Wuhan virus 2020

[3catcircus]

You're welcome, since you obviously was unaware. :ping:

One week ago isn't exactly the same as even a year ago. 38 years between virus and vaccine is still a very long time, in comparison to less than a year for covid. The HIV vax won't be brought to market for another 5 years, minimum.

[Arlo]

One week ago isn't exactly the same as even a year ago.

Nor is it "Still not have." Ten seconds of Google could have spared you egg. :up:

[Buddahaid]

One week ago isn't exactly the same as even a year ago. 38 years between virus and vaccine is still a very long time, in comparison to less than a year for covid. The HIV vax won't be brought to market for another 5 years, minimum.

Hmmm, 38 years. I wonder just how much techknowledgy has changed in those years. Let's see...

https://www.businessinsider.com/this-is-what-tech-was-like-in-1984-2014-8

[Buddahaid]

https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/8895/bVIipy.jpg

Trying to delete but it's still here.

[Skybird]

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-58347434


The research team looked at records from more than 29 million people who received a first dose of a Covid vaccine between December and April, as well as nearly 1.8 million who were infected with the virus.

The study, published in the British Medical Journal, looked for complications up to 28 days after being jabbed or infected.

It found that for every 10 million people vaccinated with the AstraZeneca vaccine:

an extra 107 would be hospitalised or die from thrombocytopenia, which can cause internal bleeding and haemorrhages, but that was nearly nine times lower than the risk of the same condition following an infection:

an extra 66 would be hospitalised or die from blood clots in the veins, but that was nearly 200 times lower than the risk following an infection.

For every 10 million people vaccinated with the Pfizer vaccine, it found:

143 extra strokes would be seen, but that was nearly 12 times lower than the risk following an infection

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/90T17wSB/120308206-uk-card-with-vax-2doses-27aug-nc.png (https://postimg.cc/4HfzCyXK)

[Jimbuna]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OuPRe0fAhkY

[Skybird]

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/laninf/article/PIIS1473-3099(21)00475-8/fulltext



A new study again confirms that Delta increases the risk of hospitalization by at least factor 2 over Alpha strains. Especially unvaccinated people should listen, they enjoy the adventure of raised stakes this autumn and winter. If you win in the lottery, you have much higher chances to win the jackpot for sure.



All the vaccinated loosers have just to foot the fews' bill. Thank you - but not thanks.

[Arlo]

https://www.facebook.com/newshour/videos/357908622708446

[Jimbuna]

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/laninf/article/PIIS1473-3099(21)00475-8/fulltext



A new study again confirms that Delta increases the risk of hospitalization by at least factor 2 over Alpha strains. Especially unvaccinated people should listen, they enjoy the adventure of raised stakes this autumn and winter. If you win in the lottery, you have much higher chances to win the jackpot for sure.



All the vaccinated loosers have just to foot the fews' bill. Thank you - but not thanks.

I'll make do with what I have :yep:

[Rockstar]

https://youtu.be/oMA7o8olHzY

[mapuc]

^This could have been posted in this thread

https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=250367

Markus

[Buddahaid]

So now it looks like Louisianna's going to be slammed again with hurricane Ida tomorrow evening with considerable storm surge. I hope the the hospitals can stay open and I don't envy anyone needing to be confined in storm shelters given the vaccine levels and mask ignorance of the area.

[Skybird]

Ah, don't be a mimosa because of some possibly unsunny weather, there's nothing better than to have a spill of some refreshing rain water from mother nature in your face to flush all that virus away and feel reborn. :up:

[August]

So now it looks like Louisianna's going to be slammed again with hurricane Ida tomorrow evening with considerable storm surge. I hope the the hospitals can stay open and I don't envy anyone needing to be confined in storm shelters given the vaccine levels and mask ignorance of the area.


They have real problems to worry about, no time for made up ones.

[Arlo]

They have real problems to worry about, no time for made up ones.

Hurricanes are real and so is Covid. Reality extends beyond a personal bubble. :03:

[Buddahaid]

They have real problems to worry about, no time for made up ones.

I don't see that as a made up problem, I see it as a real threat that needs to be considered, and planned for, as it's in the range of possible outcomes, possible problems.

[Arlo]

I don't see that as a made up problem, I see it as a real threat that needs to be considered, and planned for, as it's in the range of possible outcomes, possible problems.

Foresight vs. hindsight. Some don't even have a firm grasp on the latter. :ping:

[August]

I don't see that as a made up problem, I see it as a real threat that needs to be considered, and planned for, as it's in the range of possible outcomes, possible problems.


Yeah sure, keep your useless mask right next to your escape kit if it will make you feel better but I'd think being drowned or killed by flying debris would trump any such minor worries.

Besides I thought you guys didn't care if the unvaccinated got sick. I believe the general consensus here was that since they are considered to be all Trump supporters then they deserve to die, isn't that right?

[Buddahaid]

Well you got that wrong. I don't want anyone to die from getting Covid and at the same time I think anti-vaccers and anti-maskers are just too lazy, or stubborn, to do do the easy things to help get past the worst of it. No, I can't provide a guarantee that would be the case, but I can say more people will die otherwise as that is proven already.

I don't find obstinence in the face of a pandemic as patriotic in the least sense, rather, I find it the worst form of selfish indulgence.

[August]

I don't find obstinence in the face of a pandemic as patriotic in the least sense, rather, I find it the worst form of selfish indulgence.


Pretending that taking a vaccine is some kind of patriotic altruism is crap. We took those covid shots to protect ourselves, not anyone else. That is just as selfishly indulgent as refusing to take it.

[Buddahaid]

Pretending that taking a vaccine is some kind of patriotic altruism is crap. We took those covid shots to protect ourselves, not anyone else. That is just as selfishly indulgent as refusing to take it.

I see your point of view but I can't agree with it. I suppose we'll just have to respect our opposing views.

[MaDef]

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/laninf/article/PIIS1473-3099(21)00475-8/fulltext



A new study again confirms that Delta increases the risk of hospitalization by at least factor 2 over Alpha strains. Especially unvaccinated people should listen, they enjoy the adventure of raised stakes this autumn and winter. If you win in the lottery, you have much higher chances to win the jackpot for sure.



All the vaccinated loosers have just to foot the fews' bill. Thank you - but not thanks.

Mortality rate remains >2%.

[Arlo]

Disclaimer warning: Lots of big words.

https://asm.org/Articles/2021/July/How-Dangerous-is-the-Delta-Variant-B-1-617-2

[Rockstar]

https://youtu.be/pG164aOoLhA

[Jimbuna]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OuPRe0fAhkY&t=1s

[Jimbuna]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FhZuziTJxIg

[3catcircus]

Yeah sure, keep your useless mask right next to your escape kit if it will make you feel better but I'd think being drowned or killed by flying debris would trump any such minor worries.

Besides I thought you guys didn't care if the unvaccinated got sick. I believe the general consensus here was that since they are considered to be all Trump supporters then they deserve to die, isn't that right?

On masks... We knew *before* COVID that outside of a clinical setting using N95s, when used by those trained in their use, that masks are pretty much useless against airborne respiratory viruses. The University of Waterloo study that came out recently proves that, yes, COVID behaves like every other airborne respiratory virus when it comes to non-N95 masks used by the general public.

BTW, here's a scanning electron microscope picture of a cotton cloth mask, magnified 40x. Red boxes are pores in the weave. The size the average person believes the COVID virus particle is superimposed. The *actual* size is barely discernable in the black box in the center.

[Buddahaid]

The roof gets blown off of a Louisianna hospital so now it's a real problem.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-58378788

[Skybird]

Mortality rate remains >2%.
Discussion

New SARS-CoV-2 infections in England are increasingly caused by the delta variant. Although the proportion of cases caused by the delta variant was 20% overall during the study period, this increased to 74% of new sequenced cases in the week starting May 31, 2021.9 (https://www.thelancet.com/journals/laninf/article/PIIS1473-3099(21)00475-8/fulltext#bib9)
To our knowledge, this study provides the largest whole-genome-sequencing dataset for SARS-CoV-2 in a high-income country to date, enabling the assessment of hospitalisation risk for the delta variant compared with the alpha variant using linked administrative data. The results suggest that patients with the delta variant had more than two times the risk of hospital admission compared with patients with the alpha variant. Emergency care attendance combined with hospital admission was also higher for patients with the delta variant, showing increased use of emergency care services as well as inpatient hospitalisation. Similar results were observed for the subgroup of unvaccinated patients when comparing risks of both hospital care outcomes between the two variants. In the subgroup of patients who had received at least one vaccine dose (≥21 days since their first dose), the precision was too low to determine whether the risks of the outcomes were higher or similar for patients with the delta variant compared with patients with the alpha variant. It has previously been reported that vaccination leads to a similar relative reduction in the risk of hospitalisation for patients with the delta variant or the alpha variant.12 (https://www.thelancet.com/journals/laninf/article/PIIS1473-3099(21)00475-8/fulltext#bib12)
This is consistent with the findings in the present study: overall, the number of hospital attendances were low in the vaccinated subgroup resulting in low-precision relative risk estimates.

[Arlo]

Pretending that taking a vaccine is some kind of patriotic altruism is crap. We took those covid shots to protect ourselves, not anyone else. That is just as selfishly indulgent as refusing to take it.

Projecting your core motivation for everything you do onto others does not make it true. It merely reflects who you really are. Even then, there are other (smarter) selfishly indulgent types out there who are more self aware and avoid such crass faux pas in public. :shucks:

[MaDef]

@Skybird, nothing in that wall of text indicates a change in the mortality rate of the virus, so what's your point?

[Jimbuna]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_91RQCySddg

[Skybird]

Virologists and laboratory doctors at the university Lübeck give a first attempt to estimate values at what accumulation of antibody immunity against Covid-19 can be assumed to exist. The international unit for measuring antibodies, is BAU (Bindign Antibody Units). Based on general virus experiences, experiences with Corona and Covid-19 and empirical data from Covid19 patient records, they say a BAU belows 21.8 means you have no immunity against Covid 19, whereas a BAU above 44 indicates you have. A BAU of 1000 means they advise that you do not go for a third refreshign jab. They admit everything between 21.8 and 44 is a grey zone that slowly gets scouted and specified.


I read it as that even if you are above 44, say 50, your immunitiy nevertheless may be weak. The higher the better, I assume.



You can get your antibody levels tested, for example after you recovered, or got vaccinated. Ask your doctor, its a simple blood test, AFAIK.

[Skybird]

Many people in South Africa are not vaccinated and are suspicious of the jab. This is what oyu get for that: a live mutation horror show.

They hit the red alarm button over a new varian of high concern that shows more mutations in its genome than any other earlier variant. This come at the risk of that maybe it is resistent against the existing vaccinations.

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.08.20.21262342v1.full.pdf

Earlier this month the CEO of Pfizer said BionTech they can develope a new vaccine for any future variant within 90 days now. And then the game starts new from the starting block.

[Catfish]

Many people in South Africa are not vaccinated and are suspicious of the jab. This is what oyu get for that: a live mutation horror show.
They hit the red alarm button over a new variant of high concern that shows more mutations in its genome than any other earlier variant. This come at the risk of that maybe it is resistent against the existing vaccinations.

With the vaccination campaign having practically come to a standstill due to anti-vaccers here in Germany we will get a mutation wave here, too.

With appx. 60 percent vaccinated there is no immunity, on the contrary the virus will be able to exist on and morph.
People who have been infected and survived still have no protection against new variants.

What did society do with people getting the bubonic plague back then?
(Remember they had no chance or possibility of being vaccinated)
Isolate them.
"Oh no they take away my freedom!"
And? Screw you. You are making it worse for all.

[3catcircus]

With the vaccination campaign having practically come to a standstill due to anti-vaccers here in Germany we will get a mutation wave here, too.

With appx. 60 percent vaccinated there is no immunity, on the contrary the virus will be able to exist on and morph.
People who have been infected and survived still have no protection against new variants.

What did society do with people getting the bubonic plague back then?
(Remember they had no chance or possibility of being vaccinated)
Isolate them.
"Oh no they take away my freedom!"
And? Screw you. You are making it worse for all.

You miss the point. They isolated the *sick*. Everyone else went about their business without being also isolated.

[Catfish]

"In Germany, an epidemic law was raised that banned people caught in the bubonic plague from contact with their fellow human beings. Those who dared to do so were usually expelled from the city and chased out."
The sick ones of course, they had no means to tell wether someone was infected or not before the one showed symptoms. In the late stage when symptoms became visible, they often were not contagious anymore. So, too late anyway.
What do you think would have happened if they knew who was contagious? Care for their "freedom"?

So you can choose:
If you vaccinate no one, a lot will die and survivors will have a short time of immunity against the first variant.
If you vaccinate all very few will die, and the virus almost exterminated since there is no breeding ground, meaning also no mutations.
If you vaccinate only some the overall effect is that the virus mutates, since it is not being exterminated and it can reproduce.

[Arlo]

https://i.imgur.com/H4u52ih.jpg

[Rockstar]

Covid-19 natural immunity compared to vaccine-induced immunity: The definitive summary

https://sharylattkisson.com/2021/08/covid-19-natural-immunity-compared-to-vaccine-induced-immunity-the-definitive-summary/

The vaccine immunity problem

Hard data counters widespread public misinformation that claimed “virtually all" patients hospitalized and dying of Covid-19 are unvaccinated. Pfizer and Moderna had claimed their vaccines were “100% effective” at preventing serious illness. Many in the media even popularized a propaganda phrase designed to push more people to get vaccinated: "pandemic of the unvaccinated.”

Not so, says CDC and other data.

Listen to podcast with Dr. Jay Bhattacharya, who addresses the strength of natural immunity

Recent CDC data found that 74% of those who tested positive for Covid-19 in a Massachusetts analysis had been fully-vaccinated. Equally as troubling for those advocating vaccination-for-all: four out of five people hospitalized with Covid were fully-vaccinated. And CDC said "viral load” — indicating how able the human host is to spread Covid-19 — is about the same among the vaccinated and unvaccinated. Contrary to the infamous misinformation by CDC Director Rochelle Walensky last May, vaccinated people can— and are— spreading Covid. (CDC officials later corrected Walensky's false claim.)

[Catfish]

Sharyl Attkisson.
Untouchable Subjects. Fearless, Nonpartisan Reporting.
Keep SharylAttkisson.com independent. Donate today. (https://respectfulinsolence.com/2019/01/09/sharyl-attkisson-is-back/)
Lmao.

[Arlo]

https://i.imgur.com/QpQiZk8.jpg

[mapuc]

According to a Swedish article a natural infection with corona and survive has 10 times(I think it was) better protection than they would have with a vaccine.

Markus

[Rockstar]

Sharyl Attkisson.
Untouchable Subjects. Fearless, Nonpartisan Reporting.
Lmao.

But no comment on the actual data presented in the article? Lmao

[Rockstar]

This isn’t polio. Polio was eradicated with the help of better personal hygiene and sanitation systems.

[Arlo]

https://i.imgur.com/l8IXsvJ.png

[Arlo]

This isn’t polio. Polio was eradicated with the help of better personal hygiene and sanitation systems.

https://www.cdc.gov/polio/what-is-polio/polio-us.html

Personal hygiene and sanitation systems weren't an invention of the late 1950s.

[Rockstar]

https://i.imgur.com/l8IXsvJ.png

Don’t forget the human body was capable of defending itself against infection long before vaccines arrived. One only need look at the global population to see how well it works too. Especially in those third world over populated areas of the globe that don’t have advanced medicines.

[Skybird]

These debates with the goal of endlessly relativising the use of vaccines have long since turned surreal.



Everybody, fasten your seat belts or in case of a crash fly through the windshield, slit your arteries and bleed to death. Must I care? I must not care, and I am not interested. Honestly said I only care if I am expected to pay for your hospital stay - or if you think you have a right to deliberately slam with your car into me. Elsewise you can ruin your wellbeing in any way you want - I don't care.

[Rockstar]

https://www.cdc.gov/polio/what-is-polio/polio-us.html

Personal hygiene and sanitation systems weren't an invention of the late 1950s.

You didn’t even bother reading your own link did you? :har::har::har::har::har::har::har:

Here, this article from the U.S. National Library of Medicine actually talks about how sanititation improvements coupled with natural herd immunity played a roll in eradicating polio in the U.S. Weird thing though is they then go on and seem to say that these hygiene and sanitation improvements then caused pockets of polio outbreaks to resume in the U.S. :doh:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4108111/

[3catcircus]

Don’t forget the human body was capable of defending itself against infection long before vaccines arrived. One only need look at the global population to see how well it works too. Especially in those third world over populated areas of the globe that don’t have advanced medicines.
Polio vaccines account for the majority of polio infections in Africa...

I'm guessing Arlo is one of those cee-you-in-toledo contrarians like the antifa scum who attack crowds of patriots in Portland while wishing death to all the cops - and then demand the cops protect them when patriots proceed to stomp their guts out.

[Arlo]

Polio vaccines account for the majority of polio infections in Africa...

I'm guessing Arlo is one of those cee-you-in-toledo contrarians like the antifa scum who attack crowds of patriots in Portland while wishing death to all the cops - and then demand the cops protect them when patriots proceed to stomp their guts out.

Wow. Maybe credible citation would help you not sound crazy. Credible ... not 'Q.'

[August]

You didn’t even bother reading your own link did you?

.......

Weird thing though is they then go on and seem to say that these hygiene and sanitation improvements then caused pockets of polio outbreaks to resume in the U.S. :doh:

Yeah he's either pretty dense or as I suspect he is someone's 2nd account that they are using to play troll. Ignore him.

But regarding polio. From what I read it turns out that the polio virus was so common back in the day that before these modern hygiene improvement programs almost all infants were exposed to it while they were still being protected by the mothers immune system. Apparently it takes a few years for that benefit to wear off. By improving hygiene it delayed their exposure to the polio virus to an older age leaving them unprotected and often crippled or dead as a result.

[Arlo]

Yeah he's either pretty dense or as I suspect he is someone's 2nd account that they are using to play troll. Ignore him.

But regarding polio. From what I read it turns out that the polio virus was so common back in the day that before these modern hygiene improvement programs almost all infants were exposed to it while they were still being protected by the mothers immune system. Apparently it takes a few years for that benefit to wear off. By improving hygiene it delayed their exposure to the polio virus to an older age leaving them unprotected and often crippled or dead as a result.

Your hyperventilation during that post is damn near palpable.

https://www.newyorker.com/science/annals-of-medicine/the-last-time-a-vaccine-saved-america

:shucks:

[mapuc]

It was a combination between better hygiene and the vaccine who got rid of Polio.

Speculation

Would Polio have disappeared if we only had improved on hygiene, but no vaccine ?
Would Polio have disappeared if we only had the vaccine, but miserable hygiene ?

Markus

[Jimbuna]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gdzl-GYikPo

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/90vKCP7P/120346769-uk-card-with-vax-2doses-31aug-nc.png (https://postimg.cc/JH5PQkKt)

[3catcircus]

Wow. Maybe credible citation would help you not sound crazy. Credible ... not 'Q.'

https://abcnews.go.com/Health/wireStory/polio-cases-now-caused-vaccine-wild-virus-67287290

https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/2020/sep/02/vaccine-derived-polio-spreads-in-africa-after-defeat-of-wild-virus

https://apnews.com/article/virus-outbreak-health-middle-east-africa-united-nations-619efb65b9eeec5650f011b960a152e9

I always have the receipts. Clown.

[Arlo]

https://abcnews.go.com/Health/wireStory/polio-cases-now-caused-vaccine-wild-virus-67287290

https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/2020/sep/02/vaccine-derived-polio-spreads-in-africa-after-defeat-of-wild-virus

https://apnews.com/article/virus-outbreak-health-middle-east-africa-united-nations-619efb65b9eeec5650f011b960a152e9

I always have the receipts. Clown.

The Salk virus, used in the U.S., wasn't a live virus, dufus. :shucks:

[Rockstar]

… there’s promising news to be found within natural and acquired immunity statistics, according to virologists. As of May 29, CDC estimated more than 120 million Americans— more than one in three— had already battled Covid. While an estimated six-tenths of one-percent died, the other 99.4% of those infected survived with a presumed immune status that appears to be superior to that which comes with vaccination.

If doctors could routinely test to confirm who has fought off and become immune to Covid-19, it would eliminate the practical need or rationale for those protected millions to get vaccinated. It would also allow them to avoid even the slight risk of serious vaccine side effects.

[Arlo]

https://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2021/s0806-vaccination-protection.html

https://www.healthgrades.com/right-care/vaccines/natural-immunity-vs-vaccine-acquired-immunity-which-is-better

https://directorsblog.nih.gov/2021/06/22/how-immunity-generated-from-covid-19-vaccines-differs-from-an-infection/

[3catcircus]

The Salk virus, used in the U.S., wasn't a live virus, dufus. :shucks:

Which has ****-all to do with my statement that more people in Africa get polio from the vaccine than the virus.

You really are trying super-hard to try and be right when you can't be.

[Arlo]

Which has ****-all to do with my statement that more people in Africa get polio from the vaccine than the virus.

You really are trying super-hard to try and be right when you can't be.

When I can't be? That's a bad tell. :shucks:

[Sean C]

When all of this first started, the "experts" said that masks were useless.


Then, everybody flip-flopped and said that masks and social distancing were vital to stopping the spread of the disease.


Then, some doctors said that hydroxychloroquine looked promising as a treatment. But as soon as Trump said it was a good idea, suddenly it was a terrible idea.


When a vaccine was amazingly produced after only a year of research, the "experts" said it was our best hope and that, if you got it, you wouldn't need to wear a mask and you could gather in larger groups.


Then they flip-flopped again and said that the vaccine doesn't protect you from contracting or spreading the disease. So ... mask up, again. Vaccinated or not.



Now they're telling us that this is a "pandemic of the unvaccinated", which makes no sense when you consider that they are also telling us that the majority of people in developed countries have been vaccinated and that the "anti-vaxxers" must be some small group of crazy "right-wingers" or Trump supporters. If that is the case, then it cannot be a pandemic. Otherwise, you'd have to admit that those "crazies" are more than just a minority. And you can't have that.



Honestly, I'm surprised I've heard no mention of Christian Scientists this whole time. AFAIK, they would refuse the vaccine on religious grounds. What happens to them? Will they be shunned from society?


And some people still wonder why anyone would distrust what they are being told. There was an exposé piece many years ago about the "bird flu" and how our governments overestimated the risk and squandered billions of dollars fighting it. In the end, it was a nothing-burger. I think we'll see a similar result here. I don't think history will look kindly upon the decisions being made.



I'm reminded of a little boy who cried "Wolf!" Maybe we won't be prepared for a real threat when it arrives. Because of some political posturing. Wouldn't that be funny?


No, it wouldn't.

[Arlo]

I've never seen so many people unwilling/afraid to even wear a mask. If, in the end, it turns out that the wearing of said masks did little or nothing to help others during the pandemic I will still be glad I did so, erring only on the part of caution for the betterment of society and the health of others. What trophy will the anti-vaxxers/anti-maskers be awarding each other if it turns out the doctors and scientists were right in promoting these measures and they suddenly live in a world where every survivor buried family and friends due to their need to behave like spoiled brats?

SMDH 'The Inconvenienced Generation.'

[Dowly]

Texas anti-mask ‘Freedom Defender’ dies of COVID at age 30
https://www.mlive.com/news/2021/08/texas-anti-mask-freedom-defender-dies-of-covid-at-age-30.html


A Texas man who led a group of “Freedom Defenders” against mask restrictions died of COVID-19 on Saturday at age 30.
[..]
Wallace helped organize “The Freedom Rally” on July 4, 2020 — a gathering described in a flier as a peaceful protest by people “sick of the government being in control of our lives,” the Standard-Times reported.

He also founded “The San Angelo Freedom Defenders,” a group “to educate and empower citizens to make informed choices concerning local, statewide, and national policy and to encourage them to actively participate in their duty to secure God-given and constitutionally protected rights,” the group’s Facebook page stated.

Jessica Wallace said her husband got sick in late July, but “was so hard-headed.”

“He didn’t want to see a doctor, because he didn’t want to be part of the statistics with COVID tests,” she said.

He then tried unproven ivermectin — a livestock dewormer that has been denounced by the FDA — high doses of vitamin C, zinc aspirin and an inhaler, the Standard-Times reported.

[Rockstar]

I've never seen so many people unwilling/afraid to even wear a mask. If, in the end, it turns out that the wearing of said masks did little or nothing to help others during the pandemic I will still be glad I did so, erring only on the part of caution for the betterment of society and the health of others. What trophy will the anti-vaxxers/anti-maskers be awarding each other if it turns out the doctors and scientists were right in promoting these measures and they suddenly live in a world where every survivor buried family and friends due to their need to behave like spoiled brats?

SMDH 'The Inconvenienced Generation.'

But Dr. Fauci said it was pointless to wear a mask. Thank you Dr. Fauci! :salute:

[AVGWarhawk]

I've never seen so many people unwilling/afraid to even wear a mask. If, in the end, it turns out that the wearing of said masks did little or nothing to help others during the pandemic I will still be glad I did so, erring only on the part of caution for the betterment of society and the health of others. What trophy will the anti-vaxxers/anti-maskers be awarding each other if it turns out the doctors and scientists were right in promoting these measures and they suddenly live in a world where every survivor buried family and friends due to their need to behave like spoiled brats?

SMDH 'The Inconvenienced Generation.'

Well, like the sign says, "No shirt. No shoes. No service". Maybe mask should be added. Places of business do hang sings on the door. The signs either recommend or demand a mask.

[mapuc]

Do Mask protect a person ?

Well from what I have seen so far I would say no.

I would say it gives people a false feeling that they are protected

As mentioned before 98% handle their mask wrong before and after use.

These surgical mask Type IIR is only one-use then throw away in a bin.
Only the stripped areas may be touched not the blue front or the white back.

Secondly these Type IIR is not 100 % secure, even if you use them correctly.

That's why I wonder why we wear mask.

Markus

[Skybird]

Texas anti-mask ‘Freedom Defender’ dies of COVID at age 30
https://www.mlive.com/news/2021/08/texas-anti-mask-freedom-defender-dies-of-covid-at-age-30.html
Free at last, free at last - thank God he's free at last!

[Skybird]

Do Mask protect a person ?

Well from what I have seen so far I would say no.

I would say it gives people a false feeling that they are protected

As mentioned before 98% handle their mask wrong before and after use.

These surgical mask Type IIR is only one-use then throw away in a bin.
Only the stripped areas may be touched not the blue front or the white back.

Secondly these Type IIR is not 100 % secure, even if you use them correctly.

That's why I wonder why we wear mask.

Markus
Does a safety belt protect you when driving into that wall? Not if you strangle it wrongly around your neck and throat instead of placing it correctly over your chest. Do it right, and it does a very good job of keeping you alive.

Or a bungee rubber roap. Wrap it tight around your feet and downlegs, and you will scream but suffer no big harm. Grab the lose end with a hand and leave it to that - well... lets fix the bets... :D

There is no protection against stupidity. If people wear a mask over their mouth but under their nose - well, I just said it: there is no protection against stupidity. Wearing these masks correctly, is not that difficult. But obstructs breathing (a sign that the filtering effect actually is there) and that is what people do not want. They simply deny realisation of why a filtering mask only filters air if it - well, filters the air. If it does not filter the air, then it does not filter air.

Life is difficult. Oh so difficult. Its depressing.


Can you understand sarcasm? No joke, but serious question.

[AVGWarhawk]

The virus is very odd for sure. There is really no rhyme or reason for who experiences not much of anything, do not get it at all and or die. For example, I know entire family who contracted COVID. Three of the family members were under it for 2 weeks. Two very elderly parents of the family one contracted COVID while his wife did not. Yet, they live together. No masks or vaccine. Another elderly aunt well into her 70's lives with the 3 that were under it for 2 weeks and she never contracted the virus.

Another incident involves one of my contractors. He is 71. Got the sniffles on a Tuesday. Some fever and chills. Saturday he decides to get tested. Sunday he is advised he has COVID. I spoke to him on this day. He stated he feels pretty good and was coming out of it. Exactly 4 days. No vaccine.

Truly a unpredictable virus.

[Rockstar]

Do Mask protect a person ?

Well from what I have seen so far I would say no.

I would say it gives people a false feeling that they are protected

As mentioned before 98% handle their mask wrong before and after use.

These surgical mask Type IIR is only one-use then throw away in a bin.
Only the stripped areas may be touched not the blue front or the white back.

Secondly these Type IIR is not 100 % secure, even if you use them correctly.

That's why I wonder why we wear mask.

Markus


I remember my NBC training and I don’t recall paper masks ever being issued to defend against biological threats. The Mk V gas mask had to be fitted and provide an airtight seal in order to defend against contamination. We used smoke that smelled like bananas to test the seal. If you smelled bananas either your mask was not sealed properly or your filters were OOC.

So I think Dr. Fauci was right when he said wearing a paper mask was pointless. Thank you Dr. Fauci :salute:

[mapuc]

This is about Corona.

Skybird has on several occasion talked about seatbelt.

Using it as a compare to the vaccine is ok.

But wearing a seatbelt can be a disaster to, as a vaccine can.

One of my elderly sisters friends has, don't know what she called it-It's something with her left shoulder. Continues pain can hardly move her left arm.
(She used it correctly)

I'm NOT saying you shall not use seatbelt-They save life. so does vaccine.

Back to our Corona discussion

Markus

[Jimbuna]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JhRb5hnTseU

[Jimbuna]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDx8nRWuC3Q

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/BnFkG5FZ/120357887-uk-card-with-vax-2doses-01sep-nc.png (https://postimg.cc/K1ZJPMQC)

[mapuc]

I find it interesting that every person who in public who been critical to this corona virus and the steps our government has taken to protect us, died from this virus.

I can't remember who many I heard and read about-People who either thinks this corona is a hoax or was critical to the step taken by the government in public.

Markus

[Skybird]

Another statistical data imo is even more revealing, here in Germany.

Like everywhere, there are daily statistics done in Germany, and published. And two facts ion these, SINCE DAYS AND DAYS:

1.) All daily deaths from Covid-19 in German hospitals - are unvaccinated patients.

2.) The overwhelming majority of people needing to get hospitalised (no matter whether they survive in the following time or not) - are unvaccinated people.

[Rockstar]

Gee I guess the legend of the German Übermensch is true. Or… you might want ask more questions in Germany because you know how the saying goes ‘when things seem to good to be true?’

Over here recent CDC data found that ‘74% of those who tested positive for Covid-19 in a Massachusetts analysis had been fully-vaccinated. Equally as troubling for those advocating vaccination-for-all: four out of five people hospitalized with Covid were fully-vaccinated.


Outbreak of SARS-CoV-2 Infections, Including COVID-19 Vaccine Breakthrough Infections, Associated with Large Public Gatherings — Barnstable County, Massachusetts, July 2021

https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7031e2.htm?s_cid=mm7031e2_w

Thankfully though no deaths were reported in either the saintly true believers, all caring people who vaccinated or those of evil anti caring, anti jeebus, unvacinated group

[August]

I find it interesting that every person who in public who been critical to this corona virus and the steps our government has taken to protect us, died from this virus.

I can't remember who many I heard and read about-People who either thinks this corona is a hoax or was critical to the step taken by the government in public.

Markus


So in other words if you make a fuss you might get dead? So very hillaryish! :)

[d@rk51d3]

Another statistical data imo is even more revealing, here in Germany.

Like everywhere, there are daily statistics done in Germany, and published. And two facts ion these, SINCE DAYS AND DAYS:

1.) All daily deaths from Covid-19 in German hospitals - are unvaccinated patients.

2.) The overwhelming majority of people needing to get hospitalised (no matter whether they survive in the following time or not) - are unvaccinated people.


Seems to be the opposite here.

A large proportion of both are single and double vaxxed.

[Arlo]

......................

[Buddahaid]

Seems to be the opposite here.

A large proportion of both are single and double vaxxed.

What's that age demographic? Are these highly vulnerable elders?

[d@rk51d3]

What's that age demographic? Are these highly vulnerable elders?

Seems to be a spread.

[Catfish]

I find it interesting that every person who in public who been critical to this corona virus and the steps our government has taken to protect us, died from this virus.
I can't remember who many I heard and read about-People who either thinks this corona is a hoax or was critical to the step taken by the government in public. MarkusJust evolution doing its thing :yep:
It almost seems as if real science does not care about opinions. How inconvenient.

[August]

Just evolution doing its thing :yep:
It almost seems as if real science does not care about opinions. How inconvenient.

Plenty of Covid hoaxers and vaccine rejecting people here on this forum but none of them have died. I know that disappoints our German contingent but do try to bear up.

[Rockstar]

Plenty of Covid hoaxers and vaccine rejecting people here on this forum but none of them have died. I know that disappoints our German contingent but do try to bear up.


'The Germans are not good at controlling their feelings. They have a streak of hysteria. You will find that Germans may often fly into a passion if some little thing goes wrong.'

Instructions for British Servicemen in Germany, 1944

[AVGWarhawk]

[QUOTE=Arlo;2766051]



The vaccine is not 100% at keeping anyone from dying from COVID if one is infected. This meme is misinformed.

[Dowly]

At least 6 conservative radio hosts and anti-mask advocates have died from COVID-19 after bashing the vaccines:
https://www.businessinsider.com/conservative-radio-hosts-anti-maskers-death-covid-19-2021-9?r=US&IR=T


At least six conservative radio hosts and high-profile anti-mask and anti-vaccine advocates have died from COVID-19 in recent weeks.

Before catching COVID-19, the men — radio hosts Dick Farrel, Phil Valentine, and Marc Bernier, as well as former CIA officer and conspiracy theorist Robert David Steele, anti-masker Caleb Wallace, and South Carolina GOP conservative leader Pressley Stutts — had shared conspiracy theories about vaccines, told supporters misinformation about the virus, and even held rallies in opposition to mask mandates.

[AVGWarhawk]

At least 6 conservative radio hosts and anti-mask advocates have died from COVID-19 after bashing the vaccines:
https://www.businessinsider.com/conservative-radio-hosts-anti-maskers-death-covid-19-2021-9?r=US&IR=T

The virus apparently does not like conservative radio hosts. I guess it leans left and hates talk radio.

[Catfish]

The virus apparently does not like conservative radio hosts. [...]
Link it to intelligence :O:

[AVGWarhawk]

Link it to intelligence :O:


Stranger yet, the virus is cool with riots. :hmmm:

[Catfish]

I am a bit out of energy to feel sorry for the misinformed. But just maybe without people like Tucker Carlson there would be less anti vaxxers.
Still some, but not as many.

[AVGWarhawk]

I am a bit out of energy to feel sorry for the misinformed. But just maybe without people like Tucker Carlson there would be less anti vaxxers.
Still some, but not as many.

There are anit-vaxxers and the hesitant. The hesitant are not anti-vax. They are uncertain or feel the vaccine is still in a trial phase. Even if the FDA has approved it in such a short amount of time. The hesitant also consist of a group of individuals that do not trust the government because past experiments on said group of people proved to be fatal or long term physical damage. It is not always about misinformation. Tucker has a lot of viewership. There is also a very large group that have not heard of the guy.

[Buddahaid]

The virus apparently does not like conservative radio hosts. I guess it leans left and hates talk radio.

Maybe they have there mouths open too much....

Anyway, the gig I had scheduled for this Sunday night is now canceled as the bar has to lockdown for ten days and the staff get tested. All that because someone threw a big party and guests then went bar hopping. Some one then got sick so everybody is paying the consequences.

[AVGWarhawk]

Maybe they have there mouths open too much....

Anyway, the gig I had scheduled for this Sunday night is now canceled as the bar has to lockdown for ten days and the staff get tested. All that because someone threw a big party and guests then went bar hopping. Some one then got sick so everybody is paying the consequences.

Opening their mouth is their job. Well not for nothing....bars are notorious for the spread. I'm not surprised.

[Buddahaid]

Opening their mouth is their job. Well not for nothing....bars are notorious for the spread. I'm not surprised.

The bar didn't spread it, the ass bites that threw the party beforehand elsewhere are responsible, or irresponsible rather.

[AVGWarhawk]

The bar didn't spread it, the ass bites that threw the party beforehand elsewhere are responsible, or irresponsible rather.

Are you serious? Of course bars don't spread the virus. Gatherings at bars are notorious for spreading the virus. Does not matter if is a group using the entire bar for party or the usual crowd drinking their troubles away. Anyone can be an irresponsible ass bite at a bar. Even the vaccinated that are infected but not having symptoms thinking all is well.

[Rockstar]

Maybe they have there mouths open too much....

Anyway, the gig I had scheduled for this Sunday night is now canceled as the bar has to lockdown for ten days and the staff get tested. All that because someone threw a big party and guests then went bar hopping. Some one then got sick so everybody is paying the consequences.

During July 3–17, 2021, multiple summer events and large public gatherings were held in a town in Barnstable County, Massachusetts, that attracted thousands of tourists from across the United States. Beginning July 10, the Massachusetts Department of Public Health (MA DPH) received reports of an increase in COVID-19 cases among persons who reside in or recently visited Barnstable County, including in fully vaccinated persons. Persons with COVID-19 reported attending densely packed indoor and outdoor events at venues that included bars, restaurants, guest houses, and rental homes. On July 3, MA DPH had reported a 14-day average COVID-19 incidence of zero cases per 100,000 persons per day in residents of the town in Barnstable County; by July 17, the 14-day average incidence increased to 177 cases per 100,000 persons per day in residents of the town


According to that report 74% of the ass bites that were spreading the virus in Massachusetts were fully vaccinated. And to top off 4 out of the 5 patients hospitalized for COVID were fully vaccinated ass bites. However as stated earlier no deaths were reported in either the vaccinated or unvaccinated during this period.

[mapuc]

From what I can recall from the news some years ago the first wave had its origin at some bar in Austria. The guilty was a whistle who travel from turist to turist. Thereafter the turist went home to their countries taking Corona with them.

The owner of this bar/restaurant have been sued.

Markus

[Buddahaid]

Oh brother did I say bars can't spread it? I was referring to this particular incident which the bar was not responsible for causing.

[AVGWarhawk]

Oh brother did I say bars can't spread it? I was referring to this particular incident which the bar was not responsible for causing.

:salute:

It just sucks no matter how we look at it.

[3catcircus]

Maybe they have there mouths open too much....

Anyway, the gig I had scheduled for this Sunday night is now canceled as the bar has to lockdown for ten days and the staff get tested. All that because someone threw a big party and guests then went bar hopping. Some one then got sick so everybody is paying the consequences.

And how is it any different than if they were to have done the bar hopping but someone caught the flu or measles?

This seems like a typical ridiculous overreaction to someone getting COVID. 2 years ago, everyone would've gone "oh, that sucks" and gone about their business unless they also started feeling sick. You don't quarantine unhealthy people and without a positive test result, you have nothing to indicate that they are infected. In fact, it sounds like there isn't any way of even knowing if the person was sick at that bar, or if they contracted it later on at a different location.

[Arlo]

https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/coronavirus/in-depth/covid-19-cold-flu-and-allergies-differences/art-20503981

[Buddahaid]

Maybe. Currently the hospital I'm working at doesn't have enough monitoring to cover the Covid patients that don't require ventilators. That is not the flu.

[AVGWarhawk]

https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/coronavirus/in-depth/covid-19-cold-flu-and-allergies-differences/art-20503981

The differences is there is no separate thread for colds or flu. :D

[Buddahaid]

No but I can tell you that what I described is not what a typical flu season looks like. Yes things will get full but not for extended periods because there is usually higher turnover.

[Rockstar]

No but I can tell you that what I described is not what a typical flu season looks like. Yes things will get full but not for extended periods because there is usually higher turnover.

I have been wondering if reduction in funding has more to do with overcrowding than actual increase in patients. It’s just when I look at John Hopkins COVID dashboard. It seems the that available beds and ICU slots have been reduced throughout the country.

Honestly I’m not sure if I’m looking at the information on dashboard correctly. But it seems to me there were a heckuva lot more empty beds just a few months ago.

[Skybird]

This is about Corona.

Skybird has on several occasion talked about seatbelt.

Using it as a compare to the vaccine is ok.

But wearing a seatbelt can be a disaster to, as a vaccine can.

One of my elderly sisters friends has, don't know what she called it-It's something with her left shoulder. Continues pain can hardly move her left arm.
(She used it correctly)

I'm NOT saying you shall not use seatbelt-They save life. so does vaccine.

Back to our Corona discussion

Markus
Better a broken arm than a broken neck.

[Skybird]

Seems to be the opposite here.

A large proportion of both are single and double vaxxed.
Single and double vaxxed thown together? Absurd, it makes a lightyear in difference for Delta and later.



Single vaccnation are not even recognised over here as "vaccinated".

[Jimbuna]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sk4UoAkLaDU

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/BQwsgbm0/120370733-uk-card-with-vax-2doses-02sep-nc.png (https://postimg.cc/Lnfr49dC)

[3catcircus]

I have been wondering if reduction in funding has more to do with overcrowding than actual increase in patients. It’s just when I look at John Hopkins COVID dashboard. It seems the that available beds and ICU slots have been reduced throughout the country.

Honestly I’m not sure if I’m looking at the information on dashboard correctly. But it seems to me there were a heckuva lot more empty beds just a few months ago.

As I've been saying, it's not a lack of facilities; it's a lack of staff that goes back to last year - and hospitals did it to themselves and they haven't recovered.

https://www.npr.org/2020/05/10/853524764/amid-pandemic-hospitals-lay-off-1-4m-workers-in-april

https://www.mychamplainvalley.com/news/national/us-hospitals-hit-with-nurse-staffing-crisis-amid-covid/

If medical professionals are deciding not to get COVID vaccinated, does it mean they're not good doctors and nurses? Or does it mean that they've made an educated risk-benefit based decision based upon their expert medical opinion? As staff continue to be fired, quit, or go in strike, it's only going to get worse.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/hospital-workers-walk-out-over-mandatory-covid-vaccination-its-a-choice/ar-AAKPPNE

http://www.sovanow.com/index.php?/news/article/hospital_workers_walk_out_over_vax_mandate/

https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/medical/more-than-150-texas-hospital-staff-fired-or-quit-over-vaccine-ruling/ar-AALkP0H

[Dowly]

'Not enough research': Paramedic still opposes vaccine after losing her child to COVID-19:
https://www.fox5vegas.com/coronavirus/not-enough-research-paramedic-still-opposes-vaccine-after-losing-her-child-to-covid-19/article_f72ce156-b284-5ce7-b677-d662fe1190d5.html


Helm said she was notified that her son came in close contact with at least six people who tested positive at the school.

The Paramedic and mother of two said, she chose not to vaccinate her son because she felt there was not enough research on the vaccine, and she feels the success rate is low.

Helm tested positive for COVID-19 the day before her son Porter.

Even after losing her son, she said she is still not sure if she will now get vaccinated.
[..]
Helm was still in the hospital receiving treatment for COVID-19 when her sister told her that Porter didn’t make it.

“It’s the most horrible thing I’ve ever been through.”

Helm still has not had a chance to see her son or tell him she loves him.

However, she said she knows what she will tell him when she finally gets to see him for the last time.

“Oh my God buddy I miss you so much, I’d give anything if you were still here.”

A bit late for that now.

[Jimbuna]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b_d7OLO_2nE

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/Dz3BysT2/120385333-uk-card-with-vax-2doses-03sep-nc.png (https://postimg.cc/68zdM8qS)

[Skybird]

https://www.science.org/content/article/having-sars-cov-2-once-confers-much-greater-immunity-vaccine-vaccination-remains-vital

It is said that natural immunity from having had Sars-Cov-2 is stronger than immunity triggered from vaccination. That may be true, but usually nobody speaks about the damage the virus does to the body before the natural immunity from having survived is being established. And it seems that cost for the gains is significant.

[Jimbuna]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KlxFfiJsEfM

[mapuc]

This is a Corona related comment, even though it's about Football.

Yesterday evening a scandal unfolded in front of the viewer around the world where this match was shown.

The match between Brazil and Argentina was interrupted after a man entered the field and claimed that four of the Argentina's team had broken some
Covid-19 rules when entering Brazil.

Markus

[Jimbuna]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VL8QnUM81Wo

[Jimbuna]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bjAPtBOAulo

[Jimbuna]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QbRJzR95PkI

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/1X1qYHHk/120427081-uk-card-with-vax-2doses-07sep-nc.png (https://postimg.cc/zbpvyT47)

[August]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VL8QnUM81Wo




Dude needs to take an oral hygiene class, maybe invest in some teeth whitener, I can almost smell the bad breath from here!

[Rockstar]

https://youtu.be/3O_7O9_nV10

[Arlo]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RGvlPeo5bNU

[Subnuts]

I'm taking the middle ground

Joe Rogan Starting To Make A Lot Of Sense To Man Who Gets All His News From Joe Rogan (https://www.theonion.com/joe-rogan-starting-to-make-a-lot-of-sense-to-man-who-ge-1844369723)

[Rockstar]

I'm taking the middle ground

Joe Rogan Starting To Make A Lot Of Sense To Man Who Gets All His News From Joe Rogan (https://www.theonion.com/joe-rogan-starting-to-make-a-lot-of-sense-to-man-who-ge-1844369723)


Ya but you gotta admit it’s funny to watch CNN or some doctor’s YouTube rant about Rogan’s treatment compared to Rogan’s personal experience and thoughts on the matter 4 days later.

Either one, take it or leave makes no difference to me. But it’s said 36% of the worlds population is using it.

https://ivmstatus.com/

[3catcircus]

Ya but you gotta admit it’s funny to watch CNN or some doctor’s YouTube rant about Rogan’s treatment compared to Rogan’s personal experience and thoughts on the matter 4 days later.

Either one, take it or leave makes no difference to me. But it’s said 36% of the worlds population is using it.

https://ivmstatus.com/

I think that the fact that he took ivermectin and improved isn't what bothers this doctor or CNN. It's that he has a huge audience - larger than CNN's typical audience - with which to influence authorities.

That, along with the clearly untrue Rolling Stone article does make you wonder why there is such a strong push to discredit it's use. The fact that ivermectin has been used in humans for quite a few years and the fact that it is also an animal parasiticide aren't mutually exclusive.

[Onkel Neal]

I'm taking the middle ground

Joe Rogan Starting To Make A Lot Of Sense To Man Who Gets All His News From Joe Rogan (https://www.theonion.com/joe-rogan-starting-to-make-a-lot-of-sense-to-man-who-ge-1844369723)

Lol, post of the year material. :Kaleun_Applaud:

[Rockstar]

The ACLU, Prior to COVID, Denounced Mandates and Coercive Measures to Fight Pandemics

In a New York Times op-ed this week, the group completely reversed its views, arguing vaccine mandates help civil liberties and bodily autonomy "is not absolute."

https://greenwald.substack.com/p/the-aclu-prior-to-covid-denounced

Government agencies have an essential role to play in helping to prevent and mitigate epidemics. Unfortunately, in recent years, our government’s approach to preparing the nation for a possible influenza pandemic has been highly misguided. Too often, policymakers are resorting to law enforcement and national security-oriented measures that not only suppress individual rights unnecessarily, but have proven to be ineffective in stopping the spread of disease and saving lives . . . .

A separate ACLU report from 2015, issued during the ebola epidemic, contained a similar message. It warned “against politically motivated and scientifically unwarranted quarantines, which the report found violated individuals’ rights and hampered efforts to end the outbreak.” Hysteria over ebola became so intense that the ACLU “found that people were illegally deprived of their right to due process under the 14th Amendment because the quarantines and movement restrictions were not scientifically justified.”

While both reports acknowledge that more restrictive measures can be justified under extreme circumstances, the crux of each is that voluntary compliance is better than coercion, that state mandates typically fail, and that the far greater danger is vesting too much power in the hands of the state, which it will never relinquish given the permanence of pandemics.

How the ACLU fell from those traditional and vital civil liberties positions to urging this week in The New York Times that “far from compromising civil liberties, vaccine mandates actually further civil liberties,” is anyone's guess. But what is beyond doubt is that it is a far fall indeed. And most of all, hearing the ACLU invoke the standard rationale of authoritarians — we all have the fundamental right to bodily integrity and to make our own health care decisions, but these rights are not absolute — is nothing short of jarring.

Update, Sept. 7, 2021, 6:58 p.m.: Shortly after publication of this article, a former ACLU lawyer, Margaret Winter, noted in response: “It was NOT just ‘prior to covid’ that ACLU denounced vaccine mandates: Read ACLU's 2020 position paper passionately and correctly arguing that vaccine mandates ‘exacerbate racial disparities and harm the civil liberties of all.’” Winter was referencing this ACLU report, from May of 2020, that warned of the serious dangers of “immunity passports," under which citizens who already got COVID and thus had immunity would enjoy rights not available to others:

We at the ACLU have serious concerns about the adoption of any such proposal, because of its potential to harm public health, incentivize economically-vulnerable people to risk their health by contracting COVID-19, exacerbate racial and economic disparities, and lead to a new health surveillance infrastructure that endangers privacy rights. . . . This division would likely worsen existing racial, disability, and economic disparities in America and lead people struggling to afford basic necessities to deliberately risk their health.

While such a scheme is different in degree from vaccine passports let alone vaccine mandates — which the ACLU is now championing — its rationale for opposing such a system is fully applicable: “there are serious civil liberties and civil rights harms from making workplace decisions on that basis,” adding: “any immunity passport system endangers privacy rights by creating a new surveillance infrastructure to collect health data.”

This law enforcement/national security strategy shifts the focus of preparedness from preventing and mitigating an emergency to punishing people who fail to follow orders and stay healthy.

Much of the report is devoted to an examination of how the U.S. government has historically treated pandemics. As it reviews each pandemic — including horrifically lethal ones such as the plague and smallpox — the ACLU concludes over and over that American health authorities excessively relied on coercion rather than education and persuasion, fueled by media-aided fear porn and alarmist narratives:…

And people wonder how Germans allowed Hitler’s rise to power. :har:

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/G3WQ4xdW/120439655-uk-card-with-vax-2doses-08sep-nc.png (https://postimg.cc/K45LVLKf)

[Rockstar]

THANK YOU DR. FAUCI :har:


https://theintercept.com/2021/09/06/new-details-emerge-about-coronavirus-research-at-chinese-lab/

https://youtu.be/nnMcZvbPxpU

https://i.etsystatic.com/15415237/r/il/f2ea48/2243050138/il_570xN.2243050138_q73p.jpg

I hope they roast that lying s.o.b. murdering idiot alive.

[3catcircus]

THANK YOU DR. FAUCI :har:


https://theintercept.com/2021/09/06/new-details-emerge-about-coronavirus-research-at-chinese-lab/

https://youtu.be/nnMcZvbPxpU

https://i.etsystatic.com/15415237/r/il/f2ea48/2243050138/il_570xN.2243050138_q73p.jpg

I hope they roast that lying s.o.b. murdering idiot alive.

That it took this long to finally post any news articles on what was obvious to those of us who understand exactly how government works through contractors and subcontractors is the real tragedy.

You could tell just by his answers in front of Congress that he was obfuscating the truth.

[Rockstar]

Seems Fauci was involved in another botched response. Not only should this murdering scumbag go to prison but all his butt kissing nazi mandate lovin’ followers too.

THANK YOU DR. FAUCI :har:

https://youtu.be/ezKb_AFvU4g

[mapuc]

If they find evidence in which Fauci have lied to the Congress, what will the next step be ?

Markus

[Rockstar]

If they find evidence in which Fauci have lied to the Congress, what will the next step be ?

Markus

Who knows, I’m just glad somebody’s representative spoke up and started asking questions. Instead of just shining us on.

[Sean C]

If they find evidence in which Fauci have lied to the Congress, what will the next step be ?

Markus


A presidential pardon.

[Catfish]

Bill Gates:
"In retrospect, hiding all my microchips in Ivermection horse dewormer was a stroke of genius."

[Catfish]

Who knows, I’m just glad somebody’s representative spoke up and started asking questions. Instead of just shining us on.
So a certain president did not create the virus, but he ignored it, denied it, minimized it, joked about it, weaponized it, politicized it, and exacerbated it. Tried to ridicule science and efforts to fight it, got infected himself but was helped by just those he fought, with medical help that was and is not available to his minions.
Culpable for the enfolding chaos, unnecessary illness, and preventable deaths because of his very actions. And his supporters are, too.

Ask just of all Fauci "questions"? No problem.
What about "asking" Trump?

[Jimbuna]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oMNVxcpJ4tU

[Rockstar]

Average daily deaths in the United States from COVID-19 (June 2021) and other leading causes (2021) I should add the CDC posted a report awhile back stating the third leading cause of death in the U.S. was due to medical error but that isn’t included here.

1. Heart Disease 2,101
2. Cancer 1,614
3. Accidents 474
4. Stroke 451
5. Chronic lower respiratory disease 377
6. Alzheimer disease 351
7. COVID-19 342
8. Diabetes 285
9. Other diseases of the respiratory system 182
10. Renal failure 148
11. Influenza and pneumonia 115

Speaking of the politicization of COVID, mandate nazis are still at it. Even though the Barnstable study showed 74% of infected were fully vaccinated and 4 out of five patients hospitalized were also fully vaccinated.

You stand a better chance of dying from a gunshot in West Garfield Park, Chicago than you do dying from COVID.

Furthermore according to worldmeter, Europe even with all their well spoken politicians and worship of all things Fauci still had a higher death rate compared to the U.S. no matter what the former weapon of crass destruction said. So apparently it didn’t matter what personal opinions were, how well spoken politicians were or who ignored what and when. COVID statistics were close to being the same pretty much throughout the world.

[Jimbuna]

A further 167 people have died in the UK within 28 days of a positive coronavirus test, with 38,0013 new cases recorded.

The number of people in England waiting to start routine hospital treatment has risen to a new record high, new figures show.

Universities are expected to give students face-to-face teaching this term rather than online learning, the education secretary says.

"NHS staff have pulled out all the stops... despite caring for many more Covid patients," says NHS England medical director Prof Stephen Powis.

A six-week consultation gets under way to decide whether it should be compulsory for all NHS staff in England to be vaccinated against Covid.

Several people have been killed in a fire at a hospital treating Covid patients in North Macedonia.

The Scottish Parliament is debating whether vaccination certificates will be needed to allow entry to nightclubs and larger live events.

Northern Ireland's power-sharing executive will meet to decide whether to lift the remaining coronavirus restrictions.

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/fW1MHNt0/120452697-uk-card-with-vax-2doses-09sep-nc.png (https://postimg.cc/F1gtRwx9)

[Skybird]

A small Japanese study suppots fears that the My variant escapes antibodies formed by vaccination and infections with earlier strains. It gets found in already 40 countries, spreading further. Initially, it was only Colombia, I think.


https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.09.06.459005v1.full.pdf

[AVGWarhawk]

So a certain president did not create the virus, but he ignored it, denied it, minimized it, joked about it, weaponized it, politicized it, and exacerbated it. Tried to ridicule science and efforts to fight it, got infected himself but was helped by just those he fought, with medical help that was and is not available to his minions.
Culpable for the enfolding chaos, unnecessary illness, and preventable deaths because of his very actions. And his supporters are, too.

Ask just of all Fauci "questions"? No problem.
What about "asking" Trump?

Operation Warp Speed under the Trump administration. Interestingly enough the Biden administration changed the name. How nice of them.

[AVGWarhawk]

If they find evidence in which Fauci have lied to the Congress, what will the next step be ?

Markus

Russian collusion!

[August]

If they find evidence in which Fauci have lied to the Congress, what will the next step be ?

Markus


A criminal referral to the justice department for prosecution. Whether the justice department will prosecute is another matter.

[Rockstar]

Those uneducated buffoon mandate nazis may really screw things up.

https://youtu.be/gmy8znrLPc0

[Catfish]

Operation Warp Speed under the Trump administration. Interestingly enough the Biden administration changed the name. How nice of them.
Since most Maga Trump fans despise vaxxers as snowflakes anyway and only "alternative facts" matter, why do you complain and praise at the same time?
1. "Operation warp speed, vaccines, fantastic Trump achievement."
2. "Do not take vaccinations and do not wear masks."

Funny how all the most notorious liars of the political anti-vaxxers have all intentionally been vaccinated.
"Do as we say, not as we do." ?

re warp speed:
Trump: "From the instant the coronavirus invaded our shores, we rushed into action to develop a safe and effective vaccine at breakneck speed. China has been working very hard to contain the Coronavirus.
The United States greatly appreciates their efforts and transparency.
It will all work out well. In particular, on behalf of the American People, I want to thank President Xi!
— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) January 24, 2020

https://trumpwhitehouse.archives.gov/briefings-statements/remarks-president-trump-update-operation-warp-speed/
^ You really have to read this :D

And then this maybe?
https://fortune.com/2020/11/09/pfizer-vaccine-funding-warp-speed-germany/

[Rockstar]

https://youtu.be/HI5gtJ4ObpQ

[Dowly]

Since most Maga Trump fans despise vaxxers as snowflakes anyway and only "alternative facts" matter, why do you complain and praise at the same time?
1. "Operation warp speed, vaccines, fantastic Trump achievement."
2. "Do not take vaccinations and do not wear masks."
It really is fun to watch conservatives constantly contradict themselves.


"Nooo, the vaccines were made too fast! They're not approv- Ok! They're now approved, but still! Vaccines bad!"
..
"What? Someone on facebook said there's this drug that's not approved for covid treatment that I can take unapproved doses of to cure covid?? GIMME!!1"

[AVGWarhawk]

It really is fun to watch conservatives constantly contradict themselves.


"Nooo, the vaccines were made too fast! They're not approv- Ok! They're now approved, but still! Vaccines bad!"
..


If you don't think the FDA was pushed to approve this vaccine quickly I have a bridge in NYC to sell you. Vaccine approvals take years. Not months. That is suspect in itself.

[AVGWarhawk]

No worries all. Biden will mandate the virus out of existence. :doh:

[Onkel Neal]

It really is fun to watch conservatives constantly contradict themselves.




It certainly is. But, do you get the same joy when liberals contradict themselves? :)





AUSTIN MOTOGP RACE SET TO GO AHEAD DESPITE MEDICAL EMERGENCY (https://the-race.com/motogp/austin-motogp-race-set-to-go-ahead-despite-medical-emergency/)

Fingers crossed!

[AVGWarhawk]

AUSTIN MOTOGP RACE SET TO GO AHEAD DESPITE MEDICAL EMERGENCY (https://the-race.com/motogp/austin-motogp-race-set-to-go-ahead-despite-medical-emergency/)

Fingers crossed!

Life needs to go on. We need to learn to live with this virus. College football stadiums are full to capacity. Soon the professional football stadiums will be full.

[Jimbuna]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mwL3rkTDpXM

[Jimbuna]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kV20QcW8JXU

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/4d9tCwrg/120498850-uk-card-with-vax-2doses-10sep-nc.png (https://postimg.cc/7Gqb01Hs)

[Arlo]

"Some businesses worried customers would shop less if they had to wear a mask when they went outside, and some people claimed mask ordinances were an infringement upon civil liberties. Yet “more important in terms of critiques,” Bristow says, “is this idea that we’ve heard today as well that they give people a false sense of security.” As she points out, wearing a mask is less effective when people don’t follow other health guidelines too (and especially if some are poking holes in their masks to smoke)."


MAY 6, 2020
When Mask-Wearing Rules in the 1918 Pandemic Faced Resistance

https://www.history.com/news/1918-spanish-flu-mask-wearing-resistance

[AVGWarhawk]

"Some businesses worried customers would shop less if they had to wear a mask when they went outside, and some people claimed mask ordinances were an infringement upon civil liberties. Yet “more important in terms of critiques,” Bristow says, “is this idea that we’ve heard today as well that they give people a false sense of security.” As she points out, wearing a mask is less effective when people don’t follow other health guidelines too (and especially if some are poking holes in their masks to smoke)."


MAY 6, 2020
When Mask-Wearing Rules in the 1918 Pandemic Faced Resistance

https://www.history.com/news/1918-spanish-flu-mask-wearing-resistance

I'm not a doctor but I play one on Facebook. I think the masks work to a certain extent. But these must be used in combination of distancing and washing of hands(don't touch one's face). I never understood two things. First, those that wear the mask under their nose. Second, those alone in their car wearing as mask as they drive. :doh:

[Rockstar]

I remember when we learned about Nuclear Biological and Chemical warfare counter measures. A paper or cloth mask wether new out of the box or with holes punched in it so you can smoke would not prevent you from becoming infected with fungus, bacteria or virus.

[AVGWarhawk]

I remember when we learned about Nuclear Biological and Chemical warfare counter measures. A paper or cloth mask wether new out of the box or with holes punched in it so you can smoke would not prevent you from becoming infected with fungus, bacteria or virus.

This how we learned to survive a nuclear attack. Duck and cover.

https://media.gettyimages.com/photos/students-duck-cover-their-heads-in-the-hallway-of-their-school-during-picture-id177542173

[mapuc]

An off topic comment to AVGWarhawk picture above.

Wonder how effective this Duck and cover would have if a nuke exploded nearby ?

End of an off topic.

Markus

[Jeff-Groves]

:har:
Back in the day it was called "Duck and Cover".
Later on it became called "KYAGB"
"Kiss your arse good bye!"

[Rockstar]

When I restored a house it had a mold problem which I had to clean up. Nobody in that line of work uses N95 or cloth masks.

Only mandate nazis believe in stupid.

[Arlo]

That would be a vast majority of the medical and scientific community you're recklessly defaming for no good reason. :shucks:

[Rockstar]

Equipment required for that line of work of cleaning mold spores takes a mask that can form an airtight seal with proper filters.

Let the mandate nazis use a paper mask.

[Arlo]

Equipment required for that line of work of cleaning mold spores takes a mask that can form an airtight seal with proper filters.

Let the mandate nazis use a paper mask.

However, precautions to reduce the spread of Covid is nothing like the line of work you describe. Both black mold cleanup and asbestos cleanup suiting are Osha regulated. Too aggressive and simplistic an argument. But them masks are evil and oppressive and impossible. And the vaccines are 5g blah blah blah. :03::shucks:

[mapuc]

This Tuesday I saw a group of Elderly from German on the buss. The facemask they had on was these ordinary you use when your is working with wood.

Don't know the exact name for these facemask-I have used them when I worked on a factory where we made furniture.

Markus

[Arlo]

This Tuesday I saw a group of Elderly from German on the buss. The facemask they had on was these ordinary you use when your is working with wood.

Don't know the exact name for these facemask-I have used them when I worked on a factory where we made furniture.

Markus

But why? All of you are gonna die from sawdust anyway. (J/K - but that's kinda the 'point' being used with the anti-mask crowd.) :shucks:

[mapuc]

But why? All of you are gonna die from sawdust anyway. (J/K - but that's kinda the 'point' being used with the anti-mask crowd.) :shucks:

I was thinking the same-Why use these useless mask.

Furthermore All type of restriction is gone here in Denmark.

No facemask mandatory. No need to show negative test result or Corona passport when entering Cinema, restaurant a.s.o.

Markus

[Arlo]

I was thinking the same-Why use these useless mask.

Furthermore All type of restriction is gone here in Denmark.

No facemask mandatory. No need to show negative test result or Corona passport when entering Cinema, restaurant a.s.o.


We're actually not thinking the same. I need to invent a sarcasm font. :03:

The precautions recommended are not oppressive and those fighting against them so aggressively are just silly.

https://thumbs.dreamstime.com/b/face-mask-protection-efficiency-infographic-vector-illustration-175813532.jpg

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ef30odAX0AE2tUD.jpg

[Rockstar]

However, precautions to reduce the spread of Covid is nothing like the line of work you describe. Both black mold cleanup and asbestos cleanup suiting are Osha regulated. Too aggressive and simplistic an argument. But them masks are evil and oppressive and impossible. And the vaccines are 5g blah blah blah. :03::shucks:

No they’re not evil but they are as Fauci said early on pointless. Of course he could by lying again. :D. But if wearing one helps you sleep better at night go for it. ;)

[Arlo]

No they’re not evil but they are as Fauci said early on pointless. Of course he could by lying again. :D. But if wearing one helps you sleep better at night go for it. ;)

Certainly it does. I take whatever precautions I can to protect others as well as myself (even though I'm currently double vaxxed). It's not like I'm being asked to fight in the Battle of the Bulge (like my old school Antifa grandfather) or climb San Juan Hill.

It's funny how unconservative conservatives are today. So much so that they'll go out of their way not to do what is politely asked of them in order to protect society, flatten the curve and end the shut-downs that result from not taking said precautions in order to 'make a point' (all the while vilifying those looking out for their best interests). There was a time when 'better safe than sorry' was the way and not 'inconveniencing me in the slightest is against the Constitution!' (which, it isn't, btw).

[Rockstar]

Certainly it does. I take whatever precautions I can to protect others as well as myself (even though I'm currently double vaxxed). It's not like I'm being asked to fight in the Battle of the Bulge (like my old school Antifa grandfather) or climb San Juan Hill.

It's funny how unconservative conservatives are today. So much so that they'll go out of their way not to do what is politely asked of them in order to protect society, flatten the curve and end the shut-downs that result from not taking said precautions in order to 'make a point' (all the while vilifying those looking out for their best interests). There was a time when 'better safe than sorry' was the way and not 'inconveniencing me in the slightest is against the Constitution!' (which, it isn't, btw).

For me masks are not a constitutional issue, nor a conservative issue neither is it a political party issue. Like Dr. Fauci I believe it is a pointless issue. But like I said if it makes you feel safe and sleep better at night feel free to wear a chin diaper any time you want, it doesn’t bother me at all.

And feel free to politely ask me to wear one anytime, I just may do so.

[Arlo]

For me masks are not a constitutional issue, nor a conservative issue neither is it a political party issue. Like Dr. Fauci I believe it is a pointless issue. But like I said if it makes you feel safe and sleep better at night feel free to wear a chin diaper any time you want, it doesn’t bother me at all.

And feel free to politely ask me to wear one anytime, I just may do so.

Ah, your 'reasonable' personality. :03:

[Rockstar]

That’s me, the poster child of reasonableness :D

[Buddahaid]

For me masks are not a constitutional issue, nor a conservative issue neither is it a political party issue. Like Dr. Fauci I believe it is a pointless issue. But like I said if it makes you feel safe and sleep better at night feel free to wear a chin diaper any time you want, it doesn’t bother me at all.

And feel free to politely ask me to wear one anytime, I just may do so.

Well if you were to visit someone in the hospital you would wear a mask or stay outside. If you were to book a domestic flight you would wear an N95 or be refused boarding. It is your choice but you may be refused service. It's a simple thing to do and I don't see why people make such a big deal out of it like kindergartners. It will eventually go away.

[Skybird]

Denmark has a fully vaccinated rate of fantastic 87%. Thats why they open up. Danes embraced the free gift of vaccines with open arms and the government says the desease has now no more communal relevance. .

[mapuc]

Denmark has a fully vaccinated rate of fantastic 87%. Thats why they open up. Danes embraced the free gift of vaccines with open arms and the government says the desease has now no more communal relevance. .

The authorities here in Denmark has opened extra vaccination post in stores a.s.o. They are trying to get the last 3 procent.
They know it's impossible to get 95-98 %

Markus

[Rockstar]

Well if you were to visit someone in the hospital you would wear a mask or stay outside. If you were to book a domestic flight you would wear an N95 or be refused boarding. It is your choice but you may be refused service. It's a simple thing to do and I don't see why people make such a big deal out of it like kindergartners. It will eventually go away.

Simple as it may be even Fauci said it was pointless for the general public to wear them. Furthermore I don’t believe there is one business in this country which specifies which mask to use. They approve of your loose fitting surgical mask, fancy scarf, cloth or a paper strip ALL of which provide absolutely no protection whatsoever. Which just goes to show your health is of no concern to them or the reason why they demand you wear a covering. It’s virtue signaling (see how much we care), used by mandate nazis and makes good headlines.

I’d bet if I were to wear a Mark V gas mask they’d boot me off the plane. But wear a useless scarf or piece of paper and I’d be welcome.

Oh and hospitals I can understand. In fact when I went to visit a patient last year. They wouldn’t allow just any old chin diaper. I was given proper PPE and instructed how to properly wear them and dispose of them after use.

[Arlo]

Si You can wear a surgical mask, a scarf, a cloth or a paper strip ALL of which provide absolutely no protection whatsoever.

*sigh*

Again ...

https://thumbs.dreamstime.com/b/face-mask-protection-efficiency-infographic-vector-illustration-175813532.jpg

[Dowly]

Go stand in front of a mirror and spit. Next, put a mask on and repeat the experiment. Report back.

[mapuc]

Rockstar is sort of correct when he wrote

"Si You can wear a surgical mask, a scarf, a cloth or a paper strip ALL of which provide absolutely no protection whatsoever."

Why!? Because 98-99 % of those who used these facemask did it wrong. They handle these mask wrong before, during use and after.

I haven't seen one single person using them correctly before or after use.

Which conclude facemask did not protect us.

Markus

[Arlo]

Rockstar is sort of correct when he wrote

Because 98-99 % of those who used these facemask did it wrong. They handle these mask wrong before, during use and after.

I haven't seen one single person using them correctly before or after use.

Which conclude facemask did not protect us.

Markus

That's not his claim. And not seeing a single person using them correctly is a rather odd statement. Seeing instances of such on a regular basis is believable but 'not one single?' I'm starting to worry about the people you hang out with. :shucks:

[mapuc]

That's not his claim. And not seeing a single person using them correctly is a rather odd statement. Seeing instances of such on a regular basis is believable but 'not one single?' I'm starting to worry about the people you hang out with. :shucks:

I'm not hanging out with anybody It's the observation I make when I stand and wait for the bus or entering a store.

One of my friends who use to take the same bus as I do have told me he have used same facemask for about 2-3 month.

Said to him, that his mask are now worthless.
He said that he knew that but he could not afford to use new one 2-3 times per day.

Markus

[Arlo]

I'm not hanging out with anybody It's the observation I make when I stand and wait for the bus or entering a store.

One of my friends who use to take the same bus as I do have told me he have used same facemask for about 2-3 month.

Said to him, that his mask are now worthless.
He said that he knew that but he could not afford to use new one 2-3 times per day.

Markus

That's ... one ... of your friends. You said you've not seen a single person using a mask correctly. Via observation you can only see things like nose or chin exposure as well as both. Do you ask each and every individual if they change masks daily? Forgive me but your claim is suspicious. :shucks:

[Rockstar]

*Sigh*. Your poster doesn’t have a source.



U.S. National Library of Medicine National Institutes of Health

The only thing which can prevent from being infected is social distancing and wearing of mask (N95) and wearing of mask has its own adverse effects... (hospital setting)

…while surgical masks provide a barrier against large respiratory particles, they are ineffective at providing protection from smaller particles. Surgical masks also do not prevent leakage around the mask when the user inhales. Therefore, surgical masks are ineffective and do not provide enough protection

They don’t even consider cloth or charcoal for discussion.

I know, seeeeee! It says N95 masks can save lives. BUT shouldn’t be worn any longer than 8 hours. Who’s checking if the N95 is even still good when people board their flight? Who has had the training to use them do people even know they have an expiration date?

Do they understand they should wash their hands after removing them? Do they even know how to remove them?


Without training even wearing an N95 is pointless. Just like Fauci said early on, unless of course he was lying to us again. :haha:

[Arlo]

*Sigh*. Your poster doesn’t have a source.



U.S. National Library of Medicine National Institutes of Health

The only thing which can prevent from being infected is social distancing and wearing of mask (N95) and wearing of mask has its own adverse effects... (hospital setting)

…while surgical masks provide a barrier against large respiratory particles, they are ineffective at providing protection from smaller particles. Surgical masks also do not prevent leakage around the mask when the user inhales. Therefore, surgical masks are ineffective and do not provide enough protection

They don’t even consider cloth or charcoal for discussion.

I know, seeeeee! It says N95 masks can save lives. BUT shouldn’t be worn any longer than 8 hours. Who’s checking if the N95 is even still good when people board their flight? Who has had the training to use them do people even know they have an expiration date?

Do they understand they should wash their hands after removing them? Do they even know how to remove them?


Without training even wearing an N95 is pointless. Just like Fauci said early on, unless of course he was lying to us again. :haha:

The graphic covered the ineffectiveness of charcoal and cloth. And now you're backpedaling on your original blanket statement.

https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/coronavirus/in-depth/coronavirus-mask/art-20485449

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7883189/

https://www.epa.gov/sciencematters/epa-researchers-test-effectiveness-face-masks-disinfection-methods-against-covid-19

(You're welcome) :shucks:

[Jimbuna]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ASq0_qUo2dA

[Platapus]

Go stand in front of a mirror and spit. Next, put a mask on and repeat the experiment. Report back.




Yes. it is the transmission of droplets that we are trying to mitigate.

[Rockstar]

The "Left vs. Right" battle has very little bearing anymore in real life. What we're facing now isn't a sideways conflict but a vertical one: the 99% vs. the 1% (and its minions). The nationalists vs. the globalists. Democratic rule vs. corporate/plutocratic rule. Unfortunately, the 1% globalist plutocrats are winning handily, since they have monopoly control of the media and have bought out virtually all the politicians. It's not looking too good for the rest of us.

CJ Hopkins, who normally writes satire, has analyzed the current state of affairs in a colorful 3-part series:

https://consentfactory.org/2020/10/13/the-covidian-cult/

https://consentfactory.org/2021/04/21/the-covidian-cult-part-ii/

https://consentfactory.org/2021/09/02/the-covidian-cult-part-iii/

Their initiation into the Covidian Cult began in January, when the medical authorities and corporate media turned on The Fear with projections of hundreds of millions of deaths and fake photos of people dropping dead in the streets. The psychological conditioning has continued for months. The global masses have been subjected to a constant stream of propaganda, manufactured hysteria, wild speculation, conflicting directives, exaggerations, lies, and tawdry theatrical effects. Lockdowns. Emergency field hospitals and morgues. The singing-dancing NHS staff. Death trucks. Overflowing ICUs. Dead Covid babies. Manipulated statistics. Goon squads. Masks. And all the rest of it.

Eight months later, here we are. The Head of the Health Emergencies Program at the WHO has basically confirmed an IFR of 0.14%, approximately the same as the seasonal flu. And here are the latest survival rate estimates from the Center for Disease Control:

Age 0-19 … 99.997%
Age 20-49 … 99.98%
Age 50-69 … 99.5%
Age 70+ … 94.6%

The “science” argument is officially over. An increasing number of doctors and medical experts are breaking ranks and explaining how the current mass hysteria over “cases” (which now includes perfectly healthy people) is essentially meaningless propaganda, for example, in this segment on ARD, one of the big mainstream German TV channels.

And the mandate nazis are still gathering steam. ‘Go spit in a mirror and report back, or wear a mask to show you care” is all that’s left for the gulliable trying to shield themselves from the idea they were mindless members of a cult.

[Rockstar]

https://consentfactory.files.wordpress.com/2020/10/image.png

To be honest the photo on the right is closer to what it looks like when people walk into the shop. Very few wear a mask these days, though there are still some true believers that still wear a mask. But I never see anyone wearing an N95 hmmmm.

[mapuc]

< Please remember that among 10.000.000 citizens around 1.14 million got infected and 14.703 People in Sweden has died with Corona.

I say that's a high number for a country with only 10.000.000 citizens.

Markus

[Rockstar]

No doubt a sad thing to have happen Marcus. but the 14,600 dead account for only 0.14 percent of the population. Not exactly an apocalyptic number. The majority of which (9,700) were aged 80 and older.

[mapuc]

No doubt a sad thing to have happen Marcus. but the 14,600 dead account for only 0.14 percent of the population. Not exactly an apocalyptic number. The majority of which (9,700) were aged 80 and older.

Yes percentage it's not so bad if you compare with USA.. A majority of them was above 80 of age as you mentioned.

Even for an American the number 659.000 dead with Corona is an unbelievable number.

Until some month ago the highest number of dead in USA was the civil war. Now it's the Corona pandemic.

Markus

[Skybird]

Its amazing how short-lived people's memory is.



https://static.dw.com/image/56852596_303.jpg


Does anyone even remember when and where this picture was taken? 4500 dead in three weeks of horror, in a city with 122,000 thousand population and a region with a highly developed medical infrastructure. If it would have gone like that for a whole year, the city would have lost two thirds of its inhabitants.


Bergamo, Italy.



When the hospitals were overflooded with patients, patients got placed outside hospitals to die there, and the obituary notices in the weekly local newspapers filled not just 2-3 pages, but 28 in every edition.



The success of mask wearing and vaccination gets distorted into an argument of why these measures should not have been necessary.


It cannot get any more absurd.

[Rockstar]

Even with all the vaccine, isolation and mask mandates. the deaths in the U.S. we’re only slightly higher than Sweden. Currently at 0.20 percent of the U.S. population again not exactly apocalyptic numbers.

[mapuc]

@ Skybird

The reason to why so many Italian in northern part of the country died from/with corona had something to do with the fact a majority of them was foreigners who didn't speak or understod Italian perfectly. It also had to do with the way they lived-It wasn't unnatural that 10-20 foreigners lived together in a little apartment.

I remember this from an issue in our News Channel.

The same also here in Denmark-The area where the number of infected was/is highest and deadliest was in areas where most foreigners live(d)

Markus

[Arlo]

Well the deaths in the U.S. we’re slightly higher than Sweden. Currently 0.20 percent of the U.S. population again not exactly apocalyptic numbers.

Does it take a variant finally causing what you would admit is 'apocalyptic' to get you to support masks and vaccines? It would be way too late then.

I'll never understand Covid death cults. :shucks:

[Rockstar]

Pffft variants, big whoop. You want to peddle apocalyptic planet destroying end of the world mayhem death and destruction fear. Think 99942 Apophis.

[Rockstar]

Most people have less than a 1 percent chance of dying from COVID. But 99942 Apophis has a 2.7 % chance of wiping out the entire planet Earth.

How’s that for fearporn? Better start building your underground bunker Arlo and don’t forget to build it big so you can invite the neighborhood. You know, to show how much you care about their lives. Don’t forget to have plenty of mirrors so you can conduct those experiments of spitting on mirrors with a mask and without a mask.

[Rockstar]

Fake news strikes again, Democrats, Blue-anon, Russiagate conspiracy theorists, Covidian cult and mandate nazis rejoiced.

https://youtu.be/iDy4gVdMJ-I

[Rockstar]

Six Conditions of Mind Control

1. Keep the person unaware of what is going on and how she or he is being changed a step at a time. Potential new members are led, step by step, through a behavioral-change program without being aware of the final agenda or full content of the group.

Looking back, it is easy to see how people were conditioned, step by step, to accept the “New Normal” ideology. They were bombarded with terrifying propaganda, locked down, stripped of their civil rights, forced to wear medical-looking masks in public, to act out absurd “social-distancing” rituals, submit to constant “testing,” and all the rest of it. Anyone not complying with this behavioral-change program or challenging the veracity and rationality of the new ideology was demonized as a “conspiracy theorist,” a “Covid denier,” an “anti-vaxxer,” in essence, an enemy of the cult, like a “suppresive person” in the Church of Scientology.

2. Control the person’s social and/or physical environment; especially control the person’s time.

For over a year now, the “New Normal” authorities have controlled the social/physical environment, and how New Normals spend their time, with lockdowns, social-distancing rituals, closure of “non-essential” businesses, omnipresent propaganda, isolation of the elderly, travel restrictions, mandatory mask-rules, protest bans, and now the segregation of the “Unvaccinated.” Basically, society has been transformed into something resembling an infectious disease ward, or an enormous hospital from which there is no escape. You’ve seen the photos of the happy New Normals dining out at restaurants, relaxing at the beach, jogging, attending school, and so on, going about their “normal” lives with their medical-looking masks and prophylactic face shields. What you’re looking at is the pathologization of society, the pathologization of everyday life, the physical (social) manifestation of a morbid obsession with disease and death.

3. Systematically create a sense of powerlessness in the person.

What kind of person could feel more powerless than an obedient New Normal sitting at home, obsessively logging the “Covid death” count, sharing photos of his medical-looking mask and post-“vaccination” bandage on Facebook, as he waits for permission from the authorities to go outdoors, visit his family, kiss his lover, or shake hands with a colleague? The fact that in the Covidian Cult the traditional charismatic cult leader has been replaced by a menagerie of medical experts and government officials does not change the utter dependency and abject powerlessness of its members, who have been reduced to a state approaching infancy. This abject powerlessness is not experienced as a negative; on the contrary, it is proudly celebrated. Thus the mantra-like repetition of the “New Normal” platitude “Trust the Science!” by people who, if you try to show them the science, melt down completely and start jabbering aggressive nonsense at you to shut you up.

4. Manipulate a system of rewards, punishments and experiences in such a way as to inhibit behavior that reflects the person’s former social identity.

The point here is the transformation of the formerly basically rational person into an entirely different cult-approved person, in our case, an obedient “New Normal” person. Singer gets into this in greater detail, but her discussion applies mostly to subcultural cults, not to large-scale totalitarian movements. For our purposes, we can fold this into

Condition 5.

5. Manipulate a system of rewards, punishments, and experiences in order to promote learning the group’s ideology or belief system and group-approved behaviors. Good behavior, demonstrating an understanding and acceptance of the group’s beliefs, and compliance are rewarded, while questioning, expressing doubts or criticizing are met with disapproval, redress and possible rejection. If one expresses a question, they are made to feel that there is something inherently wrong with them to be questioning.

OK, I’m going to tell you a little story. It’s a story about a personal experience, which I’m pretty sure you’ve also experienced. It’s a story about a certain New Normal who has been harassing me for several months. I’ll call him Brian Parks, because, well, that’s his name, and I no longer feel any compunction about sharing it.

Brian is a former friend/colleague from the theater world who has gone full “New Normal” and is absolutely furious that I have not. So outraged is Brian that I have not joined the cult that he has been going around on the Internet referring to me as a “conspiracy theorist” and suggesting that I’ve had some kind of nervous breakdown and require immediate psychiatric treatment because I do not believe the official “New Normal” narrative. Now, this would not be a very big deal, except that Brian is impugning my character and attempting to damage my reputation on the Facebook pages of other theater colleagues, which Brian feels entitled to do, given that I am a “Covid denier,” a “conspiracy theorist,” and an “anti-vaxxer,” or whatever, and given the fact that he has the power of the state, the media, etc., on his side.

This is how it works in cults, and in larger totalitarian societies. It isn’t usually the Gestapo that comes for you. It’s usually your friends and colleagues. What Brian is doing is working that system of rewards and punishments to enforce his ideology, because he knows that most of my other colleagues in the theater world have also gone full “New Normal,” or at least are looking the other way and staying silent while it is being implemented.

This tactic, obviously, has backfired on Brian, primarily because I do not give a **** what any New Normals think of me, whether they work in the theater world or anywhere else, but I am in a rather privileged position, because I have accomplished what I wanted to accomplish in the theater, and would rather stick my hand in a blender than submit my novels to corporate publishers for review by “sensitivity readers,” so there isn’t much to threaten me with. That, and I have no children to support, or administrations to answer to (unlike, for example, Mark Crispin Miller, who is currently being persecuted by the “New Normal” administration at NYU).

The point is, this kind of ideological conditioning is happening everywhere, every day, on the job, among friends, even among families. The pressure to conform is intense, because nothing is more threatening to devoted cultists, or members of totalitarian ideological movements, than those who challenge their fundamental beliefs, confront them with facts, or otherwise demonstrate that their “reality” isn’t reality at all, but, rather, a delusional, paranoid fiction.

The key difference between how this works in cults and totalitarian ideological movements is that, usually, a cult is a subcultural group, and thus non-cult-members have the power of the ideology of the dominant society to draw on when resisting the mind-control tactics of the cult, and attempting to deprogram its members … whereas, in our case, this balance of power is inverted. Totalitarian ideological movements have the power of governments, the media, the police, the culture industry, academia, and the compliant masses on their side. And, thus, they do not need to persuade anyone. They have the power to dictate “reality.” Only cults operating in total isolation, like Jim Jones’ People’s Temple in Guyana, enjoy this level of control over their members.

This pressure to conform, this ideological conditioning, must be fiercely resisted, regardless of the consequences, both publicly and in our private lives, or the “New Normal” will certainly become our “reality.” Despite the fact that we “Covid deniers” are currently outnumbered by the Covidian cultists, we need to behave as if we are not, and hold to reality, facts, and real science, and treat the New Normals as exactly what they are, members of a new totalitarian movement, delusional cultists run amok. If we do not, we will get to Singer’s Condition 6 …

6. Put forth a closed system of logic and an authoritarian structure that permits no feedback and refuses to be modified except by leadership approval or executive order. The group has a top-down, pyramid structure. The leaders must have verbal ways of never losing.

We’re not there yet, but that is where we’re headed … global pathologized totalitarianism. So, please, speak up. Call things what they are. Confront the Brians in your life. Despite the fact that they tell themselves that they’re trying to help you “come to your senses” or “see the truth,” or “trust the Science,” they are not. They are cultists, desperately trying to get you to conform to their paranoid beliefs, pressuring you, manipulating you, bullying you, threatening you. Do not engage them on their terms, or let them goad you into accepting their premises. (Once they’ve sucked you into their narrative, they’ve won.) Expose them, confront them with their tactics and their motives. You will probably not change their minds in the least, but your example might help other New Normals whose faith is slipping to begin to recognize what has been done to their minds and break with the cult.

https://consentfactory.org/2021/04/21/the-covidian-cult-part-ii/

[em2nought]

I've gotta go by Tractor Supply and pick up "something". :D

[Dowly]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3vGj03pC2tY

[Jimbuna]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yISH-sCvHXU

[Rockstar]

… Which brings us to the problem of the Covidian cult … how to get through to them, which, make no mistake, we have to do, one way or another, or the New Normal will become our permanent “reality.”

I called the New Normals a “Covidian Cult,” not to gratuitously insult or mock them, but because that is what totalitarianism is … a cult writ large, on a societal scale. Anyone who has tried to get through to them can confirm the accuracy of that analogy. You can show them the facts until you’re blue in the face. It will not make the slightest difference. You think you are having a debate over facts, but you are not. You are threatening their new “reality.” You think you are struggling to get them to think rationally. You are not. What you are is a heretic, an agent of demonic forces, an enemy of all that is “real” and “true.”

The Scientologists would label you a “suppressive person.” The New Normals call you a “conspiracy theorist,” an “anti-vaxxer,” or a “virus denier.” The specific epithets don’t really matter. They are just labels that cult members and totalitarians use to demonize those they perceive as “enemies” … anyone challenging the “reality” of the cult, or the “reality” of the totalitarian system.

The simple fact of the matter is, you can’t talk people out of a cult, and you can’t talk them out of totalitarianism. Usually, what you do, in the case of a cult, is, you get the person out of the cult. You kidnap them, take them to a safehouse or wherever, surround them with a lot of non-cult members, and deprogram them gradually over the course of several days. You do this because, while they are still inside the cult, you cannot get through to them. They cannot hear you. A cult is a collective, self-contained “reality.” Its power flows from the social organism composed of the cult leaders and the other cult members. You cannot “talk” this power away. You have to physically remove the person from it before you can begin to reason with them.

Unfortunately, we do not have this option. The New Normal is a global totalitarian system. There is no “outside” of the system to retreat to. We can’t kidnap everyone and take them to Sweden. As I noted in Part I of this series, the cult/society paradigm has been inverted. The cult has become the dominant society, and those of us who have not been converted have become a collection of isolated islands existing, not outside, but within the cult.

So we need to adopt a different strategy. We need to make the monster show itself, not to those of us who can already see it, but to the New Normal masses, the Covidian cultists. We need to make Jim Jones drop the peace-and-love crap, move into the jungle, and break out the Kool-Aid. We need to make Charles Manson put down his guitar, cancel orgy-time, and go homicidal hippie. This is how you take down a cult from within. You do not try to thwart its progress; you push it toward its logical conclusion. You make it manifest its full expression, because that it when it implodes, and dies. You do not do that by being polite, conciliatory, or avoiding conflict. You do that by generating as much internal conflict within the cult as you can.

In other words, we need to make GloboCap (and its minions) go openly totalitarian … because it can’t. If it could, it would have done so already. Global capitalism cannot function that way. Going openly totalitarian will cause it to implode … no, not global capitalism itself, but this totalitarian version of it. In fact, this is starting to happen already. It needs the simulation of “reality,” and “democracy,” and “normality,” to keep the masses docile. So we need to attack that simulation. We need to hammer on it until it cracks, and the monster hiding within in appears.

That is the weakness of the system … the New Normal totalitarianism will not work if the masses perceive it as totalitarianism, as a political/ideological program, rather than as “a response to a deadly pandemic.” So we need to make it visible as totalitarianism. We need to force the New Normals to see it as what it is. I do not mean that we need to explain it to them. They are beyond the reach of explanations. I mean that we need to make them see it, feel it, tangibly, inescapably, until they recognize what they are collaborating with.

Stop arguing with them (Covidcultists) on their terms, and instead directly attack their “reality.” When they start jabbering about the virus, the variants, the “vaccines,” and all the other Covid cult-speak, do not get sucked into their narrative. Do not respond as if they were rational. Respond as if they were talking about “Xenu,” “body thetans,” “Helter Skelter,” or any other cultoid nonsense, because that it is exactly what it is. Same goes for their rules and restrictions, the “face coverings,” the “social distancing,” and so on. Stop arguing against them on the grounds that they don’t work. Of course they don’t work, but that is not the point (and arguing that way sucks you into their “reality”). Oppose them because of what they are, a collection of bizarre compliance rituals performed to cement allegiance to the cult and create a general atmosphere of “deadly pandemic.”

There are many ways to go about doing this, i.e., generating internal conflict. I have been doing it my way, others are doing it theirs. If you’re one of them, thank you. If you’re not, start. Do it however and wherever you can. Make the New Normals face the monster, the monster they are feeding … the monster they have become.


https://consentfactory.org/2021/09/02/the-covidian-cult-part-iii/


Just a friendly reminder

WHO has basically confirmed an IFR of 0.14%, approximately the same as the seasonal flu. And here are the latest survival rate estimates from the Center for Disease Control:

Age 0-19 … 99.997%
Age 20-49 … 99.98%
Age 50-69 … 99.5%
Age 70+ … 94.6%

I suppose it could have much worse had the African population not been taking Ivermectin for the last decade :D

[Dowly]

Just a friendly reminder

WHO has basically confirmed an IFR of 0.14%, approximately the same as the seasonal flu. And here are the latest survival rate estimates from the Center for Disease Control:

Age 0-19 … 99.997%
Age 20-49 … 99.98%
Age 50-69 … 99.5%
Age 70+ … 94.6%


Viral tweet cites made-up CDC ‘COVID-19 survival rates’ to downplay vaccine:
https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2020/dec/22/tweets/viral-tweet-cites-made-cdc-covid-19-survival-rates/


A tweet said "CDC COVID-19 survival rates" are 99.997% for people ages 0 to 19, 99.98% for people ages 20 to 49, 99.5% for people ages 50 to 69, and 94.6% for people over 70.

The CDC has not released survival rates, and it doesn’t have the data to do so. It’s not clear where the tweet’s numbers came from, but they correspond with figures listed as part of CDC "planning scenarios" used for planning a pandemic response.

We rate this post False.


"gullable morons" :haha:

[Rockstar]

Oh god therein lies the problem to lazy to check the actual source and instead runs to another ‘fact check’ from your favorite politifact COVID cult outlet. Who rate it as false? Why?

Try researching the data found on the CDC and NIH website instead. https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/hcp/planning-scenarios.html. And do keep in mind the date of the article and the updated CDC website.

Btw how’s your science experiment of spitting on mirrors with and without mask on. Are you close to a break through yet? The world is waiting these could be the results everyone is waiting for.

[Dowly]

Oh god therein lies the problem to lazy to check the actual source and instead runs to another ‘fact check’ from your favorite politifact COVID cult outlet. Who rate it as false? Why?

Try researching the data found on the CDC and NIH website instead. https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/hcp/planning-scenarios.html. And do keep in mind the date of the article and the updated CDC website.
Ok, I did. It says this:

The parameters in the Planning Scenarios:


Are estimates intended to support public health preparedness and planning;
Are not predictions of the expected effects of COVID-19;
Do not reflect the impact of any behavioral changes, social distancing, or other interventions; and
Do not reflect the impact of the emergence of novel SARS-CoV-2 variants.




Btw how’s your science experiment of spitting on mirrors with and without mask on. Are you close to a break through yet? The world is waiting these could be the results everyone is waiting for.I was hoping you'd do the experiment, as you are making the claim that masks are useless.

[mapuc]

A Surgical mask and the N95 has a 95 % protection against Virus and 80 % against Bacteria.

95% is a good number, as long you don't stay within 1-2 meters from an infected person for more than 15-20 minutes and this person does not cough towards you, then your Surgical or the N95 will protect you, if you haven't been reusing your facemask over and over and over again.

Markus

[Sean C]

I was talking to my mother on the phone today when I mentioned that I had not gotten the vaccine. She immediately asked me why I was against it. "I'm not.", I said, "I just don't think I need it."

But what I want to know is, given that:


Vaccinated individuals can still contract Covid*. (But the vaccine will likely reduce the severity of symptoms.)
Vaccinated individuals can still spread Covid to others.
Given 1 & 2, the only person actually endangered by me not getting the vaccine is ... me.

Then why should it be anyone else's concern whether or not I get the vaccine? The only possible reason I can think of is what the "experts" said early on: that "In all the history of respiratory-borne viruses of any type, asymptomatic transmission has never been the driver of outbreaks. The driver of outbreaks is always a symptomatic person."† So, unless a person is currently showing symptoms of Covid, it is highly unlikely that they will be the cause of an outbreak. Vaccinated or not.

But if you admit that the above statements are true, you have to admit that almost everything else we've been told cannot be entirely true. And you never admit that, because that might undermine confidence ... which it should.

Pretty much everything we've been told from the start of this is contradictory and none of it makes any real sense, if you think about it. I know that we still do not fully understand this disease and it is better to err on the side of caution. But we still don't fully understand the common cold, either. What I have a big problem with is when we start passing laws and issuing mandates about things we aren't even sure of.

And this "pandemic" is certainly not the only example of that.



* If you research this fact, you may still find some seemingly contradictory information. Some sites simply say that the Covid vaccines - and vaccines in general - will prevent you from getting the disease they were developed for. Other sites admit that it is still possible to get the disease, but the chance is reduced. Still other sites recommend not taking any chances and to continue to wear a mask and social distance ... which I do anyway.

† Dr. Anthony Fauci (https://leakedreality.com/embed/349e537c9c4d427f2614)

[Catfish]

^ to put some things right:
[...] I had not gotten the vaccine. She immediately asked me why I was against it. "I'm not.", I said, "I just don't think I need it."

But what I want to know is, given that:


Vaccinated individuals can still contract Covid*. (But the vaccine will likely reduce the severity of symptoms.)
Vaccinated individuals can still spread Covid to others.
Given 1 & 2, the only person actually endangered by me not getting the vaccine is ... me.

1. Right, but after a vaccination your body respectively your immunosystem already has the blueprint information to produce antibodies, so the system will be instantly able to fight the infection. Symptoms will be much less severe.
-> You cannot kill a virus, because it does not live. You can only kill the host, the bacteria in which the virus replicates. So the immunosystem targets infected cells and bacteria and destroys them, keeping the number of viruses low since the latter cannot replicate in masses anymore.
-> What is a virus (https://www.onhealth.com/content/1/viral_infections)

2. Yes they can still infect others. BUT they will be less contagious since the virus numbers and the time of being contagious is greatly reduced by the fast immuno answer.
Time of carrying the infection and being infectious, the reduced infection pressure on others by lower virus numbers, it all adds to the vaccine effect.

3. This is why 1 and 2 matter. It is not only you being endangered, but your time of being contagious is extended.
Vaccines don't just protect you, they also help other people stay healthy around you - especially old people, young people and people who can't get vaccinated themselves, like those undergoing chemotherapy. This is called herd immunity, and it effects the health of everybody - not just you.

To get this virus back to such small numbers that it is practically extinct (like we wre able to with the Polio vaccinations), we need at least 80 percent of the population being vaccinated.

If not, the virus will go on replicating en masse in the non-vaccinated, infecting others and worst (leading to the main big problem): be able to mutate and mutate (read adapt) again to find other less protected cells and bacteria to breed in; finally being able to overcome the human immunosystem in a way that it is not longer able to protect.
You are prolonging this mess, you are enabling the virus to adapt in the long run. It is because of this it will still be striving in 2022, and maybe forever.
Pretty much everything we've been told from the start of this is contradictory and none of it makes any real sense
If you research this fact, you may still find some seemingly contradictory information.Which "fact"? What Fox News or Trump tell you? No way. There are always statistical outliers, vaccines do work.
In the 1960's smallpox was responsible for millions of deaths, but just two decades later it was completely eradicated due to an aggressive vaccine campaign.

I do not understand how people with at least a bit of biological education are drawing false conclusions from obvious evidence.
So no, I do not admit those statements of you are true.

[Sean C]

Which "fact"?


The one with the asterisk after it, which refers to the statement with the asterisk before it. The one you completely agreed to here:


^ to put some things right:
1. Right, but after a vaccination your body respectively your immunosystem already has the blueprint information to produce antibodies, so the system will be instantly able to fight the infection. Symptoms will be much less severe.
-> You cannot kill a virus, because it does not live. You can only kill the host, the bacteria in which the virus replicates. So the immunosystem targets infected cells and bacteria and destroys them, keeping the number of viruses low since the latter cannot replicate in masses anymore.
-> What is a virus (https://www.onhealth.com/content/1/viral_infections)

2. Yes they can still infect others. BUT they will be less contagious since the virus numbers and the time of being contagious is greatly reduced by the fast immuno answer.
Time of carrying the infection and being infectious, the reduced infection pressure on others by lower virus numbers, it all adds to the vaccine effect. ...


Okay. And what about those people who have contracted Covid, recovered, and developed a natural immunity?

[3catcircus]

I was talking to my mother on the phone today when I mentioned that I had not gotten the vaccine. She immediately asked me why I was against it. "I'm not.", I said, "I just don't think I need it."

But what I want to know is, given that:


Vaccinated individuals can still contract Covid*. (But the vaccine will likely reduce the severity of symptoms.)
Vaccinated individuals can still spread Covid to others.
Given 1 & 2, the only person actually endangered by me not getting the vaccine is ... me.

Then why should it be anyone else's concern whether or not I get the vaccine? The only possible reason I can think of is what the "experts" said early on: that "In all the history of respiratory-borne viruses of any type, asymptomatic transmission has never been the driver of outbreaks. The driver of outbreaks is always a symptomatic person."† So, unless a person is currently showing symptoms of Covid, it is highly unlikely that they will be the cause of an outbreak. Vaccinated or not.

But if you admit that the above statements are true, you have to admit that almost everything else we've been told cannot be entirely true. And you never admit that, because that might undermine confidence ... which it should.

Pretty much everything we've been told from the start of this is contradictory and none of it makes any real sense, if you think about it. I know that we still do not fully understand this disease and it is better to err on the side of caution. But we still don't fully understand the common cold, either. What I have a big problem with is when we start passing laws and issuing mandates about things we aren't even sure of.

And this "pandemic" is certainly not the only example of that.



* If you research this fact, you may still find some seemingly contradictory information. Some sites simply say that the Covid vaccines - and vaccines in general - will prevent you from getting the disease they were developed for. Other sites admit that it is still possible to get the disease, but the chance is reduced. Still other sites recommend not taking any chances and to continue to wear a mask and social distance ... which I do anyway.

† Dr. Anthony Fauci (https://leakedreality.com/embed/349e537c9c4d427f2614)

I'll just leave you with my own experience. I'm currently 8 days post start of covid symptoms.

My wife and I were vaccinated (Pfizer). Our 15 year old son and 12 year old daughter were not. They're both athletes in great physical shape. My wife and I are older and in not as good a shape with high blood pressure controlled by medication. My son got a double ear infection (testing negative for covid) that was getting better once he was prescribed the right antibiotic and he resumed going to football practice. Then he started feeling worse. Back to the doctor and another covid test - this time is positive. Into isolation he goes while we waited for those results - that was 2 Thursdays ago. Since my wife and I are vaccinated, we don't have to quarantine - just wear a mask indoors and look for symptoms. Friday evening before last, my wife gets home from work and says she thinks she's getting a migraine from the stress of first day back in the classroom. Saturday morning she and my daughter both wake up with with cold symptoms and go to the urgent care to get tested. Sunday morning before last, I wake up with same symptoms and go off and get tested. By the time I got home from the doctors office, I had already lost my sense of taste and smell. We all tested positive. The kids - it was like a cold.

Me and my wife? Symptoms were slightly different - I was mostly clogged sinuses, low grade fever, and cough due to post nasal drip. She had higher fever and worse cough. Then, in around day 3 of symptoms is when we both got shortness of breath, dizziness and fatigue. No issues taking deep breaths, but obviously the O2 saturation is not where it should be - it was around 95% instead of my normal 98%. I had that for 3 days. My wife and daughter got tested in Saturday and had results on Monday - and my wife got Monoclonal Antibodies on Tuesday. My results came on Tuesday but I had to wait to get the Monoclonal Antibodies because the schedule was full. I got them last Friday and the next day I felt much better without the shortness of breath. At this point, I have a lingering cough and my taste and smell haven't yet returned.

Bottom line - getting covid sucks. If we had not been vaccinated, we'd probably have been in the hospital. If you're even slightly overweight, or have high blood pressure or diabetes, or any other type of circulatory or respiratory issue, you don't want to get it. If I had not gotten the shortness of breath, I would not have even thought twice since it was otherwise like any other cold I've ever gotten. But that shortness of breath came on suddenly and it just went in waves of it followed by feeling no shortness of breath. I actually had less shortness of breath by moving around rather than sitting down.

Absolutely, vaccination should be your choice, but don't fool yourself that you're in tip-top health if you aren't. You don't have to be 400 lbs - literally carrying an extra 15-20 pounds could be the difference in symptoms. Likewise, if you are taking medicine for high blood pressure to keep it in the normal range - you still have high blood pressure.

"Mild" symptoms can mean anything from a headache or the sniffles to full-blown AIDS levels of feeling awful - just short of needing to be hospitalized. It all depends on your individual physiology.

Your chances of getting COVID aren't all that great in most situations. But when you bring it home, you're likely going to get it. 6 days from first person showing symptoms to last person showing symptoms. And we were isolating "patient zero" from his start of symptoms while waiting for his test results. He's already back in school after clearing his 10 days (it's day 13 for him due to the weekend). Lucky for him, he only had a fever for a day, otherwise he would have had to get an EKG due to concerns over myocarditis before being allowed back to sports.

[Catfish]

[...] Okay. And what about those people who have contracted Covid, recovered, and developed a natural immunity?
I read natural immunity is not quite as good as with those vaccinated, which especially applies to the new line of mutations wave 3 and 4. You have to understand to fight this infection 'naturally' from zero their body had to do more, energy and wearout-wise. In comparison the vaccine is only a light touch that makes your system alert.
And however, you acquire this "natural" immunity by actually getting the real disease/getting the impact without a prepared system.

If i were to compare this to Polio or Smallpox or other virus diseases that have been made extinct by herd immunisation and a strict vaccine policy in the past, would it be better to get Polio than it would be to get vaccinated for polio – because you think after getting polio you will be better protected (which is doubtful) from polio in the future (in case of survival of course)?
In case of this virus it is of course more obvious, if your kid is to spend the rest of his life maimed in a wheelchair because the nervous system was destroyed by this poly-myelitis virus, your kid may not be so thankful.

I take it the vaccinated gets the same immunity, only that his immunosystem achieved this with a lot less wear and tear and a probably shortened life. If you survive it naturally even with mild symptoms, there are scars.


OT: It is not only the virus. The virus of course destroys the cells it replicates in, in the end. The cell is being ripped apart by the masses of viruses released in the virulent stage. And all those virusses are infesting new cells exponentially; so an infection getting out of hand and spreading to e.g. heart/liver/lung cell tissue can kill you. This virus is by no way limited to lung tissue, you can get it anywhere in your body, and it may spread anywhere.

Another problem is your immunosystem itself. Imagine you get covid, and it does hit a bit more heavily: your immunosystem may well be up to fight it by destroying the cells the viruses breed in, ok.

But this system may also over-react, and it can get as far as it destroys a bit too much of your cells just because it "thinks" it has to. In this case you own overreacting immunosystem may kill you. Which is what mine is currently trying to do to me, though not covid-related here.

Anyone with a computer and access to the internet can inform himself on reputable sites and honest searching, so .. just do yourself a favour.


OOT still have a lot of questions to ask you about navigation, so it is of course totally egoistic of me to wish you all the best, whatever your decision may be ;)

[Arlo]

https://scontent-hou1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.6435-9/p526x296/115822491_10217427378252312_2994692407085467121_n. jpg?_nc_cat=1&ccb=1-5&_nc_sid=8bfeb9&_nc_ohc=NdCa-ssQ_yIAX-DIHxL&_nc_ht=scontent-hou1-1.xx&oh=b3ccb656c958cffa4b82425923228b2c&oe=61660FC0

[Arlo]

COVID-19 vaccines are still highly effective at protecting people from getting really sick or dying. But breakthrough infections can happen, especially with the delta variant. And it's becoming increasingly clear that unvaccinated people can develop long COVID symptoms, even from mild cases.

Like millions of others, Kathleen Hipps thought she was safe from COVID-19 after she got two shots of the Moderna vaccine last spring. So she figured she just had a summer cold when she got the sniffles in July. But then she opened some Vick's VapoRub.

"Anyone who's ever smelled Vick's VapoRub knows how pungent of a smell it is. And I couldn't smell it. And that's how I knew I had COVID," says Hipps, 40, a Los Angeles lawyer who has two young sons.

And sure enough, Hipps tested positive. "I got very sick. I was very tired, very congested — could barely get out of bed. I couldn't work at all. I had to find colleagues to cover my work for me. And I just spent the next week basically in bed, completely isolated from my family," she says.

Hipps never ran a fever, though, and did not have bad head or body aches. She started feeling better after about a week, tested negative and went back to working from home and caring for her family. She thought she was fully recovered.

"And I was in my mom's new car and all of a sudden I felt burning. And I thought there was something wrong with her car," she says.

Wherever she moved her foot, she could still feel the burning sensation. And then her other foot started burning too. It felt like she was walking on hot coals, she says.

I've learned that this is neuropathy, and this a common symptom of long COVID," Hipps says.

Long COVID is a poorly defined, poorly understood condition that occurs when COVID-19 patients' symptoms won't go away for weeks or months, or new ones emerge just when they think they're all better.

More than six weeks after it started, Hipps still experiences the burning sensation every day, as well as tingling and numbness in her hands.

Sometimes the numbness is so bad she can't push her baby's stroller. Her periods are really heavy. And work tires her out so fast now that she has to take lots of breaks.

"I'm really scared. I mean I'm really scared that there are things that are going on with me that I'm going to have to deal with for the rest of my life," Hipps says.

Now it's really important to stress that the COVID-19 vaccines are still highly effective at protecting people from getting really sick or dying, and are still quite good at keeping most people from even catching the virus or getting mildly ill.

But breakthrough infections can happen, especially with the delta variant. And it's becoming increasingly clear that unvaccinated people can develop long COVID symptoms, even from mild cases.

"We've seen that with the infection itself in the unvaccinated individuals about 30% of those individuals continue to have these long-haul COVID symptoms," says Dr. Avindra Nath, who is studying long COVID at the National Institutes of Health.

So the concern is whether vaccinated people who get infected may be at risk for long COVID too, Nath says.

"I think that's a good question," he says.

A small Israeli study recently provided the first evidence that breakthrough infections could lead to long COVID symptoms, although the numbers are small. Out of about 1,500 vaccinated health care workers, 39 got infected, and seven reported symptoms that lasted more than six weeks.

And a large British study subsequently found about 5% of people who got infected — even though they were fully vaccinated — experienced persistent symptoms, although the study also found that the odds of having symptoms for 28 days or more were halved by having two vaccine doses.

"I think it's a reasonable concern. But it's too early. I think we need to follow these patients. It's quite recent that they've been recognized. So at the moment we don't have that answer," Nath says, adding that if there is a risk, he suspects it's probably very low.

Some infectious disease experts remain highly skeptical that long COVID from breakthrough infections is a big problem.

"Pathophysiologically, it's quite unlikely to get long COVID from a breakthrough infection," says Dr. Monica Gandhi, an infectious disease researcher at the University of California, San Francisco.

That's because the immune response generated by the vaccine would prevent the virus from taking hold in the body or triggering a harmful overreaction by the immune system, Gandhi says.

"I think it is absolutely not impossible, but pathophysiologically it is less likely," she says.

Other researchers are convinced the problem is real.

"Categorically I can say that we have already been seeing a handful of cases of long COVID from breakthrough infection," says David Putrino, who studies long COVID at Mount Sinai.

"We need to behave as though there is the same chance as always of developing long COVID from a mild-to-asymptomatic infection because once you have it you can't unring that bell and you're looking at months to years of illness," Putrino says. Putrino is working with Akiko Iwasaki, an immunologist at Yale University, to try to understand how breakthrough infections can lead to persistent symptoms.

Iwasaki says some people may experience long COVID because the virus is still hiding in the body. In others, it may be that their immune systems overreact to the virus — a so-called autoimmune response.

"We know that the vaccine induces a robust immune response to quickly clear the virus during breakthrough infections," Iwasaki says. "And that suggests to me that autoimmunity may be the culprit there."

Even if breakthrough infections can lead to long COVID, others say there are also plenty of other reasons vaccinated people should continue to keep being careful to avoid catching the virus.

"At the end of the day, my biggest concern honestly is not that I'm going to get long COVID," says Dr. Carlos del Rio, an infectious disease researcher at Emory University. "It's that I'm going to bring COVID and give it to someone else. I mean, I have a young granddaughter. If I get infected, I could give it to her. I'm more concerned that people who are vaccinated can get infected and transmit to others."

For her part, Hipps hopes her symptoms don't plague her for months or even years.

"It's scary because there's obviously a lot of things we don't know about this virus and I'm scared about these long-term implications on my body."

Still, she is glad she got the vaccine. She knows it probably kept her out of the hospital and kept her alive.

https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2021/09/13/1032844687/what-we-know-about-breakthrough-infections-and-long-covid?utm_campaign=npr&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_term=nprnews&utm_medium=social&fbclid=IwAR2td268G0r1-uk5LE1YuC4FUekQapQ6BIFd16zB6Par8ixVZfCCgiTMpKY

[Jimbuna]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uUoWSfN3xo8

[Jimbuna]

The UK’s four Chief Medical Officers have recommended all children aged 12-15 should be vaccinated against Covid.

They have agreed that children of those ages should be given one dose of the Pfizer vaccine to help prevent education being disrupted.

A final decision on rollout will be taken by ministers in the four nations of the UK

The UK recorded 30,825 new coronavirus cases on Monday, and 61 deaths within 28 days of a positive test.

Boris Johnson confirms he'll announce his Covid winter strategy on Tuesday, saying he'll be "setting it all out tomorrow"

The PM says he's "very confident in the steps that we've taken" but won't rule out a winter lockdown.

Labour leader Sir Keir Starmer says nobody wants another lockdown and the best way to avoid it is to be cautious and use practical measures.

And Sir Keir says he will back vaccinations for 12 to 15-year-olds if the scientific advice is that it's safe.

French vaccine maker Valneva says the UK government has scrapped a deal for its Covid vaccine.

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/L6z9Z9Ct/120525509-uk-card-with-vax-2doses-12sep-nc.png (https://postimg.cc/4mxkDgTy)

[Sean C]

Bottom line - getting covid sucks.

I read natural immunity is not quite as good as with those vaccinated, which especially applies to the new line of mutations wave 3 and 4. You have to understand to fight this infection 'naturally' from zero their body had to do more, energy and wearout-wise. In comparison the vaccine is only a light touch that makes your system alert.
And however, you acquire this "natural" immunity by actually getting the real disease/getting the impact without a prepared system.

Around late February of 2020, I became ill. I mean really, really ill. Fever, chills, cold sweats, body aches ... you name it. I don't often get ill, but this was as bad if not worse than I've ever been. I could not eat or drink more than a few sips every hour or so. It lasted for about three days, during which I laid on the couch. I told my wife that if I didn't start feeling better, I was going to the emergency room. Of course, this was right before Covid made headlines, so I had no idea what might be going on.

Anyway, I got better and I haven't had a problem since (other than coughing up a very small amount of phlegm now and then - but I'm also a smoker). I was classed as an "essential worker", so I worked as usual through this whole thing. I supervised about 100 people, many of whom contracted Covid. And I was in contact with hundreds of other people every day. I think I mentioned before that one former co-worker and dear friend of mine died. But I have not been ill since February, 2020.

I have no known health conditions right now (except migraines, which I've always had). I take no prescribed medications. I am still not sure if what I had back then was Covid. But I'd be honestly surprised if I did not have the antibodies in my system. From what I've read about both the vaccine and the "boosters", I don't see them as being either superior or inferior to natural immunity.

The main point of what I wrote was that I don't have a problem with this or any other vaccine. I think it makes sense for some people to get it. What I do have a problem with is legislation based on incomplete information.


OOT still have a lot of questions to ask you about navigation, so it is of course totally egoistic of me to wish you all the best, whatever your decision may be ;)

Thank you! You, as well. And please do ask. Believe it or not, almost no one does.

[3catcircus]

Around late February of 2020, I became ill. I mean really, really ill. Fever, chills, cold sweats, body aches ... you name it. I don't often get ill, but this was as bad if not worse than I've ever been. I could not eat or drink more than a few sips every hour or so. It lasted for about three days, during which I laid on the couch. I told my wife that if I didn't start feeling better, I was going to the emergency room. Of course, this was right before Covid made headlines, so I had no idea what might be going on.

Anyway, I got better and I haven't had a problem since (other than coughing up a very small amount of phlegm now and then - but I'm also a smoker). I was classed as an "essential worker", so I worked as usual through this whole thing. I supervised about 100 people, many of whom contracted Covid. And I was in contact with hundreds of other people every day. I think I mentioned before that one former co-worker and dear friend of mine died. But I have not been ill since February, 2020.

I have no known health conditions right now (except migraines, which I've always had). I take no prescribed medications. I am still not sure if what I had back then was Covid. But I'd be honestly surprised if I did not have the antibodies in my system. From what I've read about both the vaccine and the "boosters", I don't see them as being either superior or inferior to natural immunity.

The main point of what I wrote was that I don't have a problem with this or any other vaccine. I think it makes sense for some people to get it. What I do have a problem with is legislation based on incomplete information.




Thank you! You, as well. And please do ask. Believe it or not, almost no one does.

I said the same thing, but then I did some more research. They have given the mRNA vaccines to enough people now, that we know the risks of adverse effects. Even with the swine flu in 76 or the polio vaccines to start with, they knew within a few months of problems before halting and reformulating. There really aren't any vaccines that have adverse effects that show up decades later. The most likely serious adverse effects are anaphylactic shock - typically within minutes. Some student-athletes may want to wait to the off-season over risks of myocarditis, but the risk is something like 9x less getting it from the vaccines than getting it from getting covid.

I still think it should be personal choice, but the data set at this point is large enough that I'm comfortable taking them and giving them to my kids.

NovaVax might be your preference once it starts being used here since it uses a "traditional" vaccine deliver method.

Since I've been vaxed and then got it, I'm probably in almost the best position, immunity-wise. Data is showing that recovering from it and then getting one dose is the best level of immunity.

[Arlo]

https://scontent-dfw5-2.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/p526x296/241933810_4591300314254253_5604387508999336386_n.j pg?_nc_cat=107&ccb=1-5&_nc_sid=730e14&_nc_ohc=sCp08R-BjHEAX9HqeVE&tn=yPGLy6ZxJ6pwdDM0&_nc_ht=scontent-dfw5-2.xx&oh=0974bbced9f96f99e08e2a0b6311cd59&oe=614421DF

[Sean C]

"What a field-day for the heat
A thousand people in the street
Singing songs and carrying signs
Mostly say, hooray for our side


It's time we stop, hey, what's that sound Everybody look what's going down"


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gp5JCrSXkJY

[Rockstar]

I had COVID twice once before I was vaccinated and again after I was vaccinated. According to the CDC I had a half a percent chance of dying. Oh and by the way the second time was Delta last month, and what a miserable week that was I absolutely exhausted, messed up my taste buds too. I was already feeling like crap but didn’t think nothing of it until I realized whatever it was was messed up my taste. That’s when it occurred to me it was might be COVID. A bottle of water tasted metallic, nothing tasted the same. But why COVID so many times? I work in retail automotive I interact with hundreds of customers each day. Some wear face coverings some, including me, don’t.

Virus protection.

Wuhan institute lab workers.

https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2020/04/09/17/27007592-8204707-image-m-26_1586450116317.jpg

U.S. armed forces. Know your MOPP levels for biological threats.

https://www.globalsecurity.org/military/library/report/1997/mopp/image1.gif

This just in COVIDcult science has just proven you can’t spit on mirrors while wearing a face covering. Wear a face covering to protect our mirrors.

https://www.the-sun.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/6/2020/04/NINTCHDBPICT000578858335-e1587672871893.jpg?w=620

Or don’t

https://cdn.summit.news/2020/10/091020pelosi1.jpg

[mapuc]

This spit test in front of a mirror does not show if you are fully protected.

Yes it stops huge and medium sized droplets but the small micro drops pass through.

Furthermore even a simpel tissue,towel or scarf stops these huge and medium sized droplets

I do NOT say you shouldn't wear these N95 or Type IIR(surgical) mask.

They have a good protection-95 % against virus.

Markus

[Rockstar]

This spit test in front of a mirror does not show if you are fully protected.

Yes it stops huge and medium sized droplets but the small micro drops pass through.

Furthermore even a simpel tissue,towel or scarf stops these huge and medium sized droplets

I do NOT say you shouldn't wear these N95 or Type IIR(surgical) mask.

They have a good protection-95 % against virus.

Markus

No, N95 masks were NEVER intended to defend against a virus. They are intended to protect people from inhaling 95% of particles 3.0 microns or larger. Virus are sometimes carried by those particles and then become trapped in the masks filter that’s a good thing. But there are no guarantees and it also turns your mask into a breeding ground and if the wearer is untrained in their use may still infect themselves.

[mapuc]

No, N95 masks were NEVER intended to defend against a virus. They are intended to protect people from inhaling 95% of particles 3.0 microns or larger. Virus are sometimes carried by those particles and then become trapped in the masks filter that’s a good thing. But there are no guarantees and it also turns your mask into a breeding ground and if the wearer is untrained in their use may still infect themselves.

Ok I was wrong.
I based my comment on what I once read about the size on these droplets from a person who sneeze-They have sizes from viewable to so small you only can see them in a microscope.

I think that these 5 % covers these very very small droplets.

Edit
Sometimes I act before thinking-so I made a search "sneeze in a facemask" and found following

"
The most common method of spread for respiratory viruses like the one that causes COVID-19 is through respiratory droplet transmission, in which virus-laden droplets are propelled from an infected person directly onto the mucosal surfaces (found in the nose, mouth, and eyes) of a host. These droplets can also linger in the air and on surfaces.

Cloth face masks help prevent the spread of COVID-19 from sick or asymptomatically infected persons. They also protect the mask wearer from being exposed to as many viral particles, which can reduce the odds of someone getting sick if they’re near a person with COVID-19.

It’s critically important to wear a face mask to prevent the spread of germs. An October 2020 study published in the journal Nature Medicine suggests that widespread use of masks could prevent nearly 130,000 of 500,000 COVID-related death experts estimate will occur by March 2021 in the United States.

However, it’s not guaranteed that a mask will capture every respiratory droplet when someone coughs or sneeze
"
End edit

Markus

[AVGWarhawk]

Ok I was wrong.
I based my comment on what I once read about the size on these droplets from a person who sneeze-They have sizes from viewable to so small you only can see them in a microscope.

I think that these 5 % covers these very very small droplets.

Edit
Sometimes I act before thinking-so I made a search "sneeze in a facemask" and found following

"
The most common method of spread for respiratory viruses like the one that causes COVID-19 is through respiratory droplet transmission, in which virus-laden droplets are propelled from an infected person directly onto the mucosal surfaces (found in the nose, mouth, and eyes) of a host. These droplets can also linger in the air and on surfaces.

Cloth face masks help prevent the spread of COVID-19 from sick or asymptomatically infected persons. They also protect the mask wearer from being exposed to as many viral particles, which can reduce the odds of someone getting sick if they’re near a person with COVID-19.

It’s critically important to wear a face mask to prevent the spread of germs. An October 2020 study published in the journal Nature Medicine suggests that widespread use of masks could prevent nearly 130,000 of 500,000 COVID-related death experts estimate will occur by March 2021 in the United States.

However, it’s not guaranteed that a mask will capture every respiratory droplet when someone coughs or sneeze
"
End edit

Markus


I'm a supporter of mask usage. It is just one of the tools in our toolbox. Is it the strongest tool to help not contract or spread COVID? No but it is still a good tool.

[Jimbuna]

Covid remains a risk, warns Boris Johnson, but says UK better placed to deal with it.

Johnson was setting out plan for tackling Covid over winter in a briefing with Chris Whitty and Sir Patrick Vallance.

Rollout of booster jab for over 50s and younger vulnerable adults to start next week.

PM adds he can't 'rule out completely' the possibility of mandating vaccine passports.

Mandatory face masks and working from home may be necessary if the NHS is overwhelmed.

UK reports 26,628 cases on Tuesday and 185 deaths within 28 days of a positive test.

Meanwhile, children aged 12 to 15 across the UK will be offered one dose of the Pfizer-BioNTech Covid jab, the government says.

Invitations for the vaccine will begin next week and parental consent will be sought for the programme, which is based in schools.

It follows advice from the UK's chief medical officers, who say the jab will help to reduce disruption to education.

Elsewhere, job vacancies have hit a record high as the economic recovery continues and the furlough scheme starts to wind down.

[Jimbuna]

https://i.postimg.cc/mk5SfP6K/120563311-uk-card-with-vax-2doses-14sep-nc.png (https://postimg.cc/Zv6N65mL)

[Jimbuna]

Covid booster jabs will begin to be offered across the UK from next week.

Health Secretary Sajid Javid said he had accepted advice from the JCVI that around 30m people should be offered a third dose - Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland have followed suit.

The booster should be given at least six months after a second dose - with the Pfizer jab recommended.

Those eligible include over-50s, younger adults with health conditions and frontline health and care workers.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-58550833

[Arlo]

https://scontent-hou1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.6435-9/p526x296/242030507_382063616788570_1095996482294770299_n.jp g?_nc_cat=1&ccb=1-5&_nc_sid=730e14&_nc_ohc=KQS_nBEAUv8AX-D_F8Z&_nc_ht=scontent-hou1-1.xx&oh=fefb44b0b3bd72b1b1eaa7e1d63e4b22&oe=6164C1AE

[Rockstar]

I say we make those fat ass lazy and or diabetic do nothings start exercising. That too will increase their survival chance for heart disease, stroke, COVID, Flu and multitude of other health problems.

Let’s go America morning walk run and excercise program starts tomorrow early. It’s for your own good. Don’t be a bunch whiny brat neer-do-wells. Put the donuts down turn off the tv and come outside and do something productive with your life.

[Arlo]

I say we make those fat ass lazy and or diabetic do nothings start exercising. That too will increase their survival chance for heart disease, stroke, COVID, Flu and multitude of other health problems.

Let’s go America morning walk run and excercise program starts tomorrow early. It’s for your own good. Don’t be a bunch whiny brat neer-do-wells. Put the donuts down turn off the tv and come outside and do something productive with your life.

Yeah ,yeah. We should throw all wheelchair bound people on the ground and make them crawl until they walk then walk until they run then run until they flap their arms and fly.

https://www.wlox.com/2021/08/11/watch-live-health-dept-covid-surge-miss/

https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/conditions-and-diseases/coronavirus/coronavirus-and-covid-19-younger-adults-are-at-risk-too

https://account.charlotteobserver.com/paywall/subscriber-only?resume=249019270&intcid=ab_archive

https://www.advisory.com/en/daily-briefing/2020/04/13/covid-young-people

https://www.usnews.com/news/best-states/alabama/articles/2021-08-21/nobody-should-go-through-this-delta-variant-hits-young

[Skybird]

Neither adipositas nor obesity type 2 get tackled by excercising. Just saying. You torment fat or diabetic people in vein there.

I am not arguing that one should not excercise if one feels like it, and that it cannot do positive effects for other health variables. It does. But battling adipositas and diabetic type 2 efficiently is not amongst them.

Stop eating on many opportunities a day, and that includes snacking. Eat only twice or even just once a day. Dramatically reduce carbohydrates. Do not exaggerate protein. Sort out bad fats, focus on good fats. Eating good fats - makes you thin. ;) Avoid "lite fat" products. avoid sweeteners. Do not go all vegan or all vegetarian. Avoid meat form animals fed with Omega-6 enriching stuff (soy, corn, wheat). East fat fish, and often. No sugar and sweet, worse: fructose, worse: corn syrup, the worst: high fructose corn syrup (HFCS, this at the latest should be rated as a most toxic poison: it kills, and faster than any other sugar).

Reduce frequency and amplitude of insuline spikes. Thats is the Alpha and Omega of it. Insulkine is what makes oyu fat, and makes you diabetic (obviously I am not talking about diabetes type 1, which is something totally different).

See my Health thread. Its all in there.

[Rockstar]

I thought of all people here you would be happy about that. Plus, I didn’t say wheel chair bound or elderly. I said the fat overweight lazy ones who sit in front of their TV eating Cheetos all day. If only we could make them be socially responsible by mandating nationwide exercise programs. It would increase their chances of surviving heart disease, stroke, cancer and COVID. And we will make them wear masks too because you know that’s for their own good too. They’re just petulant children that need adult supervision, what’s wrong with that?.

Win win. Clean mirrors, bringing insurance rates and hospital expenses down. Making more beds available for gun shot auto accident victims. And teaching others how to be socially responsible and lead a lean healthy life style.

[Arlo]

I thought of all people here you would be happy about that. Plus, I didn’t say wheel chair bound or elderly. I said the fat overweight lazy ones who sit in front of their TV eating Cheetos all day. If only we could make them be socially responsible by mandating nationwide exercise programs. It would increase their chances of surviving heart disease, stroke, cancer and COVID. And we will make them wear masks too because you know that’s for their own good.

Win win. Clean mirrors, bringing insurance rates and hospital expenses down. Making more beds available for gun shot auto accident victims. And teaching others how to be socially responsible and lead a lean healthy life style.

Who said I wasn't happy? You sounded very Michelle Obamaesque. I was just adding more to your brilliant plan. Of course, we all know, without a doubt, that if everyone was in tip top athletic condition nobody would die from Covid. Ever. That is, unless you read and believed the articles I linked. :shucks:

[Skybird]

I thought of all people here you would be happy about that. Plus, I didn’t say wheel chair bound or elderly. I said the fat overweight lazy ones who sit in front of their TV eating Cheetos all day. If only we could make them be socially responsible by mandating nationwide exercise programs. It would increase their chances of surviving heart disease, stroke, cancer and COVID. And we will make them wear masks too because you know that’s for their own good too. They’re just petulant children that need adult supervision, what’s wrong with that?.

Win win. Clean mirrors, bringing insurance rates and hospital expenses down. Making more beds available for gun shot auto accident victims. And teaching others how to be socially responsible and lead a lean healthy life style.
Again, excercising does not make realyl fat people thinner, nor does it cure diabtes. only avodiing insuline spikes does so.

You want to tackle their issues, overweight and diabetes? Dont sent them jogging, but teach them on better eating and what is good and what is poisonous food. Most stuff in supermarkets, including what you mentioned as exmaples, should be considered as a health hazard. It makes you fat, it turns you diabetic. Highly processed industrial "food" (waste is a better name). Trans fats. The listed sugars. "Plant oils" (that indeed are seed oils, not plant oils).

Teach them on food. Teach them to eat better. Teach them how to avoid many and high insuline spikes. Teach them moderation.


Soft drinks, smoothies, with sugar or sweeteners, it does not matter that much: should be considered a taboo.

[Rockstar]

Who said I wasn't happy? You sounded very Michelle Obamaesque. I was just adding more to your brilliant plan. Of course, we all know, without a doubt, that if everyone was in tip top athletic condition nobody would die from Covid. Ever. That is, unless you read and believed the articles I linked. :shucks:

I never said nobody wouldn’t die, it’s a fact every one eventually dies from a multitude of ailments and just plain old age. I said exercise would decrease risk and increase survivability of the leading cause of death, Heart disease, Stroke and Cancer. If Biden really cared he would mandate exercise too. Teach those fat lazy little children about good health.

[Arlo]

I never said nobody wouldn’t die, it’s a fact every one eventually dies from a multitude of ailments and just plain old age. I said exercise would decrease risk and increase survivability of the leading cause of death, Heart disease, Stroke and Cancer. If Biden really cared he would mandate exercise too. Teach those fat lazy little children about good health.

Alas, exercise doesn't help against Covid as much a masking, social distancing and vaccination. But being healthier does have its benefits. Perhaps you should start a 'Rockstar's National Exercise Program (because he cares, he really really cares)' thread. :shucks:

[mapuc]

@Skybird

I thought it was a combination of
Eating healthy food, varied food and exercise

Markus

[Arlo]

@Skybird

I thought it was a combination of
Eating healthy food, varied food and exercise

Markus

Varied or not, healthy food, first and foremost (eliminate sugar and even sugar substitutes and for various other health issues, eliminate salt and fats). Exercise helps. Regrettably, not everyone can take as much advantage of exercise as they'd like (exercise modified to their capability doesn't hurt, however).

[Rockstar]

It’s a combination of mental attitude , adjustments in diet, and what you do with your time. Mandate exercise equals less time in front of TV drinking soda and eating Cheetos. Better chance of living a long life no matter what it throws at you.

Is your bed stand littered with cookies, , bottles of prescription meds and face coverings made from an old TV Guide?

Mine isn’t I have a lamp and a book. I work five days a week and venture into the wild every chance I get. Walk, bicycle eat healthy with a treat once in awhile. I am not fully vaccinated, I don’t wear a mask, had COVID, and life goes on.

Proof if we mandate exercise for the lazy slobs they would do better when faced with cold, flu, COVID, cancer, heart disease or a bad case of lard ass

[Arlo]

May it continue to. Thanks for the 'I hate needles and masks PSA.' Carry on. :shucks:

[Rockstar]

Pay attention now I am not fully vaccinated because I declined the second because of an adverse reaction. Even my doctor agreed.

Nor do I hate masks. In fact I am in no way bothered by them so feel free to wear one anytime you want.