Here we go again-Ukraine once again

[Catfish]

Russia Todays website still works in Norway.. I thought it was hacked.
Anonymous is not really effective, and a ddos attack is only temporary. At least it was down in Germany for a few hours. The Kreml quickly put up new servers and redirected.

Anonymous hacked RT.com for a few hours. RT.de or its Norway branch and all else are and were always online.
Germany restricted the RT radio broadcast, not the internet. Yet.

[Andreas86]

This article from BBC is one hour old



https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-60547473

What does special alert mean ?

Markus


I'm imagining something out of Spaceballs :haha:


https://marketingthema.files.wordpress.com/2014/10/spaceballs-ludicrous-speed-o.gif


https://i.stack.imgur.com/mNA4dm.jpg

[Susexx]

As I explained some post above, their system most likely has 4 settings, and this is the second lowest, comparable - probably - to DEFCON 4, or 3 at max. (The US scale has 5 settings).

No nuclear bombers loaded and with running engines on the runway, relax.

Not really. We don't have such a division. Special duty mode. As I said before, this is part of the "Perimeter" system.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dead_Hand

[Catfish]

https://i.imgur.com/1rLGnj9l.png

Gazprom is the russian company that supplies Germany with gas, and german ex chancellor Schroeder sits in the russian directorate of said company. He is also a good personal friend of Putin. Or was, not sure :O:

[Andreas86]

Not really. We don't have such a division. Special duty mode. As I said before, this is part of the "Perimeter" system.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dead_Hand

Interesting read. The last sentences are very telling.. Too bad Oppenheimer didn't think so as well.

"Now, the Soviets had once thought about creating a fully automatic system. Sort of a machine, a doomsday machine, that would launch without any human action at all. When they drew that blueprint up and looked at it, they thought, you know, this is absolutely crazy.

[Skybird]

Ukraine says Russia lost 4300 soldiers, 146 armoured vehicles and tanks, 27 aircraft and 26 helicopters until Sunday.

In four days.

I assume not even in Russia such losses can be hidden indefinitely from the public. The words will make the rounds. The surviving troops one day must return home.

[Catfish]

Putin speaking to his oligarchs (the ones in charge) "We cannot forecast geopolitical risks"
Who would have predicted countries would do what they said they'd do :hmmm:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i8kkeztq70c

"But comrade Putin we put you there and supported you to make MONEY. Your war is bad for our business."
"What do you intend to do about it"?
"Speak directly, Mr Putin!"

You can't make those things up :har:

[mapuc]

This is from twitter

https://twitter.com/AFP/status/1498029493033881601

Article

https://www.wsj.com/livecoverage/russia-ukraine-latest-news-2022-02-26/card/eu-member-countries-will-supply-ukraine-with-jet-fighters-borrell-says-zjCJ5iME2keSkxfiaIpr

Markus

[LUKNER]

https://youtu.be/FG1fuhKwXVA

[Red Devil]

How trustworthy are videos from obscure sources that claim to report facts but do the narration with a robot voice...?


Not at all.



Was true with the Brexit videos, probably is true with these ones now.

I watched this, saw one plane fire one missile, some tanks, some repeats of the plane firing a missile and repeated flying around, and taxing on an airfield

[Kptlt. Neuerburg]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ackArK09Tl4

[Skybird]

This is from twitter

https://twitter.com/AFP/status/1498029493033881601

Article

https://www.wsj.com/livecoverage/russia-ukraine-latest-news-2022-02-26/card/eu-member-countries-will-supply-ukraine-with-jet-fighters-borrell-says-zjCJ5iME2keSkxfiaIpr

Markus
Putin would be delighted! :D

[Armistead]

Putin appears to be in a lose lose situation, so which loss will he endure upon himself, one based on logic or one based on his personality/ego? If he leaves Ukraine the world will pour billions in aid to it. What about all the weaponry promised and coming. Would Putin leave with the possibility Ukraine will end up stronger with a stronger NATO surrounding it? Would Ukraine accept a deal, NATO, to disarm and give into a few of Putin's demands after he just invaded? It seems impossible things can go back to the way they were before and deals reached. If he escalates and takes over Ukraine, Russia will possible implode within itself and he's fighting his own starving people, not to mention a war with NATO. I guess we can only hope Putin breaks his back in Ukraine without resorting to WMD and starting WW3. I think I will temporally move to my mountain farm home and start digging a deeper hole.

[Armistead]

Is it just me or shouldn't there be bodies in the immediate vicinity?.

I heard there was a shortage of Ukrainian dogfood.

[Skybird]

It seems Belarus gave order for airmobile belarus units entering Ukraine from Monday morning on.


Bolsonaro refuses to stand against the war.


Switzerland starts to consider freezing Russian assets, but does so so slowly that Oligarchs can withdraw their money, apparently.


German finance minister Lindtner (FDP) has started to think loud about that the early shutting down of coal, gas and nuclear powerplants must be reversed. I believe that when I see that. It is expected that German inflation will see a rise and business growth a drop.

[Rockstar]

I for one was surprised Putin did what he did. I thought for sure he would just continue to use the Donbass to keep Ukraine unstable and out of NATO. But I guessed wrong. His mistake was to ‘save’ mother Russia from so-called NATO expansion and create a legacy for himself. IMO his use of old Soviet Stalinist means of strong arming other nations to fall in line with the will of the Kremlin is way way far outdated.

Nobody in NATO twisted the arm of former Warsaw Pact Members or rolled into their town square with tanks and rockets demanding compliance. They voluntarily worked to gain membership because they were scared to death of the kind of Russian military aggression we are seeing today. That’s the real reason why NATO got bigger.

NATO membership provides protection against the kind crap we are seeing Russians impose on others today. It also provides protection to a greater economic alliance and allows anyone to still be a nation to fly’s its own flag, to govern themselves and trade in relative peace.

I know a little of Russian history and I can understand why Russia may have done what they did. But those days are over if they still fear being conquered ‘again’ they should look east. Russia has a massive amount of mineral wealth and resources up for grabs, instead of spending everything on military expansion. They should have spent it on infrastructure to exploit those resources. and protect it from China.

Make money, not war! :O:


On a side note I was reading a Global Times article and the artist had a Panda representing China a Brown Bear representing Russia snarling at an Eagle representing the U.S.

Hmmm Russian Brown and a Panda, how cute. I thought we should change our national symbol from a bald eagle to a freaking North American Grizzly Bear, it’s twice as big as a Russian Brown bear and Panda put together, bigger claws, bigger teeth and can get a helluva a lot meaner and nastier when it wants to be.


Just rambling again

[Rockstar]

Valer Sakhaschyk, reserve lieutenant colonel, the Commander of the Brest Air Assault Brigade addressed the Belarusian military and urged them not to carry out criminal orders to attack Ukraine:

https://youtu.be/a4PShicIQHA

I wish you health, the defenders of the Fatherland. My appeal to you. My name is Valer Stiapanavich Sakhaschyk, I am Guards reserve lieutenant colonel. I introduce myself because I retired a long time ago. Some of the current paratroopers may not know me, although I think everyone has heard about the tests called the “black eagle”. The current valour and skill went just from there. Well, and also about the fact that once the 38th Brest Air Assault Brigade every morning ran a dozen and in full force swam in the lake all year round. Well, I'm just the brigade commander who ran ahead of the brigade for four years and was the first to jump into the hole. I am a "black eagle" number one. All the most important things in life happen on impulse, as a rule, and unexpectedly. It's impossible to prepare to be a hero. Simply in the life of each person suddenly appears a situation, in which you must completely act here and now. And either go down in history, or wait for a more opportune moment. It is true, fate usually provides a chance to commit a real act only once.

I served in Air Assault troops for a long time. I served in the Brest brigade for more than 10 years - from deputy battalion commander to brigade commander. Those who dealt with me will not let me to lie, I was one of the most fanatically devoted officers in the troops, a patriot of my Motherland. Nothing existed for me, besides service, commerciality I lack. This is to ensure that no one tries to build theories that someone hired me for this performance. There were no cases in my biography that made it possible to suspect that I was for sale. And at my age, people don't change anymore.

The Air Assault troops were everything in my life. I had been continuing to help my native brigade all the years after my retirement. A flagpole with the flag of the Air Assault Forces stood in front of my house for 18 years. I took it off and it is a separate story related to the events of 2020. But that is not the point for now. Now I decided to record the first video message in my life. Because my compatriots, guys in blue vests, the same as I wore all my life, are sitting in the forest on the border with Ukraine. And it is very likely that in the near future they are going to take part in a very bad deed, which could have disastrous consequences for our country and finally bury the glory and traditions of the troops that many generations of paratroopers have earned. And perhaps not everyone will return to their homeland alive.

The Russian army, which has vast combat experience, has been in hell for three days. The quantity of those killed is calculated already by thousand, prisoners — hundred, military hospitals and civil hospitals in the near-boundary are overfilled by injured. None of the objectives of the operation were achieved. At the moment, it was not possible to take either Kyiv or any of the regional centres. The Russian army is already exhausted. But Ukrainians, after maintaining the most difficult first 72 hours, successfully conducted mobilisation, they were organised, fixed logistics, they obtained the support of the entire world, both moral and a flow of military technical equipment. And most importantly, they saw that ordinary mortal people attacked them, they stopped being afraid, they felt the taste of victory. This army will not retreat and will not surrender.

The Russians simply became victims of their own propagandists, who promised that the people of Ukraine would meet them with bread and salt as liberators. But you already know everything. Although you are forbidden to have smartphones, you are still at home, in contact with family and friends, and have had time to evaluate and comprehend everything.

Does anyone have doubts that your entry into Ukraine will be better than the New Year's assault on Grozny in 1995? The information war is a terrible thing. The propagandists have learned how to deftly make a substitution of concepts, pass off white as black and vice versa. I don't want to get into politics, politics has always been alien to me. But any thinking person should understand at least three things.

The first: Ukraine has never threatened Belarus and is not threatening now.

The second: there are no drug addicts or nationalists in the Ukrainian government. And if they were, they would be elected in free, democratic elections.

The third: the Belarusian armed forces have no legal grounds to invade the territory of Ukraine. Moreover, it is expressly prohibited by the current Constitution.

This is not our war. You will not defend your homeland, your home and your family. You will not get glory in this conflict, but only shame, humiliation, blood, death and the position of a pariah nation for the entire Belarusian people for decades. Brothers, find a way not to participate in this dirty business. How will you live with the fact that you sent the boys to their deaths for nothing, fathers-commanders? How will you look into the eyes of mothers who have given you their sons?

Separately, I appeal to people, who can decide a lot, to military leaders with big stars. I was the commander, teacher, friend for many of you. You remain in my memory as decent, responsible, initiative military leaders, able to quickly navigate in a difficult environment, competently and deeply analyse the situation, and calculate the consequences of certain decisions. Fellows, finally these are your straight functional responsibility, precisely, you were raised by the native land for this purpose. No matter how pressured you are, do a real manly act. Make the right decision, gain civic courage, do not send the boys to the slaughter. Sometimes the greatest feat is simply to say no and go down in history as a person who saved the lives of hundreds, and maybe thousands of people and relations with a brotherly nation. And even if you are fired now, believe me - you will be heroes.

The honour is mine.”

[Onkel Neal]

Nobody in NATO twisted the arm of former Warsaw Pact Members or rolled into their town square with tanks and rockets demanding compliance.



https://i.imgur.com/TifUMHz.jpeg

[Anvar1061]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FG1fuhKwXVA

[nikimcbee]

Yep! A bunch of Mods for a Game that lets you play the Losers side!
:har:
Hey, as long as it has the Buna, Spice Girls phonograph mod.:up:

[Skybird]

Kind of a revolution indeed. If not getting watered down over the coming years.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-60549916


I fear one day Putin is gone and another one is there who poses like Putin did, and then its all flushing back to "the good old times" of love and friendship first.

[Skybird]

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The whole truth about Ukraine's crimes in the Donbass




https://disk.yandex.ru/i/FGP8LE2Af4nQJw
Reported.

[Catfish]

@Lukner: The truth? I don't think so. This is the most idiotic propaganda i have read for a long time, and there was A LOT.

The two eastward provinces have a russian percentage of about 38 percent, the rest is non-russian. Still they could of course join Russia if they wanted.
But it seems they did not want, instead they declared their independence from Ukraine AND Russia.

(B.t.w Zelensky, other than Putin, was ELECTED, by a majority of 73 percent ALL OVER UKRAINE. Zelensky is also jewish, so the fascist Putin propaganda calls HIM a fascist?
Putin said Zelensky is a drug addict, a neo-nazi or fascist (which is NOT the same but i digress), a terrorist and whatnot. Putin propaganda is distributing this over all their state-controlled media since decades, a lot of brainwashing has obviously going on)


Up springs Putin and sends some inofficial insurgents to stir the pot and start riots in those two provinces, his bullies often crossing the border into ukrainian territory, shelling it, harrassing civilians. Since both provinces still officially belonged to Ukraine until recently (only accepted by Russia though) the Ukraine of course had to do something about it.

When Putin's men failed to spread their unrest to the major part of Ukraine, Putin suddenly declares that he has to "help" the two eastward provinces with his "peace troops", by invading Kyev and the whole Ukraine?



B.t.w. meanwhile Kazachstan turned down military help for Russia against Ukraine:
https://norwaytoday.info/news/nbc-kazakhstan-rejects-russias-request-for-help-in-the-war-against-ukraine/
Maybe we already had this here, i'm beginning to lose overview.

[Skybird]

Russia sent a letter to Google, demanding that Google should no longer post numbers on Russian losses and killed Ukrainian civilians.



Russian central bank sends interest rate soaring to 20%. Thats a doubling.

[LUKNER]

The truth? I don't think so.






The information war between the United States, Europe and Russia began. Now everyone should start thinking for themselves. Synthesize your thoughts and not be a victim of propaganda. Smart people are among you, think for yourself!

[LUKNER]

Russia sent a letter to Google, demanding that Google should no longer post numbers on Russian losses and killed Ukrainian civilians.



Russian central bank sends interest rate soaring to 20%. Thats a doubling.


Lying with the truth only reinforces lies. It's time to think for yourself.

[LUKNER]

@Lukner: The truth? I don't think so. This is the most idiotic propaganda i have read for a long time, and there was A LOT.

The two eastward provinces have a russian percentage of about 38 percent, the rest is non-russian. Still they could of course join Russia if they wanted.
But it seems they did not want, instead they declared their independence from Ukraine AND Russia.

B.t.w Zelensky, other than Putin, was ELECTED, by a majority of 73 percent ALL OVER UKRAINE.

Up springs Putin and sends some inofficial insurgents to stir the pot and start riots in those two provinces, his bullies often crossing the border into ukrainian territory, and shelling it. Since both provinces still belonged to Ukraine until recently (only accepted by Russia though) the Ukraine of course had to do something about it.

When Putin's men failed to bring their unrest to the major part of Ukraine, Putin suddenly declares that he has to "help" the two eastward provinces with his "peace troops", by invading Kyev and the whole Ukraine?



B.t.w. meanwhile Kazachstan turned down military help for Russia against Ukraine:
https://norwaytoday.info/news/nbc-kazakhstan-rejects-russias-request-for-help-in-the-war-against-ukraine/
Maybe we already had this here, i'm beginning to lose overview.


President Putin V.V. and the armed forces of the Russian Federation are destroying fascism in Ukraine.

[Catfish]

Your "president" Putin is not even elected. A good description of him would be an imperialist dictator. Do not mistake Putin with the russian people.


Kazakhstan, one of Russia’s closest allies, has rejected a request from Moscow to help Russia in the war against Ukraine, reports NBC.

Furthermore, on Friday, the former Soviet republic said that it does not recognize the breakaway regions of Luhansk and Donetsk as independent states, according to NBC.
Putin used recognition of the two breakaway regions as a lever to start the war against Ukraine on Thursday.

[Niume]

Your "president" Putin is not even elected. A good description of him would be an imperialist dictator. Do not mistake Putin with the russian people.


Kazakhstan, one of Russia’s closest allies, has rejected a request from Moscow to help Russia in the war against Ukraine, reports NBC.

Furthermore, on Friday, the former Soviet republic said that it does not recognize the breakaway regions of Luhansk and Donetsk as independent states, according to NBC.
Putin used recognition of the two breakaway regions as a lever to start the war against Ukraine on Thursday.
Big respect for Kazakhstan. At least they won't live in 19th century unlike Russia is Putin will be in power.

[LUKNER]

Your "president" Putin is not even elected. A good description of him would be an imperialist dictator. Do not mistake Putin with the russian people.


Kazakhstan, one of Russia’s closest allies, has rejected a request from Moscow to help Russia in the war against Ukraine, reports NBC.

Furthermore, on Friday, the former Soviet republic said that it does not recognize the breakaway regions of Luhansk and Donetsk as independent states, according to NBC.
Putin used recognition of the two breakaway regions as a lever to start the war against Ukraine on Thursday.

Our president is elected by the people. If you look a little in history, you will understand that all the rulers of Russia in the eyes of the United States and Europe have always been bloody tyrants. Stalin was a tyrant, but the Russian people led by him defeated fascism in Berlin in 1945. The United States helped Hitler come to power, and now supports fascism in Ukraine. The time has come to answer for his works before God.

[GrenSo]

The United States helped Hitler come to power


Sorry, but with this statement, you have disqualified yourself, because that is simply not true.

[Skybird]

^ This is propaganda justifying with the all too wellknown lies Putin's obscene crime and war against the Ukrainian people.

Its here where tolerance must end and no no more talking is done.

Heck , even the very russophile and dreamdancing Germans - the GERMANS! - suddenly woke up and and have finally realised that yesterday: with a SOCIALIST chancellor, a GREEN foreign minster, and A LIBERAL fiannc eminsiter at the helm. And the only ones still weaseling are the SED, and the AfD.

Genocide in the Donbass. Urkaine preparing to attack Russia. Free elections in Russia. Pah! Russian propaganda bullsh!t.

[Catfish]

Our president is elected by the people.
This depends on how you view it.
If you look a little in history, you will understand that all the rulers of Russia in the eyes of the United States and Europe have always been bloody tyrants.No, not more than other leaders of those times(!) behaved, russian tsars and potentates are not worse than the rest of the world. I also would not say that today's Putin is a "tyrant".
Stalin was a tyrant, but the Russian people led by him defeated fascism in Berlin in 1945.This is true. To be a wiseass i might say they defeated National Socialism, not "fascism". But this is something even "Antifa" will never understand..
The United States helped Hitler come to power, and now supports fascism in Ukraine.Nonsense. Some US companies supported Hitler, like Henry Ford, yes. On the other hand the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact divided Poland between Stalin and Hitler, and both attacked and occupied it. Then Hitler broke this pact and attacked Russia. But after the war Stalin still occupied all the countries he had conquered on the way to Berlin, this went on even without Stalin until 1990.
How did the US help Hitler after 1939?
The time has come to answer for his works before God.You will be surprised.

[GrenSo]

And the only ones still weaseling are the SED, and the AfD.



SED... habe ich da was verpasst? :hmmm:

[Skybird]

SED... habe ich da was verpasst? :hmmm:
Anscheinend.


Die Linke. SED und Verklärung pur. Ist übrigens auch der Rechtsnachfolger, zweimal gerichtlich festgestellt.

[Catfish]

"Die Linke" (als Nachfolgerin der SED :O:) has at least admitted that they have made an error in believing and judging Putin. I was really surprised to hear this.

[Skybird]

Donnerwetter....! German minster Habeck says he has no more thinking taboos - and his ministry is checking to extend the runtime of the remaining nuclear powerplants.

This now leaves me speechless a bit.

[Onkel Neal]

Lunker, you are welcome to make a case for your point of view but please do not post images here of mutilated and dead people. Link to it if you wish, and include a warning of graphic content. thanks.

[PrivetFox]

Our president is elected by the people. If you look a little in history, you will understand that all the rulers of Russia in the eyes of the United States and Europe have always been bloody tyrants. Stalin was a tyrant, but the Russian people led by him defeated fascism in Berlin in 1945. The United States helped Hitler come to power, and now supports fascism in Ukraine. The time has come to answer for his works before God.

I'm sorry but the truth is that Stalin almost loses the war due to his incompetence and interference in the liberty of action of his military officers.
In fact, he was warned of the imminent invasion of Germany and rejected all the documents that corroborated it as "rubbish".

if Ukraine is a fascist regime, how it is possible that her president is jewish?
And why they fight so fiercily to stop the Russian invassion that is supposedly coming to "free" them?

[Skybird]

And why does the Russian community in the Ukriane not uprise against the government in Kyiv and ally with the Russian invaders? Instead many of them fighting against the aggressors from Russia, voluntarily?

[GrenSo]

Lunker, you are welcome to make a case for your point of view but please do not post images here of mutilated and dead people. Link to it if you wish, and include a warning of graphic content. thanks.


Many thanks, Neal for your clear statement.

[Skybird]

Many thanks, Neal for your clear statement.
:Kaleun_Thumbs_Up:
I find the propagandistic lie content much more worrysome than the images. It turns the thread into another Putin propaganda platform of which there are already so many in the Western media landscape. And thats why I reported it - not because of the images.



However, in Germany, even the last defenders of NS2 are fleeing their flag. Minister president Manuela Schwesig, head of Mecklenburg-Vorpommern (where the pipeline gets dry feet) and one of the loudest opportunistic Putin-understanders and NS2-defenders, has started a process to dismantle the legal body that heads the pipeline project, which has the law form of a foundation, and that means the pipeline now starts to get indeed officially buried once and forever. That tooks some time!

I wonder whether Biden has been lucky, or just indeed acted wisely, when he did not press the Germans over NS2, even when the war had gone hot, and held back US sanctions. What has come of it? He just had to wait for the Germans moving all by themselves, after years, and when they finally did now, he then could fire the US sanctions without causing any rifts and resistence from Germany anymore to make sure the project is dead and stays dead. Clever or lucky, the outcome is the same.

[GrenSo]

I find the propagandistic lie content much more worrysome than the images. It turns the thread into another Putin propaganda platform of which there are already so many in the Western media landscape. And thats why I reported it - not because of the images


I reported the post for both reasons. But for me it was actually the first priority that the personal rights of the dead people shown there were clearly violated with this pictures. We don't need that in the forum.

[Anvar1061]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1qXdDVnx20

[Rockstar]

Deliverance comes to mind, all that’s missing in the above video are the banjos. :D

Ukrainians fought with Germans for the same reasons they are fighting Russians today. In fact when many of Ukrainians in German uniform were sent west to fight against the U.S. Britain and the French. They rebelled shot the Nazis and joined the F.F.I. and French Resistance. After WWII one Ukrainian Major Lev Hloba even went on to join the French Foreign Legion and fought for France.

You can understand now why France is very vocal defending Ukrainians and moving arms and troops to assist other NATO members against little Stalin.

[Skybird]

Romanian news source "adevarul" writes (quoted in a German newspaper)

Only Putin's elimination could avert the danger of a generalized war. Certainly, his (Putin's) generals and political camarilla have also come to this conclusion. Probably these days there are secret talks with the secret services of NATO, about calming down the situation in a post-Putin era. (...) Members of the Russian political and military elite also have families, children and grandchildren. They have no inclination to commit collective suicide. It is only a matter of days before this elite will depose Putin, peacefully or violently.
Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator (http://www.DeepL.com/Translator) (free version)

I have started to wonder about this ^, too. How long before the rich and the military elites turn against Putin?

[Skybird]

And this: the thirteen Ukrainian defenders of Snake Island that were announced to have been killed after their now famous radio exchnage with a Russian warship, seem to be alive, though in captivity. Source: Ukrainian navy.


Also, Russia closes its airspace for all flight carriers from 36 Western states.

[mapuc]

Does anyone of you have hope, that these meetings between Ukraine and Russia will end in something positive ?

I hope it will mean the end of the invasion.

Markus

[Catfish]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F2t6YCwuZYg

[Rockstar]

Russia still ready for dialogue, despite war

"Russia will always be ready for dialogue that will bring everyone back to justice and the principles of the UN Charter," Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov said at a meeting with his Pakistani counterpart Shah Mehmood Qureshi.

The Russian Federation is ready for a new Yalta conference — Putin will not talk to comedian Zelensky.


Читайте больше на https://english.pravda.ru/world/150449-russia_ukraine_war/


Are they kidding, a new YALTA conference? WTF world is this guy Putin living in? Stop dreaming of reviving yesteryear the days of Stalinist spheres of influence are over. Make love money, not war.

[Jimbuna]

Does anyone of you have hope, that these meetings between Ukraine and Russia will end in something positive ?

I hope it will mean the end of the invasion.

Markus

I doubt it and definitely not whilst Vladolf is in power.

[Onkel Neal]

Hoo boy, Russia stepped in it now. Germany is taking off the gloves.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/feb/27/germany-set-up-fund-boost-military-strength-ukraine-putin

[Rockstar]

Does anyone of you have hope, that these meetings between Ukraine and Russia will end in something positive ?

I hope it will mean the end of the invasion.

Markus

It could have gone a lot better if once he recognized the Separatists in the Donbass he then sent his so called peace keeping force into that particular region, but no further.

But invading the rest of Ukraine Putin opened up a whole new can of worms. He really screwed up when he did that. The longer Ukraine can draw this out by defending their homeland the more internal pressure will be applied to Putin at home. He seems to long for the old days of Stalin so maybe there will be a report of him catching cold and he’ll simply disappear.

[Onkel Neal]

Hoo boy, Russia stepped in it now. Germany is taking off the gloves.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/feb/27/germany-set-up-fund-boost-military-strength-ukraine-putin

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1qXdDVnx20

:) That guy's CIA :arrgh!:

[Jimbuna]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5QWtvuPSNKM

[mapuc]

Well I started to imagine things and one imagine lead to another...Here is what I ended up with

Civil war in Russia.

Markus

[Jimbuna]

Negotiators for Kyiv and Moscow are holding talks in Belarus but expectations are not high.

Before the meeting, President Zelensky urged Russian troops to lay down their weapons and called for immediate EU membership.

Russia doubles its interest rate to 20% as its currency plunges and experts warn of a possible run on banks.

The UK's defence secretary says Russia could indiscriminately bomb cities as frustration with the campaign grows.

The north-eastern city of Chernihiv faced heavy shelling overnight, but remains in Ukrainian hands.

Reports suggest Belarus is going to deploy its own soldiers to fight.

[Onkel Neal]

You know Putin is schizo, right? All this to keep Ukraine out of NATO. Putin thinks the West is out to conquer Russia. No European or NA country wants to invade and crush Russia. Man, that's crazy, no one cares.:haha:

[Jimbuna]

Ukraine invasion: Would Putin press the nuclear button? https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-60551140

[mapuc]

Ukraine invasion: Would Putin press the nuclear button? https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-60551140

As I have said before I fear Putin is going to throw 1-2 tactical nukes in Ukraine. 2-4 kiloton strength.

What NATO response will be I don't know.

And I don't know what NATO will do if Belarus also take part in the invasion.

Markus

[Onkel Neal]

As I have said before I fear Putin is going to throw 1-2 tactical nukes in Ukraine. 2-4 kiloton strength.

What NATO response will be I don't know.

And I don't know what NATO will do if Belarus also take part in the invasion.

Markus

NATO's response should be identical.

I desperately wish the US would reflagged about 50 A-10s and send them on a run down that Ukraine highway where Putin has all that armor parked.

[Jimbuna]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gYmt4qu00uc

[mapuc]

Another debate here in Denmark and in Sweden has been about war in Europe in newer time.

Many have said our memory must be short-Who can forget the war in former Yugoslavia.

The response to these people has been

It's a different between a civil war and a war of aggression.

Markus

[Catfish]

You know Putin is schizo, right? All this to keep Ukraine out of NATO. Putin thinks the West is out to conquer Russia. No European or NA country wants to invade and crush Russia. Man, that's crazy, no one cares.:haha:
So true, and b.t.w. no one in the west wanted to have Ukraine in NATO, or the EU :yep:


This may change now. If Putin has "success" with anything it will be Ukraine in the NATO, with Finnland probably following suit. Driving more nations into NATO while making Russia an international pariah and creating economical hardship for her people. And all western nations stepping up their defenses in fear.


But fascists and NATO is only a pretext anyway, Putin wants to expand "his" Russia to cold war times, one country after the other: Chechenia, Georgia, the Krim, now Ukraine, and he already threatened the baltic states, and Finnland.


And that is the problem, if he does not succeed now he will probably use thermobaric bombs or even nuclear ones against Ukraine, and then he may probably want to leave this life with a bang. He gives a sh!t about Russia and the people.

[mapuc]

b.t.w. no one in the west wanted to have Ukraine in NATO :yep:

Are you sure !?

Only one month ago there were none who could think of Ukraine being an EU member...today more and more voices in EU has said Ukraine shall become a member as soon as possible.

I imagine the same could very well happens when it comes to a NATO membership. That in a month or so voices are speaking positive for Ukraine being a NATO member.

Edit
Found this written in a Danish article(it's behind a paywall, so I only copy what is readable)

"If Putin makes the threat of a nuclear attack a reality, NATO can no longer keep up, writes former Danish Consul General in St. Petersburg
We are in many ways defenseless if the attack comes. Did NATO learn anything from Crimea?

NATO is arming itself, but it is still too little and too uneven if we are to keep up with Putin

One of the most irrelevant data highlighted when assessing Russia's military strength is that the country's gross domestic product, GDP, is smaller than Italy's. It's a blind spot - because the key is what Russia can and wants. Before the invasion of Ukraine, Russia was waging war in two places - Eastern Ukraine and Syria. The classic definition of a great power - to be able to wage two wars at the same time.
End edit


Markus

[Jimbuna]

So true, and b.t.w. no one in the west wanted to have Ukraine in NATO :yep:
If Putin has "success" with anything it will be Ukraine in the NATO, with Finnland probably following suit. While making Russia an international pariah and economical hardship.

But fascists and NATO is only a pretext anyway, Putin wants to expand "his" Russia to cold war times, one country after the other: Chechenia, Georgia, the Krim, now Ukraine, and he already threatened the baltic states, and Finnland.


And that is the problem, if he does not succeed now he will probably use thermobaric bombs or even nuclear ones against Ukraine, and then he may probably want to leave this life with a bang. He gives a sh!t about Russia and the people.

Agreed :yep:

[Jimbuna]

Vladimir Putin put Russia's nuclear forces on high alert after comments by UK Foreign Secretary Liz Truss and others, the Kremlin has said.

Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov said "unacceptable" remarks were made about possible "clashes" between Nato and Moscow over Russia's attack on Ukraine.

It is unclear precisely which comments by Ms Truss Russia objects to.

On Sunday, she said if Russia was not stopped, other states may be threatened and it could end in conflict with Nato.

A Foreign and Commonwealth Office source told the BBC: "I don't think anything Liz has said warrants that sort of rhetoric or escalation."

They said the foreign secretary had always spoken about Nato as a "defensive alliance" and that the UK needed to support Ukraine.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-60558048

[Bilge_Rat]

I'm sure a lot of people want Ukraine in the EU, but that is an emotional response.

The reason why Ukraine is not in the EU is not because of Russia but because of the EU. EU has criterias to admit members and Ukraine does not meet any of them.

Despite having a pro-western govt. for 8 years, Ukraine is still one of the poorest and most corrupt countries in Europe. Its economy never went through the post-soviet restructuring of other economies in Eastern Europe and most of its businesses cannot compete against EU companies. The only reason they survive now is due to domestic protective measures.

Based on various articles written by economists who have looked into to this, if Ukraine was admitted in the EU right now you would have:

1. 2-3 million Ukrainains who would move to western europe and compete for low paying jobs driving up the local unemployment rate (note: these are pre-war numbers, the numbers now would be a lot higher);

2. Wholesale bankruptcies of many Ukrainian companies who cannot compete with EU companies, which would lead to...

3. EU having to pour Billions of Euros in to Ukraine to prop up the Govt and economy (think of Greece and multiply by a factor of 3x to 5x)....

4. a large chunk of which would be siphoned off into offshore accounts since based on various estimates, govt corruption at all level may account for as much as 30% of GDP.

No to mention the fact that Turkey has been a EU candidate for over 15 years and and is way closer to meeting the EU criterias than Ukraine is.

[mapuc]

^ In the news here it is said that Ukraine will use a special EU rule in their application for EU membership.

Markus

[Jimbuna]

Then the band played 'Believe it if you like'

[les green01]

AMMO Inc is donating 1 million rounds of ammunition to the Armed Forced of Ukraine

[Jimbuna]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F2t6YCwuZYg

[Red Devil]

Putin was allowed to get away with invading Georgia and Crimea, he thought it would work again. Next he would probably have tried Hungary again or Slovakia. We have to stand together, and starve Russia economically now. I did see on one channel that the EU were sending jets to Ukraine, I believe minus pilots ? The owrst it gets for Russia, the sooner Putin will be toppled. We hope.

[mapuc]

Did or didn't NATO promise Jeltsin that NATO wouldn't expand one inch ?

There's some discussion on FB among my Danish friends.

Some say it's Putin who has been altering with history while others say he hasn't we only have to read our history books.

I seem to recall it slightly something with promises to Soviet/Russia.

Markus

[Armistead]

Could this have been avoided? Was NATO and the US too weak and reactive since March? Did Putin through talks feel NATO would divide or respond weakly because of energy? Does this compare to the first Iraq War, where Saddam due to words and policies of the US and NATO felt he could take Kuwait without too many serious issues, but then came an overwhelming response that put him in a lose lose situation. It appears Putin is now in that lose lose situation due to an overwhelming response he probably didn't expect. It seems in weak reactive policy for 2 decades not to poke the bear we let the bear out of its cage. Right now Putin has chosen to escalate. I don't see how this doesn't eventually end in WW3.

[Skybird]

Did or didn't NATO promise Jeltsin that NATO wouldn't expand one inch ?

There's some discussion on FB among my Danish friends.

Some say it's Putin who has been altering with history while others say he hasn't we only have to read our history books.

I seem to recall it slightly something with promises to Soviet/Russia.

Markus
Nothing of that matters anymore. Nothing of that can be allowed to matter anymore.


Russian troops in Belarus. Russian nukes to be brought back into Belarus, they threaten. Russian troops and nukes in Kalinigrad. Add that together, and you have Russian nukes flying west beyond Berlin , and the threat of a pince attack against the Baltic states. All that is already reality, except nukes in Belarus, but Russia is mulling to move them in there.

Baltic states and Poland, Slovenia, Romania, Hungary, are front states now. We must arm them up to the last tooth, like it was done with West Germany when the cold war 1.0 was still there and Germany divided.

(And Germany must get its railtrack grid in order, and attached bridges. Its of utmost logistical relevance. Traffic networks and logistics are the real primary reason why the US forces still maintain presence in Germany. )

Just this time the Europeans have to shoulder much, much more of the military burdens. America cannot afford to focus on Europe anymore as it once has done. The priorities have shifted, from 1. Europoe, 2. Gulf, 3. China, to 1. China, 2. Gulf, 3. Europe.

Germany is crash-learning bitter lessons these days, and has started to no longer reject these lessons. Now Europe must do the same.



Ironic, foreign diplomatically Putin has achieved the exact opposite of what he planned for.



We should out his minions and oligarchs and top generals under the biggest pressure we can project against them. So that they form an egoist interest to get rid of Putin.

[mapuc]

Where's the war !?

Have the last few days been watching many hours* live stream from some of the biggest cities in Ukraine and nothing.

* Not all in once, but 5-10 minutes here and there.

I use this page

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HIPNVm6lNfM

As one wrote
​it is more peaceful than Gaza Israel wow what a war we are being lied to by media as usual

No I do NOT disbelieve, but there should be something on this stream.
Markus

[LUKNER]

You will be surprised.


At all. Such souls - immediately in Hell!!!

[Red Devil]

I wonder when russian troops will start to defect??

[Skybird]

You know Putin is schizo, right? All this to keep Ukraine out of NATO. Putin thinks the West is out to conquer Russia. No European or NA country wants to invade and crush Russia. Man, that's crazy, no one cares.:haha:
Its an old Russian mind disease. They are like this since CENTURIES. They feel small and encircled. Can happen in a crowded little space like theirs. Cabin fever, so to speak. :D

[Catfish]

https://www-n--tv-de.translate.goog/politik/400-Soeldner-in-Kiew-auf-Selenskyj-angesetzt-article23162289.html?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=de&_x_tr_pto=wapp

Putin seems to be a bit afraid.. just what does he think happens if this man is being killed by hired mercenaries?
A martyr will be nothing against this and then everyone in Ukraine will stand up and fight. This will be a forever civil war even if Putin conquers and kills as many as possible.

[mapuc]

In the headlines in a Danish newspaper.

We are only in the beginning of the beginning of the war...

Markus

[Rockstar]

Did or didn't NATO promise Jeltsin that NATO wouldn't expand one inch ?

There's some discussion on FB among my Danish friends.

Some say it's Putin who has been altering with history while others say he hasn't we only have to read our history books.

I seem to recall it slightly something with promises to Soviet/Russia.

Markus

No promises, no,treaties,

… And if the East Europeans sought to leave the Warsaw Pact, didn’t that suggest to the Soviet leadership that they might eventually want to join NATO? Gorbachev later said that this simply was not an issue at the time. “The topic of ‘NATO expansion,’” he told an interviewer in 2014, “was not discussed at all, and it wasn’t brought up in those years. I say this with full responsibility. Not a single Eastern European country raised the issue, not even after the Warsaw Pact ceased to exist in 1991.”40 But it was not true that “not a single Eastern European country raised the issue” of joining NATO during that period. The idea was in fact broached by East European leaders in meetings with Deputy Secretary of State Lawrence Eagleburger in late February 1990, just days after the Baker assurances had been given; one of them, Hungary’s foreign minister Gyula Horn, actually made public comments in this vein at the time.41 The East Europeans, to be sure, did not press this issue too vociferously. They, like everyone else, were worried that moving ahead too quickly might undermine Gorbachev’s position within the Soviet leadership, and that if he fell everything might be lost. But it was clear enough what they had in mind. As Kohl told President Bush in May, the Soviet leader had “big problems. His East European allies say they want to be in NATO.”42 And indeed Gorbachev himself told French president François Mitterrand that same month that he had told Baker “we are aware of your favorable attitude towards the intention expressed by a number of representatives of Eastern European countries to withdraw from the Warsaw Pact and subsequently join NATO.” It was in that context, he said, that he had made his famous suggestion about the USSR joining NATO as well.43

A lot of history with notes and sources in the below study.

https://www.sscnet.ucla.edu/polisci/faculty/trachtenberg/cv/1990.pdf

[Skybird]

So true, and b.t.w. no one in the west wanted to have Ukraine in NATO, or the EU :yep:


This may change now. If Putin has "success" with anything it will be Ukraine in the NATO, with Finnland probably following suit. Driving more nations into NATO while making Russia an international pariah and creating economical hardship for her people. And all western nations stepping up their defenses in fear.


But fascists and NATO is only a pretext anyway, Putin wants to expand "his" Russia to cold war times, one country after the other: Chechenia, Georgia, the Krim, now Ukraine, and he already threatened the baltic states, and Finnland.


And that is the problem, if he does not succeed now he will probably use thermobaric bombs or even nuclear ones against Ukraine, and then he may probably want to leave this life with a bang. He gives a sh!t about Russia and the people.


Anyone remembering "Citizen Kane": Rosebud?


If there is any linearity in Putin's psychological biography, then it visibly starts from the collapse of the USSR on. That was his Rosebud moment, so to speak. And as a secret service man who was selected for that job, he was filtered out for havign certain character traits and mind skills: intelligeence, and probabaly some trait that could be summarised as in total pointing at something like a psychopathic, paranoid and/or anti-empathic personality structure (I have not yet watched the video Jim has linked, its very long...). You find psychopathic personality structures like this statistically valid accumulated in people in certain jobs, for example senior doctors at hospitals, company top managers, top ban kers, poltlicla leaders and poltlicla top offic eholders. You see, certain traits in people enable them, maybe better formulated: help them to reach these positions and occupy them. Its a two-split sword, itu can help tp push throuzgh good work or goals, and it can work for turning the job holder into a monstrosity.



Which we see in case of Putin.


That cannot be an excuse to not get rid of him, no matter in which way. I do not excuse with the above, I try to explain. That are two very different things.

[Andreas86]

Where's the war !?

Have the last few days been watching many hours* live stream from some of the biggest cities in Ukraine and nothing.

* Not all in once, but 5-10 minutes here and there.

I use this page

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HIPNVm6lNfM

As one wrote
​it is more peaceful than Gaza Israel wow what a war we are being lied to by media as usual

No I do NOT disbelieve, but there should be something on this stream.
Markus


What fighting is going on in the cities is still on the outskirts. The air alarm went off several times in Kiev and Lviv yesterday, and there were explosions and rumbling of bombs throughout the day and evening. The cities are big you know, the war will not necessarily happen right in front of the webcam..

What idiot said it was calmer than Gaza? Take a look at the Grad shelling in Kharkiv earlier this day, I bet the citizens felt the same way.

[Jimbuna]

Football's world governing body Fifa and Europe's governing body Uefa have suspended Russian clubs and national teams from all competitions.

[Aktungbby]

BOTTOM LINE: having eschewed global Ma'at, Vlad the Bastard is certainly covering up his failing Götterdämmerung!!?? I submit; WWIII is underway...

Right now Putin has chosen to escalate. I don't see how this doesn't eventually end in WW3.Yer a day late and a surmise short!:03: We'll know for sure when China moves on Taiwan...in a carefully crafted two-front assault on the so-called World Order.That actually began with the unopposed takeover of Tibet in the '50's. It's a repeat of 1939; with a Sino-Soviet Axis against increasingly resolute Allies all over again. Everybody's got nukes:yeah:...let's play and get this over with once and for all. At least a nuclear winter will resolve the global warming problem-if not the Covid Pandemic!?? :arrgh!:

[Jeff-Groves]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MpmGXeAtWUw

[Red Devil]

Mapuc. If you look at the bottom right black and white image, you can clear see flashes from weapons in the distance.

[Andreas86]

Edit: Double post again, please delete.
My internet is really screwy the last days..

[Catfish]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F2t6YCwuZYg

may i return the recent compliment, try to keep up (https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=2796076&postcount=1299) :salute::O:

[Jeff-Groves]

may i return the recent compliment, try to keep up :salute::O:
His Walker is broken.

[les green01]

Where's the war !?

Have the last few days been watching many hours* live stream from some of the biggest cities in Ukraine and nothing.

* Not all in once, but 5-10 minutes here and there.

I use this page

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HIPNVm6lNfM

As one wrote
​it is more peaceful than Gaza Israel wow what a war we are being lied to by media as usual

No I do NOT disbelieve, but there should be something on this stream.
Markus

i have heard sirens going off and exposions most of the cams i seen is not panning around i'm willing to bet if they did in the distance you would see the sky lighting up but then most people posting on youtube never seen the elephant or how time slow down like your mind is recording everything in slow mo

[Catfish]

France freezes the rest of russian assets.

https://www.aa.com.tr/en/europe/france-freezes-assets-of-the-russian-central-bank/2518444

"Widening the sanctions against those Russian billionaires close to the Kremlin, Le Maire informed that his ministry will identify their assets in France and seize them. "We are drawing the complete inventory of financial assets, real estate, yachts, luxury vehicles(...) We will equip ourselves with the legal means to seize all of these assets," he said."

[Jimbuna]

may i return the recent compliment, try to keep up (https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=2796076&postcount=1299) :salute::O:

:haha:




:oops:



:/\\!!

[Catfish]

Worldwide action on Russia's treasury:

Russian central bank shut down
Russia's huge gold and foreign exchange reserves are probably Putin's most important trump card, but now he has to worry about it. The West cuts the Russian central bank's access to assets - a historic act with devastating effects.

Translation by Google:
https://www-manager--magazin-de.translate.goog/politik/russische-zentralbank-kalt-gestellt-angriff-auf-russlands-staatsschatz-a-65ced7ac-fc1c-4284-b1d9-566e2f5202ff?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp

[mapuc]

And this one-Heard a lot of sirene

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kH0ic4jptCw

Markus

[Onkel Neal]

Baltic states and Poland, Slovenia, Romania, Hungary, are front states now. We must arm them up to the last tooth, like it was done with West Germany when the cold war 1.0 was still there and Germany divided.

(And Germany must get its railtrack grid in order, and attached bridges. Its of utmost logistical relevance. Traffic networks and logistics are the real primary reason why the US forces still maintain presence in Germany. )

Just this time the Europeans have to shoulder much, much more of the military burdens. America cannot afford to focus on Europe anymore as it once has done. The priorities have shifted, from 1. Europoe, 2. Gulf, 3. China, to 1. China, 2. Gulf, 3. Europe.

Germany is crash-learning bitter lessons these days, and has started to no longer reject these lessons. Now Europe must do the same.


Yeah, wasn't there a recent American president who was forceful about NATO member states stepping up and budgeting their share of defense costs? :hmmm: Who was that guy?

In 2014, NATO members agreed to target spending 2 percent of gross domestic product (GDP) on defense, although the contributions remain voluntary. In 2017, only the U.S., U.K., Greece, Poland and Estonia reached the 2 percent target.

The U.S. represented a 71.1 percent share of the alliance’s combined defense expenditure.

[Bilge_Rat]

re: Russia's central Bank.

The Gold is safe because most/all of it is physically in Russia, but it cannot be sold quickly.

The problem is that a lot of the foreign reserves, Euros and U.S. Dollars are held in or owed by Western Banks. Those are now frozen and cannot be used to buy Rubles and prop up its value.

Very effective short term, but the long term effect will be that both Russia and China will try to switch to the Chinese Renminbi and away from Euros/Dollars.

[Jimbuna]

Worldwide action on Russia's treasury:

Russian central bank shut down
Russia's huge gold and foreign exchange reserves are probably Putin's most important trump card, but now he has to worry about it. The West cuts the Russian central bank's access to assets - a historic act with devastating effects.

Translation by Google:
https://www-manager--magazin-de.translate.goog/politik/russische-zentralbank-kalt-gestellt-angriff-auf-russlands-staatsschatz-a-65ced7ac-fc1c-4284-b1d9-566e2f5202ff?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp

This is going to be forcing Vladolf into making a decision soon but what will he do?

[Rockstar]

Yeah, wasn't there a recent American president who was forceful about NATO member states stepping up and budgeting their share of defense costs? :hmmm: Who was that guy?


More important who were the weasels doing business with Putin? All the while that certain president demanded they pony up their fair share. Even while former Warsaw Pact members now in NATO sounded the alarm over a new molotov Ribbentrop pact. No wonder why Putin looked confident and self assured over his actions. Until things started going bad for him. The real weasels we’re intent on withholding arms and looking the other way.

I’m still not sure about this swift thing and how it may affect our economy, and not ready to jump on that bandwagon. But I am keenly aware what a 5.56 NATO round will do to the human body so I’m all for sending arms to Ukraine

[Catfish]

re Jim i admit i have lost all overview myself :haha:

re Jeff :arrgh!:

[Jimbuna]

re Jim i admit i have lost all overview myself :haha:

re Jeff :arrgh!:

If I'm to be totally honest here I admit I'm getting a little concerned he won't choose the nuclear option.

[Jeff-Groves]

Well. As I recall. The USA stated they would not use Nukes FIRST!
So if Crazy Ivan uses them first? All bets are off!

[Catfish]

^ re Jim – yes. What would Hitler have done in his last days in a bunker, if he had had nuclear weapons..

[Jeff-Groves]

^ Yes. What would Hitler have done in his last days in a bunker, if he had had nuclear weapons..
We'd be playing SH3 as the Losers.
Just on the other side!

[Bilge_Rat]

This is going to be forcing Vladolf into making a decision soon but what will he do?

He does not have a choice, he has to go all in. He has maybe 1-2 weeks, if after that it does not look like the Russians are winning, the external/internal pressure will force to find a way out.

[Jimbuna]

^ re Jim – yes. What would Hitler have done in his last days in a bunker, if he had had nuclear weapons..

Hitler was that doped up at the end I doubt he could figure much out rationally but somehow I reckon Vladof is in a clearer cold and calculating state of mind.

[Jimbuna]

He does not have a choice, he has to go all in. He has maybe 1-2 weeks, if after that it does not look like the Russians are winning, the external/internal pressure will force to find a way out.

I sincerely hope you're wrong :hmmm:

[Bilge_Rat]

I sincerely hope you're wrong :hmmm:

I am not talking about the Bomb btw, as long as the war stays in Ukraine and NATO forces do not get involved, I don't see a scenario where Putin would be allowed to launch a nuclear strike.

[Jeff-Groves]

They went Defensive mode.
I'd suspect Putin fears a Cruise Missile might be heading his way.
Those Nasty Subs hiding under the Arctic Ice could pull that off.

[Jimbuna]

I am not talking about the Bomb btw, as long as the war stays in Ukraine and NATO forces do not get involved, I don't see a scenario where Putin would be allowed to launch a nuclear strike.

Ah, right...I thought when you wrote " he has to go all in" you meant the nuclear option.

[Jeff-Groves]

I don't see a scenario where Putin would be allowed to launch a nuclear strike.

So WHO gave him permission to just willy nilly launch a freaking WAR?
One that is NOT going so well for them for all accounts.
The ones that gave him 'permission'? Those people need targeted.
By Targeted I mean terminated with extreme prejudice.
Look up the meaning of that!

[Bilge_Rat]

well you can already see the war getting nastier:

1st day Ops looked they thought it could be a Coup to capture cities without much violence;

5th day, they are using MLRS to bomb cities and are dropping Cluster Bombs which are expressly designed to kill/injure as many humans as possible.

[Jimbuna]

Ukraine crisis: Ukrainians prepare to go home to fight.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-60560589

Just a handful at present but if this is replicated across other countries the numbers could soon become more significant.

[Bilge_Rat]

So WHO gave him permission to just willy nilly launch a freaking WAR?

well even in the U.S., POTUS could not just wake up one day and order a full on strike for the hell of it. If it was not justifiable, you can be sure the 25th amendment would be invoked rather quickly.

In the USSR, based on Cold War documents which come out periodically, you can see there were a lot of safeguards put in and the military had to basically sign off on the order.

I would presume the same safeguards still exist.

[Jeff-Groves]

If I was 30 years younger?
I'd join the Ukraine Foreign Legions!

Hell. I wanted to join the French Foreign Legion when I left the 82nd.
They had something back then that stopped that.
If I recall right? I couldn't speak French.

[Jimbuna]

A change from the bad news....the Ukrainian navy are reporting that the Border guards who defended Snake Island from Zmiinyi army, alive and in captivity.

[Aktungbby]

Worldwide action on Russia's treasury:

Russian central bank shut down
Russia's huge gold and foreign exchange reserves are probably Putin's most important trump card, but now he has to worry about it. The West cuts the Russian central bank's access to assets - a historic act with devastating effects.

Translation by Google:
https://www-manager--magazin-de.translate.goog/politik/russische-zentralbank-kalt-gestellt-angriff-auf-russlands-staatsschatz-a-65ced7ac-fc1c-4284-b1d9-566e2f5202ff?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp

re: Russia's central Bank.

The Gold is safe because most/all of it is physically in Russia, but it cannot be sold quickly.

The problem is that a lot of the foreign reserves, Euros and U.S. Dollars are held in or owed by Western Banks. Those are now frozen and cannot be used to buy Rubles and prop up its value.

Very effective short term, but the long term effect will be that both Russia and China will try to switch to the Chinese Renminbi and away from Euros/Dollars. Von C's rule 1: In all things B very strong"; meets "dinero es la sinews of guerra"! That said, Russian invasion vehicles are running out of gas...:oops:as Moscow turns to cryto-currency...and starts trying to buy gold...:doh:

[Jeff-Groves]

I am SO gonna love it when they go on TV at some point.
Soviet Ship. Go ******* yourself!
THAT has to rate right up there with "Nuts!"

[Jimbuna]

I am SO gonna love it when they go on TV at some point.
Soviet Ship. Go ******* yourself!
THAT has to rate right up there with "Nuts!"

WARNING: ADULT CONTENT

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Y2iVHUMZhg

[mapuc]

Just a handful at present but if this is replicated across other countries the numbers could soon become more significant.

It's not only Ukrainian from Europe who want to take the trip home, so they can defend their country Even other European are interested.

The Ukrainian defence minister said that they would create a brigrade of foreigners who take part in the war.

Markus

[Jeff-Groves]

Battle of the Bulge. (https://www.warhistoryonline.com/guest-bloggers/nuts-to-surrender.html?chrome=1)

American Declares Independence in 1776.
Facing the GREATEST Military Power in the World at that time?
The people (Sorry Jim) whooped British arse!
The Brits tried it again in the War of 1812 and AGAIN got sent home.
AGAIN the Greatest Military Power in the World at that time!

To be the Greatest does not mean you win.
Japan had no serious plans to invade the USA. They knew they would never pull it off!
Germany tried to get Mexico on board to attack us. Refusing to do that is probably why Texas doesn't extend to Panama.

[Armistead]

Yer a day late and a surmise short!:03: We'll know for sure when China moves on Taiwan...in a carefully crafted two-front assault on the so-called World Order.That actually began with the unopposed takeover of Tibet in the '50's. It's a repeat of 1939; with a Sino-Soviet Axis against increasingly resolute Allies all over again. Everybody's got nukes:yeah:...let's play and get this over with once and for all. At least a nuclear winter will resolve the global warming problem-if not the Covid Pandemic!?? :arrgh!:

I know China has a war games training going on or coming up, but it doesn't seem to have the components to invade. I assume we would know where China would be building invasion forces up, so where is this? I've been too worried about Putin pushing buttons and getting my early crops in to study the China issue. Ole Bear even helping me dig a deeper hole with my old John Deere. I do have a bunker actually but it's full of all my wife's junk and I'd rather get nuked than have to clean it out. I wonder when the nukes fly if she will finally admit she was wrong to use it as a junk she shed. Be nice to at least be told I was right once before I'm vaporized.

[Jeff-Groves]

The Ukrainian defence minister said that they would create a brigrade of foreigners who take part in the war.


Let me know when they start a Cyber Attack Force!
:03:

[mapuc]

I hear a lot of thunder in my latest yt video I posted one page back.

Markus

[Catfish]

Let me know when they start a Cyber Attack Force!:03:
Thought you already did something :D
https://www.thedailybeast.com/tass-site-hacked-with-putin-makes-us-lie-message
Tried TASS this morning and site was down, but this message did not appear yet, at the time.

[Jeff-Groves]

If I gave information?
The FBI or Home Land would be knocking on my door!
THAT would just complicate things better left alone.
:haha:

[mapuc]

Putin and nukes.

Throughout the day I've been thinking on a scene from a documentary called WW3 (it's available on yt)

Soviet is under heavy pressure-NATO has taken most of Poland, Romania and other vasal states.

In an effort to get NATO to leave, Soviet send a 50 kiloton nuke into the sea about 50 nm from the English coast

Could Putin be thinking the same-Send a nuke away and let it explode in a non-populated area ? Example in the middle of the Atlantic ?

Another thing.
Putin has threaten Denmark and Sweden, after they decided to provide Ukraine with weapons.

Markus

[Catfish]

At all. Such souls - immediately in Hell!!!
Yes. "Putin's war criminals will go straight to hell, no purgatory."
U.N. Ambassador Sergiy Kyslytsya said as he addressed russian Vassily Nebenzia, during an emergency meeting held by the U.N. Security Council.
You have been brainwashed for decades by your state-controlled media. Look into the mirror and THINK.

[Jeff-Groves]

Any launch with a Nuke explosion would be the Start of a Nuclear War.

[Catfish]

Putin and nukes. [...]
Send a 50 kiloton nuke into the sea about 50 nm from the English coast
Could Putin be thinking the same-Send a nuke away and let it explode in a non-populated area ? Example in the middle of the Atlantic ?
What for? Everyone knows what nukes are capable of. The second a nuclear missile is being sent anywhere out of Putinland there will be an instant response, no one will wait until impact.
Another thing. Putin has threaten Denmark and Sweden, after they decided to provide Ukraine with weapons. Markus
Lots of threatening lately, so Putin wants to nuke the rest of the world because they do not like his bullying?

[mapuc]

Any launch with a Nuke explosion would be the Start of a Nuclear War.

Which is also does in this documentary WW3.

Tried to find this video-It's very old more than 10 years since I saw it first time. It has also been shown on Danish tv.

Markus

[Jeff-Groves]

Here's the thing about Nuclear War.
Only the Elite go in the bunkers. So who exactly is going to be left to rebuild?
The Elite couldn't even wire a freaking light!
There would be some survivors and guess who and WHAT THEY are gonna be looking for?
And what do you think would happen to the Bunker Dwellers when (NOT IF) found?

I can tell you what I'd do to Bunker Dwellers! Kill everyone of them and take what I want.

[Rockstar]

These sanctions are going to really hurt Russia no doubt about it. But keep in mind Swift is only a communications system that allows central banks to transfer currencies.

By cutting Russia off you are you preventing Russia from making payments to people in your country who rely on those payments to stay in business. Listening to Putin’s speech I’m assuming he’s financially prepared for this. Good luck everyone it’s been good knowin’ ya’s. :salute::wah::har:

[Jeff-Groves]

I'm just waiting to see mass panic in the USA over this Nuke stuff.

[mapuc]

EU and/or NATO will get involved in this war-First we send medical stuff and now we send defensive weapon and soon fighter jets will be shipped to Ukraine..As I see it, it will not be a question on if but when the first boots land on Ukraine soil.

(Hope I'm wrong)

Markus

[Jeff-Groves]

Boots are on the ground. Just Russian boots right now!
Not saying Special Forces MAY already be there, but I'd bet there are!
I really don't think We'd not have them in place at such a time.
That is there job after all. Infiltrate enemy areas and report ACTUAL Enemy tactical information.

Do you honestly believe any Country would depend on Twitter or FaceBook for information?

I take it you have NO Military back ground.

[Rockstar]

I'm just waiting to see mass panic in the USA over this Nuke stuff.

I don’t know anything about SWIFT but I know about guns and bullets, so I’m good with nukes, I live very near a strategic target, for me it’s just a bright flash and it’s over. :up:

I feel like I’m being dragged down by Weasels and I don’t like it. But hey we got 90’000 of the world’s best professional soldiers armed with the latest state of the art weapon systems in the world over there. We can handle it. Like the boss said a couple of a10’s and it would be over in less time than it took them to fly to target. Putin knows that hence the nuke threat IMO.


There I go rambling again, where’s,the duct tape? ;)

[mapuc]

Boots are on the ground. Just Russian boots right now!

and foreigners.

Some Danish politicians has said following on FB.

"If there are Danes who wish to help Ukraine in fighting the Russian they are free to do so-They will not be punished if they decide to bear arms against Russia."

Another politician wrote
"If you are one of them who has decided to fight in the Ukrainian war I salute you and may God hold his hand over you."

So you see...first they send volunteers with the government approval next they send....

Markus

[Catfish]

EU and/or NATO will get involved in this war-First we send medical stuff and now we send defensive weapon and soon fighter jets will be shipped to Ukraine..As I see it, it will not be a question on if but when the first boots land on Ukraine soil. (Hope I'm wrong)
Markus
"The Bravery of Being Out of Range" of us armchair 'warriors'. Send them stuff and speeches, promises, thoughts and prayers, but not men. On the other hand I bet special forces are already there.

[mapuc]

Boots are on the ground. Just Russian boots right now!
Not saying Special Forces MAY already be there, but I'd bet there are!
I really don't think We'd not have them in place at such a time.
That is there job after all. Infiltrate enemy areas and report ACTUAL Enemy tactical information.

Do you honestly believe any Country would depend on Twitter or FaceBook for information?

I take it you have NO Military back ground.

No military background Only halfway educated Radar operator in the Swedish navy.

And I do NOT trust what people write on FB or Twitter..What other believe is up to them.

Markus

[Jeff-Groves]

Like the boss said a couple of a10’s and it would be over in less time than it took them to fly to target.

Funny no one wanted that A-10. Or did the USA refuse to sell them?
I saw the A-10 when it came into Service! You damned near can't shoot that thing down!
It's fire power has to be seen to believe!

[mapuc]

Don't be afraid Putin is only threating about his nukes
He will not press the button-so say those Expert I have been reading about the last few days.

(No I do not believe what they say-Yes they know more than I do, but I will not take it easy before Putin is gone and a new government has taken seat in Moscow)

Markus

[Skybird]

Turkey finally closes the Dardanelles forRussioan warships.

What if the Russians test it?

The EU wants to connect the Ukraine to the European powergrid. I can understand the pltlical idea, but I wonde rif that is a good idea for the rest of Europe. I have come to HATE interconnected computer and energy grids. One problem fed into it in pone place and it sporeads to the whole network. See what Russian cyberattacks have done in 2014.

HitlPutin insits on the demilitarization of the Ukraine. He aolso got a letter from severla of the koghty oligarchs in Russia who toeld him reltively frankly that they think the war is stupid and that he should end it. That is a real news. Is there a precedence for this? I dont think so. Putin learned one thing from that letter: that there now is a real risk that invisible men will ally and conspire to kick him out before they loose everything due to him.



I see a chance that it now maybe has started to become about Putin's mere physical survival. Who knows.

[Skybird]

Funny no one wanted that A-10. Or did the USA refuse to sell them?
I saw the A-10 when it came into Service! You damned near can't shoot that thing down!
It's fire power has to be seen to believe!
As a student I once saw two of them flying by when I was walking in a forest, and on a hillcrest, and stood on watch tower there. Its an sinastallaiton for military communications,a nd also very very near the installations of VOR-OSN. The two planes passed me almost at the height of my face (I wa son a tower standing on the hill peak) and so close that I could have reached them with a powerful stonethrow. I could clearly see the pilots head and helmet, and his head movement and hand raised to the side of his helmet, I do not know if it was waving at me, or the hand movement was just coincidence, but what then happened was no coincidence,ebut intention: the best was, beside that SOUND! , that I waved at them when they approached. And when they passed me, the lead plane waved back with its wings "nodding" three, four times, like in a movie!

He had seen me, and he greeted back that way. For the rest of the day (mind you, I was not even mid 20, and still watched movies like Top Gun), I was on 110% energy state, completely hyperbolic. It was incrdible.

I swear its true, it happend like I described, even if it may sound unbelievable. It was incredibly low, incredibly close, and he shook his wings at me, and he was at the height my face was. I have never forgotten that experience, never.
Anmd it s also true what they say, that you never forget the sound of these engines. They are unmistakable.

[Skybird]

Switzerland has joined in full the EU sanctions against Russian banks including the Russian central bank. They hesitated long.

German TV said - to my very big surprise - the Russian central bank has enormous foreign currency reserves (okay, that I knew) - but they stored 50-60% of these in foreign nations and bank deposits. Well, how stupid is that, if I may ask? :haha: You build reserves worth 500-600 billion to become independent from banking and financial sanctions like these - and then you leave them scattered around in reach of the enemy striking at them thsi easily...?? Stunning!

That means they have lost in one day 50-60% of their currency reserves.

And the ruble turns more and more into rubble.


He may also find it difficult to sell his gold reserves.

[Red Devil]

I'm worried. Read Nostradamus on Paris in the 21st C. "Paris will be destroyed by birds from the east'.

At first I thought Soviets, then when we thought they had gone, migrants, now its Putin.

I personally think that if Putin says fire the missiles, he will be killed. Its not a good time to be living .....

[mapuc]

Turkey finally closes the Dardanelles for Russian warships.

What if the Russians test it?



Edit
Found it myself

NATO member Turkey changed its rhetoric to call Russia's assault on Ukraine a "war" on Sunday and pledged to implement parts of an international pact that would potentially limit the transit of Russian warships from the Mediterranean to the Black Sea.

https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/turkey-implement-international-pact-access-shipping-straits-due-ukraine-war-2022-02-27/

End edit

Markus

[Andreas86]

Just read that Bulgaria, Poland and Slovakia will hand over 70 MiG-29 and Su-25 jets to Ukraine. Lovely!

[Skybird]

I'm worried. Read Nostradamus on Paris in the 21st C. "Paris will be destroyed by birds from the east'.

At first I thought Soviets, then when we thought they had gone, migrants, now its Putin.

I personally think that if Putin says fire the missiles, he will be killed. Its not a good time to be living .....
Paris indeed has a huge population of exotic birds and migratory birds in its huge city parks, I saw a - wonderful - nature documentary about them some years ago. They sit and sh1t everywhere, so Nostradamus' fear is somewhat justified.

[Dowly]

53% are in favor of joining NATO in Finland, according to a new poll released today. In the past majority of Finns have been against joining.

Nice one, Putler. :haha:


I say let's do it. It's not like we've been neutral in a long time any more, and now we're sending weapons to Ukraine to kill Russians. :hmmm:

[Jeff-Groves]

Read Nostradamus on Paris in the 21st C. "Paris will be destroyed by birds from the east".
You have got to be kidding me!
Nostradamus?
That stuff has been disproved for so LONG!
You may as well kill a chicken and read it's blood for future events!
See how far that works.

I think there is a conspiracy or whacko thread here at SubSim.

[Skybird]

Hungary says it will not let weapons deliveries for the Ukraine pass.


Well done, Victor, this one will break you your neck. You should have read the signs of the times.

[Skybird]

53% are in favor of joining NATO in Finland, according to a new poll released today. In the past majority of Finns have been against joining.

Nice one, Putler. :haha:


I say let's do it. It's not like we've been neutral in a long time any more, and now we're sending weapons to Ukraine to kill Russians. :hmmm:
Dowly, is it true what some days ago an analyst of the Bundeswehr said, that your milita reserve system in Finland allows you to increase the number of your standing army troops by a factorof TWENTY...? I know you have this system, I did not know about the factor.

The guy also said that you have stored, like POMCUS, full mechanised forces equipment for all these twenyt times more troops if you call them to duty, that they are not reservists of second class with nothing but rifles, but that they all have their place and seat in mechanised forces, tanks, IFVs, and full weaponry for infantrists.


Is all that true? If so, its extremely squirrelsome!!

[Kapitan]

Notwithstanding the prohibition of passage laid down in paragraph 2 above, vessels of war belonging
to belligerent Powers, whether they are Black Sea Powers or not, which have become separated from
their bases, may return thereto

In time of war, Turkey not being belligerent, warships shall enjoy complete freedom of transit and
navigation through the Straits under the same conditions as those laid down in Articles 10 to 18


Noting that many Russian ships that are currently operating in the Med and stationed at Tartarus officially and legally have their home ports in the Black sea namely Novorossiysk and Sevastopol

From the Montreux treaty this is the only one where I think Russia could actually claim we have acted against international law in principle.

But if Turkey can get a resolution passed in the UN to forgo this segment of the treaty then we could be onto something, then if Russia does force the issue using force Turkey may be able to invoke article 5 and that wont bode well for all the other members I don't think.

That said the following Article 20 and 21 should be relevant in Turkeys case and IMHO should be applied

Article 20

In time of war, Turkey being belligerent, the provisions of Articles 10 to 18 shall not be applicable; the
passage of warships shall be left entire y to the discretion of the Turkish Government.

Article 21
Should Turkey consider herself to be threatened with imminent danger of war she shall have the right to apply the provisions of Article 20 of the present Convention.

Vessels which have passed through the Straits before Turkey has made use of the powers conferred upon her by the preceding paragraph, and which thus find themselves separated from their bases, may return thereto.

It is, however, understood that Turkey may deny this right to vessels of war belonging to the State whose attitude has given rise to the application of the present Article.

Should the Turkish Government make use of the powers conferred by the first paragraph of the present Article, a notification to that effect shall be addressed to the High Contracting Parties and to the Secretary-General of the League of Nations.

If the Council of the League of Nations decide by a majority of two-thirds that the measures thus taken by Turkey are not justified, and if such should also be the opinion of the majority of the High Contracting Parties signatories to the present Convention, the Turkish Government undertakes to discontinue the measures in question as also any measures which may have been taken under Article 6 of the present Convention.

This is why I said Turkey should seek a UN resolution before closing the straight, it would give them a unobscured and undisputed position plus guarantee protection under Article 5 and also give Russia no movement what so ever on the matter.

Note: the Montreux treaty was signed in 1936 by the Soviet union and defaulted to the Russian Federation 26 December 1991

Also Note the Montreux treaty was also adopted by the UN in 1952 as is, it has been amended by remains in force.

[Aktungbby]

Funny no one wanted that A-10. Or did the USA refuse to sell them?
I saw the A-10 when it came into Service! You damned near can't shoot that thing down!
It's fire power has to be seen to believe!one might think they'd avoided such transactions...like warts on a hog!!?? And not w/o just cause. Spreading depleted-uranium tipped gatling ammo around now-captured Chernobyl reactor in an afflicted prospective NATO member is critical consideration. :smug: https://www.jstor.org/stable/4410258 DU penetrators may miss the target, hit a ‘soft’ target or
hit a ‘hard’ target. Those striking a soft target (eg a lorry,
or lightly armoured vehicle) may well pass straight
The Royal Society The health hazards of depleted uranium munitions | May 2001 | 3
through. The effect of hitting a hard target (such as the
heavy armour of a battle tank or perhaps a large rock) is
to disperse a substantial amount of the DU penetrator in
the form of an aerosol of the metal and its combustion
products (uranium oxides). Some of this dust may be
inhaled or ingested by any surviving combatants within
the struck vehicle, or by those who enter the vehicle to
rescue any survivors. DU may also be inhaled or ingested
when materials deposited in a struck vehicle are
resuspended by soldiers or civilians entering the vehicle
at a later time. Lower levels of exposure will occur at a
distance owing to the spread of DU-containing aerosols.
The consequences for health of inhaling small particles
of this weakly radioactive metal are a major focus of this
report. However, uranium is also a toxic metal that has
been particularly associated with effects on the kidney.
The levels of uranium that might occur in the kidney
after inhalation or ingestion are estimated and their
possible effects on health examined in our second
report.
A further important potential hazard arises on the
battlefield when fragments of a DU penetrator that has
impacted or pierced a tank cause shrapnel wounds.
Small pieces of shrapnel embedded deep within tissues
can be difficult or hazardous to remove and a cohort of
US soldiers are being studied who have embedded DU
fragments resulting from ‘friendly fire’ incidents in the
Gulf War (annexe B). The radiation from these
embedded fragments, and the uranium released by
their slow dissolution, results in potential radiological
and chemical hazards.
https://royalsociety.org/~/media/royal_society_content/policy/publications/2001/10023.pdf Bottom LINE: Let Vlad the Bastard go on nuclear alert; Ukranian molotov coctals are working just fine... https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x7t86r

[Platapus]

https://www.cnn.com/2022/02/28/europe/gallery/ukraine-girl-killed/index.html


Warning, graphic images

[mapuc]

@ Kapitan
When I read Skybirds comment about Turkey closing the Dardanelle I came to think of what you wrote in this thread.

https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=252006

It's a lot of reading and I must admit I didn't get half of it. To much Jura.

Edit
You have posted a part of this ^^ as a response in this thread
End edit

Markus

[Kapitan]

@ Kapitan
When I read Skybirds comment about Turkey closing the Dardanelle I came to think of what you wrote in this thread.

https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=252006

It's a lot of reading and I must admit I didn't get half of it. To much Jura.

Markus

You couldn't stand a few minuets of reading it :D I had to do a few weeks of dealing with it :haha:

Basically there is a big clause in the treaty that permits Russian warships to transit to their base even when the straight is closed, basically what its saying is Turkey cannot stop them.

Hence why I said to back up the invoking of the article 20 & 21 Turkey should seek UN resolution.

[Skybird]

Kapitan has a much deeper knowledge on that treaty than the media writers or me, obviously. I was naive to assume it would be a simpel thing. :doh:


Drop some mines, tell nobody, and go to sleep, be done.

:O:

[Onkel Neal]

Kapitan has a much deeper knowledge on that treaty than the media writers or me, obviously. I was naive to assume it would be a simpel thing. :doh:


Drop some mines, tell nobody, and go to sleep, be done.

:O:

:Kaleun_Applaud:

[Skybird]

Ukraine accuses Russia to have used a Geneva-convention-banned thermobaric bomb. CNN spotted such a system near Belgorod earlier.

And now its probably getting grim and gruesome for Kyiv. A 17 miles long convoy of armour is approaching the city. That are 27km.

I think this war will not end as long as Putin does not end. Somebody in Russia must take him out.

More oligarchs called on him to stop some hours ago.

[mapuc]

Ukraine accuses Russia to have used a Geneva-convention-banned thermobaric bomb. CNN spotted such a system near Belgorod earlier.

And now its probably getting grim and gruesome for Kyiv. A 17 miles long convoy of armour is approaching the city. That are 27km.

I think this war will not end as long as Putin does not end. Somebody in Russia must take him out.

More oligarchs called on him to stop some hours ago.

If Putin gave order to use these thermobaric bombs then you may ask yourself if he would hesitate in using nukes.

Markus

[stork100]

Just read that Bulgaria, Poland and Slovakia will hand over 70 MiG-29 and Su-25 jets to Ukraine. Lovely!

I don't doubt this claim as I've seen it previously myself, but I do think there are certain practicalities to consider that could make it unfeasible.

1. These aircraft are one of the most important military defence assets of those aforementioned countries. Would they really just give these away when potentially they may soon be required for the defence of their own nations in the coming future? I wouldn't be happy if my government gave away our primary defences to another country.

2. Propaganda from both sides makes it difficult to interpret the strategic situation regarding Ukrainian airspace. It is known however that the military airports were primary targets of the opening strikes. The Russians claim to have destroyed 34 aircraft on the ground. Could be a lie but it's also quite believable. According to Wikipedia, if you can believe that, the main combat aircraft inventory of the Ukrainian Air Force prior to the attacks looked like this:

MiG-29: 37 (8 are used for conversion training)
Sukhoi Su-24: 12
Sukhoi Su-25: 17
Sukhoi Su-27: 32 (6 are used for conversion training)

Of the fighter types, even not taking losses into consideration, it's difficult to comprehend the Russians not possessing air superiority at this time - or the ability to acquire it in the future. If so, then ferrying them into Ukraine and safeguarding them on the ground could prove extremely difficult. Either that, or they would conduct operations from bases within other countries, which of course brings about the threat of further expansion of the conflict.

3. It's possible that these new aircraft may have differences in the avionics and weapon systems than what the Ukrainian pilots are used to. Competency in these systems makes up for a significant proportion of a modern fighter pilot's workload. This may require extensive operational conversion training.

These may turn out to be all non-issues, but to me it sounds like the sort of thing politicians would dream up in the heat of the moment without conducting proper research. Looks great on paper, reality could be a different story.

[Rockstar]

Not the dreaded thermobaric bombs (napalm)! Oh dear lawdy baby Jesus.

As nasty as it can be Ukrainians should know “Charlie don’t surf” so drop the f’in hammer and take the f’in beach because it belongs to you!

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_jKzgD4pKhNk/TG3hFxwVZ1I/AAAAAAAACWQ/e8vKrI6OJ4E/s1600/charlie+dont+surf.bmp

[Skybird]

The earlier report of an armoured column 27km long has been corrected.



Its 64km long. :o

[Rockstar]

Funny no one wanted that A-10. Or did the USA refuse to sell them?
I saw the A-10 when it came into Service! You damned near can't shoot that thing down!
It's fire power has to be seen to believe!

The fire power of the A10 is also known as the “hand of god” it will pretty much open up anything like a can of sardines. F’ Europe and their wars I swear to god the more I think about it the U.S., France, Poland , Ukraine and U.K. should just level the place and Russia and all the back stabbing Weasels, wind bags, bandwagon fanbois and taking heads who rush to talk in an educated manner about things they know nothing about and just start anew.

[em2nought]

I think this war will not end as long as Putin does not end. Somebody in Russia must take him out.


Send them some Dominion voting machines. :D

[Onkel Neal]

The earlier report of an armoured column 27km long has been corrected.



Its 64km long. :o

And you have to think that the Ukraine military had to know years in advance this would be happening. I mean, the Russians are sitting ducks parked on a highway. If the Ukrainians had prepared for this by hiding away aircraft, they could deal out some serious pain. Even with the Russian air support, this would be the time to strike.

[Anvar1061]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0QpcA0Tx3X0

[Reece]

And you have to think that the Ukraine military had to know years in advance this would be happening. I mean, the Russians are sitting ducks parked on a highway. If the Ukrainians had prepared for this by hiding away aircraft, they could deal out some serious pain. Even with the Russian air support, this would be the time to strike.
I was wondering the same thing!!! Seems it would be easy just to start at one end bombing and launching missiles as you go, by the end of the run should be all over!! Naturally some casualties but good grief!! Where are they??? :k_confused:

@ Anvar1061, can't play the video on my machine!

[Aktungbby]

He's already discovered that! As I've stated earlier in this thread We need to be at DEFCON two and remove our useless ambaßador from Moscow...and find another SEC of State that ain't Blinkin', :Kaleun_Wink:n' or :Kaleun_Sleep:n'. Moreover on 60 Minutes this weekend past, the President of Ukraine admitted that Ukraine's giving up its third largest nuclear arsenal was a mistake...I wonder what remaining plums: Lithuania, Estonia, and Latvia are contemplating at this juncture:ping::ping::ping: :hmmm: Our best hope is that Mr Putin, Age 69, dies...shortly w/o a legacy! :doh:

I think this war will not end as long as Putin does not end. Somebody in Russia must take him out.My god! SkyBBY reads my posts...and agrees with me!:yeah::O: I can't wait to see what criminal charges will be initiated by the war crimes tribunal of the Hague...:hmmm::ping::ping::ping:; especially with precedents the Russians participated in at Nuremburg in 1945!:oops::/\\chop Bottom Line: we lift the evertightening sanctions after the ever greedy oligarchs turn Vlad the Bastard over to authorities of the International Criminal Court for the crime of aggression & related war crimes.; no options.

[Dowly]

Dowly, is it true what some days ago an analyst of the Bundeswehr said, that your milita reserve system in Finland allows you to increase the number of your standing army troops by a factorof TWENTY...? I know you have this system, I did not know about the factor.
Finland's combat reserves are around 280 000 soldiers, but that can increase to just shy of million soldiers, if really needed by activating everyone who've gone through conscription and aren't too old.


The guy also said that you have stored, like POMCUS, full mechanised forces equipment for all these twenyt times more troops if you call them to duty, that they are not reservists of second class with nothing but rifles, but that they all have their place and seat in mechanised forces, tanks, IFVs, and full weaponry for infantrists.

That I've no idea about. Definitely not enough material for the full 1mil reserves to be outfitted with modern equipment. Finland have stockpiled a lot of old infantry weapons for this purpose. Heck, you might even have some soldiers running around with a Suomi KP/31 in that situation. :haha:

[Catfish]

[...] Drop some mines, tell nobody, and go to sleep, be done. :O:
re Dardanelles, strange, this was my first idea yesterday :03:

[Catfish]

The earlier report of an armoured column 27km long has been corrected. Its 64km long. :o
https://www.bbc.com/news/live/world-europe-60542877
2-3 Warthogs and they are toast.

re Aktung yes i know, I was one of the first to protest against the use of DU-projectiles in former Yugoslavia and the middle east, and was almost banned at this other forum for being so unamerican :haha:

But really, they are as vulnerable now as Hitler's columns heading for France and being stuck back then..
Putin does not have air superiority. Ukraine should strike NOW, where are they? What about drones?

[Catfish]

[...] @ Anvar1061, can't play the video on my machine!You did not miss much, seems it is a propaganda video.
They say it was not Putin who shelled Akhtyrka. I take it is not Putin trying to invade Ukraine but .. aliens :03:.

[Catfish]

'A new Europe' united against Russia — even neutral Switzerland

Germany, Switzerland and Sweden set aside historic nonaggression policies to join a united European front against Russia's invasion of Ukraine.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/national-security/-new-europe-united-russia-even-neutral-switzerland-rcna18028

[Catfish]

https://www.nbcnews.com/investigations/frustrated-putin-may-order-escalation-violence-ukraine-us-officials-sa-rcna18026

Not nice. But sit there and do nothing while Putin taking Ukraine, Poland and the baltic states?

Very sorry Mr. Putin but the rest of the world will not play this game. So Putin escalates the situation because he is so frustrated, and threatens the world with a nuclear strike?
High time to stop him, by whatever means.

[Anvar1061]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1vdiEABLFoo

[Anvar1061]

@ Anvar1061, can't play the video on my machine!You did not miss much, seems it is a propaganda video.
They say it was not Putin who shelled Akhtyrka. I take it is not Putin trying to invade Ukraine but .. aliens :03:.

https://sun9-79.userapi.com/impg/9FCf7yKgfWk_DqBsGwDkQufK4_vIciAwMUcSXg/cJaO5Zs7sq0.jpg?size=500x322&quality=96&sign=50634ed4d6288473c755c8e2f4a14a32&type=album

[Catfish]

^ ?

^^ What Putin wants is probably not what most of russians want. And it is obviously not what a free and independent Ukraine wants.
Nothing of this justifies this invasion, there are russians shooting at russians for aggressor Putin's ego to make Russia great again in the borders of 1989.

[Skybird]

https://www.nbcnews.com/investigations/frustrated-putin-may-order-escalation-violence-ukraine-us-officials-sa-rcna18026

Not nice. But sit there and do nothing while Putin taking Ukraine, Poland and the baltic states?

Very sorry Mr. Putin but the rest of the world will not play this game. So Putin escalates the situation because he is so frustrated, and threatens the world with a nuclear strike?
High time to stop him, by whatever means.
Thats a good assessment from them, and I see it like them, too. Putin has chsnged, became erratic, and from tbe consequences of these errors errs even more. I too fear the ugliest part of the war is still ahead. He is an isolated rabied dog now, more dangerous than ever. The murderously cool mastercalculator is gone, is no more.

[Anvar1061]

The US has spent $5 billion supporting regime change in Ukraine. Neo-fascists played a key role in the February 2014 coup. With their help, the US State Department and the Pentagon hoped to replace the legitimate president with someone who would push Ukraine to join NATO. But the key task of the operation in Ukraine was the eviction of the Black Sea Fleet from the military bases of the Crimea, which have existed for more than 230 years.

https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2014/mar/19/facebook-posts/united-states-spent-5-billion-ukraine-anti-governm/

[Skybird]

https://www.bbc.com/news/live/world-europe-60542877
2-3 Warthogs and they are toast.

re Aktung yes i know, I was one of the first to protest against the use of DU-projectiles in former Yugoslavia and the middle east, and was almost banned at this other forum for being so unamerican :haha:

But really, they are as vulnerable now as Hitler's columns heading for France and being stuck back then..
Putin does not have air superiority. Ukraine should strike NOW, where are they? What about drones?
They kknow they are there, if they dont strike them, then probably they cant. No more missile ammo, no artillery in reach, no local air dominance - the reason could be many.

[Anvar1061]

— the grouping of the RF Armed Forces will continue to conduct a special military operation until the set goals are achieved;

- the main task is to protect Russia from the military threat posed by Western countries;

- Western countries are trying to use the Ukrainian people in the fight against Russia;

- the Russian army does not occupy Ukrainian territory, but takes all measures to preserve the lives and safety of civilians;

- strikes are carried out only on military targets and exclusively with high-precision weapons;

- the Ukrainian side uses civilians as a human shield, also uses multiple launch rocket systems, large-caliber weapons and mortars;

- The Ukrainian army is stationed in the courtyards of residential buildings, near schools and kindergartens.

(Minister of Defense Sergey Shoigu)

[Dowly]

^
Imagine being so deprived of your ability to form an independent thought that you actually believe this BS.

[Catfish]

The US has spent $5 billion supporting regime change in Ukraine. Neo-fascists played a key role in the February 2014 coup. With their help, the US State Department and the Pentagon hoped to replace the legitimate president with someone who would push Ukraine to join NATO. But the key task of the operation in Ukraine was the eviction of the Black Sea Fleet from the military bases of the Crimea, which have existed for more than 230 years.
https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2014/mar/19/facebook-posts/united-states-spent-5-billion-ukraine-anti-governm/

Did you read the article you linked to? Please do.
I quote:

"Our ruling
Contrary to claims, the United States did not spend $5 billion to incite the rebellion in Ukraine.

That’s a distorted understanding of remarks given by a State Department official. She was referring to money spent on democracy-building programs in Ukraine since it broke off from the Soviet Union in 1991.

We rate the claim Pants on Fire."

[Anvar1061]

They say it was not Putin who shelled Akhtyrka.

Do you know where Akhtyrka is on the map? How do you know what was in that military unit that was razed to the ground? You don't need to know this. This is still about the naval base in Ochakovo, which the US military was building, you they (fakenews) did not tell.

[Anvar1061]

Did you read the article you linked to?

This is a lie and an attempt to get out, referring to the wrong translation.

[Catfish]

I am not really sure that you believe this "defense minister" Sergej Shoigu?
Maybe he should better work in his role as president of the firefighters and rescue, instead of doing military attacks?

Or maybe you just quote this to openly show us how crazy some of Putin's claims are? :hmmm:
— the grouping of the RF Armed Forces will continue to conduct a special military operation until the set goals are achieved;
The "Special operation" is an invasion against an independent country, not an answer to a call for help. This is vile-smelling propaganda, but it is even more ridiculous.
- the main task is to protect Russia from the military threat posed by Western countries;How exactly do "Western countries" militarily threaten Russia? NATO is a defense pact, and as Putin exactly knows it is not especially well funded.
- Western countries are trying to use the Ukrainian people in the fight against Russia;No, you are being instrumentalised, do not believe your state-controlled hate spurts. The internet is free to inform yourself, everywhere.
- the Russian army does not occupy Ukrainian territory, but takes all measures to preserve the lives and safety of civilians;Yes we saw how they "PRESERVE" civilians. I would place a hundred laughing smilies here if it were not so atrocious.
- strikes are carried out only on military targets and exclusively with high-precision weapons;Who told you that, do yo have eyes to read and look at real evidence?
- the Ukrainian side uses civilians as a human shield, also uses multiple launch rocket systems, large-caliber weapons and mortars;Civilians as human shields? Why does Russia target civilian buildings in the middle of cities indiscriminatel killing civilians and children to terrorise the still russian population?
Regarding russian Ukrainians using mortars and large calibre weapons against an invasion, I HOPE SO.
-The Ukrainian army is stationed in the courtyards of residential buildings, near schools and kindergartens.Of course, they do this to get as most civilians killed as possible and blame it on Putin? lmao.
An aggressive army attacks a country, where the f. do you think shall civilians be? All leave the country? Putin's troops are not indiscriminately targeting civilians, they do this on purpose. It is in the attack papers to strike fear in the Ukrainians hearts.
Quite a demented plan, but done again and again, in false flag operations and wars.

[Catfish]

This is a lie and an attempt to get out, referring to the wrong translation.
The Link you quoted, quite simple:
https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2014/mar/19/facebook-posts/united-states-spent-5-billion-ukraine-anti-governm/


Did you mean the klingon translation.

[Skybird]

You are dealing with a Putin's creature, Cat, dont waste your breath. He is under a spell. You won't get through. Our forefathers in Germany 80 years ago, and today the believers of Trump the messiah were pretzty much the same.

We can only consider ourselves lucky that Trump is not at the helm in this. We might have ended up putting a blind eye on the Russian rape of the Ukraine. Trump does not oppose Putin. He admires him and wants to be like him. Too many bad unpatriotic treacherous little Americans did not let him. How could they dare...?! :O:

If Trumpo still were there during this war, I would have no more sleep currently.

In the 23 years I am in this forum, I have posted this text several times already, first my own translations of it, then better English translations I then found on the web, and now this video. One cannot post it often enough, though, it is so very very true, which is sad. The author paid with his life for thinking these thoughts, and other thoughts like that before. It was rue in the past, and is true in the present, its true in the West, in the Centre, in the East, in politics and in religion.
Its the biggest foe of mankind and might one day become the reason for man going extinct. Its a neverending well for ever new atriocties, cruelties and barbarism, all committed in the name of the "good" and the "right". Nationalism and fascism are just two of the many masks it wears.
Never shall stupids be forgiven - or not being taken care of. Never turn your back towards them.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ww47bR86wSc

[Jimbuna]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gDu9kVy17Vw

[Skybird]

They start to turn the Ukraine into a Little Chechnya.


Lets hope Kyiv, Kharkiv and other cities do not become Grozny. But that hope is unfounded, I fear.


And still no sign of a revolt in the inner circle against Putin. Shows what poor but murderous scum they all are, not just Putin.

[Red Devil]

If I'm to be totally honest here I admit I'm getting a little concerned he won't choose the nuclear option.

I went to bed thinking will I wake in the morning. I gave my wife a big kiss and tried to go to sleep. bad night.

[Jimbuna]

I went to bed thinking will I wake in the morning. I gave my wife a big kiss and tried to go to sleep. bad night.

If Vladolf Putrid gives the order to their use it'll probably be low yield tacticals or at least that's what I'm hoping.

[Jimbuna]

Freedom Square in central Kharkiv, Ukraine's second city, has been hit by a Russian strike, causing a huge explosion.

A missile hit the regional government's headquarters in the city near the Russian border.

President Zelensky of Ukraine receives a standing ovation in the European Parliament, telling them by video link: "Nobody will break us"

UK PM Boris Johnson accuses Russia of "barbaric and indiscriminate" attacks.

Kharkiv, a city of 1.4m, is known as Ukraine's tech capital and residential areas have been hit too.

Elsewhere, a huge convoy of Russian armoured vehicles is advancing on Ukraine's capital Kyiv.

In the north-eastern city of Okhtyrka, up to 70 Ukrainian soldiers have been killed in a Russian artillery strike.

[Jimbuna]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OpvoLjibmqw

[Red Devil]

Battle of the Bulge. (https://www.warhistoryonline.com/guest-bloggers/nuts-to-surrender.html?chrome=1)

American Declares Independence in 1776.
Facing the GREATEST Military Power in the World at that time?
The people (Sorry Jim) whooped British arse!
The Brits tried it again in the War of 1812 and AGAIN got sent home.
AGAIN the Greatest Military Power in the World at that time!

To be the Greatest does not mean you win.
Japan had no serious plans to invade the USA. They knew they would never pull it off!
Germany tried to get Mexico on board to attack us. Refusing to do that is probably why Texas doesn't extend to Panama.

The USA were inches away from defeat but something happened, cant recall what which turned the tide. Washington was about to surrender. Having those beautiful parade red coats didnt help our cause.

[Skybird]

Medwedev threatens with war if econoimic sancitons go too far for russia'S taste.


Their megalomania has abandoned any inhibition, it seems, they really think they can command and tell the worllrd what it should do.



These murdeorus thugs are sick at mind, and rotten at heart. And has it ever been any different with Russia's leaderships? For centuries they have been a notorious source of brutal regimes and tyranny against their own people, aggression against other people, have seen feudal elites - including the ones of today - abusing the people for their own wealth, projected terror and war beyond their borders as well as onto their own "subjects", committed organised tferror in Gulags and deathc amps and agricutlural expeiments that costes milliosn their lives and resettlements that again costed hunbdred saof thousands of lives and ripped apart cultural and ethnic contexts that belonged together: especially in the Ukraine. Its also not the first time they bring mass murder and genocides and atrocities over the people living in the Ukraine, Stalin already did that back then, scoring millions of lives. And endlessly in circles the Russian terror goes , on and on and on, since centuries. Always the same sh1t, again and again, endlessly, it seems. They got stuck, and already a very long time ago.



Like Germany, Russia also offers a rich cultural history, its composers made wonderful music, its painters painted beautiful paintings, and its writers wrote some of world's most wellknown narrations. So it is wirth German cultural history as well. But Germany has moved beyond those terrible 12 dark years back then where it exportet tyranny and terror to all of Europe. The Russians did terrorising people, especially their own and their direct neighbours, already before Hitler, since centuries, and still do it since then, until today.

That is the very big difference between us and them.



Considering how little Chinese self-understanding has changed in the past 3000 years or longer despite China having taking a nap from world history recently, but now being back, I have little hope for Russia ever being anything different than what it is today, and has been over the past couple of centuries.

[Skybird]

The Neue Zürcher Zeitung writes:


Russia is considered a pioneer of electronic warfare and is notorious for cyberattacks. However, there is not much evidence of this in the war against Ukraine. Russia's air force also seems to be holding back so far. Experts cite several reasons.

Ukraine's armed forces are holding up surprisingly well so far. Meanwhile, reports are piling up that the advance of Russian troops has been marked by strategic mishaps and, at times, bumbling mistakes. The methods of Russian warfare also appear surprisingly conventional: Putin is fighting with tanks, missiles, ground troops.

Military experts and analysts are surprised that the numerically and technologically superior Russian troops are acting in such an uncoordinated manner. It is striking that Russia is not acting in three areas as expected just a few weeks ago: Neither in terms of digital infrastructure nor in terms of cyber warfare and air combat has Putin played his trump cards.

Today, war is always waged in the virtual world. To win the battle of images and information on social networks, it would be necessary to cut off the attacked country from the Internet. To be sure, Internet connectivity in Ukraine has been severely affected at times by the Russian attacks, and was reported to have temporarily dropped below 20 percent of normal performance levels last Thursday. But Ukraine's digital infrastructure has not been a major target of the missile attacks to date.

No, says Polish military expert Konrad Muzyka. The goal of the Russian attack, he says, is to overthrow the Ukrainian leadership. It is not in Russia's interest to permanently damage Ukraine's infrastructure. Finally, he said, it is strategically important to antagonize the Ukrainian population as little as possible. The initial instructions to Russian troops were therefore not to attack civilians and to interfere with their lives as little as possible. However, Muzyka also says that the rules for the troops could change at any time or have already changed. In that case, he says, there is a threat of brutalization of the war. The shelling of the city of Kharkiv, for example, shows that Russian troops are increasingly ruthless.

Nevertheless, there is a danger for Putin in the social networks. Ukrainian President Volodimir Selensky's video messages boost Ukrainians' morale, as do videos of citizens standing in the way of Russian troops or posting instructions on military defense. "Russia has lost the PR game," Muzyka says.
The war is also taking place online, for example on Telegram. A woman warms herself at a space heater in a bomb shelter in Kiev.
The war also takes place on the web, for example on Telegram. A woman warms herself at a mushroom heater in an air raid shelter in Kiev.

However, the Ukrainians have identified not only the population in their own country and the world public as their target audience, but above all the Russian people: For example, one website documented the number of fallen Russian soldiers, which was hardly reported on in the Russian state media. Since Russia had the website blocked, the documentation has continued on a Telegram channel. The network has a high reach in Russia, with one in four residents estimated to have a Telegram account.

Putin must therefore win the digital war at home as well. To that end, Russia's information technology regulator, Roskomnadzor, decided last week to slow down Facebook's services. Along with blocking and filtering websites, this is one of the tools the Russian leadership has been using for several years to gain control over digital content. Access to Twitter has also reportedly been blocked for some Russian users, according to the group.

In the run-up to the Russian offensive, Ukrainian authorities had been bracing for the possibility that the Russians might cut off electricity or cripple the cellphone network with a large-scale cyberattack before the invasion, a senior official told NZZ. That's because Russia has demonstrated its technical prowess in this area in the past. Since the annexation of Crimea and the start of the war in the Donbass, Ukraine has seen several cyberattacks on critical infrastructure. Two attacks on the power supply were particularly spectacular.

But it didn't get that far this time. There were a number of cyberattacks the day before the invasion. Malware was used to disable the computers of companies and organizations in the financial, defense, aviation and IT sectors. But this attack did not have any noticeable impact on the electricity or cell phone networks.

One of the reasons Putin is hesitant this time around about cyberattacks on critical infrastructure, such as power and telecommunications networks or water supplies, could be their complexity. Such operations are difficult to carry out and their effects are uncertain, says Myriam Dunn Cavelty of the Center for Security Studies at ETH Zurich. "Therefore, the question is whether they are even worthwhile during an ongoing military conflict."

But it could also be because of improved protection. After the experience with the blackouts, Ukraine has, among other things, upgraded its capabilities to detect attackers in its networks as early as possible. The authorities have long been working with private IT security firms to do this. In addition, the United States and the United Kingdom are said to have sent experts to Ukraine as early as December.

However, Russia may very well have carried out targeted cyber operations, for example against the Ukrainian armed forces, which have not been known so far. Dunn Cavelty is convinced of this: "In the context of electronic warfare, there are certainly spatially limited actions to disrupt the adversary." These include, for example, jamming the GPS signal, manipulating the enemy's radar, or locating cell phone signals to obtain information about the enemy's positions. In the past, corresponding vehicles have also been spotted in the Donbass.

In another area, the Russian attack strategy also turns out to be different than previously thought: Before the Russian invasion began last Thursday, observers and experts were virtually unanimous in assuming that Russian forces would gain sovereignty over Ukrainian airspace within a very short time. The offensive started as expected: Using cruise missiles and ballistic missiles, the Russians targeted airfields, radars and air defense systems, destroying several S-300 air defense systems, among others.

The next, logical step would have been to carry out airstrikes with fighter jets, which would have finally disabled the Ukrainian air force. But this step failed to materialize. For British air force expert Justin Bronk, the Russian approach is a puzzle. "The Russians have about 300 modern, operational fighter jets in the immediate vicinity of Ukraine," he says. "And yet we've seen almost no air force sorties."

Although Russia has repeatedly affirmed that it has air sovereignty, Bronk says there is virtually nothing to indicate that this is actually the case. The British Ministry of Defense also reported Tuesday that Russia does not control Ukrainian airspace. Thus, even after several days of fighting, Ukraine is still managing to destroy Russian warplanes with Bayraktar drones and shoot down helicopters and fighter jets with surface-to-air missiles.

According to Bronk, there is no simple explanation for why the Russian Air Force has been so restrained so far. He suspects that coordination between air and ground forces is so poor that mutual firing of friendly fire cannot be ruled out. Bronk also points out that Russian fighter pilots complete only about one hundred hours of flight time per year and are thus insufficiently prepared for the complex situation in Ukrainian airspace.

In addition, the Russian Air Force has only a limited arsenal of precision munitions, says Bronk. As a result, fighter pilots have limited ability to provide air support to ground forces, he says. But the situation could change very quickly: "It's possible that the Air Force is waiting for political clearance to use unguided munitions in urban areas."

So Russia certainly has the ability to escalate the conflict further. Be that with aerial area bombardments, disinformation campaigns or attacks on digital infrastructure. But any further escalation will come with loss of life and only further incite the Ukrainian population against the Russian invaders. Vladimir Putin wanted to appear as a "liberator" in Ukraine. He will probably be remembered more as a destroyer.

Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator (http://www.DeepL.com/Translator) (free version)

https://www.nzz.ch/international/ukraine-konflikt-russland-spielt-seine-truempfe-noch-nicht-aus-ld.1672126


Lesson of it: things can turn much, much worse and uglier once the Russian attackers do not fight with one hand bound on their back anymore.The past 6 days - were the easier part of the war for the Ukrainians.

The Ukrainian government says Belarus troops have crossed the border and entered the Ukraine this morning.

Russia tries to intimidate Finland to not moving closer to NATO.

Russian separatists announce they mull attacking Mariupol in strength.

The UK blocks its harbours to ALL Russian ships, private or traders.

Russian goods dissaypöear from the shelves of German supermarkets. Contracts get cancelled.

Moscow says it will attack the uzkrainian ikntel'S informaiton networks, and told the population in the vici8nty of their builkdings to leave theri home. I think the rela big bombs and nasty things will be used here then. The strongest supportive weapon of the Ukraine is Selensky and his videos. They must get rid of that, at all cost.

Moscow mulls the ban of foreign investors accessing their investment since Russia to stop them from pulling out of Russia. I never accepted it that Western investors think they must invest into regimes like China, Iran, or Russia. Every loss they suffer now is a lecture, and I appllaude their losses. Helps them to learn, I hope.

The UK wants Russia exlcuded form the security ocuncil, which as I see it would end the existence of this pretty much corrupted and pointless gremium. Wehtehr that happens for sur,e is soemthign different.

Russia says the ukriane ha sno more access to the Asow Sea.

Gazprom has reduced its gas exports in the first two months of this year by one third. I could bite my face. How much I have underestimated this apsected of it all, gas. I made a complete idiot of myself over this, and I take the mockery. I mistook Putin'S state and ways with the contract loyalty of the Sovjet Union. That is my explanation for my failure, it cannot be an excuse. Laugh about me.

Maersk stops deliveries to Russia.

And so on and on. If there is one headline to summarise all these events, then it is this: ESCALATION.


The war of the imminent days will see less precision and more brutality and big callibres used by Russian attackers. The costs for the ukrainian people will become much higher.

[Jimbuna]

Medwedev threatens with war if econoimic sancitons go too far for russia'S taste.




I could respond to that most adequately in one short sentence but this is meant to be a 'family friendly' forum.

[Jeff-Groves]

I can imagine the Ukrainian response.
"Medwedev. Go ******* yourself!"

[mapuc]

This morning before I went to work I read on telefax(Text-tv on my tv) that Ukrainian fighter pilot could use an airbase in Poland.

Again my imagination ran away with me-Russian artillery bombard a Polish airbase because it let Ukraine use the base.

So when I came home I said I need more info and found this page-I had misunderstod it totally.

Ukrainian pilots have arrived in Poland to start the process of taking control of fighter planes they expect to be donated by European countries, a Ukrainian government official told POLITICO.

https://www.politico.com/news/2022/02/28/ukrainian-pilots-arrive-in-poland-to-pick-up-donated-fighter-jets-00012560

But they need to fly from Poland back to some airbase in Ukraine and Russia may see this as Poland taking part in the war.

Markus

[mapuc]

I can imagine the Ukrainian response.
"Medwedev. Go ******* yourself!"


Jeff regarding this Cyber warfare- Read somewhere that the Ukrainian have asked for people(hackers)who would help them fight Russia in cyber warfare.

The Ukrainian government has asked civilians to join the fight against Russia — online.

Mykhailo Fedorov, Ukraine's Minister of Digital Transformation, put out a call this weekend asking for civilians with "digital talents" to join the country's "IT army."

https://eu.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2022/02/28/ukraine-tech-army-civilians-hack-russian-websites/6975901001/

Markus

[Jeff-Groves]

My sources tell me Cyber Attacks started several days ago.
:03:

Granted many of them are waiting for the FEDs to come knocking on the doors!

[u crank]

War Propaganda About Ukraine Becoming More Militaristic, Authoritarian, and Reckless

https://greenwald.substack.com/p/war-propaganda-about-ukraine-becoming?utm_source=url

...especially those on the left taught to believe that McCarthyism was one of the darkest moments for civil liberties, would instantly understand how aggressively the CIA and FBI disseminate disinformation, how servile corporate media outlets are to those security state agencies, how neocons are always found at the center of such manipulative tactics, and how potent this sort of propaganda is. The common theme is creating a foreign villain said to be of unparalleled evil or at least evil not seen since Hitler, then accusing one's political adversaries of being enthralled by or captive to them. We have witnessed countless identical cycles throughout U.S history.

But we are way past the point where anyone cares about what is or is not factually true, including corporate outlets. Any war propaganda — videos, photos, unverified social media posts — that is designed to tug on Western heartstrings for Ukrainians or appear to cast them as brave and noble resistance fighters, or Russians as barbaric but failing mass murderers, gets mindlessly spread all over without the slightest concern for whether it is true. To be on social media or to read coverage from Western news outlets is to place yourself into a relentless vortex of single-minded, dissent-free war propaganda.

[mapuc]

^ First victime in a war is the truth.

Markus

[Red Devil]

Lots of threatening lately, so Putin wants to nuke the rest of the world because they do not like his bullying?

No, because he has thrown his teddy bear out of his pram. And the so called 'aggressive stance' of NATO is about time. Putin's Foreign Minister says he does not like nuclear missiles based in europe. Hows about WE dont like him having nukes in the USSR (as its become again) pointing at us, our children. AND are these not Russian nukes they have supposedly got rid of as the USA did.

I also imagine that tere are a lot of subs in the north sea right now and the Arctic, waiting for him to do something really stupid.

[Jimbuna]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IPVAdEjkibw

[Red Devil]

You have got to be kidding me!
Nostradamus?
That stuff has been disproved for so LONG!
You may as well kill a chicken and read it's blood for future events!
See how far that works.

I think there is a conspiracy or whacko thread here at SubSim.

Not so. He predicted so much that has come to pass, he even predicted a despot called hister who was going to kill millions. And I do not like being considered a CT either, if that wasnt your intention, I apoligise. CTs are the scourge of the woke empire. By the way, did you hear about the monk and the russian leader ;)

[Jimbuna]

Frustrated Putin may order escalation of violence in Ukraine, U.S. officials say.

U.S. intelligence agencies have determined that Russian President Vladimir Putin is growing increasingly frustrated by his military struggles in Ukraine and may see his only option as doubling down on violence, current and former U.S. officials briefed on the matter told NBC News.

As the Russian economy teeters under unprecedented global sanctions and his purportedly superior military force appears bogged down, Putin has lashed out in anger at underlings, even as he remains largely isolated from the Kremlin in part because of concerns about Covid, the sources said.
https://www.nbcnews.com/investigations/frustrated-putin-may-order-escalation-violence-ukraine-us-officials-sa-rcna18026

[kranz]

Allegedly this was shown during a security meeting at Lukashenka's

https://twitter.com/dylanhead94/status/1498679764076404737?s=20&t=BlQZdjuwDzHMRF25zlr5yA

[Ostfriese]

Allegedly this was shown during a security meeting at Lukashenka's

https://twitter.com/dylanhead94/status/1498679764076404737?s=20&t=BlQZdjuwDzHMRF25zlr5yA


If that was a correct map Russia also wants to invade Transnistria in Moldova, the small nation between Ukraine and Romania.

[Skybird]

If that was a correct map Russia also wants to invade Transnistria in Moldova, the small nation between Ukraine and Romania.
I hate to say I told you so, but I told you so, Moldavia is no surprise...


The Neue Zürcher Zeitung meanwhile writes:



Ukraine could also decide the fate of Trumpism

Despite the storm at the Capitol, Republicans still largely stand by Donald Trump. But his renewed praise of Putin is dividing his own party in light of the war in Ukraine.

Internal contradictions in his positions and his own moral shortcomings have hardly hurt Donald Trump so far. But in light of Russia's war of aggression against Ukraine and the global wave of solidarity for Kiev, his continued admiration for Vladimir Putin looks increasingly bizarre. After Moscow recognized the independence of the "people's republics" in the Donbass last week, the former American president praised the Kremlin leader's actions as "brilliant" and "smart."

At the same time, television commentator Tucker Carlson, considered a mouthpiece for Trump's "America first" movement, has been trying for weeks to impress upon his conservative audience of millions on Fox News that there is no reason for the U.S. to side with Kiev in the Ukraine conflict. "Russia is a much more significant country," Carlson argued, among other things.

In the wake of Russia's incursion into Ukraine, meanwhile, Trump appears to have adjusted his thrust somewhat. During his appearance at the annual conference of conservative organizations in Florida, he praised Ukrainian President Volodimir Zelensky as a "courageous man" and condemned Moscow's "reckless attack." However, Trump did not change his opinion of the Russian president, saying, "The problem is not that Putin is smart - of course he is. But the real problem is that our leaders are stupid." He said the U.S. has lost confidence under President Joe Biden, and Russia is not paying a price for the invasion: "Putin is playing with Biden."

Trump's message is clear: Biden is a foreign policy lightweight. If he, Trump, were still in the White House, Putin would not have dared to invade Ukraine. Meanwhile, what course history would have taken had Trump actually been re-elected in 2020 is purely speculative. Basically, regardless of the power constellation in the U.S., Putin was running out of time in Ukraine. With the secession of Crimea and the separatist areas in the Donbass in 2014, he robbed his neighboring country of the very areas with the most Russia-friendly voters, thus cementing Kiev's course toward the West. From Putin's point of view, the invasion is probably a desperate last-second attempt to save what can still be saved from his Great Russian dream.

In fact, the threatening backdrop built up by Biden against Putin was obviously not deterrent enough. For a long time, the U.S. president took a lot of notice of the reticence of his European partners, while American experts, as well as influential Republicans, called for faster and tougher sanctions against Russia and more decisive arms deliveries to Ukraine. Meanwhile, the united and decisive response of the Western alliance under Washington's leadership following the Russian incursion is visibly correcting the initial image of a dithering and weak Biden. Trump's much-maligned NATO partners in Europe are proving to be reliable allies. The American intelligence services, which Trump often distrusted, have so far provided accurate information.

Moreover, in light of fierce Ukrainian resistance and increasing Russian casualties, the notion of a genial Kremlin leader is also dissolving into thin air. Trump has never made a secret of his admiration for "strong men" like Putin - and when he called journalists "enemies of the people," for example, he sounded like an autocrat himself. But the increasingly isolated Putin and his abstruse lie about an alleged Nazi regime in Kiev demonstrate the great weakness of supposedly strong dictatorships: their leaders lose their sense of reality over time.

Republican Senator Mitt Romney has long recognized the danger posed by Russia. As a presidential candidate in 2012, he described Russia as the greatest geopolitical threat to the United States and was ridiculed by his opponent Barack Obama for doing so. Now, however, the staunch Trump critic is retroactively getting a lot of credit for his foresight. In 2020, Romney was the only Republican to vote to censure the president in the first impeachment trial against Trump. Trump was accused at the time of withholding U.S. military aid to Ukraine in order to obtain investigations into Biden and his son Hunter in Kiev.


Only a fringe group in his party now holds on to its admiration for Putin, Romney said Sunday in an interview with The Atlantic. "The larger group that cheered his boldness is now suddenly supporting Ukraine." Even though the country is thousands of miles from the U.S., the war cannot be ignored, he said. "When mothers, children and women stand up to tanks with Molotov cocktails, you can't say, 'This is none of my business.'" Ultimately, the roles in this conflict are clearly divided, even for Romney: "Selenski is the face of good, Putin is the face of evil."

Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator (free version)


https://www.nzz.ch/international/usa-der-ukraine-krieg-spaltet-die-republikaner-ld.1672064

[Jeff-Groves]

Not so. He predicted so much that has come to pass, he even predicted a despot called hister who was going to kill millions. And I do not like being considered a CT either, if that wasnt your intention, I apoligise. CTs are the scourge of the woke empire. By the way, did you hear about the monk and the russian leader ;)
Not calling you a CT and I apologize for seeming to imply such.

But if you throw numerology into the mix?
Putin could be the following seventh number.

(Born on 7th October 1952, Putin is a 7 born with life path 7 in numerology.)

The year the great seventh number is accomplished,
Appearing at the time of the great games of slaughter:
Not far from the age of the great millennium,
When the dead will come out of their graves

:roll:

And are you talking about Abel?

[Jimbuna]

@Sky

I can't say that is surprisingIn fact, the behaviour and actions of Russia might well bring both Democrats and Republicans closer together if even just for the duration of the hostilities.

[Aktungbby]

I can imagine the Ukrainian response.
"Medwedev. Go ******* yourself!" Jeeze Jeff 'ANALIZE' yourself is not "language you use in front of your mother"(per FAQ's)...but it is language you can use behind her!:O:

^ First victime in a war is the truth.

Markus Wrong, the first thing that goes in any battle is your battle-PLAN! IE: Vlad the Bastard's Krieg has lost its Blitz to the point where even his innermost oligarchs are beginning to waver. WWIII could be short!?

[Jeff-Groves]

:hmmm:
Your in the wrong thread for 'ANALIZE'.
:03:

[Skybird]

@Sky

I can't say that is surprisingIn fact, the behaviour and actions of Russia might well bring both Democrats and Republicans closer together if even just for the duration of the hostilities.
Yes, but that duration may cause a momentum working against Trumpists lasting beyond that time window that started it.

Well. Hopefully.

[Aktungbby]

:hmmm:
Your in the wrong thread for 'ANALIZE'.
:03:

...not when considering the Bovine Scatology
level in this thred.:O: Proof the lowest :subsim:er can hold his own with profeßionals: Vlad the Bastard or Joe the Demented....:doh:

[mapuc]

The feeling of helplessness.

Following the news and hear about nuclear on high alert-One feel kind of helplessness-Like there's nothing I can do I can only hope they will come to some agreement and everything will be alright again.

Markus

[em2nought]

Have you heard about this "Angel of Verdum", a beauty queen who is slaughtering Ruskies left and right? :D
https://i.redd.it/5sfbxehs67g41.jpg

The mainstream media would rather start WW3 than hand the government back over to populist Republicans in the next election. :har:

[mapuc]

^Edge of tomorrow

Markus

[em2nought]

^Edge of tomorrow

Markus


It's a joke, I know humor is now mostly frowned on. :03:

[mapuc]

It's a joke, I know humor is now mostly frowned on. :03:

My mistake-When I read what you wrote
"Angel of Verdum"

I should have figuret out that it was a joke especially when you posted a picture from the movie.

Back to discuss what we are discussing

Markus

[Catfish]

Meanwhile Putin's army is targeting especially civilians and residential buildings, he is trying to wipe out everyone there.
He lies all the time, he does not want to negotiate. Diplomacy is dead.

If we let this go on he can blackmail everyone, and all will shy away?

So, this is pure theory. How about an ultimatum?
Stop the slaughter or there IS a nuclear war. Instantly.

[u crank]

So, this is pure theory. How about an ultimatum?
Stop the slaughter or there IS a nuclear war. Instantly.

And if that ultimatum is given and Putin doesn't blink, then what? Nuclear Armageddon? Who gets to make that call?

[Jeff-Groves]

The feeling of helplessness.

Following the news and hear about nuclear on high alert-One feel kind of helplessness-Like there's nothing I can do I can only hope they will come to some agreement and everything will be alright again.

Markus
I grew up with duck and cover films in school!
So this is just another day in a different year.
:rolleyes:

[Catfish]

Is there any possibility that maybe that's what he wants?
Just asking for a friend.
:D
Let's FIND OUT!

[Andreas86]

Meanwhile Putin's army is targeting especially civilians and residential buildings, he is trying to wipe out everyone there.
He lies all the time, he does not want to negotiate. Diplomacy is dead.

If we let this go on he can blackmail everyone, and all will shy away?

So, this is pure theory. How about an ultimatum?
Stop the slaughter or there IS a nuclear war. Instantly.

My thought exactly. If US or NATO doesn't act now, why the hell would they act if a NATO country gets attacked?

The risk of nuclear war is just as big, whether the West responds in Ukraine, in Poland, or in the baltic states. The "we will defend NATO allies" narrative is getting harder and harder to swallow. If Europe won't help Ukraine militarily now because they fear WW3, won't they be just as scared if a NATO country is attacked?

We have to believe there are sane heads in the Russian top brass, that don't want to sacrifice life, family or wealth for Putin, and would not allow the worst to happen.

[Jeff-Groves]

Let's FIND OUT!

I've lived 64 years under this threat!
Let loose the Dogs of War and get it over with!
Would be one Hell of a way to go Dirt Napping!

[ET2SN]

I grew up with duck and cover films in school!
So this is just another day in a different year.
:rolleyes:

Yeah, that feeling of panic and dread fades after a while. :Kaleun_Cheers:
As horrific as it is, you do get used to it.

For some reason, I want to buy an Oldsmobile. :doh:

[Aktungbby]

I've lived 64 years under this threat!
Let loose the Dogs of War and get it over with!
Would be one Hell of a way to go Dirt Napping! Originally Posted by Aktungbby
I was slightly wrong...we should be at DEFCON 1 and launch on Moscow now; and simply get on with Vlad's idea of history! :Kaleun_Thumbs_Up::Kaleun_Cheers: :Kaleun_Salute:

[Jeff-Groves]

Yeah, that feeling of panic and dread fades after a while. :Kaleun_Cheers:
As horrific as it is, you do get used to it.

For some reason, I want to buy an Oldsmobile. :doh:

By God I'm going out in my Cadillac!

[mapuc]

And here we expect the response would come directly if Putin send a nuke towards some NATO country-However can we be 110 % Sure ?

I get the feeling that only response would be raise of voices a lot of condemnation even stronger sanctions.

Markus

[Jeff-Groves]

Some sources I have say there's problems with the Avionics software in Putin's Birds.
Also hearing that the Air to Air Missiles are suffering Software problems.
:hmmm:

[Jimbuna]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HKrReH_UQFw

[mapuc]

No-No-No fake news Everyone who have been playing games where you could control the Russian military or NATO would know that Russian military equipment ROCKS.

An old MIG21/23 can take on 5 F/A-18E easily.

Seen this in Modern Operation

My F/A-18E fired all it's AMRAAM without hitting the MIG21/23-Then this MIG fire it's missiles and hit some of my fighter jets(if I remember correctly 3 of my 5 planes was destroyed).

So...

Markus

[ET2SN]

Meanwhile, you all shouldn't be afraid of going back to the 1970's. :salute:

For all of the inflation and recession stuff, you could also bypass your catalytic converter with a couple of jack stands and an adjustable wrench.

For every John Denver, you also got

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sp3zaeOyL7Q

So don't look at this like its an empty glass. :yeah:

[Jimbuna]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ozgGPWnVLkY

[Jeff-Groves]

Pay for my way over and I'd go!
Heck. I'm still in very good shape, an Expert shot, and what better way to go out then fighting!
Plus I'm pretty good at Demolitions stuff!
An 82nd ParaTrooper deserves an Honorable death!
Not dying of old age in some freaking home!

[Catfish]

Mass arrests as Belarus confirms ditching non-nuclear status in referendum vote

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/mass-arrests-belarus-confirms-ditching-non-nuclear-status-referendum-vote-2022-02-28/

They want a nuclear war.

[Jimbuna]

Mass arrests as Belarus confirms ditching non-nuclear status in referendum vote

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/mass-arrests-belarus-confirms-ditching-non-nuclear-status-referendum-vote-2022-02-28/

They want a nuclear war.

Champion!.....just champion! :nope:

[Jeff-Groves]

We all know it's gonna happen someday.
Known that since WWII.

Let's get this over with now!
The when Archaeologists dig stuff up years from now they can wonder why a so called Advanced Civilization went POOF!

[Jimbuna]

Pay for my way over and I'd go!
Heck. I'm still in very good shape, an Expert shot, and what better way to go out then fighting!
Plus I'm pretty good at Demolitions stuff!
An 82nd ParaTrooper deserves an Honorable death!
Not dying of old age in some freaking home!

Nancy Lady will be the one who makes the final decision :)


:03:

[Jeff-Groves]

Nancy Lady will be the one who makes the final decision :)


:03:
:/\\!!
You think I could just tell her I'm going to a job site?
:hmmm:

[u crank]

Let's FIND OUT!

Glad you're not in charge. :D

[ET2SN]

Mass arrests as Belarus confirms ditching non-nuclear status in referendum vote

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/mass-arrests-belarus-confirms-ditching-non-nuclear-status-referendum-vote-2022-02-28/

They want a nuclear war.

Belarus has a bit of a problem. :yep:
They were only supposed to be the doormat for the great Russian invasion.
Now, they have a lot of people to their south who look like them, dress like them, drink the same brand of tea, and speak the same language.

And, those people are P.O.'d.
And, those P.O.'d people are now ARMED. :yeah:


BTW, you don't go nuclear against a common border. Freakin' amatures. :haha: