If you dont like the online DRM...

[GoldenRivet]

Originally Posted by Mikhayl

-People who simply want to buy a game with no strings attached.

Read your EULA on ANY game you have ever installed

No strings attached commercial software does not exist that im aware of.

Originally Posted by Mikhayl

-People who have no internet connection (either a gaming PC, or navy people in deployment and so on).

So those without internet connection then... I guess nobody will be travelling back to 1984 and playing SHV... bummer

As for people on deployment... i would imagine that SHV will just be on a long list of games they wont be able to play unfortunate as that really is.

Originally Posted by Mikhayl

-People who have a connection paid per hour (dialup, some broadband services etc). If you play your weekly 5 hours of SH5 it's going to raise the bill significantly.

People still do this???

Originally Posted by Mikhayl

-People who just have a not so stable connection, if your game pauses for anywhere between 5 and 30 minutes everytime there's bad weather or whatever connection issue it's not going to make anybody happy.

While this is true... it brings this image to mind.



(some folks need to roll with the punches and grow up and realize that this scenario is VERY RARE.)

Originally Posted by Mikhayl

People who tell others that "this is modernity and if you don't have 27/7 broadband you shouldn't be playing hi-end games", well they're full of ****. The only requirement for a hi-end solo game is a hi-end computer, and those are available regardless of internet coverage. Internet is as relevant to solo gaming as my oven is to my toaster.

an excellent point.

but... you have these options

1. buy the game and deal with it

2. dont buy the game and sulk

3. Do either 1 or 2 but in the mean time, stop crying and whining at subsim about it, it is not our fault and nobody here can do anything about it.

[piri_reis]

Originally Posted by GoldenRivet

So those without internet connection then... I guess nobody will be travelling back to 1984 and playing SHV... bummer

-People who have a connection paid per hour (dialup, some broadband services etc). If you play your weekly 5 hours of SH5 it's going to raise the bill significantly.

People still do this???

Dude get back down to earth. There are people out there:

Without Internet connection, people that get services w/ quota.
And there are people that want to play the game without needing a connection. (Out at a summer house, on the road, at a coffee shop where there is paid internet, etc..)

[GoldenRivet]

I completely understand all of the frustrations, really i do.

However, i fail to see what complaining will really do for you besides maybe raise your blood pressure.

Ubi is NOT your friend.

Ubi is a corporation out to make money

dont be delusional about it.

If Ubisoft decides this is the best way for them to protect their bottom line, they have had hundreds of meetings about it before any announcment was ever made... thats the choice they have made, if you chose not to buy the game, all good and well, i have yet to make up my mind as there are no accurate and available reviews of the game... however, stinking up the place is not going to help either way

thats the whole point im trying to make

[SteamWake]

Announcement.. heh... more like the cat slipped out of the bag

[ParaB]

You seem to ignore the fact that massive consumer protest in the past HAS actually led major publishers to re-think their DRM policies. You are, of course, free to go into surrender mode () but you might also consider that protest (as in protesting with your wallet) CAN actually change the way you, as a customer, are treated.

[martes86]

Originally Posted by GoldenRivet

However, i fail to see what complaining will really do for you besides maybe raise your blood pressure.

Ubi is NOT your friend.

Ubi is a corporation out to make money

dont be delusional about it.

You think we don't know that?
I think that now you're the one that's gotten the wrong directions of the protest. The protests are not just to stink the place for no reason. Showing our disagreement and anger about this matter is definitely a way to show we don't like what's been done, and, in some cases, opinions can change the final outcome. The best example is SH3's dynamic campaign and its delay from september to march, that made it much more likable than what it might have been had it been released earlier, and without the people's protests.

And there's no real reason to stink the place, just being civil, polite, and respectful, points can be made, and those shall show Ubi the mistake of their positions. It's been proven to work, why shouldn't it work now?

[trenken]

Originally Posted by martes86

You think we don't know that?
I think that now you're the one that's gotten the wrong directions of the protest. The protests are not just to stink the place for no reason. Showing our disagreement and anger about this matter is definitely a way to show we don't like what's been done, and, in some cases, opinions can change the final outcome. The best example is SH3's dynamic campaign and its delay from september to march, that made it much more likable than what it might have been had it been released earlier, and without the people's protests.

And there's no real reason to stink the place, just being civil, polite, and respectful, points can be made, and those shall show Ubi the mistake of their positions. It's been proven to work, why shouldn't it work now?

You have to know a little about technology to know that this is a lost cause. When you make a game that uses DRM, so much of the game is structured around that system. This is not something that this small community is going to get changed. It would delay the game for a year or more.

It's a large structural change that would need to take place, its simply not happening. Live with it or stop crying about it because it is what it is, dont buy the game if you dont want. Simple as that.

[piri_reis]

Originally Posted by trenken

It's a large structural change that would need to take place, its simply not happening. Live with it or stop crying about it because it is what it is, dont buy the game if you dont want. Simple as that.

You got some pretty flawed logic my friend.
This is a single player game not an MMO. So it should have minimal amount of code about the DRM. I bet it's just a wrapper around the core SH5 code, and some more on the savegame/patch update engine. It could be very easy to take out for the developers, if UBI ever decided to do so.

And Subsim is the biggest community of online simmers, just what are you talking about

[trenken]

Originally Posted by piri_reis

I bet it's just a wrapper around the core SH5 code

Hehe, wikipedia is your friend. It's not a wrapper. It's something that is decided before anything is done on the game because every single aspect of the game needs to know how to work with DRM. Do some research.

About the community, noone is saying its not the biggest, but it is still relatively small to all the gamers that would buy SH5. Im pretty sure they arent going to delay and rebuild aspect of this game for a handful of people here. Seriously man...

[exponent8246]

I personally am not keen on DRM's and dont fancy having to go online just to play BUT i will still buy the game because it looks so promising and I love the series!
I will definately give it a chance!

There is 1 single advantage to being logged into UBI's servers and that is to instantly receive the numerous patches that will be released in the months after release because lets face it, it will NOT be finished when released anyway!!!

Buggy and BSOD will be the constant cries from the punters (if previous SH releases are anything to go by)

Bring on the Modders!!!!

[tater]

A flakey net connection is not "very rare" for some of us, sadly.

If a game requires me to be online, I expect to be playing with and vs other human beings. Period. I can accept that when my connect goes to crap I cannot play.

When an OFFLINE game gets screwed up because of a flakey connection, that's where I draw the line. It's a 100% show stopper. Never would I pay money for that. Not ever.

[conus00]

Originally Posted by GoldenRivet

Sad really.

perhaps ubisoft should just abort? forget about the project?

Maybe they should. They also should release the game engine code to the subsim community so we can pitch money together, "hire" devs and build ourselves u-boat simulator WE want.

[conus00]

Originally Posted by trenken

No you're not understanding. Again GW is a great example since it uses DRM. Arenanet is talking about stopping support for GW, but you can play the game forever, it will always use DRM, it will always access their server, they just wont be serving any updates, thats what not supporting means, it doesnt mean changing the way the game works.

They wouldnt rebuild the entire game when all their servers are doing is holding people save files and tracking stats. That's nothing. There would never be a need to do that.

DRM is also great as time goes by, it allows them to improve the look of the game over time, updating textures and whatnot. Its really cool.

Somebody open this guy's eyes: NOT EVERYBODY HAS STEADY INTERNET CONNECTION. Speaking about internet connection (just in the USA) about 30% of people still have dial-up. Do you seriously think that they play pay-per-hour game?

[martes86]

Originally Posted by trenken

You have to know a little about technology to know that this is a lost cause. When you make a game that uses DRM, so much of the game is structured around that system. This is not something that this small community is going to get changed. It would delay the game for a year or more.

It's a large structural change that would need to take place, its simply not happening. Live with it or stop crying about it because it is what it is, dont buy the game if you dont want. Simple as that.

Don't even try to lecture me on technological complications, I'm a professional programmer working in the medical systems for the whole southern Spain, and developing for an indie railroad sim in my spare time, so I know the field well enough to ponder what's complicated and what not.

Is it complicated? Yeah, that's no mistery when it involves synchronizing info with a remote server. All methods managing the game information must have calls to the respective client-side communication libraries, which, in the event of a need for a change, would involve creating all class libraries that would use independent system interaction without the need for a remote connection. Or maybe it's much simpler, and all it does is gather runtime information, and then send all at once in the programmed events, which would actually be the wise decision, to centralize communications within a class, that gets a single call whenever a synchronization takes place, and so, if this was the case, it could be as easy as developing a new class that contained methods for intro validation, and load/save routines.

No matter what, it doesn't mean we have to "stop crying". Again, tell that to those that cried for dynamic campaign back when SH3 was being developed. As long as it is civil, I don't see a problem in people complaining about the ill-advised design decisions.