Murder in London

[Red October1984]

Originally Posted by BossMark

@Red October1984
Lets look at it like this if some lunatic terrorist scum are coming at you with weapons drawn and it comes down to you or the vile evil terrorist scum it would be very hard not to shoot the bastard wouldn't it. And that's not being trigger happy its preserving your own life as well as others.

Originally Posted by Herr-Berbunch

Sorry, and you live where? Oh, in that country where one man can kill as many in one day as the British Police have done (rightly or wrongly) in over 30 years.

In just one month this year (March, according to your favourite Wiki) there have been 25 fatal shootings in the US by police, January was 42 - Happy New Year! By Contrast February was a good month, only 15.

Saying the British Police are very, very, very, very trigger happy is way off the mark, I'm sure even if you included data from Northern Ireland it would still be way below that of your good ol' law enforcement officers - and I'm not saying that yours are very, very, very, very trigger happy, just moreso.

Okay. Obviously what I said there was an overgeneralization based on one passage that I read from Wikipedia. I tend to do that sometimes. I know that there are tons of shooting accidents with US cops and I probably got a bit generous with the "Very" part.


I didn't think before I posted very well.

@ Jim, BossMark, Herr-Berbunch. I'm sorry about that. I didn't think.

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by Red October1984

@ Jim, BossMark, Herr-Berbunch. I'm sorry about that. I didn't think.

That is correct...you didn't but as long as you learn from the action then all is well

[mapuc]

I have just read a blog made by a danish politician named Naser Khader. I tell you if every muslim was like him, I'm 110% convinced that we would have peace with each other.

It's in danish and the google translate translate many of his words into...well it miss it's point(Reading and understanding what it says between the lines)

I could try

Markus

[Oberon]

Originally Posted by mapuc

I have just read a blog made by a danish politician named Naser Khader. I tell you if every muslim was like him, I'm 110% convinced that we would have peace with each other.

It's in danish and the google translate translate many of his words into...well it miss it's point(Reading and understanding what it says between the lines)

I could try

Markus

[mapuc]

Originally Posted by Oberon

I'm not an expert on Islam, but I do believe he is right about his sayings.

Here are the last part of Naser Khader's blog

"
I know that Islam is much more than raw violence and oppression of women, but it is now such that it is these
monstrosities that dominate Islam. Muslims need to shape up before it's too late. All the violence harms Islam much more than some ridiculous drawings. Why should a few grotesque violence men sully an otherwise fine and meaningful religion with intolerance and terrorism? Are we to other Muslims really find ourselves with? No we should not!

Think about that, he who is silence, often agree. Look ahead and compared you to the world, we are all a part of it and forget the cliché
'It's not my problem'. For it may very easily be! "

And he's right. The 98 % af the good Muslim needs to tell those extremist to go and fly a kite(with our help if needed)

Markus

[Skybird]

I know that Islam is much more than raw violence and oppression of women, but it is now such that it is these monstrosities that dominate Islam.

"Now"...? When has it ever been different froim Muhammad's days on?

Why should a few grotesque violence men sully an otherwise fine and meaningful religion with intolerance and terrorism?

Ehem, just a guess - maybe becasue it is the will of God that thy do so, his revelation to be read in the Quran - could that be, maybe...?

And when considering the massive racism present in Quran as well as in all Islamic history, the antisemitism that is rooting so deep in islam that you would reach the centre of the Earth if you follow it to the very tip of it, when you think of the barbaric suppression of women and the denial of basic rights for them that gets also accused, and demanded, by scripture, the explicit descriptions of discriminating infidels to make them feel suffering and experiencing inferiority due to their resistence to Allah, then I wonder what could be meant by "an otherwise fine and meaningful religion".

No , Mr Khader, by the posted excerpts I do not buy what you have to say in them. Cannot say whether you are just deceiving us and yourself over the dark and inhumane nature of Islam, or whether you indeed defend the values that you maybe imply in your vision as hinted at in these quotes and that then would qualify you as something more valuable indeed than just a blind barbar. But then I would ask you to have the graciousness and admit that the vision that you may have on mind is valuable maybe indeed - but has nothing to do with the message of Islam. Have the greatness, therefore, and leave your loyalty to this darkness that Islam is behind. To put it in Pat Condell's words: "there is too much at stake to be polite anymore, and there is too much at stake to be afraid anymore." And as long as Muslims stick to their perceived superiority as earning them the right for special status, and as long as they insist on the Quran being the perfect and infallible word of God, any declaration of how Islam could be reformed and how beautiful it really could be if only the dark and shabby bits in it would not spoil the impression so fundamentally, are just hot air and narcissistic babbling lacking any real substance.

Not directed against you, mapuc, I have heard such talking like quoted by you just some times too often now as if I would easily believe in it anymore. There is a reason why not any attempted reformist but conservative Islam is spreading in the world currently. The four gospels obviously are not the word of God, but man's attempt to describe the biography of claimed God'S son - that opened the option to put up questions on interpretation, and asking for validity, and in general: reflect about it. The Quran is not seen by Muslims as man'S work, but the original revelation of God's word, not man's description of it, but the original word by God himself. That is what puts it beyond reforms by humans. We know for sure that historically the Quran of course is man-made, and that many different versions of it existed in the early three centuries - but for Muslims, this is invalid and also uninteresting, for as a believer you must not know, but can simply chose to believe different. It's all heavenly magic, you know.