In Border States, BATFE Asks: "May We See Your Guns?"

[Stealth Hunter]

Who are these people they requested serials from? That's what I'd like to find out before I took a side on this particular issue.

[GoldenRivet]

Originally Posted by Stealth Hunter

Who are these people they requested serials from? That's what I'd like to find out before I took a side on this particular issue.

i dont care if its bonnie and clyde in a fortified house with billy the kid, the hole in the wall gang and bin laden...

without a warrant - it doesnt matter who they are

from the article it sounds to be law abiding NRA members

[Stealth Hunter]

Originally Posted by GoldenRivet

without a warrant - it doesnt matter who they are

Well really it does matter, because if these people have a history of gun smuggling (big problem down here) or have been caught in the past with an illegal firearm, the government should have every right to check on what weapons they own and get detailed information about them.

[GoldenRivet]

Originally Posted by Stealth Hunter

the government should have every right to check on what weapons they own and get detailed information about them.

yes... with a warrant

if they have that history - obtaining a warrant should be a piece of cake, or should we ALL eventually just open our doors to Obama and his gestapo clowns no questions asked?

Are you new to America?

[Stealth Hunter]

Originally Posted by GoldenRivet

yes... with a warrant

A warrant should not be a mandatory requirement for that kind of situation, simply because of the amount of time it would and could take (time enough to dispose of any evidence) and the fact you're dealing with a convicted felon who has shown no regard for the law in the past.

But in regards to good and upstanding citizens with no criminal background (as of then), I think the standard warrant laws we're using right now should be kept (so one would not be needed if the citizen agreed to let the law search their home and obtain information on firearms they have, but one would be needed if they refused).

Originally Posted by GoldenRivet

if they have that history - obtaining a warrant should be a piece of cake,

That's hardly guaranteed given how many of these judges can be.

Originally Posted by GoldenRivet

or should we ALL eventually just open our doors to Obama and his gestapo clowns no questions asked?

I have no trouble doing it. But then again, I'm only one person with nothing to hide.

Originally Posted by GoldenRivet

Are you new to America?

If you think asking for information about guns in this kind of manner is an authoritarian thing to do (as bad as the Gestapo's tactics apparently lol), then Golden, you have never lived in a country or even been CLOSE to a country with an actual authoritarian government, and you would not last long in one either...

I'm lucky to be living under these kinds of laws (I could be a lot worse off right now), and so are you, quite frankly. As I result, I'm not going to complain. But if you want to that's your right. Just my two cents.

[GoldenRivet]

Originally Posted by Stealth Hunter

A warrant should not be a mandatory requirement for that kind of situation

what exactly do you think the situation is?

they knocked on the door... asked to see firearms - owner said no - they got pushy and threatened him with legal actions.

no - thats not how it works.

Originally Posted by Stealth Hunter

But in regards to good and upstanding citizens with no criminal background (as of then), I think the standard warrant laws we're using right now should be kept.

those "good and upstanding citizens" are specifically the people being targeted. - did you even read the article?

i stick to my guns here... if the cops knocked on my door without a warrant and i have done nothing wrong (or hell - even if i had) and they wanted to see anything in my house - out of sheer curiosity - i would tell them to take a piss - its that simple.

what the ATF is doing here is wrong. period. - sure they can come and knock and ask nicely to see my guns... of course i will say "no" - but because i answer "no" doesnt mean they should resort to bullying and threatening.

Originally Posted by Stealth Hunter

I have no trouble doing it. But then again, I'm only one person with nothing to hide.

i myself have absolutely nothing to hide, however i am far right - anti big government and these clowns would get no respect from me or cooperation if they cannot follow simple due process that they might learn in YEAR ONE of their law enforcement classes.

Originally Posted by Stealth Hunter

If you think asking for information about guns in this kind of manner is an authoritarian thing to do

I do think that. these ATF bums are supposedly professional law enforcement officers - and to threaten innocent individuals with some sort of completely made up action against the individual if they dont cooperate is BS, its bullying and it is completely authoritarian.

Originally Posted by Stealth Hunter

I'm lucky to be living under these kinds of laws (I could be a lot worse off right now), and so are you, quite frankly. As I result, I'm not going to complain. But if you want to that's your right. Just my two cents.

what are you talking about?

im not complaining about the laws - im complaining about the Law Enforcement Officers complete and utter disregard for due process.

i know it could be a lot worse... and my home FULL of firearms is the only thing which keeps it from being "a lot worse".

when the left half of this nation kills all religion and prys my gun from my cold dead hands - they can do whatever the "F" they want.

until then i intend to hold on very tightly to both

[ETR3(SS)]

I've got an idea for punishment for these "officers." Since they're attempting to infringe on the rights of American citizens, maybe we should take their rights away for a little while. Since they don't think the rules apply to them...

[Buddahaid]

Originally Posted by GoldenRivet

im not complaining about the laws - im complaining about the Law Enforcement Officers complete and utter disregard for due process.

i know it could be a lot worse... and my home FULL of firearms is the only thing which keeps it from being "a lot worse".

when the left half of this nation kills all religion and prys my gun from my cold dead hands - they can do whatever the "F" they want.

until then i intend to hold on very tightly to both

I consider myself to be on the left side, and I own three firearms for the very reason you state. I'm not anti-gun, but I never felt compelled to own one until after 9-11 when the Bill of Rights was being dismantled in the name of security. I think you see left and right as black and white a bit too much. I do believe in a strong military as the world, and man, still has a lot of growing up to do. I applaud your efforts to keep your weapons responsibly, but the problem arises from those who don't or can't, and like all other things, it takes only a few to mess it up for all. My uncle in Texas deals in firearms, but never will join the NRA whom he considers run by an idiot. My point being this is not about taking sides and I feel just as strongly as you about my rights and privacy.

Buddahaid

I might add that before the firearms I collected about fifteen airguns of various types and ages. The oldest being a Daisy MD25 from about 1920.

[August]

Originally Posted by Stealth Hunter

I'm lucky to be living under these kinds of laws (I could be a lot worse off right now), and so are you, quite frankly. As I result, I'm not going to complain. But if you want to that's your right. Just my two cents.

That somebody has it worse than you is no reason not to defend what you have SH lest you eventually find yourself in their shoes.

[SUBMAN1]

Originally Posted by August

That somebody has it worse than you is no reason not to defend what you have SH lest you eventually find yourself in their shoes.

Let him go. He is just stirring the pot.

-S