[WIP] IRAI (Intelligent Random AI)

[Kentrat]

Hi TDW, did you see my post #1739 about the 34.1 update shortcut?

Regards

[TheDarkWraith]

Don't get me wrong, I like the new system! I was just trying to provide enough info for you to work with. I like the starshells a lot, though they did cause my (pretty high-end) system slow to a crawl while they were being sent up. I'll keep playing with the new AI and report back.:salute:

Thanks for your support, TDW.

I like the new system also :D Seems much more realistic in their searching for you when they have absolutely no clue where you are.

The starshells sometimes cause my system to micro-pause when they are being sent up also. I can't for the life of me figure out why these starshells/flares cause a very short pause when they are being fired :damn:

I'm making more changes in the next upcoming version. I've made some value changes in sim.cfg to make the enemy find you a little easier (they need a little help from all the changes made :yep:). I've also identified a possible error in my code that could cause the leader to come to a stop when he is unable to follow waypoints. I've corrected this oversight so that the leader will keep moving forward if it can't follow waypoints.

More optimizations being done on the code

Rewriting the sub AI (again) so they don't get slaughtered by the AI ships gunfire (they will minimize their exposure to it)

Might make some changes to the AI ship's ability to fire guns. I'm thinking about removing the hydro part of it. The more I think about it they have no clue what depth you're at when using hydro so it's unrealistic for them to fire guns. What I am going to do is add the ability to fire guns when sonar detects you. With sonar they know heading and depth so this is more realistic. The ability to fire guns at you from visual detection will remain (if they see your periscope they will open fire)

HK groups are getting another operation added to them - the ability to ram. I noticed that they never tried to ram me when they spotted me close to the surface anymore. The reason is because I tell the leader to stay some distance away and circle. What I'm going to do is if the leader sees you near the surface he will make a bee line for you and try to ram you.

The time the ships can search for you has increased by about 25%. This falls under the they need more help in finding you from all the changes made :yep:

If I have time I'll look into making the changes to the plane AI I spoke about some posts back.

I also need to correct the devs improper implementation of the ship's shooting starshells.

Any input or suggestions?

[0rpheus]

What's your opinion of the starshells they shoot up? I like em but not sure if everyone else does. I think it adds a new level of realism.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but weren't the starshells/flares part of FX_Update? Are they now in IRAI?

I had to deactivate both flares & starshells on my old rig, as they always caused massive stutter just prior to launch. That said they really do look great, and its certainly authentic - but the performance is the biggest issue, and I've seen a fair few subsimmers posting about deactivating them for that reason.

I've since upgraded GPUs, so if they are in the new IRAI I'll give them a look to see if performance is better on the new card - but it's the performance, not the visuals on the flares that concern most users I think. Only sunk one merchant so far, but will report back when I encounter them :up:

[TheDarkWraith]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but weren't the starshells/flares part of FX_Update? Are they now in IRAI?

FX_Update had my version of starshells that I made for SH3 that relied upon entries in the unit's .eqp file and an invisible gun. The starshells in IRAI are handled by the game itself - no editing files or anything. I just tell the game fire starshells and it does the rest :D

[libindi]

all the difficulty levels at 1.0


how do i leave all the difficulty levels at 1.0?do i need to edit some files?

[TheDarkWraith]

all the difficulty levels at 1.0


how do i leave all the difficulty levels at 1.0?do i need to edit some files?

If you leave the values as is (don't edit the init.aix), aka as designed, then everything is as it should be :up:

[ADMIRALTIA]

The link to the upgrade to v0.034.1 leads us to the upgrade to v0.030.1:hmmm:

[0rpheus]

FX_Update had my version of starshells that I made for SH3 that relied upon entries in the unit's .eqp file and an invisible gun. The starshells in IRAI are handled by the game itself - no editing files or anything. I just tell the game fire starshells and it does the rest :D


Aha! In that case, I'll report back on the performance as & when I encounter them. :O:

[TheDarkWraith]

The link to the upgrade to v0.034.1 leads us to the upgrade to v0.030.1:hmmm:

Yep, it's ok. That 'upgrade' is just one file - sim.cfg. This file makes the AI easier to cope with :yep:

[THE_MASK]

Playing the campaign and western approaches mission in the happy times . Just found one of the biggest escorted convoys i have ever seen in SH5 . Time to test IRAI .
Mods i am using related to IRAI

AI_sub_crew_1_0_1_TheDarkWraith
FX_Update_0_0_19_ByTheDarkWraith
NewUIs_TDC_6_9_0_ByTheDarkWraith
NewUIs_TDC_6_9_0_alt_officer_wounded_by_Torpedo
NewUIs_TDC_6_9_0_Real_Navigation
Manos Scopes-patch for 16x9
IRAI_0_0_34_ByTheDarkWraith
IRAI_upgrade_to_v_0_0_31
TDW_No_Hydrophone_On_Surface_1_1_0

PS also a good time to test the new bose headphones i bought yesterday .

[TheDarkWraith]

Playing the campaign and western approaches mission in the happy times . Just found one of the biggest escorted convoys i have ever seen in SH5 . Time to test IRAI .

Why are you using the upgrade? Have you tried the enemy AI without the upgrade? I find the upgrade makes them WAY too easy to evade/escape from :hmmm:

I'm currently testing v35. Watching the new (again) AI sub behavior to ensure they don't get slaughtered by the ship's gunfire along with some other things ;)

[THE_MASK]

Why are you using the upgrade? Have you tried the enemy AI without the upgrade? I find the upgrade makes them WAY too easy to evade/escape from :hmmm:

I'm currently testing v35. Watching the new (again) AI sub behavior to ensure they don't get slaughtered by the ship's gunfire along with some other things ;)Ok , i wont use the upgrade . I had a ctd so i will send you the Dbgview .

[TheDarkWraith]

v35 is shaping up to be another great version :D

v0.0.35 - made changes to sim.cfg to make it a little easier for AI to detect you
- enemy is allowed to search for contact longer
- operation plaster now has ability to ram contact if close enough to the surface
- HK leader now has ability to ram contact if close enough to the surface
- corrected bug where if leader was unable to follow waypoints it could possibly come to all stop (and the rest of the ships in group come to all stop also)
- more optimizations done
- changed how AI ships can fire guns at submerged contacts. If they spot you visually or they spot you on sonar (not hydro!) and you are <= 20m depth and within 8000m they will open fire
- rewrote sub AI so they don't get slaughtered by ship gunfire (they minimize exposure to it)
- corrected bug where if single unit was unable to follow waypoints it could come to all stop
- changed hedgehogs fall speed to 6.5
- changed hedgehogs launcher to max range of 200, diameter to 70
- fixed bug of when torpedo detected a unit could come to all stop vice trying to avoid torpedo
- Airplanes now hang around if they have cannons available and will not resume waypoints until your sub has submerged or it runs out of ammo. Also if a plane has no bombs and no torpedoes but it has cannons then it will come and investigate you (in previous versions it would just keep following waypoints)
- Airplanes (excluding torpedo bombers) now change altitudes as they are coming to investigate you, drop bombs on you, or shell you to death. This is something I've been trying to do for many months!
- When an airplane initially spots a contact it will drop down close to the water surface for it's initial run. If it's a torpedo bomber then it will stay close to the water until it delivers it's torpedo. If it's a bomber or a plane that has no bombs or torpedoes then it will pop up and make it's 'bomb run' at 3000m from the contact. This makes for a very nasty surprise because you have little to no warning that an airplane is tracking you!

Note the entries about the airplanes :rock:

Hope to have this available here very soon :|\\

[TheDarkWraith]

Thanks TDW! Still okay to use the no surface aircraft spotting and hyrdrophone add on from v0.30 ?

You should take these from my add-on mods thread :yep:

One thing, the link to 34.1 on page one points to the IRAI_upgrade_to_v_0_0_31.zip

Regards

You were correct. I have removed that link as I feel you do not need to dumb down the AI anymore.

[TheDarkWraith]

v0.0.35 released. See post #1

The new hell just got worse :D

:|\\

[THE_MASK]

Playing with realistic sensors enabled in the ingame options .
I tried to attack a convoy from within but had no chance against the dds . You will need to shadow the convoy and wait for wolfpack or try a spread shot from a long way off if there is lots of dds . Actually in hindsite i should have radioed the convoy in and then scouted for a few days to see how many dds there were . Star shells , ramming , the pinpoint accuracy is gone . Lost for words actually . You have taken the AI and made it realistic . Brilliant . I did notice when firing a salvo at the convoy from a few kilometers away , as soon as i fired the torps the ships all fired there star shells . would it be possible to have a delay . I think i will start a new campaign and just cruise up and down Kiel harbor , too scared to go anywhere else .

[Sartoris]

Another new version! You are a machine, TDW! :yeah:

I'll try my best to test it today before I go to work and post my impressions here.

[tonschk]

:woot::DL:D:yeah::salute::rock::sunny::up::woot:


v0.0.35 released. See post #1

The new hell just got worse :D

:|\\

[TheDarkWraith]

I did notice when firing a salvo at the convoy from a few kilometers away , as soon as i fired the torps the ships all fired there star shells . would it be possible to have a delay . I think i will start a new campaign and just cruise up and down Kiel harbor , too scared to go anywhere else .

That will be a hard one to do :hmmm: I might have an idea...

[TheDarkWraith]

Another new version! You are a machine, TDW! :yeah:

No machine, just determined. Once something pisses me off (common in software) I will work tirelessly to fix it or make it do what I want it to do (exploitation). I was playing the game and the AI pissed me off royally because it was acting completely dumb. I couldn't take it anymore :yep: I'd been putting off working on the new versions of IRAI long enough. It was time to put the GR2 Editor/Viewer to the side for a little while and put my modding hat back on :DL

Today I will look into all the problems that have been reported with Scapa Flow to see what the AI is doing/not doing. I have to update my OHII first then I'm off to Scapa :cool:

[TheDarkWraith]

This is not good: I'm just outside Scapa Flow and I enable the in-game AI debugger so I can see what the AI is doing. I click on any ship and the game crashes :o :shifty: There's a problem somewhere in IRAIs code and now the time consuming task of playing isolation begins :dead:

If I disable IRAI I can click on any ship and the game doesn't crash. Wonderful :-?

[TheDarkWraith]

This makes no sense. I disabled everything (AI code wise from IRAI) and am able to click on any ship without crashing. I slowly added one thing at a time until everything was re-enabled and I can still click on any ship without crashing :hmmm: This makes me suspect a rogue ship in the roster...something is wrong with one of them.

On a good note I figured out why ships come to a stop sometimes! Do you see anything wrong with this line of code:

!Ship:GetRole() == ROLE_IDLE and !Ship:GetRole() == ROLE_ERROR_BATTLESHIP and !Ship:GetRole() == ROLE_ERROR_ESCORT

This was a sinister bug!! The game wouldn't crash because of it. Here's what it should be:

Ship:GetRole() != ROLE_IDLE and Ship:GetRole() != ROLE_ERROR_BATTLESHIP and Ship:GetRole() != ROLE_ERROR_ESCORT

Now they keep looking/searching for you :DL

[TheDarkWraith]

Well they did keep searching/looking for me except for when they got into shallow water. Once that happened they froze, won't do anything. We need to increase the water depth in scapa flow! :yep:

[Trevally.]

We need to increase the water depth in scapa flow! :yep:

:o Dont tell Sober:O:

We did try this without any improvement - could that have been due to the other error that you posted:06:

[Trevally.]

Were the ships close to the shore when they stopped (this will be hard to fix depth) or was it just shallow water out in the middle of the bay:06:

[TheDarkWraith]

Were the ships close to the shore when they stopped (this will be hard to fix depth) or was it just shallow water out in the middle of the bay:06:

shallow water out in middle of the bay

[Trevally.]

shallow water out in middle of the bay

Ah ok thats good as the terrain editor should make short work of a fix:up:

[TheDarkWraith]

I just edited the map2 raw file with photoshop to see if I could make the water deeper that way...testing now

[TheDarkWraith]

That didn't work as expected. All the terrain data must reside in \data\Terrain\Data\TerrainData.BFD and .BFI :hmmm:

[Echolot]

AFAIK the terrain data ist stored to Terrain/Data/Detailmasks/ in RAW files and dds files.

:hmmm:

[Trevally.]

AFAIK the terrain data ist stored to Terrain/Data/Detailmasks/ in RAW files and dds files.

:hmmm:

Yes - that is where the terrain editor saves too

[TheDarkWraith]

AFAIK the terrain data ist stored to Terrain/Data/Detailmasks/ in RAW files and dds files.

:hmmm:

Time to figure out how these pieces of the puzzle go together then :up:

[Echolot]

And how deep the water needs to be to not stop the AI working.:hmmm:

[TheDarkWraith]

And how deep the water needs to be to not stop the AI working.:hmmm:

I just carved a 45 foot valley into scapa flow...even shows on the maps! The game created new raw files for them. The numbers of the raw and dds files indicate lattitude and longitude with W being West and E being East, N being North and S being South. The dds files seem to be the ones that define vegetation and rocks. The raw files dictate water depths

[Echolot]

We need to test at which depth the AI is not working anymore:06:.:-?

Maybe the dds files stores the changes with terrain editors texture brushes, the raw files for noise, circular and the other hight map related brush (starting game to check the name atm).

Edit: Level Brush to smooth the terrain

[Trevally.]

How do you edit a raw file:06:

[THE_MASK]

2 things , firstly if you want to see what you are doing when editing the depth . Go to this file and comment out the name .
Shaders\HDR\;QuadVS

Secondly i already did the whole area about 2 months ago , took half a day .
Its been in the download section for over 2 months but you wouldnt have needed to know that till now .

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=3494

[volodya61]

...Secondly i already did the whole area about 2 months ago , took half a day .

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=3494

I'm sorry that interfere. I always use Sobers dredging project scapa flow and never had a CTD in Scapa

[TheDarkWraith]

How do you edit a raw file:06:

Photoshop has native support for RAW files (file-->Open).

A RAW file is nothing but a string of bytes in sequential order (there is no layout/structure/meaning) :yep:

[TheDarkWraith]

We need to test at which depth the AI is not working anymore:06:.:-?

Maybe the dds files stores the changes with terrain editors texture brushes, the raw files for noise, circular and the other hight map related brush (starting game to check the name atm).

Edit: Level Brush to smooth the terrain

I just found out about Sober's dredging a little too late...I dredged out a nice valley so that when the patrolling escort would hear me he should be able to continue on...but no. Once he jumped out of cruise status and into alert status it was all stop and never moving again no matter what I did. I disabled IRAI and did the same test again and had same result. As soon as the enemy detects you they get maybe 5-10 seconds of reaction time then they go all stop and switch everything off. I don't understand why. This seems to only happen in scapa flow :damn:

[Trevally.]

These units "portDefense.mis" are place in the game by Random Gen Groups and use waypoints to travel around the game world (looped back to first point).
I think this issue is not just in scapa, but most ports where there is land and shallow water.

DDs that never stop (deep sea) are from convoys and are place in the game by generators and use the common paths set by nodes to travel around the game world (a to b).

Could it be this method of generation and waypoints that is causing the problem:hmmm:


Edit - no it can't be as this is also the method used in single missions and they work ok

[col_Kurtz]

I'm sorry that interfere. I always use Sobers dredging project scapa flow and never had a CTD in Scapa
Without this I did three times or even 5! Scapa Flow. First time - ok. Hit the capital ship, sunk and escape. They follow me. One ship missed my head about 10 meters. So it was normal searching (dead ahead about 1-2kts my U) Tried sneak out but I forgot edit my SH5.exe for hydro. Reloaded all in JSGME. Edit SH5.exe and start new Campaign and back to SF. Three times in a row CTD - tried hit the second capital - I tought that was a reason.
Next SF - no activated this mission but I received message from Bdu - Scapa available with iron cross so I sneak to SF from South side go to the port and hit two battleships - mission completed - I escaped. No CTD - nice and steady.
Played with
IRAI_0_0_30_ByTheDarkWraith
IRAI_upgrade_to_v_0_0_31.
If I`m getting CTD - reason is one - RAM to low IMO.

[TheDarkWraith]

These units "portDefense.mis" are place in the game by Random Gen Groups and use waypoints to travel around the game world (looped back to first point).
I think this issue is not just in scapa, but most ports where there is land and shallow water.

DDs that never stop (deep sea) are from convoys and are place in the game by generators and use the common paths set by nodes to travel around the game world (a to b).

Could it be this method of generation and waypoints that is causing the problem:hmmm:


Edit - no it can't be as this is also the method used in single missions and they work ok

I've added a V&W destroyer to the port defense. It's not a random group or anything but the actual ship. I gave it waypoints. Testing now to see how it behaves :hmmm:

[ADMIRALTIA]

I've added a V&W destroyer to the port defense. It's not a random group or anything but the actual ship. I gave it waypoints. Testing now to see how it behaves :hmmm:

And in no time another version is out. Just when you think you've got the latest version of the mod. All hail the persistent modders in SUBSIM:sunny:

[TheDarkWraith]

And in no time another version is out. Just when you think you've got the latest version of the mod. All hail the persistent modders in SUBSIM:sunny:

Such is the life of progression and perfection :D And yes, v36 is just about to be released :up:

I had to be devious on this one...the HK director now has the ability to ram. If you surface without checking for contacts first you could get a nasty surprise! Since he is the one who sits motionless and quiet you'd never know he's there unless you check for contacts first. He has the ability to fall back from the group and wait for you to surface (has a pretty long wait time before he has to rejoin the group)

[ADMIRALTIA]

Such is the life of progression and perfection :D And yes, v36 is just about to be released :up:

I had to be devious on this one...the HK director now has the ability to ram. If you surface without checking for contacts first you could get a nasty surprise! Since he is the one who sits motionless and quiet you'd never know he's there unless you check for contacts first. He has the ability to fall back from the group and wait for you to surface (has a pretty long wait time before he has to rejoin the group)

Well that makes everybody's lives harder. But its better than the vanilla retarded AI that does nearly absolutely nothing.

Short story I had A DD right on top of me (it was vanilla AI) and it was very shallow Im within its Hydrophone range and suddenly nothing happended WTF.:haha:

[TheDarkWraith]

Been testing and trying to figure out this AI ship and shallow waters problem. No matter what if the enemy ship is in shallow waters and it detects a contact it will turn into a zombie and come to all stop and do absolutely nothing. You can ram it, shoot shells at it, fire torpedoes at it, nothing matters. It will not move or respond. Looks like a problem in shsim.act :hmmm:

[THE_MASK]

I read something in the patch 1.2 readme about something similar .
Patch 1.2 change list
===================
Bugs and issues
- Fix for CO2 not being saved correctly
-Fix for crew morale
- Fix for weather being reset to clear weather after load
- Fixes for crewmen showing under water under certain conditions
- Fixes for ships exploding in ports or hitting the shore

[ADMIRALTIA]

Been testing and trying to figure out this AI ship and shallow waters problem. No matter what if the enemy ship is in shallow waters and it detects a contact it will turn into a zombie and come to all stop and do absolutely nothing. You can ram it, shoot shells at it, fire torpedoes at it, nothing matters. It will not move or respond. Looks like a problem in shsim.act :hmmm:

Ah,yes that takes me back to a historical Mission

Mission : In Spite of Everything
Story: Being hunted by DDs still in the shallow part of the harbor. One DD found me and dropped a large load of Depth Charges they all missed.
It turned around and all of a sudden stopped. It was not alone every other ship stopped including the Warspite and the other DDs that didn't find me and I ended sinking the Warspite from the surface. No gunshots or whatever. And we were having tea while the DDs where sitting there doing nothing. :hmmm::har:

EDIT:

v0.0.35 -
- When an airplane initially spots a contact it will drop down close to the water surface for it's initial run. If it's a torpedo bomber then it will stay close to the water until it delivers it's torpedo. If it's a bomber or a plane that has no bombs or torpedoes then it will pop up and make it's 'bomb run' at 3000m from the contact. This makes for a very nasty surprise because you have little to no warning that an airplane is tracking you!




Unless You have radar.

[TheDarkWraith]

v0.0.36 released. See post #1 :|\\

[TheDarkWraith]

I read something in the patch 1.2 readme about something similar .
Patch 1.2 change list
===================
Bugs and issues
- Fix for CO2 not being saved correctly
-Fix for crew morale
- Fix for weather being reset to clear weather after load
- Fixes for crewmen showing under water under certain conditions
- Fixes for ships exploding in ports or hitting the shore

Just checked what changed and it appears that they modified shcollisions.act. Time to open it up and take a peek inside :yep:

[THE_MASK]

Just checked what changed and it appears that they modified shcollisions.act. Time to open it up and take a peek inside :yep:I dont think they changed much LOL . When playing the single mission In spite of everything 9 times out of 10 the dds still head towards the shore and explode with patch 1.2 .

[ADMIRALTIA]

v0.0.36 released. See post #1 :|\\

Just when I was about to test v0.0.35 oh well.

[THE_MASK]

The only thing i would change is
IRAI_0_0_36_ByTheDarkWraith\data\Cfg\Sensors
;Submarine player sensors detection parameters
[SensorParameters]
;Visual.
Visual range factor=0.30 ;[>=0] was 0.5, decreased by 25%
Visual fog factor=0.75

Change to
;Submarine player sensors detection parameters
[SensorParameters]
;Visual.
Visual range factor=0.30 ;[>=0] was 0.5, decreased by 25%
Visual fog factor=0.875

I use sobers fog V10

[Sartoris]

Tested the new version, tried attacking a task force of DDs surrounding an aircraft carrier. The DDs behaved as TDW described, they didn't have pinpoint accuracy but it was still a pretty brutal fight. I enjoyed it very much, apart from this unfortunate incident:

http://i1196.photobucket.com/albums/aa419/sartoris36/sh52012-04-2616-17-53-76.jpg

[TheDarkWraith]

Tested the new version, tried attacking a task force of DDs surrounding an aircraft carrier. The DDs behaved as TDW described, they didn't have pinpoint accuracy but it was still a pretty brutal fight. I enjoyed it very much, apart from this unfortunate incident:

Not too much I can do about that. Collision avoidance is hard coded.

Did you notice that the capitol ships no longer come to investigate you unless you're surfaced? That was another thing that people were complaining about in previous versions.

What do you think of the AI's search routines?

And the aircraft, did you run into any of them?

[Sartoris]

Well, the capital ships kept circling around me, just like the destroyers, and they even passed over me a couple of times. In fact, they kept getting in the way of the dds search patterns, so the DDs often had to stop and let the capital ship pass or even back away to make room for it.

I didn't encounter any aircraft, unfortunately. I liked the search routine, it was methodical but I didn't get the feeling that the dds were cheating at any time. I think one of the dds was the leader, as he would stop every once in a while and just listen, while the others continued to attack.

[TheDarkWraith]

Well, the capital ships kept circling around me, just like the destroyers, and they even passed over me a couple of times. In fact, they kept getting in the way of the dds search patterns, so the DDs often had to stop and let the capital ship pass or even back away to make room for it.

I didn't encounter any aircraft, unfortunately. I liked the search routine, it was methodical but I didn't get the feeling that the dds were cheating at any time. I think one of the dds was the leader, as he would stop every once in a while and just listen, while the others continued to attack.

Sounds like I need to work more on the capital ships :hmmm:

The dd you think was the leader was actually the director. He now searches until he thinks he has a contact. Once he thinks he has a contact he goes all stop and listens for some time. If it's a false hit then he continues searching :yep: If it's not a false hit then he will continue listening and call in the cavalry.

[Sartoris]

I think you can definitely be proud of what you've achieved with the AI so far. You've managed to eliminate the "cheating" AI which knew exactly where the player is, and replaced it with a perfectly functioning AI that knows how to use a useful search pattern. In addition, you've made it so that the AI can be dumbed down if one wanted to do so using the DC disturbances mod, but IMO this mod is no longer required.

I will continue to test the AI further and report back. One thing I wanted to ask you: does the game model the level in the sea beneath which the dds can no longer track you (I forget the name, it had to do with the amount of heat trapped above the layer I suppose)?

When the dds were hunting me, I dropped below 150 meters, hoping to hide beneath that layer, but it didn't work. I even tried standing completely still at around 160 meters, but the dds just slowed down to a crawl and listened to me for a bit, and then continued to shell me to bits. The positioning of the depth charges didn't feel like cheating, and they were definitely missing with most of them, but by that time I was running out of ideas and just decided to go to periscope depth and see if I could hurt the capital ship. Once I reached 11 meters and extended the periscope, the ships did not fire at me, but one of the dds immediately turned toward me, passed overhead and dropped the killing blow.

[TheDarkWraith]

I will continue to test the AI further and report back. One thing I wanted to ask you: does the game model the level in the sea beneath which the dds can no longer track you (I forget the name, it had to do with the amount of heat trapped above the layer I suppose)?

When the dds were hunting me, I dropped below 150 meters, hoping to hide beneath that layer, but it didn't work. I even tried standing completely still at around 160 meters, but the dds just slowed down to a crawl and listened to me for a bit, and then continued to shell me to bits. The positioning of the depth charges didn't feel like cheating, and they were definitely missing with most of them, but by that time I was running out of ideas and just decided to go to periscope depth and see if I could hurt the capital ship. Once I reached 11 meters and extended the periscope, the ships did not fire at me, but one of the dds immediately turned toward me, passed overhead and dropped the killing blow.

Yes the game does model the thermal layer. In this version I reduced the effectiveness of the thermal layer. This value definitely needs tweaking to get to the correct value. What you do can for me is play with this value to find a good value for it. It's in \data\cfg\sim.cfg under the Sonar header. Increase in small values (.05 to 0.1) at a time.

The reason one of the dds turned towards you is because of the ramming routine I added. If they have you on any of their sensors and they can determine that you are at a depth that they can ram effectively then they will try to ram you. Even when trying to ram they are still allowed to fire guns and DCs

[Swat]

It sounds brilliant. And it is brilliant. Thank you TDW. However I'm still testing around Scapa. I know it is a problematic part of the map, I've read about that depth problem so maybe that's it. I was there again, capital ship opened massive fire at me which felt very intense, not very accurate, got only few hits which I also consider as realistic. However destroyers were only shining at me, didn't open fire and remained stationary. Once I submerged that was it, I could do anything I wanted around the harbor. And they still remained stationary.

Sorry to bother you with such comments and I urge you to not to take it as disrespect. I would hardly play this sim if there was no IRAI mod. I'm convinced the AI can do things mentioned in a readme as well as when I read the comments of the other guys here and it all sounds incredible how far you've pushed things so far. But this Scapa raid is so bloody easy at the moment. If I've missed some of your comments about Scapa then I'm sorry...

[TheDarkWraith]

Sorry to bother you with such comments and I urge you to not to take it as disrespect. I would hardly play this sim if there was no IRAI mod. I'm convinced the AI can do things mentioned in a readme as well as when I read the comments of the other guys here and it all sounds incredible how far you've pushed things so far. But this Scapa raid is so bloody easy at the moment. If I've missed some of your comments about Scapa then I'm sorry...

No disrespect taken :up: I'm not entirely sure why all those warships come to all stop and shut everything down. It appears because of a depth problem with ocean floor. If they are not in alert status everything is ok. Once they switch into alert status and they are in shallow waters they are broke and can't do anything. I've been looking in SHCollisions.act for answers and stumbled upon something I've been looking for in regards to magnetic detonators. I'm still looking for the solution to this warship problem :yep: I'm looking for the function call that changes their status from cruise to alert. Once I find that it may shed some light on the answer.

[TheDarkWraith]

Tested the new version, tried attacking a task force of DDs surrounding an aircraft carrier. The DDs behaved as TDW described, they didn't have pinpoint accuracy but it was still a pretty brutal fight. I enjoyed it very much, apart from this unfortunate incident:

http://i1196.photobucket.com/albums/aa419/sartoris36/sh52012-04-2616-17-53-76.jpg

In an effort to minimize these kind of 'encounters' I have removed the ability of the HK leader to try and ram surfaced sub contacts if it's a capital ship (Battleship or aircraft carrier). I also noticed that the game is unreliable in reporting a sub's depth - it varies based on class of ship :nope: Thus I found a mean value to use -4m

v0.0.37 released. See post #1

Any comments on the new plane and/or sub AI?

[THE_MASK]

Playing the campaign , when i encounter some planes i will give a report . Submerged 150 meters . Did some evasive manouvres trying to get the dds behind me by running at flank speed then stopping . Escorts moving away aft of me . Dared to go 1 knot . The damn listener has sent them back . I managed to evade the dds by going to 175mts and all stop . There is no way i will be engaging a convoy with escorts if i have less than 200mts under keel . I think that is pretty realistic , i had depth on my side .

[TheDarkWraith]

Playing the campaign , when i encounter some planes i will give a report . Submerged 150 meters . Did some evasive manouvres trying to get the dds behind me by running at flank speed then stopping . Escorts moving away aft of me . Dared to go 1 knot . The damn listener has sent them back . I managed to evade the dds by going to 175mts and all stop . There is no way i will be engaging a convoy with escorts if i have less than 200mts under keel . I think that is pretty realistic , i had depth on my side .

If you install the patch for the magnetic detonators it also fixes the sub not taking any damage (hull integrity never decreasing). Thus be very wary of DCs - you will incur hull damage from them :DL

[Rongel]

Thanks for the new version TDW!

I've been testing this a bit now. The shooting at periscope works just great! I noticed this before that I rarely get any damage to the periscope even when they are firing all around it. So I made a collision spheres and boxes to the sensors.zon file for the periscopes (they don't have them for some reason).

So now I noticed that they actually shoot my periscope completely off, no more periscope. That was great, but it's a weird thing that the damage report still shows no damage to it, or just a few procent.

The crew can still fix it to 100% but the actual scope just isn't there and can't be used. Sooo, do you know can we actually make this work so that the damage screen would show the actual damage? It would be a great improvement if this would work without bugs.

[Husksubsky]

no hydrophone at surface gone?included? :)

[volodya61]

no hydrophone at surface gone?included? :)

No, it's included in TDW Add-on mods

Here they are - http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=183649

[Husksubsky]

thx:)

[Husksubsky]

Hmmm it overwrites a lot, is it safe? I tested it and the merches shoot at me so I guess it s fine

[HUNterkarabiner]

I experienced a phenomenon (v0.0.37). When the convoy discovered, all at once to start the ship's signal rockets (FX 0.0.19). For some reason, it is burdened with the CPU operation. Often caught in seconds the program. IRAI previous versions it was not so affected.
Other meetings such phenomena?

Thank you anyway for IRAI! The SH club everyone uses.:yeah:

[Meldric]

Hi!

I am very uncertain if this is related to this mod, but I'll try it here (sorry!).

I have been in Skapa and sunk the warship "Nelson". Then I started to escape from skapa and after an hour, I saved and went to bed. When I loaded that saved game up today, the Nelson was back alive again, but my torpedos are gone. I double and triple checked, it is the right saved game...

Is that a known issue?

[Sartoris]

I think this is a common bug, you should never save around other ships. I always make sure that I'm out on the open sea and all alone when I save during my patrols.

[Trevally.]

Hi!

I am very uncertain if this is related to this mod, but I'll try it here (sorry!).

I have been in Skapa and sunk the warship "Nelson". Then I started to escape from skapa and after an hour, I saved and went to bed. When I loaded that saved game up today, the Nelson was back alive again, but my torpedos are gone. I double and triple checked, it is the right saved game...

Is that a known issue?

Yes - when you save your game, no information about the damage to your targets are saved - only if it was sunk.
So do not leave your game until the ship is down:up:

[THE_MASK]

Just an idea . Anyway to link the thermal layer signal attenuation in sim cfg to the journal viewer . Everytime the game loads the sim cfg it could load the thermal layer signal attenuation based on the position of the last navigation fix . I guess water disturbances would do the same thing , could it be linked to something to give difrent disturbances for cold/warm water .

[TheDarkWraith]

Just an idea . Anyway to link the thermal layer signal attenuation in sim cfg to the journal viewer . Everytime the game loads the sim cfg it could load the thermal layer signal attenuation based on the position of the last navigation fix . I guess water disturbances would do the same thing , could it be linked to something to give difrent disturbances for cold/warm water .

Anything related to sensors I have not found/looked into in the .exe or .act files yet. When I do I'll keep this in mind :yep:

[Rongel]

I experienced a phenomenon (v0.0.37). When the convoy discovered, all at once to start the ship's signal rockets (FX 0.0.19). For some reason, it is burdened with the CPU operation. Often caught in seconds the program. IRAI previous versions it was not so affected.
Other meetings such phenomena?



I have found too the new starshells to be very heavy on the computer. When a convoy spots my torpedo, computer locks down for a few seconds. Today I had also a crash when this happened. I wouldn't want to disable the starshells, is there any other way? Otherwise this IRAI version is just super!

[Sartoris]

I agree, the starshells do need some tweaking.

[TheDarkWraith]

I have found too the new starshells to be very heavy on the computer. When a convoy spots my torpedo, computer locks down for a few seconds. Today I had also a crash when this happened. I wouldn't want to disable the starshells, is there any other way? Otherwise this IRAI version is just super!

you can disable the starshells very easily. Open up the \data\Scripts\AI\ship-weapons.aix file with Notepad. Make the very top of the file look EXACTLY like the below:

strategy ShipFire(Ship)
{
precond
{
Ship:ContactPresenceIs(PRESENCE_SENSORS, 0) or (Ship:ContactPresenceIs(PRESENCE_LOOSING, 0) and Ship:GetContactLostTime() <= 360.0)
}
strategies
{
DC,
Cannons,
CannonsAtSubmerged
#CheckStarshellEnable,
#ShipFireStarShells,
#ShipFireStarShellsDistance
}
}

So all in all you are adding two #s and removing one , (used to be after CannonsAtSubmerged)

With those changes no starshells will ever be fired :yep:

[THE_MASK]

The only weird thing i have observed with the latest irai is larger planes in kiel fly normally for a while and then after a while they look tail heavy and cannot gain altitude and eventually crash . The game is much harder now (realistic) .

[TheDarkWraith]

The only weird thing i have observed with the latest irai is larger planes in kiel fly normally for a while and then after a while they look tail heavy and cannot gain altitude and eventually crash . The game is much harder now (realistic) .

Are these friendly or enemy aircraft? Are they just flying along straight and level and then all of a sudden look tail heavy and lose altitude and crash or is something else happening (they did a bomb run, torpedo run, etc.)? :hmmm:

[THE_MASK]

Are these friendly or enemy aircraft? Are they just flying along straight and level and then all of a sudden look tail heavy and lose altitude and crash or is something else happening (they did a bomb run, torpedo run, etc.)? :hmmm: Friendly , doing a loop , when starting a campaign and in the port of kiel . I will check to see which aircraft . The only one it could be is the junkers ju-290

[Rongel]

you can disable the starshells very easily. Open up the \data\Scripts\AI\ship-weapons.aix file with Notepad. Make the very top of the file look EXACTLY like the below:
Thanks for the quick answer TDW! It's still too bad that I have to remove them completely, starshells are very nice.

Friendly , doing a loop , when starting a campaign and in the port of kiel . I will check to see which aircraft . The only one it could be is the junkers ju-290

I saw the same thing some time ago and took a screenie: http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=162521&page=188

[gap]

I saw the same thing some time ago and took a screenie: http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=162521&page=188

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=1877338&postcount=2812 :03:

[RedTerex]

Great work and fantastic dedication to this sim TDW. Thanks a lot for the update. I have dl'd and installed and now going to test it out. :salute:

[crazyfox]

Hey. Great mod but i get CTDs with the 0_0_37 version.
It happens when i come upon a circle convoy around a captial ship. All works fine with just the airplane and sub scripts though.
Also i'd like to know if its possible to just disable the white flares but not the red distress ones?

[gazzmetrik]

Hey. Great mod but i get CTDs with the 0_0_37 version.
........
Also i'd like to know if its possible to just disable the white flares but not the red distress ones?

I've never seen flares EVER. Is it dependent on a year? Time of day? Kind of enemy? I would like to see some flares too.

Anyway, to help you out, edit your message and post your mod loadout so the modders and/or TDW can see what's causing the CTDs.

Also for good measure, make sure you follow the proper mod order as stated in this post (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=1821607&postcount=8474).:up:

[Meldric]

I think you'll only see them if you have TDWs FXUpdate installed.

[gazzmetrik]

I think you'll only see them if you have TDWs FXUpdate installed.

I do have it installed. lots of eye candy, and nice explosions and water effects, but no flares. I got no other mods that overwrite anything in TDW's FX update... oh well, keep hunting. :salute:

[volodya61]

I do have it installed. lots of eye candy, and nice explosions and water effects, but no flares. I got no other mods that overwrite anything in TDW's FX update... oh well, keep hunting. :salute:

Try to look higher in the sky :up:

[Stevepine]

After so many versions of IRAI .....Do we still need Wamphyris plane mod 2 anyone know? still advisable to run both?

[volodya61]

I think we no longer need to use it...
I disabled it and everything is still OK..:up:

[Stevepine]

I think we no longer need to use it...
I disabled it and everything is still OK..:up:

Cool! Thats good to hear ! Thanks for the information! :)

[crazyfox]

I got alot of mods, some files deleted from some mods to make them fit togheter ofc.
No magic skills v1.5
MightyFine Crew Mod 1.2.1
Interior working dials v1_21
Naights Submarine Textures (internal) V1.1
SKIN_SH5_Type-VIIC_North_Atlantic_Grime_Weathered
SH5Lifeboats_by_Rongel_TDW_stoianm_v2.11
OpenHorizionsII_fullv1.8
Dynamic Environment SH5-V2.1
SubFlags__0_0_8_byTheDarkWraith
AST_SH5_v2
FX_Update_0_0_19_TheDarkWraith
IRAI_0_0_37_TheDarkWraith
NewUIs_TDC_6_9_0
And my own sound mod.Anyway after some testing I noticed I didnt get a CTD with the IRAI disabled, thats why i posted here. But gonna test it out now with enableing those 3 mods in the magic order.

The flares look great but are as stated very cpu heavy. Destroyers fire white ones when you get detected. Red ones gets fired by all ships when sinking.

[TheDarkWraith]

If you were to classify the war years into 3 periods of time where the allies equipment became 'harder' what would they be (starting month/day/year to ending month/day/year for each)?

[Trevally.]

If you were to classify the war years into 3 periods of time where the allies equipment became 'harder' what would they be (starting month/day/year to ending month/day/year for each)?

I like the sound of where this may be going:yeah:
Where is Gap:D

[THE_MASK]

Doesnt the naval base in the mission editor dictate the veterancy levels / doctrine / secondary and main equipment for the ships linked to it via the node form ? I can connect a node to a navel base and alter the performance levels for that node in that particular camapign ?

[Stormfly]

If you were to classify the war years into 3 periods of time where the allies equipment became 'harder' what would they be (starting month/day/year to ending month/day/year for each)?

what about interpreting the hunting vessels equipment and availability file, adding a specific factor to calculate sensor strange for the regarding momentan hunting vessels`s sensors, each time the sub got searched ?

even if the sensor isnt present in the game, it maybe could be some kind of dummy sensor just for calculation.

[gap]

If you were to classify the war years into 3 periods of time where the allies equipment became 'harder' what would they be (starting month/day/year to ending month/day/year for each)?

I like the sound of where this may be going:yeah:
Where is Gap:D

If you were to classify the war years into 3 periods of time where the allies equipment became 'harder' what would they be (starting month/day/year to ending month/day/year for each)?

difficult to give a simple answer :hmm2:

I may be wrong but I think that, as far as equipment improvements are concerned, WWII anti-submarine warfare didn't score such a big jumps ahead. At least not so big to allow us drawing the line between different phases of the conflict.
In general, even taking into account paroxysmal events of the Battle of the Atlantic, like the ones happened during the illfamed spring '44, a number of factors, both in the technical and tactical compartment, accountend for a gradual but relentless change in the balance of the war at sea in favour of Allies.
Indeed, someone more informed than me can disconfirm these last statements.

Slightly offtopic: while looking for information on the topic you've raised, I've found some information on Royal Navie's anti U-boat strategies, that you might want to have a glance at:

http://www.valoratsea.com/destroyer.htm
http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/interactive/games/battle_atlantic/index_embed.shtml

The second link refers to an educational flash game by BBC that illustrates with neat animations some common maneuvers used by convoy escorts to surround and neutralize U-boat attacks. Probably your AI routines do include most of those tactics, but I think it could be worth having a glance at them anyway :)

[Sailor Steve]

Three parts? I would have to go with:

1. 1939-1941: Sonar is still iffy, doesn't work above 12 knots, escorts are dispatched one at a time, air cover is sparse.

2. 1942-1943: Sonar is much better, escorts work in pairs, hunter/killer groups start to operate. Air cover is widespread except in mid-Atlantic.

3. !944-1945: Sonar is now effective up to 18 knots, hunter/killer groups have air support, general air cover now extends over the whole Atlantic.

[TheDarkWraith]

The reason for 3 parts is:
- minimize the amount of work to do what I'm thinking
- minimize the number of new sensors added to the game

I'm thinking of adding new sensors to the game. They will be based on the old sensors but their 'difficulty' will be based on the year range. This way IRAI will not be so hard in the beginning years but will be it's current difficulty (or worse :hmmm:) in the later years. It's the last thing to do to IRAI to make it complete in that area. My GR2 Editor/Viewer will finally let me do what I've been wanting to do also.

[Sartoris]

Sounds like a good idea!:woot:

[gap]

The reason for 3 parts is:
- minimize the amount of work to do what I'm thinking
- minimize the number of new sensors added to the game

I'm thinking of adding new sensors to the game. They will be based on the old sensors but their 'difficulty' will be based on the year range. This way IRAI will not be so hard in the beginning years but will be it's current difficulty (or worse :hmmm:) in the later years. It's the last thing to do to IRAI to make it complete in that area. My GR2 Editor/Viewer will finally let me do what I've been wanting to do also.

Good :up:

but it would be weird having abrupt changes in difficulty levels. Is there any chance that you can set window ranges between main phases?

For instance:
- 1st phase ends on 30 nov 1941: before this date "easy" IRAI settings are applied;
- 2nd phase starts on 1 feb 1942: after this date "medium" IRAI settings are applied;
- between 1 dec 1941 and 31 jan 1942 there should be some chance that either easy or medium settings are applied to each single unit/convoy/taskforce we meet in game, possibly increasing their probability to be harder opponents as we get closer to the end of the window range.

Provided that the effectiveness of the new sensors can be expressed with a number, an alternative method could be having intermediate settings that increase until reachig their maximum at the beginning of the new phase.
Finally, if both methods were viable, you could mix them for having very erratic results during intermediate phases... :hmmm:

[finchOU]

Three parts? I would have to go with:

1. 1939-1941: Sonar is still iffy, doesn't work above 12 knots, escorts are dispatched one at a time, air cover is sparse.

2. 1942-1943: Sonar is much better, escorts work in pairs, hunter/killer groups start to operate. Air cover is widespread except in mid-Atlantic.

3. !944-1945: Sonar is now effective up to 18 knots, hunter/killer groups have air support, general air cover now extends over the whole Atlantic.

Sonar as in ASDIC or Active Sonar right? What is the Hydrophone (passive Sonar) speed at which it cant be used above?

The reason for 3 parts is:
- minimize the amount of work to do what I'm thinking
- minimize the number of new sensors added to the game

I'm thinking of adding new sensors to the game. They will be based on the old sensors but their 'difficulty' will be based on the year range. This way IRAI will not be so hard in the beginning years but will be it's current difficulty (or worse :hmmm:) in the later years. It's the last thing to do to IRAI to make it complete in that area. My GR2 Editor/Viewer will finally let me do what I've been wanting to do also.

:up::up::up:

[TheDarkWraith]

Good :up:

but it would be weird having abrupt changes in difficulty levels. Is there any chance that you can set window ranges between main phases?

For instance:
- 1st phase ends on 30 nov 1941: before this date "easy" IRAI settings are applied;
- 2nd phase starts on 1 feb 1942: after this date "medium" IRAI settings are applied;
- between 1 dec 1941 and 31 jan 1942 there should be some chance that either easy or medium settings are applied to each single unit/convoy/taskforce we meet in game, possibly increasing their probability to be harder opponents as we get closer to the end of the window range.

Date ranges can and will be used, that is why I asked for them.

It will be a rather simple addition to IRAI. I'll add new bones to the sensors file so that I can make different versions of each sensor needed. The labor intensive part is editing every ship's .sns file so that the 3 date ranges are used for the sensors.

There's really no way to prevent abrupt changes. The game month/day/year will dictate which version of the sensor the unit uses. I don't really see this as a problem though. I would love to make them variable but that is just not possible to do. This is the only way I've found to add some 'variability' to the sensors used.

With the scripts I have no access to current game date so there's no way to change tactics based on game date. It would've been nice if the devs had included a function that one could call to get current game data :shifty: So even though the tactics used will be the same irregardless of current game date the sensors will be different which will accomplish some of everything I have planned for IRAI.

You have to remember that the unit can be poor, competent, veteran, elite, etc. so this adds some variability to the sensor also.

[TheDarkWraith]

Here's a quick question: why are the NCA and NCL unit's sensors non-existent? NCV and NCVE units don't look correct either sensor wise :hmmm: I wouldn't even know what sensors each of these units should have :dead:

[finchOU]

Here's a question for you.... I'm a bit new to SH5. I've attacked a couple of convoys and have noticed something.

When a ship is hit and starts flooding/slowing down....the whole convoy seems to come to a standstill while waiting for that ship or ships to sink. They do start zig zagging immediately....but they slow to a cralw or even stop for a couple of minutes.

I'm thinking Convoys had a survival of the fitest mentality while under attack. Meaning they just kept their speed up and pass the wounded ducks.

Have you guys noticed this? Is this just early war Convoy behavior (only ones i've seen are the unescorted ones)? Is there a way to fix/mod this?

[TheDarkWraith]

Here's a question for you.... I'm a bit new to SH5. I've attacked a couple of convoys and have noticed something.

When a ship is hit and starts flooding/slowing down....the whole convoy seems to come to a standstill while waiting for that ship or ships to sink. They do start zig zagging immediately....but they slow to a cralw or even stop for a couple of minutes.

I'm thinking Convoys had a survival of the fitest mentality while under attack. Meaning they just kept their speed up and pass the wounded ducks.

Have you guys noticed this? Is this just early war Convoy behavior (only ones i've seen are the unescorted ones)? Is there a way to fix/mod this?

If you hit the 'leader' of the convoy I can see this happening (and nothing can be done about it) but if it's not the leader then something is not right :hmmm:

[finchOU]

hmm...I'll try not to aim for the front row next time and I'll see what happens.

[quink99]

Three parts? I would have to go with:

1. 1939-1941: Sonar is still iffy, doesn't work above 12 knots, escorts are dispatched one at a time, air cover is sparse.

2. 1942-1943: Sonar is much better, escorts work in pairs, hunter/killer groups start to operate. Air cover is widespread except in mid-Atlantic.

3. !944-1945: Sonar is now effective up to 18 knots, hunter/killer groups have air support, general air cover now extends over the whole Atlantic.

The VLR (Very Long Range) B-24D Liberators specially modified for anti U-boat work were operating in the "Alantic Gap" in early 1943 from both Iceland, and England and, several months later, from both Canada and the nothern United States. By May of 1943 they had become very effective in cooperating with the Convoy Escort groups in the suppresion and destruction of U-boats throughout the northern "Air Gap".

[gap]

There's really no way to prevent abrupt changes. The game month/day/year will dictate which version of the sensor the unit uses. I don't really see this as a problem though. I would love to make them variable but that is just not possible to do. This is the only way I've found to add some 'variability' to the sensors used.

With the scripts I have no access to current game date so there's no way to change tactics based on game date. It would've been nice if the devs had included a function that one could call to get current game data :shifty: So even though the tactics used will be the same irregardless of current game date the sensors will be different which will accomplish some of everything I have planned for IRAI.

You have to remember that the unit can be poor, competent, veteran, elite, etc. so this adds some variability to the sensor also.

Yes I see,

we can still play with several factors controllable via ME, like aerial coverage, number and composition of escorts and, indeed, enemy unit's skills.
I Think Trevally is currently working on a general rebalance of the campaign, taking especial care of the aerial layer. :up:
Things like these will greatly affect the game difficulty during the campaign, especially if arranged in concert with the sensor's variability you want to add to IRAI. :)

[gap]

The VLR (Very Long Range) B-24D Liberators specially modified for anti U-boat work were operating in the "Alantic Gap" in early 1943 from both Iceland, and England and, several months later, from both Canada and the nothern United States. By May of 1943 they had become very effective in cooperating with the Convoy Escort groups in the suppresion and destruction of U-boats throughout the northern "Air Gap".

Yes, the cooperation between aerial and naval allied forces should be a key factor during late campaign. Though, one hopefully solvable limit I see to its implementation in game, is that as I was told once by Trevally, aircraft aren't easily assigned to escorting duties, making them hard to coordinate with naval escorts.

[Stormfly]

There's really no way to prevent abrupt changes. The game month/day/year will dictate which version of the sensor the unit uses. I don't really see this as a problem though. I would love to make them variable but that is just not possible to do. This is the only way I've found to add some 'variability' to the sensors used.

oh, arent sensors equipped using the equipment file of each vessel ? ...what about giving some escort types those newer sensors a bit later, maybe 2-3 month ? ...doing so would add some variability during the implementation phase of new equipment.

[DrJones]

oh, arent sensors equipped using the equipment file of each vessel ? ...what about giving some escort types those newer sensors a bit later, maybe 2-3 month ? ...doing so would add some variability during the implementation phase of new equipment.


@stormy: tried to write a pm but can't reach you because you have to tide up your messageboard....

[Stormfly]

@stormy: tried to write a pm but can't reach you because you have to tide up your messageboard....

ups... try again, i cleaned it up a bit :salute:

...thought good work on the sounds would be like a donation for subsim but instead of being able working on new sounds they let me clean my pm box more often..:down::rotfl2::arrgh!:

[TheDarkWraith]

Added a download link to an update for IRAI if you have my Ship's Inertia mod installed. This update will cause the maximum speed of the unit to be dictated by the amount of damage the unit has.

[THE_MASK]

Added a download link to an update for IRAI if you have my Ship's Inertia mod installed. This update will cause the maximum speed of the unit to be dictated by the amount of damage the unit has.I think i am starting to lose it . So the mod order would be .
IRAI_0_0_37_ByTheDarkWraith
TDW_No_Hydrophone_On_Surface_1_1_0
TDW_Ship_Inertia_1_1_0
TDW_IRAI_Inertia_Damage_Test (link on first page of IRAI)

Nice mods as usual :salute:

[TheDarkWraith]

I think i am starting to lose it . So the mod order would be .
IRAI_0_0_37_ByTheDarkWraith
TDW_No_Hydrophone_On_Surface_1_1_0
TDW_Ship_Inertia_1_1_0
TDW_IRAI_Inertia_Damage_Test (link on first page of IRAI)

Nice mods as usual :salute:

that'll work :up:

[THE_MASK]

AI_sub_crew_1_0_1_TheDarkWraith
FX_Update_0_0_19_ByTheDarkWraith
NewUIs_TDC_7_0_0_ByTheDarkWraith
NewUIs_TDC_7_0_0_alt_officer_wounded_by_Torpedo
NewUIs_TDC_7_0_0_Real_Navigation
NewUIs_TDC_7_0_0_RadCapTools_0_2_alpha
Manos Scopes-patch for 16x9
IRAI_0_0_37_ByTheDarkWraith
TDW_No_Hydrophone_On_Surface_1_1_0
TDW_Ship_Inertia_1_1_0
TDW_IRAI_Inertia_Damage_Test

[TheDarkWraith]

AI_sub_crew_1_0_1_TheDarkWraith
FX_Update_0_0_19_ByTheDarkWraith
NewUIs_TDC_7_0_0_ByTheDarkWraith
NewUIs_TDC_7_0_0_alt_officer_wounded_by_Torpedo
NewUIs_TDC_7_0_0_Real_Navigation
NewUIs_TDC_7_0_0_RadCapTools_0_2_alpha
Manos Scopes-patch for 16x9
IRAI_0_0_37_ByTheDarkWraith
TDW_No_Hydrophone_On_Surface_1_1_0
TDW_Ship_Inertia_1_1_0
TDW_IRAI_Inertia_Damage_Test

Looks good. Let me know what you think of the ship inertia and the ship's maximum speed being dictated by amount of damage incurred.

What should happen is when you torpedo the unit it won't instantly slow down. Because of the ship interia mod it will slow down gradually finally settling on a speed that is <= maximum speed for damage incurred.

[THE_MASK]

The armed trawler has water over the decks in 0/ms wind . I observed this while in kiel harbor .

[gap]

The armed trawler has water over the decks in 0/ms wind . I observed this while in kiel harbor .

Good starting point for converting it in the first or second non stock SH5 submarine unit :D

[Tonci87]

Looks good. Let me know what you think of the ship inertia and the ship's maximum speed being dictated by amount of damage incurred.

What should happen is when you torpedo the unit it won't instantly slow down. Because of the ship interia mod it will slow down gradually finally settling on a speed that is <= maximum speed for damage incurred.

Where would this mod
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=163930
come in the list?
It´s a nice little mod that lets ships sink over time after they have been struck by torps.

[volodya61]

Anywhere..

[minett]

im not sure if others suffer this but here it goes using this mod which i may ad is great :-) .

on attacking a convoy i move into position and sit and wait submerged for the convoy to almost be on top of me .

soon as i move out of silent running the escorts descover me and dc ..

they dont even no im there just cant run in anything but silent running im only in 1940 so i cant see the escorts being able to find me that easy .

i cant get a clear run on a convoy because of this .

can anyone help ???

[Sartoris]

Post your mod list, maybe there's something odd about it.

[minett]

hi Sartoris

thanks for your prompt response

my mod list is as follows im unsure if im honest if its in the correct order i know a few are

Accurate German Flags
RemoveLogoIntroTheDarkWraith
sobers green spinning thing SH5
NDB,NDH OM#1 - No Dialog Indicator
Dynamic Environment SH5 Basemod (normal ) V2.1
Dynamic Environment SH5 DarkerNights V2.1
stoianm colored exterior mod v2 (low color)
Dynamic Environment SH5 v 2.1 - Skycolor Hotfix #1
sobers better terrain v3 SH5
sobers best ever fog V12 SH5
sobers best ever waves V5 SH5
North Atlantic Green 1.1
sobers see thru wake fix
sobers_realistic_underwater_FX2
sobers 3D deck spray mod V7
Window_Lights_Redone_V1
SteelViking's Interior Mod V1.2
SteelViking's Interior Mod V1.2.2 Patch
NewUIs_TDC_6_9_0_ByTheDarkWraith
NewUIs_TDC_6_9_0_alt_officer_wounded_by_Torpedo
NewUIs_TDC_6_9_2_Patch_ByTheDarkWraith
NewUIs_TDC_6_9_2_Patch_RadCapTools_0_2_alpha
MightyFine Crew Mod 1.2.1 Alt faces
MCCD_1.04_MFCM_1.2.1_compatible
Stormys DBSM SH5 v1.3 Basemod
Rubini_Crash_dive_fix_for MCFM 1.2.1&MCCD v1.3b_For_All
FX_Update_0_0_19_ByTheDarkWraith
IRAI_0_0_37_ByTheDarkWraith
TDW_No_Hydrophone_On_Surface_1_1_0
AI_sub_crew_1_0_2_TheDarkWraith
Cerberus62 Corrected Depth Charge Projector 1.0
Reworked Morale and Abilities v.1.01
OPEN HORIZONS II_full v1.9
OHII Higher Tonnage Objectives for v1.9
OHIIv1.9_Patch1
OHII_traffic_speed_Fix_v2
sobers green crew training V3 SH5
TDW FX Fix for Sobers chimney smoke
sobers NO water drops V1
sobers Lights Cfg V4 SH5
sobers no footstep sound mod
Shadow Improvement ModLR
SH5Lifeboats_by_Rongel_TDW_stoianm_v2.11
sobers bad weather deck gun V1 SH5
U-boat Historical Specifications 1.7 for TDW Mods
stoianm upgrade available mod stock file


thanks in advance Minett :arrgh!:

[Sartoris]

Nothing about your mod list strikes me as odd, it's even a bit similar to my own. Have you fiddled with the IRAI files in any way?

[minett]

no i have just installed them as normal i havent messed with cfg setting nothing its baffling me , im wondering if U-boat Historical Specifications 1.7 for TDW might be the reason as i installed it after i started a campaign .


Its a shame that the game its self is so bugged that without these great mods its just useless .

[Tonci87]

no i have just installed them as normal i havent messed with cfg setting nothing its baffling me , im wondering if U-boat Historical Specifications 1.7 for TDW might be the reason as i installed it after i started a campaign .


Its a shame that the game its self is so bugged that without these great mods its just useless .
That might indeed be the reason. I think historical Uboats requires a new campaign, or a new patrol at least.

[minett]

i defo started a new patrol and added it on the happy times period when we get moved to france after completing coastal waters .

is there a single player misson that good for testing this mod that i could perhaps try ??

because surely if it is indeed an effect of the campaign then that wouldnt effect a single mission etc ??


p.s thanks for the imput so far guys

[Trevally.]

I may be wrong but I dont think that mod is needed anymore....IRAI does it all:hmmm:

[Tonci87]

I may be wrong but I dont think that mod is needed anymore....IRAI does it all:hmmm:
You mean historical subs? Doesn´t it alter the speed turning rate etc of the sub? :06:

[minett]

ill try by removing that mod , seems a shame if that is the case :wah:

[minett]

i removed U-boat Historical Specifications , and my problem still happens im at 40 feet at ahead standard dived long before i came in view destroyers go over the top here my im dc .. Im at a loss to no what to , there is conflict in my mods order somewhere i just cant pin point it and its ruined this great mod for me :/\\!!

[CharlieFirpo]

First of all a very very good mod, many thanks that at last we can enjoy this (unfortunately) half-way done Ubi software :smug:

What I would like to ask, after short checking the 0.0.37-er version:
Airplanes: checked and tested on the two custom single mission: For me the fighter is arriving, strafing one (maybe two, in the second round), but after that it is just circling over me and nothing happens...the torpedo bomber the same. Releases the torpedo, comes back and circles. Every time they are just over me, but no shooting or nothing (after the first 1-2 round).
For eg. for the 0.0.30-er version the fighter is coming back and shooting until I am fully holed (not just circling). The torpedo bomber releases its load and leaves the area (moves forward to the direction and flies away).

(so the 0.0.30-er is more realistic in this way)

Is there anything behind of this? Currently I have overwritten the Airplane.aix with the old 0.0.30-er file.
The bombs from the fighter were also released just once.

My mod-list:
- Real flooding 1.3
- Irai 0.37 (NEWEST) - with 0.30-er Airplane
- Morale mod (or morale system quickfix)
- Old style explosions 1.1
- Interior mod 1.2
- Campaign update
- Capthelms audio mod
- Conus Graphics mod

Any help is mostly appreciated,
Thank You guys :cool:
Laszlo

[Sartoris]

I've been using Sober's mod list, and it works great, but I noticed one thing: sometimes when I am submerged and destroyers are hunting above me, I can rise to the surface and they won't fire their guns at me. I tried it several times now. Basically, they always shoot when they see me for the first time, but if I then submerge and come back to the surface, they hold fire until I start shooting. The moment I allow my gunners to open fire (literally the moment I click the fire at will button), the AI destroyers do so too, so we start firing simultaneously. I've had destroyers following me like this without shooting for long distances, and they only shoot if I do it first.

[THE_MASK]

I've been using Sober's mod list, and it works great, but I noticed one thing: sometimes when I am submerged and destroyers are hunting above me, I can rise to the surface and they won't fire their guns at me. I tried it several times now. Basically, they always shoot when they see me for the first time, but if I then submerge and come back to the surface, they hold fire until I start shooting. The moment I allow my gunners to open fire (literally the moment I click the fire at will button), the AI destroyers do so too, so we start firing simultaneously. I've had destroyers following me like this without shooting for long distances, and they only shoot if I do it first.The beauty about using the same mod list is that we can work together to work problems out .

[Sartoris]

I didn't enable that mod because of the conflict. I decided to make a smaller list than yours so here it is:


Generic Mod Enabler - v2.6.0.157
[C:\Igre\SilentHunter\MODS]

RemoveLogoIntroTheDarkWraith
DBM Background Video
No Damn Bubbles, No Damn Halo Mod
NDB,NDH OM#1 - No Dialog Indicator
Dynamic Environment SH5 Basemod (realistic version) V2.1
Dynamic Environment SH5 BrighterNights V2.1
Dynamic Environment SH5 Sounds V2.1
Dynamic Environmental SH5 Realistic Colors V2.1
Dynamic Environment SH5 Waves (realistic version) V2.1
Window_Lights_Redone_V1
Equipment_Upgrades_Fix_v1_4_byTheBeast
Equipment_Upgrades_Fix_v1_4_Patch_1
#Equipment_Upgrades_Fix_v1_4_Patch_1_HotFix
Eqp_Upgrades_fix_v1.4 dates by sober Patch V2
FX_Update_0_0_19_ByTheDarkWraith
NewUIs_TDC_7_1_0_ByTheDarkWraith
Manos Scopes-patch for 16x9
IRAI_0_0_37_ByTheDarkWraith
TDW_No_Hydrophone_On_Surface_1_1_0
OPEN HORIZONS II_full v2
Reworked Morale and Abilities v.1.01
Grossdeutscher Rundfunk
SteelViking's Interior Mod V1.2
SteelViking's Interior Mod V1.2.2 Patch
Trevally Automated Scripts v0.6
Trevally Harbour & Kiel Canal Pilot v2.9
sobers no footstep sound mod
Shadow Improvement Mod
NewUIs_TDC_7_1_0_Real_Navigation

The bug (if it is a bug, and not just a mod conflict) I wrote about doesn't strike me as too problematic, but who knows, it might cause some other problems down the line.

EDIT: I'll give more details: I only noticed the bug happen after I save and reload on the open sea, and then after a while encounter some escorts (who were not around when I save, I never save around other ships). I did not notice it happening at the beginning of a new career, but I will try it out today and pay more attention. The game is patched to 1.2 and with TDW's patcher (all patches enabled), it's a fresh install, no prior mods.

[Sartoris]

One more thing: I just noticed I can't drag and drop the external torpedo. I fired one torpedo, reloaded it, and then wanted to drag the external torpedo into the space that appeared in my tubes. However, the game wouldn't let me. I was not submerged, of course.

EDIT: Seems like it comes and goes. I reloaded a saved game and the issue was gone. Still, it's not good that it happens from time to time.

[Trevally.]

One more thing: I just noticed I can't drag and drop the external torpedo. I fired one torpedo, reloaded it, and then wanted to drag the external torpedo into the space that appeared in my tubes. However, the game wouldn't let me. I was not submerged, of course.

EDIT: Seems like it comes and goes. I reloaded a saved game and the issue was gone. Still, it's not good that it happens from time to time.

How was the sea state:06:
If high wind and waves - no ext torps

[The General]

@TDW,

I still have the bug where a friendly or enemy Escort locks onto you, at roughly 20 km distance off your Port Stern/Starboard Stern, and folows you all over the Map until you save/reload. When you stop, it circles a spot at same 20 Km distance. It is a bug that has existed since Silent Hunter 5 V1.0 came out. Is this a hardcoded problem that can never be fixed? I know you probably rarely play the game, and are busy working miracles in other departments.

I am using OHII v2
Your UI
and your IRAI, latest version.

But, this bug seems to be there no matter what Mod you use.

[Sartoris]

How was the sea state:06:
If high wind and waves - no ext torps

You're right, it's possible that was the problem.

[Sartoris]

@TDW,

I still have the bug where a friendly or enemy Escort locks onto you, at roughly 20 km distance off your Port Stern/Starboard Stern, and folows you all over the Map until you save/reload. When you stop, it circles a spot at same 20 Km distance. It is a bug that has existed since Silent Hunter 5 V1.0 came out. Is this a hardcoded problem that can never be fixed? I know you probably rarely play the game, and are busy working miracles in other departments.

I am using OHII v2
Your UI
and your IRAI, latest version.

But, this bug seems to be there no matter what Mod you use.

Yes, this still happens occasionally. I hope there's a way to fix this.

Also, whenever there are multiple destroyers hunting for me, I always see at least one go down due to friendly collision. The last time I played, a large warship plowed right through three (!) of his own escorts. I understand there's not much you can do about this, but maybe you could set a distance the enemy ships have to keep between each other.:hmmm:

[TheDarkWraith]

Yes, this still happens occasionally. I hope there's a way to fix this.

Also, whenever there are multiple destroyers hunting for me, I always see at least one go down due to friendly collision. The last time I played, a large warship plowed right through three (!) of his own escorts. I understand there's not much you can do about this, but maybe you could set a distance the enemy ships have to keep between each other.:hmmm:

I have yet to have this happen to me. Once it does I'll be able to use the built in AI editor to possibly see why this is happening. Until then there's nothing I can do about it.

The collision routines are hard-coded in the exe (possibly in one of the act files). I have yet to locate them.

[Sartoris]

I have yet to have this happen to me. Once it does I'll be able to use the built in AI editor to possibly see why this is happening. Until then there's nothing I can do about it.

The collision routines are hard-coded in the exe (possibly in one of the act files). I have yet to locate them.

I was recording the session, so I took some screenshots from the movie, which you can find below. I also added my mod list under the photos, which is based on sober's mod list. I did not modify any of the files. Let me know if there's any way I can help you with this problem: maybe I can copy some data or send you some files?

http://i1196.photobucket.com/albums/aa419/sartoris36/wmplayer2012-08-1410-52-38-30.jpg

Here is the first one. The capital ship rammed his escort, then backed away.

http://i1196.photobucket.com/albums/aa419/sartoris36/wmplayer2012-08-1410-54-07-05.jpg

Not even I can do this.

http://i1196.photobucket.com/albums/aa419/sartoris36/wmplayer2012-08-1410-54-42-55.jpg

A second one is rammed and sits burning next to the first one.

http://i1196.photobucket.com/albums/aa419/sartoris36/wmplayer2012-08-1410-55-53-31.jpg

The capital ship heads straight for his third escort...

http://i1196.photobucket.com/albums/aa419/sartoris36/wmplayer2012-08-1410-56-03-73.jpg

...rams his bow...

http://i1196.photobucket.com/albums/aa419/sartoris36/wmplayer2012-08-1410-56-11-61.jpg

...and the escort explodes!

http://i1196.photobucket.com/albums/aa419/sartoris36/wmplayer2012-08-1410-56-27-67.jpg

A different angle.

http://i1196.photobucket.com/albums/aa419/sartoris36/wmplayer2012-08-1410-57-26-77.jpg

After so much ramming the capital ship sustains damage and starts burning. They're pretty much doing my work for me!

My mod list:


Generic Mod Enabler - v2.6.0.157
[C:\Igre\SilentHunter\MODS]

RemoveLogoIntroTheDarkWraith
DBM Background Video
No Damn Bubbles, No Damn Halo Mod
NDB,NDH OM#1 - No Dialog Indicator
Dynamic Environment SH5 Basemod (realistic version) V2.1
Dynamic Environment SH5 BrighterNights V2.1
Dynamic Environment SH5 Sounds V2.1
Dynamic Environmental SH5 Realistic Colors V2.1
Dynamic Environment SH5 Waves (realistic version) V2.1
Window_Lights_Redone_V1
Equipment_Upgrades_Fix_v1_4_byTheBeast
Equipment_Upgrades_Fix_v1_4_Patch_1
#Equipment_Upgrades_Fix_v1_4_Patch_1_HotFix
Eqp_Upgrades_fix_v1.4 dates by sober Patch V2
FX_Update_0_0_19_ByTheDarkWraith
NewUIs_TDC_7_1_0_ByTheDarkWraith
Manos Scopes-patch for 16x9
IRAI_0_0_37_ByTheDarkWraith
TDW_No_Hydrophone_On_Surface_1_1_0
OPEN HORIZONS II_full v2
Reworked Morale and Abilities v.1.01
Grossdeutscher Rundfunk
SteelViking's Interior Mod V1.2
SteelViking's Interior Mod V1.2.2 Patch
Trevally Automated Scripts v0.6
Trevally Harbour & Kiel Canal Pilot v2.9
sobers no footstep sound mod
Shadow Improvement Mod
NewUIs_TDC_7_1_0_Real_Navigation

[Cybermat47]

Just wondering, do the wolfpacks respond to contact reports with v0.0.37?

[The General]

I have yet to have this happen to me. Once it does I'll be able to use the built in AI editor to possibly see why this is happening. Until then there's nothing I can do about it.It may not be immediately apparent TDW, because the trailing Escort stays just out visual range, so you can only pick him up on Sonar. If you have your 'no surface sonar mod' activated then you won't see him unless you submerge for a while. The game slows down during TC, which is an indicator that this has occured and he's become 'attached'. It takes a save/reload to shake him off.

I restarted the campaign yesterday, and this anomally occured during OHII's Scapa Flow mission. After sailing through Kiel Canal, passing closely by Hegoland, with TC engaged, I found that the game slowed (stuttering during only x1024 TC) for 100 miles into open water. I went to x1 TC, submerged to check sonar, and sure enough there he was; a friendly Escort, following me at roughly 10 - 20 km.

I don't expect you to spend any time specifically looking for this event, I just wanted to make you aware of it. It's kind of a big immersion killer. All the best.

[Cybermat47]

YOU HAVE TO BE PATCHED TO v1.2 OF THE GAME!!!

Umm... actually, no.:har:

[Cybermat47]

For some reason U-Boats are only attacking un-escorted convoys in my game.
Any thoughts on how to mmake them go after escorted convoys?

[Cybermat47]

For some reason U-Boats are only attacking un-escorted convoys in my game.
Any thoughts on how to mmake them go after escorted convoys?

Oh wait, they only piss themselves when there are destroyers.

[TheDarkWraith]

Oh wait, they only piss themselves when there are destroyers.

They will always try and evade escorts, destroyers, basically any warship. Even if they are attacking a merchant and a warship is close they will call off the attack and evade :up: They have somewhat of a brain now :D

[Rongel]

It may not be immediately apparent TDW, because the trailing Escort stays just out visual range, so you can only pick him up on Sonar. If you have your 'no surface sonar mod' activated then you won't see him unless you submerge for a while. The game slows down during TC, which is an indicator that this has occured and he's become 'attached'. It takes a save/reload to shake him off.

I restarted the campaign yesterday, and this anomally occured during OHII's Scapa Flow mission. After sailing through Kiel Canal, passing closely by Hegoland, with TC engaged, I found that the game slowed (stuttering during only x1024 TC) for 100 miles into open water. I went to x1 TC, submerged to check sonar, and sure enough there he was; a friendly Escort, following me at roughly 10 - 20 km.

I don't expect you to spend any time specifically looking for this event, I just wanted to make you aware of it. It's kind of a big immersion killer. All the best.

This happened to me two times in a row. First was really irritating, I was being depth charged for a while but then seemed to lose the destroyer. But it was still circling behind me, doing really small circles and still steadily following me (i was going 1 knots, silent running). When I changed course, so did the destroyer. Wasn't sure if this was a bug because after several hours the destroyer left. But I could see that it was still following me, just keeping 7 kilometers distance. I saved the game and loaded it again to get rid of the bug, but it didn't go away!

The destroyer changed course and was now 12 kilometers from me. I continued my course back to base, and the destroyer was escorting me back to Germany! I could see it in the distance, not following behind but cruising right in front of me! So days passed and I finally started to approach coast. I sent a contact report from the destroyer, and soon the planes came. But the destroyer shot them down and suddenly "awoke" and was charging towards me. After few hours of depth charging, the destroyer finally gave up and left back to England....

Second case was today when a whole task force of destroyers started to follow me, keeping 20 kilometers distance. Saving and loading fixed this issue.

Maybe it was just bad luck, but it seemed that this behaviour is more common now, could some mod increase the possibility? It was a interesting find to see that the destroyer could "wake up" from the following mode, when planes attacked it, could this mechanic be used somehow to fix this issue? Like the General said, it is a big immersion killer.

[Captain73]

:salute: Hi TheDarkWraith! Hi! With mod IRAI_0_0_37_ByTheDarkWraith I have big problems of the destroyers of the enemy in 1939 and in 1940! Although I know the weak anti-submarine defense in 39-40! Can You ask for advise me to put the weaker fashion IRAI? :hmmm:
1939 IRAI______ ?
1940 IRAI______ ?
1941 IRAI______ ?
1942 IRAI______ ?
1943-45 IRAI_0_0_37_ByTheDarkWraith
Thanks for the help!

[Sartoris]

This happened to me two times in a row. First was really irritating, I was being depth charged for a while but then seemed to lose the destroyer. But it was still circling behind me, doing really small circles and still steadily following me (i was going 1 knots, silent running). When I changed course, so did the destroyer. Wasn't sure if this was a bug because after several hours the destroyer left. But I could see that it was still following me, just keeping 7 kilometers distance. I saved the game and loaded it again to get rid of the bug, but it didn't go away!

The destroyer changed course and was now 12 kilometers from me. I continued my course back to base, and the destroyer was escorting me back to Germany! I could see it in the distance, not following behind but cruising right in front of me! So days passed and I finally started to approach coast. I sent a contact report from the destroyer, and soon the planes came. But the destroyer shot them down and suddenly "awoke" and was charging towards me. After few hours of depth charging, the destroyer finally gave up and left back to England....

Second case was today when a whole task force of destroyers started to follow me, keeping 20 kilometers distance. Saving and loading fixed this issue.

Maybe it was just bad luck, but it seemed that this behaviour is more common now, could some mod increase the possibility? It was a interesting find to see that the destroyer could "wake up" from the following mode, when planes attacked it, could this mechanic be used somehow to fix this issue? Like the General said, it is a big immersion killer.

I agree, this is a huge problem, because you can never know if a destroyer is bugged or not. I hope TDW will soon focus on this and help us out. I'm sure he can do it, he proved he can crack tougher nuts than this one! :rock::up:

[Magic1111]

Hi TDW!

I read somewhere on the Forum, that we don´t need anymore (can be disable) the MOD "TheDarkWraith_DC_Water_Disturbances_v2_0_SH5" when we use IRAI v0.0.37.

Is this correct? :hmmm:

Best regards,
Magic

[volodya61]

..Is this correct? :hmmm:..

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=1874065&postcount=1713

[Magic1111]

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=1874065&postcount=1713

Aaah, okay, thx! :up:

I didn´t found this post! :oops:

Best regards,
Magic:salute:

[chun]

Hello TDW, belong to a virtual flotilla (www.24Flotilla.com (http://www.24Flotilla.com)) we played much multiplayer, we like to attack convoys in droves,(wolfpack) we have observed that with the latest version of IRAIv0.0.37, escorts not very precise in their attacks when we discovered, launched their loads quite far from their position subtracting emotion submarines to attack, because we have never been sunk, and the attack on the convoy becomes a duck shooting.Do nothing but give circles around,in previous versions, if you have more precision.attacks were more complicated and fun.
Question: Could you put more precision attacks by bodyguards when they launch their depth charges? Can you tell us how it's done?
AI? Vary their behavior in multiplayer or does it just as campaigning?
Sorry my bad English I have to use a translator
Thank you very much.

[TheDarkWraith]

Hello TDW, belong to a virtual flotilla (www.24Flotilla.com (http://www.24Flotilla.com)) we played much multiplayer, we like to attack convoys in droves,(wolfpack) we have observed that with the latest version of IRAIv0.0.37, escorts not very precise in their attacks when we discovered, launched their loads quite far from their position subtracting emotion submarines to attack, because we have never been sunk, and the attack on the convoy becomes a duck shooting.Do nothing but give circles around,in previous versions, if you have more precision.attacks were more complicated and fun.
Question: Could you put more precision attacks by bodyguards when they launch their depth charges? Can you tell us how it's done?
AI? Vary their behavior in multiplayer or does it just as campaigning?
Sorry my bad English I have to use a translator
Thank you very much.

What are your difficulty settings set at? Ensure they are all at stock (as designed) values. Are you also using my DC water disturbances mod? If so, disable it. If the AI is still too easy for you then you could adjust the settings in \data\Cfg\Sim.cfg (make the changes in yellow):

[Hydrophone]
Detection time=1.0 ;[s]
; lower values then 1 make it harder for AI to detect you
Sensitivity=1.0 ;(0..1)
Height factor=0 ;[m]
Waves factor=0.5 ;[>=0]
Speed factor=14 ;[kt]
;1 is on the deaf side
;0.10 is on the uber end
Noise factor=0.2 ;[>=0] was 1.3, decreased by 74.5%
Thermal Layer Signal Attenuation=1.0 ;[>0], 1 means no signal reduction, 3 equals signal reduction to 33% was 3.0, decreased by 55%
Min Signal Strength=0.1

[Sonar]
;how long you have to be in the AI's active sonar cone before he will start pinging.
Detection time=1.0 ;[s] was 5
; lower values than 1 make it harder for AI to detect you
Sensitivity=1.0 ;(0..1)
Waves factor=0.2 ;[>=0]
Speed factor=15 ;[kt]
;how much surface area you present to the AI for him to ping off of, before he gets a ping
;think of this variable as to how much "slop" you can have when pointing your bow or stern at an approaching AI to minimize your profile
Enemy surface factor=175 ;[m2] was 520, decreased by 35%
Lose time=20 ;[s]
Min Signal Strength=0.1
Thermal Layer Signal Attenuation=1.25 ;[>0], 1 means no signal reduction, 5 equals signal reduction to 20% was 5.0, decreased by 70%


Those changes will spice things up for sure :yep:

I removed the pinpoint accuracy the warships had in the latest version because people were complaining. You're now seeing that the AI really has no clue where you are unless you are actually spotted.

[chun]

TDW thank you very much, do these changes and test.:salute:

[CaliEs]

Maybe this can be integrated into IRAI: Destroyer tactics "Plaster" and "Creeper"
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=197130

http://silentseawolvesmsw.devhub.com/blog/590526-anti-submarine-warfare-asw/

[gap]

Maybe this can be integrated into IRAI: Destroyer tactics "Plaster" and "Creeper"
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=197130

http://silentseawolvesmsw.devhub.com/blog/590526-anti-submarine-warfare-asw/

...and 'beta search', 'pineapple' and 'raspberry' :03:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/worldwars/wwtwo/launch_gms_battle_atlantic.shtml

[chun]

What are your difficulty settings set at? Ensure they are all at stock (as designed) values. Are you also using my DC water disturbances mod? If so, disable it. If the AI is still too easy for you then you could adjust the settings in \data\Cfg\Sim.cfg (make the changes in yellow):

[Hydrophone]
Detection time=1.0 ;[s]
; lower values then 1 make it harder for AI to detect you
Sensitivity=1.0 ;(0..1)
Height factor=0 ;[m]
Waves factor=0.5 ;[>=0]
Speed factor=14 ;[kt]
;1 is on the deaf side
;0.10 is on the uber end
Noise factor=0.2 ;[>=0] was 1.3, decreased by 74.5%
Thermal Layer Signal Attenuation=1.0 ;[>0], 1 means no signal reduction, 3 equals signal reduction to 33% was 3.0, decreased by 55%
Min Signal Strength=0.1

[Sonar]
;how long you have to be in the AI's active sonar cone before he will start pinging.
Detection time=1.0 ;[s] was 5
; lower values than 1 make it harder for AI to detect you
Sensitivity=1.0 ;(0..1)
Waves factor=0.2 ;[>=0]
Speed factor=15 ;[kt]
;how much surface area you present to the AI for him to ping off of, before he gets a ping
;think of this variable as to how much "slop" you can have when pointing your bow or stern at an approaching AI to minimize your profile
Enemy surface factor=175 ;[m2] was 520, decreased by 35%
Lose time=20 ;[s]
Min Signal Strength=0.1
Thermal Layer Signal Attenuation=1.25 ;[>0], 1 means no signal reduction, 5 equals signal reduction to 20% was 5.0, decreased by 70%


Those changes will spice things up for sure :yep:

I removed the pinpoint accuracy the warships had in the latest version because people were complaining. You're now seeing that the AI really has no clue where you are unless you are actually spotted.
Hello TDW've made the changes suggested by you on file and got Sim.cfg be detected before, but the AI behavior remains search patterns in circles around the submarine, and we know where we have set but not attacking with precision, depth charges continue to fall away from the submarine's position, I do not remember anyone being sunk by the destroyers, there are no reports of death in action of our players, with this behavior, the AI is still very easy,:nope: remember that IRAI in previous versions were much harder. Our difficulty setting is 69% and did not use the TheDarkWraith_DC_Water_Disturbances_v2_0_SH5.Why AI behaves differently in multiplayer mode single?
One question:
What file. Aix, makes them behave this way?
Could you make a much closer IA AI SH3?:hmmm:
Thank you very much for your attention, we know we have a lot of work with the patches for. Exe, we value your hard work.:salute:

[WOLFNMA81]

Hello TDW, i am friend of Chun and i am from the 24Flotilla Geweih.

I am studing the diferents Actions of the AI whit your IRAI Mod and AI of stock game.
-In the stock game AI, the destroyers go to center of the submarine, it what do easy to avoid the DepthCharges if we accelerate.

-Other problem is when the destroyers pass over the submarine dont fire depth charges.
I have changed the value in the File Ship_Weapons.aix, in the line Precond, the value before was -4:




strategy DCRacks(Ship)
{
precond
{
Ship:CanFireDCRacks() and Ship:GetContactDepth() <= -1.0 and Ship:GetCurrentSpeed() >= 2 #SUBISSUBMERGEDDEPTH

I expected what that problem finished, but destroyers dont shoot depth charges when they pass just over contact.
What happend?: Hmmm:

You could give me anyone solution please?: 06:

We like your work TDW : Rock:but seem dont work good the mod IRAI, the destroyers follow strategy but they dont attack the submarine whit accuracy.

Sorry by my inglish, i am learning.: Saber:
Thanks by your work TDW, you have changed this game: Rock:

[Lauxman]

Is there a way to upload this to a site that isn't mediafire or megaupload? Such as gamefront, or here on subsim. In Afghanistan we can't download from Mediafire.

[Loltak]

Hello all,
I have "stupid" question :oops:.
I saw on various post, and on the first page of the threat : Leave the difficulty to 1.0
But at what is it referring?
In the option panel, it's some box to check, giving % of difficulty so i guess it is something else. A config file perharps?

Thanks :)

[Echolot]

A config file perharps?
IRAI_0_0_37_TheDarkWraith.7z\IRAI_0_0_37_ByTheDark Wraith\MODS\IRAI_0_0_37_ByTheDarkWraith\data\Scrip ts\AI\init.aix

Try to edit the file with text editor.

:salute:

[Loltak]

Hi,
Ok, thanks because i will not able to find it by myself! :yeah:

It's on viewing all these files that you realise the big work done by TheDarkWraith :salute:
Bye

[Interpol]

I seem to get random CTD's mostly when going near ports. Deactivated IRAI and they stopped.

Edit: Starting to think BRF may have something to do with this.
Edit 2: Disabled BRF but still having CTD, seems like its happening 4 - 5 minutes of getting into the game, close by to one of these glitched spawns.

Also seem to get ships spawning in one another and cant move, but I'm sure thats a different mod, trying to track down which one.

[flostt]

Are you using TDW's FX Update at the same time ??

BARF and FX Update are not compatible !!

[Interpol]

Are you using TDW's FX Update at the same time ??

BARF and FX Update are not compatible !!

I disabled BRF and it's still crashing, trying a new career to see if that fixes anything.

[tonschk]

I disabled BRF and it's still crashing, trying a new career to see if that fixes anything.

Remember to delete the "Documents" which are inside the Mod before enable the Mod, apparently from what I hear in this Forums is not healthy to enable Mods with "Documents" still inside
__________________

[johan_d]

Remember to delete the "Documents" which are inside the Mod before enable the Mod, apparently from what I hear in this Forums is not healthy to enable Mods with "Documents" still inside
__________________

Is this really true ?.. I am hunting random CTD's... is this linked ?:hmmm:

[Interpol]

Can gladly say I'm not getting any CTD atm (touch wood) and no ships spawning inside one another.

[mishuleu155]

How can i turn off starshells. Cause major lag when they are launched.

[volodya61]

How can i turn off starshells. Cause major lag when they are launched.

It's not IRAI issue.. see FX Update thread..

[mishuleu155]

If i activate with jsgme only irai mod those starshells appears. If i put only the fx mod with the modified tweaks they are not launching. If i put first fx update and second irai or vice versa appears again.

[mishuleu155]

success:yeah:

I made this modifications.

Ship weapons:
#

strategy ShipFire(Ship)
{
precond
{
Ship:ContactPresenceIs(PRESENCE_SENSORS, 0) or (Ship:ContactPresenceIs(PRESENCE_LOOSING, 0) and Ship:GetContactLostTime() <= 360.0)
}
strategies
{
DC,
Cannons,
CannonsAtSubmerged,
#CheckStarshellEnable,
ShipFireStarShells,
ShipFireStarShellsDistance


I deleted the "ShipFireStarShells" and "ShipFireStarShellsDistance" in IRAI mod.

I hope it will help those who have ATI cards.:salute:

[finchOU]

"If you are using my Ship's Inertia mod then you'll want to update IRAI with this: http://www.mediafire.com/?r6mxk65jaxmb9fu
This will allow the maximum speed of the unit to be dictated by damage incurred. Enabling this without my Ship's interia mod installed will cause the ship's to instantly slow down when they are damaged."

So I install this after IRAI....will this coflict with Critical Torps?



RemoveLogoIntroTheDarkWraith
Dynamic Environment SH5 Basemod (realistic version) V2.1
Dynamic Environment SH5 DarkerNights V2.1
sobers best ever fog V20 SH5
MightyFine Crew Mod 1.2.1 Alt w beards
MCCD_1.04_MFCM_1.2.1_compatible
German U-Boat Crew Language Pack
Speech fixes and additions (german version)
Stormys DBSM SH5 v1.3 Basemod
TDW_Ship_Inertia_1_1_0
FX_Update_0_0_19_ByTheDarkWraith
NewUIs_TDC_7_2_0_ByTheDarkWraith
NewUIs_TDC_7_2_0_Real_Navigation
IRAI_0_0_37_ByTheDarkWraith
OPEN HORIZONS II_full v2
NewUIs_TDC_7_2_0_New_radio_messages_German
SteelViking's Interior Mod V1.2
Critical hits 1.1 Torpedos
SH5Lifeboats_by_Rongel_TDW_stoianm_v2.11
sobers green crew training V4 SH5
No magic skills v1.5 MCCD compatible
sobers no footstep sound mod
Trevally Automated Scripts v0.6
OH II Minefield map for TDWs Ui
SH5 Longer Repairs v.1_Stock


EDIT: Nevermind...I figured it out.... posted below from Ships Inertia Thread.

"Here is something to test with IRAI and this interia mod enabled: http://www.mediafire.com/?r6mxk65jaxmb9fu

It will limit the max speed of the units based on damage incurred. For warships the max speed penalty is 35% of max speed of the unit. For merchants the max speed penalty is 25% of max speed of the unit.

To enable: you must have IRAI and this interia mod enabled. Unzip to MODS folder and enable LAST via JSGME.

I'm curious to know outcomes of this" TDW

[mishuleu155]

Where ca i find TDW_Ship_Inertia_1_1_0.

[mishuleu155]

Nevermind i found it.:salute:

[Trevally.]

Download from subsim http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=3866
:up:

[THE_MASK]

After some minutes of testing with my latest fog (which imo is the best medium fog yet) i have come to the conclusion that the Visual fog factor should be as below .
;Submarine player sensors detection parameters
[SensorParameters]
;Visual.
Visual fog factor=0.875 ;[>=0]
thankyou .
http://i50.tinypic.com/27wrj15.jpg

[TheDarkWraith]

I just figured out how to have airplanes and subs use more AI commands than they originally had. This is exciting :D

Now I can get the damage amount of an airplane...I can do things with airplanes that wasn't possible before :rock:

[gap]

I just figured out how to have airplanes and subs use more AI commands than they originally had. This is exciting :D

Now I can get the damage amount of an airplane...I can do things with airplanes that wasn't possible before :rock:

Man, I have to admit that I am in love with your brain and with this continuous "figuring out" process which is going on in it ;) :D

[Hinrich Schwab]

I just figured out how to have airplanes and subs use more AI commands than they originally had. This is exciting :D

Now I can get the damage amount of an airplane...I can do things with airplanes that wasn't possible before :rock:

I am certain that your discovery will open new and more realistic avenues in the next revisions to IRAI.:) With that said, I must address my crew....ALARMTAUCHEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!:Kaleun_Periskop:

[Trevally.]

Man, I have to admit that I am in love with your brain

:hmmm:


http://img827.imageshack.us/img827/3808/ilovebrain4.jpg


BRAINS (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=169859)

[gap]

http://planetarybargains.com/PBPictures/Tee%20Shirts/X-T-Z/The%20Mind%20Is%20A%20Wonderful%20Thing%20To%20Was te%20Shirt%20White%20Front.jpg

:yep: :O:

[TheDarkWraith]

This is awesome! I finally have planes changing heading and altitudes when coming in to bomb and torpedo you :D Finally I can do what I've always wanted to do.

And I have kamikaze's coded in :cool:

[gap]

And I have kamikaze's coded in :cool:

:o

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kamikaze
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leonidas_Squadron

[TheDarkWraith]

v0.0.39 released. See post #1

:|\\

[Fifi]

Cool! that was fast :o

I suppose we have to be in bunker to change from old version to the 0.0.39?

[Navuhodonosor]

This is awesome! I finally have planes changing heading and altitudes when coming in to bomb and torpedo you :D Finally I can do what I've always wanted to do.

And I have kamikaze's coded in :cool:

So you just made our life on sea more miserable, nice!:D
Thanks.

[arnahud2]

Damn, a very bad idea will be to engage ANY aircraft, now !

Thank you TheDarkWraith.:up:

[gap]

v0.0.39 released. See post #1

:|\\

Great news! :rock:

By the way, have you looked yet in the issue I reported in the other thread, about the hurricane firing at an invisible opponent?

[Navuhodonosor]

Well, after few hours on sea with new updates I must admit something. The game runs much smoother. :D

[Tonci87]

This is awesome! I finally have planes changing heading and altitudes when coming in to bomb and torpedo you :D Finally I can do what I've always wanted to do.

And I have kamikaze's coded in :cool:

Kamikaze? Really? Did British pilots fly kamikaze runs?

[TheDarkWraith]

Kamikaze? Really? Did British pilots fly kamikaze runs?

The Kamikaze part only kicks in when the airplane is highly damaged. If you think about when would this happen? When the airplane is on an attack run on the enemy. This kamikaze part just makes sure the airplane won't try to run away when it's highly damaged but instead continue on it's course.

[gap]

Kamikaze? Really? Did British pilots fly kamikaze runs?

From Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kamikaze):
Before the formation of kamikaze units, deliberate crashes had been used as a last resort when a pilot's plane was severely damaged and he did not want to risk being captured or he wanted to do as much damage to the enemy as possible since he was crashing anyway; this was the case in both the Japanese and Allied air forces. According to Axell and Kase, these suicides "were individual, impromptu decisions by men who were mentally prepared to die." In most cases, there is little evidence that these hits were more than accidental collisions, of the kind that sometimes happen in intense sea-air battles.

[gap]

The Kamikaze part only kicks in when the airplane is highly damaged. If you think about when would this happen? When the airplane is on an attack run on the enemy. This kamikaze part just makes sure the airplane won't try to run away when it's highly damaged but instead continue on it's course.

Do you mean so damaged that it wouldn't be able to return to base anyway?

[TheDarkWraith]

Do you mean so damaged that it wouldn't be able to return to base anyway?

I made it so that if the damage was > 85% the airplane would kamikaze because at that point it's basically unflyable. At 50% it calls off the fight and resumes following waypoints.

[gap]

I made it so that if the damage was > 85% the airplane would kamikaze because at that point it's basically unflyable. At 50% it calls off the fight and resumes following waypoints.

I suppose that at 85% hp, the plane would hardly glide toward us.

If, as I hope, my conjecture is true, it woul reduce the probability of an heavily damaged plane hitting its target, thus adding an extra randomness factor.

I will carry some tests to ascertain it :up:

[Tonci87]

The Kamikaze part only kicks in when the airplane is highly damaged. If you think about when would this happen? When the airplane is on an attack run on the enemy. This kamikaze part just makes sure the airplane won't try to run away when it's highly damaged but instead continue on it's course.

Oh OK, that sounds good!

[gap]

planes don't attack with v0.0.39 :06:

experience with this mission (http://rapidshare.com/files/2002255920/AA%20Guns%20Test%20Missions.rar) used by me and Volodya for many tests on flak guns settings. With previous version of IRAI the plane attacks as supposed :hmm2:

[gap]

quick update:

if attacked, the plane responds to fire and becomes aggressive. If not attacked, it just flies over the sub, ignoring it.

Moreover, please have a look to this screenie:

http://img202.imageshack.us/img202/7494/sh5img20130122001656.jpg

Left wing on fire, yet the Hurricane kept attacking for several dives :hmmm:

[gap]

second update: this time the Hurrican took the offensive before being fired on. After all it seems I rushed to much with my first report :up:

Again, it keept attacking after getting damaged, though this time it was a lesser serious damage.

P.S: could be unrelated but during the last two tests the game ctd'ed while I was observing the scene with the binocular. :-?

Never happened before with the same mission, and I played it tens of times :yep:

I will keep you informed on any further test I will carry on.

P.S: it might be just my impression, but it seems that after enabling this last version of IRAI airplane's strategy became more varied. Now it changes elevation much more than before, and it approaches the U-boat from more varied angles :)

[Gaugeforever]

I'm not sure if I experienced my first IRAI event today. Was chasing ship in a really nasty storm. I get about 500m off her (yea it was that dark and hard to see). She wasn't flying a flag. I was perplexed by this. Followed her for a good while. Never altered course. I almost thought to leave it as it must be some random boat.

I decided to fire a single shot from the deck gun high above the water line. Second I did polish flag flies and she takes off at full speed.

Not sure if that was a bug or the A.I. but was clever. on top of that she was deep in keils water. Clever bastard.

[funken]

v0.0.39 released. See post #1

:|\\

Great! :up:

Thanks a lot! :salute:

[gap]

After further testing with these missions (http://rapidshare.com/files/2002255920/AA%20Guns%20Test%20Missions.rar), this in my updated report on the new features introduced with IRAI v 0.0.39:

- I can confirm that plane strategies are much more varied now: not only the change their altitude more often, they also engage enemies from more varied angles, and the interval between two consecutive attack dives may vary greatly. :up:

- I have never seen damaged aircraft clearing off the area. They keep attacking even though their engine is on flame. On the other hand, I have noiced that sometimes they give up their attack for no apparent reason, or (rarely) they don't attack at all.

- I have never been kamikazed. During my tests it seemed to me that damaged planes tended to get closer while attacking, as if the wanted to crash against us, but they raised their nose at the last minute.

- since I changed v 0.0.37 for 0.0.39, attacking planes have never dropped bombs against me. In the same test mission, this was a common occurrence using previous IRAI version... :-?

[vlad29]

After further testing with these missions (http://rapidshare.com/files/2002255920/AA%20Guns%20Test%20Missions.rar), this in my updated report on the new features introduced with IRAI v 0.0.39:

- I can confirm that plane strategies are much more varied now: not only the change their altitude more often, they also engage enemies from more varied angles, and the interval between two consecutive attack dives may vary greatly. :up: - Can only agree thats a good issue:yep:

- I have never seen damaged aircraft clearing off the area. They keep attacking even though their engine is on flame. - Unfortunately it is 0%realistic:nope:
On the other hand, I have noiced that sometimes they give up their attack for no apparent reason, or (rarely) they don't attack at all. - That is close to reality if to keep in mind limited ammo or absence of powerfull armament on board for the described cases:up:

- I have never been kamikazed. - No place for outstanding heroism in SH5 that means :D
During my tests it seemed to me that damaged planes tended to get closer while attacking, as if the wanted to crash against us, but they raised their nose at the last minute - Not realistic I think. Damaged planes should get out from 'fire' area ASAP and take course to the closest base or shore with climbing as high as they cood to keep good reserve of altitude untill engine stop (and also for pilots safe 'ejection').

- since I changed v 0.0.37 for 0.0.39, attacking planes have never dropped bombs against me. - Not good, because bombs were the main anti-sub weapon:nope:
In the same test mission, this was a common occurrence using previous IRAI version... :-?

Nice report Gap:up:. Have added some comments in yellow if You don't mind:salute:
Besides, as we've agreed few months ago, I 'scanned' some materials re. air attacks on subs during WWII (mostly - by soviet WWII naval aviation). The results are the following:
1. I haven't find any approovement that U-boats were sunk directly due to air-gun and machine gun hits. There were some situations when after few (up to 6) hits of 37-mm shells from plane guns the U-boat took damages that didn't allow her to submerge. After that in most cases the 'final dot' have been put with an air-bomb (f.e. from the other plane redirrected to that grid).
2. The U-boat was not the target easy for gun-fire aiming during air attack because of its narrow and low hull shape (machine-gun fire with traces was used mostly for gun-aiming) . Thats why the number of heavy shell hits was few (in case when one or two planes were carrying attack on her) and not enough for 'complete' damage.
3. Light (non-gun) fighters during air raides on naval targets were used mostly for 'covering' bombers and heavy fighters while the last were attacking ships and boats.
So in SH5 the planes AI behaviour should in my oppinion be the following:
- The non-gun light fighters without bombs: when detecting the U-boat are just passing it, but later the appearence of heavy bomb-or gun-armed planes should be expected;
- Non-gun figters with bombs: bomb attack on the U-boat and then leaving the place;
- Heavy fighters and bombers: attacking U-boat with bombs, gun and machine-gun fire.
The damage level from those categories of planes should differ also of course.
Thats the theory, and how to implement it in practice - who knows:hmmm:

[gap]

Hi Vlad,

I see you are much more more documented than me on the matter of air attack strategies. Your remarks seem entirey plausible to me; nonetheless, we should tick in mind that:

- as often noted by TDW himself, planes AI is very limited, and not everything can be done;

- many of the features we are discussing were introduced recently, and probably not tested before their release. Hopefully there is still space for some finetuning;

- last but not least, tough being the result of many tests, my remarks are based on one single mission where the attacker is an Hurricane. It would be better if, while we are waiting for TDW to come back, someone else tested the new IRAI version in campaign, and posted here his reports :yep:

[Fifi]

I'm running latest IRAI among my mods list, and i just had a nice example of boats reaction and damages...

2 big troops transport following each other at 15 knots far south of Feroe islands. Aimed the first, and 3 torps later began to sink. Last torp was for the second one, nicely hitted too...
But the second one just slowed down and took some fire upstairs, tried to avoid me, and headed an other direction accelarating again.
Impossible to use the deck gun cause of waves, and as soon as i surfaced, machine guns illuminating sky!
So decided to follow him underwater, but his speed was still too fast.
Waited some time, and surfaced again to gain some speed.
I had to follow him for hours in the night before he finally sinked!
Fire was also gaining all the boat with time, and he lost gradually knots untill he stops and sunk :)

[johan_d]

On the planes in SH5..

They always annoyed me.

Fighter planes were not developped for submarine hunting. So trying to find them with one relies on pilot sight, and the sea is a huge place, so spotting would be hard. (ever really zoomed out on your sub ?
I cant see it on the same distance a plane can.. so no compettion in this :-( )

Furthermore, I think IRAI (dont know if this already does it) should let the plane radio in position, keep distance, and follow the uboat untill lost.

Destroyers and such should steam up to the uboat location. Damaged planes.. I assume when you fly an old WW2 bird, who are very vulnerable to damage, over such large space of water, the immediate action would be disengage, may day may day, and head for the nearest land.

Not kamikaze, the Japs did that later in the war, not the RAF. Nobody would be over the northsea in a gasguzzling plane shooting at a target in the middle of nowhere what shoots back at you with flak.
Unless of course there a more planes around to help. (but not in the beginning with those bi-planes) Bombers, some were adjusted for this task, but most of then are very slow.
After they dropped their bombs I assume they keep following their target untill help comes in, untill out of fuel. Later in the war tactics changed.

Does IRAI take this in account ?

I do not use IRAI at the moment, gave me game crashes. Is the latest version more stable ?

[Navuhodonosor]

Hy, I am using latest version of IRAI and I was lurking tanker escorted by one destroyer. Destroyer passed first, then tanker and then I waited for them to go four miles and surfaced the sub. I was using my deck gun to hit the tanker ( run out of torpedoes ) and destroyer never turned back to defend the tanker.
Is that normal to happen sometimes:hmmm::salute:

[THE_MASK]

I cannot start a new campaign with these 2 mods enabled . Game crashes to desktop upon loading .
TDW_IRAI_Inertia_Damage
TDW_Ship_Inertia_1_1_0

[Mikemike47]

I cannot start a new campaign with these 2 mods enabled . Game crashes to desktop upon loading .
TDW_IRAI_Inertia_Damage
TDW_Ship_Inertia_1_1_0

Same here.

[mikaelanderlund]

Very strange :hmmm:. I do not think it depends on TDW_IRAI_Inertia_Damage or TDW_Ship_Inertia_1_1_0. However, I can not start a new (or my old) campaign with IRAI v 0.0.39 and FX21 but it works great with IRAI v 0.0.37 and FX 19 :o.

[gap]

Very strange :hmmm:. I do not think it depends on TDW_IRAI_Inertia_Damage or TDW_Ship_Inertia_1_1_0. However, I can not start a new (or my old) campaign with IRAI v 0.0.39 and FX21 but it works great with IRAI v 0.0.37 and FX 19 :o.

During my tests, I have started a new campaign with IRAI v 0.0.39 and FX21 many times and with no problems :yep:

[Mikemike47]

I cannot start a new campaign with these 2 mods enabled . Game crashes to desktop upon loading .
TDW_IRAI_Inertia_Damage
TDW_Ship_Inertia_1_1_0

Same here.


Very strange :hmmm:. I do not think it depends on TDW_IRAI_Inertia_Damage or TDW_Ship_Inertia_1_1_0. However, I can not start a new (or my old) campaign with IRAI v 0.0.39 and FX21 but it works great with IRAI v 0.0.37 and FX 19 :o.

No CTDs with IRAI v 0.0.37 and FX 19 with TDW_Ship_Inertia_1_1_0 added where Sober suggested. Other threads stated removing both inertia damage mods with IRAI v 0.0.39 and FX21 because it solved CTDs. I do not remember seeing an Inertia Damage version before IRAI_0_0_39.

During my tests, I have started a new campaign with IRAI v 0.0.39 and FX21 many times and with no problems :yep:

Using IRAI v 0.0.39 and FX_Update_21 with TDW_IRAI_Inertia_Damage or TDW_Ship_Inertia_1_1_0, I got CTDs.

Here is my mod list presently which is similar to Sobers':
Accurate German Flags
RemoveLogoIntroTheDarkWraith
sobers game loading tips V2 SH5
DBM Background Video
sobers green spinning thing SH5
Dynamic Environment SH5 Basemod (realistic version) V2.1
Foam_Mod_0.3
sobers best ever fog V22 SH5
Capthelms Audio+SV Touch Ups
Window_Lights_Redone_V1
SMission - D-Day Landings
Grossdeutscher Rundfunk
U-Boat Watch Crew Routine SFX
WolfPack Wotan
Torpedo_Door_Sound_Mix
Speech fixes and additions (english version)
Pascal-sh5-Crew-Uniforms
SteelViking's Interior Mod V1.2
SteelViking's Interior Mod V1.2.2 Patch
silentmichal's interior mod 1.2.1
SH5_7A_Conning_Fix
Fuel Gauge WoGaDi_SteelViking's Interior
SteelViking's Bunker Fixes V1.0
sobers Lights Cfg V5 SH5
German U-Boat Hydrophone SFX
Equipment_Upgrades_Fix_v1_4_byTheBeast
Equipment_Upgrades_Fix_v1_4_Patch_1 & hotfix
Equip_Upgrades_fix_v1.4 dates by sober Patch V2
NOZAURIO'S SKIN (Standard No Emblem) v-1.1.0
FX_Update_0_0_21_ByTheDarkWraith
AI_sub_crew_1_0_2_TheDarkWraith
NewUIs_TDC_7_2_0_ByTheDarkWraith
NewUIs_TDC_7_2_0_alt_officer_wounded_by_Torpedo
NewUIs_TDC_7_2_0_jimimadrids_map_tools
IRAI_0_0_39_ByTheDarkWraith
TDW_No_Hydrophone_On_Surface_1_1_0
Cerberus62 Corrected Depth Charge Projector 1.0
Sub_Bubbles_v0_0_3_ byTheBeast
OPEN HORIZONS II_full v2
OHII v2 Western Approaches Mission Fix
OHIIv2.1 sovietunionflag+fixes
SOAN_Filter_Fix(For TDW NewUIs_TDC_7_1_0)
Expanded Navies by Cybermat47 v.1.0.0
Reworked Morale and Abilities v.1.1
MightyFine Crew Mod 1.2.1 Alt faces
MCCD_1.04_MFCM_1.2.1_compatible
sobers green crew training V4 SH5
OH II Minefield map for TDWs Ui
OPEN HORIZONS II v2 - TDW_Mines_Subnets_Detectable_in_hydro
TDW FX Fix for Sobers chimney smoke
Trevally TDC Help v2
Trevally Tutorial - All v0.2(for OHIIv1.3)
Krauters Automated Scripts (v5_0_0 compatible)
Trevally Automated Scripts v0.6
Trevally Harbour & Kiel Canal Pilot v2.9
Sonar Sound Collection v 1.0 for SH5 - Distorted
sobers hud sounds V1 SH5
AMMO_v1.0_SH5_by_Raven_2012
sobers Depth of Field V4 SH5
sobers bad weather deck gun V3 SH5
Voice, Sounds & Help

[mikaelanderlund]

During my tests, I have started a new campaign with IRAI v 0.0.39 and FX21 many times and with no problems :yep:

Including TDW_IRAI_Inertia_Damage or TDW_Ship_Inertia_1_1_0 in your modsoup?

[gap]

Including TDW_IRAI_Inertia_Damage or TDW_Ship_Inertia_1_1_0 in your modsoup?

No, without them

[7thSeal]

I cannot start a new campaign with these 2 mods enabled . Game crashes to desktop upon loading .
TDW_IRAI_Inertia_Damage
TDW_Ship_Inertia_1_1_0

I'm guessing you have Open Horizons II in the mix when this happens to you and the others?

The only workaround that I've found is to disable Open Horizons II first then start a new campaign. Skip the tutorial and when in bunker make your gameplay changes in options and choose layout for the sub. Save the game and exit. Then load Open Horizons II and any mods you normally load after it. Start the campaign from the save and it should now work. :)

[Trevally.]

I'm guessing you have Open Horizons II in the mix when this happens to you and the others?

The only workaround that I've found is to disable Open Horizons II first then start a new campaign. Skip the tutorial and when in bunker make your gameplay changes in options and choose layout for the sub. Save the game and exit. Then load Open Horizons II and any mods you normally load after it. Start the campaign from the save and it should now work. :)


This will cause the stock camapign to load and not OHII:hmmm:

[guruganesh]

since some sessions, i've got an unknown contact at 170° in my hydrohpone. this contact occures quite regularly and isn't definitly not there...?! any ideas? my mod soup:

Generic Mod Enabler - v2.6.0.157
[C:\Ubisoft\Silent Hunter 5\MODS]

RemoveLogoIntroTheDarkWraith
sobers green spinning thing SH5
DBM Background Video
Real Environment - Revision_3
sobers better terrain v3 SH5
Small_trees_SH5_V1
SKIN_SH5_Type-VIIC_North_Atlantic_Grime_Weathered
MightyFine Crew Mod 1.2.1 Alt w beards
Naights Submaine Textures v1.2 (PUV)
Equipment_Upgrades_Fix_v1_4_byTheBeast
Equipment_Upgrades_Fix_v1_4_Patch_1
#Equipment_Upgrades_Fix_v1_4_Patch_1_HotFix
FX_Update_0_0_19_ByTheDarkWraith
NewUIs_TDC_7_1_0_ByTheDarkWraith
NewUIs_TDC_7_1_0_New_radio_messages_German
NewUIs_TDC_7_1_0_WWIIInterface_by_naights
Depth_Keeping_Problem_HB_2_0_0_TheDarkWraith
Shadow Improvement ModLR
IRAI_0_0_37_ByTheDarkWraith
JD Realistic Depth Charge Damage and Shaking 1.0
TheDarkWraith_DC_Water_Disturbances_v2_0_SH5
TDW_Ship_Inertia_1_1_0
Torpedo_Speed_Abilitie_Fix_for_TDC_SH5_v120
Nauticalwolf's_Damage_and_Torpedo_UI(g)_Mod_v1.1
Accurate German Flags
sobers game loading tips SH5
ers_5_8_ratio
R.E.M_by_Xrundel_TheBeast_1.2
OPEN HORIZONS II_full v2
TDW_Mines_Subnets_Detectable_in_hydro (OH II v2)
Critical hits 1.1 Torpedos
Old Style Explosions V1.1
Grossdeutscher Rundfunk
Trevally Automated Scripts v0.6
NDB,NDH OM#1 - No Dialog Indicator
IO_StrategicMap_4_7_for_TDWv710
OH II Minefield map for TDWs Ui
Fix for bearing sound (german speechpack)
Fix for digits (german speechpack)
AilRain 1.0
AilSmoke 1.7

[Moin]

Have also a small problem with the hydrophone:
Although I am on the surface and drive with 9 knots and the TDW_No_Hydrophone_On_Surface_1_1_0 patch is installed, calls the sonar man constantly contacts out! Once the boat reaches a depth of 6 meters, the hydrophones is active!
Happened during a historical mission (Wolfpacks with Escorts!)
Did I make something wrong?

Current Modlist:
----------------
Dynamic Environment SH5 Basemod (realistic version) V2.1
Dynamic Environment SH5 v 2.1 - SkyColor-MurkyWaters-DarkerNights Hotfix #1
Dynamic Environment - Winter hotfix 1
SteelViking's Interior Mod V1.2
SteelViking's Interior Mod V1.2.2 Patch
silentmichals interior mod 1.2.1
Fuel Gauge WoGaDi_SteelViking's Interior
Speech fixes and additions (german version)
Equipment_Upgrades_Fix_v1_4_byTheBeast
#Equipment_Upgrades_Fix_v1_4_Patch_1_HotFix
Eqp_Upgrades_fix_v1.4 dates by sober Patch V2
SH5 Longer Repairs v.1
FX_Update_0_0_21_ByTheDarkWraith
NewUIs_TDC_7_2_0_ByTheDarkWraith
IRAI_0_0_39_ByTheDarkWraith
TDW_No_Hydrophone_On_Surface_1_1_0
OPEN HORIZONS II_full v2
OHII v2 Mission Fix WA
Reworked Morale and Abilities v.1.1
MightyFine Crew Mod 1.2.1 Alt w beards
MCCD_1.04_MFCM_1.2.1_compatible
gap - Sonar Sound Collection v 1.0 for SH5 - Das Boot
Warfox deck crew always whispering SH5 German Version
sobers bad weather deck gun V3 SH5
Grossdeutscher Rundfunk
TDW patcher

SOLVED: Have set MaxSensorHeight settings in UBoot-Sensor.sim file to -9 and it looks, that it works now! Sonar man is quiet and hydrophone works from 9m!
Hope it was the right way!

[7thSeal]

This will cause the stock camapign to load and not OHII:hmmm:

When I enter to select missions while in the bunker I have the missions available when using OHII. I start the mission and the ships and everything available in OHII is there. :up:

The only other thing I forgot to mention during those steps is that when I start the campaign from the save after enabling OHII is that I go ahead and save it again while in the bunker. I exit to main menu and restart from that last save and head out on my first mission. OHII has been working fine for me when using the workaround I mentioned.

No stock campaign loads.

Any ideas?

[V13dweller]

I have quite a few problems with this mod, the enemy hydrophones one the surface, enemies that never give up, airplane turrets not tracking enemies, and ships that fire starshells, one fired, their guns no longer track enemies, on on the Admiral Hipper heavy cruiser, it relies on its main guns for firepower fire starshells, and as I have pointed out, they no longer fire, making nearly useless in combat.

[gap]

I have quite a few problems with this mod, the enemy hydrophones one the surface...

Do you refer to enemy subs? As far as I can see from its sns file, the Undine (the only enemy sub featured in game), is not equipped with any hydrophone. :hmm2:


...enemies that never give up...

try reducing IRAI's 'Lost contact time' setting, in Sim.cfg :03:


...airplane turrets not tracking enemies...

see my reply here (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=2007858&postcount=4)


and ships that fire starshells, one fired, their guns no longer track enemies, on on the Admiral Hipper heavy cruiser, it relies on its main guns for firepower fire starshells, and as I have pointed out, they no longer fire, making nearly useless in combat.

Yes TDW, can you please look into this weird issue (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?p=2000409#post2000409): it seems that without IRAI, guns are not firing their starshells at all; they do with IRAI enabled, but then they keep staying at maximum elevation, and they stop tracking targets :hmmm:

I know that Fx Update adds a new class of starshells; we could just get rid of the problem with "normal" starshells by removing them from gun's outfits, but I was planning to make them into smoke shells, and IMO it would be a pity giving them up...

[THE_MASK]

I have quite a few problems with this mod, the enemy hydrophones one the surface, enemies that never give up, airplane turrets not tracking enemies, and ships that fire starshells, one fired, their guns no longer track enemies, on on the Admiral Hipper heavy cruiser, it relies on its main guns for firepower fire starshells, and as I have pointed out, they no longer fire, making nearly useless in combat.Is the mod IRAI enabled properly IE: Have you just enabled what was extracted without looking at which folder needs enabling ?

[Fifi]

try reducing IRAI's 'Lost contact time' setting, in Sim.cfg :03:


Is it the only factor that make them giving up?
With IRAI, do the destroyers have limited depth charges?
(that brings me an other question to my mind, if no limited depth charges, the chalk board is useless...! Well not easy to count them anyway as the hydro guy don't announce them all)

[TheDarkWraith]

Yes TDW, can you please look into this weird issue (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?p=2000409#post2000409): it seems that without IRAI, guns are not firing their starshells at all; they do with IRAI enabled, but then they keep staying at maximum elevation, and they stop tracking targets :hmmm:

I know that Fx Update adds a new class of starshells; we could just get rid of the problem with "normal" starshells by removing them from gun's outfits, but I was planning to make them into smoke shells, and IMO it would be a pity giving them up...

v0.0.39 patch 1 is available at post #1 of this thread. This patch removes the ability of the ships to fire starshells and thus the severe game bug with it. Unzip to MODS folder. Enable after main mod and let it overwrite file.

I'll add my FX version of the starshells to ships sometime in the future (it's a butt load of work to do it :dead:). If you look closely at FX Update's starshells in game you'll see that I attached a smoke generator to them so that they give off smoke just as they would in real life from burning.

[Echolot]

v0.0.39 patch 1 is available at post #1 of this thread. This patch removes the ability of the ships to fire starshells and thus the severe game bug with it.

Thank you TheDarkWraith.

:sunny:

[TheDarkWraith]

Hi , when i extract the IRAI_0_0_39_ByTheDarkWraith_Patch_1 the folder name is the same . Then inside that folder is a folder called IRAI_0_0_39_ByTheDarkWraith ?

Your unzipper is creating the extra folder then. Uncheck the create folder option.

As far as the cannons shooting at your sub when submereged here is how the AI is coded for it:
- if sub is submerged is between 0 and 20 meters depth and:
- they can visually see you or can hear you on sonar then they will lob shells at you if you are <= 8000m.

[TheDarkWraith]

Which folder do i enable for the patch to work ? thanks .

The one that has the data folder in it :up:

[Fifi]

Thank you very much for this patch TDW :up:
Even on pretty good computer, starshells were giving some freeze.


- they can visually see you or can hear you on sonar then they will lob shells at you if you are <= 8000m.

Wow, up to 8 Km!! :o...that's a lot! lol

[V13dweller]

Do you refer to enemy subs? As far as I can see from its sns file, the Undine (the only enemy sub featured in game), is not equipped with any hydrophone. :hmm2:
I was talking about the passive hydrophones board the destroyers, I know that the U-boats sat high enough in the water that the waves on the sea nullify the effect of the passive hydrophones when the U-boat is on the surface.
Did you say the Undine class submarine has no passive hydrophone? then of does it track enemies while underwater?

[gap]

v0.0.39 patch 1 is available at post #1 of this thread. This patch removes the ability of the ships to fire starshells and thus the severe game bug with it. Unzip to MODS folder. Enable after main mod and let it overwrite file.

I'll add my FX version of the starshells to ships sometime in the future (it's a butt load of work to do it :dead:). If you look closely at FX Update's starshells in game you'll see that I attached a smoke generator to them so that they give off smoke just as they would in real life from burning.

Thank you man :up:

I just hope that one day you will manage to properly fix this feature, once and for all. I mean guns layed at maximum elevation and firing the starshells assigned to them in guns_radars_01.sim (if any), and returning to track enemy targets afterwards... :03:

Thank you very much for this patch TDW :up:
Even on pretty good computer, starshells were giving some freeze.

I think you are referring to FX Update's starshells which, to my knowledge, are not removed by IRAI patch.

Wow, up to 8 Km!! :o...that's a lot! lol

what do you suggest instead?

I was talking about the passive hydrophones board the destroyers, I know that the U-boats sat high enough in the water that the waves on the sea nullify the effect of the passive hydrophones when the U-boat is on the surface.
Did you say the Undine class submarine has no passive hydrophone? then of does it track enemies while underwater?

What you ask can be probably done by increasing AI hydrophone's MinElevation. :yep:
For most (or all) of the hydrophones it is set to 80 deg. Changing this setting to 85-90 deg should be enough to make hydrophones deaf against surfaced submarines. The only downside is that they probably wouldn't pick surface targets either. In order to make ships detectable on hydrophone by other ships, we should decrease the height of their hyd soundsource :hmm2:

[arnahud2]

Thanks for the patch#1, TDW :up:

[Dignan]

TDW,

Just wanted to report my experience with the latest version of IRAI. I've been away from the game for some time. Came back, loaded up the updated versions of all the mods and I think IRAI is almost perfect. :up:

I got myself in some hot water in my last patrol. I was tracking an arctic convoy and got in too close. I was forced to fire my torps early when I DD detected my periscope (I was within their screen and pretty close to the DD). I dove (missed my target too :/\\!! ) and endured about 5 hours of depth charging and being hunted by about 7 destroyers. I took a few good shots from close DCs. Sustained damage but was able to continue on. I eventually lost them (but it wasn't easy) by going deep, 140m, and remaining still.

I think the balance of difficulty and playability has been found. Escorts are a threat but not impossible to escape from. Thanks for this mod.

[gap]

I think the balance of difficulty and playability has been found. Escorts are a threat but not impossible to escape from. Thanks for this mod.

Has anyone tested aircraft behaviour with the latest IRAI version enabled?

Were they dropping bombs, depth charges or torpedoes? :hmmm:

[volodya61]

Has anyone tested aircraft behaviour with the latest IRAI version enabled?

Were they dropping bombs, depth charges or torpedoes? :hmmm:

I've so far only tested it using the Trevally's patch for OHII and in this test mission the plane didn't dropped bombs.. :hmmm:

[gap]

I've so far only tested it using the Trevally's patch for OHII and in this test mission the plane didn't dropped bombs.. :hmmm:

Try switching to the previous version then, and you will see what I mean :yep:

[volodya61]

Try switching to the previous version then, and you will see what I mean :yep:

OK.. I will test it..

[Fifi]

what do you suggest instead?


Nah, was thinking at first submerged...my bad :/\\!!.
Surfaced, it's ok :up:

[volodya61]

Were they dropping bombs, depth charges or torpedoes? :hmmm:
OK.. I will test it..

That was weird.. with IRAI 0.39 the plane dropped bombs only when it was heavily damaged.. after that it tried to be a kamikaze..
with IRAI 0.37 it dropped bombs on the third or fourth approach.. right after shooting of cannons..

Maybe it worth one more time to look at the scripts.. :hmmm:

[gap]

That was weird.. with IRAI 0.39 the plane dropped bombs only when it was heavily damaged.. after that it tried to be a kamikaze..
with IRAI 0.37 it dropped bombs on the third or fourth approach.. right after shooting of cannons..

Maybe it worth one more time to look at the scripts.. :hmmm:

:yep:

Running our AA guns test mission with IRAI 0.39, the Hurricane never dropped its bombs, even if heavily damaged. Only once, when it was flying at low altitude directly over the sub (a failed kamikaze attack?), something fell down in the water, not far from us. But I suspect that it was just debris, because the plane had just been hit, and the sub didn't suffer any damage. :hmm2:

[Dignan]

Has anyone tested aircraft behaviour with the latest IRAI version enabled?

Were they dropping bombs, depth charges or torpedoes? :hmmm:

I had a bi-plane drop something on me that exploded. It was either a bomb or a DC.

[gap]

I had a bi-plane drop something on me that exploded. It was either a bomb or a DC.

That was in campaign, I suppose :hmmm:

[Dignan]

That was in campaign, I suppose :hmmm:

Yep. Arctic Convoys