The Scottish Independence thread - Yay or Nay? - Page 4

Oberon · 09-06-14, 06:37 PM

Would be a shame to see them go, but they have the right to do so, the Better Together campaign has been a bit of a damp squib and it was a bad move to put the former chancellor at the head, his past has just overshadowed the whole campaign.
Honestly I think their long term prospects aren't as rosy as they think it is, but if they made the right choices they could make a go of it. Expect a lot of sour grapes from Westminster and feet dragging if they do split.

09-06-14, 06:51 PM

Quote:

also read that there are fears that they could get a "conservative" government in London

again at the next electiuns, while most Scots - at least that is what I read - would prefer a more "social-democratic" (=socialist) government. I wonder whether the author is right there?

Conservative governments destroyed their support in Scotland. They completely screwed their conservative/unionist power base which used to give them a third of the votes.
They finally killed it off with their disasterous "all people are equal" tax scheme which resulted in the conservative government belatedly discovering that Maggie had lost the plot entirely.

THEBERBSTER · 09-06-14, 06:56 PM

I hope that Scotland is brave it enough to go it alone.

The thousands of deaths and massacres of the Scots fighting the English through the ages will not then have been in vain.

The Clansmen fought for their independence at the time and paid a heavy price.

Many of the voters will have had relatives from these times gone by.

I hope they will say yes, and do it for them.

Now there is an opportunity but will it be taken?

Oberon · 09-06-14, 07:57 PM

I'd like to think that all we've done as a union would make up for the massacres before, but admittedly, and much to our shame, so much of what we made was clustered down south, around London and the Home Counties, Scotland has always been the poor relation and the forgotten area, just like the rest of the north, despite being home to some of our best inventors and driving figures of the 19th and 20th centuries and beyond.

Stealhead · 09-06-14, 08:05 PM

Also the home of some of your best soldiers.

Eichhörnchen · 09-07-14, 02:52 AM

You got that right: the 15th(Scottish) and 52nd(Lowland) Divisions (although I think including Canadians, who were just as fearsome) scared the crap out of the German paras in NW Europe at the end of the war.

Like I said in the other thread mentioned, so much of what what makes Britain "Great" is Scottish, but they've had always to watch their lives largely shaped and controlled from Westminster.

Jimbuna · 09-07-14, 05:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eichhornchen

Visit our thread: "What's to Become of Sir Hamish?"

Or better still, read the thread from the link below:

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/show...t=independence

Threads merged...one Scottish thread is enough for some Brits

Jimbuna · 09-07-14, 05:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by magicstix

Being an American I have no dog in this fight, but I've always found it funny that the Scots seem to want to have it both ways by getting the good of independence and none of the bad. I found myself chuckling when they just automatically assumed they could keep using the UK sterling pound for currency and automatically join the EU with all of the same exceptions that were afforded the UK, as well as just being able to freely cross UK borders and use UK passports.

It sounds a lot like they just want to be independent in name only, with none of the hardships involved in being a sovereign nation...

That if I may say so is a pretty good assessment imho but what I will add is the fact that they are refusing to pay their share of the national debt if we don't allow them to use the pound....won't be much good for their credit rating in financial circles.

Salmond is gambling too much on oil and gas reserves, estimates of which differ widely from expert to expert and any drop in energy prices will amount to a loss of income and a heavier burdon on a population amounting to a little over 5 million.

That won't bother him though, he'll probably not be on his 'throne' long enough to suffer for the consequences.

Eichhörnchen · 09-07-14, 05:25 AM

Now that the threads have merged, can I ask again my original question: what's to become of Sir Hamish?

STEED · 09-07-14, 05:26 AM

Quote:

LONDON (Reuters) - The British government is scrambling to respond to a lurch in the opinion polls towards a vote for Scottish independence this month by promising a range of new powers for Scotland if it chooses to stay within the United Kingdom.
British finance minister George Osborne said on Sunday that plans would be set out in the coming days to give Scotland more autonomy on tax, spending and welfare if Scots vote against independence in a historic referendum on Sept. 18.

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/uk-scotlan...s.html#umrt6kq

Osbourne the slimball trying a bribe.

Cybermat47 · 09-07-14, 06:09 AM

Scotland already IS independent. In 1807 two Corps of the Grand Armeè landed in the French client state of Irealnd, and quickly moved against Edinburgh. After a pitched battle, in which a British General was killed and Arthur Wellesly was wounded, Scotland gained it's independence, albeit as a French client state.

My Napoleon: Total War campaigns DO change history, right?

Catfish · 09-07-14, 06:16 AM

OT just read there you did not need a passport, when you wanted to pass a border from one nation to another, before 1914.

I take it Scotland would then need new passports and a whole new citizen management as well – but i take it it won't happen anyway, and if they will just use an adapted english system (?)

Jimbuna · 09-07-14, 06:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by STEED

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/uk-scotlan...s.html#umrt6kq

Osbourne the slimball trying a bribe.

Much more of that and the English will be demanding similar privileges

Jimbuna · 09-07-14, 06:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Catfish

OT just read there you did not need a passport, when you wanted to pass a border from one nation to another, before 1914.

I take it Scotland would then need new passports and a whole new citizen management as well – but i take it it won't happen anyway, and if they will just use an adapted english system (?)

They'll need a lot more than a passport after Hadrians Wall is rebuilt

STEED · 09-07-14, 08:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jimbuna

Much more of that and the English will be demanding similar privileges

I have a whole list but I think the answer will be no unless like the Scots I could blackmail him on something.

09-06-14, 06:56 PM	#48
THEBERBSTER Growing Old Disgracefully Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: Hythe - Southampton Posts: 9,609 Downloads: 1133 Uploads: 0	I hope that Scotland is brave it enough to go it alone. The thousands of deaths and massacres of the Scots fighting the English through the ages will not then have been in vain. The Clansmen fought for their independence at the time and paid a heavy price. Many of the voters will have had relatives from these times gone by. I hope they will say yes, and do it for them. Now there is an opportunity but will it be taken? __________________ LSH3-2015 <> TUTORIALS <> ALL YOU NEED TO KNOW <> ALL IN ONE PLACE SH4 <> TUTORIALS <> HOW TO DO IT <> INFORMATION <> DOWNLOAD LINKS SH5 <> TUTORIALS <> HOW TO DO IT <> INFORMATION <> DOWNLOAD LINKS Always Here To Help A Fellow 'Subber' \| Need An Answer to A Question Just Send Me A PM

09-07-14, 02:52 AM	#51
Eichhörnchen Starte das Auto Join Date: Aug 2014 Location: The Fens Posts: 17,408 Downloads: 5 Uploads: 0	You got that right: the 15th(Scottish) and 52nd(Lowland) Divisions (although I think including Canadians, who were just as fearsome) scared the crap out of the German paras in NW Europe at the end of the war. Like I said in the other thread mentioned, so much of what what makes Britain "Great" is Scottish, but they've had always to watch their lives largely shaped and controlled from Westminster. Last edited by Eichhörnchen; 09-07-14 at 03:32 AM.

09-07-14, 06:09 AM	#56
Cybermat47 Willing Webfooted Beast Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Australia Posts: 5,408 Downloads: 300 Uploads: 23	Scotland already IS independent. In 1807 two Corps of the Grand Armeè landed in the French client state of Irealnd, and quickly moved against Edinburgh. After a pitched battle, in which a British General was killed and Arthur Wellesly was wounded, Scotland gained it's independence, albeit as a French client state. My Napoleon: Total War campaigns DO change history, right? __________________ Historical TWoS Gameplay Guide: http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?p=2572620 Historical FotRSU Gameplay Guide: https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/sho....php?p=2713394

09-06-14, 06:37 PM	#46
Oberon Lucky Jack Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 25,976 Downloads: 61 Uploads: 20	Would be a shame to see them go, but they have the right to do so, the Better Together campaign has been a bit of a damp squib and it was a bad move to put the former chancellor at the head, his past has just overshadowed the whole campaign. Honestly I think their long term prospects aren't as rosy as they think it is, but if they made the right choices they could make a go of it. Expect a lot of sour grapes from Westminster and feet dragging if they do split.

09-06-14, 07:57 PM	#49
Oberon Lucky Jack Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 25,976 Downloads: 61 Uploads: 20	I'd like to think that all we've done as a union would make up for the massacres before, but admittedly, and much to our shame, so much of what we made was clustered down south, around London and the Home Counties, Scotland has always been the poor relation and the forgotten area, just like the rest of the north, despite being home to some of our best inventors and driving figures of the 19th and 20th centuries and beyond.

09-06-14, 08:05 PM	#50
Stealhead Navy Seal Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Kentucky Posts: 5,421 Downloads: 85 Uploads: 0	Also the home of some of your best soldiers.

09-07-14, 05:25 AM	#54
Eichhörnchen Starte das Auto Join Date: Aug 2014 Location: The Fens Posts: 17,408 Downloads: 5 Uploads: 0	Now that the threads have merged, can I ask again my original question: what's to become of Sir Hamish?

09-07-14, 06:16 AM	#57
Catfish Dipped Squirrel Operative Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: ..where the ocean meets the sky Posts: 17,773 Downloads: 38 Uploads: 0	OT just read there you did not need a passport, when you wanted to pass a border from one nation to another, before 1914. I take it Scotland would then need new passports and a whole new citizen management as well – but i take it it won't happen anyway, and if they will just use an adapted english system (?)