The proposed health care bill thread (merged)

[Fish]

Originally Posted by Tchocky

The situation seems to be that the US pays a lot more per capita for healthcare, without substantially better results than countries such as France or the Netherlands. Question is, is the current system optimal?

The Dutch system:

http://www.justlanded.com/english/Ne...lth/Healthcare

In the Netherlands, the government is not in charge of the day-to-day management of the healthcare system. Private health suppliers are responsible for the provision of services in this area. The government is responsible for the accessibility and quality of the healthcare.

[geetrue]

They really did leave something off of this chart ...

The illegal aliens ...

The border patrol will have to now ask everyone entering the United States if they have the mandatory insurance.

All international flight attendants will be required to ask, "Coffee, tea, milk, soda, mandatory health insurance ...

[geetrue]

Originally Posted by Tchocky

EDIT - and when you think about it, most people won't use insurance anyway. That's how it works. If only sick or likely-to-be-sick people were to take out insurance, the cost of premiums would skyrocket, leaving a lot of people out of the loop, likely to be sick and unable to get treatment. That to me is a strong (brief) argument for a public plan option.

Not true with company insurance ... I know many that get all of the benefits they have coming to them, like neck massages from looking at a computer screen all day (which is okay with me).

You are also forgetting dental insurance now that's something that should be mandatory

[mookiemookie]

Originally Posted by Neal Stevens

That's what's missing from this chart, most of the money will come from people who will not use the insurance.

That's true for any insurance. Heck, it's what the whole idea of what insurance is. I don't see the problem here.

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by geetrue

Not true with company insurance ... I know many that get all of the benefits they have coming to them, like neck massages from looking at a computer screen all day (which is okay with me).

You are also forgetting dental insurance now that's something that should be mandatory

Good point Geetrue....just another government program to be exploited by those that know how to work the system. I know a few myself.

[VipertheSniper]

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

Good point Geetrue....just another government program to be exploited by those that know how to work the system. I know a few myself.

What are they gonna do? Get their teeth knocked out intentionally? Or are you speaking of the whole plan here?

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by VipertheSniper

What are they gonna do? Get their teeth knocked out intentionally? Or are you speaking of the whole plan here?

The whole plan. You will see an increase of people needing perscription pain medication. The Oxycotin folks. It happens now in the ER and now it will grow into a larger problem. I foresee fictious monetary compensation claims by doctors coming also. This happens already but will become worse as the government pencil pusher will just approve it. After all, it is good enough for government work.

[SteamWake]

Originally Posted by Max2147

You can keep your private insurer. Nobody's forcing you to switch to the government plan.

Sure that sounds great but I wonder how is a private plan supposed to compete with an entity that does not have to make a profit?

In other words private health care will be driven out of buisness.

[geetrue]

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

The whole plan. You will see an increase of people needing perscription pain medication. The Oxycotin folks. It happens now in the ER and now it will grow into a larger problem. I foresee fictious monetary compensation claims by doctors coming also. This happens already but will become worse as the government pencil pusher will just approve it. After all, it is good enough for government work.

I know this is hard to believe, but I know a drug dealer (not me no siree) that trades pot for prescription drugs especially pain medications.

Medicare fraud has uncovered doctors offices that are never open, but bill the medicare as if they were. These are not isolated cases.

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by geetrue

I know this is hard to believe, but I know a drug dealer (not me no siree) that trades pot for prescription drugs especially pain medications.

Medicare fraud has uncovered doctors offices that are never open, but bill the medicare as if they were. These are not isolated cases.

Oh yeah, geetrue, just the tip of the iceberg now. Wait until the government is involved...

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by SteamWake

Sure that sounds great but I wonder how is a private plan supposed to compete with an entity that does not have to make a profit?

In other words private health care will be driven out of buisness.

In the end, yes. Why should my boss continue to pay for our own healthcare policy when he does not have to nor has to worry about it anymore? He does'nt and he won't.

[Onkel Neal]

Originally Posted by mookiemookie

That's true for any insurance. Heck, it's what the whole idea of what insurance is. I don't see the problem here.

In other words, if I am covering my family through my private insurer, I do not want the govt to pull more money from me to cover those who use the govt. health care plan. The govt health care plan should be funded by those who use it.

[Max2147]

Originally Posted by SteamWake

Sure that sounds great but I wonder how is a private plan supposed to compete with an entity that does not have to make a profit?

In other words private health care will be driven out of buisness.

If there are enough people like you who prefer their private health insurers, then they will stay around.

You can't say that the government insurer will be awful then in the next breath say that it will be so good that it will drive everybody else out of business.

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by Neal Stevens

In other words, if I am covering my family through my private insurer, I do not want the govt to pull more money from me to cover those who use the govt. health care plan. The govt health care plan should be funded by those who use it.

Yes they should but it is not looking that way. Either way, we(me and you) are paying on average $1600.00/insured/year to cover those that are not covered already. This is obtained through premiums, medical cost and perscription costs. The hospitals certainly do not suck it up for humanity. One wonders then, do you and I get a reduced cost/year if we carry our own after the government starts their program? Probably not.

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by Max2147

If there are enough people like you who prefer their private health insurers, then they will stay around.

You can't say that the government insurer will be awful then in the next breath say that it will be so good that it will drive everybody else out of business.

You have to understand, what is keeping large companies from not just turning over healthcare of each and every employee to the government? Nothing is. Companies can get rid of entire departments for employee benefits. Expenditures for all the paperwork, etc. are now off the books. The employees healthcare is now the governments headache.