The good old fashioned functional UI

[Lognoreng]

Would it somehow be possible to make SH5 more like SH3 with the things we can change with modding?

Take away the moral system, and all the passive and active abilities. And instead use a system where the crew gets slightly better as they are spending more time with their jobs during career patrols. Bring back the old order system with a command bar, because really, if the captain wanted the torpedo guys to load an electric eel in tube 4. Wouldnt he just relay that order thru his "right hand man" or something like that? (I have no clue how the real crew operated, but this seems more correct). And have the interior of the boat just as a way of immersion. All the running around and whispering orders in the crews ears are just to actually use the new space.

Basically, less RPG, more simulation..

Would it be possible at all?

Alex

[piri_reis]

Yes it's all possible, did you just get here?
Check the UI mods on this page for starters.

[Lognoreng]

I am aware of those. But is it possible to that extent?

[kylania]

Originally Posted by Lognoreng

I am aware of those. But is it possible to that extent?

You didn't look at the posts did you? We already have essentially the SH4 interface and the SH3 keeps getting closer and closer. Thankfully it's not an entire mirror of the older interface though, but we're getting back our functionality.

[Ducimus]

The good old fashioned functional UI

SH5 more like SH3...

You know there is alot of that going around. Why do people want things more like SH3? Nostalgia? Resistance to change? You know, if all command accessiblity was in place, there is a good argument for the new styled UI. It's not in your way, and has a low footprint on the screen, plus it's more ACCURATE then the same old 6 dials that people have been staring at since 2005.

I admit, in SH4, i missed the SH3 UI, for one reason, and one reason only. Interaction with the crew! Well, we obviously have that now in Sh5, don't we? So why go backwards?


Hell, im reminded of a little mod called the "realistic embodyment mod" I dont know if i came up with it, or someone else did.

Here's what i wrote back in 2007:

Realistic embodyment mod
Cause your hardcore and don't use the external camera.

Info:
It removes most shortcut keys and shortcut menu bar forcing the player to interact with the crew and move about the compartments as a real sub skipper would. You can however still "shout" commands to your crew via the officer menu on the bottom left of the UI.

Yup, no more jumping from the navigation map or control room to the attack periscope like a fart in the wind. Climb up that ladder to the conning tower captain! Want to check the captains log? its the little book on on the crew management table. Want to work out the damage control or crew assigments? You'll have to consult your charts, graphs and such at the crew management table. Want to man the hydrophones yourself? You'll have to walk over to your sonar man and tell him to shove a bun. Want to go back to the bridge after checking with the radioman? Its through the control room, and up the ladder

So anywho, i acknowledge that there's going to be a huge difference of opinion, and that there's two camps of folks in the UI department, Those who long wistfully for SH3, and those ready to try something new and move forward.

[TheDarkWraith]

call it options, call it choices, call it whatever you want. I'm a firm believer in user choice. I hate it when something is forced onto me. I like to be able to choose and thus is why I've made different UIs. Everybody likes things their way and thus giving them that choice lets them play the way they want.
As a side note it also gets me exposure to the files. The more I 'play' with the files the more I learn about the game. The more I learn the more options and more additions can be made. Plus to me, it's FUN to experiment and dabble and see what I can make.

Thank you for all your hard work TheDarkWraith. I want to enjoy this game by doing things that are fun and challenging. I don't care if the Captain would or wouldnt have done it IRL. Walking up and down the ladders is fun the first three times, but after that it is just me pushing a stupid key for no reason. Computers were invented to eliminate repetitive tasks... That is why I would rather have the option to tele-port to the station as needed even though I play at 100% and try to limit the TC. If I did not have a zombie crew, I might feel differently.

[Ducimus]

Originally Posted by TheDarkWraith

call it options, call it choices, call it whatever you want. I'm a firm believer in user choice. I hate it when something is forced onto me.

Oh i am too. Believe me i am, not just in mods, but on a whole range of topics. But thats for the general forum. What's getting my goat though, is that "bring back" and "good ole" and really and it's the most what there is to see.

Infact, excepting the one TDC UI you did in the direction of the minimalist style, every other UI work i have seen posted has been in SH3/4 style. With more of the same on the way. ( How exciting! /sarchasm ) So really, what choice is there? If i had more time and patience, id get into UI modding just to counterbalance that, but frankly im too burnt out on modding in general to care enough to bother, and i refuse to learn a programming language (python) that has no practical application in my daily job. It's much easier to complain.

(side note on phython: opnion at my work is taht phython is crap. It's slow. Yes it's an interpretted language, but so is pearl, and that runs much better)

[Galanti]

Originally Posted by Ducimus

You know there is alot of that going around. Why do people want things more like SH3? Nostalgia? Resistance to change? You know, if all command accessiblity was in place, there is a good argument for the new styled UI. It's not in your way, and has a low footprint on the screen, plus it's more ACCURATE then the same old 6 dials that people have been staring at since 2005.
....

So anywho, i acknowledge that there's going to be a huge difference of opinion, and that there's two camps of folks in the UI department, Those who long wistfully for SH3, and those ready to try something new and move forward.

Nostalgia and resistance to change pretty much sums it up for me!

Duci, the thing is, the new UI is in my way. I dont' need the bazillion flashing indicators all over the place, nor do I need most of the junk in the upper-right corner (TC controls). Command accesibility? Most of it is missing completely. I'm a little surprised to see you making this argument.

I agree with where I think it is you're going with this, but SH5's stock UI is not it, IMHO.

[Ducimus]

There's no argument from me that the stock UI is lacking. But it's STYLE, is the direction that, I at least, would love to go. Anything from Sh3/SH4, in my opinion, is going backwards. I can't be the only one tired of seeing all these psuedo realistic bars and dials festooned all over the screen that lacked any sort of immediate accuracy when issuing commands.

[mobucks]

I was thinking on this as i played last night and i agree with bill, walking around to each station is a pain, but brings to light a now glaring issue with the series.

In older silent hunter games, you could order the boat to surface, and as soon as your baby broke waves you could insta teleport to the deck gun and start firing away. You could order a dive and still fire guns untill decks awash. The tactical advantage is obvious.

In SH5, you must manually walk around to/from the deckgun, which adds a little realism. The thing missing now is the crew. It would add a lot more strategy and tension if you had to wait for the entire deck crew to ALSO leave station and come back inside one by one down the one ladder available before being able to dive. Situations where you were in some danger of being spotted now have a lot more tension since you have to wait X longer to dive.

Might be hell to script the animation but i'd be happy for now with just a sound being played and an added duration to commence diving orders.

PS DarkWraith i had a warm moment reading your post under me, what a nice guy to want to do that.

[Galanti]

Originally Posted by Ducimus

There's no argument from me that the stock UI is lacking. But it's STYLE, is the direction that, I at least, would love to go. Anything from Sh3/SH4, in my opinion, is going backwards. I can't be the only one tired of seeing all these psuedo realistic bars and dials festooned all over the screen that lacked any sort of immediate accuracy when issuing commands.

Well, as you said it's matter of choice. The bar in SH4 I never cared for, but I'll take the dials over digital readouts any day of the week.

I think the ideal is voice activation, but it's difficult to implement on a number of levels, plus it makes me feel like a complete jackass when I'm doing it.

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by Galanti

Well, as you said it's matter of choice. The bar in SH4 I never cared for, but I'll take the dials over digital readouts any day of the week.

I think the ideal is voice activation, but it's difficult to implement on a number of levels, plus it makes me feel like a complete jackass when I'm doing it.

Skwasjer has voice recognition working. I hear it is darn good also. As far as looking like a jackass doing it...well...I can not help you there!

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=164926

[Ducimus]

Originally Posted by Galanti

Well, as you said it's matter of choice. The bar in SH4 I never cared for, but I'll take the dials over digital readouts any day of the week

I think the ideal is voice activation, but it's difficult to implement on a number of levels, plus it makes me feel like a complete jackass when I'm doing it.

You too huh? I've avoided voice activation for that very reason.

As for dials vs digital readouts, the pro with the new UI is you can specify a depth right down to the single digit. With the dials im clicking 2 or 4 times to get the number i want.

At any rate, ill write up a post with pics when i get home from work (10 hours from now) and do my best to point out how the stock UI could be improved for posterity.

[Galanti]

Originally Posted by Ducimus

As for dials vs digital readouts, the pro with the new UI is you can specify a depth right down to the single digit. With the dials im clicking 2 or 4 times to get the number i want.
.

You're absolutely right, but again, it makes no difference to me. The dials may be unrealistic in concept, but they look authentic to me, and that's what floats my boot. I'll put up with reduced functionality if it means a period-looking UI.

Damn, voice recognition is looking even better with Skwasjer's mod, but I can't get over that whole 40-Year-Old Virgin vibe. Maybe if there was an option to morph your own voice into Jurgen Prochnow's...