Murder in London

[Stealhead]

Originally Posted by Armistead

All religions have radical aspects, but not all religions are radical, Islam is radical! No doubt Christianity was as bad for most it's history and I dread to think where it would be had not secular law became rule. I recall a pastor years ago that stated he wished he could start a "kill a queer for Christ" program. He was a known Baptist evangelist through the SE. Sure, he said it with a laugh, but who says such crap without first having the thought.

You just proved my point actually.I do not think that you realize that you did but you did....23.4% or about 1 billion humans are Muslims if the majority(hell it would not even take a majority if even 20% of Muslims where radicals) where violent radicals we would not be having this conversation right now we'd be praying towards Mecca seeing that we are not praying towards Mecca clearly displays that most Muslims are not in line with the extremists if they where they would literately overwhelm us.

[eddie]

I think they handled the whole situation just fine. I feel sorry for the family of that soldier.

Now, the UK should take that goofy cleric, that they have been spending so much money trying to deport, and let that special police unit handle him the same way. One bullet is cheaper then all those court costs,lol

[Rockstar]

Originally Posted by Armistead

That's what makes me mad, every time we have one of these attacks, our leaders spend so much time telling us Islam is a religion of peace, etc.

Well islam IS a religion of peace, there just can't be no peace until all have submitted to islam.


I figure what comes around goes around. Tribes in North America were probably looking at european immigrants much the same way. A few may have saw the future. But "Oh don't worry"; they said. Its just a few bad apples we can live in peace we just have to be more tolerant of them.

Oh well thats life in the fast lane. Nabulsi anyone?

Where it is clearly said in the Quran that there should be violence and discmrination of infidels and Jews until they convert to Islam, else they should be killed.

What complete and utter bollox.
I wonder where the people of the book got refuge when infidels(christian word) were getting the convert or die treatment?

I think they handled the whole situation just fine.

Yes, Boris did as good a job with his statement as the previous idiot of a mayor did after the London bombings.
I agree wholeheatedly with the second part of that line.

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by Red October1984

@ Jim, BossMark, Herr-Berbunch. I'm sorry about that. I didn't think.

That is correct...you didn't but as long as you learn from the action then all is well

[mapuc]

I have just read a blog made by a danish politician named Naser Khader. I tell you if every muslim was like him, I'm 110% convinced that we would have peace with each other.

It's in danish and the google translate translate many of his words into...well it miss it's point(Reading and understanding what it says between the lines)

I could try

Markus

[Oberon]

Originally Posted by mapuc

I have just read a blog made by a danish politician named Naser Khader. I tell you if every muslim was like him, I'm 110% convinced that we would have peace with each other.

It's in danish and the google translate translate many of his words into...well it miss it's point(Reading and understanding what it says between the lines)

I could try

Markus

[mapuc]

Originally Posted by Oberon

I'm not an expert on Islam, but I do believe he is right about his sayings.

Here are the last part of Naser Khader's blog

"
I know that Islam is much more than raw violence and oppression of women, but it is now such that it is these
monstrosities that dominate Islam. Muslims need to shape up before it's too late. All the violence harms Islam much more than some ridiculous drawings. Why should a few grotesque violence men sully an otherwise fine and meaningful religion with intolerance and terrorism? Are we to other Muslims really find ourselves with? No we should not!

Think about that, he who is silence, often agree. Look ahead and compared you to the world, we are all a part of it and forget the cliché
'It's not my problem'. For it may very easily be! "

And he's right. The 98 % af the good Muslim needs to tell those extremist to go and fly a kite(with our help if needed)

Markus

[Skybird]

I know that Islam is much more than raw violence and oppression of women, but it is now such that it is these monstrosities that dominate Islam.

"Now"...? When has it ever been different froim Muhammad's days on?

Why should a few grotesque violence men sully an otherwise fine and meaningful religion with intolerance and terrorism?

Ehem, just a guess - maybe becasue it is the will of God that thy do so, his revelation to be read in the Quran - could that be, maybe...?

And when considering the massive racism present in Quran as well as in all Islamic history, the antisemitism that is rooting so deep in islam that you would reach the centre of the Earth if you follow it to the very tip of it, when you think of the barbaric suppression of women and the denial of basic rights for them that gets also accused, and demanded, by scripture, the explicit descriptions of discriminating infidels to make them feel suffering and experiencing inferiority due to their resistence to Allah, then I wonder what could be meant by "an otherwise fine and meaningful religion".

No , Mr Khader, by the posted excerpts I do not buy what you have to say in them. Cannot say whether you are just deceiving us and yourself over the dark and inhumane nature of Islam, or whether you indeed defend the values that you maybe imply in your vision as hinted at in these quotes and that then would qualify you as something more valuable indeed than just a blind barbar. But then I would ask you to have the graciousness and admit that the vision that you may have on mind is valuable maybe indeed - but has nothing to do with the message of Islam. Have the greatness, therefore, and leave your loyalty to this darkness that Islam is behind. To put it in Pat Condell's words: "there is too much at stake to be polite anymore, and there is too much at stake to be afraid anymore." And as long as Muslims stick to their perceived superiority as earning them the right for special status, and as long as they insist on the Quran being the perfect and infallible word of God, any declaration of how Islam could be reformed and how beautiful it really could be if only the dark and shabby bits in it would not spoil the impression so fundamentally, are just hot air and narcissistic babbling lacking any real substance.

Not directed against you, mapuc, I have heard such talking like quoted by you just some times too often now as if I would easily believe in it anymore. There is a reason why not any attempted reformist but conservative Islam is spreading in the world currently. The four gospels obviously are not the word of God, but man's attempt to describe the biography of claimed God'S son - that opened the option to put up questions on interpretation, and asking for validity, and in general: reflect about it. The Quran is not seen by Muslims as man'S work, but the original revelation of God's word, not man's description of it, but the original word by God himself. That is what puts it beyond reforms by humans. We know for sure that historically the Quran of course is man-made, and that many different versions of it existed in the early three centuries - but for Muslims, this is invalid and also uninteresting, for as a believer you must not know, but can simply chose to believe different. It's all heavenly magic, you know.

[Armistead]

Originally Posted by Stealhead

You just proved my point actually.I do not think that you realize that you did but you did....23.4% or about 1 billion humans are Muslims if the majority(hell it would not even take a majority if even 20% of Muslims where radicals) where violent radicals we would not be having this conversation right now we'd be praying towards Mecca seeing that we are not praying towards Mecca clearly displays that most Muslims are not in line with the extremists if they where they would literately overwhelm us.

The fact is radical Islam has overwhelmed many parts of the world, from the Mid-East, Africa, parts of Eastern Europe. It's the uneducated poor man's religion, ran by smarter educated leaders. Sure, there is a softer brand of Islam in secular nations.

I don't agree if all of Islam went radical we would all be praying to Mecca.
If you saw Islam go totally radical in America, acts of random terror, the American people wouldn't wait for the government to solve the problem, nor would most of the cultured nations of the world. If anything, it would lead to the extinction of Islam.

[BossMark]

Originally Posted by eddie

Now, the UK should take that goofy cleric, that they have been spending so much money trying to deport, and let that special police unit handle him the same way. One bullet is cheaper then all those court costs,lol

Yes a lot easier and cheaper simply to put a bullet in its head

[BossMark]

A BBC newsreader said last night "We need to say the man pictured in that VT is one of the alleged attackers in the Woolwich attack on a British solider"

Yes it's important we don't jump to any conclusions that the guy holding a machete covered in blood telling us why he did it is guilty.

[Red October1984]

Originally Posted by BossMark

A BBC newsreader said last night "We need to say the man pictured in that VT is one of the alleged attackers in the Woolwich attack on a British solider"

Yes it's important we don't jump to any conclusions that the guy holding a machete covered in blood telling us why he did it is guilty.

I hate it when they say stuff like that. If we had the actual mauling on tape they'd say the same....

And then they'd have to confirm that it was the same guy.

[Jimbuna]

These are the two 'suspects'...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-22636624

I believe two 29 year olds (a male and a female) have also been arrested on the grounds of conspiracy to commit murder...

http://www.itv.com/news/update/2013-...olice-station/

[kranz]

Just watched a short footage ( in Polish only :<) on how CNN and some British station cut out fragments in which the black guy talks about Koran, Islam and his inspirations.