View Full Version : Here we go again-Ukraine once again
Some hours ago I read that Macron requested an urgently phone call with Putin..some hours later I read this on twitter-The media report that Macron was denied a conversation with Putin.
MarkusNobody will recognize these annexations result will be more support to Ukraine "Senior US military official says US may provide Ukraine with tanks."
Catfish
09-20-22, 12:55 PM
Quite easy what happens, Putin will hold "referendums" which of course will show that 99,9 percent are for joining Russia (lmao), then any attack against this area will be declared as an "attack" against Russia itself.
So Russia has to "react" against an "attack" with general mobilisation at least, and a nuclear "defense" at most.
I wonder if there is anyone in the whole world who believes Putin's bullsh!t. And i do not even mean russian people.
Does not matter though since no one will take the referendums seriously. But then NATO has the chance to punch him seriously on his nose.
Quite easy what happens, Putin will hold "referendums" which of course will show that 99,9 percent are for joining Russia (lmao), then any attack against this area will be declared as an "attack" against Russia itself.
So Russia has to "react" against an "attack" with general mobilisation at least, and a nuclear "defense" at most.
I wonder if there is anyone in the whole world who believes Putin's bullsh!t. And i do not even mean russian people.
Does not matter though since no one will take the referendums seriously. But then NATO has the chance to punch him seriously on his nose.Ukraine already attacked Russia (Belgorod & Crimea) loser does not need this defiantly lost that clown he lost on the battlefield now he tries it political.
Jimbuna
09-20-22, 01:09 PM
Quite easy what happens, Putin will hold "referendums" which of course will show that 99,9 percent are for joining Russia (lmao), then any attack against this area will be declared as an "attack" against Russia itself.
So Russia has to "react" against an "attack" with general mobilisation at least, and a nuclear "defense" at most.
I wonder if there is anyone in the whole world who believes Putin's bullsh!t. And i do not even mean russian people.
Does not matter though since no one will take the referendums seriously. But then NATO has the chance to punch him seriously on his nose.
Call the bastids bluff...that is the only way to react to a tyrannical bully?
Jimbuna
09-20-22, 01:12 PM
Officials in four occupied areas of Ukraine say they will hold snap votes on joining Russia.
Administrations in Luhansk, Donetsk, Kherson and Zaporizhzhia say they will begin this Friday.
The US says it will "never recognise" Russian annexations of Ukraine territory, adding that the latest moves were a sign of Russia's weakness.
The Nato chief calls the planned votes a "sham", French President Macron labels them a "parody"
Ukraine's Foreign Minister Dmytro Kuleba also dismisses the votes as a sham and says they will not change anything.
Meanwhile, world leaders are gathering in New York for the United Nations General Assembly.
Jimbuna
09-20-22, 01:20 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lGIJn2TjIPg
Rockstar
09-20-22, 01:23 PM
Officials in four occupied areas of Ukraine say they will hold snap votes on joining Russia.
Administrations in Luhansk, Donetsk, Kherson and Zaporizhzhia say they will begin this Friday.
The US says it will "never recognise" Russian annexations of Ukraine territory, adding that the latest moves were a sign of Russia's weakness.
The Nato chief calls the planned votes a "sham", French President Macron labels them a "parody"
Ukraine's Foreign Minister Dmytro Kuleba also dismisses the votes as a sham and says they will not change anything.
Meanwhile, world leaders are gathering in New York for the United Nations General Assembly.
Gotta give credit where credit is due, even Olaf came out and said he would not recognize these referendums.
Keep in mind too there is a huge difference between ‘what Putin wants to do’ and ‘what Putin can do’. I betting that a full mobilization will only expose his lack of control and eventually lead to an uprising. Mobilizing millions of young males into the army. What next? Now you need to:
test & allocate them (who goes where)
train & arm them
quarter & feed them
place them under the capable officers and NCOs
None which is Russia capable of doing well enough
Jimbuna
09-20-22, 01:24 PM
^ Agreed :yep:
Skybird
09-20-22, 01:24 PM
I think media are right when saying that before a nuclear escalation the referendum will be used as an excuse to formally declare war on Ukraine, and order general mobilization. But the nuclear escalation is the logical end point of this development if Russia cannot stop the loss of occupied terrain conventionally.
Jimbuna
09-20-22, 01:27 PM
If matters turn nuclear I think only the US well retaliate in a likewise manner.
Jimbuna
09-20-22, 01:57 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y_gIaQs2Dko
Jimbuna
09-20-22, 02:05 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JGim6oH1fA0
Chairman of the Duma Defense Committee Andrey Kartapolov: "There will be no general mobilization, but martial law may be introduced in some places". https://twitter.com/nexta_tv/status/1572299706331545602
Jimbuna
09-20-22, 02:59 PM
Occupiers are suffering significant losses in Bakhmut and Avdiivka directions and have decided to transfer regiment from Syria to Ukraine, - General Staff
Operational information of the General Staff of the Armed Forces of Ukraine regarding the Russian invasion as of 6:00 p.m. on 09/20/2022.
This is reported by Censor.NET with reference to the page of the General Staff of the Armed Forces of Ukraine.
"Glory to Ukraine! It has been 209 days of heroic resistance of the Ukrainian nation to the Russian military invasion. The enemy continues to focus its efforts on attempts to fully occupy the Donetsk region, organize defense and hold the captured territories, as well as disrupt the active actions of the Defense Forces in certain directions.It fires at the positions of our troops along the contact line, takes measures to regroup its troops, and constantly conducts aerial reconnaissance.
During the current day, the Russian occupiers launched 7 missile and 20 air strikes, carried out more than 15 shellings with multiple rocket launchers on military and civilian objects on the territory of Ukraine, violating the norms of international humanitarian law, laws and customs of warfare. As a result of the terrorist actions of the Russian troops, the infrastructure of more than 20 settlements was damaged during the current day. Among them are Sloviansk, Siversk, Soledar, Bakhmut, Vuhledar, Stepne, Nikopol and Ochakiv. In the settlement of Pechenihy, the occupiers tried to destroy the dam of the Pechenihy Reservoir, but were unsuccessful. The threat of air and missile strikes by the enemy on the entire territory of Ukraine remains.
The situation has not changed on the Volyn and Polissia directions. In other directions, the enemy fired from tanks, mortars, and artillery of various calibers:
in the Siversk direction - in the areas of settlements Mykhailove and Huta Studenetska of Chernihiv region and Novovasylivka and Riasne of Sumy region;
in the Slobozhansk direction - in the areas of Kozacha Lopan, Strelecha, Hlyboke, Derhachi, Fiholivka, Dvorichna, Shevchenkive, Kupiansk and Kamianka settlements;
in the Kramatorsk direction - Yarova, Pryshyb, Donetske, Serebrianka, Shchurove, Raihorodok, Ozerne, Kryva Luka, Mykolaivka, Siversk, Ivano-Dariivka, Rozdolivka, Oleksandrivka and Hryhorivka;
in the Bakhmut region – Verkhniokamianske, Vyimka, Spirne, Vesele, Bilohorivka, Yakovlivka, Soledar, Bakhmutske, Bakhmut, Vesela Dolyna, Odradivka, Mykolaivka Druha, Zaitseve, Mayorsk and New York;
in the Avdiivka direction – Krasnohorivka, Mariinka, Novomykhailivka, Pervomaiske;
in the Zaporizhzhia region – Novosilka, Novopil, Vremivka, Velyka Novosilka, Vuhledar, Novomayorske, Zaliznychne, Huliaipole, Malynivka, Chervone, Dorozhnianka, Mali Shcherbaky, Mala Tokmachka and Kamianske.
More than 25 settlements were shelled by the enemy in the South Bug direction. In particular, Visokopillia, Myroliubivka, Novohryhorivka, Bilohirka, Blahodativka, Shyroke, Zoria, Shevchenkove, Ternovi Pody, Pravdyne, Myrne and Oleksandrivka.
As a result of the successful actions of units of the Defense Forces in the Bakhmut and Avdiivka directions, the enemy continues to suffer significant losses. Medical facilities in the city of Horlivka are full of seriously wounded servicemen of the occupation forces. In addition, two large trucks with the bodies of dead persons from the 1st Army Corps of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation were moved from the territory of the Kherson region to the temporarily occupied territory of the Donetsk region. The quantity is being specified.
Due to the unsuccessful conduct of covert mobilization measures, the military-political leadership of the Russian Federation made a decision to withdraw units of the 217th Parachute Regiment from the territory of the Syrian Arab Republic and their further preparation for transfer to the territory of Ukraine.
Units of the Defense Forces repelled enemy attacks in the areas of the settlements of Vesele, Kurdiumivka, Mykolaivka Druha, Zaitseve, Mayorsk, Pervomaiske, Mariinka, and Novomykhailivka.
During the current day, in order to support the actions of ground groups, the aviation of the Defense Forces hit 12 areas of concentration of enemy manpower and military equipment and one position of an anti-aircraft missile complex. In addition, our air defense units destroyed one enemy UAV.
Missile troops and artillery during the current day inflicted fire damage on 30 enemy objects. In particular, in 17 areas of concentration of personnel, weapons and military equipment, 10 areas of concentration of artillery, as well as 3 warehouses of ammunition. The total losses of the enemy are being clarified.
United we are invincible! We are approaching victory together! "Glory to Ukraine!" - says the information of the General Staff of the Armed Forces of Ukraine. Source: https://censor.net/en/n3368473
Rockstar
09-20-22, 03:28 PM
If matters turn nuclear I think only the US well retaliate in a likewise manner.
We’ll probably launch those we have stored in Germany and make it look like they did it. :D
If matters turn nuclear I think only the US well retaliate in a likewise manner.
Not our fight, and I'm pretty sure the U.S. won't use nuclear weapons unless attacked directly with nuclear weapons.
Hmm how sure is it, that it would mean the end of Putin's era if he declare full mobilisation ?
He's not going to do it...not yet.
Markus
Skybird
09-20-22, 05:16 PM
He prepares to do it.
It will not mean his end. Like every dictator he will use force against his own people, if needed.
Quite some in the military tick even more radical than he does. Which is the reason for two possible scenarios: that they topple him, or that they stay loyal. It will depend on how they see their own interests. Putin is a secret service man, not the military's man, the spy stuff is the main fundament he bases on. And the KGB always held the military on a short line. So does the FSB.
Thank you
It has been mentioned so many times even here in this thread. It would mean the end of his career
You said it he will use force against his own people, if needed.
His government is his marionet dolls.
Said it before Russia is Putin or Putin is Russia.
Markus
Rockstar
09-20-22, 07:53 PM
I heard Brittney Griner took a six contract with Wagner Group as a stormtrooper so she could get out jail early. :haha:
Rockstar
09-20-22, 09:56 PM
Kremlin pool journalist Dmitry Smirnov says the address will be at 8am Moscow time.
les green01
09-20-22, 11:43 PM
Not our fight, and I'm pretty sure the U.S. won't use nuclear weapons unless attacked directly with nuclear weapons.
depends on if you're talking missiles or not land base most you have is 20 minutes before they go off and have nice little clouds between USA and Russia so they wouldn't wait too long before counter from sea you can cut that time down even more you wouldn't want someone sitting there with a thumb up their backside
Skybird
09-21-22, 05:19 AM
The Economists argues that we must not worry so much about socalled strategic nuclear weapons of huge destruction and range, but small socalled tactical weapons. Their military relevance is apparently limited, but they are meant to force the enemy into psychological shock, and from there: into surrender.
https://www.economist.com/the-economist-explains/2022/09/14/do-russias-military-setbacks-increase-the-risk-of-nuclear-conflict
To be sure, Russia’s precision munitions have often missed their target in this war, and are running short. But tactical nuclear weapons would not be a viable substitute: huge numbers would have to be used to produce a lasting military effect. One study of India-Pakistan scenarios concludes that a five-kiloton nuclear bomb might destroy as few as 13 tanks if they were dispersed. In any event, Russia has shown vanishingly little ability to locate and strike moving targets.
Regarding the referendums, I think the west must answer with mutliplying military deliveries to make clear to the few sane minds that may still exist in the fascist military what the name of the game is. There cnanot be any limits according range and "heavy callibre" then anymore. To talk to the political leaders is absolutely useless now, they are completely insane and totally disconnected form reality, now inventing their own alternative reality and according narration that reverse the real world by 180°. Its totally pointless to talk to them anymore, they should be put into mental asylums and drugged into oblivion. They do not share this reality and dimension with the rest of the world anymore, but drift and dwell in their own nightmarish dreamworld. We have seen this kind of madness in Hitler in the later stages of the war.
Stop assuming the Russians politically decide rationally anymore. They don't. They do not live with their minds in this world anymore.
Catfish
09-21-22, 05:21 AM
Russians react to mobilisation
"Russia saw a spike in citizens searching Google for how to leave the country ahead of a now-canceled national address from President Putin, driving speculation that Moscow would escalate its war effort in Ukraine."
https://www.newsweek.com/how-leave-russia-top-google-trend-putin-delays-national-address-1744724
https://twitter.com/meduza_en/status/1572311066687725569
Jimbuna
09-21-22, 05:50 AM
President Putin says military reservists are to be sent to Ukraine as part of a partial mobilisation of Russian forces.
In a televised address to the nation, he said this was a necessary step to ensure Russian territorial integrity.
He accused the West of wanting to see Russia weakened and said a threat to retaliate further "is not a bluff"
Meanwhile, Western nations have condemned Moscow's plans to hold so-called referendums in parts of Ukraine that are currently under Russian control.
The US, Germany and France have said they would never recognise the results of such "sham" ballots.
And world leaders are gathering in New York for a UN meeting - US President Biden and Ukraine's President Zelensky will speak later.
Jimbuna
09-21-22, 06:04 AM
West condemns Russian plans for 'sham' Ukraine vote
Western nations have condemned Moscow's plans to hold urgent so-called referendums in parts of Ukraine that are currently under Russian control.
The votes have been called by Russian-backed officials in four Ukrainian regions to ask whether they should become part of Russia.
The US, Germany and France have said they would never recognise the results of such "sham" ballots.
The Nato military alliance said the plans spelt an escalation in the war.
Plans to run polls for five days, starting on Friday, have been announced in the eastern regions of Luhansk and Donetsk - as well as Zaporizhzhia and Kherson in the south.
The quartet represent around 15% of Ukrainian territory - or an area the size of Hungary, according to Reuters news agency.
The suggestion that legitimate and fair polls could be run in the middle of a war were immediately scorned by the West.
German Chancellor Olaf Scholz blasted the Russian plans for "sham" votes, while French President Emmanuel Macron labelled them a "parody" of democracy.
"If the Donbas referendum idea wasn't so tragic it would be funny," Mr Macron told reporters in New York, where he is attending the United Nations General Assembly.
He pleaded with neutral countries to change their stance to the war, saying silence or complicity was an "historic error".
US National Security Advisor Jake Sullivan said the US would never recognise the votes, calling them "an affront to the principles of sovereignty and territorial integrity".
Any referendum planned by invading forces contravenes international law and will have no legal force, the Organisation for Security and Cooperation in Europe (OSCE) said in a statement.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-62976560
Jimbuna
09-21-22, 06:43 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZCOMTYt1VFI
Jimbuna
09-21-22, 07:14 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cfyqaQIQzcI
Jimbuna
09-21-22, 07:21 AM
Mobilization in Russian Federation is alarming escalation, - British Foreign Minister Keegan
Russian dictator Vladimir Putin’s declaration of partial mobilization in Russia amid the war against Ukraine is a worrying escalation.
This was stated by the Minister of Foreign Affairs of Great Britain, Gillian Keegan, Censor.NET reports with reference to RBC-Ukraine.
She accused Putin of rewriting history.
"Some statements are very disturbing, and we should strive for calm," the minister said, calling on Russian citizens to "look further than their own mass media."
According to her, the threats should be taken seriously, as Ukraine begins to move forward, recapturing the lands previously seized by Russia.
"Let's be clear - there are Putin's lies. This is Russia's illegal war in Ukraine. And, of course, we will, as before, support Ukraine together with all our NATO allies. We are there, we are on your side - we will help in any way we can." - she emphasized.
The minister also reacted to Putin's nuclear blackmail.
"It's something that we have to take very seriously because, you know, we're not in control. I'm not sure he's in control either. Really, I mean, it's an obvious escalation," Keegan said. Source: https://censor.net/en/n3368584
Jimbuna
09-21-22, 07:36 AM
In China, they reacted to announcement of mobilization in Russia: they called for negotiations
The Ministry of Foreign Affairs of the People’s Republic of China reacted to the announcement of partial mobilization in Russia and again called for negotiations.
Chinese Foreign Ministry representative Wang Wenbin said this at a briefing, Censor.NET reports with reference to Sky News.
China calls on Ukraine and Russia "to start dialogue and consultation to find a way to solve common security problems."
"China's position regarding Ukraine is consistent and clear," said Wang Wenbin. Source: https://censor.net/en/n3368589
Jimbuna
09-21-22, 07:49 AM
Russian Federation chose International Day of Peace to escalate its unjustified war, - EU Ambassador Maasikas
The Ambassador of the European Union to Ukraine, Matti Maasikas, noted that the decision of the President of the Russian Federation on partial mobilization was announced on the International Day of Peace, and noted that the EU will continue to support Ukraine even after that.
As Censor.NET reports, Maasikas wrote about this on his Twitter.
"It is not surprising that the Russian Federation chose the International Day of Peace to escalate its unjustified war. Ukraine needs peace on its own terms - with respect for Ukraine's sovereignty and territorial integrity. The EU will continue to support Ukraine to win the war, as it is also fighting for peace for us," Maasikas wrote. Source: https://censor.net/en/n3368596
Jimbuna
09-21-22, 08:04 AM
Mobilization in Russian Federation is sign of Kremlin’s panic, - Prime Minister of Netherlands Rutte
The order for partial mobilization in Russia is a sign of panic in the Kremlin, which should not be taken as a direct threat of full-scale war with the West.
As Censor.NET informs, this was reported by Reuters with reference to the statement of the Prime Minister of the Netherlands, Mark Rutte.
"Mobilization calls for referendums in Donbas are all signs of panic. We've heard his (Putin's) rhetoric about nuclear weapons many times before, and it leaves us cold," Rutte said. Source: https://censor.net/en/n3368613
Skybird
09-21-22, 08:10 AM
If one looks close at it and considers the implications, what Putler said is nothing else but a general mobilization in disguise, partitioned into several waves of sub-mobilizations.
All that babbling at the UN will not lead anywhere. Only superior raw force that the Russians cannot compete with will bring this war to an end. Little Olaf and many others are way too civilsed and tame in their thinking to realise this. They will mess this up.
Or in the words of Mike Tyson: Everbody has clever plans - until somebody comes along and starts beating him in the mouth.
Jimbuna
09-21-22, 08:12 AM
Shoygu on Russia’s losses in war: "To date, 5,937 people have died". VIDEO
The Minister of Defense of the Russian Federation Serhiy Shoygu stated that the losses of the Russian Federation amount to, allegedly, 5,937 people.
The Minister of Defense of the Russian Federation Serhiy Shoygu stated that the losses of the Russian Federation amount to, allegedly, 5,937 people.
He said this during the address, Censor.NET informs.
"Our losses today are 5,937 people. Of the total number of wounded, about 90% have recovered. These are guys who passed through our hospitals and continue to serve," Shoygu said. Source: https://censor.net/en/v3368571
https://i.postimg.cc/NG6kP5rS/liaranimatedanimationli-1.gif (https://postimages.org/)
:har:
Yes it's almost laughable if it wasn't so serious!! :doh::oops:
Jimbuna
09-21-22, 08:24 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BB6DTJzajyw
If those 300.000 reservist have been in the military within the last 10 years, then they only need 1-2 month training.
Most of them have been in the military for 1 year or 2 depending on how far back they did the service. It's first lately they have reduced it from 2 years to 1 years.
Though further back they did their military service though more training they need.
Markus
les green01
09-21-22, 10:12 AM
putin acting like a two year old again someone better go change his diaper and give him his baby bottle but make sure you spike it but then he nothing but a pansy
Jimbuna
09-21-22, 10:34 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4tEJ6n2UPus
Skybird
09-21-22, 10:42 AM
FOCUS writes:
-------------------------
Putin continues ice-cold. Military setbacks in Ukraine, economic problems in Russia, telephone calls with top Western politicians such as, most recently, German Chancellor Olaf Scholz - apparently nothing can dissuade him from his course of violence and destruction.
With the partial mobilization of the Russian armed forces, in which up to 300,000 reservists will be drafted, and the renewed threat of a nuclear strike ("This is not a bluff!"), the Kremlin ruler ignited a new escalation stage in his ruthless campaign against Ukraine and the West. The hardliner with an intelligence service past thus confirmed what experts such as political scientist Andreas Heinemann-Grüder had always feared: peace is not possible with Putin.
The professor from the International Centre for Conflict Studies in Bonn had repeatedly warned the West against caving in to Putin and trying to achieve peace through a "cuddly course". In doing so, he clearly opposed the "peace movements" in Germany and other countries who believed or still believe that Putin can be stopped by demands for a "negotiated solution" or "large-scale diplomatic offensives". Now the expert sees himself - unfortunately - confirmed.
"The partial mobilization and announced annexation should be the end of any illusions according to which Putin should not be provoked because otherwise he would act irrationally. The West should finally support Ukraine in recapturing the occupied territories with battle tanks and combat aircraft. It is a matter of victory or defeat, not of 'a little peace,'" Heinemann-Grüder told FOCUS online.
Although the West is supporting Ukraine militarily and imposing economic sanctions on Russia, European leaders are repeatedly seeking contact with Putin. At the end of May, Chancellor Scholz and French President Macron spoke on the phone with the Kremlin leader for 80 minutes. In the conversation, they urged an immediate ceasefire and a withdrawal of Russian troops. A few days ago, Scholz spoke again with Putin and called for a diplomatic solution to the Ukraine war. Even if it is sensible from the West's point of view not to let the thread of talks break - Putin is not impressed by warm words, pleas or demands. He remains tough and determined to do anything, no matter what Western politicians think and say.
Heinemann-Grüder is convinced: "A peace agreement will no longer be possible with Putin; the regime he represents is structurally incapable of peace." In his view, the only chance of ending the fighting in Ukraine lies in the "complete debacle of Russian warfare." Putin, he said, has no reason to relent as long as he considers himself the victor militarily. "Putin expects to have the longer breath in the war of attrition, and first the West, then Ukraine, will give up."
"Whoever wants to make a new pact with Putin will only get more war," the political scientist told FOCUS online. Faced with the choice of "withdrawal or escalation?", Putin opted for the latter, he said. "He had lost the escalation dominance, wants to regain the initiative and is looking for the decisive battle because he cannot survive a defeat domestically," Heinemann-Grüder said. Russia's partial mobilization is the answer to the Ukrainian offensive, he said. The fiction of a "special operation" is being abandoned, he said.
"The war is arriving in Russia. The war is not made more popular by partial mobilization. The reservists, torn from family and work, do not know what they are fighting and dying for, they are not welcomed as liberators. No one will buy the Russians being victims anymore," the conflict researcher told FOCUS online.
With the four territories to be annexed after sham referendums, Putin has for the first time laid down territorial claims, he said. The annexed territories would be considered state territory in the Russian understanding, which the Kremlin intends to protect by any means, including the threat of nuclear weapons, Heinemann-Grüder predicted. Ukrainian attacks on these territories would be considered an "attack on Russia."
"After the annexation, a harsh terror regime will be established," the expert is convinced. "Anyone who does not accept the Russian passport will then be considered an extremist or terrorist, will be tortured or put in jail. Russian will become the official language, schools will have to adopt the Russian curriculum. Opposition figures will be handed over to the Russian judiciary: North Korea in Russian."
The expert recalled that the West has failed with its previous course towards Putin. "Since 2014, there have been negotiations with Russia, de facto acceptance of the Crimean annexation and construction of the Baltic Sea pipeline. Result: blackmailability instead of interdependence (mutual dependence, the editors)." Referring to the war in Ukraine, he said, "Only as a result of defeat will the regime change, open up and face up to its imperialism, militarism and culture of violence. Only as a result of defeat will Russia be accepted back into the European family of nations."
The conflict researcher is convinced that Putin will continue to test limits and cross red lines. He will continue to threaten the West, he said, and do everything he can to ensure that tensions escalate in Germany as well. "A world food crisis, exorbitant gas and electricity bills, a global recession, new mass migration and the threat of nuclear war are meant to bring civil war to European cities," the expert told FOCUS online. "Russia's elite takes advantage of any weakness, fear of war and divisions in the West."
According to the Bonn professor, "The Russian regime does not think in categories of interdependence, reconciliation of interests and preservation of a peaceful status quo, but follows zero-sum thinking and the Bolshevik motto: Every border that is not unmistakably set offers an opportunity for transgression." He urgently warns, "Anyone who sets out to make a deal with Putin at the expense of the right to self-determination of Ukraine, Poland, the Balts, Moldova, or Georgia only increases the likelihood of an expansion of the war as a result."
To be sure, Heinemann-Grüder believes an end to the war is conceivable. "However, only if Putin has no other choice and international security guarantees for Ukraine are robust."
Skybird
09-21-22, 10:45 AM
At the Finnish-Russian border, a traffic jam of over 35 km length should have build up. Russians flee Russia.
Jimbuna
09-21-22, 10:53 AM
^ and this is just the beginning.
Jimbuna
09-21-22, 10:56 AM
Russia will not be able to win nuclear war, - Stoltenberg
Russia will not be able to win a nuclear war - and NATO clearly communicates this to Moscow.
This was stated by NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg, Censor.NET informs with reference to LIGA.
Putin's nuclear rhetoric is dangerous and irresponsible, but not new, Stoltenberg noted. NATO has not yet seen any changes in the configuration and readiness of the Russian nuclear forces.
"He (Putin, editor) knows that a nuclear war should never start, cannot be won and will lead to unprecedented consequences for Russia," Stoltenberg said.
The Secretary General did not give a direct answer as to what NATO would do in the event of Putin's use of nuclear weapons. The Alliance is doing everything to ensure that there is no misunderstanding in Moscow about the consequences.
"How we will react depends on what the situation will be and what weapons they will use. The most important thing is to prevent this from happening. Therefore, we are very clear in our communication with Russia about the consequences, about the fact that the Russian Federation cannot win a nuclear war - said the Secretary General, adding that NATO is also strengthening its eastern flank. Source: https://censor.net/en/n3368687
Jimbuna
09-21-22, 11:12 AM
Putin’s speech shows that war against Ukraine is not going according to plan - Stoltenberg
The speech of Russian President Vladimir Putin and the partial mobilization in Russia demonstrate that his war against Ukraine is not going according to plan.
This was announced by NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg, Censor.NET informs with reference to "European Truth".
Stoltenberg noted that Putin's speech about partial mobilization is "an escalation, but not a surprise."
"We will remain calm and continue to support Ukraine. President Putin's speech shows that the war is not going according to President Putin's plans. He miscalculated badly," Stoltenberg said.
According to him, Putin thought that he would be able to establish control over Ukraine within a few days.
"He was forced to withdraw from the north of Ukraine. Then he launched a major offensive in Donbas, this offensive was stopped by Ukrainian forces and now the Ukrainians were able to liberate the territory. The speech and partial mobilization in Russia simply demonstrate that he miscalculated and made major strategic mistakes," - believes NATO Secretary General. Source: https://censor.net/en/n3368695
Jimbuna
09-21-22, 11:31 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hqERTujzVyw
If those 300.000 reservist have been in the military within the last 10 years, then they only need 1-2 month training.
Most of them have been in the military for 1 year or 2 depending on how far back they did the service. It's first lately they have reduced it from 2 years to 1 years.
Though further back they did their military service though more training they need.
MarkusThe Russian professional army was already suffering heavy losses because they were so dramatically poorly organized and equipped. If the Kremlin is now calling lots of civilian people back under arms, it is an illusion that these will be the forces that will defeat the hardened Ukrainian military. Those militaries also all need basic training again. By the time they are on the ground, we will be several weeks away and winter is coming.
What Putin may be aiming at is to form an occupying force to annex "annexed" areas such as Luhansk and Donetsk as definitively as possible. The more you mobilize, the more you have to rely on inexperienced military and the weaker your whole organization becomes, actually mobilization is therefore always a weakness.
Jimbuna
09-21-22, 11:53 AM
But not to those that left the military only a few months ago...granted a minority though.
Jimbuna
09-21-22, 12:13 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_sXeLO9yZ6o
Jimbuna
09-21-22, 12:24 PM
Putin’s statement is statement of weakness, - Truss and von der Leyen
The President of the European Commission, Ursula von der Leyen, and the Prime Minister of Great Britain, Liz Truss, issued a joint statement in which they called the recent statement of the President of Russia, Vladimir Putin, "a statement of weakness" and assured of supporting Ukraine in its struggle as much as necessary.
The text of the statement made following the meeting at the UN General Assembly in New York, distributed by the press service of the European Commission, Censor.NET reports with reference to Interfax-Ukraine.
"They strongly condemned Russia's actions in Ukraine and agreed that Putin's recent calls for the mobilization of some of the population were a sign that the Russian invasion was failing. This is a statement of weakness. They recognized the courage and bravery of the Ukrainian people and emphasized their shared commitment to support Ukraine in its struggle as much as it needs," the message reads.
In addition, von der Leyen and Truss discussed EU-UK relations, including energy, food security and the Northern Ireland Protocol. Source: https://censor.net/en/n3368714
The Russian professional army was already suffering heavy losses because they were so dramatically poorly organized and equipped. If the Kremlin is now calling lots of civilian people back under arms, it is an illusion that these will be the forces that will defeat the hardened Ukrainian military. Those militaries also all need basic training again. By the time they are on the ground, we will be several weeks away and winter is coming.
What Putin may be aiming at is to form an occupying force to annex "annexed" areas such as Luhansk and Donetsk as definitively as possible. The more you mobilize, the more you have to rely on inexperienced military and the weaker your whole organization becomes, actually mobilization is therefore always a weakness.
This was not what I meant-A soldier who left the military 5 years ago need 1-1½ month training to reach same strength and knowledge he had when he left.
A soldier who left 20 years ago-Need at least 6 month of training.
Markus
This was not what I meant-A soldier who left the military 5 years ago need 1-1½ month training to reach same strength and knowledge he had when he left.
A soldier who left 20 years ago-Need at least 6 month of training.
Markus
That is correct. The longer one is away from something the longer it takes to get back up to speed but I think his point is that those times are dependent upon having qualified trainers to whip them back into shape.
If those professionals are largely fertilizing Ukrainian Sunflower fields it will likely take much longer to train up returning reservists.
That is correct. The longer one is away from something the longer it takes to get back up to speed but I think his point is that those times are dependent upon having qualified trainers to whip them back into shape.
If those professionals are largely fertilizing Ukrainian Sunflower fields so it will likely take much longer to train up returning reservists.
That is true-They the reserve need qualified trainers and as you so poetic put it-professionals are largely fertilizing Ukrainian Sunflower fields
They will find some 70-80 years old General who will get the task.
Markus
Skybird
09-21-22, 01:42 PM
^ and this is just the beginning.
As long as Russia keeps the border open.
Just about the time Iranian drones supplied to Russia began appearing in the skies over Ukraine last week, press reports surfaced purporting a company in Israel is moving to step around the nation’s formal refusal to take sides in the conflict by ushering anti-UAV defense systems to Kyiv using Poland as an intermediary.
First published by the Hebrew language site Zman Yisrael and picked up by its sister publication The Times of Israel, the report alleges that an unnamed defense company plans to deliver the anti-UAV system to an entity in Poland, knowing Ukraine is the intended recipient.
https://dronedj.com/2022/09/19/israel-reportedly-permitting-anti-uav-system-transfer-to-ukraine/
That is true-They the reserve need qualified trainers and as you so poetic put it-professionals are largely fertilizing Ukrainian Sunflower fields
They will find some 70-80 years old General who will get the task.
Markus
Probably but remember that Generals of any age don't actually train their troops, they just set policy and direction. The actual training and handing of recruits or returning reservists would be (in the west anyways) a sergeants job, and it's those very professional soldiers who are the ones currently fertilizing the sunflowers. (remember that Babushka berating the Russian soldier last spring to fill his pockets with seeds before they killed him? :03:)
As long as Russia keeps the border open.Duma already want stricter laws so that men of certain age can not leave Russia, border for them will close soon.
Update border is closed: Russian airlines ordered to stop selling tickets to Russian men aged 18 to 65 https://www.airlive.net/breaking-russian-airlines-ordered-to-stop-selling-tickets-to-russian-men-aged-18-to-65/
Duma already want stricter laws so that men of certain age can not leave Russia, border for them will close soon.
Update border is closed: Russian airlines ordered to stop selling tickets to Russian men aged 18 to 65 https://www.airlive.net/breaking-russian-airlines-ordered-to-stop-selling-tickets-to-russian-men-aged-18-to-65/
What about the Finnish border-Have they closed it for men between 18 and 65 years old ?
Markus
What about the Finnish border-Have they closed it for men between 18 and 65 years old ?
MarkusThink this will be soon or already. Also, according to the new law, adopted the day before the mobilization announcement, service evaders can go to prison for years.
War in Ukraine: Fact-checking Russian claims that Nato troops are fighting in Ukraine
We've looked at the evidence provided for these claims of Nato boots on the ground in Ukraine.
https://www.bbc.com/news/62974506
I seem to recall that there was Special units from UK and USA in Ukraine when the war broke out-But they were moved quickly to Poland.
Markus
Skybird
09-21-22, 03:54 PM
I have no idea of the terrain, but it cannot be too difficult to cross the Finnish-Russian border without the Russian authorities' consent...? :hmmm: Its a lonely place and its a long border, I mean, and its not the inner-German wall and death strip, or is it?
Jimbuna
09-22-22, 05:38 AM
I have no idea of the terrain, but it cannot be too difficult to cross the Finnish-Russian border without the Russian authorities' consent...? :hmmm: Its a lonely place and its a long border, I mean, and its not the inner-German wall and death strip, or is it?
Quite bleak over there, especially in winter so it wouldn't surprise me if the Russians laid mines on their side tbh.
Jimbuna
09-22-22, 05:40 AM
Russia is pushing ahead with plans to mobilise reservists to fight in Ukraine after suffering setbacks there.
More than 1,000 anti-mobilisation protesters are reported to have been arrested in protests on Wednesday.
Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov has not denied media reports that some protesters were given draft papers.
Meanwhile the BBC has spoken to young men fleeing over the border into Georgia - one of the few remaining countries Russians can get to without a visa.
And Ukraine is celebrating a prisoner exchange which saw more than two hundred prisoners of war released by Russia.
They include more than a hundred members of the Azov Battalion, hailed as heroes for mounting resistance at a steelworks in Mariupol.
Five British nationals also freed by Russian backed forces in Ukraine have arrived back in the UK
Jimbuna
09-22-22, 05:47 AM
Russia says its prisoners of war are back on home soil
In Moscow, officials are celebrating the return of 55 servicemen who were also freed in last night's prisoner exchange - Russia's largest swap with Kyiv since the start of the war.
"All servicemen have been delivered to the territory of the Russian Federation by military transport aircraft and are in medical institutions of Russia's defence ministry," the Kremlin department said in a statement.
It added that the released prisoners were receiving the "necessary psychological and medical assistance".
The statement did not mention Viktor Medvedchuk, a former Ukrainian MP accused of high treason and of being a Vladimir Putin ally. He was also released in the swap.
Who are the Britons captured in Ukraine?
As we have been reporting, five British men released by Russian-backed forces in a prisoner exchange have arrived back in the UK. They are:
Aiden Aslin, 28, who was sentenced to death after being captured fighting with Ukrainian forces in Mariupol.
Shaun Pinner,48, who was captured and sentenced to death alongside Aslin.
John Harding, in his 50s, who is understood to have been captured defending the Azovstal steelworks in Mariupol.
Andrew Hill, 35, from Plymouth, who was fighting with Ukraine's International Legion.
Dylan Healy, in his early 20s, is from Hungtingdon, Cambridgeshire. He had been volunteering in Ukraine as an aid worker when he was captured at a checkpoint in April, alongside Paul Urey, who died in July while being held by Russian-backed separatists.
Jimbuna
09-22-22, 06:04 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YeAfxE1bzMk
Jimbuna
09-22-22, 06:22 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2iQUi_J1ObI
Jimbuna
09-22-22, 06:35 AM
Estonia will not hide Russians fleeing mobilization - Kallas
Estonia will not grant asylum to Russians who wish to avoid the mobilization announced by Vladimir Putin on September 21.
Estonian Prime Minister Kaya Kallas said this in an interview with CNN, Censor.NET informs.
"We accept Ukrainian refugees. Every citizen is responsible for the actions of his country, and Russian citizens are no exception. Therefore, we do not give asylum to Russian men who flee their country. They should speak out against the war," said Kallas.
Also remind, that on September 21, Russian president Vladimir Putin signed a decree on partial mobilization. According to Putin, only citizens who are in the reserve will be subject to conscription, they will undergo additional training taking into account the war in Ukraine. According to the decree, mobilization begins on September 21.
At the same time, the Russian invaders in the temporarily occupied Luhansk region are taking all the men they can find.
Protests swept through Russia. Detained men are served with summonses.
It is known that men are trying to leave the Russian Federation en masse. In particular, to Finland and Georgia. EU countries - for example, Estonia, Latvia, and Lithuania - declare that they will not provide shelter to Russian citizens fleeing mobilization. Source: https://censor.net/en/n3368890
Quite bleak over there, especially in winter so it wouldn't surprise me if the Russians laid mines on their side tbh.
Well, not so bad. The forest is very dense, there are many swamps and lakes. Severe frosts in winter, and mosquitoes will eat you alive in summer. And so it's very beautiful, I regularly hunt and fish in Karelia. There are very few roads, you need to be a well-prepared traveler to cross the border there. There is nothing to mine there, a normal person will not go there.
Jimbuna
09-22-22, 06:40 AM
Perhaps but I suspect many of those fleeing forced conscription will be desperate as opposed to normal.
Perhaps but I suspect many of those fleeing forced conscription will be desperate as opposed to normal.
The funny thing is that those who are running are the ones who are not in danger. Ordinary frightened citizens. It is clear that if the Third World War begins, they will be drafted into the army, but I do not think that in Georgia they will escape from the horrors of war.
Jimbuna
09-22-22, 07:02 AM
Residents of Melitopol are urged to immediately leave territory of occupied city via "Crimea - Georgia" route. VIDEO
The authorities of the temporarily occupied Melitopol call on citizens to leave the territory of the city immediately.
This was announced by Mayor Ivan Fedorov, Censor.NET informs.
The authorities of the temporarily occupied Melitopol call on citizens to leave the territory of the city immediately.
This was announced by Mayor Ivan Fedorov, Censor.NET informs.
"Men under the age of 35 are recommended to immediately leave the occupied territory via the Crimea-Georgia route. Already today, at the enemy checkpoint in Vasylivka, men aged 18 to 35 were not allowed to go to Zaporizhzhia. And this practice will continue," the head of the city emphasized.
According to Fedorov, the goal of the occupiers is to mobilize Ukrainian men as "cannon fodder" for the front.
"In 2014, the occupiers organized a real manhunt in the so-called LPR/DPR. They will do the same in the TOT of the Zaporizhia and Kherson regions. It is necessary now to either try to leave in the direction of Zaporizhia, or choose an alternative route - towards Georgia through a temporary occupied Crimea. There is little time left!" - he concluded. Source: https://censor.net/en/n3368891
Jimbuna
09-22-22, 09:24 AM
Queues have sprung up along Russia's border as men attempt to leave the country amid a military call-up for the war in Ukraine.
President Vladimir Putin announced a partial military mobilisation on Wednesday, which could see 300,000 people summoned to serve in the war.
The Kremlin says reports of fighting-age men fleeing are exaggerated.
But on the border with Georgia, miles-long queues of vehicles have formed including men trying to escape the war.
One man, who did not want to be named, told the BBC's Rayhan Demytrie he had grabbed his passport and headed to the border, without packing anything else, immediately after President' Putin's announcement - because he fell into the group that could potentially be sent to the war.
Some witnesses estimated the queue of cars at the Upper Lars checkpoint to be some 5km (3 miles) long, while another group said it had taken seven hours to get across the border. Video from the scene showed some drivers leaving their cars or trucks temporarily in standstill traffic.
Georgia is one of the few neighbouring countries that Russians can enter without needing a apply for a visa. Finland, which shares a 1,300km (800 mile) border with Russia, does require a visa for travel, and also reported an increase in traffic overnight - but said it was at a manageable level.
Other destinations reachable by air - such as Istanbul, Belgrade or Dubai - have seen ticket prices skyrocket immediately after the military call-up was announced, with some destinations sold out completely. Turkish media have reported a large spike in one-way ticket sales, while remaining flights to non-visa destinations can cost thousands of euros.
The call-up sparked protests in major Russian cities including Moscow and St Petersburg on Tuesday, resulting in a reported 1,300 arrests.
There were also reports from Russia that some of those detained for protesting had been handed draft papers while in custody at police stations. Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov, when asked about the reports, said that doing so was not against the law.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-62996212
Jimbuna
09-22-22, 09:47 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ojlCO8yyYXQ
Skybird
09-22-22, 11:28 AM
^ Excellent analysis. Superb. That guy knows his stuff. He forces me to change some details in my views. Is he a well-known name?
Buddahaid
09-22-22, 12:29 PM
He's interviewed in these videos.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lf1uQF38ZeA&t=161s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6NZQMUclv5g
Jimbuna
09-22-22, 12:39 PM
^ Excellent analysis. Superb. That guy knows his stuff. He forces me to change some details in my views. Is he a well-known name?
Justin Bronk is the Research Fellow for Airpower and Technology in the Military Sciences team at RUSI. He is also Editor of the RUSI Defence Systems online journal. Justin's particular areas of expertise include the modern combat air environment, Russian and Chinese ground-based air defences and fast jet capabilities, unmanned combat aerial vehicles and novel weapons technology. He has written extensively for RUSI and a variety of external publications, as well as appearing regularly in the international media. Justin is also a part-time doctoral candidate at the Defence Studies Department of Kings College London and is a private glider and light aircraft pilot.
Jimbuna
09-22-22, 12:46 PM
Czech Republic won't issue visas to Russian men
Rob Cameron
BBC Prague Correspondent
The Czech Foreign Minister Jan Lipavsky has said his country will not issue humanitarian visas to Russian men fleeing mobilisation orders.
Lipavsky told the Czech news server Novinky.cz that while he understood their motivations, such cases did not meet the conditions for a humanitarian visa.
The Czech Republic joins other countries such as Latvia which has said it will not provide sanctuary to Russians seeking to avoid the draft on humanitarian grounds. Germany, on the other hand, says it will do so.
The Czech Foreign Ministry has also confirmed it has written to two NHL teams to say Prague would not issue visas to Russian ice hockey players wishing to travel to the Czech capital to take part in the NHL's Global Series games.
Prague will host two matches between the San Jose Sharks and the Nashville Predators, both of which have Russian players, on 7 and 8 October.
10,000 Russians volunteer for mobilisation - report
Following Russia's announcement yesterday that thousands of extra troops will be called up to fight the war in Ukraine, a Russian military spokesman has said that around 10,000 Russians have already volunteered of their own accord on the first day of the mobilisation drive.
"About 10,000 citizens arrived at recruitment offices of their own accord without waiting for a summons," Vladimir Tsimlyansky said in comments quoted by Russian news agency Interfax.
The BBC is unable to verify the figure.
Over 1,300 protesters have been detained for protesting against the mobilisation announcement between Wednesday and today, according to the latest figures from Russian human rights NGO OVD-Info.
Jimbuna
09-22-22, 12:56 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yats4seJaW0
Jimbuna
09-22-22, 01:03 PM
SSU showed footage of exchange of Ukrainian prisoners of war in Chernihiv region. VIDEO
The Security Service of Ukraine showed footage of the exchange of Ukrainian prisoners of war, which took place on September 21 in the Chernihiv region.
As Censor.NET informs about this with reference to the SSU press center.
"This event touched the whole of Ukraine. Many people worked to ensure that our Heroes finally returned home. This is, without exaggeration, a historic moment. We want to show unique footage of exactly how the exchange took place, the earliest and most sincere emotions of the Ukrainian defenders who knew - they will not be forgetten and will be definitely returned home.
And we will continue to fight until we free everyone who is still in captivity and win back the last piece of our land!", the message reads.
It will be recalled that on September 21, as a result of the exchange, 215 Ukrainian defenders, as well as 10 foreigners, were returned from Russian captivity. Instead, Putin's godfather Viktor Medvedchuk, who is suspected of treason, and 55 other Russian soldiers were returned to the Russian side. Source: https://censor.net/en/v3368985
After Putin announced mobilization in Russia, 90% of support for the "special operation" disappeared, said Russian opposition politician and journalist Igor Yakovenko in an interview with OBOZREVATEL. "A significant number of Russians were ready to support this war by sitting on the couch. But as soon as it touched their own lives, all that support disappeared. Nobody wants to die. It is unclear what you should give your own life for," he said. https://twitter.com/Flash_news_ua/status/1572981471316709376
Jimbuna
09-22-22, 01:22 PM
^ That is so often the case and not only in Russia.
^ That is so often the case and not only in Russia.Prominent Russian human rights lawyer Pavel Chikov says he has been made aware of multiple reports of men in their 40s, 50s and even 60s receiving military call-up notices since yesterday reckon old meat must be slaughtered first.
“It’s not a partial mobilisation, it’s a 100% mobilisation.” Midnight summons, vodka-fueled farewells, and showdowns at the draft centers. Russia says it’s recruiting 300,000 but the real number could be 3x higher. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/sep/22/russia-mobilisation-ukraine-war-army-drive?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other
See reports of many tank transports (T-80BV, BMP-2, BMP-1KSh, and T-62M tanks) the mass of untrained Russian conscripts will be unarmed or at best with ancient equipment of little utility against the modern weapons that Ukraine has and think that training will be short.
The war between Ukraine and Russia should be ended at the negotiating table as soon as possible, — Chinese Foreign Minister Wang Yi.
According to him, China calls for the resumption of the dialogue between Moscow and Kyiv without preconditions.
https://twitter.com/Flash_news_ua/status/1572996699878195203
Mobilization going swell Anti-war protest held in Grozny
The Head of Chechnya, Ramzan Kadyrov, confirmed that an anti-war protest was held in Grozny on 21 September. Opposition media suggest that mothers were detained following the protest, and their sons forced to sign up to fight.
Kadyrov shared a video message in his Telegram channel, in which he confirmed that an anti-mobilisation rally was held in Grozny — the first protest against the ruling regime in Kadyrov’s 15 years as head of the republic.
https://oc-media.org/anti-war-protest-held-in-grozny/
Skybird
09-22-22, 04:42 PM
See reports of many tank transports (T-80BV, BMP-2, BMP-1KSh, and T-62M tanks) the mass of untrained Russian conscripts will be unarmed or at best with ancient equipment of little utility against the modern weapons that Ukraine has and think that training will be short.
Its about numbers. Has the Ukraine more AT missiles than Russia has tanks or has Russia more tanks than the Ukraine has ammo and shooters?
That's Putin's calculation here. He copies ways they tried during WWII, where masses of bodies should defeat German positions or superior mobile operation leadership or superior firepower: just throw more bodies at the enemy than the enmy can shoot at. Saturating the killzone with bodies so that the enemy cannot see and hit anything anymore. High own losses? Irrelevant.
As long as they do not revolt, at least.
Russian soldiers always have had two enemies when at war: their military enemy, and their own leadership. And often it is not clear who the worse enemy was (and is).
Jimbuna
09-23-22, 03:56 AM
Its about numbers. Has the Ukraine more AT missiles than Russia has tanks or has Russia more tanks than the Ukraine has ammo and shooters?
That's Putin's calculation here. He copies ways they tried during WWII, where masses of bodies should defeat German positions or superior mobile operation leadership or superior firepower: just throw more bodies at the enemy than the enmy can shoot at. Saturating the killzone with bodies so that the enemy cannot see and hit anything anymore. High own losses? Irrelevant.
As long as they do not revolt, at least.
Russian soldiers always have had two enemies when at war: their military enemy, and their own leadership. And often it is not clear who the worse enemy was (and is).
Sums it up well for me :yep:
Jimbuna
09-23-22, 03:59 AM
Russians flee to border after military call-up
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-62996212
Jimbuna
09-23-22, 04:02 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b4Oc3ja34vI
Jimbuna
09-23-22, 04:04 AM
Another 11 ships with Ukrainian agricultural products left Ukrainian ports. PHOTOS
Ships go to countries in Africa and Asia.
This is reported by Censor.NET with reference to the Ministry of Infrastructure.
"The bulk carrier ZEKO Y departed from the "Odesa" port, the MERRY M, LADY AYANA, MO GAN SHAN, TZAREVICH, GUDENA, NIL DEMIR, SEA DOVE from the "Chornomorsk" port, and the FORTUNA, GEM STAR, MAVKA from the "Pivdenny" port. On board 201 thousand tons of food," the message says.
Since the departure of the first ship with Ukrainian food, 4.58 million tons of agricultural products have already been exported. A total of 203 ships with food for the countries of Asia, Europe, and Africa left Ukrainian ports. Source: https://censor.net/en/p3369082
Skybird
09-23-22, 07:51 AM
Der Tagesspiegel writes:
In the Russian mobilization decree there is apparently a secret seventh point, according to which the Ministry of Defense is allowed to call up one million people. This had been reported by the Russian newspaper Novaya Gazeta, citing sources in the presidential administration. This point is missing from the published version of the decree and was classified as "For official use only." Point six is followed instead by point eight in the publicly available decree.
Such a clause would contradict statements made by Defense Minister Sergei Shoigu on Wednesday. The latter had said after President Vladimir Putin's televised address that only 300,000 "combat-experienced" reservists would be called up.
Presidential spokesman Dmitry Peskov on Thursday called the report a "lie" when asked, but confirmed that the secret point of the decree was about the number of reservists who could be called up for military service. "The only thing I can say is what Sergei Shoigu said: We are talking about the number of up to 300,000 people," Peskov said.
Novaya Gazeta further reports that the issue of classifying the entire decree as classified was initially discussed in the Kremlin. Later, however, it was decided to block only the seventh item.
The U.S. think tank Institute for the Study of War (ISW) now reports that even the promise to draft only "combat-experienced" reservists is not being kept. For example, according to the ISW, the Russian opposition claims that an IT specialist was drafted even though he had never done military service. Students and men over 50 are also said to be affected. Shoigu had explicitly ruled out that the former would be drafted.
According to ISW, there are reports from two Russian regions, the Republic of Sakha and Kursk Oblast, that reservists are forbidden to leave their place of residence. Novaya Gazeta even reports at least four Russian regions where military commissariats have signed such orders.
The first Russian reservists had already been contacted on the day the partial mobilization was announced. According to the Russian military, even within 24 hours about 10,000 people volunteered to fight in Ukraine.
They had come to the recruiting offices voluntarily and without waiting for the summons, a military spokesman told the Russian news agency Interfax on Thursday. However, it is not possible to independently verify the veracity of the Russian statements.
Other Russians are being forced into military service as punishment: Reuters news agency reports, for example, that some of the more than 1,300 arrested during protests against the partial mobilization had received conscription notices while still in police custody. Russian civil rights organization OVG-Info reported cases from 15 police stations. Kremlin spokesman Peskov described this procedure as legal on Thursday.
Can't remember which one of you mention this earlier in this thread
Dmitry Peskov, the Russian president’s press secretary, has said that in the event that Ukraine attacks the occupied Ukrainian territories where the so-called "referendums" are taking place, "the constitution of Russia will come into force."
https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2022/09/23/7368758/
Markus
The Muslim Board of Uzbekistan has issued a fatwa (legal ruling) which deny Muslims to participate in any military activities except to defend their motherland. "You should not be involved, it is haram", says the fatwa. It also appeals to current anti-mercenary laws. https://twitter.com/nikmccaren/status/1573293291700948993
Its about numbers. Has the Ukraine more AT missiles than Russia has tanks or has Russia more tanks than the Ukraine has ammo and shooters?
That's Putin's calculation here. He copies ways they tried during WWII, where masses of bodies should defeat German positions or superior mobile operation leadership or superior firepower: just throw more bodies at the enemy than the enmy can shoot at. Saturating the killzone with bodies so that the enemy cannot see and hit anything anymore. High own losses? Irrelevant.
As long as they do not revolt, at least.
Russian soldiers always have had two enemies when at war: their military enemy, and their own leadership. And often it is not clear who the worse enemy was (and is).The most important thing is to fill quotas, same as in the past quotas were always achieved in the gulags for the useless canals same with production the Russian way of corruption to saturate the kill zone they need to hire the Chinese Russian drunks will not archive victory.
Platapus
09-23-22, 05:31 PM
To paraphrase Emperor Hirohito, 124th Emperor of Japan
The war situation has developed not necessarily to Russia's advantage
Jimbuna
09-24-22, 02:31 AM
Russian-backed officials in Luhansk, Donetsk, Kherson and Zaporizhzhia are holding self-styled referendums on joining Russia.
The four regions involved are either partially or completely under Russian occupation.
The G7 group of wealthiest nations have condemned what it says are sham votes, that are taking place over five days.
Meanwhile Russia is implementing plans to call up reservists to fight in Ukraine after suffering setbacks there.
Queues have sprung up along Russia's borders as men attempt to leave the country to avoid a military call-up.
Jimbuna
09-24-22, 02:33 AM
Total combat losses of Russia since beginning of war - about 56,300 people, 255 planes, 220 helicopters, 2,262 tanks, 1,361 artillery systems, and 4,807 armored vehicles. INFOGRAPHICS
The Russian invaders, who invaded the territory of Ukraine, continue to suffer losses. As of the morning of September 24, the loss of enemy personnel are approximately 56,300.
This is reported by Censor.NET with reference to the press center of the General Staff of the Armed Forces of Ukraine.
As noted, the total combat losses of the enemy from 24/02 to 24/09 are approximately:
personnel - about 56,300 (+240) people were eliminated,
tanks - 2262 (+8) units,
armored fighting vehicles - 4807 (+11) units,
artillery systems - 1361 (+6) units,
MLRS - 327 (+1) units,
air defense equipment - 170 (+0) units,
aircraft - 255 (+1) units,
helicopters - 220 (+1) units,
UAVs of operational-tactical level - 956 (+6),
cruise missiles - 240 (+0),
ships/boats - 15 (+0) units,
automotive equipment and tank trucks - 3681 (+22) units,
special equipment - 126 (+0). Source: https://censor.net/en/n3369285
I'm running out of funny comments to add to all these complaints about mobilisation. https://twitter.com/wartranslated/status/1573615102019964928
https://i.postimg.cc/Cxp60qNy/mobilisation.png https://i.postimg.cc/QdgYdd4F/mobilisation-rus.png
We pretend that mobilisation works, and they pretend to fight!
Skybird
09-24-22, 07:29 AM
FOCUS writes:
The sham referendums initiated by Russia in the occupied parts of Ukraine are in full swing. Curious: apparently, people who have already died are also allowed to vote. Russian administrative authorities in Alchevsk are counting the "votes" of people who are in captivity or have died, said Serhii Haidai, the head of the region's military administration. "There are certainly many voters. A resident of Alchevsk who is on the front lines, in captivity or already dead will also vote somehow. Perhaps their vote will be taken into account by telepathic means," the Ukrainian newspaper "Ukrainska Pravda" quoted the Russian administration chief as saying.
Is it propaganda or is the Russian in such a condition.
Throughout the days I have seen a lot of small video clips showing drunk, very drunk Russian who has been drafted.
This made me wonder-Are they all drunk or is it Ukrainian propaganda.
Furthermore-Putin & Co knew that a mobilisation would happen and he should have build what I call drill school and try to hire civilian drill sergeants.
Then I would when I have announced this mobilisation sent these young men to a 8 weeks intensive training at these drill school.
Markus
Is it propaganda or is the Russian in such a condition.
Throughout the days I have seen a lot of small video clips showing drunk, very drunk Russian who has been drafted.
This made me wonder-Are they all drunk or is it Ukrainian propaganda.
Furthermore-Putin & Co knew that a mobilisation would happen and he should have build what I call drill school and try to hire civilian drill sergeants.
Then I would when I have announced this mobilisation sent these young men to a 8 weeks intensive training at these drill school.
MarkusAlcoholism is a big problem in Russia men drafted are old do not think they have personnel to train them certainly not in these numbers fear they get sent quick to the front with old rusty bad material
Alcoholism is a big problem in Russia men drafted are old do not think they have personnel to train them certainly not in these numbers fear they get sent quick to the front with old rusty bad material
Are you telling me that there isn't any sufficient structure in the Russian military when it comes to train and equip ?
Markus
Ukrainian forces shot down four Russian fighter jets today.
4 aircrafts (Su-25, two Su-30 and one Su-34) https://twitter.com/WarMonitor3/status/1573715122710843394
Almost daily you can see these reports Russia loses millions daily no mater how many they mobilize this war is lost for them Putin only delays his execution Russia cannot win against an army that is led and trained as the Ukraine army.
Ukraine shot down $167,000,000 of Russian fighter jets today.
1x Su-25 - Cost $11M
2x Su-30 - Cost $60M = $120M
1x Su-34 - Cost $36M
Are you telling me that there isn't any sufficient structure in the Russian military when it comes to train and equip ?
MarkusYes, they lack the staff to train and lead an army what they got is old equipment a lot, but most can not be used Russia has whole divisions of it rust in open air. Because Putin decided to keep his forces in the pocket in Kherson oblast to save his own position, a lot of BTG's are lost that is Russian leadership they never gone win this war.
I'm running out of funny comments to add to all these complaints about mobilisation. https://twitter.com/wartranslated/status/1573615102019964928
https://i.postimg.cc/Cxp60qNy/mobilisation.png https://i.postimg.cc/QdgYdd4F/mobilisation-rus.png
The rusty AK's were not the worst, according to an "LPR" guy... https://twitter.com/wartranslated/status/1573711929499160576
https://i.postimg.cc/w3YYhwsq/rustak.pnghttps://i.postimg.cc/7LRH5MX6/rustak-rus.png
Yes, they lack the staff to train and lead an army what they got is old equipment a lot, but most can not be used Russia has whole divisions of it rust in open air. Because Putin decided to keep his forces in the pocket in Kherson oblast to save his own position, a lot of BTG's are lost that is Russian leadership they never gone win this war.
I was aware you would say(write) something like that.
Now I'm going a little off topic and turn conspiracist
There are those of my friends who truly believe Russia will win this war..They say Putin should be helped-He is fighting WEF-It's WEF who's behind this war together with Biden and Zelenskyy
End of going a little off topic....
They are my friends and I worship this friendship-But here I can't do anything than shake my head and laugh about it.
Markus
Russian flee to Georgia border guards sent them back because of the Z symbol on their cars stupid Russians start to threaten Georgia border guards to redo 2008 :mad: pfff and that are people fleeing for the mobilization.
I was aware you would say(write) something like that.
Now I'm going a little off topic and turn conspiracist
There are those of my friends who truly believe Russia will win this war..They say Putin should be helped-He is fighting WEF-It's WEF who's behind this war together with Biden and Zelenskyy
End of going a little off topic....
They are my friends and I worship this friendship-But here I can't do anything than shake my head and laugh about it.
MarkusIt is not so hard to see daily that the 3-day invasion is lost, Russia army can not win against a western trained army Russia is corrupt to the bone to ever win anything. WEF yeah what to say nah never it is like the manifest of Zion it was never written never true everybody always biaach about the EU but the WEF rules the world :har:
Mobilization in Russia takes place in two parallel realities: while the authorities continue to say that only professional soldiers are being taken to the front, in reality, summonses come to anyone. Those who could have been retired for a long time if not for the reform, the elderly with diabetes, spinal hernias, deaf and even dead. https://theins-ru.translate.goog/news/255386?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en&_x_tr_pto=wapp
Yes, they lack the staff to train and lead an army what they got is old equipment a lot, but most can not be used Russia has whole divisions of it rust in open air. Because Putin decided to keep his forces in the pocket in Kherson oblast to save his own position, a lot of BTG's are lost that is Russian leadership they never gone win this war.New York Times: Putin rejects commanders’ requests to withdraw from Kherson.
Russian President Vladimir Putin has been more directly involved in planning Russia’s war in Ukraine, reports New York Times, citing unnamed U.S. officials. While he has accepted some recommendations by Russian commanders, Putin’s increased involvement on the battlefield has reportedly “created tensions.” https://twitter.com/KyivIndependent/status/1573635124603805697
Mobilization in Russia takes place in two parallel realities: while the authorities continue to say that only professional soldiers are being taken to the front, in reality, summonses come to anyone. Those who could have been retired for a long time if not for the reform, the elderly with diabetes, spinal hernias, deaf and even dead. https://theins-ru.translate.goog/news/255386?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en&_x_tr_pto=wapp
Dead is not an excuse for doing your duty for your country and if the dead doesn't appear this person will get 10 years in prison. It will be seen as deserting.
Markus
New York Times: Putin rejects commanders’ requests to withdraw from Kherson.
Russian President Vladimir Putin has been more directly involved in planning Russia’s war in Ukraine, reports New York Times, citing unnamed U.S. officials. While he has accepted some recommendations by Russian commanders, Putin’s increased involvement on the battlefield has reportedly “created tensions.” https://twitter.com/KyivIndependent/status/1573635124603805697
Why did Stalingrad 1942-43 pop up ?
Markus
Mobilization in Russia takes place in two parallel realities: while the authorities continue to say that only professional soldiers are being taken to the front, in reality, summonses come to anyone. Those who could have been retired for a long time if not for the reform, the elderly with diabetes, spinal hernias, deaf and even dead. https://theins-ru.translate.goog/news/255386?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en&_x_tr_pto=wapp
Don't forget the bear with the balalaika yet. :D You still need to be able to read more independent sources, as well as sometimes communicate with native speakers.
Don't forget the bear with the balalaika yet. :D You still need to be able to read more independent sources, as well as sometimes communicate with native speakers.I speak with Russians and Ukrainians my sources are vast from the ground and international.
Why did Stalingrad 1942-43 pop up ?
MarkusDo not know, but Stalingrad was won because it became a kettle :hmmm:
Dead is not an excuse for doing your duty for your country and if the dead doesn't appear this person will get 10 years in prison. It will be seen as deserting.
Markus
Can not argue that :D
Do not know, but Stalingrad was won because it became a kettle :hmmm:
Can't remember his name-But General XX wanted to make a break-out(I think they call it) But Hitler refused and gave him order to stand his ground.
Markus
Can't remember his name-But General XX wanted to make a break-out(I think they call it) But Hitler refused and gave him order to stand his ground.
MarkusField marshal Friedrich Paulus.
After a heavy Soviet offensive overran the last emergency airstrip in Stalingrad on 25 January, the Soviets again offered Paulus a chance to surrender. Paulus radioed Hitler once again for permission. Telling Hitler that collapse was "inevitable," Paulus stressed that his men were without ammunition or food, and he was no longer able to command them. He also said that 18,000 men were wounded and were in immediate need of medical attention. Once again, Hitler rejected Paulus' request out of hand, and ordered him to hold Stalingrad to the death. On 30 January, Paulus informed Hitler that his men were only hours from collapse. Hitler responded by showering a raft of field promotions by radio on Paulus' officers to build up their spirits and bolster their will to hold their ground. Most significantly, he promoted Paulus to field marshal. In deciding to promote him, Hitler noted that there was no known record of a Prussian or German field marshal ever having surrendered. The implication was clear: Paulus was to commit suicide. Hitler implied that if Paulus allowed himself to be taken alive, he would shame Germany's military history
Field marshal Friedrich Paulus.
After a heavy Soviet offensive overran the last emergency airstrip in Stalingrad on 25 January, the Soviets again offered Paulus a chance to surrender. Paulus radioed Hitler once again for permission. Telling Hitler that collapse was "inevitable," Paulus stressed that his men were without ammunition or food, and he was no longer able to command them. He also said that 18,000 men were wounded and were in immediate need of medical attention. Once again, Hitler rejected Paulus' request out of hand, and ordered him to hold Stalingrad to the death. On 30 January, Paulus informed Hitler that his men were only hours from collapse. Hitler responded by showering a raft of field promotions by radio on Paulus' officers to build up their spirits and bolster their will to hold their ground. Most significantly, he promoted Paulus to field marshal. In deciding to promote him, Hitler noted that there was no known record of a Prussian or German field marshal ever having surrendered. The implication was clear: Paulus was to commit suicide. Hitler implied that if Paulus allowed himself to be taken alive, he would shame Germany's military history
Thank you Dargo-It was this one "Putin rejects commanders’ requests to withdraw from Kherson." Who made me remember Stalingrad.
I have remembered it somehow wrong though.
Someone may say it's Hitler Once again-Taking part in planning of military operations despite having none or very little knowledge.
Markus
Thank you Dargo-It was this one "Putin rejects commanders’ requests to withdraw from Kherson." Who made me remember Stalingrad.
I have remembered it somehow wrong though.
Someone may say it's Hitler Once again-Taking part in planning of military operations despite having none or very little knowledge.
MarkusThe last tsar did that also and... it did not end well for him and his family.
“We dealt with the professional Russian army. Now it’s time to defeat the unprofessional army.” Commander-in-Chief of the Ukrainian Armed Forces Valery Zaluzhny reacting to news of Russia’s mobilization.
https://i.postimg.cc/1RTL8G2g/Zaluzhny.jpg
Three governors of Russian regions have already criticized military commissariats for mobilizing everyone, even those who are not subject to conscription. They were joined by the pseudo-head of Sevastopol.
This was reported by the "Medusa", the Censor.NET informed.
The first to complain that military commissariats mobilize citizens who do not meet the criteria set by the Ministry of Defense was the head of Yakutia Aysen Nikolayev. Then - the Governor of Magadan region, Sergey Nosov. After them - "to deal with those who were drafted by mistake" gathered the occupation "head" of Sevastopol Mikhail Razvozzhayev.
Now, the governor of Vladimir region Alexander Avdeev said that the military commissariats "mistakenly" mobilized some citizens. According to him, they should return home.
According to the newspaper, there are also known cases in Saratov, Volgograd and Nizhny Novgorod regions and Buryatia, when citizens were mobilized illegally.
Translated from: https://censor.net/ua/n3369379
Russian media: Russia considers imposing martial law, banning men of draft age from leaving the country.
According to Russian media Verstka, Russia is considering imposing martial law “if Ukraine continues to attack" occupied territories that Russia plans to illegally annex. According to the media, the Kremlin might also ban men of draft age from leaving Russia. The move might be announced ahead of Russian dictator Vladimir Putin’s address to the Federal Assembly which, according to Verstka, is scheduled for Sept. 30. https://twitter.com/KyivIndependent/status/1573744568515936257
That resolved quick LOL
Skybird
09-24-22, 04:17 PM
Chaos. A total nuthouse.
-------------
In recent days German media see a rise in publications where authors demand that now is the time the West must press Selensky to accept concessions and negotiate a peace dela with Russia.
I do not agree with these basterds one bit, I only say the media swing around. Putins atomic threats reap harvests.
The dilemma and tragedy of Ukraine is twofold. First, its hopelessly depending on wepakj n deliveries from the West, and so hangs on the mericful drip. If the West decides the ukraine has to stop to not provoke Putler any further, the West can force it by simply not delivering anything anymore. Second, the Russians have occupied the economic heartlands of Ukraine's industry and main parts of its agricultural hotspots, too, much industry that lies outside the occupied territories has been destroyed by the Russians. I know Dargos aid some weeks ago the Donbass is not the only industrial centre, but our media at least describe it as extremely important and relevant, heavy in economic importance. The economic wounds are life-threatening for Ukraine already now, and it is practically bancrupt. In this regard, Russia's war has done an almost complete job.
Russia has lost the war, no doubt. But that does not automatically translate into an Ukrainian win.
We need to keep the rats in the West, who want negotiations with Putin, under tight control, keeping them on the shortest of lines.
Catfish
09-24-22, 04:24 PM
^ What exactly did you say, about Sarah Wagenknecht? :D
Unbelievable.
Yes, negotiations are necessary. But only after Russia has reached the borders of before 2014.
kpv1974
09-24-22, 04:32 PM
Chaos. A total nuthouse.
-------------
In recent days German media see a rise in publications where authors demand that now is the time the West must press Selensky to accept concessions and negotiate a peace dela with Russia.
I do not agree with these basterds one bit, I only say the media swing around. Putins atomic threats reap harvests.
The dilemma and tragedy of Ukraine is twofold. First, its hopelessly depending on wepakj n deliveries from the West, and so hangs on the mericful drip. If the West decides the ukraine has to stop to not provoke Putler any further, the West can force it by simply not delivering anything anymore. Second, the Russians have occupied the economic heartlands of Ukraine's industry and main parts of its agricultural hotspots, too, much industry that lies outside the occupied territories has been destroyed by the Russians. I know Dargos aid some weeks ago the Donbass is not the only industrial centre, but our media at least describe it as extremely important and relevant, heavy in economic importance. The economic wounds are life-threatening for Ukraine already now, and it is practically bancrupt. In this regard, Russia's war has done an almost complete job.
Russia has lost the war, no doubt. But that does not automatically translate into an Ukrainian win.
We need to keep the rats in the West, who want negotiations with Putin, under tight control, keeping them on the shortest of lines.
December will be a turning point. Putin will inflict a nuclear strike on the Anglo-Saxons.
God bless us all.
The living envy the dead.
Putin's strategy is not about losing.
Either Putin wins, or the whole world is in ruins.
Catfish
09-24-22, 04:47 PM
December will be a turning point. Putin will inflict a nuclear strike on the Anglo-Saxons.
God bless us all.
The living envy the dead.
Putin's strategy is not about losing.
Either Putin wins, or the whole world is in ruins.
He cannot win. And god does not "bless Russia".
To fulfill Putin's egoism Russia and the rest of the world should die? Children, men women, animals, all. Brilliant.
You attack another nation and dare to threaten the whole world with war because you are not able to win?
Are you crazy? I'd rather propose to get rid of your dictator.
B.t.w. this is the future of the russian "army"?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ufOVEKwY2sw
kpv1974
09-24-22, 05:01 PM
He cannot win. And god does not "bless Russia".
To fulfill Putin's egoism Russia and the rest of the world should die? Children, men women, animals, all. Brilliant.
You attack another nation and dare to threaten the whole world with war because you are not able to win?
Are you crazy? I'd rather propose to get rid of your dictator.
B.t.w. this is the future of the russian "army"?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ufOVEKwY2sw
mad, does not know that they are mad. He performs a mission that is known only to him, which is dictated to him by the "inner voice".
In psychiatry, there is some explanation for this deviation.
it's called schizophrenia, but in a milder form, it's like paranoia.
Putin is pure paranoid.
Therefore, he will not flinch by pressing the red button.
For us in Russia, he said a long time ago - that we will go to heaven, and the Anglo-Saxons will burn in the fire.
He's just sick. And he is dangerous.
December will be a turning point. Putin will inflict a nuclear strike on the Anglo-Saxons.
God bless us all.
The living envy the dead.
Putin's strategy is not about losing.
Either Putin wins, or the whole world is in ruins.Talking about turning points, Russia already had it they gone lose nukes will not give them victory or save face it will be burned of this earth by the retaliation, so December will not happen Putin is stupid but not that stupid. The principal role of nuclear weapons is to deter potential adversaries from an attack, nothing else.
kpv1974
09-24-22, 05:11 PM
Talking about turning points, Russia already had it they gone lose nukes will not give them victory or save face it will be burned of this earth by the retaliation, so December will not happen Putin is stupid but not that stupid. The principal role of nuclear weapons is to deter potential adversaries from an attack, nothing else.
We have to wait until December.
A cornered rat is capable of amazing things.
Map of arson attacks on military enlistment offices and local administrative buildings in locations across Russia since Wednesday 21 September.
https://i.postimg.cc/bv92LGJx/arsonattacks.jpg
We have to wait until December.
A cornered rat is capable of amazing things.Why December Putin gone cosplay Santa Claus? Furthermore, it has no gain for Russia to use nukes nill Santa Claus does not exist
Catfish
09-24-22, 05:22 PM
re kpv1974
It seems i misunderstood you, i am sorry. I agree, he is dangerous.
If humanity survives this, in the long run the question should be how to not let certain people reach certain (political) leading positions anywhere in this world. It is easier for dictators, but it is also possible for 'democratic' politicians when they or their supporters are crazy.
It really is a complete shambles. I have russian friends, most of them here are against Putin. Like me they are "for Russia", but not "for Putin".
On the other hand way too much russians here support him.
I ask them why, and why they do not move to Russia if they like it so much, which always creates an uneasy reaction. The far right of them says something like "i wait for Russia to come here", which is of course cowardly nonsense, the rest tries not to answer.
Why don't they fight for Russia in Ukraine? Or against Latvia, Estonia, Lithuania, Poland and whatever comes next?
I guess they do not know what it is about living in Russia right now, but i admit I do not know what their reasons are. Some cloudy patriotism, "right or wrong my country"? Disinterest?
After all some Ukrainian said that
“For most people they turn off the tv and the war is over for them, but not for us.”
For us, it is easy.
kpv1974
09-24-22, 05:38 PM
Talking about turning points, Russia already had it they gone lose nukes will not give them victory or save face it will be burned of this earth by the retaliation, so December will not happen Putin is stupid but not that stupid. The principal role of nuclear weapons is to deter potential adversaries from an attack, nothing else.
>> Russia already had it they gone lose nukes will not give them victory or save face it will be burned of this earth by the retaliation
Did the most honest BBC tell you this? (LOL)
What makes you think that Russia will give up its nuclear weapons?
And what is she, does not contain him in full combat readiness?
I wouldn't jump to such rash conclusions.
Just - Russia is very sensitive to these types of strategic weapons.
Moreover, the puten has nothing more, an effective argument for confrontation with Western "partners".
kpv1974
09-24-22, 05:57 PM
Why December Putin gone cosplay Santa Claus? Furthermore, it has no gain for Russia to use nukes nill Santa Claus does not exist
because Putin said-either Russia will win, or the whole world will turn into dust.
I don't doubt his statement.
Because paranoids are in power, they decide the fate of the world.
And alas - no one can resist them.
at least in that police system which now exists in Russia.
You must understand that Putin is a dictator.
And no political opponent has the right to vote against him.
Whoever gives his dissenting vote will be immediately destroyed by the Putin regime. I hope this is clear to you?
You should not underestimate Putin. In fact, you still don’t know what kind of world evil this is.
I do not have a crystal ball, I can therefore not foresee the future..
I'm confused how can anyone know what's will happen in December.
Markus
kpv1974
09-24-22, 06:17 PM
Time will tell whether nuclear weapons are in the hands of responsible politicians, or whether they are in the hands of political blackmailers.
because Putin said-either Russia will win, or the whole world will turn into dust.
I don't doubt his statement.
Because paranoids are in power, they decide the fate of the world.
And alas - no one can resist them.
at least in that police system which now exists in Russia.
You must understand that Putin is a dictator.
And no political opponent has the right to vote against him.
Whoever gives his dissenting vote will be immediately destroyed by the Putin regime. I hope this is clear to you?
You should not underestimate Putin. In fact, you still don’t know what kind of world evil this is.Putin is a loser, that I am certain of also certain he is a bully dictators do not rule alone always by support of... Putin is on a dangerous power road, not certain he will survive. He can oppress people, but that is done by other forces if they decide it is over, Putin is a goner and knowing Russia everyone with a bit of power is trying to destroy each other to become tho top dog. Putin is busy saving his ass, got no time pressing buttons.
because Putin said-either Russia will win, or the whole world will turn into dust.Source?
Time will tell whether nuclear weapons are in the hands of responsible politicians, or whether they are in the hands of political blackmailers.Russia has only political blackmailers all failed and backfired not afraid only good answer is aufs Maul only thing fascists understand.
Russia has threaten even giving a hint on using nukes in Ukraine.
Maybe they will use nuke(s) in Ukraine, maybe not.
If they decide to use these, will it happen in Oct. Nov. or in Dec. ?
Markus
Skybird
09-24-22, 06:47 PM
Tactical nukes used by Russia are possible, i say that since months. Strategic nukes I do not waste a thought on, hte principle of mutual assured destruction still applies and an ICBM going off in Ukraine inevitably will bring the West actively into the war., If Ukraine goes after the Crimea peninsula, I almost expect the sue of tactical nukes by Russia if they cannot stop them conventionally. Which they probably couldn't, if Ukraine is so confident to indeed attack the Crimea on the ground to retake it from the occupiers.
Russia can only lose by using tactical nukes, and Ukraine will not be impressed: they already have seen their cities obliterated by conventional means, a small nuke cannot shock them much anymore. Militarily, the relevance of tactical nukes is very limited, if they want to seea military effect, they would need to use not one, but many, and this inevitably will trigger a very robust NATO reaction - when the fallout clouds reach Europe at the latest. Russia will be reached by fallout as well, btw.
Russia cannot win a war with NATO, or the US alone, after the past 7 months we can base on that assumption, I think. Stupid European politicians however could lose a war, however. By cowardice and appeasement and allowing to get intimidated by Putin's threats. Putin understands just one thing: immer auf die Fresse. I preach this since years; Putins only reaction scheme to being confronted has always been one and the same: he escalates. Escalates. Escalates. Escalates. He is a macho and a psychopath, evertyhing else would be a sign of weakness, and he does not allow himself to be perceived as weak. By now he also has no other choice indeed anymore. If he falls back, his own puppets will get rid of him.
He is done, any way. Only question is how many more lives he pulls down along with him and how much more destruction Ukraine will suffer.
les green01
09-24-22, 06:56 PM
why wait until December if he was going do it he would already done it and if UK or the US seen doing preparation for a strike they would react in a heartbeat,dictators are in power because the citizens allows them to be all it take is some balls and determination to stand up
Skybird
09-24-22, 07:04 PM
why wait until December if he was going do it he would already done it and if UK or the US seen doing preparation for a strike they would react in a heartbeat,
He currently fabricates a nuclear casus belli - the referendums. Once they have been counted (as if that would be needed...) he will claim the occupied territories now are Russian soil and any attack on them would be an attack on Russia itself. And then he unchains the nukes.
If they let him.
He currently fabricates a nuclear casus belli - the referendums. Once they have been counted (as if that would be needed...) he will claim the occupied territories now are Russian soil and any attack on them would be an attack on Russia itself. And then he unchains the nukes.
If they let him. Ukraine already attacked Russia (Crimea Belgorod) several times and Putin did not react nuclear it will not happen he is only prolonging this to ensure his power but think that will be in vain
Ukraine already attacked Russia (Crimea Belgorod) several times and Putin did not react nuclear it will not happen he is only prolonging this to ensure his power but think that will be in vain
Would you like to have a nuclear strike already? After the referendum, it is very possible that a blow will be struck at the Yavorsky landfill in Ukraine and there will be an ultimatum further. And for some reason it seems to me that his conditions will suit everyone. It is very possible that on February 24 it was necessary to do so and save people in Ukraine and in Russia.
Give Ukraine a couple of nukes!! (as a deterrent) :yeah:
Jimbuna
09-25-22, 04:50 AM
Give Ukraine a couple of nukes!! (as a deterrent) :yeah:
Would only encourage Putin to go with overwhelming nuclear force.
Jimbuna
09-25-22, 04:52 AM
Hundreds of people have been arrested by authorities as protests against Russia's new "partial mobilisation" continue across the country, an independent rights group has said.
OVD-Info said 724 people were detained across 32 different cities on Saturday.
Widespread demonstrations have broken out since President Vladimir Putin announced plans to draft 300,000 men to fight in Ukraine.
Unsanctioned rallies are banned under Russian law.
But Mr Putin's move to draft civilians into the military has sparked large scale protests in urban areas, with more than 1,000 people being detained at demonstrations earlier this week.
In Moscow, news agency AFP reported witnessing one demonstrator shouting "we are not cannon fodder" as she was arrested by officers.
And in St Petersburg, Russia's second city, one man told reporters: "I don't want to go to war for Putin."
Seventy-year-old Natalya Dubova told AFP that she opposed the war and confessed she was "afraid for young people" being ordered to the front.
Some of those arrested on Saturday reported being given their draft papers after being detained. The Kremlin defended the practice earlier this week, saying "it isn't against the law".
Moscow has also approved harsh new punishments for those accused of dereliction of duty once drafted.
Mr Putin signed fresh decrees on Saturday imposing punishments of up to 10 years imprisonment for any soldier caught surrendering, attempting to desert the military or refusing to fight.
The president also signed orders granting Russian citizenship to any foreign national who signs up to serve a year in the country's military.
The decree, which some observers have suggested displays how severe Moscow's shortage of troops has become, bypasses the usual requirement of five years of residency in the country.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-63021118
Jimbuna
09-25-22, 04:54 AM
Russia's defence ministry has revealed a host of occupations it says will be exempted from conscription aimed at boosting its war effort in Ukraine.
IT workers, bankers and journalists working for state media will escape the "partial mobilisation" announced by President Vladimir Putin on Wednesday.
Around 300,000 citizens face being called up as part of the drive.
The move has prompted a rush towards borders as young men attempt to flee to evade the draft.
Announcing the exemptions on Friday, Russia defence ministry said employers must compile a list of workers who meet the criteria and submit it to its offices.
But it accepted some sectors had to be excluded to "ensure the work of specific high-tech industries, as well as Russia's financial system".
Some commentators have observed that the text of the mobilisation decree has been left vague - potentially allowing it to be widened if necessary.
And one paragraph remains entirely classified. Kremlin Spokesperson Dmitry Peskov said on Friday this referred to the total number of Russians who could be conscripted, which he said could not be disclosed.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-63005406
Jimbuna
09-25-22, 04:55 AM
Dmitry Bulgakov: Putin fires deputy defence chief amid supply failures
Vladimir Putin has fired the general charged with managing the Russian military's faltering logistics operations in Ukraine.
Gen Dmitry Bulgakov, a deputy defence minister, was removed from his role on Saturday, the defence ministry said on Telegram.
The ministry said the 67-year old was "released" to transfer into a new role.
He will be replaced by Col Gen Mikhail Mizintsev, who managed Moscow's brutal siege at the port city of Mariupol.
Gen Bulgakov has run the military's logistics operations since 2008 and was responsible for keeping Russian troops supplied after their deployment to Syria in 2015.
But observers say he has become side-lined in Moscow in recent months, with many blaming him for the chaotic logistics operations that have dogged Russia's advance and seen their troops left undersupplied.
In recent months, the Kremlin has been forced to approach North Korea and Iran - two of its only remaining allies - for new artillery and drone supplies.
Gen Bulgakov's dismissal comes as footage circulated on social media showing newly drafted Russian recruits being equipped with rusty assault rifles.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-63021117
Jimbuna
09-25-22, 04:57 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NB0I9ONvZn4
Jimbuna
09-25-22, 04:59 AM
Total Russian combat losses since beginning of war - about 56.7 thousand people, 259 aircraft, 220 helicopters, 2,275 tanks, 1,368 artillery systems and 4,832 armored vehicles. INFOGRAPHICS
The Russian invaders who have invaded Ukraine continue to suffer casualties. As of the morning of September 25, enemy personnel losses totaled approximately 56,700.
This is stated by Censor.NЕТ with reference to рress center of AFU General Staff.
As noted, total enemy combat losses from 24.02 to 25.09 are approximate:
personnel - about 56700 (+400) eliminated,
tanks - 2275 (+13) units,
armored combat vehicles - 4,832 (+25) units
artillery systems - 1368 (+7) units
multiple rocket launchers - 328 (+1) units
anti-aircraft defence systems - 171 (+1) units
airplanes - 259 (+4) units, helicopters - 220 (+0) units
helicopters, 220 (+0) units,
UAVs of operational-tactical level - 966 (+10),
cruise missiles - 241 (+1),
ships/boats - 15 (+0) units,
motor vehicles and fuel tankers - 3701 (+20) units
special equipment - 130 (+4). Source: https://censor.net/en/n3369418
Commander Wallace
09-25-22, 05:41 AM
^ something to add to Jimbuna's post.
https://s.yimg.com/ny/api/res/1.2/4VuaU39Fk35.kG.e8.0FLw--/YXBwaWQ9aGlnaGxhbmRlcjt3PTk2MDtoPTUzODtjZj13ZWJw/https://s.yimg.com/uu/api/res/1.2/DA2oFukcVIBf7N_RJC2a_A--~B/aD0zODc7dz02OTA7YXBwaWQ9eXRhY2h5b24-/https://media.zenfs.com/en/ukrayinska_pravda_articles_451/bcaba10f87084ad1498c91397c7aab31
Ukrainska Pravda
Fri, September 23, 2022 at 7:17 AM
UKRAINSKA PRAVDA (https://www.pravda.com.ua/authors/561fc96582bad/) — FRIDAY, 23 SEPTEMBER 2022, 20:09, 14:17
Russian occupiers are gradually retreating in the South of Ukraine. Ukraine’s Armed Forces managed to destroy the areas where their equipment and weapons are concentrated.
Source: Natalia Humeniuk, the head of the press centre of Operational Command Pivden (South), on air of national 24/7 newscast, reports Interfax-Ukraine (https://interfax.com.ua/)
Quote from Humeniuk: "The fighting is fierce, it is quite hot here in the south, despite the fact that the weather has become a little cooler. The fire is coming from one side and from the other. But the enemy is still giving way; we are securing territories, little by little. And this stresses the Russian forces out, so the shelling becomes more or less intense, depending on the amount of [Russian] ammunition we hit during the night...
We landed quite significant hits over the past day; these [targets] are control points, command posts, and areas of concentration of equipment and weapons, as well as people, but we do not see the results yet, because they are still being investigated. It is clear that it is more difficult to estimate such results in the occupied territory. But we are very grateful to the local population, [and] very grateful to the resistance movement; they help us in this, and we are sure that by the evening the report [on Russia’s losses] will be quite powerful."
Details: Humeniuk says that illegal "referendums" organised by the occupiers that aim to legitimise merging of Ukraine’s southern oblasts with the Russian Federation, as well as the announcement of the mobilisation of Russian citizens, are an imitation of real activity by the Russian leadership.
Quote from Humeniuk: "They [occupiers - ed.] need mobilisation in order to demonstrate at least some activity, in particular, to the military and political leadership of the aggressor country, because they do not see anyone caring about them; they lack logistic support; they have no feeling they are necessary there (I'm talking about the [hostile] units that are currently deployed on the front lines in the south)... Mobilisation and the referendum are just another [ways of] manipulation, which they resort to so as to simulate their activities, nothing more."
Humeniuk recently said (https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2022/09/19/7368133/) that Russian units in southern Ukraine are trapped between the Ukrainian army and the right bank of the Dnipro River. Some of the Russian occupiers’ commanders are trying to get in touch with representatives of the Ukrainian Armed Forces to lay down their arms and surrender.
https://www.yahoo.com/news/russians-retreating-armed-forces-ukraine-111755066.html
I'm 95 % Sure Putin will not use WMD even if he loses Crimea and the other areas which he has planned on annex(or what you call it)
Because these areas isn't really Russian soil..
It will hurt a lot if or when Putin loses these areas.
For once I hope I'm right.
Markus
The Germans had V1 and V2, which was used to terrorize civilians
The same is seen in Ukraine.
Another uncensored footage of an impact of the Iranian kamikaze drone "Shahed-136" on a building in Odesa, this morning.
https://twitter.com/TpyxaNews/status/1574010390115229697
Markus
Would you like to have a nuclear strike already? After the referendum, it is very possible that a blow will be struck at the Yavorsky landfill in Ukraine and there will be an ultimatum further.
Putin has not changed his strategy, it is a warning towards NATO to stay out of the war. The threat has worked; that was Putin's goal. Putin's problem is: if he deploys nuclear weapons, this deterrent is gone. And then the West can do anything, you cannot ignore his statement about nuclear weapons, we have to take it seriously, but for me his mobilization plan is more important. Putin is desperate, this was not a speech by a leader who is confident. If Putin cannot stabilize the front line and get the troops through the winter, he is in real trouble. Whether he has any options left, that remains to be seen. I am very skeptical about Putin's mobilization plan and/or this can help him.
And for some reason it seems to me that his conditions will suit everyone.Ukraine and the rest will not accept this not the UK, U.S. but also not China and India do not support Russia in case of a nuclear attack. They are concerned about the situation, this is not the way they want things to go, they are not going to continue to support Russia at any cost.
It is very possible that on February 24 it was necessary to do so and save people in Ukraine and in Russia.You really say this you really mean that this invasion will save people in Ukraine you really think an aggressor who only destroys civilian objects (also known for that tactic in Chechnya Georgia and Syria) as revenge for its military failure is the savior of people Ppffff :yawn:
Putin does not need a referendum to annex parts of Ukraine as ... to ... Several attacks in Western Russia, primarily in the Bryansk, Kursk and Belgorod oblasts, have been reported since the start of the 2022 Russian invasion of Ukraine (And therefore, the disarmament of the Belgorod and Voronezh killers' warehouses is an absolutely natural process. Karma is a cruel thing,), the use of this nuclear threat is mostly for keeping the hawks in the Kremlin happy and Putin believes the West will do nothing or backs down their support he is wrong every move by Putin is followed with more support that will not change it is ongoing for more than 8 years even under Trump Ukraine got military support. This is a conflict between the west and the anti-west that will not be gone for decades, get used to it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1FARHRxGCS0
Which category goes this under ?
A strategy I've never heard of before
Russian soldiers have recently sold several armoured vehicles to the Ukrainian army in Vyskopillya area.
The exchange reportedly happened earlier in the week without incidents.
Just crazy...
https://twitter.com/WarMonitor3/status/1573705233536098304
Markus
les green01
09-25-22, 10:41 AM
Which category goes this under ?
A strategy I've never heard of before
https://twitter.com/WarMonitor3/status/1573705233536098304
Markus
we did the same thing in Vietnam so much for a certain weapons
Rockstar
09-25-22, 11:02 AM
Let me see your war face.
The Russian president’s nuclear warnings are “a matter that we have to take deadly seriously,” White House national security adviser Jake Sullivan told CBS on Sunday.
“We have communicated directly, privately at very high levels to the Kremlin that any use of nuclear weapons will be met with catastrophic consequences for Russia, that the United States and our allies will respond decisively, and we have been clear and specific about what that will entail,”
^^ It's new to me.. You learn something each day.
FYI.. Tactical Nukes-There isn't exactly a given strength on a nuke who have been used on the battlefield. That's the only reason to why they are called tactical
Used against civilians or cities well then it ain't a tactical nuke.
Markus
^^ It's new to me.. You learn something each day.
FYI.. Tactical Nukes-There isn't exactly a given strength on a nuke who have been used on the battlefield. That's the only reason to why they are called tactical
Used against civilians or cities well then it ain't a tactical nuke.
MarkusRussia does not make a difference between civilian or military targets there is no exact definition of the "tactical" nuclear weapon, generally smaller in explosive power gravity bombs, short-range missiles, artillery shells, land mines, depth charges, and torpedoes.
Which category goes this under ?
A strategy I've never heard of before
https://twitter.com/WarMonitor3/status/1573705233536098304
Markuscategory corruption was too expected, Russians are born for that.
Russia does not make a difference between civilian or military targets there is no exact definition of the "tactical" nuclear weapon, generally smaller in explosive power gravity bombs, short-range missiles, artillery shells, land mines, depth charges, and torpedoes.
I remembered wrong-Sorry
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tactical_nuclear_weapon
Markus
Russian defenses are collapsing north and west of Lyman, a key city in northern Donetsk, which is one of the gateways to the northern part of the Luhansk region. Russian sources report that some Russian forces are retreating from Lyman to avoid being surrounded. https://twitter.com/StateOfUkraine/status/1573958455630745601
I remembered wrong-Sorry
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tactical_nuclear_weapon
MarkusWith small, they mean Hiroshima type of destruction, but before that Russia will do a test if we see a test we know he is trying to nuke Ukraine, and it can not happen because factions in the Kremlin or China stops him they will certainly after that kinda test.
Skybird
09-25-22, 03:11 PM
https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=2828799&postcount=6572
This is still the best summary and most precise assessment on all one needs to talk about when thinking "nukes" that I have heard about nukes and ukraine war so far. I see nothing to add or substract from that. Thats why I ignore Russian threats on the use of nukes, and would even carry on to dleievr wepaons to Ukraine even if Russia uses smaller nukes.
The onyl worry is not whether Ukraine is psychologically able to handle the impact of a nuke (they will not submit to it), but what the use of nukes would do to the decision making processes in European capitals.
Catfish
09-25-22, 03:41 PM
Just to remind some who this a$$hole Jordan Peterson really is
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BnxxELn00gk
Peterson is basically talking sh!t all the time while selling it as "being honest" lmao
Surely boosts his tv presence.
Just to remind some who this a$$hole Jordan Peterson really is
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BnxxELn00gk
What in particular has enraged you?
Rockstar
09-25-22, 04:11 PM
What part of that video do you disagree with? Is it just the part which made the headline; it was naive to think Russia could lose? Because he did go on to explain quite well IMO what he meant by that. And I can agree with his explanation too so I guess that makes me an a$$hole as well. :up: :haha:
He certainly makes more sense than those German far left socialist groups like AfD backing Putin and Die Linke saying the Bucha massacre was faked.
Catfish
09-25-22, 04:26 PM
Because standing up against Russia is not about economics alone, simple.
It is about being against something being obviously wrong, 'political' if you will, but also including sheer hate against an aggressor.
So you think "we" cannot win an economical war against Russia?
You think we cannot win a military war against Russia?
I tell you what, bury your head and chime in with Putin.
Commander Wallace
09-25-22, 05:14 PM
What in particular has enraged you?
I think what Catfish doesn't like and I certainly agree with Catfish is that Jordan Petersen believes Russia is unbeatable. Jordan believes that Europe has to have Russian oil. Jordan believes that the Ukraine can't possibly win even though the Ukraine have shown incredible resolve.
I tend not to believe " self styled experts " and for good reason. They have been shown to be wrong again and again. Jordan just tends to make a number of assumptions the same as Putin himself has. Assumptions such as these have led to an ugly war. For the record, Jordan Petersen is allegedly a Psychologist. I'm not saying he isn't, by the way. Jordan Petersen is not a military man. My suggestion is if he wants to weigh in on military mattes that he is clueless about and has limited knowledge and understanding of, then Jordan should not only serve some time in uniform but do so while his country is at war. Then he can come back and tell us of his " vast experiences and insight " in war.
My opinion for what it's worth is for the Ukraine to continue to bravely battle as it has been and let the chips fall where they may.
The guy is entitled to his opinion. Agree or disagree, that doesn't make him an ******* no matter how you spell it.
Rockstar
09-25-22, 05:24 PM
If Putin leaves Ukraine in a state of total disrepair & destruction he didn’t win but then he didn’t lose either. That’s what I got out of it.
Skybird
09-25-22, 06:18 PM
Putin already has lost the war. Russia's nimbus of being unbeatable, is destroyed. Second strongest army in the world? Laugh on! The military apparatus is in ruins. The economy is punished and wll be in delcine for years. Look at the Southern areas, former sovjet areas: they all suddenly stand up and fight each other, are not scared of Russian masters anymore. And China does not see Russia as an equal anymore. His own personal fate Putin tied to the war, and this his fate is in question. Russia has lost this war, no matter what happens in Ukraine. The price for whatever they acchieved in Ukraine already is way too high.
The question is whether the ukraine can translate Russia's defeat into an own victory, and that also is in quesitonc considering the enormous destruction, the damaged economy, the financial situation, the wiped out cities. As I see it, Russia AND Ukraine have lost.
Also lost have the Europeans. Their - especially Germany'S and France's - diplomacy and its underlying assumptions are in smoking ruins, its whole diplomatic model has collapsed, and the constraints of existential realpolitik are forcing Europe, with ice-cold grins, to abandon ideological maximalist positions that have always been unworldly but now threaten to threaten its very existence. Not to mention to the massively hurt economy and the acceleration of the impöosion of the Euro system.
Lost also has China. Russia has created a so unsettled world situation that China's own ambitions and global projects have taken huge damage, and this in a time of further self-inflicted damage due to rigid zero covid policies, and demographic problems, and imploding fiscal systems and property bubbles bursting. I doubt Bejing has warm feeling for Putin. He really messed up their own powerplay. That Russia now more depends on china than the other way around, hardly is compensation for that. If Putin now uses nukes, China will really have big problems with that.
There is also a clear winner: the US. All others take economical, military and financial and reputation and influence losses. The US gaines on all these. Plus it can now sell fracked LNG gas to before oh so hesitent Europe, and it can dictate the prices for it. And it is so far away that any fallout from the Ukraine - physically or poltically - will not reach it. And Europe's dependency has clearly been demonstrated. The costs for rebuilding Ukraine will be left to the Europeans. And I do not even disagree with that: the US has delivered several times more military aid than all of Europe together.
Commander Wallace
09-25-22, 06:33 PM
The guy is entitled to his opinion. Agree or disagree, that doesn't make him an ******* no matter how you spell it.
You're correct in that everyone has an opinion. Catfish has expressed his as well. You have an opinion as well, August. They can all be respected. My opinion, for what's it's worth is that Jordan Petersen should refrain from going into military matters unless he has some background or expertise he isn't telling us of.
Russia has threatened Poland, Germany and England and France not to mention the U.S. with Nuclear weapons. Putin certainly can't wage a war with conventional forces against the countries of NATO. NATO would make the War in the Ukraine look like a picnic. It's certainly understandable that those who live in those European countries like Catfish in Germany would be uneasy.
Putin is on a fools errand if he doesn't understand that most of those countries he has threatened with Nuclear Weapons also have a nuclear arsenal that would leave Russia a smoldering, radioactive ash pile.
Most here in Subsim report what they have read without lending anything in the way of forecasting. Most here have also lamented the stupid waste, destruction and loss of life. Something else we can all agree on.
As Rockstar has alluded to and I think we can all agree, is that there will be no winners in this Ukraine war. Then again, there never are any winners in a war. That's what makes it something to be avoided.
If Putin leaves Ukraine in a state of total disrepair & destruction he didn’t win but then he didn’t lose either. That’s what I got out of it.
That was about my take as well.
^ There is a winner in a war...Weapon manufactors
Markus
Commander Wallace
09-25-22, 07:15 PM
^ There is a winner in a war...Weapon manufactors
Markus
Well, that's true, too. :hmmm:
^ There is a winner in a war...Weapon manufactors
Markus
:haha: have to give you a plus for that comment!! :yep:
Russia will declare war after the "referenda" - terrorist Girkin.
“The next step after the “referenda” is an ultimatum. Either Ukraine withdraws troops from the "DPR", "LPR", Kherson and Zaporizhzhia regions. Or Russia officially declares war.”
https://twitter.com/TpyxaNews/status/1574122237547929601
TPYXA is a reliable source.
Markus
I have a question, after watching the lackluster performance of the Russian military, bad logistics, supply chains, and equipment issues, etc. Just how viable is the Russian nuclear arsenal?
^ There is a winner in a war...Weapon manufactors
Markus
Yes the Americans.
Because standing up against Russia is not about economics alone, simple.
It is about being against something being obviously wrong, 'political' if you will, but also including sheer hate against an aggressor.
So you think "we" cannot win an economical war against Russia?
You think we cannot win a military war against Russia?
I tell you what, bury your head and chime in with Putin.
Well Catfish, I love it when you talk about standing up against what is obviously wrong. It would seem Your sheer hate against the Russians has something to do with it. You may call them the Aggressor and that's ok.But it started as a regional conflict right.
Let's look at it this way from the rest of the worlds eye.It started out as much Russians argue with Russians.Ok if it gets where they need moderators then the European Union with their brightest minds who have been educated across the planet, the oldest and brightest who are in the top positions that any human being could achieve in their lifetime.
Could bring their "Collective Minds" together and solve this regional dispute. And what happened Here comes Yankee Doodle Dandy.To get involved again cause Yankee Doodle pays the bills of Nations who cain't take care of their own selves. So you see Catfish it's Yankee Doodle in Washington DC. America that creates and controls everything that happens on this planet. Don't be pissed at the Russians their just trying to resist Yankee Doodle. And if it comes to fire and brimstone.You have none to blame but the ignorance of the best leaders you voted into power.
Catfish
09-26-22, 02:09 AM
The guy is entitled to his opinion. Agree or disagree, that doesn't make him an ******* no matter how you spell it.
This is of course right, point taken.
Thanks Commander Wallace, i was offline right after my post, you essentially made clear what i ran away from :)
I ran over this Mr. Peterson several times, and while he is good and routinely professional in speaking about all what he calls truth and honesty, it is often rhetorical rubbish. I especially clashed with his imho confused ideas about climate science. He also is no military man, but there a lot of non-military persons who have a better grasp on the situation.
re Gorpet, it is not me that has a "hate" against russians, it is about this invasion, with some of the russian soldiers obviously being poor devils. (though my sympathy is held in check, especially when i hear and read of russian voices supporting the aggressor).
I always was for Russia, for trading, making connections, criticizing the US for their policies after 1989 towards Russia if you read my older postings.
It was a bit hard but this invasion and what becomes known of Putin's cleptocracy and his openly imperial and fascist ideas changed my mind.
We have privately brought some stuff to help Ukraine via Poland to Lwiw, though not ammo or weapons, yet.
I also think chancellor bubble-Olaf Scholz has to go, he was a great admirer of Russia and the GDR in his youth, and he obviously has a lot of friendship left for Russia and Putin's régime, though Putin has nothing to do with communist ideas (though he certainly (ab)uses Rusia's "glorious" communist past to justify his war.) Funny how the far right and left suddenly agrees when it comes to imperial ideas.
Skybird
09-26-22, 08:20 AM
The fascists in the Kremlin claim that the West is trying to destroy and rip apart Russia itself. But truth is that this objective is something that they acchieve to 100% all by themselves. FOCUS writes:
------------------------
Putin has called for partial mobilization. But there are many indications that Russia is deploying a mass army. Will that achieve its goals? No, believe military experts. One historian even believes it will spell the end of Russia as we know it.
Russian President Vladimir Putin will send significantly more than just 300,000 men into the Ukraine war. That's the prediction of Torsten Heinrich, a military historian who has studied "partial mobilization" in Russia. "Rather, Russia is deploying a mass army to overrun Ukraine by sheer mass," he writes on Twitter.
Heinrich is puzzled that Putin is not first "sending only what is necessary to stabilize the front" and training the rest well. Instead, he says, there are indications "that Russia simply intends to throw everything it can into uniform to the front. Proper training, even basic training, is being dispensed with."
This coincides with recent reports. The Ukrainian General Staff recently reported that Russia is sending recruits directly to the front without preparation. There are increasing statements from Russia that possibly far more than the 300,000 reservists announced by Defense Minister Shoigu will be drafted. Companies are prophylactically producing an extra 25 million body bags.
But what purpose would a mass mobilization serve? Military expert Brett Friedman analyzes on Twitter that sheer mass has not been winning wars for a long time. "It won't work for the Russians," he writes. "Mass is among the most common war strategies. But putting everyone in uniform provides units, but not capable units."
For a long time, armies have not fought in mass formations, he adds. "It's more about the quality of the troops, the planning, the coordination, the art of warfare," Friedman said. The Russians, once pioneers, have been shown by the Ukrainians what modern warfare means, he said.
Friedman concludes his remarks: "I don't expect 300,000 hastily trained replacements to get the Ukrainians in trouble. It's tragic, but they're walking right into the meat grinder."
"Mobilization is completely disorganized and chaotic"
Defense Minister Shoigu said only reservists with combat experience would be drafted. Experts directly doubted this because there were not enough such men in Russia at all. Now it turns out that there is a cross-section of men being called up, some of them without any previous experience in the army, others old, sick or allegedly exempt students.
Military historian Heinrich analyzes: "Despite months of preparation, the mobilization is practically completely unorganized and chaotic. This indicates a maximum lack of understanding of the situation on the part of the decision-makers." He says it is either a matter of incompetence or a rigid structure in the dictatorship, in which unwelcome news is suppressed because it endangers the progress of the messengers.
Heinrich sees a problem above all for the troops: The morale of the previously deployed troops had already been low. The morale of the units now moving up "will far undercut this. This should lead to massive rates of deserters and surrendering soldiers." Especially as they come with the impression that without mass mobilization, victory can no longer be won against a country like Ukraine.
Heinrich, however, goes a step further and analyzes the impact on Russian society. Many Russian men are currently trying to leave the country. The second brain drain, because already after the invasion of Ukraine some educated Russians went abroad.
Trust in the regime is dwindling. In a country that already has great demographic difficulties, this is a problem. In addition, many young Russians will die, as cannon fodder in Ukraine. Heinrich concludes that the economy will also suffer as potential top performers end up "in coffins or fleeing."
The loss of confidence could also grip minorities in the country who have been loyal to Putin but are now paying the blood toll in this war. "The moment it becomes clear that the majority is purposefully burning the minority for war, without that war being a threat to the minority, secession becomes not only an attractive alternative but a practical necessity," Heinrich writes.
All of this, the moribund economy, collapsing demographics, loss of confidence in the government's legitimacy, plus the broken arms industry and dwindling support among partner countries, all lead to one conclusion, Heinrich says: "This is (at the very least) the end of Russia (as we know it)."
Rockstar
09-26-22, 08:59 AM
Regarding the last video. Seems everyone here isn’t arguing about anything Peterson actually said. I think we are arguing over another fookin’ headline AGAIN.
I wonder if the video was linked directly to the original source “Piers Morgan Uncensored - Jordan Peterson Debates the Psychology of Valdmir Putin”. Would we be talking about that rather than the clickbait headline from SkyNews “Peterson says Putin can’t lose”. weeeee
Skybird
09-26-22, 09:14 AM
FOCUS writes:
-------------------------
Monday. September 26, 06:44: Chancellor Olaf Scholz (SPD) still refuses to supply battle tanks to Ukraine. For this restraint, he is criticized not only in Germany, but also abroad. The criticism is particularly harsh from the largest arms supplier to Ukraine, the USA. The renowned newspaper "New York Times" approached Scholz about it - and he reacted stroppy, the newspaper writes. "Several times he insulted journalists for asking these questions," it continues.
When the author of the text quoted Ukrainian Foreign Minister Kuleba and wanted to know "what is Berlin afraid of that Kiev is not?", Scholz reacted "irritably," it writes. He then said an oft-heard phrase to justify his strategy: "Leadership doesn't mean doing what others ask you to do." And further, "Leadership means making the right decisions and being very strong. And that's what I do."
"Surprisingly emotional," the "robotic" Scholz also reacted to the question of why Germany still will not spend 2 percent of its gross domestic product on military spending in the coming years, as Scholz has announced. When asked this question, Scholz "hissed," "Asking this question is not serious, to be honest."
The text goes on to say that Scholz rejected any suggestion that the U.S. would welcome Germany taking the lead in supplying battle tanks. The journalist further notes that Scholz's reticence was also evident when he refused to comment on a possible end to the war, instead quoting President Biden.
--------------
This sneaky guy is just disgusting with his smug grin. So again my warning: Do not trust the Germans. Not today. Not tomorrow.
:o
General Staff: Russia sends newly mobilized conscripts directly to frontline.
Conscripts do not undergo any military training before being sent to the war against Ukraine, Ukraine's General Staff said.
https://twitter.com/KyivIndependent/status/1574170287406567428
Markus
les green01
09-26-22, 10:31 AM
I have a question, after watching the lackluster performance of the Russian military, bad logistics, supply chains, and equipment issues, etc. Just how viable is the Russian nuclear arsenal?
that a good question most of us here wouldn't know the answer and if they did they probably wouldn't answer only one sure way to find out don't think the world wants to find out of course some of the boneheads in Russia are saying we are going find out,if they do it probably be a tac nuc or a raid on a nuc powerplant in Ukraine or try better than what they have done on the plants if they do the US will answer ,main thing we have found out like Sky been saying German has became like French and can't be trusted
Jimbuna
09-26-22, 10:45 AM
Protests in Russia's Dagestan region against new draft
People in Russia's Dagestan region have clashed with police in the latest protests against Moscow's call-up of 300,000 military reservists.
Over 100 people were arrested during protests in the regional capital Makhachkala, OVD-Info, an independent Russian human rights monitor said.
It said it was concerned by reports of the province's "very tough detentions".
Dagestan is a mainly Muslim region of Russia with a higher death toll than any other province in the war.
Recent analysis by the BBC's Russian service showed that at least 301 soldiers from Dagestan have died, 10 times more than in Moscow. The true figure is likely to be far higher.
More than 2,000 people have been arrested at mass protests since Russian President Vladimir Putin announced the partial mobilisation of military reservists on Wednesday.
While large protests have taken place in major cities across Russia in recent days - with more than 700 people being arrested on Saturday alone - the images of Dagestani demonstrators fighting with police marked a rare outbreak of violence against authorities.
Dozens of videos posted to social media showed protesters confronting police and other security officials in Makhachkala, with OVD-Info reporting that officers resorted to using stun guns and truncheons on the crowds.
In one video, a man detained by officials headbutts a police officer, before being beaten by other personnel.
Another video showed a security officer fleeing from a large group of demonstrators, some of whom attempted to grab and trip him as he ran.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-63028586
Jimbuna
09-26-22, 10:51 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xMd-O2l0o4k
Skybird
09-26-22, 10:51 AM
that a good question most of us here wouldn't know the answer and if they did they probably wouldn't answer only one sure way to find out don't think the world wants to find out of course some of the boneheads in Russia are saying we are going find out,if they do it probably be a tac nuc or a raid on a nuc powerplant in Ukraine or try better than what they have done on the plants if they do the US will answer ,main thing we have found out like Sky been saying German has became like French and can't be trusted
With their arsenal of around 6000+ warheads its enough if they can bring just every 10th weapon to launch and detonation. Thats also true if only looking at tactical nukes, of which Russia has around 2000.
The US has slightly less nuclear weapons in total, but a higher ammount of them are launch-ready at any time, and they have the - small - lead in the strategic sector, whereas Russia has more tactical nukes than the US.
Jimbuna
09-26-22, 10:54 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gk4J8LMQnD8
Jimbuna
09-26-22, 10:56 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ZywLkKOg58
Jimbuna
09-26-22, 11:05 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nw8XKe6O8Pk
Jimbuna
09-26-22, 11:07 AM
Putin told Erdogan that he is ready for negotiations with Ukraine, but "on new conditions", - Turkish Foreign Minister Cavusoglu
Russian dictator Putin told Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan that he was ready for negotiations with Ukraine.
This was stated by the head of the Turkish Foreign Ministry, Mevlüt Çavuşoğlu, Censor.NET informs with reference to Anadolu.
According to him, the meeting between Putin and Zelensky could lead to a ceasefire.
Çavuşoğlu added that at a meeting with Erdogan in Samarkand, the Russian dictator said he was ready to return to negotiations.
"However, the longer the war lasts, the more complicated it becomes, the more difficult it is to end it. Of course, they also say that there are new conditions," the minister said. Source: https://censor.net/en/n3369725
Jimbuna
09-26-22, 11:11 AM
Ten EU countries insist on limiting price of Russian gas, - Reuters
Ten countries of the European Union insist on the development of plans to establish a price ceiling for Russian gas.
This is reported by Reuters with reference to the draft document, Censor.NET reports with reference to LigaBusinessInform.
The countries plan to ask the European Commission to make proposals on the maximum price for gas for discussion at the meeting of EU energy ministers on Friday, the publication notes.
"We recognize the efforts made by the Commission and the measures it has proposed to overcome the crisis. But we still have to solve the most serious problem: the wholesale price of natural gas," Reuters quotes the contents of the letter from EU ministers to the European Commission.
According to the publication, Belgium, Italy, Poland, Malta and Greece will make such a proposal.
EU countries justify the idea of capping Russian gas prices on the grounds that it will help overcome "unwarranted inflationary pressures" and can be designed in such a way as to ensure supply reliability.
Reuters adds that Germany, the Netherlands and Denmark oppose capping Russian gas prices because it would jeopardize the security of gas supplies to Europe.
The European Commission was expected to issue an update this week on new sanctions in response to the Russian mobilization and mock referendum, but EU officials said on Monday that it was now expected in early October.
SOURCE: HTTPS://CENSOR.NET/EN/N3369739
Jimbuna
09-26-22, 11:22 AM
Great Britain introduced sanctions against Russian Federation due to pseudo-referendums
Great Britain introduced new sanctions against Russia due to the holding of pseudo-referendums in the temporarily occupied Ukrainian territories.
This is reported on the website of the government of Great Britain, Censor.NET informs.
"This process repeats their (Russian. - Ed.) approach in Crimea in 2014, which combines disinformation, intimidation and false results. These referendums do not reflect the will of the Ukrainian people and are a serious violation of the territorial integrity and political independence of Ukraine," the minister emphasized of Foreign Affairs James Cleverley.
The list includes 92 individuals and legal entities. Among them are 33 Russian officials whom the Kremlin sent to the captured territories, as well as local traitors. The sanctions package also includes 55 managers of Russian state companies, in particular, members of the board of Gazprombank, Sberbank and Sovkombank.
In particular, the list includes:
- Serhiy Yeliseev: head of the "government" in Kherson, vice-admiral of the Russian fleet. Since his escape from the Ukrainian Navy in 2014, Yeliseev has continued to undermine Ukraine's independence
- Ivan Kusov: "Minister of Education and Science" of the so-called "Luhansk People's Republic".
- Yevhen Balytskyi: appointed by Russia as the head of the so-called "Government" in Zaporizhzhia.
- Yevhenii Solntsev, deputy head of the so-called "DPR".
IMA Consulting, which is called "Putin's favorite PR agency", was also sanctioned. The IMA has reportedly been tasked with leading public campaigns for these bogus referendums and to spread their false legitimacy in Russia. Also on the "black" list was "Gosznak", a company for the production of security documents, known for its monopoly on the production of "tens of millions" of state documents, including expedited passports in the territories temporarily occupied by Russia. Source: https://censor.net/en/n3369735
Jimbuna
09-26-22, 11:43 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FtKALqnzTCA
Jimbuna
09-26-22, 12:28 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3lFIqDihBJE
^ There is a winner in a war...Weapon manufactors
MarkusAnd all the states that made billions with tax on energy do not think they did not profit, same goes for the energy industry!
Commander Wallace
09-26-22, 03:00 PM
I wasn't sure if anyone caught this or read this report this morning. This may tie in to the Ukrainian / Russian war.
Russia has reported that 22 children have been hurt and 11 children have been killed in a school shooting, 15 fatalities thus far. Apparently, a gunman wearing Nazi symbols opened fire at a school in the western Russian city of Izhevsk, Russian authorities said Monday.
Quote: Russian officials named the shooter as Artem Kazantsev, a local resident born in 1988 who was an alumnus of the school where the shooting took place. The identification process was delayed because no documents were found on the body of the suspect, TASS reported. Investigators have started searching Kazantsev’s residence and probing reports of his “neo-fascist views and Nazi ideology,” Russia’s Investigative Committee said. Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov said the attacker was “a person who, apparently, belongs to a neo-fascist organization or group.”
https://www.cnn.com/2022/09/26/europe/izhevsk-school-shooting-russia-intl/index.html
I don't believe in coincidences. If this school shooting is true, I would bet that it was staged by Putin to rally his countrymen in the war against what he describes as " Nazis in the Ukraine." Now there has been a shooting by someone wearing swastika's . I think this is another chapter from Putin's sad " playbook."
Earlier in the Ukrainian war, Putin was in the act of staging other incidents that were to be committed by Ukrainian's. Various Western intelligence agencies discovered the plots before they came to fruition. Putin knows his citizenry doesn't believe in his war and certainly doesn't want to fight in it.
https://news.yahoo.com/nine-dead-including-five-children-093357387.html
I wasn't sure if anyone caught this or read this report this morning. This may tie in to the Ukrainian / Russian war.
Russia has reported that 22 children have been hurt and 11 children have been killed in a school shooting, 15 fatalities thus far. Apparently, a gunman wearing Nazi symbols opened fire at a school in the western Russian city of Izhevsk, Russian authorities said Monday.
Quote: Russian officials named the shooter as Artem Kazantsev, a local resident born in 1988 who was an alumnus of the school where the shooting took place. The identification process was delayed because no documents were found on the body of the suspect, TASS reported. Investigators have started searching Kazantsev’s residence and probing reports of his “neo-fascist views and Nazi ideology,” Russia’s Investigative Committee said. Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov said the attacker was “a person who, apparently, belongs to a neo-fascist organization or group.”
https://www.cnn.com/2022/09/26/europe/izhevsk-school-shooting-russia-intl/index.html
I don't believe in coincidences. If this school shooting is true, I would bet that it was staged by Putin to rally his countrymen in the war against what he describes as " Nazis in the Ukraine." Now there has been a shooting by someone wearing swastika's . I think this is another chapter from Putin's sad " playbook."
Earlier in the Ukrainian war, Putin was in the act of staging other incidents that were to be committed by Ukrainian's. Various Western intelligence agencies discovered the plots before they came to fruition. Putin knows his citizenry doesn't believe in his war and certainly doesn't want to fight in it.
https://news.yahoo.com/nine-dead-including-five-children-093357387.htmlIn a registration and recruitment office in Siberia, a man shot a recruitment officer. The shooter was subsequently detained, writes the governor of the Irkutsk region. The shooting took place in the city of Ust-Ilimsk in eastern Siberia. According to several reports on Telegram, the man walked into the office and said "no one will fight," before opening fire.
With the satellite countries turning against Russia, Iran on the brink of secular revolution, china and India backing down support, Putin gets more and more on the road to his exit.
Catfish
09-26-22, 03:17 PM
^ this looks like an FSB stunt, but also could be just a crazy nazi. There are lot of those in Russia, sure more than in Ukraine :03:
Meanwhile..
"Mobilized man killed a drafting office commander in Ust-Ilimsk, Irkutsk region, Russia.
Alexandr Yeliseev, the commander, was shot four times almost point blank.
The murderer is Ruslan Zinin, born in 1997, "partially mobilized". He decided jail is better than death in Ukraine."
Warning graphic content (https://twitter.com/Gerashchenko_en/status/1574282010499190784?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5 Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1574282010499190784%7Ctwgr% 5E2ced3535952c01f70830635195cf7a6b04925c02%7Ctwcon %5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fs9e.github.io%2Fiframe%2Ftwi tter.min.html1574282010499190784)
Looks like Russia found its own lend-lease... ohh bugger from WWII
https://i.postimg.cc/T3wGLRzT/lendlease.jpg
Commander Wallace
09-26-22, 03:30 PM
In a registration and recruitment office in Siberia, a man shot a recruitment officer. The shooter was subsequently detained, writes the governor of the Irkutsk region. The shooting took place in the city of Ust-Ilimsk in eastern Siberia. According to several reports on Telegram, the man walked into the office and said "no one will fight," before opening fire.
With the satellite countries turning against Russia, Iran on the brink of secular revolution, china and India backing down support, Putin gets more and more on the road to his exit.
I read that as well. Hard to keep up with developments in Russia.
I read that as well. Hard to keep up with developments in Russia.Dagestan is on fire. One of the cornerstones of Putin’s ‘Russki Mir’. Who’s going to be next? I would pay a special attention to Tatarstan, Buryatiya, Kalmykiya, Altay, Tuva. The prediction of the Russia’s collapse is slowly coming true.
Platapus
09-26-22, 04:00 PM
Maybe Putin can draft Snowdon, now that he is a Russian Citizen.
Maybe Putin can draft Snowdon, now that he is a Russian Citizen.
It is Putin middle finger to the US Snowden was stupid that he went to Russia, big mistake. His lawyer said it doesn't because Snowden never served in the Russian army.
Commander Wallace
09-26-22, 04:54 PM
It is Putin middle finger to the US Snowden was stupid that he went to Russia, big mistake. His lawyer said it doesn't because Snowden never served in the Russian army.
You forgot Putin's buddy who lives there too. None other than Steven Segal. Steven is rough and tough and practiced in the art of Bu****o. :yep::D There are none better than Steven in this art. I wonder if he will go on the front lines against the Ukraine. I'm betting he won't.
Maybe as a tank? :doh:
The years haven't been kind. :yep:
les green01
09-26-22, 05:57 PM
It is Putin middle finger to the US Snowden was stupid that he went to Russia, big mistake. His lawyer said it doesn't because Snowden never served in the Russian army.
from reports they hadn't been following that but it be funny if snowden gets call in goes and ukraine captures him he probably end up back in US quick has a present
from reports they hadn't been following that but it be funny if snowden gets call in goes and ukraine captures him he probably end up back in US quick has a present
I posted a link in which it was said that these young Russian men is sent directly to the front-No training whatsoever.
Markus
Danish BT writes:
Uprising against Putin smoulders in Dagestan: 'Could help shift attitudes across Russia'
The burning photo of Vladimir Putin falls to the ground. Angry women attack police directly.
Shouts of 'we are not blind' and 'it was Russia that attacked Ukraine' are heard. Or "our children should not end up as fertilizer".
The above scenes are just a few of the countless videos that have spread on social media over the weekend from the Russian republic of Dagestan. From the capital Makhachkala to the small village of Endirei.
There have been even highly visible protests against President Vladimir Putin's partial mobilisation of 300,000 extra troops for Ukraine.
"There are signs that people are realising they have been taken for a ride. That it has been led astray with vertical lies," as Russia expert Mette Skak, a lecturer at Aarhus University, puts it:
"This may well be the straw that breaks the camel's back and simply leaves Putin with an escalating domestic political crisis. That, one can already sense, may come out of this."
That protests have flourished in Dagestan in particular is interesting. It is a small, poor and unattractive region with fewer inhabitants than Denmark - but according to statistics, it is still the republic that has lost the most soldiers in Ukraine so far.
More than ten times as many as Moscow, for example. Similar trends are emerging in other remote republics with large ethnic minorities.
Street protests against Putin's #mobilization are growing in the southern #Dagestan region of #Russia. In #Makhachkala city, a hundred protesters had been arrested by riot police so far. pic.twitter.com/I8hzBW5N0f
- Viktor Kovalenko
And the picture has been the same in the recent mobilization, where men in the republics in question have also apparently been drafted at random and not at all according to the declared criteria.
Old and young have been drafted, as have invalids, university students, people with no military experience and even men who have been dead for years.
"People have become angry and now the point has been reached where people are saying no. Enough is enough," says Mette Skak, who also calls the mobilisation "a domestic political self goal":
"And even if it's 'just' in Dagestan, it matters in the bigger picture, because we also know that the Russian population at large - including those in well-protected big cities like Moscow and St Petersburg - are very nervous about how the partial mobilisation is being so carelessly administered in practice. It may well help to create a mood shift throughout Russia and develop seriously for Putin."
Governors and mayors from Dagestan, but also from the equally impoverished republic of Buryatia, have been out this weekend to lament the haphazard mobilisation. Without, however, addressing the amount of soldiers drafted in from the territories.
According to the independent organisation OVD-Info, more than 2,350 protesters have been arrested in Russia since Vladimir Putin's announcement of the partial mobilisation on Wednesday.
Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator (free version)
Markus
Skybird
09-26-22, 06:10 PM
Norstream 1 and 2 apparently sabotaged. Damage seems to be significant and serious. Der Tagesspiegel comments:
----------------------------
The Nord Stream pipelines may have been damaged by targeted attacks and therefore leaked.
After there was already a drastic loss of pressure in one of the two strings of Nord Stream 2 on Monday night and a leak was detected in Danish territorial waters, a spokesman for the twin Nord Stream 1 pipeline said that a "sharp drop in pressure" was also recorded in both pipelines on Monday evening. The situation is now being investigated, he added.
Root cause investigations have been initiated in both cases, and federal security authorities have taken up the cases. "Forensic results" are not expected within a short time, he said, because the seabed must be reached.
However, the worst is expected due to the timing, the three pipelines affected and the severe pressure losses in Nord Stream 1, which also suggest a major leak. "Our imagination no longer yields a scenario that is not a targeted attack," said a person privy to the assessment by the federal government and federal agencies. It continued, "Everything speaks against a coincidence."
Such a suspected attack on the seabed is anything but trivial, it must be carried out with special forces, for example, naval divers, or a submarine, it was further said from the circles informed about the initial situation assessment.
Regarding the authorship of the alleged attacks, two main possibilities are being discussed. First, according to the initial speculations, Ukrainian forces or forces associated with Ukraine could be responsible. With the temporary shutdown of the Nord Stream pipelines, gas deliveries from Russia to Germany and Central Europe would only be possible via the Yamal connection, which runs through Poland, or the Ukrainian pipeline network.
Second, exactly the same scenario, but as a so-called "false flag" operation by Russia, was a possible explanation for the pipeline leaks. This could fuel additional uncertainty and possibly push the price of gas back up to exacerbate the European energy price crisis, which had recently eased minimally.
Russian gas monopolist Gazprom had stopped deliveries through Nord Stream 1 at the end of August, catapulting gas prices in Europe upwards. Allegedly, urgent maintenance work is not possible due to sanctions against Russia.
Both Western equipment suppliers and the German government deny this account. Berlin security circles said it could not be ruled out that a suspected attack had already been planned before the delivery stop, because the lead times for such special operations could be long.
A spokeswoman for the Federal Ministry of Economics said on Monday evening: "We are in the process of exchanging information with the authorities concerned and the Federal Network Agency to clarify the facts here as well. Currently, we do not know the causes of the pressure drop," she said.
The Federal Network Agency does not see any impact on supply security after the pressure drop in the Nord Stream 1 pipeline. "We are in the process of clarifying the facts here as well, in exchange with the Federal Ministry of Economics and the authorities concerned. Currently, we do not know the causes of the pressure drop," a spokesman for the authority said. "We do not see any impact on supply security," he added.
Did he foresee the future ? This author Lars Wilderäng
He wrote a thriller called Midwinter Darkness
The main story is Russia attack Sweden and occupy Gotland-They do so because they accuse the Swedish government to hide Terrorist who should be behind the sabotage of Nordstream.
I have this book as audiobook oh man it is a nail biting war thriller.
Back to serious discussion
Markus
Catfish
09-27-22, 01:35 AM
^ @Markus Don't give them ideas, sounds like a perfect false flag operation! :o
^^@Skybird if there is a leak there should be visible bubbles, and along with hydrocarbon sniffers the position should be found if weather allows :hmmm:
Skybird
09-27-22, 02:30 AM
^ @Markus Don't give them ideas, sounds like a perfect false flag operation! :o
^^@Skybird if there is a leak there should be visible bubbles, and along with hydrocarbon sniffers the position should be found if weather allows :hmmm:
The DDanes seem to know where the leaks (plural! ) are, ghey have established exclusion zones for navel and aerial traffic.
Could have been many interesting sides. Russia. Poland. Ukraine. US. Could be targetted against the complete West. Could be targetted specifically against Germany and its foolish nonsense diplomacy, to prdvent its continuation after the war for sure.
Jimbuna
09-27-22, 04:33 AM
Ukraine-Russia war latest: US and Nato will not intervene in event of nuclear strike, claims Dmitry Medvedev
Former Russian president Dmitry Medvedev has raised the possibility of a nuclear strike on Ukraine, saying that the U.S.-led military alliance NATO would still stay out of the conflict for fear of a nuclear apocalypse.
Dmitry Medvedev, a former president who now serves as deputy chairman of Russia's Security Council, said Russia had the right to defend itself with nuclear weapons if it is pushed beyond its limits and that this is "certainly not a bluff".
"Let's imagine that Russia is forced to use the most fearsome weapon against the Ukrainian regime which had committed a large-scale act of aggression that is dangerous for the very existence of our state," Medvedev said in a post on Telegram.
"I believe that NATO would not directly interfere in the conflict even in this scenario," Medvedev said. "The demagogues across the ocean and in Europe are not going to die in a nuclear apocalypse."
Medvedev's comments come as Russia prepares to annex large swathes of Ukrainian territory after referendums in Russian-controlled regions in Ukraine. Ukraine and the West have denounced the votes as an illegal sham.
Jimbuna
09-27-22, 05:18 AM
Vladimir Putin is likely to announce the annexation of occupied regions of Ukraine into Russia within days, the UK's defence ministry says.
The Russian president could make the announcement when he addresses the country's parliament on Friday, according to the ministry.
It comes as Russia stages a final day of voting in discredited referendums in occupied regions of Ukraine.
Ukraine and the West say the result has already been decided by the Kremlin and will be used as an excuse for an illegal land grab.
Meanwhile, two leaks have been found on the Nord Stream 1 pipeline in Swedish and Danish waters, Sweden's maritime authority says.
And the Kremlin has admitted mistakes were made in its drive to mobilise Russian army reservists, amid growing public opposition.
Jimbuna
09-27-22, 05:27 AM
Gas leaks at Nord Streams occurred due to sabotage, - German mass media
In Germany, it is suspected that the gas leaks on the branches of the Russian Nord Stream gas pipelines through the Baltic Sea are the result of deliberate actions.
Tagesspiegel writes about this with reference to a source in the competent authorities who has access to information about the investigation, Censor.NET reports with reference to European Pravda.
"We cannot imagine a version that does not include a targeted attack. Everything indicates that this is not an accident," said the interlocutor.
As reported, on the night of September 26, the dispatcher of the Nord Stream-2 shore site recorded a sharp drop in pressure in the pipeline. In addition, a gas leak was recorded from both threads of the first "Nord Stream" - in the exclusive economic zone of Denmark to the northeast of the Bornholm island.
The Danish Energy Agency has asked Energinet, which is responsible for the overall operation of the Danish electricity and gas system, to increase the level of preparedness of Denmark's electricity and gas sectors following gas leaks. Five-mile exclusion zones for shipping have been established around the leakage zones.
As none of the pipelines were in operation, none of the incidents are currently relevant to the supply of gas to Europe
Nord Stream AG, the operating company of the Nord Stream, called the simultaneous incidents on three branches of the gas pipeline "unprecedented" and said that it could not estimate the timing of infrastructure restoration. Source: https://censor.net/en/n3369876
Jimbuna
09-27-22, 05:31 AM
Russian Federation plans to create "Crimean District", which will be headed by Rogozin - Russian media
In the Russian Federation, after the "referendums", the "Crimean Federal District" can be created in the occupied territories. They want to include the occupied peninsula itself, as well as the captured territories of Luhansk, Donetsk, Zaporizhzhia, and Kherson regions.
An interlocutor in the Federation Council and a source close to the "Government of Crimea" informed "Vedomosti" about this, Censor.NET reports.
So, according to the publication, after the completion of the "referendums" in the occupied territories of Ukraine, Russia wants to create a new federal district - Crimea.
Dmytro Rogozin, ex-director of Roscosmos, may head the new "delegation office", an interlocutor at one of the defense industry enterprises and two sources close to the Putin administration told "Vedomosti".
Another interlocutor notes that the decision regarding Rogozin will be made in the near future and it will most likely be positive.
He explained the need to create a new federal district with the "difficult situation" that has developed around the "referendums", and they should be managed by a "political heavyweight".
Another source close to Putin's administration explains the possible appointment of Rogozin as "deputy leader" as follows: "There is a large front of work, so it is quite possible."
Rogozin left the position of head of Roscosmos on July 15. Then Putin's spokesman Dmytro Peskov said that later "he will have a new job." Now, neither Peskov nor Rogozin have answered questions about Rogozin's appointment. Source: https://censor.net/en/n3369858
Russia will send a ship to the area where these leaks has occurred-there they will conduct an "investigation" In this "investigation" they will indicate a country.
I can't say which country they will point finger at.
YES-This is a false flag operation.
Markus
I still say give some nukes to Ukraine. :Kaleun_Thumbs_Up:
Jimbuna
09-27-22, 07:16 AM
Less than 6% of the territory of Kharkiv region remains temporarily occupied, - RMA
Less than 6% of the territories of the Kharkiv region remain occupied by the Russian invaders.
As reported by Censor.NET, the head of the RMA, Oleh Synehubov, stated this on the air of the telethon.
"Another 6% of our region remains temporarily occupied. Currently, it is a little less," the head of the RMA said.
Synehubov reminded that the Russians continue to shell the Kharkiv region, in particular Kupiansk. Over the past day, 9 people died, and 5 people were injured. Source: https://censor.net/en/n3369906
Jimbuna
09-27-22, 07:23 AM
Lukashenko - to Putin about nuclear weapons: "Volodya, tell me, how long are you going to live?"
Belarusian dictator Oleksandr Lukashenko, during a joint lunch with Russian dictator Vladimir Putin, jokingly asked him how long he was going to live.
Telegram channel Generall SVR writes about this, Censor.NET reports.
The meeting between Putin and Lukashenka took place in Sochi. The two dictators discussed the recognition of the referendums of the Russian Federation in the occupied territories of Ukraine - Donetsk, Luhansk, Zaporizhzhia and Kherson regions, as well as mobilization.
According to the channel, Lukashenko listened for a long time, objected little, but as a result promised to "consider everything at home."
Generall SVR claims that, according to sources, "Lukashenko has been negotiating through intermediaries with the leadership of the USA, the European Union and several European countries separately for several weeks. Moreover, serious progress has been made in these negotiations and to fight with the whole world for the sake of friendship with Putin, Lukashenko clearly has no intention."
The Belarusian dictator was also not afraid to troll his Russian colleague.
"During dinner, Lukashenko, in the presence of several people, asked the Russian president an unexpected question: "Volodya, tell me, how long are you going to live?" Stunned Putin asked what this question was about, Lukashenko replied that rattling nuclear weapons is fine, when it is a bluff , and if it's not a bluff, then it's suicide. To this, Putin said that it's too early to talk about it, and changed the subject," the channel writes. Source: https://censor.net/en/n3369890
Jimbuna
09-27-22, 07:49 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kbfi3PuXfT0
Skybird
09-27-22, 08:09 AM
Ukrainian forces seem to have achieved the next major breakthrough, having overrun Russian positions on the eastern side of the river Oskil where the oblasts Kiev, Luhansk and Donezk meet. This could mark the beginning of a collapse of the complete Russian frontline in that region, even pro-Russian observers say. A major supply line, the only one the Russians have there, is less than 5 km away from the frontline, and that was two days ago with the Ukrainians advancing. In other words, the Ukrainians have it under fire with all they want: light and heavy artillery, even mortars.
Commander Wallace
09-27-22, 08:13 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kbfi3PuXfT0
^ The term Fubar springs to mind. :hmmm:
Jimbuna
09-27-22, 08:17 AM
Ukrainian forces seem to have achieved the next major breakthrough, having overrun Russian positions on the eastern side of the river Oskil where the oblasts Kiev, Luhansk and Donezk meet. This could mark the beginning of a collapse of the complete Russian frontline in that region, even pro-Russian observers say. A major supply line, the only one the Russians have there, is less than 5 km away from the frontline, and that was two days ago with the Ukrainians advancing. In other words, the Ukrainians have it under fire with all they want: light and heavy artillery, even mortars.
Putin can't be far from going tactically nuclear now.
Jimbuna
09-27-22, 08:17 AM
^ The term Fubar springs to mind. :hmmm:
Yep, I agree :yep:
Putin can't be far from going tactically nuclear now.
There will be an ultimatum first where Putin are going to demand Ukrainian forces withdrawn from these four areas(Kherson, Luhansk etc)
Markus
Jimbuna
09-27-22, 08:45 AM
Yes. that's what I meant :yep:
Skybird
09-27-22, 09:36 AM
Der Tagesspiegel:
Measuring stations in Sweden and Denmark have recorded powerful detonations underwater before the Nord Stream gas leak in the Baltic Sea occurred, according to a media report. There is no doubt that these were blasts or explosions, seismologist Björn Lund of the Swedish Seismological Network (SNSN) told Swedish broadcaster SVT on Tuesday.
There were two distinct detonations in the area on Monday, the broadcaster reported, citing the network - one at 2:03 a.m. that night and a second at 7:04 p.m. that evening.
So far, however, the cause of the incidents has not been conclusively determined. However, there are indications of sabotage. If it was an attack, only a state actor could be considered in view of the technical effort involved, according to security sources.
https://cdn.prod.www.spiegel.de/images/0c66a1cb-f893-4788-bd1c-0d975df2a105_w948_r2.194_fpx50_fpy60.jpg
-------------
New on the mind: trans-atlantic cables, continental communication, pipelines... Well, not really new on the mind, more a reminder of how vulnerabel such infrastructure is. Russia has developed submarines designed to go after such cables and pipelines in the ocean bed, I read somewhere years ago.
It is also reported that the pipelines are both ruptured over a longer distance, not just punctually damaged.
One thing is certain, I think: there is no way going back.
HunterICX
09-27-22, 10:20 AM
Putin can't be far from going tactically nuclear now.
From starting World War 3 you mean, the world can't stand idle if nukes of any kind are used against people.
Jimbuna
09-27-22, 10:27 AM
From starting World War 3 you mean, the world can't stand idle if nukes of any kind are used against people.
Precisely so but the million dollar question is, will anyone react in a similar fashion....Medvedev for one certainly reckons not.
The only ones who can stop him are his senior generals and that would mean the end of his regime.
Putin can't be far from going tactically nuclear now.
You really think so? I'd think that tactical nukes would hurt his forces as much as it would hurt the Ukrainians and they would have to be employed in the very areas that he is trying to capture.
From what I see of the prevailing winds unless they were deployed well westward of the front line (like around Kiev itself), it would send the fallout right back into Russia.
Jimbuna
09-27-22, 10:32 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lt9ANAX8uBk
Jimbuna
09-27-22, 10:59 AM
Russia to open war enlisting hub on Georgia border
Russia is to open an army enlisting centre on the border with Georgia, where massive queues have formed as Russian men try to flee the country to avoid being sent to fight in Ukraine.
Officers at the Verkhniy Lars crossing will be tasked with serving summons to "citizens of the mobilisation age", the authorities say.
Recent satellite images have shown queues going for miles from Russia.
All those crossing into Georgia look exhausted, a BBC correspondent says.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-63050880
Rockstar
09-27-22, 11:37 AM
Maybe an ‘accident’ happened just to make sure those Putin lovin’ Germans and Italians have absolutely no choice but to remain united with NATO instead of Russia. Russians out and Germans down because together people will lose their freedom and die when those two get together.
Biden, German chancellor present united front amid tensions with Russia over Ukraine
Biden said if Russia invaded Ukraine that the Nord Stream 2 pipeline "will end."
February 7th 2022
https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/biden-meet-german-chancellor-urge-united-front-amid/story?id=82712888
While the Biden administration has warned for weeks that Russia will face "severe" consequences if it invades Ukraine, Germany had often opted for a softer response, refusing to send military equipment to Ukraine or deploy more troops to the eastern flank. Germany had also shown reluctance to shut down Nord Stream 2, a Russian natural gas pipeline, not yet operational, that would carry gas directly to Germany, bypassing Ukraine.
Meanwhile, Biden has been rallying European allies to respond to Russia's threats in lockstep with his more aggressive plan. But meeting with Scholz Monday, the two world leaders expressed unity with their posture towards Russia.
After both leaders appeared to avoid mentioning the pipeline, under repeated questions from reporters an afternoon press conference, Biden, standing next to the German chancellor said Nord Stream 2 would not move forward if Russia invades Ukraine, in a warning to Russian President Vladimir Putin of potential economic consequences.
"If Russia invades, that means tanks or troops crossing the -- the border of Ukraine again, then there will be -- there will be no longer a Nord Stream 2," Biden said during the press conference with Scholz, who did not go as far as Biden, but insisted the U.S. and Germany remain "absolutely united.
Pressed on how he can commit to that given that Nord Stream 2 is under German control, Biden doubled down, saying, "We will -- I promise you -- we will be able to do it."
KA-BOOM
Jimbuna
09-27-22, 12:03 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wBQTMviZRXM
Maybe an ‘accident’ happened just to make sure those Putin lovin’ Germans and Italians have absolutely no choice but to remain united with NATO instead of Russia. Russians out and Germans down because together people will lose their freedom and die when those two get together.
Biden, German chancellor present united front amid tensions with Russia over Ukraine
Biden said if Russia invaded Ukraine that the Nord Stream 2 pipeline "will end."
February 7th 2022
https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/biden-meet-german-chancellor-urge-united-front-amid/story?id=82712888
KA-BOOMMy thought exactly
Skybird
09-27-22, 01:15 PM
Der Spiegel reports that the CIA had information on a planned attack on the pipelines and that Berlin was informed on this intel data.
As I said earlier, I think theoretically several suspects must be looked at. Though the propabailty for each of them is dratsically varying.
The most likely attacker of course is Russia. It has thew reigonalö access, the militry means, and it would be a continuation of an old pattern: to artificlaly create fabricate soutations in the world to which iknnocent Russia thna just happens needing to react to. in this case Russia will claim that it cannot deliver any gas because of the broken pipelines. It has cheated like this before, when claiming the Siemens turbines where not ready, had no valid papers, could not be accepted back, and so forth. I have no ideya why these world famous lioars are to obsessed by constructing such chetaign stories as alib is for their misddeds (like now the referendums as well). But I must realise that this is what they are always doing, and that this pattern is well-established. - The likelihood for Russia being behind this, is very high, and most likely they are behind the attacks indeed.
The Ukraine obviously also has an interest in preventing once and for all time to come that gas will flow through this pipeline, and it wants no money flowing from Germany to Russia. They probably have the means - I imagine military combat divers: the Ukrainian equivalent to American SEALs - , but no easy access to the Baltic, would have needed to run a deep and extensive secret operation. There are reasons speaking against it, however: they risk to seriously alienate their Western partners over their stunt if it gets unmasked. - I see the propbability for the ukriane being behind the attack as possible, but very low.
Poland was always against the pipeline, and not only due to not making deals with Russia, but due to their interest to booster their own ambition to become a supply centre for LNG gas that they planned to land in Denmark and then deliver to Poland from there it would be distributed into the Europan pipeline grid. Would have given them a controling seat to blackmail the EU, if need be, and would have given them transit fees. They also obviously have the geographical access, and certainly they have combat divers. But I think all this is no longer valid, and I also assume they would not have gone this far to realise their - outdated - plan. So: theoretically it could be Poland behind this, but the probability is very low.
Germany: it has precise knoweldge on the pipeline locations, it has capable combat divers, submarines, and saccess to the Baltic. Doe sGermany have a motive? Well, indirectly, yes. The calculation could be to solve inherent problems inj the colatiin which is/was locked down over diefrences on nulcear power, energy policies, and how to support Ukraine, and how to dela wioth Russia after the war, and this while some maybe always were eyind to just return to gas dleoiveries via the pipelines after the war. Theoretically it is possible to imagine that some power actors in this complex innerpolitical mess wanted to create a clear situation that leaves some more room for any uncertainties regarding futrure options. However, it is unlikely that an internal plot bypassed Bubble Olaf, and Bubble Olaf himself is too indifferent and cowardly to to decide a coup like this for which he could be called out if it gets revealed, also he would have preferred to, as he calls it, keep his options open instead of killing them. It is theoretically possible that Germany is behind the attack, but I see it as extremely unlikely.
The United States. Obviously, Washington is very unsatisfied with Bubble Olaf's policy, and his hesitation to deliver tanks, also, the gas dependency the Germans have enforced against all warnings had Washington in arms beyond party lines, and finally America since years tried to sell its expensive LNG gas to Europe in bigger quantities. Russia obviously as unwelcfomed comeptition and beat the US by price dumping. These days Wahsington must be worrie dbaotu what the crazy Germans will do in tue future regardign Russia, and one obviopusly does not trust Berlin blindly, and already not since many years, I think (Berlin's request to become member of the five eys club was put down, especially by Washington). Wahsington has any itnerets tere is to make sure the Germans will never consider to buy Russian gas anymore after any "deal" Putin made, and what is more ensuring to secure this potlical objecitve by simpyl making it impossible - by destrpoying the pipeline? But here again, what speaks agaisnbt it is that if this stunt becomes known, gets revealked, thsi would leasd to very serous egostratgeic irritations between Europoe and America, and I think Biden, who is more aware of Europe than Obama or Trump were, would not take such a gamble. The US has the motives (plural!), it certainly has the means, but I nevertheless think the probability of Washignton havign attackedthe pipeline is less than moderate: its low.
I point my finger at Russia, with 90+ pc confidence. It just meets their typical behavioral pattern, and all inhibitions that speak against the others suspects in case of Russia obviously do not apply.
Catfish
09-27-22, 01:16 PM
^ If it was Russia, what i honestly doubt, they would not have any advantage from this. I mean they are not delivering and selling much gas anyway anymore, so why destroy it.
Being able to deliver gas and just closing the line is much more effective than having no means to apply pressure. Especially after what Biden has said in february, I am 100 percent sure it was the US.
And if the US was it, this is blackmail.
Skybird
09-27-22, 01:23 PM
^ Putin is not as ice-cold rational (and realistic) anymore as he once has been, he has become desperate by now, and irrational, and I am not the first suspecting that he changed by personality over the Covid years and their isolation. Maybe he wanted just revenge. By now he must have realised that in february he made a cataclysmic error. Now he wants wioth his head thrpough the wall, knowing that if he is not successful with that, he is dead.
Mind you, they torpedoed gas deliveries already before: by refusing to take back that gas turbine, so your argument they want to sell gas is not valid anymore. Putin also calculate that if the dissatisfaction in germany grows, public opinion will turn against the official policy of the government, and Germany becoming unstable. So this is another reason why Putin does not want to sell us gas.
He even burns it near that pipeline entry in Russia, near the Finnish border!
Putin now reminds me of Hitler in the final weeks. "If the Germans are too weak to give me the victory I demand from them, they are weka scum and do not deserve to survive me!" Well, Putin thinks the same about Russians, obviously. I read they have a word in Russia now, for those poor men getting sacked to get killed at the front. Translated it means "gravification" or "gravificator", it describes a living man send to the war to get turned into a grave, or means to make graves out of men.
^ If it was Russia, what i honestly doubt, they would not have any advantage from this. I mean they are not delivering and selling much gas anyway anymore, so why destroy it.
If the US was it, this is blackmail.
Blackmail? If it is it sorta violates rule #1 of extortion, ie: "Don't destroy your leverage before the mark complies".
On the other hand the idea that Russia did this to provide a ready made excuse to keep the spigot turned off seems to me pretty reasonable.
There are Danes who is afraid that Denmark will be involved in a war with Russia.
They have gathered the info we have been told throughout the days-and this has made them convince that Denmark will soon be at war with Russia.
I said to some of them-They should calm down-Yes it's sabotage-Everything is pointing in this direction-Who's behind it-Well I say it's a false flag while others say it's USA. But this is far from enough to start a war.
Markus
Catfish
09-27-22, 01:57 PM
Blackmail? If it is it sorta violates rule #1 of extortion, ie: "Don't destroy your leverage before the mark complies".
The US effectively destroyed any russian leverage that was left via the Nordstream pipes.
Leaving the US with a lot more leverage via LNG deliveries.
On the other hand the idea that Russia did this to provide a ready made excuse to keep the spigot turned off seems to me pretty reasonable.
If Russia just kept turning it off (without destroying it) it would make a bit more sense, don't you think so?
They could open the tap anytime if the EU states complied, now there is no leverage left.
And as Rockstar quoted, it was even announced.
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