the matter I should be in a position to give you a pretty close prediction of the time :yep:

Jimbuna

07-06-19, 05:36 AM

Of course he will as a remainder and knowing his job could be on the line Hammond has nothing to loose by muddy the waters.

Hammond is toast, regardless of the eventual winner.

STEED

07-06-19, 11:00 AM

Please new PM can we have some more money..

The DUP is set to present the next prime minister with a demand for cash for NHS waiting lists in Northern Ireland within days of coming to office.

The party's MPs have told Sky News they expect to review the confidence and supply arrangement later this month after Theresa May stands down.

https://news.sky.com/story/dup-to-demand-nhs-cash-boost-in-northern-ireland-from-next-pm-11757553Interesting move wonder how Boris will take it. :hmmm:

Probably be swinging from the chandeliers beating his chest shouting out how dare they. :03: :haha:

MGR1

07-06-19, 12:16 PM

Please new PM can we have some more money..

Interesting move wonder how Boris will take it. :hmmm:

Probably be swinging from the chandeliers beating his chest shouting out how dare they. :03: :haha:

An unfortunate consequence of having to rely on the DUP, the party that normally says NO to everything.:hmmm:

At least the SNP aren't that mercenary. At least until the possibility of a Labour Government and even then it would be a case of support in return for another IndyRef.

Another wall-o-text from Dante over on the TotalWar Center forum (https://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?761357-Brexit-Time-to-scrap-it-and-start-again&p=15801570&viewfull=1#post15801570):

I've had the privilege to partake in a series of brexit seminars and conferences over the past few weeks analyzing it and this point was raised extremely well as something that has rather gone under the radar, so kudos for reaching the same conclusion faster i'd say mate. If we take the (quite right i'd say) thesis that Britain only became a 'nation' (prior to being the first 'sphere' of an empire- being Scotland, England, Wales and Ireland with London, Glasgow and Liverpool as an imperial metropoles) post-1940s, when the 'techo-nationalist' state forged an identity that for the first time attempted to incorporate the constituent nationalities into 'Britain', but then this work was undone (or abandoned- depends on view) by Thatcher, who 'internationalized' again Britain...this time without the Empire (So going from a free-trading foremost power, who directly reaped all the benefits of free trade to a free trading, but rather typical economy that no longer was in the position to reap the real rewards of pushing a free trading policy, the term 'reverse colonization' could be somewhat awkwardly applied in terms of the business world indeed). In doing this though, the half-formed 'British identity' gave way, to well... nothing. What unified Britain's constituent nations together was the imperial project, without it, the fact that administration and identity had never really been addressed (Indeed i wrote a paper on the Boer War highlighting admittedly a very niche group- soldiers- how their 'national' identities within Britain, relied on the 'Empire' to define and shape them- Scottish and English without that imperial aspect where broad, debatable and fluid...and just rather awkward).

So from Thatcher to brexit, a background narrative has been these nations of Britain attempting to resolve this mess (Another interesting aside, its why Labour is arguably the only truly 'British' party in terms of historically having an identity and policy platform that actually attempts to bridge the four nations identities...how successful this has been you decide https://www.twcenter.net/forums/images/smilies/emoticons/tongue.gif) and forge their identities, often in opposition to one another. Brexit is part of this indeed- It will likely either result directly in, or be the catalyst for Scotland leaving the UK, But for England, its a battle within their identity (as well as vs 'British') over what it means to be English, and frustration at a perceived (and actual) lack of recognition for 'English' identity (though going back to my Boer war paper, its partly the English political elites fault for essentially using 'English' and 'British' interchangeably- thus unlike Scotland and co, they've rather 'stunted' the typical work that goes into adapting and 'keeping relevant' a national identity, and instead relied on 'British'...which is in itself tied to a dead imperial project, seeking new meaning and rather empty post-1960 essentially- if anyone is interested in all this stuff, i can give them a full bibliography- most work is open access).

Political representation is a big part of this, no longer is it fair to assume 'Westminster= England and Britain'. However, the other fear, made apparent above is that for some perceptions of 'English', taking 'England' out of Westminster would essentially just signal that Britain and the UK is truly 'finished'. So its an interesting perspective, and historians who are interested in identity and nationalism are loving it a lot so far https://www.twcenter.net/forums/images/smilies/emoticons/tongue.gif.

A personal comment to that poll though- Genuinely scary (for my perspective), as while it is evidence that Conservatives are still very much tied to a solid 'English' (and not British as Labour) identity, the fact that

A)politics is so polarized that Conservative members largely would rather see the UK cease to exist and a decade long depression happen than see Corbyn as PM- The damage he could do even for a far-right worst case perspective is far less, and indeed in 5 or less years could be undone... It seems tribal politics is back in a way that it hasn't been for quite a while, and that logic is out the window.

B) That the Conservative members are now solely thinking of the short term. If brexit does 'significant damage to the UK economy' or breaks up the UK, you can guarantee the sustainability of brexit (already questionable) will collapse, it means we'll be back in the EU a mere few years down the line, and without in all likelihood our special status within it. Actual analysis of how to make their cause 'work', has gone out the window in favour of short-term emotional fulfillment, that would see the thing their willing to sacrifice so much for (Brexit), collapse and be undone in front of their very eyes a relatively short time later.

This is though a failure of brexiteer leadership to get that across of course, its also a failure of remain who indeed did totally misjudge their campaign- if anyone wanted to hear a chancellor squirm on this point, the QC interview on youtube between Osborune and Campbell highlights an awareness of this- Osbourne essentially admits that fresh from the GE and successful Scottish referendum, they were partly overly confident and partly misjudged brexit and ran the same campaign they had in these cases without really doing the groundwork research. Cameron further hamstrung himself by his constant emphasis that 'blue on blue' violence should be avoided, thus Boris and co were given a very free hand. Maybe from this poll they should have all allowed Corbyn to campaign for brexit (as i suspect he wanted to do), it would have seen the Tory membership change their minds rather sharpish by the look of it https://www.twcenter.net/forums/images/smilies/emoticons/tongue.gif I think it highlights something I find quite interesting as a concept - that what we're seeing is England asserting it's own, separate, national identity in the face of it's own political elite's attempts to throttle that awareness off because that elite view's this England only identity as a threat to both their own position and to the continuation of the British State.

So, the question should be asked: what does Brexit actually mean if the concept of Britain as a state no longer has any real meaning?

Mike.:hmmm:

Jimbuna

07-07-19, 07:28 AM

Labour's deputy leader Tom Watson has described another Brexit referendum as "the least worst option" and urged his party to throw its weight behind one.

Speaking to the BBC, he said Labour should then fight for Remain, even though "we might lose some votes".

Jeremy Corbyn has resisted calls to fully endorse another public vote, only calling for it in some circumstances.

But Mr Watson said Labour would pay "a very high electoral price" if it did not have "a clear position" on Brexit.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48658683

Looks to me like you're putting yourself in harms way again Tom.

JU_88

07-08-19, 02:15 AM

Too little too late - RIP Labour, they'll still get votes from naive students indoctrinated in to the church of social justice and greivence culture, but everyone else has moved on.

Jimbuna

07-08-19, 04:23 AM

^ True that but not just Labour :yep:

Jimbuna

07-08-19, 04:25 AM

Everyone should worry about no deal, the civil servant who was, until March, head of the Brexit department has said.

Philip Rycroft, who resigned after 18 months, told the BBC's Panorama no deal was "fraught with risk".

And NI police said no deal could help recruitment for paramilitary groups.

Both the candidates in the race to replace Theresa May as prime minister - Jeremy Hunt and Boris Johnson - have said they would be prepared to leave the EU without a deal.

Former Defence Secretary Sir Michael Fallon said there was "no reason at all" why new negotiations with the EU could not be completed "the next three months".

But the EU has repeatedly refused to re-open negotiations.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48901055

I really don't see the EU backing down unless the forthcoming changes in their leadership feel differently to the old regime.

Catfish

07-08-19, 04:56 AM

[...] votes from naive students indoctrinated in to the church of social justice and greivence culture, but everyone else has moved on...

... from once-granted statutory rights, to new age exploitation, national unilateralism and far-right interests with their solo attempts. Multipolarism rules again. Divide and screw the people :up:

Jimbuna

07-08-19, 11:54 AM

Corbyn to speak at 135th Durham Miners' Gala
Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn has been confirmed as the main speaker at the 135th Durham Miners' Gala on Saturday.

Mr Corbyn has attended the event - dubbed the Big Meeting - every year since becoming leader.

This precisely why I broke a personal twenty year tradition of visiting the Gala as soon as he came onto the scene.

JU_88

07-08-19, 12:37 PM

... from once-granted statutory rights, to new age exploitation, national unilateralism and far-right interests with their solo attempts. Multipolarism rules again. Divide and screw the people :up:

Er.... Pardon?
You want to talk about sewing the seed of division?
have you still not realized or accepted that the success of the 'far right' is largely reactionary - and is a response to the far lefts past decade of work? Carving people up to special interest groups to demand not equality but equity.
BLM, the current generation of Feminism, LGBTQ etc. Where did all these 'groups' sprouted from? Answer - The Universities, and who runs the academia? Tommy Robinson and The far right? No, I don't think so.
Not to mention good old ATIFA masked in black, beating people and calling themselves 'anti fascists'. Amazing.

If you legitimize such group Identity, and then cast certain people out, don't be surprised when they join / form their own bitter resentful groups. You have after all just legitimized the practice.
In a nut shell If the far left hadn't spent the past decade promoting 'group identity', we would not have such a far right problem as we do now.
Look at the Lefty term 'people of colour' a term to lump all non-white people together, created by 'well to do' white people. but there can be no good outcome from creating such a divisive term.

Frustratingly much of Left are still pegging the rise of the far right on failed economics & capitalism.
The level of denial is amazing.
We had a major crash in 2008- and what rose from the aftermath of that?, Libertarians and socialists, yes - but nazis? not so much!

The left has its crazies just like the right, what we have now seen is what happens when the sensible leftists fail to control the fringes. Their own fringe grows and so does the 'rights' in backlash.

Catfish

07-09-19, 04:31 AM

Er.... Pardon?
You want to talk about sewing the seed of division?
No i'd say it is a fact, whoever does it. I would not even know whether the left or the right is bader, though i think it is the side with big money trying to seed division. And while the left may have some, the big money is on the corporate 10 percent side, which is b.t.w. seldomly 'left', politically.

[...] have you still not realized or accepted that the success of the 'far right' is largely reactionary - and is a response to the far lefts past decade of work? Carving people up to special interest groups to demand not equality but equity."Reactionary". Who was first, the hen or the egg? I would say that 'the right' in history almost always had the say in the past centuries and back to the cavemen (by sheer brutal force, or by religion explaining why males are more worth in god's eyes), maybe until the 1980ies. No, i would not call Stalin 'left' indeed.

But I am all for equity. Since people differ so much "equality" cannot match here. But equity, yes, everyone should have the same right to live, and pursue his/her/x (ahem lol, pc off from here i promise) path to happiness.

BLM, the current generation of Feminism, LGBTQ etc. Where did all these 'groups' sprouted from? Answer - The Universities, and who runs the academia? Tommy Robinson and The far right? No, I don't think so.
Not to mention good old ATIFA masked in black, beating people and calling themselves 'anti fascists'. Amazing.It is not so much about "feminism" but about equal treatment regarding the law. Why should a woman earn less if she perfoms same or even better than her male colleague? Shouldn't she be allowed to vote?

The Antifa are idiots. So the universities are the bad ones now since all those eggheads want to spoil my fun cruising around with a 8 litre Diesel truck by scientific methods and arguments fake news. I agree, damn them! Vote for Trump! Vote for brexit! To hell with their fancy theories, i want my fun and i want it now.

This genderism or whatever one calls it is ridiculous, but again imho it is a reaction of centuries of suppression, of women not being able to withstand brute power, and of minorities. And now since all can voice their opinion also minorities like transgender people see their chance to say it aloud. Why not? Imho it is an overreaction, and after all most people are not transgender. So why is the latter so scared?

Also majorities have been suppressed or enslaved, if you think of Africans (but not only). They have a good reason to protest today against racism don't you think so? And don't tell me racism is dead, not in the US, not in Europe, not in Russia, Asia or anywhere else in this oh so civilised world.

Back to genderism, LGBTQ and so on i guess it will even itself out when those undercurrents get out of fashion. Soon.

And back to those poor suppressed right wing people who say were not allowed to speak their mind openly and publicly until Trump under those bad left governments, in the last decades. (i guess this includes the KuKluxers?)
I'd say they the latter were not even holding back much, but then you are right insofar that "the left" (or should i say common sense) has obviously not paid enough attention to them. Whether this attention consists of allowing them to publicly lynch certain people or spread their racism in blogs and all over the internet, or this attention involves a certain kind of force towards arsonists and haters trying to bring society to its knees, is not really debatable?

Those bitter resentful groups indeed. So who really had to suffer in the last decades, by democratically elected presidents or governments? Was there racial unrest? Did people really suffer, physically, like in Iraq, Syriah? Most are moaning from their high horse, and it is ridiculous to see.
Social unrest, well. Enough to kill and hate others? Like with Mr. Luebcke in Germany? Or Mrs Cox in England?

In a nut shell If the far left hadn't spent the past decade promoting 'group identity', we would not have such a far right problem as we do now.
Look at the Lefty term 'people of colour' a term to lump all non-white people together, created by 'well to do' white people. but there can be no good outcome from creating such a divisive term.It is a bit easy to blame it all on the left. They have their problems, wrong ideologies, and some are just donkeyholes. So the alternative is to use right wing terms for "coloured people". What would you propose?

The left has its crazies just like the right, what we have now seen is what happens when the sensible leftists fail to control the fringes. Their own fringe grows and so does the 'rights' in backlash.I can agree, but still think that even the craziest left have a lot more humour than those "bitter and resentful" on the right.

Jimbuna

07-09-19, 06:09 AM

Jeremy Corbyn has challenged the next PM to put their Brexit deal or a no deal exit to a second referendum, saying Labour would campaign for Remain in those scenarios.

The Labour leader announced the shift following a meeting of his top team, having come under pressure from critics to rectify what they characterised as a lack of clarity from Mr Corbyn on the issue.
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/brexit/corbyn-calls-on-next-pm-to-put-brexit-deal-to-second-referendum/ar-AAE4Cv7?li=BBoPRmx&ocid=mailsignout

It looks like Steptoe is finally being forced to climb down off the fence but sti;; falls short of his parties expectations.

Jimbuna

07-09-19, 06:13 AM

The head of the World Trade Organisation has blown a hole in Boris Johnson’s Brexit plans as Conservative members vote on whether he should become party leader and prime minister.

Mr Johnson has argued that if the UK crashes out of the EU without a deal on 31 October, businesses will still be able to continue tariff-free trade with Europe under an obscure trading law known as Gatt 24. Without this protection, thousands of goods traded between the UK and the EU would be subject to standard WTO tariffs, adding considerably to costs to consumers.

But WTO director general Roberto Azevedo has now baldly stated that the mechanism – which his organisation oversees – cannot be invoked unless the parties involved have reached agreement on a future trade deal.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/boris-johnson-brexit-business-wto-gatt-24-article-eu-trade-leave-a8996001.html

This is the man who is the current favourite to become PM?

God help us :o

Skybird

07-09-19, 07:45 AM

You messed it up, and they will do all they can to crush you into pieces after a Brexit.

On your knees, surrender to the EU, and beg for mercy.

We in the EU ruin ourselves - and in this we will not leave you behind. Promised.

JU_88

07-09-19, 08:41 AM

It is a bit easy to blame it all on the left. They have their problems, wrong ideologies, and some are just donkeyholes. So the alternative is to use right wing terms for "coloured people". What would you propose?

I wouldn't dream of exclusively blaming the left for anything, 'the left' is still very broad -as is the right. But they do seem to struggle will calling out their own at the moment.

As for the term 'P.O.C'
My point is that the old right wing term 'coloured' and the new left wing term ' people of colour' are equally vile.
Can you give me one good reason why we need a term to segregate whites from non-whites at all? and one that wont involve any discrimination?
No you cant. And How is lumping all non whites in to one homogeneous group not racist?
The bottom line is - in a liberal meritocracy we should not need any term for that, no good can come of it.

Ultimately the far left is just as bigoted as the far right, they just have a difference of opinion on which groups require the 'preferential treatment' in order to achieve fairness. neither one wants equality and neither one values the sovereignty of the indervidual either. To either them you are very much defined by your race.
Mixed race people in particular don't take kindly to this as you can imagine, because they face rejection from both sides for not being 'pure' enough one way or the other.

I can agree, but still think that even the craziest left have a lot more humour than those "bitter and resentful" on the right.

Hmm, maybe go on twitter and post 'there are only two Genders, lol - just kidding' and see what happens....

So... I would disagree there, how many comedians is now that are afraid of performing at College campuses? How many conservative and even liberal speakers have been shut down /cancelled in the past few years? (some genuine far right yes, but not by and large)
The far left views certain words and ideas as violence and will meet satire of say racial and gender issues with the same level of anger as the real thing. Some have actually gone to prison for 'insensitive jokes'. So yes, when we are having to censor comedy primarily to appease far left activists - they are indeed every bit as humorless.
The Nazis were not known for there great sense of humor, but neither were the soviets, or any extremist for that matter, their entire wold views are driven by anger and resentment.

Catfish

07-09-19, 09:04 AM

[...] I would disagree there, how many comedians is now that are afraid of performing at College campuses?
We seem to have a completely different perception, or things are very much different in both countries.
While liberal and left-wing comedians were there quite often, theatre and events of all kinds have been mostly organised by students all over the spectrum. This has almost come to nil since the right wing organises scrapping mobs to "dissolve" such actions or meetings. A lot are frightened to enter the campus anymore, let alone organise any events that have not something to do with the studies.

This includes "left" and "central" students and comedians alike. It is not that right wingers were forbidden, but to be true there was not much coming from them ever (speaking of Goettingen here).

When it comes to right wing organisations and e.g. AfD ideological "chief" Hoecke speaking publicly in the university, this and others have not been forbidden, although there were some (still peaceful) protests from a lot of students, and citizens.

I have experienced much more hate and violence from the right spectrum here.

JU_88

07-09-19, 04:58 PM

Interesting, Where abouts are you Catfish?

This article & commentary sum it up nicely. (whats been happening to the left in the Anglo sphere at least)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MXKImEwbChs

STEED

07-09-19, 05:03 PM

I see no evidence we are leaving the eu. None apart from a massive wast of money for the last three odd years.

mapuc

07-09-19, 08:47 PM

JU_88

07-10-19, 04:19 AM

I get the feeling your politicians are saying to you.

"We asked you a simple question

Shall we leave or stay in EU ?

And you couldn't give a correct answer to our very simple question.

So we will ask you again, and you better give a correct answer this time"

Markus

Yes more or less, the same kind of shenanigans that went down in Greece in 2012. 'We'll just keep asking, until we get the answer we want'.

STEED

07-10-19, 05:16 AM

Just watching the news on B&J debate last night and clearly Hunt is weak and cautious and Boris is brash and soundbites making him more dangerous.

Just going back to jim's link about the warning from the President of the WTO why something this big has not been front cover news? :hmmm:

Jimbuna

07-10-19, 05:29 AM

I watched the debate on ITV last night (sad me) and one thing I did notice was the fact that Boris refused to answer any of the questions Hunt put to him whilst Hunt answered every one put to him by Boris.

Nigel must be wringing his hands in delight at the thought of an upcoming general election.

Jimbuna

07-10-19, 05:32 AM

Boris lover in Tory expenses 'abuse' claim: Carrie Symonds forced to quit £80k Tory HQ job over 'poor work' and accused of costing party thousands in improper expenses.
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/boris-lover-in-tory-expenses-abuse-claim-carrie-symonds-forced-to-quit-%c2%a380k-tory-hq-job-over-poor-work-and-accused-of-costing-party-thousands-in-improper-expenses/ar-AAE7it1?li=BBoPWjQ&ocid=mailsignout

Quite an interesting article if true.

Catfish

07-10-19, 05:48 AM

Quite an interesting article if true.
Hey if you don't like it call it fake news and the whole world will dismiss it :03:

Jimbuna

07-10-19, 06:01 AM

Hey if you don't like it call it fake news and the whole world will dismiss it :03:

True that :)

Jimbuna

07-10-19, 06:07 AM

Sir Kim Darroch resigns as UK ambassador to US amid row over leaked emails critical of Trump administration.

No doubt this will please Trump but I hope we find whoever is responsible for the leak.

Catfish

07-10-19, 06:18 AM

^ some comments should never be made public :yep:
Though it is just of all those comments which provide inofficial background and valuable information for real political decisions.
I hope we find whoever is responsible for the leak.
I do not think Mr. Darroch made handwritten comments, just asking which internationally used US eMail program would he use .. :hmmm:

Hello Microsoft, just saying :03:

Jimbuna

07-11-19, 07:56 AM

Senior Labour figures have expressed anger and alarm over claims some of Jeremy Corbyn's closest allies tried to interfere in disciplinary processes involving allegations of anti-Semitism.

Deputy leader Tom Watson said there was a "permissive culture" of anti-Semitism in the party and Mr Corbyn was "the only one" to fix it.

But Chief Rabbi Ephraim Mirvis said the leadership was "directly complicit".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48946070

This is absolutely disgraceful and still Steptoe fails to act :nope:

STEED

07-11-19, 08:12 AM

^ Yea yea yea, here we go the moderates are alarmed and we must move forward and end this, same old BS. Steptoe and his gang are raging anti-semites and if you lot don't get off your arses and boot him and his gang out of Labour then you are a useless load of b'stards. I'm sick to death of Labour under the boot of steptoe and his gang of anti-semites while he sucks up to terrorist's.

JU_88

07-12-19, 04:11 AM

yeah Forget about Labour Jim, its over. While they might still market them selves as the 'party of the poeple/workers' to their legacy voters their more northern constituencies, they are absolutely the party of the Southern progressive Soy frapachino drinking Guardian reader.
Vote for them if you want 1930's Social equity 'though an intersectional lense' :doh: or if they kick out team Corbyn, a Tony Blair MkII, Because i don't see what else they can really offer at this stage.
In 2018, they tried to hold a conference with different ticket prices for different races. If that's not rock bottom I don't know what is.

That said, I'm not advocating any of the other three, I too would have traditionally been a Labour voter, but I have zero faith in them to provide the most basic level of competence now. I cannot trust any party who are Ideologues first and technocrats second. All that approach has ever done in the long run is break things.

ikalugin

07-12-19, 04:43 AM

Having anti-semitic communists makes Labour spicy.

Jimbuna

07-12-19, 05:22 AM

That said, I'm not advocating any of the other three, I too would have traditionally been a Labour voter, but I have zero faith in them to provide the most basic level of competence now. I cannot trust any party who are Ideologues first and technocrats second. All that approach has ever done in the long run is break things.

Yep, looks like we are both in the same boat Francis. In fact, just the other night I floated the idea with the wife about emigrating and her response was "Where to and what about our six week old grandaughter Lucia"?

I didn't have an answer.

Jimbuna

07-12-19, 05:27 AM

Potential prime minister Boris Johnson has pledged to end "unfair" prosecutions of Army veterans who served in Northern Ireland.

The Tory leadership contender has joined rival Jeremy Hunt in backing a public campaign supporting soldiers who served during the Troubles.

Many Conservative MPs have called for such a move in recent months.

The government is working on legislation to deal with the legacy of Northern Ireland's Troubles.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-48961053

One of the few topics they genuinely agree on and one on which I totally support.

Jimbuna

07-12-19, 05:49 AM

Checking a couple of my Hotmail accounts and look what popped up :o

MPs Plot Commons 'Sit-In' To Stop Boris Johnson's No-Deal Brexit Plan To Shut Down Parliament.

Chancellor Philip Hammond expects MPs to stage a ‘sit-in’ to stop Boris Johnson from shutting down parliament to ram through a no-deal Brexit, HuffPost UK has learned.

Hammond has told colleagues that Commons Speaker John Bercow and Opposition MPs are likely to insist on carrying on their duties as normal even if the new prime minister attempts to ‘prorogue’ parliament.
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/brexit/mps-plot-commons-sit-in-to-stop-boris-johnsons-no-deal-brexit-plan-to-shut-down-parliament/ar-AAEbOsn?li=BBoPWjQ&ocid=mailsignout

:haha:

STEED

07-12-19, 06:13 AM

For those of you who feel you must vote..

Labour under the present leader who I will not state that persons name anymore will bankrupt the country and the result the Conservatives back in power for a good 10 to 15 years, do you really want that? Labour is in the hands of gangsters and until this lot are booted out there is no hope for Labour.

Conservatives are about to change there leader for the front runner Boris who will crash the UK out of the EU without agreement with them and massive tariffs here we come, Boris and his rich buddies can ride out the rough time can you?

LibDems are also about to change there leader and both candidates have stated they will not work with Labour with their current leader if Labour wins a hung Parliament. LibDems may increase their seats but never will run the country.

SNP will probably not work with Labour with in a hung Parliament without massive demands.

DUP will probably work with Boris and if the Conservatives win a hung Parliament the DUP will be in a better position to make massive demands for their support.

The Brexit Party could very well win a few seats but remember under Nigel UKIP was predicted to win up to 50 seats at one of the past general elections which in the number of votes they came fourth with no seats.

I don't care what that lot say at Westminster the evidence speaks for its self. Politicians do not give a dam about us its all bloody sound bites and fake news from them now, politics is dead.

Jimbuna

07-12-19, 06:23 AM

You're missing one salient point regarding Farage....This time he has a valid agenda that more voters can identify with, even more so that that which UKIP had......Betrayal!

STEED

07-12-19, 06:34 AM

You're missing one salient point regarding Farage....This time he has a valid agenda that more voters can identify with, even more so that that which UKIP had......Betrayal!

Boris will probably crash us out the EU and Brexit party will be history. The backlash will not be pretty, I hope we leave with a deal but I fear the worst.

Jimbuna

07-12-19, 07:07 AM

I doubt we will ever see a Brexit under the current political climate.

Deepseadiver

07-12-19, 11:49 AM

I will be happy with that.

STEED

07-12-19, 04:08 PM

I voted to leave the EU with I hoped a orderly withdraw, care too note I paid no attention to the reforendrum campaign and if I did I would have not bothered voting ether way.

So now here today I rather stay in the EU and we plan for the collapse of the EU because one day it will happen and on that day we will be ready. But with the load of usless swine we have at Westminster your probably better off doing your own planing.

JU_88

07-13-19, 02:05 AM

Boris will probably crash us out the EU and Brexit party will be history. The backlash will not be pretty, I hope we leave with a deal but I fear the worst.

Boris may not be able to legally crash us out - not without the support of parliament. The EU would have to kick us out, but as long as they get £££ out of us, they wont.
While Boris has more conviction than May I don't think he is any more competent TBH.

STEED

07-13-19, 03:31 AM

Boris may not be able to legally crash us out - not without the support of parliament. The EU would have to kick us out, but as long as they get £££ out of us, they wont.
While Boris has more conviction than May I don't think he is any more competent TBH.

Problem is he is not going to do a MayBot and come Oct 31st he knows if he stays in his career is over.

STEED

07-13-19, 04:35 AM

ANALYSIS
If Greg Clark is right about Brexit, the Tories could face electoral oblivion
In what could be his final interview as business secretary, Greg Clark didn't pull punches about the damage of a no-deal Brexit.

By Beth Rigby, political editor

https://news.sky.com/story/if-greg-clark-is-right-about-brexit-the-tories-could-face-electoral-oblivion-11761422

:hmmm:

Jimbuna

07-13-19, 05:58 AM

While Boris has more conviction than May I don't think he is any more competent TBH.

She may (no pun intended) have been stubborn and naive but I can't knock her honesty.

Theresa May has admitted she underestimated the "entrenched positions" in Parliament over Brexit.

Ahead of her departure from Number 10 in less than two weeks, Mrs May said she would have feelings of disappointment about her tenure as PM.

She conceded that she could have talked to more colleagues to get her withdrawal deal through the Commons, and said if the future relationship had been negotiated alongside there would not have been the same issue with the Irish backstop.
https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/theresa-may-i-underestimated-mps-entrenched-positions-on-brexit-a4189011.html

Jimbuna

07-13-19, 06:11 AM

I'll readily admit I'm a fan of the This Week programme that is about to stop airing and believe Andrew Neil to be a competent interviewer. So here are the interviews facts and claims by both Johnson and Hunt being set out and checked.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48965645

JU_88

07-14-19, 03:54 AM

This is a good site too Jim:
https://fullfact.org/

STEED

07-14-19, 04:49 AM

Two former Labour officials who criticised the party's handling of cases of alleged antisemitism are planning to take legal action against the party.

https://news.sky.com/story/whistleblowers-to-take-legal-action-against-labour-party-11762711

Take that you ragging Anti-Semite and you ragging Anti-Semites.

https://fullfact.org/

Yea I some times dip in there, don't like opening what I want to read in a new tab, I want double click.

Some other good sites I dip into.
https://www.politicshome.com
https://www.politics.co.uk
https://www.theyworkforyou.com
https://www.parliament.uk

Jimbuna

07-14-19, 05:16 AM

This is a good site too Jim:
https://fullfact.org/

Been a few times recently and yes, not bad at all.

Skybird

07-14-19, 05:19 AM

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-48978739

Mr Davis, who quit as Brexit secretary last year, told the BBC that the Treasury wanted to avoid talking about the prospect of leaving without a deal.
He concluded that many in Whitehall did not believe it would ever happen - despite two years of planning.
"I've got to be able to say to you 'if this doesn't work we'll leave anyway' and you've got to believe it.
"And for you to believe it I've got to believe it. And I don't think Whitehall really ever believed that they would actually carry out the plans we laid so carefully over two years."

Wowh, that frankly it got rarely put by somebody that there never was the intention to carry out the Brexit referendum's demand anyway. Well, I did, form beginning on, but I do not count. :oops:

But despite spending £4.2bn on Brexit preparations (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-46611652), Mr Hammond warned that the government has limited influence on how a no-deal scenario might look.
Asked if the UK can control Brexit, he said: "We can't because many of the levers are held by others - the EU 27 or private business. We can seek to persuade them but we can't control it."

Stay with us, we will enjoy your band music on deck while our ship is going down.

Jimbuna

07-14-19, 05:33 AM

She's at it again.

Anti-Brexit campaigner Gina Miller says she will take the government to court if the next PM tries to shut down Parliament to push through no deal.

Ms Miller, who won a legal battle against ministers over Article 50, said the step would be "an abuse" of powers.

She told Sky News she wanted to "defend Parliamentary sovereignty", not stop Brexit.

Brexiteer MP Priti Patel said it was "not acceptable" to use the courts to try to tie the hands of MPs.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48980408

Skybird

07-14-19, 05:42 AM

Needless sabre rattling - Johnson as PM has no intention to leave without deal, I assure you this. Like May he plans to weasel around and turn things such that Britain will stay tied to the EU - the difference is that May wanted that from beginning on, while Johnson maybe not, but starts to play "May-hem" - pardon the pun - only when he does not get renegotiations with the EU. Which he will not get.

Brexit is as good as over a project. They all play just a theatre stage play. They all cheat and lie. ;) May, Johnson, Corbyn, and the many others - them all.

Jimbuna

07-14-19, 05:48 AM

Skybird

07-15-19, 02:18 AM

^ However. Yesterday I saw some interesting documentation, 10 minutes or so, about the background of this extreme Brexit wing in the Tories party, and the strong business and economic ties these people have with the US. I did not know that these connections were this extreme, I only knew that this group exists. The narration went like this: that the US and Trump and their associates in Britain want the Brexit not despite but right because of the chaos it now would bring: the bigger chaos, the better, because chaos and economic turmoil always also means chance and opportunity for prepared, ahead-planning entrepreneurs with deep money pockets who want to take the chance to bite out big heaps of the British economy and finances and see a chance for big US business to especially get control over parts of the British economy and public services by privatization. Following this narration I would conclude that the US and Trump probably are the biggest enemy of Britain. Narration further included the tale that Johnson maybe knows what he is heading for - and even if he would want to change it and bail out, he no longer can, being driven by names in the background and forces that he has no control over, that abuse him and will spit him out once they chewd enough on him and Brexit chaos has been delivered.

The disobedient children of the revolution return back home to England to take it over. Say hello. Mind you, this strategy woudl exactly follow Trump's predatory scheme: destroy international treaties, get bilateral nation-to-nation deals on an individual basis as a replacement, and in this arrangement mercilessly push the other against the wall. Special relation thing? Pfffft, only you imperial Brits still believe in this nostalghic echo from history. :O:

Jimbuna

07-15-19, 04:50 AM

^ And all the above can be summed up in one word....'Politics' :yep:

STEED

07-15-19, 07:16 AM

She's at it again.

Ms Miller was deeply upset about the abuse she got from morons last time and she is asking for these morons to step up their abuse of her. I don't like the way she thinks but I for one would not give her grief.

Jimbuna

07-15-19, 11:30 AM

Tonight brings the final episode of the Tory political circus.

I can hardly wait https://i.imgur.com/0nmqnue.gif

Boris Johnson and Jeremy Hunt are preparing for the second and final head-to-head debate of the Conservative leadership campaign.

They will face 90 minutes of questions from Sun newspaper readers.

The event, starting at 19.00 BST, will be streamed live on the newspaper's website and broadcast on Talk Radio.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48988420

Jimbuna

07-16-19, 05:23 AM

'Parliamentary bible' Erskine May available online for free.

Anyone sad enough to be interested https://erskinemay.parliament.uk/

STEED

07-16-19, 07:46 AM

^Hey its free jim like a free beer...oh wait a free beer is better. :)

Yes both the low profile and super high profile Lib/Con race to become leaders is almost over. Shame the only one that really should count the downfall of you know who, come on moderate Labour get that thing and its followers out of Labour.

Jimbuna

07-16-19, 08:53 AM

Tory leadership contender Jeremy Hunt has refused to guarantee that the UK will leave the EU before Christmas, but said he "expects" it to happen by then.

He would not say when Brexit would take place if he became PM, telling the BBC: "I'm being honest with people".

Rival Boris Johnson said the UK would leave by 31 October "come what may".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48963421

Why can't they both just show a bit of realistic paragmatism and honesty and say they've no idea how to achieve this Brexit at all because Parliament will not allow it?

Jimbuna

07-16-19, 09:03 AM

Brexit Talks Get More Hostile as EU Considers Sweeteners to Deal
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/brexit/brexit-talks-get-more-hostile-as-eu-considers-sweeteners-to-deal/ar-AAEoBVf?li=BBoPWjQ&ocid=mailsignout

Are the EU going to 'blink' first?

I don't think so.

Jimbuna

07-16-19, 12:31 PM

Nigel Farage causes chaos by slamming von der Leyen’s ‘communist’ vision.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z75l0hhuw-4

I'm still not convinced he is correct in asserting the belief that Brexit will go ahead.

Catfish

07-16-19, 02:55 PM

hehe, what a ridiculous show. So Farage 'you' are humiliated? I hope to see this more often, and soon :haha:
You're toast!

STEED

07-17-19, 05:58 AM

LONDON (Reuters) - More than 60 opposition Labour members of Britain’s upper house of parliament signed a statement in a newspaper on Wednesday accusing leader Jeremy Corbyn of failing “the test of leadership” over anti-Semitism in the party.

https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-politics-labour/more-than-60-british-lords-criticise-corbyn-over-anti-semitism-idUKKCN1UC0UI As if that thing cares about that, the time has come for moderate Labour to get rid of that thing and the gang.

Jimbuna

07-17-19, 06:04 AM

hehe, what a ridiculous show. So Farage 'you' are humiliated? I hope to see this more often, and soon :haha:
You're toast!

I thought you'd approve :)

STEED

07-17-19, 06:11 AM

WOOHOO May has woken up and hammered that anti-Semite at PMQ's. That thing did not like it.

I picked up from JU 88 comment some pages back and here it is..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-xg7JwbJfWA

Are they planning another crack at Russia? :hmmm: :03: :haha:

Jimbuna

07-17-19, 06:24 AM

That's an old video.

STEED

07-17-19, 06:38 AM

That's an old video.

Still has meaning. :03:

Jimbuna

07-17-19, 06:38 AM

It certainly has for Nigel.

STEED

07-17-19, 06:48 AM

It certainly has for Nigel.

I wonder how he will feel if we are still in the EU on Oct 31st. :hmmm:

I for one given up on all hope of leaving in a proper meaningful way.

Jimbuna

07-17-19, 09:10 AM

You're not alone.

Jimbuna

07-18-19, 06:23 AM

10 things that stopped Brexit happening.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-49008826

STEED

07-18-19, 07:58 AM

The government and in coming Boris have lost a vote by 41 votes. Benn-Burt amendment: If parliament suspended, it must be recalled for five days of debate on N.Irland.

YES 315
NO 274
MAJORITY 41

Jim can put up the link I'm on my tablet and its a bit of a pain in the arse for me to do it.

Jimbuna

07-18-19, 08:45 AM

STEED

07-18-19, 10:28 AM

:up:

I see Boris has made a right bllinking gaff over the kippers, and he is the front runner to be our next PM...Oh heck we are doomed.

Jimbuna

07-19-19, 04:50 AM

Two million public sector workers are reportedly set to get a £2bn pay rise.

The Treasury will unveil the biggest public sector pay rise in six years as one of Theresa May's final acts as prime minister, the Times reported.

Soldiers are set to get a 2.9% rise while teachers and other school staff will get 2.75%, police officers, dentists and consultants 2.5% and senior civil servants 2%.

It is thought the money will come from existing budgets.

The Treasury is expected to confirm the increases in an announcement on Monday.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-49041295

Mays farewell gift.

JU_88

07-19-19, 07:46 AM

Well - it at least that makes me feel a tiny bit better about the lump sum I just had to pay HMRC two days ago.
Every time I pay them I cant seem to shake visions of champagne and luxury duck houses from my mind. :hmmm:

Jimbuna

07-19-19, 07:51 AM

^ Aye, I'll never get over the resentment I harboured for the times I was a higher rate tax payer and today the only freebie I get is prescriptions and that is on the grounds of my age.

JU_88

07-19-19, 08:02 AM

Could be worse, Labour could get in and charge me a white male tax or something'. :O: That should be a stupid 'edgy' joke, but sadly, certain members of that party would absolutely applaud such a proposal. :oops:
I'll be bigging up my Asian heritage if that ever happens :D Or just move to get away from the subsequent race riots /2nd Nazi uprising etc

Jimbuna

07-19-19, 08:11 AM

The next general election will probably be the most entertaining one in my living memory. As matters stand now I can see both the major parties being decimated and the battle for who ends up with overall control may well depend on either the Lib Dems or Brexit party.

Of course, the above is subject to potential change as matters unfold.

Jimbuna

07-20-19, 09:34 AM

Labour's shadow justice minister Gloria De Piero has quit its front bench and decided not to stand at the next general election, saying she is worried about the party's "lack of tolerance".

Ms De Piero, who is the MP for Ashfield in Nottinghamshire, said she had received "grim" online abuse.

She campaigned for Remain in a strongly pro-Brexit seat but does not support a second referendum.

The shadow chancellor John McDonnell said her decision was "disappointing".

Speaking to members on Friday, Ms De Piero said a "lack of tolerance for different viewpoints in the Labour Party frankly worries me".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-nottinghamshire-49056313

That worries me too but surely Steptoe must know the answer.

Jimbuna

07-21-19, 05:31 AM

Philip Hammond has said he intends to resign as chancellor if Boris Johnson becomes the UK's next prime minister.

Mr Hammond said a no-deal Brexit, something Mr Johnson has left open as an option, was "not something I could ever sign up to".

Asked if he thought he would be sacked next week, he said he would resign on Wednesday to Theresa May.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-49062514

Clearly a man of principle.

Skybird

07-21-19, 07:38 AM

Men of principles do not work under Johnson - or May.

Its more reminding me of abandoning the ship one helped sinking.

Jimbuna

07-21-19, 07:50 AM

I think my sarcasm eluded you :03:

Skybird

07-21-19, 07:58 AM

Looking at the world and politicians, I maybe have lost my sense of humour.

Jimbuna

07-21-19, 08:20 AM

Good to see someone spelling the word 'humour' correctly around these parts :)

STEED

07-21-19, 11:29 AM

Stand by for King Boris the 1st and his mighty cabinet whom will give us Brexit. One usless b'stard out and a bigger useless b'stard in, so no change for the better.

Jimbuna

07-22-19, 04:21 AM

But ahead of the polls closing at 17:00 BST, Sir Alan Duncan quit as a Foreign Office minister in protest against a possible Boris Johnson victory.

Chancellor Philip Hammond told the BBC on Sunday he intends to resign as chancellor if Mr Johnson becomes prime minister.

Justice Secretary David Gauke also reiterated in the Sunday Times that he would also resign this week for the same reason.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-49065490

The list grows longer and longer. Up to half the current Cabinet it is thought will resign as soon as the clown takes up residence at No10 on Wednesday.
(Not sure if he will actually move in until after Friday.

STEED

07-22-19, 05:15 AM

^Just saving Boris the job sacking them all. But ahead of King Boris the 1st we have the results of the LibDems today or tomorrow. OK, not big news like King Boris getting his crown.

Jimbuna

07-22-19, 05:20 AM

Pales into insignificance.

Skybird

07-22-19, 06:08 AM

LINK (https://www.amazon.co.uk/Popping-Corn-Popcorn-25kg-Postage/dp/B07QP87YMM/ref=sr_1_1?keywords=popcorn+25+kg&qid=1563793580&s=gateway&sr=8-1)

Skybird

07-22-19, 07:58 AM

10 points explaining the mess that it is.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-49008826

Personally I think the British membership in the EU always has been a big misunderstanding, and the self-understanding of the EU as this ominous European project going beyond a free market always was a megalomaniac erring of the masses, and a selfish hobby of the self-proclaimed elites trying to provide themselves bigger, shinier, higher thrones.

Jimbuna

07-22-19, 09:20 AM

Jo Swinson or Sir Ed Davey will be named as the next leader of the Liberal Democrats later, replacing incumbent Sir Vince Cable.

The result of the pro-EU party's leadership contest is expected at around 16:00 BST on Monday.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-49068552

One can hardly contain the excitement https://i.imgur.com/59wl8Kl.gif

Jimbuna

07-22-19, 10:29 AM

Jo Swinson wins Lib Dem leadership contest https://i.imgur.com/E8Uz3ah.gif

MGR1

07-22-19, 11:49 AM

Scottish MP representing a Scottish constituency as leader of a UK wide party?

West Lothian Question anyone?

Mike.

Jimbuna

07-22-19, 02:15 PM

I sometimes ask that question of myself and well remember Tam Dalyell.

STEED

07-22-19, 04:48 PM

Jo Swinson wins Lib Dem leadership contest https://i.imgur.com/E8Uz3ah.gif
Another one promising the world and will deliver nothing.

MGR1

07-22-19, 05:43 PM

I sometimes ask that question of myself and well remember Tam Dalyell.

Very true - he did believe that once devolution was enacted it was highly likely Scotland would eventually become independent.

The only possible way around the problem would be devolution and a separate Parliament for England, but so far the people of England don't appear to want the extra layer of politicians that and a fully federal UK would entail. The latter is something the Lib Dems support, BTW.:hmmm:

I am going to be slightly pithy and write that Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland have that additional set of politicos (we voted for them), so why shouldn't England? If English people don't want non-English MP's voting on English only matters then there are only two real alternatives - that extra layer of politicians, or start voting for the English Democrats and independence from the UK.

There is a third - scrap devolution and go back to the status quo ante 1997, but how badly do people want to send troops onto the streets of Northern Ireland (again) and the Clyde Valley (the most likely trouble spot in Scotland)?

Mike.

Jimbuna

07-23-19, 03:54 AM

Theresa May pushes ahead with milkshakes tax plan as one of her last acts as Prime Minister even though her likely successor Boris Johnson has vowed to scrap it.
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/theresa-may-pushes-ahead-with-milkshakes-tax-plan-as-one-of-her-last-acts-as-prime-minister-even-though-her-likely-successor-boris-johnson-has-vowed-to-scrap-it/ar-AAEJ4N1?li=BBoPWjQ&ocid=mailsignout

You simply couldn't make this up :o

Politicians, those that keep on giving :haha:

Jimbuna

07-23-19, 04:09 AM

New UK prime minister: Johnson and Hunt await Conservative leadership vote.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-49078864

We will know in a little under two hours https://i.imgur.com/j8kUVjq.gif

Skybird

07-23-19, 06:23 AM

Happy condolences. He is the best since there is nobody worse.

:o [minute of silence to let this sink in]

ikalugin

07-23-19, 06:27 AM

Happy condolences. He is the best since there is nobody worse.

:o [minute of silence to let this sink in]
I am not sure if you worded this right :D

Immagine Farrage or Corbyn being the PM. The sweet sweet tears.

Jimbuna

07-23-19, 06:45 AM

Happy condolences. He is the best since there is nobody worse.

:o [minute of silence to let this sink in]

At 11am GMT I took the dog to his bi-monthly grooming parlour and after dropping him off I went to a bookmakers a few shops away and asked what the odds were on Hunt and Johnson to be told Hunt was 5/6 and no more bets would be taken on Johnson.

The bookmaker is seldom wrong.

MGR1

07-23-19, 06:54 AM

Boris as PM? This will be interesting.....:88)

Could Prime Minister Boris Johnson break up the UK? (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-49083746)

Will Brexit break Britain, and would England care? (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-49053233)

The latter highlights the dichotomy of the Unionist position in both Northern Ireland and Scotland - they support something which an increasing number of English people don't.

Though it could be argued that Unionism is inherently undemocratic as it's based on the idea that preserving the Union is more important than the democratic will of the people(s) of the UK.:hmmm:

Mike.

Jimbuna

07-23-19, 07:09 AM

Skybird

07-23-19, 07:22 AM

I am not sure if you worded this right :D

Trust me, I did! :)

STEED

07-23-19, 07:30 AM

MGR1

07-23-19, 07:42 AM

I don't envisage any serious threat to the Union atm but come post Brexit (should it happen at all) then people will make their own judgement depending on what the consequences are for each part of the Union.

Generally I agree, but if an IndyRef2 ever did came about I have a suspicion it'll be a repeat of 2014:

Yes - Sovereignty and the ability to make own decisions.

No - It's the economy, stupid.

The latter point will probably be the decider. All those polls that show a majority for yes in the event of a no-deal Brexit don't take into account the debate that would occur during any referendum campaign. That is where the No side will have the advantage. For example, depending on the size of the UK National Debt a hypothetical Scottish share would probably be prohibitively large to be economically sensible.

Therefore I suspect that, unless something extraordinary happens, we Scot's will vote with our wallets again and not our hearts.:hmmm:

We just have to face reality - we're easily bought.

Mike.

Jimbuna

07-23-19, 07:48 AM

The Conservatives memberships gives you your new Prime MinisterKing....

KING BOJO BUFFOON BORIS THE FIRST.

Meanwhile in the Labour Leadership Bunker they are rubbing their hands with glee hearing the news expert's and bookies now think there will be a general election before the end of the year.

There is nothing legally that can be done to stop Boris achieving Brexit.

The only route left for Tory remainers would be to withdraw themselves from the whip and support a vote of no confidence in the government thereby bringing about a general election which in turn will put every parliamentary seat at risk.

Whether or not the remainers are willing to risk all is open to individual opinion but somehow I personally doubt that will happen.

Jimbuna

07-23-19, 07:49 AM

We just have to face reality - we're easily bought.

Aren't we all?

Bilge_Rat

07-23-19, 08:10 AM

Having Johnson as PM makes everything clearer. Either he will push Brexit through or there will be a 2nd referendum.

In or out, a decision has to be made.

MGR1

07-23-19, 08:10 AM

Aren't we all?

True, money rules.:hmmm:

Mike.

Skybird

07-23-19, 08:53 AM

Johnson implied he knows how to walk over water.

It would be better for him he skips that plan and instead knows where the stepstones lie. Else his first 100 days could very well be his last. As a German commentator wrote today: from tomorrow on he will start to break promises. Well, very likely he will, since he cannot please the Brexit hardliners and the EU-friends in his party at the same time. Not to mention the public's diverse opinion camps.

ikalugin

07-23-19, 09:01 AM

I think that no-deal leave would be the best option for UK now.

Jimbuna

07-23-19, 09:04 AM

Skybird

07-23-19, 09:16 AM

If he doesn't deliver Brexit on 31st October I suspect his tenure in Downing St. will be short lived.
The stubbornly impertinent question here is whether or not a Brexit based on the EU deal "as is" and including the Backstop, qualifies for the description of a Brexit or not. ;)

Johnson promised some people the left, while he promsied others the right, and he promsied some the forward while he promsied others the backwards, only to get all their support. He now must either sit still where he is and would thus break ALL promises he made, or he must break some promises the moment he makes his first step at whatever direction.

STEED

07-23-19, 11:13 AM

Boris will loose his rag with Parliament and the EU and plunge this country is to a nightmare scenario.

It will be a blood bath in Parliament when they come back from their summer break.

mapuc

07-23-19, 11:28 AM

May your new Ruler spread wisdom and happiness among you his minions

And

May your Ruler be proud of you

Markus

STEED

07-23-19, 11:31 AM

May your new Ruler spread wisdom and happiness among you his minions

And

May your Ruler be proud of you

MarkusFat chance, better start stocking up on baked beans. :03:

Here is one person who will be eating his own words from Sept 12th 2018.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/sep/12/boris-johnson-never-prime-minister

Catfish

07-23-19, 12:09 PM

Clown time!

ikalugin

07-23-19, 01:18 PM

Well after Boris you can expect Vladimir.

Jimbuna

07-23-19, 01:19 PM

Vladimir who?

Jimbuna

07-23-19, 01:22 PM

Clown time!

Precisely :yep:

https://i.imgur.com/wMEJgNf.jpg

STEED

07-23-19, 01:43 PM

Get it right jim.

Precisely :yep:

https://i.imgur.com/wMEJgNf.jpg

HERE WE GO, HERE WE GO, HEREEEE WE GO.

Sorted. :03:

Jimbuna

07-23-19, 01:46 PM

You might wanna be careful, he knows your Bishop as far as I'm aware.

STEED

07-23-19, 01:49 PM

You might wanna be careful, he knows your Bishop as far as I'm aware.
:hmmm: if true he will not get a christmas card from boris. I believe he is pro EU. :03:

Jimbuna

07-23-19, 01:51 PM

The Lord moves in mysterious ways.

Catfish

07-23-19, 03:29 PM

[…] Johnson promised some people the left, while he promsied others the right, and he promsied some the forward while he promsied others the backwards, only to get all their support. […]

This does not matter much, since he's changing his attitude and opinion daily by a 180 degrees.
So he will take every challenge, one at a day.

Seriously, i wonder what has happened to the political landscape recently.. but i must say i still prefer idiots with good intentions though :D

Onkel Neal

07-23-19, 04:54 PM

Congrats on your American Prime Minister :arrgh!:

STEED

07-23-19, 05:33 PM

Congrats on your American Prime Minister :arrgh!:Trump v.2.0 :haha:

From here on in it will be all sound bites.

Onkel Neal

07-23-19, 06:08 PM

We don't deserve any better :har:

mapuc

07-23-19, 06:27 PM

Subnuts

07-23-19, 07:14 PM

Isn't about time we shot all of the reality TV stars who aren't in positions of power yet into the Sun? :hmmm:

kraznyi_oktjabr

07-24-19, 01:10 AM

There's something I really don't understand.

Your new PM have said Great Britain will leave EU on oct 31 deal or no deal.

And here is what I don't understand.

Your Parliament have some weeks or month ago voted for some rule saying Great Britain can't leave EU without a deal.

So how can he say "we will leave EU even without a deal" when the Parliament have said no ?

MarkusThe law of the land says, that the exit day is 31st of October - as agreed with the EU. As far as I know, that has not changed. The Parliament can say "no" to no-deal Brexit, but unless they ratify the Withdrawal Agreement, its all sound bites without any concrete meaning.

Only thing PM Johnson has to do to get no-deal Brexit, is to do nothing. The no-deal Brexit is the standard option unless something else is agreed on. In theory he could negotiate new agreement with the EU, but first he would have to persuade them back to the negotiation table.

At the moment the Parliament says "no" to all alternatives and - atleast to me - it appears they are either unable or unwilling to define what kind of agreement they could accept. How could PM Johnson and the EU renegotiate the agreement, if they do not konw what kind of agreement is acceptable?

In my opinion, unless there is major political change in the UK, there is no point in wasting time with new round of negotiations. I also believe that extension to the Brexit date should be granted only, if its purpose is to give time to implement no-deal option.

em2nought

07-24-19, 01:53 AM

Only thing PM Johnson has to do to get no-deal Brexit, is to do nothing. The no-deal Brexit is the standard option unless something else is agreed on.

I think we could do some lend lease for the UK on soybeans. Has to be better than those beans you serve for breakfast over there. :D

Catfish

07-24-19, 02:13 AM

I think we could do some lend lease for the UK on soybeans. Has to be better than those beans you serve for breakfast over there. :D

Hehe the EU has been forced by Trump to buy US soy bean overproduction already, so the UK may already have its "fair" share.
Then i heard about soybean flooding but it seems i misunderstood :03::
https://www.iasoybeans.com/news/articles/farmers-still-have-more-questions-than-answers-when-it-comes-to-missouri-river-flooding/
And Trump once more turns his back to his voters.

STEED

07-24-19, 04:45 AM

There's something I really don't understand.

Your new PM have said Great Britain will leave EU on oct 31 deal or no deal.

And here is what I don't understand.

Your Parliament have some weeks or month ago voted for some rule saying Great Britain can't leave EU without a deal.

So how can he say "we will leave EU even without a deal" when the Parliament have said no ?

MarkusSimple he lied. :03:

Its's hard to tell at the moment as Parliament breaks up for its summer holiday so the big fight will not take place until their return. Both sides will draw up their battle plans, Labour is already planning a vote of no confidence in the new government under Boris. Plus his joint majority with the DUP is only two and if three tories go independent or join the Liberals he is stuffed.

So at the moment all eyes are on his cabinet and if SKY News is correct about being two thirds leave and one third remain in the words of Nigel Farage leader of the Brexit party that is not going to work for boris and there will be a general election before the end of the year.

STEED

07-24-19, 04:57 AM

It's MayBot's last PMQ'S today will she go out with a bang, will it hammer her. Or will the whole thing be gush so roll up for the last one before their holidays and get set for.....:03:

Jimbuna

07-24-19, 05:01 AM

Congrats on your American Prime Minister :arrgh!:

Rather frightening isn't it! :o

Skybird

07-24-19, 05:03 AM

The law of the land says, that the exit day is 31st of October - as agreed with the EU. As far as I know, that has not changed. The Parliament can say "no" to no-deal Brexit, but unless they ratify the Withdrawal Agreement, its all sound bites without any concrete meaning.

Only thing PM Johnson has to do to get no-deal Brexit, is to do nothing. The no-deal Brexit is the standard option unless something else is agreed on. In theory he could negotiate new agreement with the EU, but first he would have to persuade them back to the negotiation table.

At the moment the Parliament says "no" to all alternatives and - atleast to me - it appears they are either unable or unwilling to define what kind of agreement they could accept. How could PM Johnson and the EU renegotiate the agreement, if they do not konw what kind of agreement is acceptable?

In my opinion, unless there is major political change in the UK, there is no point in wasting time with new round of negotiations. I also believe that extension to the Brexit date should be granted only, if its purpose is to give time to implement no-deal option.

I agree the EU will not renegotiate. It got everything what it wanted and it got the UK in an extremely weakened position, the EU will not let go this wonderful outcome. Cream on top is that it cna always point fingers at the UK, demanding the UK to move and to change and to alter its stance. All burden to adapt to the arranegment by May is on the UK, none on the EU. Perfect outcome!

I get the impression that a clear majority of parliament agrees on at least one thing: to not have no-deal.

So they could prevent no-deal exit by getting rid of Johnson and have reelections and install somebody willing to accept the deal there-is, the all-sales-deal by May, that is. Question is whether time is sufficient, I do not know what the British non-existent constitution:) says about timetables for announcing elections after Johnson got put down by a non-confidence vote. However, the EU already has signalled that while it will not let go of the deal it has, it is very well prepared to give the UK more time to prepare a ratification of this May-deal by British parliament. They will call it by different names, of course, and hide it from the public, but the EU would welcome the UK to install a deal-friendly government - or one that abandons Brexit alltogether. Even letting things in a non-decided state like it is now is better than to let the UK off the hook, from a perspective of European powerplay. And after all, the EU also is not shy to break its own laws, rules and treaties if it sees it could opportunistically benefit from that. The historic record of having done so in the past, already is discouragingly long by now. The EU will play foul if it can and sees benefit from that. Its institutions and offices will find the needed excuses and defences for that.

Or do I understand it all wrong?

This thing still is long from being over.

Johnson himself has no political ideals and is a pure opportunist, beside his charms he is said to have no further skills and competences, he will not mind kicking the country into an even deeper hole than was already done, if that serves his interests. So, he will do what serves his powerpolticla ambitions best.

And the Tories? They have voted Johnmosn into IM office and illiustrated that populism and winning the next elections is more important for them than the higher interest of their country.

No player in all this mess is any better than any of the others. Nobody. I include the vast majoirty of ordinary people and the electorate in this judgement. Why they have not stormed the house and burnt it down already, is beyond me. But I ask the same about Germany, America, France or any other country, too, so there is no real surprise.

Seen this way, everybody seems to get what he deserves, no matter how it goes and ends.

Jimbuna

07-24-19, 05:05 AM

Jimbuna

07-24-19, 05:07 AM

I agree the EU will not renegotiate. It got everything what it wanted and it got the UK in an extremely weakened position, the EU will not let go this wonderful outcome. Cream on top is that it cna always point fingers at the UK, demanding the UK to move and to change and to alter its stance. All burden to adapt to the arranegment by May is on the UK, none on the EU. Perfect outcome!

I get the impression that a clear majority of parliament agrees on at least one thing: to not have no-deal.

So they could prevent no-deal exit by getting rid of Johnson and have reelections and install somebody willing to accept the deal there-is, the all-sales-deal my May, that is. Question is whether time is sufficient, I do not know what the British non-existent constituiton:) says aboiut timetables for announcing elecitons after Johnson got put down by a non-confidence vote. However, the EU already has signalled that while it will not let go of the deal it has, it is very well prepared to give the UK more time to prepare a ratification by parliament. They will use diferent wordings, of course, and hide it from the oublic, but the EU would welcome the UK to install a deal-friendly government - or one that abandons Brexit alltogether. And after all the eU also is not shy to break its own laws, rules and treaties if it sees it could opportunisztically benefit form that. The historic record of having done so in the past, already is discouragingly long by now.
Or do I understand it all wrong?

This thing still is long from being over.

It is still possible that Boris could turn out to be the shortest time serving PM in living memory.