Wuhan virus 2020

[Onkel Neal]

Wuhan virus
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/coronavirus-china-wuhan-latest/2020/01/23/2dc947a8-3d45-11ea-afe2-090eb37b60b1_story.html

As the uncertainty continued, Guan, the virologist who identified SARS, offered a chilling perspective on the outbreak.

“I’ve seen it all: bird flu, SARS, influenza A, swine fever and the rest. But the Wuhan pneumonia makes me feel extremely powerless,” he told Caixin. “Most of the past epidemics were controllable, but this time, I’m petrified.”

[Mr Quatro]

They actually traced this outbreak virus to a lady that ate a snake purchased at the local market in this area now quarantined.

On you tube is another video of a lady eating a bat ... how dumb is that :o

https://in.news.yahoo.com/snakes-might-source-coronavirus-outbreak-095553642.html

Snakes might be the source of coronavirus outbreak in China, says new study


Beijing: Snakes may be the original source of the newly discovered novel coronavirus (2019-nCoV) that has triggered an outbreak of a deadly infectious respiratory illness in China, according to a new study.

The finding, published in the Journal of Medical Virology, provides important insights on the potential origins of the most recent outbreak of viral pneumonia in China, which started in the middle of December and now is spreading to Hong Kong, Singapore, Thailand, and Japan.

"Results derived from our evolutionary analysis suggest for the first time that snake is the most probable wildlife animal reservoir for the 2019-nCoV," said study researchers from the Wuhan University in China.

[Skybird]

If it reaches Germany and they lock down my city as well, I could hold out from cold start for 2-3 months, including drinking water, toilet and washing water, food, medicine, energy, warmth, cooking heat of various sorts.

Boy scout picnic in my flat. :03:

And my ready-rucksack, or bug-out-bag as they call it, can see me jump-starting on my emergency-escape within 5-10 minutes, no matter the escape route leading into more urban or more natural territory, with all supply needed for 2-4 days and shelter for temps down to -10°.

Say what you want about me, but never say I am not prepared. :D

The real fears of mine all are of political, bureaucratical, system-related and administrative nature, and the brutality of my beloved "civilised" fellow citizens who will make claims for my reserves once they realise they are needed and I have thme while they have not. That is the simple reason why I am also armed, legally. The worst disaster that I fear, is the state itself: its failings, and its inherent brutality to cover that failing. And against the state, you can almost not defend yourself. Its crime and evil-doing will reach you, no matter your preparation. You are defenceless against the state and the system it represents. Currency collapse. Economic restrictions. Taxes. Expropriations. Oppressive laws. Arbitrary justice. Martial law.

Some think I am paranoid maybe, but I am not. I remember the looks of the basements in the house of my grand parents (on side of my mother), and the immense reserves in food, batteries, sweet water, bartering stuff like sugar and salt and medicine and cigarettes and Schnaps, which they had stored there. Lessons from war, which in this regard has never ended for them. And if you think of it - its not that long time ago. Modern economic dependencies and supply chains - are insane. Absolutely vulnerable. Super-sensitive. Absolutely insane. Its so frighteningly easy to bring them down with just a few takeouts here and there: and the rest collapses along with these few direct hits. I wonder whether people even know the meaning of the word "reserves" anymore. Our economy and finance system surely do not, and that scares the hell out of me, since I cannot safeguard against these. The state will always put its own interests and that of its elites over yours. It will always turn you into the victim of the crime, and it will never stop to do so.

FFP3 grade equipment (breathing masks and face/eye protection especially) in case of pandemic biological hazards, is recommended to have in reserve, too. And a simple Geiger counter. They have become so very cheap.

The other big risk is power blackouts, and cyberattacks. With all the mess following in their wake. The consequences of 24 hours without power nation-wide will be messy for weeks to come (talking of Germany). It will even take severla days to just restore power supply again, since it would need a cold start of the grid, and that cannot be had from one hour to the next. IT WOULD TAKE DAYS. And the number of cold-start-capable powerplants gets systematically massacred. This also affects windmills, btw. transformer stations for solar energy.

People spend so much money for insurrances: for their car, their family, their house, their camping trailer, their health, property, flat, bicylce, their this, their that - and if fate does not strike them, they will never get anything of it back,those thousands and thousands of coins you paid over the years are lost forever. . Now do the math of how much money this costs you! And then you tell the world that you cannot afford to spend a few hundred, maybe 1-2 thousand dollars for the direct safety and supply of your family with the goods of important needs of everyday life - by buying and stockpiling them a bit, so that you can keep them and they are yours for all time to come? I do not believe you! 2 thousand dollars - the costs of one holiday trip with all the family. That is not worth it, in your opinion?

Think again.

[Mr Quatro]

The other big risk is power blackouts, and cyberattacks. With all the mess following in their wake. The consequnces of 24 hours without power nation-wide will be messy for weeks to come. It will even take severla days to resotre power supply again, since it wou,d need a cold start of the grid, and that cnanot be had form oinbe hour to the next. IT WOULD TAKE DAYS.


Now that's something to worry about Sky, especially in a big city like yours which could be from almost anything too. Like terrorist, rouge generals, air burst electrons, ban on oil imports, little boys playing with aluminum kites :yep:

Don't be afraid be ready :o

[Skybird]

Don't be afraid be ready :o
Thats a good motto!

Though I would prefer to put it differently to defeat those idiots always claiming that "you just act out of fear". I would say: "Be prepared so that you must not be afraid."

Over 15 years ago we had a severe winter emergency over here, by our standards, I mean many americans are used to Blizzards like that and would just have smiled, but in germany, they are rare and almost unknown to most. Powerpoles and gridline towers collapsed under the snow, the damage was pretty immense. Outside my city, the districts and rural places to the north were without power and heating for up to three and four days. It was not that bad were I live, I hardly was effected, but back then I still had not the money available to have run some peparation procedures, and so felt a little bit exposed to factors beyond my control. I did not like that feeling. Not one bit.

We can never control all and everything, and we always must find a balance between investment and preparation level gotten in return. But by all reason, guys: at least try a bit! "Readiness is all!" That is especially important when you have family and kids, and are not responsible for yourself alone only.

[ET2SN]

MRE's are great unless you have to live on a steady diet of them. After a while they all start to taste the same with the exception of Chicken Pesto Pasta. :doh:

MRE's are great if you're starving. They are NOT for long term use unless you run marathons or are into body building. Seriously, check the calories in one MRE. :o

Canned ANYTHING that includes tomatoes is a bad idea for extended storage. The higher acid content will destroy (steel or alum.) metal cans over time. If you can't live without tomato sauce, canned in glass holds up longer.

I found a nice alternative in a deceptive label for short(er) term "bail out" food (natural disasters, zombie swarms, loss of power, etc.).
Next time (in North America) you're at the grocery store or the big box store, look around for those Hormel Compleats sealed mini bowls of horror. :yeah:
They're cheap and shelf stable at room temperature (for an easy six months to a not-so-easy year) and pre-cooked. Meaning, peel off the plastic cover and chow down. :up:
No, you don't want to serve this stuff at your anniversary dinner BUT the calorie content is high enough to get you through one more day. :salute:
The taste can be down-right nasty at times (besides the chili and chili with beans which is really good hot or cold) but in times of a real emergency, #### the taste. You just want to live without winding up with a case of dysentery or out-right food poisoning . :up:
These things are also small enough so you can pack out seven or eight without giving up a lot of space and they tend to taste a LOT better than the standard MREs.

:D

[Skybird]

On Food:

Have a mix of dried loose food (millet, rice, oats etc.), stuff to get some taste and sauce into it, have cans made for long-time packaging (the quality of can material and thickness is better, and more care is taken to really fill them under utmost hygiencial conditions), have emergency food ratios like NRG-5 or something similar. Have CHANGE in taste and style, in case you need to live by this kind of food for longer time, do no underestimate the importance of chnage in taste and food style. Have canned bread. Plenty, plenty , plenty of sweet water, in glass bottles (not plastic!), with high grade of sparkling gas, the more, the better. Milk powder, soup and sauce powder, coffe poweder and stuff like that is a good idea. Salt, sugar, oil. Dried vegetable like to be sued in soups. Canned meat.

Canned food, if canned properly and right, lasts for not just years, but decades. Serious. And nboody stops you form rotating you cans: eat your oldest ones ocassionally, and fill the gap with new ones. A principle that our grandparents most likely took as a routine of everyday life. ;) Farmer households most likely also remember it.

Store in lightprotected places, and moderate and lower temperatures. Chgeck your cans once a year for signs of corrosion. Bent cans should be replaced even if looking intact, on the insight isolation layers might have become puctured.

I also found a nice alternmative her ein Germany, a priuct from the Czech Republik. They use food isolated heavy duty plastic bags. They guarnatee a lignevity of at least ten years, whcuh was beleived to be impossible outside the use of tin cans. The nic ebtiung about them is: the ones I tried so far, tasted delicous and did not include this typical and unwanted taste that you usually get from tin canned food and conserved food.

https://www.sicherstadt.de/epages/64487205.sf/de_DE/?ObjectPath=/Shops/64487205/Categories/Einzelprodukte/Gourmet-Fertiggerichte

Avoid potatoes and especially noodles in tin cans. It almost always tastes messy. Rice is very soft in cans, but at leats dioes niot taste that - well, this - strange...

Never forget that you do not need sweet water fro drinking only, but also for cooking, and some more work.

Also prepare a toilet solution if the water flushing of your bathroom toilet fails! Often overseen, so I mention it. Biologicla waste can become quickly a very severe nuisance and more if you stay inside your appartment block. Its not just the scent, it also is about rats.

Prepare to be able to use as many different kinds of fuel for cooking as you can, since you will not know in advance what kind of fuel you can replenish the earliest: liquid gas, petroleum, gas cartridges, wood, coal, etc. You want a burning option for any fuel you can get your hand on.

If emergency comes, eat food from the refrigerator first!

Have a good medikit packed together, plus drugs for pain killing, wound desinfection, against diarrhoe.

Have severla options for water purifying, and may it only be to use river water for household and washing water. In urban theme parks like Germany, however, NEVER dare to think that a stream or a river can be turned into drinking water by using any of the usual survival and outdoor kits for water puyrifying! these things work remarkably well against biological threats, yes, but they are almost helpless against chemical intoxication and dirty water from farming and industry and traffic (gasoline, oil). Coal cartridges should not give you a feeling of being safe now! - For this reason the recommendation even is to not drink rain water, if you are not desperate. It is clean destillated water while still being a cloud, yes - but when it rains down and falls through the air, it washes out the particles in the air and all the dirt and dust and germs that are in the air . Still, if you must drink and have no other option, rain water is preferred. If you collected and stored it, purify it again with a physical filter (helps against one-cellular organism and if it is a good kit, even virusses). Avoid drinking from streams and rivers. If you have plenty of human-free nature and are high up in the mountains, you may dare it to drink there (after purifying), but make sure you drink as close to the source as possible, as high in a place as possible, and if you can, check that there is no human presence or abandoned industrial plant close to or above the water source. Chemical contaminations from for exmaple mining can exist for decades after the activity was stopped. - Giving this sermon only due to many people misunderstanding what outdoor water purifiers can do - AND WHAT NOT.

Prepping is always starting wiht a deicison, whether you plan to avoid by becoming mobile, or stay in place. Security and protection against other people is a major concern in both scenarios. If you stay stationary, willing to fight for and defend your place, have as much sweet water as your place can hold. You can never have enough of it.

And in these scenarios, immediately stop automatically thinking that other foreign humans are your friends. Strangers are enemies as long as the opposite has not been proven beyond doubt! Chances are you will learn sooner or later that not even those you once called friends still are your friends anymore. Sorry, but thats the simple human truth. The most important lesson to be learned about humans. When it is about either gold or survival, they become - strange very quickly.

[Mr Quatro]

Cans don't really last that long ... for a poor man I would use a vacuum sealer.

This is the sealer he uses for everyday items, but they have sealers for up to 2 and 3k dollars

https://www.amazon.com/FoodSaver-Vacuum-Sealer-FM5200-Starter/dp/B01MDRSCVF/ref=as_li_ss_tl?pd_rd_wg=5snOu&pd_rd_r=27c5afef-2872-4465-9605-21c1cc036402&pd_rd_w=kf6kx&ref_=pd_gw_psimh&pf_rd_r=J0XCJTN0W9P02NG8HTYB&pf_rd_p=a1e8e44e-a6a8-5785-afd0-7f174f0d74f9&linkCode=sl1&tag=canaprepyoutc-20&linkId=6a01199bd519d93129155ca1dab3e0df&language=en_US

Here's a man up in Canada that is into vacuum sealing ... He even seals water :yep:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmO9axnKoEk

Here's one of his followers good advice:

Just a quick technique tip - I don’t pack/store anything I’ve sealed for about a week. Sometimes you don’t get a good seal, but you don’t know it. By waiting about a week, you’ll see if your bags are still tight. If they’re loose, air has gotten in. I also check all of my vacuum sealed preps every 6 months. It only takes a teeny tiny hole to break the seal, so sometimes you find something that needs to be re-sealed or used.

[ET2SN]

BTW, since you all got me started on the subject, here are some quick observations I've stacked up over the years:

My folk's house (in northern Maine) always had a wood stove which looked quaint but we all hated it. Burning wood is a solid pain in the ###, even if you're used to it. Its a pain to find the right wood, its a pain to chop the wood into usable pieces, its a pain to store the wood you've chopped so it ages properly and doesn't get too wet. Its a pain to deal with the critters who enjoy living in the wood you chopped, etc, etc, etc. :doh:
Its also a pain in learning how to build the fire and its a REAL pain learning how clean your chimney so it (and the house) doesn't burn down. :yep:

So, we converted the house to run on oil heat and the old wood stove went that-a-way. :salute:

Which was just fine and dandy. Until we got nailed by a bad ice storm in the middle of winter and lost power for two days. :o

If you want to see modern people freak the #### out, take away their electricity for more than two hours. :yeah: A modern house without electricity is worse than a car with an automatic transmission and a dead starter (think about it for a minute).

So, what to do, what to do?? :o

Maybe mooch an old camp stove off a neighbor? Nope, believe me, the LAST thing your neighbors want to see is anyone mooching for anything that involves fire wood, gasoline, or food and doesn't involve their kids. They have their own problems to deal with, thank you, and even Mother Theresa would turn you away. Remember, humans can panic and they LOVE to panic when the lights go out. :yeah:

So, what could we do? Well, there were two cars in the driveway and we had keys to both of them. :03: There was no where to go, the roads were in pretty bad shape, but at least we could stay warm.

What else did we need? Hmm, how about flushing a toilet when the water pressure in the pipes goes to zero? I know, its a trick question as long as you have access to *some* standing water, like in a bathtub, but you'd be amazed how many people stop thinking when the #### hits the fan.

What about drinking water? We were standing in it up to our knees, as long as we could melt some of it, it wasn't an issue.

How about a radio that worked off batteries (or a hand crank)? How about batteries that weren't eight years old to run the radio?

So, hopefully you're getting the idea. Don't just buy a crutch, learn how to think this stuff through, 99% of your possessions will be worth ###-all to you in a real emergency. Its better to make sure that the 1% that can help you still works.

Don't assume you'll figure it out when the time's right. Having a wall of canned food doesn't mean jack if you have no way to open the cans. Think about it NOW and come up with a workable plan. Practice your plan NOW (or at least think it through) so you'll find the 8,000 things you didn't consider. :salute:

[Skybird]

Cans don't really last that long ...


If the can is in good shape, it does its purpose, and lvie slogner than a human'S lifetime. ;) They found bread in cans in shipwrecks older than 100 years - and microbiological analysis showed it to be free of germs and funghi or anything. They said the taste suffered a bot, so did the looks, it wa smroe pale n lokks and taste dnot as fresh anymore, but was fully consummable. The nutrition value had not suffered compared to freshly conswerved bread.



I have plenty of various cans, a few cheap and ordinary ones from the supermarket for exmaple containing mostly "Sauerbraten" and "Gulasch" of a brand that showed to offer very good content-for-value-ratios, and many specially manufactured and more expensive cans for emergency long time storage. Their lifetime is given for legal reasons only (2 yearsd and 10 years), in fact is pretty much "infinite", if manufactured right (thats why in several Asian countries they have no date stamped on the cans at all, it makes no difference). The difference is that such cans are of thicker wall diameter, and more care gets spent on the cannigbn process and hygiencics, to avoid ifnestation of the content. These cans are immune to corrosion as long as not being dented or deformated. Food supplies of the B undeswehr sometimes get siold this way, dating back to the 80s. Whether the food always is delicous is somethings different (I found 2 in 3 dishes being anythign but pleasant, but some actually are really good).



Plastic is ifnerior, due to its vulneraiblity to UV radiation, easier punctuation and possiblke chemcial degeneration and agents escaping into the food. If using plastic bags, then it should be special multi-component, multi-layered

films containing metal film as well. Oridnary household vacuum sealing film is not what I would trust for more than 1-2 years, if my life depends on it.


The best we know, is a good can. Its also the only one that is proven over several decades. And this although back in past days the metla use dinc ans indeed was vuklnerable to corrision, as you mentioned. The point is: for modern, good can quality this hold no more truth anymore! ;)



Else, I recommend millet, also in cans. I tastes well, is rich in nutrition value, easy to process both in sweet and hearty dishes, and very diverse in use. For many centuries, it was the by far most imopriotant grain to feed the masses across Europe, and abroad. I absolutely regret that it has almost completely lost any relevance in the West, does not get farmed in the West anymore (its mostly imported form china now), and is more valuklable than oats, corn, wheat, barley or meadow barley. I find it more delicious than Amaranth or Quinoa, or ordinary rice. Its easy to cook, and easy handling is what you look for in emergency food. Millet is my personal super-grain, not just for prepping, but in ordinary cooking as well. It has replaced rice for me almost completely. My preference for it reflects the historic dominant importance it once has had.



When I have my "fish day", I only have three different types of grilled fish (salmon, thuna steak, catfish) in three different sauces, and pure millet with a few drips of rosted oil, may it be walnut oil or seasam oil. Wonderful!

[ET2SN]

Um, Skybird, your last post is wrong on some fundamental things. Not meaning to pick a fight, its wrong because you haven't thought it through on some basic levels. :salute:

If you're in a location where things are about to get violent, its well past time to GTFO (and PM me if you don't understand what those four letters mean). :03:

The very LAST thing I would advise anyone, is to start pinning scalps to your wall one hour or one month after the power goes out. If things are THAT bad, you don't need to be there. :up:

Having a truckload of medicine isn't worth a thing if you haven't been trained how to use it and when to use it. :)

[Skybird]

BTW, since you all got me started on the subject, here are some quick observations I've stacked up over the years:

My folk's house (in northern Maine) always had a wood stove which looked quaint but we all hated it. Burning wood is a solid pain in the ###, even if you're used to it. Its a pain to find the right wood, its a pain to chop the wood into usable pieces, its a pain to store the wood you've chopped so it ages properly and doesn't get too wet. Its a pain to deal with the critters who enjoy living in the wood you chopped, etc, etc, etc. :doh:
Its also a pain in learning how to build the fire and its a REAL pain learning how clean your chimney so it (and the house) doesn't burn down. :yep:

So, we converted the house to run on oil heat and the old wood stove went that-a-way. :salute:

Which was just fine and dandy. Until we got nailed by a bad ice storm in the middle of winter and lost power for two days. :o

If you want to see modern people freak the #### out, take away their electricity for more than two hours. :yeah: A modern house without electricity is worse than a car with an automatic transmission and a dead starter (think about it for a minute).

So, what to do, what to do?? :o

Maybe mooch an old camp stove off a neighbor? Nope, believe me, the LAST thing your neighbors want to see is anyone mooching for anything that involves fire wood, gasoline, or food and doesn't involve their kids. They have their own problems to deal with, thank you, and even Mother Theresa would turn you away. Remember, humans can panic and they LOVE to panic when the lights go out. :yeah:

So, what could we do? Well, there were two cars in the driveway and we had keys to both of them. :03: There was no where to go, the roads were in pretty bad shape, but at least we could stay warm.

What else did we need? Hmm, how about flushing a toilet when the water pressure in the pipes goes to zero? I know, its a trick question as long as you have access to *some* standing water, like in a bathtub, but you'd be amazed how many people stop thinking when the #### hits the fan.

What about drinking water? We were standing in it up to our knees, as long as we could melt some of it, it wasn't an issue.

How about a radio that worked off batteries (or a hand crank)? How about batteries that weren't eight years old to run the radio?

So, hopefully you're getting the idea. Don't just buy a crutch, learn how to think this stuff through, 99% of your possessions will be worth ###-all to you in a real emergency. Its better to make sure that the 1% that can help you still works.

Don't assume you'll figure it out when the time's right. Having a wall of canned food doesn't mean jack if you have no way to open the cans. Think about it NOW and come up with a workable plan. Practice your plan NOW (or at least think it through) so you'll find the 8,000 things you didn't consider. :salute:


Amen to all of that! Nothing of it contradicts what I said.

I would add: practice certain things that need practice to function properly. I can make fire with a lens, I can make fire with a steel and stone, even a wood and a cord, but especially the latter was not easy to get too, and it has the right wood as a preconditiion. Better to have a lighter with you! Assuming that you coulkd dare to make an open fire, which is no certainty in a public emergency (I would prefer to stay in stealth mode and eat my can cold, its the same calories). How to span up a tarp in various setups? How to arrange a camp site with strong winds, and what works best inside a bivy bag with very limited space if you need to use both a winter sleeping bag and a thick isolation mat? That gets crowded, I tell you. Not to mention how to get used to the feel of claustrophobia that can come over you inside such a sleeping place. My first such night had me kind of panicking repeatedly in a closed bag. It takes time to get used to that. How to do good knots with a cord, for what purpose. And so forth.

For heaven's sake, guys, your equipment is only as good as your experince with making good use of it. So while you have time: practice! I do it severla times, now in our garden behidn the house. Just for fun. Peopel are maused, come and tlak. I explain, and else do my thing. I knwo why I do it, and whetehr they care for it or not, does not really interest me. After all, I share property rights in this place and have a right to use the place. End of message.

The best equipment there is is always the one you have with you. Because its the only equipment that in case of emergency is available to you its the one that you have with you, and no other. The thoughts on putting a Rucksack together - must have been spent BEFORE you stumble into an emergency situation. Lets say there is an industrial desaster, with or without controlled management by the state authorities. Wind plays a role, and the expectation of escaping either into an urban or a natural environment. How do you move? Car? Public transportaiton? Bike? On foot? What equipment will you pick? That are questions you should spend time on BEFORe an emergency breaks out and you are running thin on time. Will you need a multitool in the forest? No. Do you take a chainsaw, a foldable pocket saw, or a small axe? One of them, but which one, and why? All three is too heavy. Or is it just your all-purprose knife (no foldables, please)? You can expect to bring it to good use in the forest maybe. But if you escape into an urban environment, I would immediately trade any of them for a multi-waterkey and a tong with cable scissors: the city has no trees, but many fences, wire fences, loicks on public doors, water dwells and so forth. What do you need in a medikit? And so forth and so on. In emergency, you do not have the time nor the mental calm to think all this through thoroughly, you must have done it in advance. Finally, can you expect to find shelter and friendly help at the destination where you plan to flee to, or do you need to expect that other humans will compete with you for ressources? - Thats why I have more items and equipment than I do expect to bring to use, in fact I hope I never will use anything of it at all. My Rucksack is mostkly ready-packe,d but a few items are niot included, since they muust be choosen for the scneario then being actual. Weight is an issue to monitor, just packing in evertyhing is no option just because the individual thing weighs just 200 gr. Five such pieces make one 1 kg, and there you go, Superman! Suddenly you feel the difference. Also, I do not grow younger. At some time you have to realise that fleeing is no option for you anymore, and you are left to "stationary defence".



And the Rucksack itself: do not make it military-looking, you raise attention when moving in a city. Do not use neon colours, you stand out rreom the backgorudn if moving in nature. Make it a simple green or brownish colour, that is modest, dark not bright. somethign that raises no interest and no attention in any envrionment. I even use a dark blue and medium grea one, 45-55 liters, modular. Very good fit, poriginally a women'S model, since I have a narrower chest, the SL (=slim) verison matched my anatomy perfectly. As a male, do not be shy to check women backbacks as well! I am not kidding.


And do not underestimate the burden of weight. The military may find it a good idea letting its soldiers running around with 25 kilograms plus weapons and ammo, but for untrained, civilians not used to daily exercises I consider that to be a an excess that will cost you: in range, in speed, in endurance and in water consummation.. Idal would be 10-12 kg, my limit to which I pack is 15 kg max, but I try to stay below that value significantly, which includes two packs of NRG-5 (1kg, 2x 2300 calories), and 3 liters of water, tarp 3x3m, sleeping bag, isolation mat (both of best quality: the mat is ultra-isolating and reflecting, I have two sleeping bags, ultralight but still extremely warm, or medium warm: one for winter conditions of down to -6°C in transition zone, and one for all other times of the year, transition zone I thionk +4 or +2°). A good, comfortable Rucksack with strapü mounts that match your chest width. Mind you, many of us are not training everyday anymore, we are not used to physical stress anymore every day. There is no point in overestimating your own physical training status.

Why I come from stationary preparation to bagging out all the time? Because the transition is fluent. When your reserves run thin, you must turn mobile, and you better do that while you still have the resources, both materially and physically. And for both scenarios there is one basic truth. While you spend a weekend in the woods to practice this and that survival skill, its all just a game. Its hobby, and not even a bad one. But when it is a real emergency, then it is fight: fight for survival, and fight against other humans wanting to take from you what you have.

And that are two totally different kinds of party. Just mastering skills will not prepare you for that. You need to find another way to prepare for that. I give you a hint: you must unlearn to be a too civilised being. It's a thing of mental attitude. Killing technically is not difficult. The issue is those hurdles people have inside their head.

Did you know that most people who ran through self-defence courses of any kind and later become victims of a crime, say assault or rape, nevertheless fail to defend themselves although having the technical skill to do so and to inflict pain and injury on their attacker? The problem is their head. One needs to find a way to work on that.


Finally, saying that with all caution: in case of such emergency scenarios, with state order collapsing: for heavens sake, try to get armed with a firegun, preferred a small one that you can hide away (pistol over rifle, you do not intend to start a war, do you). No matter the legal situation and claims by your place's laws: if somebody tries to kill you to rob your food, water, equipment, being legal in your means of self defence will not help you. So in these circumstances: get a gun if only you can.

[Skybird]

Um, Skybird, your last post is wrong on some fundamental things. Not meaning to pick a fight, its wrong because you haven't thought it through on some basic levels. :salute:

If you're in a location where things are about to get violent, its well past time to GTFO (and PM me if you don't understand what those four letters mean). :03:

The very LAST thing I would advise anyone, is to start pinning scalps to your wall one hour or one month after the power goes out. If things are THAT bad, you don't need to be there. :up:

Having a truckload of medicine isn't worth a thing if you haven't been trained how to use it and when to use it. :)
Absolutely! One basic principle of for exmaple Kravmagav is to recognise the unfolding risk of trouble early and to avoid it before one cannot escape from it anymore! You are absolutely right.

You see, I would not talk about all this and my storage preparation this openly in public if people could identify me easily and find out who I am and where I live. In real life, my lips are 100% sealed and silent about all this. Like I also do not talk about my wealth preservation strategy. If a French reactor goes up and away west of my city or a blackout lasts for one day and one night and then the chaos of the following days unfolds, the last thing I want is that foreign neighbours to whom I never have talked before in 20 years suddenly ring at my (lev 4 high security) door and ask whether I could share my precious reserves with them for they lack food. Or water. Or this, or that. If i can prepare, so you can prepare, too, Mister. If I can spend money and time on it, you with your own property and garden and one-family house could have done so as well, while you had time. I do not allow to accept punishment for preparing myseelf while others fail or even refuse to perpare themselves while they had the time and opportunity.

If violence becomes too hard anymore, then the same thing apllies that I mentioned one post above: its time to give up your position and become mobile. You see, I said above that preparing in place as well as preparing a bag out bag to move out goes hand in hand. They are kind of phases of one and the same scenario, if this scenario detoriates too fast or lasts too long.

And believe it or not, beside a plan B regarding an evasive hideout, I even have a plan C. The A-team would have loved me.

Heck, for thinking like this I even got hired and got paid good money in the later 90s. :yeah: Always working on increasing the degrees of freedom available to you, always working on increasing your alternatives. Never depend on just one or two. But with age comes a need for a third thing: always altering existing plans to reflect the growing limitations of your physical possibilities. Thats a real game breaker sooner or later...

[ET2SN]

Well, just so we're clear, I'm not advocating cannibalism. :up:
If you're packing heat and ammo, and you have the energy to slaughter the townsfolk, there's only one other thing to make sure you have. A stew pot and the means to light a fire under it.

Of course, if its just a disaster and not the end of civilization, its going to be embarrassing (to say the least) when the cops and the Army show up and you're standing there. Next to piles of clothes, shoes, and polished bones :O:

[Skybird]

Well, just so we're clear, I'm not advocating cannibalism. :up:
If you're packing heat and ammo, and you have the energy to slaughter the townsfolk, there's only one other thing to make sure you have. A stew pot and the means to light a fire under it.

Of course, if its just a disaster and not the end of civilization, its going to be embarrassing (to say the least) when the cops and the Army show up and you're standing there. Next to piles of clothes, shoes, and polished bones :O:
Well, turning "mobile" and leaving your bastion only makes sense for me if having a destination I could escape to. Germany is not the right place to "live in the wilderness", since we have none. Its all an urban place. And if I have no place to flee to, why leaving my home in the first? I am turning too old to endlessly sneak around and play playing cowboys and indians. With every year, the bag out bag becomes less important for me, and good fortificaiton wins in importance. Heck I am turning 53. Not an old man, but then, not a young panther anymore as well. Not having own family, helps, however. I can afford to accept a coming fate more easily than if there were kids and wife in the background. Playing cowboys and indians is for the younger ones. And a sitting on the ground at the fireplace is not only a gemütlich experience, but in the first it is a very hard seat to sit on... :)

[Onkel Neal]

They actually traced this outbreak virus to a lady that ate a snake purchased at the local market in this area now quarantined.

On you tube is another video of a lady eating a bat ... how dumb is that :o

https://in.news.yahoo.com/snakes-might-source-coronavirus-outbreak-095553642.html

Snakes might be the source of coronavirus outbreak in China, says new study


Yeah, this seems to always happen in China and Africa. They need to build more Whataburgers there.

For me, the crazy thing about this latest virus - it spreads human to human, it has a 14 day incubation period, and even though they are locking down Wuhan and a couple other cities, they seem to be about 14 days behind. People who were in Wuhan two weeks ago, they have it but they may not be showing symptoms, yet they are spreading it. News was saying they expect millions of Chinese to travel abroad this weekend for the New year, seriously? Don't people think it may be a good idea to change plans? :o I tell you, one day there will be a virus like this, and it will mutate to a strand with a really bad fatality rate, and it will be unstoppable.



If it reaches Germany and they lock down my city as well, I could hold out from cold start for 2-3 months, including drinking water, toilet and washing water, food, medicine, energy, warmth, cooking heat of various sorts.

Boy scout picnic in my flat. :03:

A
People spend so much money for insurrances: for their car, their family, their house, their camping trailer, their health, property, flat, bicylce, their this, their that - and if fate does not strike them, they will never get anything of it back,those thousands and thousands of coins you paid over the years are lost forever. . Now do the math of how much money this costs you! And then you tell the world that you cannot afford to spend a few hundred, maybe 1-2 thousand dollars for the direct safety and supply of your family with the goods of important needs of everyday life - by buying and stockpiling them a bit, so that you can keep them and they are yours for all time to come? I do not believe you! 2 thousand dollars - the costs of one holiday trip with all the family. That is not worth it, in your opinion?

Think again.

Yeah, I agree, a little prepping is not a bad thing. Right now I am in between houses, so I am pretty vulnerable. Hopefully my new house will be built and ready by July. Right now I could hold out 2 weeks max.

As for MREs vs storing general canned food, the can stuff will last 2 years pretty easily. Any disaster that lasts more than two years is something I don't have a plan for, other than Mad Maxxing it 24/7. Let's hope it doesn't come to that. :O:

One strategy I thought of, have a "help a neighbor pantry/stash, aka public supplies, that you can give out, but keep your main supplies hidden, as in buried or behind a brick wall. That way when a neighbor comes for help, you can help, but he "sees" your limited supply and maybe will think you are just like him. As they see your supplies dwindle, they won't direct all their attention to you. Then when you empty your public supplies, you just need to stick to a strict ration and lose weight like everyone else, until they are too weak to attack you, then hold out with your regular diet. Cold-hearted, I know. But it's the age old dilemma, people/friends/relatives will mock a prepper until the SHTF, then they will plead for your kind-hearted help, and then attack you if they need to.

Well, just so we're clear, I'm not advocating cannibalism. :up:
If you're packing heat and ammo, and you have the energy to slaughter the townsfolk, there's only one other thing to make sure you have. A stew pot and the means to light a fire under it.

Of course, if its just a disaster and not the end of civilization, its going to be embarrassing (to say the least) when the cops and the Army show up and you're standing there. Next to piles of clothes, shoes, and polished bones :O:

Post of the Year candidate!

[Skybird]

Don't people think it may be a good idea to change plans?
Would you cancel thanksgiving and christmas this year if somebody suggests that this is a good idea?

[Onkel Neal]

Uh, not dying is a great idea :shucks:

As I am reading this, a lady sitting nearby is coughing her head off. :yeah:

https://ei.marketwatch.com/Multimedia/2020/01/23/Photos/NS/MW-HY882_corona_20200123111402_NS.jpg?uuid=5eab8b4a-3dfb-11ea-a546-9c8e992d421e

[Skybird]

As for MREs vs storing general canned food, the can stuff will last 2 years pretty easily.
If the cans are intact and the walls made of good material, you must not worry at all. The dates printed on them are exclusively for legal reasons. Practically, a can can hold for decades, and that is no exaggeration. I currently have some cans on the ready shelf in my kitchen that contain pea soup from Aldi, 12-15 years old. They taste as if bought yesterday. They are absolutely, totally fine. The colour of the peas has faded a very little bit, that is all.

Also, I rotate them through, slowly, old ones in the front get occasionally eaten, new ones get resupplied and stored in the back of the shelf. That way you also learn which cans taste good and which one you do not wnat to buy again. Mostkly, I avoid supermarket cans. They are cheaper. And usually you taste why.

So again, the date stamps are a legal obligation only, two years is a maximum that must be stamped on food in germany and probably in the US as well. Its a formality, it has nothing to do with the real longevity of the contained food as long as the can's sealing is intact. As I said, in some Asian countries they have no dates on cans anymore at all - because it is practically pointless and misleading. It does not matter if they sell the can immediately or five yera slater, andn whether the customer eats it immediately or stores it another five years. There is no health risk, if the can was well-manufactured and used good material.



I do not mean to sell Sorströmming to you!

[Skybird]

Uh, not dying is a great idea :shucks:


Sure, but the Us population is bigger than just 1, or not? Or has Corona already gotten all the rest?


Wait - you are not telling me you have become the Omega Man, no?! :o

[mapuc]

There's one thing you haven't taken into consideration

How will(a huge percentage of) people survive without their daily dosis FB. ?

Markus

[ET2SN]

Uh, not dying is a great idea :shucks:

As I am reading this, a lady sitting nearby is coughing her head off. :yeah:


C'mon out to Iowa. :up:
I have NO idea why, but its considered normal to go outside when its below freezing in a tee shirt, shorts, and flip flops.

Like I said, I'm against cannibalism but maybe I'm not so against whaling on a dude with a 2 X 4 who has no ####ing clue. :up:

[Mr Quatro]

There's one thing you haven't taken into consideration

How will(a huge percentage of) people survive without their daily dosis FB. ?

Markus

That's funny Markus :D

What about Starbucks?

I know a lady that spends over $300 a month at Starbucks and she only works Mon thru Friday :o

[mapuc]

That's funny Markus :D

What about Starbucks?

I know a lady that spends over $300 a month at Starbucks and she only works Mon thru Friday :o

What we are talking about here is preparing for the unthinkable within the physiological and not the psychological.
I don't think we can be prepared psychologically..we will be forced to if the unthinkable should happen.

Markus

[Onkel Neal]

It's here
Texas A&M student suspected of having coronavirus, state health officials investigating (https://www.mysanantonio.com/news/houston-texas/article/County-officials-in-East-Texas-are-investigating-14999040.php)

Brazos County’s health department is investigating a suspected case of the the mystery pneumonia-like virus that has claimed 18 lives in China and was confirmed in the U.S. for the first time earlier this week.

The department said in a tweet that the patient had traveled from Wuhan, China, the district where the so-called 2019 novel coronavirus originated.

The case would be the first for the state of Texas. Roughly 90 miles outside of Houston, Brazos County is home to the cities of Bryan and College Station, where Texas A&M University is located.

Another departmental tweet said health-care providers in the area were aware of public health guidance about the virus and quickly recognized the patient met the criteria for testing. The patient, a Texas A&M student, is being kept isolated at home.

Meanwhile, all the people she has been around the last 10 days, in school, at the airport, grocery store, etc. are off and about to spread their own spores. :doh:

Next time you go to Olive garden and you reach for the Parmesan cheese shaker, consider how many other hands have been on that thing.

When you go to the grocery store and grab a cart... how many unwashed hands have been on that handle.

Ominous.

[Rockstar]

Isn't the coronavirus the same virus responsible for the common cold?

[Jimbuna]

If this has the ability to surpass all the previous virus we could be in big trouble.

[Onkel Neal]

https://www.cnn.com/2020/01/24/china/wuhan-coronavirus-update-intl-hnk/index.html



The virus, which was first discovered in the city of Wuhan in December, has spread to every province in China, except the remote autonomous regions of Qinghai, Inner Mongolia and Tibet, with the number of infections rising to 846 worldwide.
As of Friday, the virus had claimed the lives of at least 26 people in mainland China, including a 36-year-old man not listed as having any pre-existing conditions.



So, that's around a 3% fatality rate, although I have read in several reports they say it is 17%... not sure who is doing the math there...




People spoke of sick family members turned away from hospitals due to a lack of beds, or wards packed with feverish patients and limited screening or quarantine.

Video from Chinese social media appears to show hospitals in the city totally overwhelmed. In one video, a hospital corridor appears to be flooded with patients waiting for test results. In another, medical workers tend patient wearing full protective suits. CNN has not been able to independently verify the videos.

Hmmm... in the clip above from the same report, they say 846 people have been infected worldwide, yet the hospitals are being overrun in Wuhan?

It initially appeared to spread only by very close contact that would typically occur within a family -- such as hugging, kissing, or sharing eating utensils -- but now evidence is accruing that shows more distant contact could spread the virus, such as if a sick person were to sneeze or cough near someone else's face.

Heymann said there is no evidence at this point that the virus is airborne and could be spread across a room, as happens with the flu or measles.

Lol, initially

[Mr Quatro]

What was the last big scare out of CHINA?

It was bad reporting early on and claimed 8,000 people by the time it was over :yep:

SARS

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_the_SARS_outbreak

On 16 November 2002, an outbreak of the severe acute respiratory syndrome (SARS) began in China's Guangdong province, which borders Hong Kong. A farmer in the Shunde district of Foshan County was likely the first case of infection. The People's Republic of China notified the World Health Organization (WHO) about this outbreak on 10 February 2003, reporting 305 cases including 105 health-care workers and five deaths; Later, it was reported that the outbreak in Guangdong had peaked in mid-February 2003. But this appears to have been false, as subsequently 806 cases of infections and 34 cases of deaths were reported.

[Skybird]

You have to give it to the corona virus - it has overwhelmed China's infamous and omnipresent face recognition technology regime. Peace Nobel Prize!

[mapuc]

When SARS or was it MERS was around A Swedish Doctor said on Swedish tv.

Why are you journalist escalating this as it was the plaque.

Then he said something about higher death rate when the flu was over us.

Markus

[STEED]

UK is all clear from those been screened only problem reported on the BBC News there are some where in the region of 2000 passengers from that area of China still at large.

OBTW...early reports France has confirmed two cases as reported on SKY News some 10 minutes odd ago.

I agree with the old granny at the bus stop China is a filthy country they eat cats and dogs.

[Jimbuna]

Figures continue to rise.

The death toll from a newly-discovered coronavirus in China has risen to 41 on the day of the Lunar New Year.

Another 15 deaths in Hubei province, where the outbreak began, were announced on Saturday.

Health officials are struggling to contain the outbreak as millions of people travel for the Chinese new year, one of the most important events. Many festivities have been cancelled.

There are now more than 1,200 confirmed cases in China.

The virus has also spread to Europe, with three cases confirmed in France. The UK is investigating a number of suspected cases, with officials trying to trace around 2,000 people who have recently flown to the UK from Hubei province.

Australia has also confirmed several cases in Melbourne and Sydney, joining a handful of countries treating patients.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-china-51245680

[Onkel Neal]

41 deaths / 1200 cases = 3.4%

So, if the virus was to spread and infect 10 million people, there would be ~ 333,000 deaths.

[STEED]

Once again the media here has gone nuts milking this story for every drop they can get out of it, I am bloody fed up with this over hyping by the dam news media.

Here is a point raised earlier today on LBC Radio by the presenter, and I have to take what he said as fact. He pointed out in America 2019 there were over 1000 deaths from the common flu virus, most of those cases were in the 65 plus age group. So why didn't our UK media raise that? May have something to do not spreading around the world.

[Rockstar]

3.4%? thats nothing.


https://www.zerohedge.com/health/coronavirus-pandemic-simulation-run-3-months-ago-predicts-65-million-people-could-die



...according to one simulation run less than three months ago, things could get much, much worse. Less than three months ago, Eric Toner, a scientist at the Johns Hopkins Centre for Health Security, had run a simulation of a global pandemic involving the exact same type of virus, according to Business Insider.


His simulation predicted that 65 million people could die "within 18 months".

https://media.giphy.com/media/We8ngtByVDmo0/giphy.gif

[em2nought]

3.4%? thats nothing.



Maybe the democrats finally get the tragedy they've been praying for on Trump's watch? :hmmm:

[mapuc]

A few minutes ago I read in a Swedish news paper who wrote this Corona Virus has a higher death rate than the ordinary flu.

From what I understand most of those who havde died from this is mostly elders and weak persons.

and it's only contagious by contact.

The expert fear the virus may mutate.

Markus

[Onkel Neal]

Let's not politicize this thread :03:

[Aktungbby]

Let's not politicize this thread :03:Why am I not the least SARRY this in China...again!?? (as I head to my Walgreens for my damn flu shot for elderly and weak persons ):wah::timeout::yep:

[Skybird]

Over the last couple of years I tremendously reduced the frequences by which I catch an ordinray common flu:

Washing my hands often.

Once or twice a week I use a cotton ball and alcohol on some much used household items: mouse, keyboard, telephone, light switches, door holds, smartphone, TV rmeote control, keys, grips on refirgerator and cupboards. Just try not become excessive. You do not want to develope an anancastic personality! ;)

When being in town or shopping, NEVER touch my face with my fingertips anymore. Especially not the area close to eyes, nose and mouth (infection via mucosa).


Avoiding crowds or floicks of people. Keeping a distance. Avoiding coughing people early.


Small things, Great effects!


If this viurs story turns into something bigger, have some filter masks with protection grade FFP3 ready. They are affordable. The use of these is more common in Asia, and the idea is good. It protects you from others coughing in your face. But also it protects the others from you, if you already are infested and just do not know it.



Just that any papermask will not make a difference. You need to learn a bit about what works and what not. I have something like this in my ready-chest: http://www.nanologix.eu/?lge=en
Filters must be level FFP3. FFP2 and FFP1 filters are not fine enough, they are meant for craftsmen! A framed mask like this models seals nose and chin area more relably than just a paper mask, also, the filte ritself is efficient. Most clioncal appe rmaks used in hospitals are not to prevent infection by virusses, but to prevent infection by patients spitting out blood and such. These masks will not even protect you from flu. You can wear protective glasses along with it. I have a beard. In case of troubles I woul shave it off, to have the mask sealing my chin correctly if I have to leave the house. Full face masks have their own worries if you wera glasses. The fram wbrakes the seal, like a beard does. Be prepared to get rid of both if needing to wear such masks.


Eating outside my home I have already drastically reduced since as a student I worked for 4 weeks in a Biergarten kitchen. That job taught me a lot of things that now are the cause why I do not easily pay for restaurants anymore. :D Food and eating is a matter of trust. Why just trusting just anybody...? Trust is an empirically justfiied thing, not a lottery. Also, eating outside sinmply has become tooi expensive, it is mostly not worth it to me.


If you think such masks and gloves are a good idea, BUY THEM NOW. Once the outbreak is widespread, everybody will want one. And many will not get any anymore. Also have some replacement filters. Consider eye-protection.

[Mr Quatro]

I'm not one to worry and I'm not being a chicken little, but ground zero is sounding quite serious :yep:


https://time.com/5771606/wuhan-car-ban-hong-kong-coronavirus/

China cut off trains, planes and other links to Wuhan on Wednesday, as well as public transportation within the city, and has steadily expanded a lockdown to 16 surrounding cities with a combined population of more than 50 million, greater than that of New York, London, Paris and Moscow combined.

The cities of Yichang, Suizhou and Jingzhou were the latest added to the list on Friday evening and Saturday.

Wuhan went one step further Saturday, announcing vehicle use including private cars would be banned in downtown areas starting after midnight, state media reported. Only authorized vehicles to carry supplies and for other needs would be permitted after that, the reports said.

6,470 miles
San Francisco, CA → Wuhan, China

https://www.bing.com/maps/geoplat/REST/v1/Imagery/Map/RoadVibrant?ms=1182,493&pp=37.777119,-122.41964;S1;San%20Francisco%2c%20CA&pp=30.59276,114.305252;S2;Wuhan&ml=Basemap,Landmarks,OsmBuildings&dc=1,ff000000,2.00&key=AnTcaqBi2ypp0xI-OZNi4W_ik2KhjgpqioTAtXLC8GzkMBQRMlyxvxyTnd5b73im&c=en-US&dpi=Large&fmt=jpeg&od=2&logo=n&da=ro&withMetaData=1

[Rockstar]

on the job I deal with a lot of people helps keep my immune system working. I also try eat fruits and veggies, walk, camp, paddle for excercise on my off time. All that and my doctor also prescribed 20mg fucitdall to be take twice daily to help with anxiety

[Skybird]

I'm not one to worry and I'm not being a chicken little,

Nor am I, but I see it like many peopole in Asia: there it is an issue of oliteness and respect that you try to reduce the risk to others if you have a flu yourself, or just a cold - by wearing a mask. Its a scoail nornm, and I think it is a good one. And if you need to go to the supoermarket or to town, and it is known that a pandemic, not even an overly lethal one, is working its way thoruzgb the place, it is a reaisbale thing to be prepared a bit and protect yourself a bit. If they wlulkd say on radio that the water in the tube is infested, you would not continue to drink it would, you?

Hysteria or exaggerated concerns and worries have little to do with it. Its not about beign a chicken, but about being reasonable. Mioght save you from days in bed with high fever, bone pain and a terrible headache.


I do not get yearly injections of the latest flu immunization. Simply because I am amongst people so rarely these days that the risk by that alone is so low that I skip getting an immunization. Also, I do not want to know how many come back from the doctor and after having sat in the waiitng room for half an hour or longer, go back home sicker than they have arrived at the doctor. ;) Waiting rooms at doctors are risk zones.

[Mr Quatro]

I hate to bring up the G** word, but what if there really is a G** and He is not happy with China's persecution of the church by closing them down and putting the pastors in prison?

What if the Chinese soothsayers tell the leaders of China that this is punishment for their anti-christian attitude?

Causing a reversal of the communist party to be anti-christians and an entire nation comes to it's knees to pray for God's favor to come upon them.

Just like in the Old Testament Bible story of Jonah and the whale and his assignment by God to tell Nineveh to repent and they repented. :o

If you don't think this scenario could happen please let us not argue ... :yep:

I think I'll write it up anyway ... would make a good film for believers :up:

[Skybird]

If you ask me all that, you ask the wrong one. Better ask David Lynch instead, he may encode his answer in another strange movie. :D

[Skybird]

BTW:


Germany reports 13 thousand cases of influentia this season - and so far 32 deaths.


Puts it all into relation a bit. Corona is not our dominant virus problem.


And then there is the swines' influenza which does not kill people, but threatens lifestock across all Europe and now sits right before Germany's eastern borders. In China it led to the culling of over 50% of their lifestock (some mention even 80%). - (That is the real reason why the Chinese signed a deal with Trump on certain things. They would have done so anyway, since pig is a basic food in China.)

[mapuc]

I don't know how reliable this source is

China installed the first of a planned five to seven biolabs designed for maximum safety in Wuhan in 2017, for the purpose of studying the most high-risk pathogens, including the Ebola and the SARS viruses.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-7922379/Chinas-lab-studying-SARS-Ebola-Wuhan-outbreaks-center.html?fbclid=IwAR3FM-_Cn40z30lKxPW6sMDxF7YxaRXry3hjGxTGd9IXts8YShw1gOfJ pJo

Markus

[STEED]

I hear the UK is still allowing three flights a week from Wuhan to land and what action is being taken? A leaflet handed to passengers! Keep calm we are useless oh my....Oops it's....

I have no faith in these jokers passing themselves off as the Government what ever the party in charge.

[Onkel Neal]

I'm not one to worry and I'm not being a chicken little, but ground zero is sounding quite serious :yep:


https://time.com/5771606/wuhan-car-ban-hong-kong-coronavirus/



6,470 miles
San Francisco, CA → Wuhan, China

G]

I feel the same, I have no idea if this will become a world-changing event. It may not, but it certainly could. Someday the right combination of virus will come along and with the massive travel levels and the casual nature people have, reluctance to enforce effective quarantines, etc. the world will take a big hit.

But, a medic has claimed China is lying and that as many as “100,000 people are infected”.

A harrowing voice message on a WhatsApp group has now emerged which suggests the outbreak is hundreds of times worse than official figures coming out of China suggest.

The audio was shared by Chinese news outlet Global Himalaya, who claimed it was sent from a member of the medical staff in Wuhan.

In a translation verified by Daily Star Online, a woman says: “I have been working all day long…The infection is much more horrible than it’s reported on TV.

“There are so many cases. Doctors have estimated about 100,000 infected.”

China reports 15 new coronavirus fatalities, total death toll now 56 (https://www.cbc.ca/news/health/coronavirus-china-hong-kong-1.5440539)


Wuhan doctor treating coronavirus patients dies after contracting disease (https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/wuhan-doctor-treating-coronavirus-patients-dies-after-contracting-disease)

A Chinese doctor treating patients who contracted the coronavirus died after contracting the virus himself.

Liang Wudong, 62, died Saturday morning after he was infected with Wuhan coronavirus and admitted to the Wuhan Medical Treatment Center. Wudong was one of the top ear, nose, and throat doctors at the Hubei Provincial Hospital of Integrated Chinese & Western Medicine before he retired last year.

Hope this blows over... wash your hands and wear gloves!

[Skybird]

During the SARS pandemic, lying was the preferred mode of communication of the Bejing mafia regime, so it should be expected that they do it again today. Due to the delay in information, measurements will be delayed as well. And more people will die.


Anyting goes in regimes like this. But it delays global reactions as well.



Well, its China, what else to say.

[Rockstar]

Since we have several people with the virus in our own countries we no longer need wait on China for all the answers. So we got that going for us. :yeah:

[Onkel Neal]

During the SARS pandemic, lying was the preferred mode of communication of the Bejing mafia regime, so it should be expected that they do it again today. Due to the delay in information, measurements will be delayed as well. And more people will die.


Anyting goes in regimes like this. But it delays global reactions as well.



Well, its China, what else to say.

You know, this doesn't feel right.:o

https://www.ibtimes.sg/china-virus-chilling-videos-wuhan-show-coronavirus-infected-men-women-collapsing-streets-38246


https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=12&v=HfVXVPVdR5E&feature=emb_logo

Edit: someone on Reddit nailed it
It is completely hopeless in China. Millions of people left Wuhan in the days leading up to the lockdown to return home for CNY. If symptoms weren't showing up yet, they're scattered across China right now, slowly developing their symptoms as time goes on. There's only been a lockdown for four days, but the disease can incubate for two weeks.

[Skybird]

As to my best knowledge, this film gets the basics on the cons and pros of face masks right.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5M7saVTtBQI

Best way to maximise your chances to stay healthy of course is not to move amongst people. But there might be times when you have no other option, if only for the purpose needing to go to the supermarket every couple of days. For the reasons given in the film, I recommend to use frame masks or half-masks or however they are being called. They usually have silikon rims that seal mouth and nose areas better than surgeon paper masks, and they have chnageable filters. If oyu do craftsman work, you probabaly have met them in any form during your working when handling paints or dissolavants, dusty material and such things. Just remember, you need better filters than that for craftsmen. FFP3 instead of FFP2 and FFP1.

These masks are not expensive, and are much more fail-safe to handle by people never having handled masks before. They still are relatively unobstrusive. You can wear glasses with them, to protect your eyes' mucosa as well.

Again, I recommend this model by Nanologix, its great advantage is that the soft thin silicon rim fits your face nicely, you really have to make it an effort to wear it in a way that unfiltered air from the side slips through. The filters can be exchanged. We talk about 20-25 coins for the frame and one FFP2 filter, and 8 coins per FFP3 filter.

http://www.nanologix.eu/images/respira-15.jpg

The masks are used by police, firebrigades, emergency rescuers, government services in the Czech Republic and have been distributed to several EU authority offices and services as well.

Anyhow, something like this, instead of simple paper surgeon masks. You get the idea. BTW, they are pretty light.

[Rockstar]

https://www.webmd.com/lung/coronavirus#1


There is no vaccine for coronavirus.


To help prevent a coronavirus infection, do the same things you do to avoid the common cold:
Continue Reading Below


Wash your hands thoroughly with soap and warm water or with an alcohol-based hand sanitizer.
Keep your hands and fingers away from your eyes, nose, and mouth.
Avoid close contact with people who are infected.

You treat a coronavirus infection the same way you treat a cold:


Get plenty of rest.
Drink fluids.
Take over-the-counter medicine for a sore throat and fever. But don't give aspirin to children or teens younger than 19; use ibuprofen or acetaminophen instead.

A humidifier or steamy shower can also help ease a sore and scratchy throat.
Even when a coronavirus causes MERS or SARS in other countries, the kind of coronavirus infection common in the U.S. isn't a serious threat for an otherwise healthy adult. If you get sick, treat your symptoms and contact a doctor if they get worse or don't go away.

[Skybird]

All that is correct, Rockstar, and I mentioned it before. What it does not say, however, is the one fear, the one big risk, the one threat that media try to not mention too often:

The risk of the virus mutating into. Something. New.

That is was the underlaying risk of bird flu that drive them so crazy. Sars. Mers.

[Rockstar]

True, this not the everyday common cold type coronavirus. The one we are hearing about today '2019-nCoV I think is a new mutation.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HZyCGws2r08

[mapuc]

Some of you presented some percentage ratio of how many got sick and how many had died

Is or could this be correct ?

We do not know the exact numbers of people who have been sick from this Corona virus.

Markus

[skidman]

True, this not the everyday common cold type coronavirus. The one we are hearing about today '2019-nCoV I think is a new mutation.

Yep. And like all biota those little bastards are subject to constant change. Nothing in evolution is static.

To our very good health!

https://www.dropbox.com/s/syu2agwc49pbnc1/Corona%20Wuhan.jpg?raw=1

[Buddahaid]

....Best way to maximise your chances to stay healthy of course is not to move amongst people....

I recommend killing yourself. You'll never get sick after that.

[Onkel Neal]

starting its own thread.

https://nypost.com/2020/01/26/coronavirus-whistleblower-nurse-says-china-has-90000-sick/

The coronavirus now has a whistleblower — a nurse in Wuhan who insists in a shocking online video that close to 90,000 people in China have the disease, far more than the 1,975 reported by officials.

“I am in the area where the coronavirus started,” her video begins. Wuhan is the epicenter of the outbreak.

“I’m here to tell the truth,” the anonymous nurse says in the video, which shows her wearing a full-head face mask.

“At this moment, Hubei province, including the Wuhan area, even China, 90,000 people have been infected by a coronavirus.”

She does not reveal how she arrived at the sobering statistic.

The video has been viewed on YouTube some two million times, the Daily Mail reported.

Other horrifying videos have shown dead bodies covered in sheets lying in hospital hallways.

This could explain why a city of 11 million is having to rush build a hospital and does not have enough beds....

[Mr Quatro]

How many people think this is going to get worse in their own area before it gets better in China? :o

Me! :yep:

[Catfish]

Now was not there a state-owned laboratory in Wuhan.. biological warfare development gone "wrong"? Or is it really all civilian there?
It's easy finger pointing, but wasn't there some precedent case there.

[ikalugin]

starting its own thread.

https://nypost.com/2020/01/26/coronavirus-whistleblower-nurse-says-china-has-90000-sick/



This could explain why a city of 11 million is having to rush build a hospital and does not have enough beds....


They did the same thing during the previous pneumonia.


As to the video - in the current era of internet based psyops I would be careful.

[Rockstar]

How many people think this is going to get worse in their own area before it gets better in China? :o

Me! :yep:


so far reports i get out of Mongolia indicate there are more people in a state of panic than have the virus,

[Skybird]

This could explain why a city of 11 million is having to rush build a hospital and does not have enough beds....
I wish they would build our airport in Berlin. What they do in 11 days, we have not done after 11 years.

[Onkel Neal]

They did the same thing during the previous pneumonia.


As to the video - in the current era of internet based psyops I would be careful.

Very true, my friend.

[Jimbuna]

Possibly the hardest task at the moment is sorting out fact from fiction atm.

[ikalugin]

I wish they would build our airport in Berlin. What they do in 11 days, we have not done after 11 years.


Berlin airport is an excelent story of incompetence. But sadly offtopic.


As to the ontopic - they probably failed to contain the infection due to the travel Chinese do on the new year. And it would appear that centralised government from Beijing took over running this operation from the local (municipal) authorities.

[STEED]

So far the media that is to say here in the UK has not mentioned the last outbreak back in 2009-10 which was swine flu. :hmmm:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_flu_pandemic_tables

[Skybird]

Berlin airport is an excelent story of incompetence. But sadly offtopic.


As to the ontopic - they probably failed to contain the infection due to the travel Chinese do on the new year. And it would appear that centralised government from Beijing took over running this operation from the local (municipal) authorities.
Russians have no sense of humour, eh? ;)

During the last pandemic they build a huge hospital from scratch, equipped it and started operation in either 7 or 11 days.

(The new mega airport at Bejing they build in a fraction of the time they so far have consumed at Berlin).

[STEED]

An app that tasks users with spreading a deadly virus around the world has skyrocketed in popularity in China amid the coronavirus outbreak.https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-51222796

Interesting I would have said sales were down, looks like I got that wrong.

BTW: I tried the free version and killed the world by starting in China but that was a bacteria. Got bored with it after a short while, any how that is a bit of a eye opener.

The board game is better but that is another topic for another day.

[Catfish]

Russians have no sense of humour, eh? ;)

During the last pandemic they build a huge hospital from scratch, equipped it and started operation in either 7 or 11 days.

(The new mega airport at Bejing they build in a fraction of the time they so far have consumed at Berlin).


Yeah of course, but then such 'projects' can always be faster (read be forced) in a dictatorship :03:

[Mr Quatro]

Okay, I'm a little busy right now to find a link, but my new fear
is that this new virus can be transferred on to the next person
by people that don't even have even have any of the known symptoms
of the flu :o


Here it is ... back to work now:

China warns coronavirus can spread before symptoms show

https://www.cnn.com/asia/live-news/coronavirus-outbreak-01-27-20-intl-hnk/index.html

News about the coronavirus has dominated the headlines for days, as it has killed at least 80 people in China and spread across the globe.

Yet it still doesn't have an official name.

Although it has been widely referred to as the "Wuhan coronavirus," the virus is still formally known as "novel coronavirus" or
"2019-nCoV," where the "n" stands for "novel", while the "CoV" denotes "coronavirus."


PS I just read this at the bottom of the article

There are about 1,390 people from Wuhan currently in Macau, according to reports.

Those who do not obey orders are to stay in government-specified quarantine facilities.

This must be a place where they will be eliminated :hmmm::o:yep:

[Mr Quatro]

Now was not there a state-owned laboratory in Wuhan.. biological warfare development gone "wrong"? Or is it really all civilian there?
It's easy finger pointing, but wasn't there some precedent case there.

Yes Catfish your seed thought led me to check it out and are you ready for this FB is even chastising/rebuking FB users that pass on information about the virus being from eating bats and snakes.

Virus-hit Wuhan has two laboratories linked to Chinese bio-warfare program
Virology institute there has China's only secure lab for studying deadly virus

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2020/jan/24/virus-hit-wuhan-has-two-laboratories-linked-chines/

The deadly animal virus epidemic spreading globally may have originated in a Wuhan laboratory linked to China’s covert biological weapons program, according to an Israeli biological warfare expert.

[Onkel Neal]

First coronavirus case confirmed in Germany (https://www.welt.de/vermischtes/live205334991/Neuartige-Infektion-Erster-Coronavirus-Fall-in-Deutschland-bestaetigt.html)

According to the current assessment of experts, the novel lung disease appears to be mild in most cases, possibly even without symptoms. According to current knowledge, most of the deaths registered in China are due to older patients with severe previous illnesses.


The new pathogen is very similar to the virus behind the 2002/2003 Sars epidemic. At that time, according to data from the World Health Organization (WHO) between November 2002 and July 2003 there were only nine records in Germany. There were no deaths here.

[Skybird]

^ First human-to-human infection outside Asia.

Reactions, and the authorities over here, are quite relaxed.

Warnings are given that surgical masks are neither needed, nor are meant to provide cover to those wearing them, they are meant to protect the others from the person wearing the mask.


The only real fear and risk is, that the virus mutates further.

[JU_88]

Its not looking too good, But I expect it will end up on similar scale to SARS
There is nothing to gain from over or under estimating it at this point (on a personal level anyway)

[Skybird]

If it does not mutate, it will be a so-la-la story that gets desperately milked by media to win more views. The common seasonal cold or the winter temperature is more a health concern and kills more people, tbh.


But it might be a good test run for authorities and hospitals for the day when a real dangerous virus pandemic starts to rage.

[STEED]

If it does not mutate, it will be a so-la-la story that gets desperately milked by media to win more views. The common seasonal cold or the winter temperature is more a health concern and kills more people, tbh.


But it might be a good test run for authorities and hospitals for the day when a real dangerous virus pandemic starts to rage.

First point, indeed cry wolf enough times and people will laugh when it becomes far more deadly. This stupid milking of this story has gone on far to long.

Second point, no chance here in the UK our NHS can not cope with seasonal flu outbreaks. Come the day when we have a real nasty one the UK will be finished.


Question, has there been any deaths reported outside China? Not seen any news here if there is any.

[Onkel Neal]

Problem is, with China, they are most likely severely under reporting the numbers. You'll know it's a real problem if by Sunday there are 40,00 reported infected.

[Mr Quatro]

Question, has there been any deaths reported outside China? Not seen any news here if there is any.

Good news there is the answer is 'No'

https://apnews.com/8abebaa0abb67a92c1efe8501a122d0d

Peiris, an adviser on the World Health Organization’s coronavirus emergency committee, said it is reassuring that outside of China
the disease has not spread widely beyond the people who brought it from Wuhan.

[mapuc]

Came home a few hours ago after work, turn on my tv and can see there's a breaking news

The headlines

"Danish citizen is examined for possible corona infection.

The patient has been isolated

Hopefully it's false alarm, as it was with two Swedish citizens some days back.

Edit
As I hoped, it was false alarm
End of Edit

Markus

[Aktungbby]

:k_confused:GOOD NEWS: IT IS A FAIRLY STABLE NON-MUTATING VIRUS AND UNLIKE ITS PREDESSESSER, SARS, WHICH KILLED 10% (745 DEATHS W0RLDWIDE)THIS ONE IS ONLY KILLING 3%...:arrgh!: NOW IF ALL THE AMERICANS FLEEEING WUHAN WOULD JUST STAY PUT INSTEAD OF COMING TO SAN FRANCISCO, I'D FEEL BETTER....note: THAT PLAN HAS NOW BEEN DIVERTED TO ANCHORAGE ALASKA Americans in Wuhan Prepare to Flee Coronavirus—or Weather Outbreak in Isolated City U.S. evacuation flight set to ferry some citizens to California, while hundreds remain Americans in Wuhan Prepare to Flee Coronavirus—or Weather Outbreak in Isolated City:yeah:
The plane will land in Ontario, Calif., a city about one hour east of Los Angeles, a State Department spokeswoman said Monday. She added that all travelers would be screened for symptoms before departing. During a refueling stop in Anchorage, passengers will disembark into a terminal closed to the general public and receive another health screening before continuing on to California, said Anne Zink, Alaska’s chief medical officer.
Medics will be on the flight, Dr. Zink said. If a passenger shows symptoms between Wuhan and Anchorage, health officials will determine what to do on a case-by-case basis, she said, adding that Anchorage hospitals were prepared to treat any ill passengers.
Representatives for the California state Department of Public Health didn’t respond to requests for comment about the state’s plans for the plane’s arrival. ISOLATED CERTAINLY SOUNDS BETTER TO ME; SO WHO IN WASHINTON D.C. IS DETERMINING THAT BRINGING THEM HERE IS A BETTER PLAN.....:hmmm:

[Buddahaid]

They are all claiming diplomatic "immunity".

[Jimbuna]

They are all claiming diplomatic "immunity".

Sore subject in some parts of the UK atm :)

[mapuc]

Add additional 3 more confirmed infected with Corona in Germany.
(heard it 10 sec ago)

Markus

[Mr Quatro]

All those measures that Aktungbby's article talks about are being taken for a virus that can be passed on from one person to the next person by people that don't even show the symptoms yet, duh! :o


https://i0.wp.com/vietnaminsider.vn/wp-content/uploads/2020/01/cold-symptoms.jpeg?resize=1024%2C651&ssl=1

The Wuhan area is in a lockdown situation for over 50 million people ... California is only 38 million people :o

[Rockstar]

Keep an eye on "superspreader" in the news, i.e. 1 patient has infected around 14 hospital staff. If this was just being in the room with him while taking precautions that's scary... it'll go global in weeks.


A world-renowned scientist in Hong Kong has warned that the deadly Wuhan coronavirus could infect as many as 150,000 people per day in one of China’s largest metropolitan areas – Chongqing.

https://www.asiatimes.com/2020/01/article/hong-kong-urged-to-strengthen-anti-virus-measures/ (https://www.asiatimes.com/2020/01/article/hong-kong-urged-to-strengthen-anti-virus-measures/)

*****warning language*****
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dsx2vdn7gp (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dsx2vdn7gpY)

[Rockstar]

Now in an effort to quell the chances of mass panic and riot comes news of hope for a vaccine.

https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/health-environment/article/3047956/china-coronavirus-hong-kong-researchers-have

[Rockstar]

TWO WEEKS AGO
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dcbJdRb6mds





YESTERDAY talking about the possible need for draconian measures :o
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LZeKzqphlzM





TODAY @2:04 "The American public should not be fearful, BUT...." oh boy lol
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zz_EEQQA_Mk

[mapuc]

As expected as always

It's one of the laws of humanity that any major event must have its own conspiracy theories, and the coronavirus is no exception.

https://www.iflscience.com/health-and-medicine/people-are-sharing-dangerous-and-wild-conspiracy-theories-about-the-coronavirus-please-stop/?fbclid=IwAR18u5qu4r0p8-GlF9a8_Yy38JtYJWlycMkPDLYYH8KOiyn5ibet0u_fw60

Markus

[Buddahaid]

Hmmmm....
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-51288854

[Onkel Neal]

TWO WEEKS AGO






YESTERDAY talking about the possible need for draconian measures :o





TODAY @2:04 "The American public should not be fearful, BUT...." oh boy lol
]

Good info, thanks, man.

In 8 hours let's see if the reports match my projection:
29-Jan cases 8,696 deaths 161

[Catfish]

What is a bit scary is that tailored viruses for biological warfare are in the making.. but this is only a test :oops:

[Jimbuna]

Hundreds of British citizens being flown back to the UK from Wuhan on Thursday will be put in quarantine for two weeks.

Health Secretary Matt Hancock has instructed officials to put them in quarantine for two weeks - possibly at a UK military facility.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-51292590

[Mr Quatro]

Hundreds of British citizens being flown back to the UK from Wuhan on Thursday will be put in quarantine for two weeks.

Health Secretary Matt Hancock has instructed officials to put them in quarantine for two weeks - possibly at a UK military facility.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-51292590


201 American's have been flown from Wuhan China, but the plane has now been diverted and has now arrived at a military base outside LA

https://abcnews.go.com/US/us-chartering-evacuation-flight-wuhan-coronavirus-zone-california/story?id=68571310

The plane's 201 passengers underwent two sets of health screenings upon arrival in Anchorage, and all were approved to continue on to California, officials said in a press briefing early Wednesday morning.

Passengers erupted into cheers once they were all cleared, officials said. Authorities had said earlier that anyone who got sick en route to Alaska could be separated from the group in Anchorage and flown onward independently.

MORE: What to know about the new coronavirus' symptoms
All passengers were also screened twice before leaving China, said officials.

Upon arrival in California, all passengers will be quarantined for at least three days and monitored by the CDC, per authorities. Those who show signs of the illness and need to be tested could be held for as many as 14 days.

While around 4,500 people have been sickened in China, the CDC said on Monday that the disease is "not spreading" in the U.S. There have been five confirmed cases so far -- all of whom traveled to Wuhan.

[Mr Quatro]

Good info, thanks, man.

In 8 hours let's see if the reports match my projection:
29-Jan cases 8,696 deaths 161

Check this out Neal they already have a cure for this new virus

Something is very very fishy here along with the Chinese spy just caught in San Francisco with biotech sponsoring by China.

Spells money to me and lots of it :yep:

Kane Biotech (TSXV: KNE)

https://search.yahoo.com/search?fr=mcafee&type=E211US1274G91208&p=Kane+Biotech+(TSXV%3A+KNE)

KANE BIOTECH INC

Sponsored link by Viglink
kanebiotech.com
Headquarters: Winnipeg, MB
Stock Price: KNBIF (Other OTC) $0.1498 +0.0054(+3.74%)

Wed, Jan 29, 2020, 9:43AM EST

[Rockstar]

Check this out Neal they already have a cure for this new virus

Something is very very fishy here along with the Chinese spy just caught in San Francisco with biotech sponsoring by China.

Spells money to me and lots of it :yep:

Kane Biotech (TSXV: KNE)

https://search.yahoo.com/search?fr=mcafee&type=E211US1274G91208&p=Kane+Biotech+(TSXV%3A+KNE)

KANE BIOTECH INC

Sponsored link by Viglink
kanebiotech.com
Headquarters: Winnipeg, MB
Stock Price: KNBIF (Other OTC) $0.1498 +0.0054(+3.74%)

Wed, Jan 29, 2020, 9:43AM EST

When coronavirus made headlines most biotech stock, even those with absolutely no chinese connections, saw a spike in their share price. While others of mine took a header.

[Onkel Neal]

If they already "found" a cure, that suggests they knew about this particular virus months before its outbreak.

[Mr Quatro]

Suspicious at best ... that Canadian company (Kane Biotech) has been working on a cure for animals for a couple of years and already has a huge order for it pet line product from China before this news broke.

Russia and China Are Working on Virus Vaccine: Consulate
Jan. 29, 2020, at 2:44 a.m.

U.S. News & World Report
Russia and China Are Working on Virus Vaccine: Consulate

https://www.usnews.com/news/world/articles/2020-01-29/russia-says-it-is-working-on-virus-vaccine-together-with-china

MOSCOW (REUTERS) - Russia and China are working to develop a coronavirus vaccine and Beijing has handed over the genome of the virus to Moscow, a Russian diplomatic mission in China said on Wednesday.

The death toll in China from coronavirus rose to 132 on Wednesday with the number of confirmed cases now at nearly 6,000.

"Russian and Chinese experts have begun developing a vaccine," the Russian consulate in Guangzhou city said in a statement.


Somewhere in some little room greedy men are talking and plotting and planing how to make money off of this fear :o

[Onkel Neal]

They've updated - 7,186 confirmed cases worldwide, including 170 fatalities. (https://bnonews.com/index.php/2020/01/the-latest-coronavirus-cases/)

That's tracking
29-Jan 8,696 161

This time tomorrow look for 30-Jan 12,609 233



Oh boy, the truth is coming out :o

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EPdiCL_WAAA4DTm?format=jpg&name=900x900



:haha:

[Aktungbby]

THIS ONE IS ONLY KILLING 3%...:arrgh!:

They've updated - 7,186 confirmed cases worldwide, including 170 fatalities. (https://bnonews.com/index.php/2020/01/the-latest-coronavirus-cases/)

That's tracking
29-Jan 8,696 161

This time tomorrow look for 30-Jan 12,609 233




170 out 7,186 of makes it 2.3657% fatality rate....so far; 233 out of 12608 = 1.8480% a drop in the rate! EBOLA reported 28616 cases of which 11,310 died 39.5233 %!! Modern outbreaks of plague in 1997 reported 5,419 cases of which 274 died: 5%; and again in 2003, of which 182 died: 9%. The Medieval Black death plague (1340's)which also started in Asia is estimated to have killed 40%.The population was 200 years regaining the pre-endemic population count! ...considering Mother Nature 'calls the ball' we're in good shape here, assuming our Sino-friends are reporting acurately...:hmmm:

[Onkel Neal]

Hmm.... ok, but I think to get the actual mortality rate, you would need to factor in the day the patient gets sick, and the day he dies, which could be weeks later.

Say for example, you take the number of deaths on Jan 29 divided by the number of patients who were reported infected ~7 days earlier.

Wouldn't that be a more accurate rate of deaths? The patient does not die on the day he gets infected. So the number of deaths is always catching up to the number of infected.

[Aktungbby]

:hmmm:

[Aktungbby]

: NOW IF ALL THE AMERICANS FLEEEING WUHAN WOULD JUST STAY PUT INSTEAD OF COMING TO SAN FRANCISCO, I'D FEEL BETTER....note: THAT PLAN HAS NOW BEEN DIVERTED TO ANCHORAGE ALASKA ISOLATED CERTAINLY SOUNDS BETTER TO ME; SO WHO IN WASHINTON D.C. IS DETERMINING THAT BRINGING THEM HERE IS A BETTER PLAN.....:hmmm: JEEZE! Somebody down under reads my posts!(maybe Reece passed up the chain of command?:haha:) In today's WSJ: "Australia will pull out citizens stuck in Wuhan...and quarantine them in an immigration detention center on a remote island 1000 miles from its coast-Christmas Island near Indonesia. The quarantine plan is one of the most extreme undertaken by any government thus far to limit the spread of the virus. Evacuees will be kept there for two weeks believed to be the incubation period for a potetial virus carrier to develope symptoms. So far 600 people have registered with Australia's foreign affairs dept. Currently 7 people are confirmed to have the coronavirus Down Under." Somebody competently in charge realizes: with the devastating fires et al; Australia simply doesn't need a 'second headache' at this time in history!:yep: :ping::ping:

[mapuc]

Tried to find this Swedish article about the background of those who have died due to this Corona.

From memory

Most of those had a disease, such as high blood pressure, some kind of heart sickness and some more thing.

Not only the elder, as I mentioned before.

A fully fresh person, who are treated from the start, have a very high possibility to survive it.

Markus

[Mr Quatro]

Coronavirus –About 7,000 passengers and crew are trapped on a cruise ship in Italy amid fears two holidaymakers have coronavirus.

A husband and wife from China have been put in isolation on the Costa Smerelda, which might have Britons on board, after the couple came down with a fever and breathing problems.

Nothing to see here ... don't go there it's just a cruise ship sitting at dock

This is what fear can do :yep:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oTFYjvaEw7w

[Onkel Neal]

I wouldn't call it "fear", just being responsible.

[Aktungbby]

:O:I wouldn't call it "fear", just being responsible.
WELL AFTER EIGHT YEARS AND A CONVICTED CAPTAIN(16 YEARS FOR 32 DEAHS-MANSLAUGHTER), THOSE ITALIAN CAPTAINS ARE LEARNING...:up: 2012'S COSTA CONCORDIA DISASTER>https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/c7/Collision_of_Costa_Concordia_11.jpg/1024px-Collision_of_Costa_Concordia_11.jpg
THE COSTA SMERRALDA's CAPTAIN'S QUARANTINE IS JUST WISDOM ON THE HIGH SEAS....:arrgh!: ie THE POOR MANS VERSION OF AUSTRALIA's OFFSHORE CHRISTMAS ISLAND PRECAUTION.

[STEED]

Radio news has reported Italy has confirmed two cases.

Meanwhile UK ups the alert to relax and take a stress pill. Yea I have no faith in my useless government.

[Mr Quatro]

This scare is over ... this was the biggest one yet. :yep:

What if a sailor on a Chinese submarine should get sick though :o

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-51314138

Six thousand people on board a cruise ship in Italy have been allowed to disembark after health officials said a Chinese passenger who had symptoms of coronavirus had tested negative.

The 54-year-old as well as her husband were held in isolation on the ship but tests confirmed she was not infected.

Meanwhile, the World Health Organization (WHO) declared the coronavirus a global health emergency.

The death toll from the outbreak has risen to 170 in China.

[Rockstar]

30 January, the scare continues ;)

https://www.asiatimes.com/2020/01/article/wuhan-virus-spreads-to-every-region-in-china/

Wuhan virus spreads to every region in China

The pace of the outbreak is causing ‘acute’ concern for Beijing, the WHO and the rest of the world
It started off in Wuhan, but now the deadly coronavirus has spread to every region in China and is creeping across the planet.
Already the death toll has climbed past 200 while nearly 10,000 people have become infected by the 2019-nCoV disease.

[Catfish]

I still say it is not pure chance it all happened in Wuhan. Experimenting with biohazards that cannot be contained is one thing and bad enough, but tailored biosequences for military use escaping those facilities is worse.

[Jimbuna]

First two confirmed cases in the UK and only ten miles away from me :hmmm:

Two people from the same family have tested positive for coronavirus in the UK, the chief medical officer for England has announced.

They are being treated at a specialist centre in Newcastle after being taken there overnight.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-51325192

[STEED]

Nice one Bojo what's that you say, Britain's NHS can cope with it......:haha:

What garbage the NHS can not cope with the normal seasonal cold/flu outbreaks if this starts to infect greater numbers. :ping:

[Commander Wallace]

First two confirmed cases in the UK and only ten miles away from me :hmmm:


Just hold your breath for a while Jim, It will be ok. :D

There are a number of cases here in the U.S as well.

[Jimbuna]

Just hold your breath for a while Jim, It will be ok. :D

There are a number of cases here in the U.S as well.

I'd be interested in seeing a breakdown on those who have died because it is likely they all had underlying additional conditions but I doubt the Chinese will release that kind of information.

[Commander Wallace]

I'd be interested in seeing a breakdown on those who have died because it is likely they all had underlying additional conditions but I doubt the Chinese will release that kind of information.

I don't know how much of a role a predisposition has to do with this outbreak as this is a relatively new epidemic and as you said, figures are not widely available. A couple in Arizona developed the disease after the wife had traveled to the affected area ( Wuhan ) in China.

Those Countries like the U.S, England, Germany, France etc... should be able to handle the virus owing to the better medical facilities in these countries. Isolation and decent medical care should mitigate those numbers in developed countries. I don't know how many in China have access to decent medical care. Meanwhile, China is building a 1000 bed hospital in six days to deal with the virus.

https://archpaper.com/2020/01/china-is-building-a-1000-bed-hospital-in-six-days-to-deal-with-coronavirus/

[Mr Quatro]

I don't know how many in China have access to decent medical care. Meanwhile, China is building a 1000 bed hospital in six days to deal with the virus.

https://archpaper.com/2020/01/china-is-building-a-1000-bed-hospital-in-six-days-to-deal-with-coronavirus/


Now it's two (2) hospitals :o

https://www.wsj.com/articles/how-china-can-build-a-coronavirus-hospital-in-10-days-11580397751

Chinese authorities are rushing to build two new hospitals in Wuhan, the city at the heart of the coronavirus outbreak, in a matter of days to help combat the fast-spreading virus.

The outbreak is straining the resources of Wuhan’s front-line hospital staff, who have been forced to turn patients away because of a lack of beds and basic medical supplies. The 1,000-bed Huoshenshan facility is expected to be in operation Feb. 3, while the second, a 1,600-bed hospital called Leishenshan, is supposed to be ready by Feb. 5, just 10 to 12 days




One of the patients that died in Wuhan district was a eyes, ears and nose doctor treating the outbreak ... no one has died outside of China yet.

In fact no one has passed it on outside of China except for one lady that returned from China in Chicago and gave it to her husband.

Who would trust China :hmmm: ... not me :oops:

[Onkel Neal]

First two confirmed cases in the UK and only ten miles away from me :hmmm:

How many days can you go without leaving the house, Jim? If it comes to that.

[mapuc]

Sweden are now a member of this exclusive Corona-club.

A 20 year old woman have been infected with Corona.

Markus

[Jeff-Groves]

First two confirmed cases in the UK and only ten miles away from me :hmmm:

Taken to Newcastle eh?
Didn't that area take a major hit in the 1630's?
:hmmm:

[Onkel Neal]

@46:10 US govt makes it clear, they really don't know, and for once they are taking strident steps.

https://www.whitehouse.gov/live/

[Onkel Neal]

Spain's first case of coronavirus is someone who had contact with one of the cases in Germany


https://twitter.com/BNODesk/status/1223374787487072257

On the "conspiracy" front, we have:
https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/coronavirus-contains-hiv-insertions-stoking-fears-over-artificially-created-bioweapon

https://zh-prod-1cc738ca-7d3b-4a72-b792-20bd8d8fa069.storage.googleapis.com/s3fs-public/styles/inline_image_desktop/public/inline-images/HIV%20corona.jpg?itok=Yjq6C4BV

It has to be a conspiracy, no government actually experiments with biological weapons, right? :timeout:

[Rockstar]

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=12304547

Coronavirus: China accused of 'burning bodies in secret'

World health officials, back from a visit to Beijing, expressed great concern that a dangerous new virus was spreading between people outside of China, even as the number of illnesses continue to grow dramatically inside that Asian nation.
The new virus has now infected more people in China than were sickened during the 2002-2003 severe acute respiratory syndrome (SARS) outbreak. On Wednesday, the number of cases jumped to 5974, surpassing the 5327 people diagnosed with SARS.
The death toll, which stood at 132 on Wednesday, is lower than the 348 people who died in China from SARS.
Doubts have been raised about the official death toll, however, with claims Chinese authorities have been cremating bodies in secret.

[Onkel Neal]

The death toll, which stood at 132 on Wednesday, is lower than the 348 people who died in China from SARS.

Not after Sunday it won't be.

[Rockstar]

yep, a report of cremating bodies then to play down the death toll had me scratching my head, didn't make sense.

[Jimbuna]

How many days can you go without leaving the house, Jim? If it comes to that.

Well, put it this way, I've a couple of months supply of beer in one of the garages :03:

The two infected people were in York and Newcastle is the nearest facility with specialist quarantine facilities.

Unsurprisingly, both people are Chinese nationals.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-7951403/Coronavirus-hits-UK.html

[Jimbuna]

Taken to Newcastle eh?
Didn't that area take a major hit in the 1630's?
:hmmm:

I've no idea Jeff, I wasn't around then but I'll ask Ann :)

[Rockstar]

Here from what I believe to be a very reputable source, is what we actually know about the virus.

The Lancet 2019-nCoV Resource Centre
https://www.thelancet.com/coronavirus

Clinical features of patients infected with 2019 novel coronavirus in Wuhan, China
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30183-5/fulltext



I know for some here China is the big bad world player the unstoppable juggernaut who so good at everything it does, that will outsmart the world and all who oppose it. But from what I heard from reports out of China and Mongolia. Its a dump with a dysfunctional government and infrastructure and that reality is coming to the surface and now being exposed.

[ikalugin]

https://www.interfax.ru/russia/693663


Meanwhile Russia deployes military airlift and biological warfare specialists to evacuate Russian citizens from China.

[u crank]

But from what I heard from reports out of China and Mongolia. Its a dump with a dysfunctional government and infrastructure and that reality is coming to the surface and now being exposed.


This is something that has been a suspicion of mine for a while. And I think the Chinese government lives in fear of something like this outbreak. An event which they cannot control.

[Mr Quatro]

This is something that has been a suspicion of mine for a while. And I think the Chinese government lives in fear of something like this outbreak. An event which they cannot control.

Speaking of fear :o

Were you aware that North Korea and Mongolia have closed their borders to China :yep:

Hong Kong is next

[Rockstar]

https://www.interfax.ru/russia/693663


Meanwhile Russia deployes military airlift and biological warfare specialists to evacuate Russian citizens from China.




"Beijing, which insists it can contain the virus, began to show impatience over the growing ostracism, with the foreign ministry calling Washington's earlier advice against travel to China "unkind".
"Certainly it is not a gesture of goodwill," foreign ministry spokeswoman Hua Chunying said. :rolls: trying to save face by blaming someone else maybe?

[Onkel Neal]

I've no idea Jeff, I wasn't around then but I'll ask Ann :)

At least we know it won't be Kung Flu that kills you, Jim :arrgh!:

[mapuc]

I get the feeling by hearing, reading the officials news stream

That this Corona virus is in a way intelligent

Markus

[Mr Quatro]

A few new facts:

More than half of China extends shutdown over virus

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/02/01/coronavirus-more-of-china-extend-shutdown-accounting-for-80percent-of-gdp.html

At least 21 provinces, municipalities and regions in China have told businesses not to resume work before Feb. 10 at the earliest.

The Lunar New Year holiday was initially set to run from Jan. 24 to Jan. 30, with work resuming on Jan. 31. Nationwide, the Chinese government has extended the holiday so that businesses would not reopen until Monday, Feb. 3

Hubei, where the disease is concentrated, has told businesses not to reopen until at least Feb. 14

Tianjin: Businesses and schools are not to reopen until further notice.

In most regions, businesses involved with public utilities, supermarkets or other essential industries are to remain open.

[Catfish]

I get the feeling by hearing, reading the officials news stream
That this Corona virus is in a way intelligent Markus
I'd rather say it is tailored for certain targets.
I still wonder if it is an overreaction or if it really is that dangerous :hmmm:

[Jeff-Groves]

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/EsteemedDeliriousAdouri-size_restricted.gif

[Onkel Neal]

I'd rather say it is tailored for certain targets.
I still wonder if it is an overreaction or if it really is that dangerous :hmmm:

Hard to say, but we will find out. Let's hope these containment measures, while certain to trigger some segments of our population, are effective the spread levels off.

Had to laugh at this:
https://www.aljazeera.com/mritems/Images/2020/2/1/f5d081747b114dac80f466a7f9702190_18.jpg

Facemasks optional, Scientists doubt their effectiveness

Yet, everyone in the medical field and affected areas are wearing them. :)

[Skybird]

Neal,

these face masks they talk of, are not for no reason called "surgeon masks". They are not meant to protect the wearer from infection, but they are meant for him not infecting others. The surgeon should not breath into the open wounds of his "victim", and a patient being infectous should not sneeze into the face of his nurse. No infection by mopisture drops or mouth and nose moisture being sneezed or breathed out.

Thats why I recommended the kind of masks that I described on earlier pages. These DO protect the person wearing them, but only if using filters of the FFP3 norm, which may be labelled differently in the US. These filters are not just coffee filters :D, but are woven by nano-filament.

The mask frame with silicon rim may cost around 20-30 coins, a filter 5-10 coins. If you have a beard, shave it off, else the mask is insufficently sealed. Men shoud always shave before exposing themselves to a ciontaminated environment where they must wear such half-masks, as they are claled in German. If you do not want that, choose full face-covering masks.

But that is exaggerated for this virus, I think. While the infection potential of this virus is extremely high, it lethaölity is not, SARS was wors,e and the oridnary seasonal flu causes more deaths every season. Many infected people do not form symptoms that seriously takes them out of action.

The simple paper masks have their purpose. But most people who feel afraid simply do not know how to use them correctly and in what way to correctly handle them, technicallyy, so that these masks would do what they should. Wrong purpose and bad handling. No good combination, and thus: almost pointless indeed.

[Jeff-Groves]

And everyone was afraid of a Zombie Virus!
:har::har:

[Onkel Neal]

Neal,

these face masks they talk of, are not for no reason called "surgeon masks". They are not meant to protect the wearer from infection, but they are meant for him not infecting others. The surgeon should not breath into the open wounds of his "victim", and a patient being infectous should not sneeze into the face of his nurse. No infection by mopisture drops or mouth and nose moisture being sneezed or breathed out.

.

Yeah, so? It works in one direction? :O:

https://i.imgur.com/15Y77BX.jpg

[Rockstar]

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30183-5/fulltext


https://els-jbs-prod-cdn.literatumonline.com/cms/attachment/atypon:cms:attachment:img:d73e6:rev:1580353696770-4553:pii:S0140673620X00055/cover.tif.jpg


Coronaviruses are enveloped non-segmented positive-sense RNA viruses belonging to the family Coronaviridae and the order Nidovirales and broadly distributed in humans and other mammals. Although most human coronavirus infections are mild, the epidemics of the two betacoronaviruses, severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus (SARS-CoV) and Middle East respiratory syndrome coronavirus (MERS-CoV),have caused more than 10 000 cumulative cases in the past two decades, with mortality rates of 10% for SARS-CoV and 37% for MERS-CoV.

The coronaviruses already identified might only be the tip of the iceberg, with potentially more novel and severe zoonotic events to be revealed.

SO I guess what they're trying too say is, one day quite possibly in our future the feces is going to hit the rotating oscillator.

[Rockstar]

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-02-01/china-vows-financial-stability-as-markets-prepare-for-selloff


China Vows Financial Stability With Markets Bracing for Selloff
Bloomberg News February 1, 2020, 4:01 AM EST Updated on February 1, 2020, 4:45 AM EST

[Onkel Neal]

"We're coming to give you your flu shot, comrades"
https://twitter.com/i/status/1223777826970562560

Edit: JANUARY 30, 2020 / 2:21 AM / 3 DAYS AGO
Philippines confirms first case of new coronavirus: health minister (https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-health-philippines/philippines-confirms-first-case-of-new-coronavirus-health-minister-idUSKBN1ZT0S0)

Coronavirus: Philippines reports first death outside China (https://www.scmp.com/news/asia/southeast-asia/article/3048576/china-coronavirus-duterte-orders-travel-ban-visitors)
Published: 9:51am, 2 Feb, 2020

[Jimbuna]

At least we know it won't be Kung Flu that kills you, Jim :arrgh!:

I doubt the virus could survive the cold environment we 'enjoy' up north :03:

[Mr Quatro]

This is not a small hospital, uh?

Read the article for more updates about the death toll true, but also about the new Bird flu and the swine flu already in progress now will cause a food problem in China

China builds a coronavirus hospital within 10 days

https://static01.nyt.com/images/2020/02/02/world/02virus-briefing-hospital/merlin_168258054_74d60639-1313-4608-bd97-0a51c07d1c41-superJumbo.jpg?quality=90&auto=webp

The Chinese government has delivered on its promise to build a hospital for coronavirus patients at the epicenter of the outbreak within 10 days. About 1,400 military medics will begin working at the hospital on Monday, according to state news media.

[Mr Quatro]

Here's a man from Hong Kong in the article above that only spent a few hours in mainland China and then went on a cruise in Japan with 3,000 other passengers. I wonder if they had any contact with him?

Hong Kong confirmed its 14th coronavirus case late Saturday. The patient, an 80-year-old man, had traveled for a few hours to mainland China in early January, and later spent several days on a cruise ship in Japan with more than 3,000 passengers and employees.

This could get out of hand in a hurry if true due to the disease can be passed on by people that have no symptoms.

The lady in Chicago that flew home from China had no symptoms yet her and her husband came down with the virus.

One man in Indonesia came down with the virus .. guess what his job was? A taxi driver, duh?

[Jimbuna]

A man has died of the coronavirus in the Philippines, the first confirmed fatality outside China.

The patient was a 44-year-old Chinese man from Wuhan, in Hubei province, where the virus was first detected.

He appeared to have been infected before arriving in the Philippines, the World Health Organization (WHO) said.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-51345855

[Buddahaid]

Meanwhile in the US......
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-51342278

No filter! No brains.

[Aktungbby]

C'MON NOW! He said he was SARRY :yep: and they rebooked him on a later flight...meanwhile DOW has dropped 600 points(not to worry; I'll recoup on cut rate Boeing and PG&E stock:yep::Kaleun_Salivating::Kaleun_Party:)and China's expansionist Belt and Road takeover of Earth has taken a hit amidships; even close ally, North Korea has officially sealed boarder traffic with its only ally...China. EVEN NORWGIAN CRUISE LINES IS AFFLICTED https://www.newsweek.com/hawaii-family-lose-thousands-cancel-cruise-china-coronavirus-1485228 (https://www.newsweek.com/hawaii-family-lose-thousands-cancel-cruise-china-coronavirus-1485228) Morrison says she contacted Costco first, but they referred her to Norwegian Cruise Line who told her that she was not eligible for a refund and that her trip insurance doesn't cover an epidemic.
Morrison said she was told the "bottom line is, if you cancel you lose all your money."
"Rather than put myself through all that headache and most of all the risk of getting this virus, I just want to be able to cancel my cruise and get my refund. That's all I ask," she said. "And I don't think that's a lot to ask with what's going on. And it's getting worse every day."
A spokesperson for Norwegian, which is based in the U.S., told CNBC that it hasn't altered any of its itineraries due to the coronavirus outbreak, but that none of its vessels are currently porting in mainland China.

[Catfish]

So next time there is a flu somehere in the world all airlines and trade will come to a halt? :doh:

[Aktungbby]

The population was 200 years regaining the pre-endemic population count! ...considering Mother Nature 'calls the ball'we're in good shape here, assuming our Sino-friends are reporting acurately...:hmmm:
So next time there is a flu somehere in the world all airlines and trade will come to a halt? :doh: Yes,but in this case ...who FLU the koop?!!2/02/2020:China reports outbreak of deadly bird flu among chickens in Hunan province, close to coronavirus epicentre of Wuhan
Bird flu outbreak in Hunan province, which lies on the southern border of Hubei province, the epicentre of the coronavirus outbreak
Bird flu is much deadlier than either Sars or the coronavirus, but as of yet no human cases have been reported in this outbreak
With the ongoing African Swine Fever epidemic: https://www.nytimes.com/2019/12/17/business/china-pigs-african-swine-fever.html (https://www.nytimes.com/2019/12/17/business/china-pigs-african-swine-fever.html)
A devastating disease spreading from China has wiped out roughly one-quarter of the world’s pigs, reshaping farming and hitting the diets and pocketbooks of consumers around the globe. China’s unsuccessful efforts to stop the disease may have hastened the spread — creating problems that could bedevil Beijing and global agriculture for years to come...The epidemic shows the limits (https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/22/business/china-pigs-african-swine-fever.html) of China’s emphasis on government-driven, top-down solutions to major problems, sometimes at the expense of the practical. It has also laid bare the struggle of a country of 1.4 billion people to feed itself. 'Twixt the corona virus; the chicken flu; and the swine fever, the worlds largest population is under a three-prong attack; suffering the ravages of Mother Nature's method of overpopulation control: Pigs, Poultry or People..... oh my! hmmm:

[Jimbuna]

Coronavirus: UK tells all Britons to leave China 'if they can'

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-51374056

Better late than never? :hmmm:

[Moonlight]

THE Chinese authorities are deliberately falsifying the coronavirus numbers, a leading expert has said.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/10886942/overwhelmed-china-deliberately-faking-coronavirus-death-toll-government-crumbles-killer-outbreak/

If this is true ^ it wouldn't suplise me.

[mapuc]

And now to something different....Sport

We are heading towards to major sport event

European Championship Football and the Olympic in Tokyo

It have made me wonder if one or both of these event will be postponed or cancelled.

Markus

[Mr Quatro]

Now this is big news and China is mad at the US for shutting down air travel :hmmm:


Coronavirus: Bad Luck Hits Macau Casinos With 15-Day Shutdown
China’s gambling hub suffers blow in unprecedented closure

https://www.wsj.com/articles/deadly-coronavirus-forces-chinas-gambling-hub-to-shut-its-casinos-11580816447

MACAU—Casinos in the world’s richest gambling market were already down on their luck when city officials ordered them on Tuesday to close their doors at midnight for 15 days to help curb the spread of the coronavirus that has killed hundreds of people in China.

I have seen video's on the news that show drones following people that don't wear face mask and making verbal notice of it to everyone around them. :o

[Mr Quatro]

Here it is ... I saw it on ABC :yep:
even has a video :up:

https://abcnews.go.com/International/coronavirus-china-deploys-drones-cameras-loudhailers-chastise-people/story?id=68746989

Coronavirus: China deploys drones with cameras, loudhailers to chastise people for unsafe behavior

Chinese authorities are employing drones in their fight to contain the new coronavirus outbreak, including using loudspeakers to warn unsuspecting members of the public who are taking insufficient precautions or breaking rules put in place to prevent the spread of the virus, China state television claims.

Videos released by Chinese state media outlets show a drone’s-eye-view of confrontations between citizens and the unmanned aircraft, which are equipped with loudspeakers allowing officials to communicate with the public.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QPw6xjwAlHc

[Catfish]

As far as i read this is a flu virus. What the hell is so dangerous? :doh:

Ok, on one hand China's dictator Xi Jinping wants to show off how capable his ruling model is, in comparison to the decadent west.
So spraying something into the landscape, building hospitals in a few weeks, deploying drones and publicly denouncing and chastizing people who do not follow orders is the try to appear as if it all is under control. Fail.

[Rockstar]

490 fatalities from 2019-nCov

3,219 serious
892 recovered
23,260 suspected


U.S. Averages
102 fatalities per day from auto accidents
130 fatalities per day from drug overdose
14 fatalities per day from food poisoning
44 murders per day
6 alien abductions per day

[Onkel Neal]

As far as i read this is a flu virus. What the hell is so dangerous? :doh:

Ok, on one hand China's dictator Xi Jinping wants to show off how capable his ruling model is, in comparison to the decadent west.
So spraying something into the landscape, building hospitals in a few weeks, deploying drones and publicly denouncing and chastizing people who do not follow orders is the try to appear as if it all is under control. Fail.

What's so dangerous about a novel virus? If you contract it, it could kill you. I'm 60, so I would be high risk. And even if it does not kill you, I don't want to spend a week in the Intensive Care Unit in extreme distress. :shucks:

So next time there is a flu somehere in the world all airlines and trade will come to a halt? :doh:

Yes, it would be nice to stop this from spreading. This is not a flu virus that we are used to. And there's no way to say it won't mutate as it spreads and kills more people. Imagine you have a 3 year old granddaughter and she contracts this, suffers and dies. The most important thing we can do is all we can to limit the spread of this virus.

[Catfish]

^ maybe it is being played down here, but there seems to be not much concern about it.
A bigger problem here are the thousands of people blocking emergency hospitalisation because they think they have this corona virus.

"This is not a flu virus we are used to".
True, though the flu virus we know kills ten thousands more than this new one.

Better safe than sorry alright, you have a point.

[Onkel Neal]

1. A bigger problem here are the thousands of people blocking emergency hospitalisation because they think they have this corona virus.

"This is not a flu virus we are used to".
2. True, though the flu virus we know kills ten thousands more than this new one.




1. That's definitely a big concern, if your town experiences a massive outbreak, service could be overwhelmed, leading to more casualties. If you have not seen the movie Contagion, I highly recommend it. The virus in that movie was fictitious, it affected the victim more quickly and more lethally than coronavirus seems to do, but the transmissiblity seems comparable. And with these viruses, we never know how it could adapt to treatment and drugs, it could get worse. A mad dog that could become a rabid lion.

2, The new flu will match the old flu, probably surpass it by a lot, if it ever gets loose in the general population. That's why the concern now is containment. It's a small problem as long as we act strenuously to limit the spread. We will know in 4~6 weeks how these actions fare.

I think of it like a fire. You see a small fire in your apartment, you know without thinking that it must be extinguished with every possible effort while it is still possible to do so. Act casually and it could spread beyond any hope of control before you realize it.

[Jimbuna]

At least 10 people on board a cruise ship docked in the Japanese port of Yokohama have tested positive for coronavirus, health authorities say.

Almost 300 of the 3,700 people on the Diamond Princess have been tested so far. The number of infected could rise.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-51381594

Being on a ship (especially if underway at sea) is one of the last places I'd want to be.

[Mr Quatro]

Being on a ship (especially if underway at sea) is one of the last places I'd want to be.

Not me ... my time at sea was with healthy people

I see some kind of similarity here with the man that died in Hong Kong had only been in China for a few hours before he took at cruise in Japan. So he comes back tested positive and died in Hong Kong (which now has the nurses on strike) and I wondered if he had passed it on to the ships passengers.

Now there are two cruise ships in Japan with the same virus problems


Ten people aboard a quarantined cruise ship run by Doral-based Carnival have tested positive for coronavirus, including one American.

https://news.yahoo.com/10-people-test-positive-coronavirus-155659657.html

One Filipino crew member, two Australian passengers, three Japanese passengers, one passenger from the U.S. and three passengers from Hong Kong have all tested positive aboard the Diamond Princess, which will remained locked down for at least 14 more days in Japan, Princess Cruises said in a statement Tuesday.

Japanese health officials held the Diamond Princess ship at the Yokohama port outside Tokyo on Tuesday to inspect all 3,711 people on board because a man tested positive for the virus on Feb. 1 after disembarking in Hong Kong.

The Japanese military has taken the people who have the virus to local hospitals, the company said. Around half of the 2,666 passengers on board the ship are from Japan; 416 are from the U.S.

2nd cruise ship :o

Nearly 2,000 people are also being held on another cruise ship called World Dream at Hong Kong’s Kai Tak Cruise Terminal after several crew members reported symptoms associated with the coronavirus.

[Rockstar]

"This is not a flu virus we are used to".
True, though the flu virus we know kills ten thousands more than this new one.

Better safe than sorry alright, you have a point.

We cant simply compare the total number of fatalities. We need to look at is whats called the 'case fatality rates'. Which places SARS, MERS and 2019-nCov in a far more deadly catagory than say the common flu virus.

SARS case fatalities I think were around 10%. The common flu case fatalies are around 0.1% . Yes the percentages maybe somewhat off but you get the idea

[mapuc]

About informations on this Corona Virus.

We can fully believe what China tell our news media
or
We can believe what those none-main stream tells us.

In my opinion I say they are both wrong.

The death toll is between what China have told us and what those alt-media have said.

Then the question is

How many have actually died and how many have actually been infected

Markus

[Mr Quatro]

Chinese President Xi Jinping has been missing for days now

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/02/05/asia/xi-jinping-china-wuhan-virus-intl-hnk/index.html

Xi himself has not been seen for several days, missing from his usual place of prominence on the front page of the state-owned People's Daily newspaper and in the nightly newscast on state broadcaster CCTV.
This is weird, not only because a country's leader is normally front and center during a crisis, but because Xi typically dominates media coverage at the best of times, regardless of how seemingly routine his activities are. Since he came to power in 2012, the People's Daily especially has become known for running multiple headlines about Xi

Could this mean the Communist Party is tired of their leader (since 2012) or
does it mean they want to blame Wuhan's problems on lesser persons?

[Onkel Neal]

Conspiracy alert: Tencent may have accidentally leaked real data on Wuhan virus deaths

https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/3871594

Tencent briefly lists 154,023 infections and 24,589 deaths from Wuhan coronavirus

s many experts question the veracity of China's statistics for the Wuhan coronavirus outbreak, Tencent over the weekend seems to have inadvertently released what is potentially the actual number of infections and deaths, which were astronomically higher than official figures.

On late Saturday evening (Feb. 1), Tencent, on its webpage titled "Epidemic Situation Tracker," showed confirmed cases of novel coronavirus (2019nCoV) in China as standing at 154,023, 10 times the official figure at the time. It listed the number of suspected cases as 79,808, four times the official figure.

The number of cured cases was only 269, well below the official number that day of 300. Most ominously, the death toll listed was 24,589, vastly higher than the 300 officially listed that day.

Moments later, Tencent updated the numbers to reflect the government's "official" numbers that day. Netizens noticed that Tencent has on at least three occasions posted extremely high numbers, only to quickly lower them to government-approved statistics.

Some are speculating that a coding problem could be causing the real "internal" data to accidentally appear. Others believe that someone behind the scenes is trying to leak the real numbers.

[d@rk51d3]

Conspiracy alert: Tencent may have accidentally leaked real data on Wuhan virus deaths

https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/3871594

Tencent briefly lists 154,023 infections and 24,589 deaths from Wuhan coronavirus

Couple of reports I've heard from acquaintances... one from a medico in Singapore, says at least 90K infected, and that was about a week ago.

Another went back to China for CNY, and says he won't be back any time soon. Populace have been herded into apartment blocks, with the doors barred shut behind them. Bodies in the streets, that have lain there for at least a week.

[Onkel Neal]

Couple of reports I've heard from acquaintances... one from a medico in Singapore, says at least 90K infected, and that was about a week ago.

Another went back to China for CNY, and says he won't be back any time soon. Populace have been herded into apartment blocks, with the doors barred shut behind them. Bodies in the streets, that have lain there for at least a week.

Yeah, there is a lot of buzz about Singapore recently.

[Traveller]

Yep. Doctors and nurses in China are saying anonymously (for fear of arrest) that the actual numbers are perhaps 10x higher than the official numbers, meaning up to 250,000 infected and 5,000 dead.

- Apparently crematoriums in Wuhan are running at full capacity 24/7.

https://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/world-news/wuhan-coronavirus-crematoriums-working-247-21434630


- Mysterious thick 'fog' descends on Wuhan. Crematorium smoke?

https://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/latest-news/fears-thick-death-smog-over-21426098


- Chinese government has ordered a funeral ban. Bodies must be incinerated immediately.

https://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/world-news/china-orders-coronavirus-corpses-instantly-21420935

[Jimbuna]

Not me ... my time at sea was with healthy people

I see some kind of similarity here with the man that died in Hong Kong had only been in China for a few hours before he took at cruise in Japan. So he comes back tested positive and died in Hong Kong (which now has the nurses on strike) and I wondered if he had passed it on to the ships passengers.

Now there are two cruise ships in Japan with the same virus problems


Ten people aboard a quarantined cruise ship run by Doral-based Carnival have tested positive for coronavirus, including one American.

https://news.yahoo.com/10-people-test-positive-coronavirus-155659657.html



2nd cruise ship :o

I'm thankful my boy is on extended leave atm.

[Catfish]

^ was already thinking of him, good to hear :)

[Jimbuna]

^ was already thinking of him, good to hear :)

Cheers Kai :up:

[Onkel Neal]

Chinese doctor Li Wenliang, one of the eight whistleblowers who tried to warn other medics of the #coronavirus outbreak but were reprimanded by local police, dies of coronavirus on Thursday in Wuhan, the Global Times has learned.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EQGYxWAUcAcfsU1?format=jpg&name=360x360https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EQGYxWAUcAUnXiC?format=jpg&name=360x360

[Mr Quatro]

All of this news is not good ... I believe that it is going to get a lot worse before it gets better, but the report of 25k dead does not compute.

I know they like to have funerals and you can't hide that many deaths from the relatives they wouldn't stand for it.

But what Traveller posted made me very sober ... they can't lie forever :o

Apparently crematoriums in Wuhan are running at full capacity 24/7.

Mysterious thick 'fog' descends on Wuhan. Crematorium smoke?

Chinese government has ordered a funeral ban. Bodies must be incinerated immediately

[STEED]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EQGYxWAUcAcfsU1?format=jpg&name=360x360https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EQGYxWAUcAUnXiC?format=jpg&name=360x360

Reported on SKY News a few minutes ago he is not dead. :hmmm:





Too much bullcrap news and lies and harrdly any proper factual news. News agencies world wide are getting their jollies from this. :nope:

[Mr Quatro]

Reported on SKY News a few minutes ago he is not dead. :hmmm:

Too much bullcrap news and lies and harrdly any proper factual news. News agencies world wide are getting their jollies from this. :nope:

I don't have time to follow up every news item ... keep up the good work :up:

[Traveller]

Reported on SKY News a few minutes ago he is not dead. :hmmm:

Too much bullcrap news and lies and harrdly any proper factual news. News agencies world wide are getting their jollies from this. :nope:


It's all over the news. He is dead.

[Traveller]

Analyst: China's coronavirus victims 'probably 10 times' higher than reported

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/chinas-coronavirus-victims-likely-10-times-higher-than-reported-analyst-says-155836267.html

We had an estimated 45M influenza cases in 2017-2018- roughly 13.8% of total US population. Of those cases, an estimated 61K died- or 0.135% of those that were infected. If the Coronavirus hit those same 45M with a 3% mortality rate, that would 1.35M, which would put it as one of the worst pandemics in the US, let alone if it hit other countries in the same fashion. It would be catastrophic. 3% is massive compared to 0.135%.The reason why this virus is so much more serious than SARS is that SARS only infected others after symptoms showed. This new Coronavirus reportedly can infect others before symptoms show (2-14 day incubation period).

Also, China supposedly has 60+ million citizens in quarantine lockdown now and is quickly building new hospitals within 8 days that can hold 1,000 patients each.

Serious indeed.

[Traveller]

As of today, the 'official' numbers are now 630 dead and 31,000 infected. Unofficial numbers could be as high as 6,300 dead and 310,000 infected.

https://news.yahoo.com/everything-know-mysterious-deadly-wuhan-152644525.html


About 5 million residents (half the population) left Wuhan city before the lockdown because of the deadly Coronavirus epidemic.

https://www.scmp.com/news/china/society/article/3047720/chinese-premier-li-keqiang-head-coronavirus-crisis-team-outbreak

[em2nought]

Coronavirus might keep Social Security solvent for several decades to come. :hmmm: Social Security might not even be needed anymore. :o

[Mr Quatro]

It's all over the news. He is dead.

Yes he's a goner now ... Steed must have gotten in on the end when he just had his heart stop ... He's dead after signing a document that he was a danger to the state for causing alarms.

So much for what the authorities think :o

I wonder if Chinese President Xi Jinping has to wear a mask now after his visit to the Wuhan. Maybe he's in quarantine too :yep:

Thank you Traveller it's harder to find data on the Wuhan problem too

So keep it up ... just make sure of the source.

Like the cruise ship now in Hong Kong that is quarantined I wonder if it was the same one that the Hong visitor to China took for a cruise and died Feb 1st after returning?

Did you know that that cruise ship was headed for Taiwan and it was denied entry so it went on to Hong Kong and now all cruise ship ports in Hong Hong have been closed.

[Buddahaid]

There needs to be a better name for this virus variant. I think Lysol labels state it's kills human coronavirus.

[Traveller]

There needs to be a better name for this virus variant. I think Lysol labels state it's kills human coronavirus.

It's part of the coronavirus family, and the official name is (2019-nCoV), but everyone just calls is Coronavirus.

[Traveller]

Epidemiologist: Virus is spreading among locals overseas and it's now too late to contain.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4T_Gs9xNjA

[Traveller]

Global shipping has been hit by the coronavirus. Goods are now getting stranded.

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/02/05/business/shipping-coronavirus-impact/index.html

Besides the shipping problem, factories are being idled all over China right now and production is way down due to the virus. If there's anything you need to buy and it's made in China, I suggest getting in now while it's still available.

[Onkel Neal]

There needs to be a better name for this virus variant. I think Lysol labels state it's kills human coronavirus.

Kung Flu ?


Expert: Virus is spreading among locals overseas and it's now too late to contain.

]

That's possibly true, but it still doesn't feel like it. I guess when we see the number of cases in Singapore, Japan, Thailand shoot up 20% daily, it will seem real.

[Traveller]

Kung Flu ?

That's possibly true, but it still doesn't feel like it. I guess when we see the number of cases in Singapore, Japan, Thailand shoot up 20% daily, it will seem real.

With a 2-14 day incubation period, I have a feeling we'll start seeing many more confirmed overseas cases in the next week or so. They say on average, each infected individual infects 2-3 more people (remember, it can take each newly infected individual up to 14 days before the first symptoms show). Exponential infections is a possibility until a vaccine is developed.

And speaking of Japan (where I live), I remember hearing about the first case two weeks ago where a tour bus driver was infected by a Chinese passenger. He was the first. There are now 45 confirmed cases in Japan, and probably many more unconfirmed cases. The scary thing is that the guy from Hong Kong who infected that cruise ship which in now in quarantine traveled around Tokyo for 3 days before flying back to Hong Kong, after which his first symptoms started showing.

And good luck finding surgical masks (not that they protect the wearer) or antibacterial hand gels in Japan. They are sold out everywhere. I went to several local drugstores and asked when they would get more in and they said they had no idea.

[Traveller]

Experts: Already a pandemic situation.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wq33oZdQ-R4

[Traveller]

Beijing (China's capital) basically a ghost town due to lockdown.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K19YfNr7Vqc

[Traveller]

Number of confirmed Coronavirus cases on quarantined cruise ship jumps to 61.
A total of 61 people have been confirmed to have Wuhan coronavirus on the Diamond Princess cruise ship, quarantined off the coast of Japan with 1,045 crew and 2,666 passengers on board.

Some 20 cases had been confirmed on Thursday, and an additional 41 confirmed today. The number of cases on board raise the national total of confirmed cases to 86.https://edition.cnn.com/asia/live-news/coronavirus-outbreak-02-07-20-intl-hnk/index.html

Exponential.

[Gorpet]

As an American construction worker, I say bring it on to this country. Why? I want this country to watch as the Washington Politicians, Hollywood movie star's ,
The Elite news media and all the social progressives right down to your own local Mayor and City Council Members Make a choice.Stay and possibly die or Haul ass out of this country with their precious family's. And on steps of their 747's ,

They will thank you for voting them into Office.And tell you they are going to find a cure. And as Macarthur said I will return, And when the dead are dead and burned .Low and Behold the return of the Shepherd .The sheep will need a Shepherd And his family will once again bring knowledge and enlightenment to their dismal world. Yes the return of the same Super smart wealthy Sob's Politicians and their family's that the dead voted
into office to begin with.But there will be no more division in this country, just the surviving sheep that need basic math and writing so they can begin teaching them what taxes are and how a wonderful world they will now create if you just give up all your memories of the past. Work hard fo da tribe trust into them for the new future. Yep let's see if today's Sheep can catch the Shepherds leaving them to the Wolf. Yi Pi Ki ya . Let the United States be a Beacon .We are the richest country on this planet and we have the best crematorium's , so get here if you don't want to be just dumped in a hole in the ground . End Transmission:Kaleun_Cheers:

[Gorpet]

Traveller, My post was not directed at you. I just couldn't figure out how to make a Independent post. Live long and prosper while you can my friend. I think the Elite's that live on this little planet are inducing population control.End Transmission:Kaleun_Salute::Kaleun_Salute:

[Mr Quatro]

Your sick GORPET :o You know that, right? :D

[Traveller]

Methinks somebody had a wee bit too much whiskey to drink. :)

[Traveller]

Infected cruise ship docked in Naha, Okinawa before arriving in Yokohama. 2,600 passengers debarked.

Nakasone warned that many cruise ship passengers had used taxis and buses during their stay in Naha, and said that “taxi and bus drivers (who may have had contact with the infected travelers) may be at high risk.”

https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2020/02/05/national/science-health/naha-alert-coronavirus-last-week-quarantine-cruise-ship/#.Xj1MwDyRWyU

It's probably already spread all over Naha by now.

[STEED]

Yes he's a goner now ... Steed must have gotten in on the end when he just had his heart stop ... He's dead after signing a document that he was a danger to the state for causing alarms.


Yea they said later in the evening their investigation has found he died. No doubt the conspiracy lot will say he was bumped off.

As for the outbreak it seems to be dropping in the news agenda here down to third or fourth news item. Maybe be the viewers are fed up with having this rammed down their guts 24/7 and the news media has noticed. I for one doubt that....:03:

[Onkel Neal]

Yeah, back to Trump and the Royals for the uneducated masses.

[STEED]

Yeah, back to Trump and the Royals for the uneducated masses.

Top story here today...

Phillip Schofield comes out as gay - 'I have been coming to terms with it' :roll:

[mapuc]

I still claim - the real numbers of defected and who have died from this Corona virus, is somewhere between the official numbers and those mentioned in our alt-media.

Markus

[Onkel Neal]

Markus, I believe you are right. I have a running estimate of what I think the actual figures are, far right two columns. Based only on anecdotal information from the web.

[Traveller]

I still claim - the real numbers of defected and who have died from this Corona virus, is somewhere between the official numbers and those mentioned in our alt-media.

Markus

Is isn't just the so-called 'alt-media' saying this, but also mainstream media sources are saying the infection and death rates could be 10x higher than the Chinese government numbers.


If China's been reporting about 800 with 25 deaths, we think the number is probably 10 times that number in China right now because you had a number of misdiagnoses, Meekins said.https://finance.yahoo.com/news/chinas-coronavirus-victims-likely-10-times-higher-than-reported-analyst-says-155836267.html

More than 75,000 people - ten times the official tally of confirmed cases - have been infected with the coronavirus in Wuhan, ground zero of a global health emergency, according to research published Friday.


"We estimate that 75,815 individuals have been infected in Wuhan as of January 25, 2020," a team led by Gabriel Leung from the University of Hong Kong reported in [I]The Lancet (https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30260-9/fulltext).
https://www.sciencealert.com/new-study-estimates-75-000-people-in-wuhan-infected-with-coronavirus

How does coronavirus compare with the flu?

With up to 5 million cases, 140,000 hospitalizations and 8,200 deaths in the U.S. during the current season, according to the CDC, flu sounds like much more of a health risk. It's the coronavirus uncertainty, and lack of a vaccine, that concerns public health officials. But the coronavirus death rate is up to 10 times higher, with no predictable beginning and end to the season, like flu.https://hartfordhospital.org/about-hh/news-center/news-detail?articleid=23988&publicId=395

Look at how many people die from influenza in the US every year. Coronovirus is much more deadly and China has worse health care than the US.

Read that again... the Coronavirus death rate is 10 times higher than the flu, and the seasonal flu kills between 290,000 to 650,000 people per year worldwide.

Now here's something very interesting. Tencent, China's largest online news site (https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7971401/Have-real-coronavirus-death-figures-leaked-Chinese-conglomerate-lists-death-toll-24-589.html),may have accidentally (or purposefully) released the actual Coronavirus numbers:

Figures posted Saturday on Tencent's website showed that the number of confirmed cases of the coronavirus stood at 154,023, 10 times higher than the official figure. It also listed suspected cases at 79,808, four times higher than the official figure.The site published the number of cured cases at 269, and the number of deaths at 24,589- 82 times higher than the Chinese Communist Party is reporting. The official number of cases and deaths at the time were both 300.

The website was quickly updated to official government numbers. It is still unclear if the alternate numbers are the result of a insider leak or tampering.
https://disrn.com/news/tencent-leak-suggest-coronavirus-numbers-much-higher-than-reported

There's no way to confirm if these numbers were a mistake or purposefully leaked, but it is interesting.

[Traveller]

Neal, your death estimate is running about 40x higher than the 'official' number, which is very possible from everything I've read.

[Jimbuna]

Five more Brits but there is an Asian connection.

Five Britons have tested positive for coronavirus in eastern France, the French health minister confirmed.

Four adults and a child were diagnosed with the virus after coming into contact with a British national who recently returned from Singapore.

Local officials said they all stayed in the same ski chalet in the Alps, but none was in a serious condition.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-51425702

[STEED]

American dies of coronavirus in China;....

BEIJING (Reuters) - A 60-year-old American has died of the new coronavirus, the first confirmed non-Chinese death of the illness.....

https://uk.reuters.com/article/us-china-health/american-dies-of-coronavirus-in-china-britons-infected-at-french-ski-resort-idUKKBN20003J

Hmmm....

[Rockstar]

case fatality rates compared


typical influenza pandemic: < 0.1%


2019-nCoV: case fatality based on onkle neal's 7 February "actual figures not reported", 14.9%. Case fatality rate based on official reports: 1.86%. And I dont think 2019-nCov is considered a pandemic spread, YET

I kinda think the current fatality rate stems primarily from the inability of the most awesome, highly regarded and smartest country in the whole wide world, that mythical beast named China to provide proper treatment for its own citizens. OR regulate what's sold at its own markets to prevent stupid things like this from happening again. But Im sure Xi Jinping, where ever he may be hiding, is developing plans to outsmart this virus as we speak.

[Mr Quatro]

Hmmm....

He might have been an American, but he died in Wuhan :yep:

This case in France with five British citizens infected from a man that had just been in Singapore ...
Now that is news that the man was from Singapore,
plus others have contacted the virus that were taxi drivers, tour bus drivers, cruise ship employees.

This is no where being over ... the numbers might be off, but how they catch the virus is not :yep:


https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-health-idUSKBN20003J


The death toll in mainland China rose to 722 on Saturday, according to authorities, and is expected to pass the 774 deaths recorded globally during the 2002-2003 outbreak of Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome (SARS).

Most of the deaths in China have occurred in and around Wuhan. Across mainland China, the number of cases stood at 31,774 as of Saturday.

The virus has spread to 27 countries and regions, according to a Reuters count based on official reports, infecting more than 330 people. Two deaths have been reported outside mainland China - in Hong Kong and the Philippines. Both victims were Chinese nationals.

[em2nought]

So would my life insurance policy pay out if I died from Coronavirus, or is it an act of God? Guess I better check. :hmmm:

[Jeff-Groves]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8XgUQOkej54

[Catfish]

^ we just had this in the hospital, it was regarded with mixed feelings :haha:

Re the Wuhan corona virus, the inability of its dictator to cope with the situation means that he either has been infected himself, or he does not like to be connected to bad situations and that he obviously is afraid, otherwise he would show up and hold patriotic speeches.
I guess there is no control and the situation is worse than i thought :hmmm:

[Onkel Neal]

Bad enough that is has ripped right past SARs in fatalities and cases. As reported, probably 5x worse in actuality.
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/world/asia/china-coronavirus-contain.html

https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/attachment.php?attachmentid=2979&d=1581192580

[Jeff-Groves]

Time to find a remote Island in the Pacific and drop infected there!
Maybe the Atlantic would work.
Tristan da Cunha looks like a nice place.
Better then Bouvet Island!

[mapuc]

if you fear this Corona virus or you may think someone have infected you...don't panic you may have the cure for this disease at home.

All you have to do is drink a glass of beer morning(before breakfast) and before bedtime.

This will for sure cure you Corona virus infection.

(Irony could have been used in the comment above)

Markus

[Traveller]

if you fear this Corona virus or you may think someone have infected you...don't panic you may have the cure for this disease at home.

All you have to do is drink a glass of beer morning(before breakfast) and before bedtime.

This will for sure cure you Corona virus infection.

(Irony could have been used in the comment above)

Markus


But only effective if Mexican beer. :D

[Traveller]

Crematoriums in China are struggling to keep up with the hundreds of bodies they are receiving.
The Epoch Times, a Chinese-American anti-communist newspaper, sent journalists to speak with the heads of several funeral homes and crematoriums in Hubei province ***8211; whose capital, Wuhan, is the epicenter of the current novel coronavirus outbreak. The newspaper found that adding up the total number of people cremated per day in several funeral homes yielded a significantly larger number than the official number of deaths tallied since the outbreak began in December.

***8220;I received 127 corpses yesterday [February 3], and burned 116. Among them, 8 were confirmed [coronavirus cases] on the death certificate and 48 were suspected,***8221; a funeral home director in Hubei using the pseudonym ***8220;You Hu***8221; told the newspaper. ***8220;I am about to collapse, we are under great pressure now.***8221;


The newspaper offered insight into a larger funeral home in Hankou, a Wuhan neighborhood, which it estimated had the capacity to burn 576 people per day. ***8220;You Hu***8221; told the Epoch Times that the backlog of people waiting to be cremated was not due to lack of space in the burners, but lack of sufficient transportation and collapsing staff numbers, as few were sleeping or taking breaks. Due to transportation and staff limits, the Epoch Times estimated that the Hankou crematorium was burning 225 corpses a day.
https://www.breitbart.com/national-security/2020/02/07/report-china-crematorium-funeral-homes-burning-coronavirus-patients/

[Traveller]

Crematoriums in China are struggling to keep up with the hundreds of bodies they are receiving.


The Epoch Times, a Chinese-American anti-communist newspaper, sent journalists to speak with the heads of several funeral homes and crematoriums in Hubei province – whose capital, Wuhan, is the epicenter of the current novel coronavirus outbreak. The newspaper found that adding up the total number of people cremated per day in several funeral homes yielded a significantly larger number than the official number of deaths tallied since the outbreak began in December.

“I received 127 corpses yesterday [February 3], and burned 116. Among them, 8 were confirmed [coronavirus cases] on the death certificate and 48 were suspected,” a funeral home director in Hubei using the pseudonym “You Hu” told the newspaper. “I am about to collapse, we are under great pressure now.”

The newspaper offered insight into a larger funeral home in Hankou, a Wuhan neighborhood, which it estimated had the capacity to burn 576 people per day. “You Hu” told the Epoch Times that the backlog of people waiting to be cremated was not due to lack of space in the burners, but lack of sufficient transportation and collapsing staff numbers, as few were sleeping or taking breaks. Due to transportation and staff limits, the Epoch Times estimated that the Hankou crematorium was burning 225 corpses a day.
https://www.breitbart.com/national-security/2020/02/07/report-china-crematorium-funeral-homes-burning-coronavirus-patients/

[Traveller]

One current death estimate at 1.4 million.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=688x-E-8dpc

[Mr Quatro]

Crematoriums in China are struggling to keep up with the hundreds of bodies they are receiving.



I thought they couldn't hide how many died due to families like to have funerals even in China, but all funerals have now been expended due to the lock down of the fifty to sixty million peoples in the affected area. :yep:

[Traveller]

I thought they couldn't hide how many died due to families like to have funerals even in China, but all funerals have now been expended due to the lock down of the fifty to sixty million peoples in the affected area. :yep:


True. Funerals (at least in Wuhan) have supposedly been banned by the government.

[Traveller]

6 new cases of Wuhan coronavirus have been confirmed on the Princess Dream cruise ship docked off the coast of Yokohama. Total infected is now 70.

https://edition.cnn.com/asia/live-news/coronavirus-outbreak-02-08-20-intl-hnk/index.html

[STEED]

I came across one of these many YouTube videos but what caught my eye was the comments below. People were posting this person was selling face masks at twice the normal cost along with his virus survival kit, amazing how some people are determined to make money from people's fear.

[Jimbuna]

if you fear this Corona virus or you may think someone have infected you...don't panic you may have the cure for this disease at home.

All you have to do is drink a glass of beer morning(before breakfast) and before bedtime.

This will for sure cure you Corona virus infection.

(Irony could have been used in the comment above)

Markus

I must have full immunity then :03:

[kraznyi_oktjabr]

Six new cases of Wuhan coronavirus have been confirmed on the Princess Dream cruise ship docked off the coast of Yokohama. Total infected is now 70.

https://edition.cnn.com/asia/live-news/coronavirus-outbreak-02-08-20-intl-hnk/index.htmlPrincess Cruises does not have ship of that name. Ship quarantined in Yokohama is Diamond Princess (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diamond_Princess_(ship)) (company uses "Princess" as suffix, not prefix).

[Traveller]

Princess Cruises does not have ship of that name. Ship quarantined in Yokohama is Diamond Princess (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diamond_Princess_(ship)) (company uses "Princess" as suffix, not prefix).

Looks like the journalist got the ship names mixed up.

[Rockstar]

https://www.defense.gov/Newsroom/Releases/Release/Article/2076940/dod-statement-on-additional-request-from-hhs/


Secretary of Defense Dr. Mark T. Esper is expected to support a request from the Department of Health and Human Services which asked DOD to identify military installations near 11 major airports that could house additional passengers, should HHS facilities become filled. These are tertiary locations, and HHS already has primary and secondary locations identified that are not DOD facilities. ...


Under the request, DOD support at each location will be limited to providing housing support for up to 20 people as they undergo a period of quarantined observation. The department will also provide office space for several HHS personnel and their equipment through February 22, 2020.

[Mr Quatro]

Doesn't make sense to fly them inland and if the virus spreads you will know why. :o

California is far enough :yep:

[Buddahaid]

But the electoral college allows the heartland states higher representation per capita. Let's not deny them their share....:shucks:

[Mr Quatro]

But the electoral college allows the heartland states higher representation per capita. Let's not deny them their share....:shucks:

I see where you are going with this, but without the electoral college the great state of California would decide all national elections for years to come. :o

So with that in mind let us allow the great state of California to contain this spreading virus to just their state. :yep:

[mapuc]

I made a mistake in my last comment.

Instead of posting a link from iflscience about this ridiculous conspiracy I created a funny story

But out of all the nonsense being shared, few ideas are more ridiculous than grifters and conspiracy theorists telling people that drinking a bleach-laced liquid will help protect them against coronavirus.


https://www.iflscience.com/health-and-medicine/conspiracy-nuts-claim-drinking-bleach-miracle-cure-can-cure-coronavirus-/

Markus

[Jeff-Groves]

Nah. Not bleach laced.
What would work is a bit of bleach mixed with ammonia.
My not cure the virus but you'd not have to worry any more about catching it!
:haha:

[Rockstar]

Mountainhouse (https://www.mountainhouse.com/) is selling out get it while you can! Its pretty tasty I use it sometimes when going out backcountry. Usually I dehydrate my own food as its much cheaper too do it yourself.

[Jeff-Groves]

I'm waiting to see if Wright-Patterson is a DOD area to bring infected to.
They store Aliens there so it should be a good place.
:har:

[kraznyi_oktjabr]

Doesn't make sense to fly them inland and if the virus spreads you will know why. :o

California is far enough :yep:When you transport infected patient, viruses do not implify fall out of window. Following proper procedures when handling patients is much more critical than physical location of quarantine facility. In my local hospital such facility is located immediately upstairs from emergency room which minimizes contact with other patients and staff.


Situation is somewhat different with thousands of passengers and crew onboard a cruise ship but even then only those in precautionary quarantine stay onboard. Its simply practical question as its cheaper (to society, not cruise line) than moving everyone to purpose built quarantine facility.

[Jeff-Groves]

Its simply practical question as its cheaper (to society, not cruise line) than moving everyone to purpose built quarantine facility.
Wanna go cheap? Send the ship out into deep waters and sink it.
Watch the Movie Contagion.

[kraznyi_oktjabr]

Wanna go cheap? Send the ship out into deep waters and sink it.I'm not too convinced that it would be cheper option. I see a lot of potential litigation opportunities there especially if you involve American courts and lawyers into it.

[Jeff-Groves]

How cheap will it be if people in California and other States start sueing to keep infected out?
:hmmm:

In years past there were places for Leporecy.

[Jimbuna]

Thousands of people stuck on a cruise ship in Hong Kong for four days have been allowed to disembark after tests for coronavirus came back negative.

Some 3,600 passengers and crew on the World Dream ship were quarantined amid fears some staff could have contracted the virus on a previous voyage.

Another cruise ship where dozens of cases have been confirmed remains in quarantine off Japan.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-china-51433079

[Traveller]

Scientist Who Discovered Ebola: Britain Faces ‘Major’ Coronavirus Outbreak.


The United Kingdom is facing a “major outbreak” of the deadly coronavirus, warns the scientist who co-discovered the Ebola virus in Africa.

As the death toll for the coronavirus officially surpasses that of the SARS outbreak in 2003, the director of the London School of Hygiene and Tropical Medicine, Peter Piot, said that he is “increasingly alarmed” by the rapidly spreading virus, saying that it is a “greater threat” than Ebola.

“It’s a greater threat because of the mode of transmission. The potential for spread is much, much higher. If the number of people who get infected is huge, then that will also kill a number of people”, Piot told (https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/uk-faces-major-coronavirus-outbreak-warns-world-expert-wxf628g75) The Times.

“In today’s world, no epidemic remains just a local affair. What happens thousands and thousands of miles from here in China has the potential of causing a major outbreak here”, warned the professor.

Mr Piot said that he is concerned about the capability of Britain’s socialised medical system, the National Health Service (NHS), to cope with an outbreak of the virus.

“You know how already overburdened the NHS is and if you’ve got a sudden major rise in cases of pneumonia or milder respiratory infections… The NHS can hardly cope with the normal situation,” he explained.https://www.breitbart.com/europe/2020/02/09/britain-facing-major-outbreak-of-coronavirus/

[em2nought]

Thousands of people stuck on a cruise ship in Hong Kong for four days have been allowed to disembark after tests for coronavirus came back negative.


I thought it was supposed to take up to two weeks for symptoms to develop with Kung Flu? I hope those tests are accurate. :hmmm:

[Mr Quatro]

“You know how already overburdened the NHS is and if you’ve got a sudden major rise in cases of pneumonia or milder respiratory infections… The NHS can hardly cope with the normal situation,” he explained.

Same here in the USA especially in rural area's :yep:

Can you imagine the entire state of California, Oregon, Utah, Nevada and Arizona in a lock down situation, plus Las Vegas closed till further notice? :o

That's what China is experiencing right now to contain the outbreak :yep:

Something tells me a cure is right around the corner for only $49 a pill :D

[Onkel Neal]

But the electoral college allows the heartland states higher representation per capita. Let's not deny them their share....:shucks:

Just remember, that's where your food comes from! :timeout:

[Buddahaid]

Just remember, that's where your food comes from! :timeout:

Which food is that? Wheat? California is a huge agricultural state.

" Furthermore, California's Central Valley is one of the most productive agricultural regions on Earth, growing over half the country's fruits, vegetables, and nuts.[14]"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_California

[Traveller]

66 newly confirmed coronavirus cases aboard the Diamond Princess ship docked in Yokohama.
That brings the total number of cases on the ship to 136, nearly doubling the previous total of 70 confirmed cases yesterday.https://edition.cnn.com/asia/live-news/coronavirus-outbreak-02-10-20-intl-hnk/index.html

Number of confirmed infected almost doubled in one day. :o

139 positive out of 336 tested. Very high infection rate. :o

[Traveller]

Number of UK coronavirus cases doubles to 8.
Four further patients in England have tested positive for coronavirus, bringing the total UK tally to eight, Britain's Department of Health said in a statement on Monday.

https://edition.cnn.com/asia/live-news/coronavirus-outbreak-02-10-20-intl-hnk/index.html

[Traveller]

Coronavirus is airborne, Chinese official warns.
An official in Shanghai confirmed the virus wasn't just passed on through human contact, but can float long distances through the air.https://10daily.com.au/news/a200210wuevn/coronavirus-is-airborne-chinese-official-warns-20200210

This is a very serious development. :shifty:

By the way, surgical masks do not protect the wearer from becoming infected if airborne contact is made. To avoid airborne infection, at the very minimum, an N95 mask tightly fitted around the face, plus goggles is required. But having said that, wearing these masks and goggles is not practical on a daily basis. Washing your hands frequently with soap and warm water for at least 20 seconds each time and staying away from those who are sneezing or coughing is the best practical protection. Also, try to avoid touching your eyes, nose, and mouth.

[Traveller]

Only those showing symptoms such as high fever are being segregated on the Diamond Princess.
Several members of the Diamond Princess crew have appealed for help from the Indian government, and alleged that they are at risk of infection by not being segregated.

"We are extremely scared at this point in time," Binay Kumar Sarkar said in a video obtained by CNN. "Our request is to segregate the crew members from the infected."

"Only people who are recording temperatures higher than 37.5 degree Celsius are being checked," Sarkar said.
https://edition.cnn.com/asia/live-news/coronavirus-outbreak-02-10-20-intl-hnk/index.html

Crazy. Sounds like the whole ship will eventually become infected before this is over.