[REL] patSH3r - Reborn

[propbeanie]

I have a quote in my signature from Jimbuna that perfectly fits this. I would also like to thank Fader_Berg for what he has accomplished with this. I would also like to thank Stiebler and h.sie for what they have done - in fact, I'd like to thank ~ALL~ the modders who have done anything for the modding community, conforming to "standards" or not (by whose definition are these "standards", btw?). It ain't easy doing this modding stuff, because as can be seen, someone seems quick to criticize. Do it constructively and politely please... whoops - my soapbox collapsed from my body weight... sorry.

[hauangua]

Originally Posted by Blackswan1940

Ahaaa! And you should also consider taking back your last decision about rekoving the compatibilty to H.sie!

It is totally counterproductive when your patch is not compatible with Hasie and Stiebler. It will not be used then.

Hope this thought helps. Keep up your good work!

Maximum respect and gratitude is needed, for all modders, it is thanks to all of them if SH is still alive and always more beautiful.1000+ mods that are there may like it or not, or they may partially like it, anyone can "roll up their sleeves" and create the mod that they like most.
Defining a counterproductive Mod, it is an unfortunate expression and I want to hope for a simple "writing" error.

[makman94]

..."standar".......come on guys...lets get a little bit serious here.


i would not say such thing for ANY mod at all !! All these years in subsim , i can say ,for sure, this: if there were any "standards" now you would all play with mods made back at 2005-6.


for example, i use Fader_berg's patch and its obvious to me (for many reasons) that Fader_berg's skills are in no doupt.
I stongly believe that if someone can "judge" his work are ONLY those who can "see" what executables do (and probably will tell you that Fader_berg is one of the best around). I really trust this guy on whatever generously offers to sh3


bottom line, someone can use it or not but can't "judge" it (unless he knows what work has been done in its files)

[areo16]

Originally Posted by Fader_Berg

No, I should not. Look. Hsies code is horrible to work with. It's all over the place and he has made many poor design choices. It's too *******ing boring and time consuming to work with. Besides... I don't use many of his patches anyway.

Counterproductive...? I take that as an insult. Do you even know what that word mean? I may possibly have made something that you don't want to use. I use it though. That's pretty much all that matters for me. If any one else wants to use it - fine. If anyone else don't want to use it - perfect. I don't care.

I have given all the code away into the public domain for anyone to fiddle with and to merge with hsies work if that's wanted. How is that counterproductive?! Blame yourself or anyone else that have done nothing in this matter for being counterproductive instead.

D*mn I'm pissed... counterproductive my *ss.

I do sympathize here as concerns to working with other people's code that may not have the same disciplines as yourself, same education or even understanding of design principles.



It's quite frustrating (not to say that either of those developers in question used bad practices as I haven't spent much time looking at the source. I do know however, that working with assembly is so low-level that any design concepts, if they can be applied, that are common with higher level languages can't be applied to assembly.). I'd really hate to design a whole application in assembly to begin with, why not read the byte values in a higher level language and output the modified bytes to executable?

[areo16]

Originally Posted by Blackswan1940

Ahaaa! And you should also consider taking back your last decision about rekoving the compatibilty to H.sie!

It is totally counterproductive when your patch is not compatible with Hasie and Stiebler. It will not be used then.

Hope this thought helps. Keep up your good work!

This comment pisses me off. Could have said this in a nicer way...




He did it for free, as all modders do. If you don't like it, learn ****ty assembly and rewrite it yourself.

[Fader_Berg]

Originally Posted by areo16

I do sympathize here as concerns to working with other people's code that may not have the same disciplines as yourself, same education or even understanding of design principles.

hsie made a great deal of work that impressed me and others. I really don't care how his code looks like while it works and I don't need to get in touch with it.

Originally Posted by areo16

It's quite frustrating (not to say that either of those developers in question used bad practices as I haven't spent much time looking at the source. I do know however, that working with assembly is so low-level that any design concepts, if they can be applied, that are common with higher level languages can't be applied to assembly.). I'd really hate to design a whole application in assembly to begin with, why not read the byte values in a higher level language and output the modified bytes to executable?

The problem is where the two patches interfere with each other. It can't be avoided and has to be dealt with.
I tried at first. In some parts of the patSH3r source code you can still see that I tried it. It's mentioned in the comments (which I've forgotten to update when I gave up).


If I make one patch I might end up having to write two or more patches to make it compatible with hsies. One when hsie.A i enabled. One more when hsie.A is disabled. Fu*k... it crashes. This because a variable in the hsie.A-code are also being used in hsie.C and -F-code too, and doesn't get updated correctly now. I have to figure out how this variable works in fragmented, disorganized and very sparse commented code in gerrman. By the way... which other hsie-features uses this variable also?! Not to mention all variables that are being used between A, B, G and O that I may have missed, and doesn't result in a crash. That's gonna affect the game somehow. It probably ends up in some "when I got 56% oxy left and the clock is 12:42 a friday the submarine crashdives"-bug.
I just puked in my mouth.



No! If I have to fill my my spare time with something extremely hard and boring. I rather work extra and make some money instead.

[areo16]

Originally Posted by Fader_Berg

If I make one patch I might end up having to write two or more patches to make it compatible with hsies. One when hsie.A i enabled. One more when hsie.A is disabled. Fu*k... it crashes. This because a variable in the hsie.A-code are also being used in hsie.C and -F-code too, and doesn't get updated correctly now. I have to figure out how this variable works in fragmented, disorganized and very sparse commented code in gerrman. By the way... which other hsie-features uses this variable also?! Not to mention all variables that are being used between A, B, G and O that I may have missed, and doesn't result in a crash. That's gonna affect the game somehow. It probably ends up in some "when I got 56% oxy left and the clock is 12:42 a friday the submarine crashdives"-bug.
I just puked in my mouth.

This sounds like is using global variables here when he should be using local variables? Or he is referencing the same variable from the same package over and over again?


This is a design issue.


What about copying these globals to local variables in the scope you need to use it in, and edit them as such, not affect the global variable itself (assuming you don't need the edits on these variables to be outside of your current scope)?

[Fader_Berg]

Originally Posted by areo16

This sounds like is using global variables here when he should be using local variables? Or he is referencing the same variable from the same package over and over again?


This is a design issue.


What about copying these globals to local variables in the scope you need to use it in, and edit them as such, not affect the global variable itself (assuming you don't need the edits on these variables to be outside of your current scope)?

Some of them are global for a reason, some of them are not. Believe me. If there was a easy way around this, I would have taken it a long time ago.

To be able to remedy this I (or anyone else for that matter) need to analyze and understand pretty much everything he has written. Since, like I told you, the code is very sparsely commented in german (with even most of the variable names being made in german, scattered around the source in a non logical way). it's damn frustrating and hard to cope with.

It's not impossible off course, Anyone can do it. It just takes time and effort I'm not willing to invest.

[padi]

Originally Posted by makman94

i would not say such thing for ANY mod at all !! All these years in subsim , i can say ,for sure, this: if there were any "standards" now you would all play with mods made back at 2005-6.

If something is used by 90+% of all players it is the standard...

[makman94]

Originally Posted by padi

If something is used by 90+% of all players it is the standard...

i guess you would have said the same for the mods used by 90+% of players back at 2005-6

[John Pancoast]

<dead thread> Shame this wasn't developed further especially in regards to working with H.sie's/Stiebler's patches.
Some really great functions and work done with this patch.

[Niume]

I agree

[Fader_Berg]

Long time no see... everybody.



I was going through an old external harddrive and found the old patSH3r with sources. I thought it was lost when I couldn't find it years back. But there it was. I uploaded it for you guys who want to use this legacy version (which still has support for hsies patch). Mostly 'cause you want the WO & HY targeting I guess.


The binary can be downloaded here and the sources here.



Have a nice day.

[Onkel Neal]

Nicely done!

[ivanov.ruslan]

Thanks!