Realism- and gameplay-related hardcode fixes for SH3.EXE

[Stiebler]

I have now tried extending the U-boat visual range (in NYGM sensors.dat) from 15000m to 20000m, when testing H.sie's single mission setup for the WOlfpack mod. The other change I made was to set wind to 5 m/s (visibility = light fog), a reasonable level often encountered.

It did not much improve the ability of the U-boat to detect the convoy, and the corvettes (crewrating=2) of the convoy quickly detected the U-boat as soon as it was daylight. [Edit: AI_sensors range is 11000m visual range for the corvettes, 6500m for their radar.]

The difficulty occurs when heading in to the convoy to make another sighting report. It sometimes happens that the escorts are carrying out their snake-like weaving pattern outwards at the same time, so the U-boat runs into them and cannot turn. Detection by the escorts always occurred at about 6-7000m, under these weather conditions.

A key factor that is probably influencing play is the state of training of the U-boat crew. When you play any single-mission, you start with an untrained, novice crew. By contrast, the escorts are already defined as 'competent' (CrewRating=2). This is likely to be less of a problem in campaign mode, since the U-boat crew-members are already likely to have reached some standard of skill by the time they encounter convoys.

H.sie is surely joking when he suggests that the correct way to shadow a convoy is at TC=1. This would require typically 12 hours from my real life each time I encounter a convoy. I have better things to do!

Completum:
Smoke-on-Horizon mod. This uses the standard SH3 convoy detection routines that are also used by the WolfPack mod, so there is no way of shadowing a convoy better than you can already.

Stiebler.

[h.sie]

@Stiebler: Of course I was joking, but with some serious thoughts in mind.
I didn't want you to test for the next weeks.

But what if the problems only occur at TC>=32 and not at TC=1?

If you play seriously, do you really want to do the shadowing at TC=32?

In my opinoin that situation is interesting and thrilling enough to be played at TC=1, even if it takes 12 hours. (of course I also play at TC > 1 during times when nothing happens).

Question: So the planned changes for Alpha2 (allowed 3 hours between messages) won't help?

[h.sie]

@Hitman: No I did not discover code that affects render range. Even if I had found it: I fear lots of side-effects when changing this value. Then, h.sie has to fix these side-effects, and so on. ......

We need simple solutions/compromieses. I come to my limits now and I cannot re-program the whole sh3.

I was never unhappy about restricted range of 16km. I explained it (for myself) by rests of fog in the air, conditions are not optimal, even in clear sky.

[PapaKilo]

@Hitman thanks :yep:


I was never unhappy about restricted range of 16km.

H.Sie

I heard the limits of maximum visibility in game might reach 20 km ?

Does 20 km atmoshphere has some side-effects ?

[h.sie]

No it doesn't. Since that was possible without hardcode changes and change of render range.

Exception: All Sensors for all Supermods had to be adjusted.

[Hitman]

We need simple solutions/compromieses. I come to my limits now and I cannot re-program the whole sh3.

I was never unhappy about restricted range of 16km. I explained it (for myself) by rests of fog in the air, conditions are not optimal, even in clear sky.

It is obvious that we need then to ensure that the mod works for 16k environments as standard, and also for the even better 20km ones.

This makes us face the problem of doing as many tweaked sensor files as environment mods are out there, which is quite simply ridiculous. So I come back to my original idea, exposed some posts ago, that this is something best left for 3rd party modders and author of supermods.

Do the wolfpack mod starting from the asumption that you will be able to shadow effectively in 16k or 20k environments, and let others sort their own stuff ...

Personally, if I were you I would even steer away from the hardcode fixes to ensure no UBoat detection you already suggested, as it might cause unwanted secondary effects.

At most, I would recommend choosing one beautiful 20km environmental mod (F.e. MEP3 or Rik's or Reece's if they add 20km) and provide an optional pack with sensors tuned for that environment. But strictly optional and separated from the wolfpacks mod in JSGME.

If you are interested on that, I volunteer to provide a sensors pack for MEP3 in NYGM & GWX, as this is something I have already been working with. Maybe someone else jumps in an offers creating it for other environment mods?

[PapaKilo]

:timeout: I can't live without OLCG2 enviroment mod!

Wouldn't want to choose between wolfpacks or OLCG2 :shifty:

[Stiebler]

H.sie asked:
Question: So the planned changes for Alpha2 (allowed 3 hours between messages) won't help?
I regard this change as *essential*. As you have said, it still allows serious game players to make 1-hourly reports.

The change will reduce the number of times the U-boat must risk being seen by convoy escorts while making contact reports, and also allows enough time (if sighted by an escort) to dive and avoid it.

The various other ideas about changing sensors will be great, if they work. But will they work? Your proposed alpha2 WolfPack mod will permit all outcomes.

Stiebler.

[h.sie]

Ok. Then let's first program and test Alpha2 and then think about sensors/detection.

There will be a LITE version, requires half of the time and contact messages.

[Pdubya]

@Pdyubya: Since until now 99% of the problems that seemed to be related to my patch, at the end were caused by corruted game installations, I ask you to

1) do a fresh GWX3 install without any further mod. (Also, compress your fresh install into a ZIP, RAR or 7z archive for later use. This will save a lot of time for re-installing a fresh GWX.)

2) Then try whether all works fine.

3) Then apply V15G2+Supplement. Start NEW mission and try again. Does it work as intended?

Do NOT load a saved game with V15G2 that has been saved without V15G2 and vice-versa.

Often enabling / disabling mods and forgetting a Rollback in SH3Cmdr rises the risk to corrupt the installation.

OK H.Sie, I'll get back with you on this. Don't think I will have time today before work, so it may be a bit.
Thanks.

[reaper7]

Do the wolfpack mod starting from the asumption that you will be able to shadow effectively in 16k or 20k environments, and let others sort their own stuff ...

+1:up:

This in my opinion is the best solution longterm :yep:.

[h.sie]

Hitman wrote:

Do the wolfpack mod starting from the asumption that you will be able to shadow effectively in 16k or 20k environments, and let others sort their own stuff ...

Good idea. Hopefully, alpha2 is easier to play. Then, no other changes are necessary. Thanks also for your offer to fine-adjust the sensors for MEP3, which I would also perfer, if I need to change to a 20km env. But I think Makman already did that adjustment.

[h.sie]

@Hitman: I cannot reproduce your statement, that there must be at least 3 ships of a convoy in visible range to be able to send a contact report. I can send as soon as I can see 1 ship.

[PapaKilo]

@Hitman: I cannot reproduce your statement, that there must be at least 3 ships of a convoy in visible range to be able to send a contact report. I can send as soon as I can see 1 ship.


It can't be that simple man.. It never gave to send contact report if there is only 1 or 2 ships sighted.

Luftwaffe respond to these reports if you have in sight no less than 3 ships and you are < 300 km from nearest base

[Stiebler]

@H.sie:

No, a single ship cannot be sufficient to send a convoy report. Otherwise, every lone merchant ship encountered at sea could be called a convoy.

I found in extensive testing for my 'Smoke-on-horizon' mod that you need a minimum of two ships in view to send a Contact Report. The number of ships needed can be much higher in light fog or darkness.

However, it is true that, once the convoy is detected, it needs only a sighting of a single ship of the convoy for the convoy to be 'recognised'.

Many thanks for the variable address that you sent to me. I have not tested it yet, but it is perhaps the case that it records ships-in-sight, rather than convoys.

Stiebler.

[PapaKilo]

[QUOTE=Stiebler;1757833However, it is true that, once the convoy is detected, it needs only a sighting of a single ship of the convoy for the convoy to be 'recognised'.

Stiebler.[/QUOTE]

This might be right on the other hand.. Never tried to send a report while sighting only 1 ship out of all bloody convoy, since they were too far from home base anyway to call an air strike :hmmm:

[rik007]

From what I understand reading about how far is the horizon by altitude:

1.7 meters above ground - 4.7 km

100 meters above ground 36 km

Theoretically dstance till horizon in plain surface is somewhat http://upload.wikimedia.org/math/e/6/e/e6e9b789af722a9857dbf46eabf82a68.png where h is eye level altitude

If I check the bridge height of a type ViII the point of view will be around 5.2 meters above sea. Means that the horizon is 8,22 Km's (stock distance).

[PapaKilo]

If I check the bridge height of a type ViII the point of view will be around 5.2 meters above sea. Means that the horizon is 8,22 Km's (stock distance).

And we have 16 km :) Wrong or right ? It's not good that all the ships of course comes to visibility range together with horizon line. I bet there was no option or nor is now in GWX to make an object appear over horizon line in clear weather ? I understand the approach to make 16 km environment or even more, cuz there is no other way to make it happen.

[rik007]

And we have 16 km :) Wrong or right ? It's not good that all the ships of course comes to visibility range together with horizon line. I bet there was no option or nor is now in GWX to make an object appear over horizon line in clear weather ? I understand the approach to make 16 km environment or even more, cuz there is no other way to make it happen.

What I noticed is that the horizon line is not lower than the sea plane around the point of view (you expect the earth will curve the surface down) but it slightly curles upwards to the horizon and thus absorbing the ships (as the sea is higher than the ships at horizon) emulating 'above the horizon'. So 8 Km is a bit unnatural as there is no above the horizon (it should be a bit longer).

20K is a overstretched thing, 16 K is a limit.

[Hitman]

@Rik: It seems that the calculations involved to have the ships be displaced downwards in the vertical axe as they go more distant were too complicated ... thus the expeditive solution taken by the devs was to curve the earth upwards (!) so that it would be the sea which would raise to hide ships instead of them sinking due to following the earth's curvature. You can give the earth in the scene.dat the correct curvature and the horizon is then beautiful, but you will see distant ships floating in the air because they did not stick to the water surface and instead kept their height in the same plane as you :damn: To cover the rest of the sea and prevent it from seeing it rendered behind the ship upwards, horizon fog was used.

Some clever mods like MEP3 use a combination of horizon fog and colours to minimize this effect, and the result is very close to what we want. But never perfect, and a high magnification in the optics will reveal the trick to the player.

[complutum]

I'm thinking if would be possible that for first contact report you need to see more than 2 ships to ensure it is a convoy, but once you've send it and while you are shadowing for the wolfpack you could send next reports just only seeing one ship of the convoy. Perhaps this way could be lees dangerous shadow it

[LGN1]

Hi,

am I right that shadowing without sending messages is no problem, i.e., the player can see/shadow the convoy without being detected?

Has anyone tried to lock on the ship/ships he can see (UZO on ship and pressing 'L', it might be required to increase the precise_range in the sensor file)? Usually, I can always lock on all ships I see (sometimes only for seconds, but that's enough) and then I can send a report :hmmm:

Regards, LGN1

PS: Once I thought that at the first encounter you have to see the number of ships that are given in the contacts.cfg file for a small contact/convoy. However, I'm no longer sure about that. Actually, I could never figure out a real pattern for how much ships you have to see in which situation :-?

[PapaKilo]

LGN1 is also correct. If your WO spots the very first ship out of the rest of the convoy, it is possible for the player to spot and identify (or simply lock on them ) other ships nearby that are still not reported as sighted by WO.

But in this case the report should be send very quickly just after manualy identifying nearby ships otherwise they will get "out of visual range by WO" again :)

[h.sie]

@Stiebler: I made a test mission with a convoy, consisting of some merchants and a single leading escort, which is located 2km in front of the other ships.

As soon as the leading escort comes in visible range for the first time (I still cannot see the other ships), I can send a contact report (sh3 engine seems to know that this is not only a single ship).

Could this difference between your and my results be inducted by NYGM/GWX differences?

[Depth Charger]

xxx

[Stiebler]

@H.sie:
As soon as the leading escort comes in visible range for the first time (I still cannot see the other ships), I can send a contact report (sh3 engine seems to know that this is not only a single ship).

Could this difference between your and my results be inducted by NYGM/GWX differences?

It could be so, perhaps.

Stiebler.

[rik007]

@Rik: It seems that the calculations involved to have the ships be displaced downwards in the vertical axe as they go more distant were too complicated ... thus the expeditive solution taken by the devs was to curve the earth upwards (!) so that it would be the sea which would raise to hide ships instead of them sinking due to following the earth's curvature. You can give the earth in the scene.dat the correct curvature and the horizon is then beautiful, but you will see distant ships floating in the air because they did not stick to the water surface and instead kept their height in the same plane as you :damn: To cover the rest of the sea and prevent it from seeing it rendered behind the ship upwards, horizon fog was used.

Some clever mods like MEP3 use a combination of horizon fog and colours to minimize this effect, and the result is very close to what we want. But never perfect, and a high magnification in the optics will reveal the trick to the player.

Welll, Understood! That's what I experienced. The visual aspect of this mod and the recognition-distance could lead to a more sophisticated sensor model. Hopefully better surface attacks. Combined with the Wolfpack we should have all we hoped for since a long time....!

[h.sie]

Wolfpack Alpha 2 available for download:

http://www.mediafire.com/?raxlajcdz1xsl

Details and instructions see here:

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=1755521&postcount=2131

Changes compared to Alpha1:


Time between contact messages now up to 3 hours without penalty (without magnified risk of wolfpack losing the convoy). But in order to lead wolfpack to the convoy using the quickest route, you should send hourly reports whenever possible.
A LITE-Version can be switched on/off using Stieblers OptionsSelector (per default it is switched on). In the LITE-Version, time between 1st contact report and wolfpack attack is halved compared to the HARD version.
The Single Mission "Wolfpack" now is easier to play.

Happy hunting and testing.

[Hitman]

D/l now, will report if I can patch it :up:

[SquareSteelBar]

D/l now, will report if I can patch it :up:If not let me know about...

[Flyingsub]

Very good mod. However I'm having problem getting the abandon ship button to show. On the NYGM install it shows as abandon ship but it's not red and looks like the old button. On GWX it won't show at all. Not using any other mods,just stock installs. Edited en menu text as needed, using the latest version of mod, patched SH3 uncracked exe. installed via jasme. What am I missing?:hmmm:

[h.sie]

This is alpha testing and not intended for playing. Thus, it does not contain the abadon ship mod. Stiebler will surely add it as soon as Wolfpack mod is final.

[reaper7]

First try and BDU told me to attack alone. If kept shadowing and send reports to see if it would change.
Question, if BDU say to attack alone is there a chance that wolfpacks may attack further along or is it best to try again :hmmm:

[h.sie]

@reaper: No. If BDU orders to attack alone, there are currently no other Uboats available that could attack.
This state won't change for some days.

Just start the mission again -> New roll-a-dice

[reaper7]

@reaper: No. If BDU orders to attack alone, there are currently no other Uboats available that could attack.
This state won't change for some days.

Just start the mission again -> New roll-a-dice

Cheers h.sie, had started a new one. Shadowed it for hours - All going well, then bdu reported to much activity around convoy and to attack alone :wah:


Made a youtube video of it in action - If only the wolfpack had showed up. But watchable for the contact reports and shadowing. Plus I can upload long videos now so what better reason to use it.

Video of my attempt to shadow of the convoy. (Click the picture below)

http://i4.ytimg.com/vi/S2S714vSnz8/default.jpg (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NxshPQYCLMI)

[h.sie]

@reaper: Sorry, but I also programmed some problems like enemy activity and so on, but in 1942 (date of your mission) these are not that often. bad luck.

Thanks for testing.

The focus of this mod is not only the crash-boom-bang effect when the wolfpack attacks. it's also focused on the difficulties when shadowing a convoy: concentration required for maneuvring to stay out of visible range, the frustration when something goes wrong and the pleasue in case of success.

A video of an attack would be nice for those who don't believe it works.

[makman94]

All worked as expected also at this test mission H.Sie ! :up:
about 10-11 reports needed at random times (not every hour but most of them was about every hour) and the wolfpack ''appeared''.
it is getting more and more exciting ! :salute:

some questions:

1.as you can see from pic 1 there were four 'wolfs'(exept me) that took place for attacking but they were dead stopped very far from convoy's course . only the mark 2 'wolf' was close enough (about 4km) and successfully attacked (it sunked two targets)

2.as the wolfs are stopped how do i have sonar lines for these contacts ?(seems odd ...) .
additionally ,i had the scope up so i am thinking that maybe you are very 'close' to give us another tiny but very usefull addition : to have the hydro lines always available no mutter if scope is up or down.


@Reaper : a 30 minutes video on youtube :o? you must send me (when you got some free time) some instructions how to do it ! (check your pms)

pic 1:

http://img825.imageshack.us/img825/6186/53353745.png

meeting with the mark 2 agressive 'wolf' :

http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/4062/88537883.png

========================================

[reaper7]

@Reaper : a 30 minutes video on youtube :o? you must send me (when you got some free time) some instructions how to do it ! (check your pms)


I applied for longer video times using our site www.u-boot-hahd.com as an organisation that required longer vids. And I got it. :yeah:
Nice shots of the Wolkpack - never thought to look for them in my following vid :(.

@reaper: Sorry, but I also programmed some problems like enemy activity and so on, but in 1942 (date of your mission) these are not that often. bad luck.

Thanks for testing.

The focus of this mod is not only the crash-boom-bang effect when the wolfpack attacks. it's also focused on the difficulties when shadowing a convoy: concentration required for maneuvring to stay out of visible range, the frustration when something goes wrong and the pleasue in case of success.

A video of an attack would be nice for those who don't believe it works.


Well this time around was a success, wolfpack showed up - alas I missed it visually while on the map.
1 ship was sunk, took over an hour game time at 32TC but was well worth it.
Shadowing was fun as convoy kept changing course - so kept me on my toes to stay outside there visual range.

Have it on video as proof that ship was sunk, and not by me :DL
And it was the cruiser they got too, leaving the convoy open.
If only my Torps didn't grave the ship hull and detonate on the bottom - due to heavy seas. Although I got 1 hit before sulking off. :up:

Video of my 2nd shadowing of the convoy in single mission. (Click the picture below)

http://i3.ytimg.com/vi/rWFNlYyaY0E/default.jpg (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rWFNlYyaY0E)

Its a long one at 1Hr12Min, Best watched at 720P :o

[h.sie]

I strongly suggest to play and enjoy the wolfpack feeling, the difficulty of shadowing, the battle --- instead of starting to analyse and re-engineer how the mod works and find its weak points.

@makman: you get a pm as soon as I am at home and find time

I remember you saying (in MEPv3 thread) that knowing about the visible sensor ranges in detail is an immersion killer. same for the wolfpack mod. it won't behave realistically if you look with a microscope on it. but from the perspective of the kaleun (binocular, periscope - if you play realistically) you see a battle, ships burning and sinking, distress flares and escorts leaving the convoy in order to attack the wolfs.

[SquareSteelBar]

...if I can patch it :up:So I assume patching did work? :hmmm:

[Hitman]

No I haven't been able to try yet, the weeked got suddenly complicated. Will see if tonight I can give it all a try and otherwise I'll PM you Thnxs :up:

[Stiebler]

@H.sie,

I have now managed to see wolf-pack attacks with the Alpha-2 patch.

With the default 'lite' version, it was very easy to get the wolf-pack to attack, with occasional convoy reports, and I had no trouble in shadowing the convoy.

With the 'lite' version ticked off (= realistic), I had to make several attempts to see a wolf-pack in action, but finally I achieved it. It required eight transmissions at about 1-1.5 hour intervals before I was released for attack, after which the pack sank four ships.

During one unsuccessful shadowing mission (realistic mode), I was ordered to shadow all through the afternoon, then all through the night, and then into the following day. Is this correct (programmed) behaviour?

Likewise, in campaign mode, it was very difficult to cause a pack attack. Indeed, I have yet to see an attack by wolf-packs in campaign mode with Alpha-2-Realistic.

Another minor issue: in en_menu.txt, item 4872 states simply 'signal acknowledged'. Elsewhere (4876), we have 'Signal received. Continue as ordered'. Are these signals intended to ask the player to continue shadowing, or to attack the convoy? It is not clear. In fact, I abandoned shadowing after receiving these two signals in succession after two shadowing reports, but, after looking at the en_menu.txt file, it seems that the signals intended the player to continue to shadow. This needs to be made clear.

We really must congratulate whoever it was (LGN1?) who fixed the files for the AI U-boats. Their torpedo-like gun attacks are very realistic, and I spent some time in camera mode watching a destroyer fire guns at one of the AI U-boats, invisible in the darkness. The overall effect is superior to that of Sergbuto's original VIIA AI U-boats, where the Allied ships all started to fire on one another, and half the convoy was destroyed with gunfire. The new VIIF boats give a much better result.

Concerning contact reports of convoys by player U-boats:
I have no trouble with NYGM in making a convoy report on the single-mission convoy as soon as the first escort (and nothing else) is in view.

However, in campaign mode, it is a different story, even with similar visibility (light fog) and wind speeds (12-14 m/s). The U-boat really has to see several ships of the convoy before you can send the first contact report, and often you have to get in close to the convoy even to send a second contact report - one escort in view is not enough. It seems that campaign and single-mission modes operate differently in the way they handle detection of convoys.

I tried changing the scene.dat file in NYGM back to an earlier and inferior form, similar to stock SH3. This made it harder to send a convoy contact report!

I hope this helps. In any case, congratulations again to you and to LGN1 for such a brilliant new mod, for so long desired by the community.

Stiebler.

[LGN1]

@all: Thanks for the feedback! It seems the mod works as intended, no CTDs,... maybe some parameter tweaking later, but basically it works. Time for a beta, h.sie?

@Stiebler: With the realistic setting it can take quite some time until the pack attacks. One reason for the long time is that the pack only attacks at night. Thus, you can be sure that you have to shadow at least until sunset (if you start shadowing at night you might have to shadow until the next night).

I don't know the actual setting that h.sie uses in the alpha2, however, for non-testing purpose we plan not to have a high probability for a wolfpack. Expect something like seeing a wolfpack approx. on every second convoy IF CONDITIONS ARE PERFECT. Please keep in mind that this depends on the area you are and the month/year (end of '42 has the highest probability). Seeing a wolfpack in action should be a rare highlight in one's career.

As h.sie has already written, the mod is more about the shadowing than about the action of the AI-subs. It's intended to provide the danger, frustration, challenge,... that real sub commanders had go through because of BDU orders. I guess most of them had preferred attacking a convoy instead of shadowing (a dangerous task without much reward quite similar to mine-laying). And it was difficult; Buchheim mentions in one of his books that the captain hardly left the conning tower during the shadowing.

Concerning the mentioned messages, their meaning is that the player has to continue shadowing. I thought this is clear because if you do not get any new orders, your old orders are still valid and the old order should be shadowing :hmmm: Anyway, I think anyone can adapt the messages to his/her liking (Maybe one should add a comment in the menu.txt which messages are used in which situation).

Regards, LGN1

PS: Stiebler, did you 'lock' on the ships you could see and what's the 'preciserange' value for your visual sensor?

[h.sie]

WITHOUT SDK!

(Sorry, I couldn't resist.)

[SquareSteelBar]

WITHOUT SDK!

(Sorry, I couldn't resist.)

Hats off!

Couldn't resist, too.

[LGN1]

WITHOUT SDK!

(Sorry, I couldn't resist.)


:salute:

Are you looking for a new challenge :D ?

(Sorry, I couldn't resist either.)

[reaper7]

Yes well done Guys, its a wonderful achievement :Kaleun_Cheers:
Sh3 is reaching new levels - there's load of life left in the old girl yet :yep:

I've really enjoyed trying out the wolfpack mission, gives new tactics to the game-play element of the sim.
I've encountered no issues to the use of this addon to the sim as of yet (using Manos MEP 20km environment).

[h.sie]

I apologize for my embarrassing comment above, but I must admit that I am really satisfied and I feel now, that the time has come to start my first serious career. I really hope that I like Uboat simulations, since otherwise my time would have been wasted (from my point of view).

Thanks to all testers for your comments!!!

@LGN1: No new ideas, please!! :D. The next version will be a beta, but that will take some time, since I have to re-implement and re-arrange all my fixes for V16. Code became too complex, confusing and spaghetti....

@Makman: I don't know much about the sonar contact lines at 0 knots. Even Sergs AI-Subs have them. But I didn't try to remove them, since a sound source could be useful to attract escorts.

@reaper: Thanks for your patience and the video. After BDU once informs, that wolfpack has assembled, no further contact reports are necessary. I will change the messages accordingly to make this clear. If you continue sending, BDU will order "Full freedom of manoeuvre granted", but risk rises of being detected.

@Stiebler: Thanks very much. Glad you like it. I will change the messages accordingly to prevent from misunderstanding. I think, with some sensor adjustments and/or or some experience and patience of the player, wolfpack attacks will be possible even in the career. It was surely hard in '42, so it should be for the player. You simply have to add the "WolfSubs" into the Campaign.scr of next NYGM version if you like. They do no harm for those who decide not to use the Wolfpack-Mod.

@ALL TESTERS: When shadowing a convoy for a long time, the most important message is something like "Wolfpack has assembled. Expect attack soon" or similar. Since currently some messages get lost, it is also possible that this important message gets lost and you receive consecutive messages like "Individual attack recommended". Did that happen frequently or only seldom for you?

If I'm informed correctly, radio messages have not been sent directly from BDU to the Uboat because of restricted range of the used radio waves. Instead, the messages have been relayed between some radio stations and even several Uboats acting as relais-stations. Thus, it seems possible for me, that some messages can get lost, but I don't know for sure. I like the little chaos when messages get lost, but if chaos is too big, I could shorten the response time of the BDU so that the chance for lost messages sinks.

So what were your experiences regarding lost messages?

[reaper7]

@reaper: Thanks for your patience and the video. After BDU once informs, that wolfpack has assembled, no further contact reports are necessary. I will change the messages accordingly to make this clear. If you continue sending, BDU will order "Full freedom of manoeuvre granted", but risk rises of being detected.

Ah thats good to know, I kept sending even after receiving that message. :D

[ETsd4]

Video of my 2nd shadowing of the convoy in single mission.
Thanks for the videos. Interesting. Keep it coming.
Very nice work, h.sie.
The message from BdU "Seems like you are on your own." irritates me a bit. "Attack at your own will. Status of the rest of the wolfpack is unclear." or something like that i would expect more.
And i saw the problems of shadowing a convoy on visual sight over hours and attacking a convoy with others (chaos, unpredictable course changes etc.).

[makman94]

I strongly suggest to play and enjoy the wolfpack feeling, the difficulty of shadowing, the battle --- instead of starting to analyse and re-engineer how the mod works and find its weak points.

@makman: you get a pm as soon as I am at home and find time

I remember you saying (in MEPv3 thread) that knowing about the visible sensor ranges in detail is an immersion killer. same for the wolfpack mod. it won't behave realistically if you look with a microscope on it. but from the perspective of the kaleun (binocular, periscope - if you play realistically) you see a battle, ships burning and sinking, distress flares and escorts leaving the convoy in order to attack the wolfs.

yes H.Sie i have said so(about the sensors) and i believe it ! i didn't 'analyzed' or re-engineered your mod for finding its weak points ! i was just wondering if this could be 'improved' but if we have 'limits' here that is absolutely fine with me . don't ever think that i am judging your FANTASTIC mod and i really.... really like it ! You and LGN1 (and all the rest involved in this) are doing a wonderful work here ,maybe the best ever made for sh3.

........

@Makman: I don't know much about the sonar contact lines at 0 knots. Even Sergs AI-Subs have them. But I didn't try to remove them, since a sound source could be useful to attract escorts.
.........

in fact (although unrealistic) i LIKE these hydro lines even for the stopped 'wolfs' ! why ? becuase ,thanks to these hydrolines, i know where the wolfs are placed (can 'pretent' that wolfpacks had communicate and were awared for their positions each other so it seems logical for me to know their positions on map).
knowing where the 'wolfs' are placed, i can choose my position in order to be me the one that will start the attack and not the wolfpack ! so ,that way ,the final decision of the attack is on user and that is ....ABSOLUTELY perfect !

I applied for longer video times using our site www.u-boot-hahd.com (http://www.u-boot-hahd.com) as an organisation that required longer vids. And I got it. :yeah:
Nice shots of the Wolkpack - never thought to look for them in my following vid :(.

......

you are a real 'explorer' ,John :up: (better than.... Indiana Jones ! )
for sure,we will make some nice videos-tutorials with this accommodation :yeah:

[h.sie]

@ETsd4: Thanks. I will rework some of the messages for the next version so that their intention will be more clear.

Regarding shadowing: I don't know how careful you acted while testing, but I think this cannot be done "quick and dirty" at high TC. One has to react on every course change of the escorts in order to maintain the distance and stay undetected. I will play shadowing at TC=1.

Try MEPv3. Makman says, this environment makes shadowing easier.

Writing these lines, I remember the film "Das Boot" where the Kaleun, standing on the bridge, tried to maneuvre his surfaced Uboat through lots of enemy escorts at gibraltar. Every minute he gave new orders e.g. "Rudder 50 starboard, engines slow ahead" for keeping his boat out of visible range of the enemy.

[h.sie]

@Makman: I decided to write in the forum instead via PM:

I know that your intentions were not to point out the weak points of my work. Your intentions are constructive and positive - no doubt.

But my (naive) hope was, that noone discovers these sonar lines. I personally don't like them, because in my opinion the player should not know about the exact position of the AI-subs, and he also should not know, how many AI-Subs there are, and that the AI-Subs don't move after the player has directed them to their final interception position with his course estimations. Our mod uses the players imagination ("other Uboats lurking around here, actively searching for the convoy"), and this imagination could be destroyed.

Thus, I was disappointed as you mentioned the sonar-lines and that the AI-Subs don't move during the attack. But most of the players will surely discover that by themselves - without your help.

So there is no problem at all with your post. Thanks again for your testing and your kind words.

The more knowlege you have about how the mod works, the more disenchanted you'll be.

Very worse for LGN1 and me, because we know every detail. But I think it is possible to *forget* the knowledge how the mod works internally and to create a new imagination of wolfpack action after some time.

The battle itself indeed looks as if there were wolfpack subs lurking around - and that's the most important thing.

Yes, I am at the *limit* with this mod at the moment. More is not possible in my spare free time and with the (still) restricted knowledge about the sh3.exe.

[reaper7]

you are a real 'explorer' ,John :up: (better than.... Indiana Jones ! )
for sure,we will make some nice videos-tutorials with this accommodation :yeah:

Hehe, once I think of something - I'll find a way to do:D. If it it means having to learn something from scratch.
But yes the youtube unrestricted times will be great for creating tutorials for all aspects of Sh3 - and that is my intention :up:.
I've created a BDU section on our website for tutorials ahope to keep adding to it.:up:

Regarding shadowing: I don't know how careful you acted while testing, but I think this cannot be done "quick and dirty" at high TC. One has to react on every course change of the escorts in order to maintain the distance and stay undetected. I will play shadowing at TC=1.

Try MEPv3. Makman says, this environment makes shadowing easier.


I found using Mepv3 that I had no problem maintaing visual on the convoy at 32TC.
In fact it made things even easier, by keeping the optics in use at a fixed bearing on any ship. Increase TC to 32, the user can slowly increase/decrease own speed to match the target (You can see me doing this in my 2 videos above) as long as the target is traveling in a straight line perpendicular to yourself you will know his speed.

Also you will know if he change course as he will all of a sudden start to lag behind your optics bearing :D

Thus, I was disappointed as you mentioned the sonar-lines and that the AI-Subs don't move during the attack. But most of the players will surely discover that by themselves - without your help.

I don't think this will take away from the mod at all. For example I missed the action as I thought the bearing lines were the convoys escorts :doh:.
And besides I imagine that the wolfpack would have been stationery lying in wait for the convoy to attack - so this recreates that perfectly.

And this is just the start, who knows what tricks we'll uncover down the road :03:

[Hitman]

As for the stationary subs in the wolfpack, I wonder if it would be possible to spawn them with an order to set speed to 7 knots or so (surfaced, less if submerged) so they would move even if in a simple straight line.

As I already suggested, you also could make the model invisible and then the AI would not shoot at it but only drop DCs (They will not shoot with guns if they only have hydrophone contact). And finally, make it dissapear after a while, to simulate the chance of escaping - less in late war.

In all, seeing the hydrophone lines i not that bad, as realistically you could have contact with other uboats, but f you spawn them submerged then I would suggest reducing the noise level a lot, so that both the player rarely contacts them (As in real life) and the scorts have a harder time finding them.

[LGN1]

As for the stationary subs in the wolfpack, I wonder if it would be possible to spawn them with an order to set speed to 7 knots or so (surfaced, less if submerged) so they would move even if in a simple straight line.


I tried this, but it didn't work :hmmm: I think you need waypoints and this makes it much harder.

Regards, LGN1

[Hitman]

I tried this, but it didn't work :hmmm: I think you need waypoints and this makes it much harder.

Regards, LGN1But same as the uboats can be spawned, can't they be given even a single waypoint as they spawn? If they are spawned in a circle, they all could be told to converge on the circle's centre, meaning the predicted convoy position according to its speed and course as reported by the player. If you spawn the uboats at a various (random) distances, they will sucesively arrive there and start shooting, and if you ensure that once they arrive there or abouts they dissapear, you will be mimmicking quite well the approach phase surfaced at night, shooting and dissapearing (submerging or running away).

[h.sie]

@Hitman: Your ideas are good and nearby. But I must jugde your ideas by my ability to program them!

LGN1 and me discussed hundreds of nearby ideas, and of course we had the same idea as yours. Only problem: The praxis. I currently cannot "beam" waypoints. I also cannot change the AI-Subs course and speed. Only possible: Beaming the AI-Subs. It was the hardest part of all. Hundreds of lines of assembler, and I must admit that I'm not willing to add another hundreds of lines to beam waypoints.

Since it's not even necessary!

Instead of moving the AI-Subs, I gave them a huge gunnery radius of 6000m and eagle-eyes, even in the dark. This fully compensates the fact that they don't move. No need to move into the directon of the convoy, since the convoy moves towards them. The effect is the same:

Boom!

It is sufficient and desired that the convoy comes in gunnery range of only one AI-Sub, since it has the power to sink up to 8 ships (depending of some random numbers). My only AI-tweak was indirect, by making the Subs blind for some random time intervals and let them see for other times, so that it seems the convoy ships are attacked by random.

Did you play it in the meantime? If not, I suggest to try it.

I am at my limit. More than this compromise I cannot offer at the moment, but everybody is welcome to enhance the mod.

[makman94]

whatever we discuss here are just...details . you all did here a superb mod which is working wayyyyyy more than expected .

yes...users get the 'feeling' 100% of the wolfpacks 'being around' and this is a 100% success of mod and ,also, this is something that ,not long ago, was 'out of range' .
you are showing to everyone what executables are capable for and the sad thing is that you are alone (as for programming itself and 'exploring' the .exe) and ,of course, you will 'hit' limits ! ...but...you have amazed me more than one times H.Sie ...so i am sure that you will 'strike' back again (sooner or later) !

[Robin40]

@Hitman: Your ideas are good and nearby. But I must jugde your ideas by my ability to program them!



well...from what you have done till now, we are justified to think that you can program anything you want:salute:

[h.sie]

well...from what you have done till now, we are justified to think that you can program anything you want:salute:

That's true in theory, but not in practice.

[PapaKilo]

Has somebody ordered a medal or two for H.sie ? :) :ping:

[SquareSteelBar]

http://img560.imageshack.us/img560/4237/ritterkreuz.png


Dem frischgebackenen Ritterkreuzträger Kptlt. h.sie ein dreifach 'Hoch' !!! http://img98.imageshack.us/img98/2144/pirateso.gif





.

[frau kaleun]

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/0c/Blue_Max.jpg/225px-Blue_Max.jpg

[PapaKilo]

Hell yeah - a reward time! :salute:

[h.sie]

Known bugs in V15G2:


CTD when Radar Fix is disabled



Periscope Fix not working correctly for Type IIA

will be fixed in forthcoming V16A2, which will also contain Wolfpack 1 Beta.

[reaper7]

Known bugs in V15G2:


CTD when Radar Fix is disabled



Periscope Fix not working correctly for Type IIA

will be fixed in forthcoming V16A2, which will also contain Wolfpack 1 Beta.


:yeah: Looking forward to its release :03:

[complutum]

me too


Johannes Franz U27

Member of the Enigma Flotilla, take a look at our subforum and join us

[Fish In The Water]

Known bugs in V15G2:


CTD when Radar Fix is disabled



Periscope Fix not working correctly for Type IIA

will be fixed in forthcoming V16A2, which will also contain Wolfpack 1 Beta.

Wasn't even aware of the first one, but thanks in advance for the fix. :sunny:

[urfisch]

great work!!!

:salute:

[Rhodes]

Got a CTD using V15G2 and the Stiebler_Surrender_Smoke_CAM (SSSC). I think I did everything as the read me file said. Patched a SH3 to V15G2. And then that file was patch with the SSSC. First I copy the SH3 file directly to the main game folder. Then after the first ctd I saw my mistake and (correct if I read wrong in the readme file of SSSC) the SH3 patched is going to the same folder of the mod and then enabled with jsgme. Had the same result.
I manage to run the game only using the V15G2 with out the SSSC.

[Jaeger]

Would it be possible to implement both mods in one? why not integrate stieblers smoke on the horizon fix into hsies patchkit? only one options selector would be needed and less complications for the users...

[h.sie]

@Rhodes: If V15G2 works but you get a CTD with Stieblers Add-On, Stiebler is your man. But you should help him by giving some more detailed information. You could also try to find out which Fix causes the CTD by disabling / enabling some of the Fixes and see if CTD still occurs.

@Jaeger: Possible in principle, BUT: Stiebler programs, supports (see above) and is responsible for his Fixes, I do the same with mine. This saves me a lot of work. So if you love his fixes, you should be willing to spend 3-5 minutes for patching.

[Depth Charger]

@hsie & Stiebler and the others...

OK - So I have been playing alpha 1 in campaign mode for a few days now - no hassles.

I am using GWX's 16K env and Raph's GUI because I think that it's the best because it takes away all that junk at the bottom of your screen which really helps on dark nights when you are tracking convoys.

LGN is right about being able to "paint" the target at a very long distance by pointing the uzo in the convoys general direction. I can already do it from 20k's plus and it's then quite easy to sneak up on them to do your contact report but it takes time and patience. (I been learning a lot these last few days.)

Another thing, when in reduced visibility, even though your chaps cant see the target, I have noticed that sometimes, the WO tends to stop rotating and stares in the direction of the threat/convoy. It's a warning that you getting close but doesn't always happen.

Lock on's and Contact Reports are now much easier for me- Firstly, paint the target at 20k's by locking on via your uzo. Once you get a lock, then open your ship manual and if it says cargo then find a cargo ship and click the check box. Same for tankers etc. The important thing is that the ship type must appear on your little notepad and once there, lock on again and immediately send your contact message. works first time for me quite often and I am in no real danger. I don't even need to "see" the target any more and you can TC yourself silly if you want to rush. Also, I don't think it really matters which "environment" you use - I tried a few and can lock on from over 20k's but I prefer to go in now and take a look. Also, night time needs to be closer for some reason, and you need more ships. (Update, not so sure about this, I seem to be able to lock on at night like i do in the day now.)

On convoys - I also assume that SH3's dB has a fleet table of sorts and so when you highlight a ship, then if it's row has a flag for being in a convoy, then the system and also your code will treat it as such which is why SH3 knows when you looking at a convoy or not by locking on to a single ship. (Alpha 1 reacts quite happily to small 3 ship convoys as well.)

I cant wait for the Beta but at this juncture, Alpha 1 on v15g2 has been cool all the way through and no ctd's for me.

One last thing though, you hardly get hits on campaign for wolf packs and I noticed you mention to someone that they should restart the mission each time (roll dice.) Is this true, if I go bust on the first convoy, then will none of the others work in that mission?

Your mod is really really nice and it feels fantastic to be in SH3 and not to feel alone any more when I am hunting.

Lastly, I know that you getting millions of requests but I think that I have an idea that may appeal to you and this group's skills. As I said, we are not alone in SH3 any more with your mod, but if you could pull off an extra bit that sends radio messages telling us to clear the harbour, go to some grid close by, and then on to our actual patrol area grid, and then somewhere else near to home and then home, based upon the patrol grids issued during the campaign. That would deepen the immersion factor more.

It's just a thought and am not even sure if possible as you have pointed out, there are limits to what you folks can do. It just seemed to be in line with your and Stiebler's thinking.

Thanks once again for everything, it is most appreciated.

DC

[Rhodes]

@Rhodes: If V15G2 works but you get a CTD with Stieblers Add-On, Stiebler is your man. But you should help him by giving some more detailed information. You could also try to find out which Fix causes the CTD by disabling / enabling some of the Fixes and see if CTD still occurs.

I see, but the SH3 pacthed with SSSC needs to be in folder that is enable with jsgme, isn't?
Thanks, I will do a fix on/fix off and see what info I can get!

[Depth Charger]

And tonight, after firing my torps in low vis, I escaped on the surface for the first time! No painful DC session for me! This mod is changing the way I play.

I was 3600m from the side of the convoy and just over 5k from the nearest escort when I realized it was a gap and bolted. Also got to see my hits from the top after I surfaced and was up to flank speed. The convoy stayed on course until the first impact and so they never saw me. I also got to see the search lights and flares and everything going off. It was a whole new view of the convoy under attack and its great.

Also, because i am now using the uzo and am also now getting the ship manual out to identify dd's and cv's after i lock on them, I can now see on the map what I think are their visual ranges. And so I toyed around a bit testing the perimeter of the convoy and I didn't get bust. It's really hard work and I didn't go in very deep but all of a sudden, the feasibility of a surface attack at night doesn't seem impossible anymore. Once again, Raphs GUI and a clear view from the conning tower is essential. Your little movie dream is coming real on my PC. I don't know yet if I can do it but next time I get a convoy at night in semi reduced vis, I am going to try a surface attack. Probably die, but what the hell...

In the past, I always plotted a convoy, moved ahead, periscope depth, manual targeting, shot my bolt, dived, got dc'd, escaped or died... It never changed and was boring...

But now its a huge challenge and all of a sudden I am an uzo freak after having almost never used it before and also, the info on the map is making much more sense and seems useful, if not actually designed for assisting one to carry out a surface approach.

It's like the lights are coming on in SH3 for us now with this mod. Well for me at least.

[shanetrott]

Sorry for my ignorance but what is Raphs GUI which has been referred to in the last few posts?

Thanks

[h.sie]

@Rhodes: Correct. Simply put the patched sh3.exe into the Supplement folder (same directory where the dll's are located) and than activate the whole MOD using JSGME

@DepthCharger: Thanks very much for your report. This encourages me to also take a rest and play a career......Glad you like it.

[Depth Charger]

Sorry for my ignorance but what is Raphs GUI which has been referred to in the last few posts?

Thanks

Apologies, it is - GWX 3.0 Rafael DSK GUI and you can find it in the downloads section. Takes away the dials at the bottom unless you hover your mouse over the area. This reduces screen glare on dark nights, this helps when tracking/locking on from the tower.

Also, be careful to read the install notes for this mod in order to update the menu.txt files so that you get your wolfpack msgs...

[Fubar2Niner]

And tonight, after firing my torps in low vis, I escaped on the surface for the first time! No painful DC session for me! This mod is changing the way I play.

I was 3600m from the side of the convoy and just over 5k from the nearest escort when I realized it was a gap and bolted. Also got to see my hits from the top after I surfaced and was up to flank speed. The convoy stayed on course until the first impact and so they never saw me. I also got to see the search lights and flares and everything going off. It was a whole new view of the convoy under attack and its great.

Also, because i am now using the uzo and am also now getting the ship manual out to identify dd's and cv's after i lock on them, I can now see on the map what I think are their visual ranges. And so I toyed around a bit testing the perimeter of the convoy and I didn't get bust. It's really hard work and I didn't go in very deep but all of a sudden, the feasibility of a surface attack at night doesn't seem impossible anymore. Once again, Raphs GUI and a clear view from the conning tower is essential. Your little movie dream is coming real on my PC. I don't know yet if I can do it but next time I get a convoy at night in semi reduced vis, I am going to try a surface attack. Probably die, but what the hell...

In the past, I always plotted a convoy, moved ahead, periscope depth, manual targeting, shot my bolt, dived, got dc'd, escaped or died... It never changed and was boring...

But now its a huge challenge and all of a sudden I am an uzo freak after having almost never used it before and also, the info on the map is making much more sense and seems useful, if not actually designed for assisting one to carry out a surface approach.

It's like the lights are coming on in SH3 for us now with this mod. Well for me at least.

@Depth Charger

Just read this, and I'm drooling. I really think I'm going to have to install ths :yep:

Best regards.

Fubar2Niner

[Fubar2Niner]

@H.Sie

I have a quick question if I may, I have 2 installs of SH3 both using MultiSH3 and both installs using the reloaded hack.

If I'm right your mod won't work on the hacked sh3.exe correct? So would I have to uninstall both installs I have currently, then install a starforce free copy of SH3 and reinstall my other 2 installs I have starting fresh careers ?

Sorry if this all reads a tad :88) can't think of a better way to explain my predicament.

Best regards.

Fubar2Niner

[SquareSteelBar]

...If I'm right your mod won't work on the hacked sh3.exe correct?...You're not right. It works... ;)

[Fubar2Niner]

You're not right. It works... ;)

Great news shipmate, many thanks for the heads-up :salute:

Best regards.

Fubar2Niner

[Rhodes]

About my problem, even enabling on and of several fixes, I got allways CTD. But I notice this, in the game menu, the message that appeared was NYGM war tonage 3.5. I'm GWX user. Is this the root of the problem isn't?

[shanetrott]

Apologies, it is - GWX 3.0 Rafael DSK GUI and you can find it in the downloads section. Takes away the dials at the bottom unless you hover your mouse over the area. This reduces screen glare on dark nights, this helps when tracking/locking on from the tower.

Also, be careful to read the install notes for this mod in order to update the menu.txt files so that you get your wolfpack msgs...

@Depth Charger: Thanks for the reply. :yeah:

[Fish In The Water]

Great news shipmate, many thanks for the heads-up :salute:

Best regards.

Fubar2Niner

I can confirm that. It works on SF as well. :sunny:

[h.sie]

@Rhodes: If you have NYGM text in your GWX installation, then you didn't follow the install instructions correctly. You have overwritten your en_menu.txt file with an invalid one, instead of appending only Stieblers new messages to your GWX en_menu.txt.

@Stiebler: In the forthcoming patches, I will no more put the whole en_menu.txt in the Supplement-MOD. Instead, I will only put the additional messages into a separate file, which the users have to append to their individual en_menu.txt. This could prevent users to make the same mistake as Rhodes did. Would be kind if you also do so.

h.sie

[Stiebler]

I have been playing the alpha-2 wolf-pack release for several days now, in campaign mode.

So far, it has not been possible to cause a single wolf-pack attack on a convoy when the 'lite' option is toggled off. I.e, realistic mode selected. I have attacked perhaps 20 convoys, over five campaign patrols, during June 1942- June 1943, all in north and middle Atlantic.

I have tried sending contact reports at night and at day, and in flat seas (wind 0 m/s) all the way up to 12 m/s. I have tried to send contact reports only when the wind is weak and the visibility is clear in daylight, while ignoring first contact with convoys in storms/night-time/medium fog. In every case, after my first contact report, the message from BdU is one of the variations of 'attack alone'. There is never a request to send hourly contact reports.

H.sie, I think you may need to check the code for 'realistic' wolf-packs. Otherwise, I have been terribly unlucky with my contact reports, far too many times.

Can anyone else confirm my experience?

In the forthcoming patches, I will no more put the whole en_menu.txt in the Supplement-MOD. Instead, I will only put the additional messages into a separate file, which the users have to append to their individual en_menu.txt. This could prevent users to make the same mistake as Rhodes did. Would be kind if you also do so.Agreed.

Stiebler.

[h.sie]

@Stiebler: Did I understand you correctly, that you get the order "attack alone" ALWAYS after first contact report?

Or are there situations where you first get the order to shadow, and after some reports you get the order to attack alone??

This is very important for me to know!

If you are ordered EVERY TIME to attack alone after the first contact, there are no Wolfs available (either from my code or not scripted correctly in Campaign.scr)

Did you always use the same career, or did you start a new one?

Could you please post the position from where you sent the contact report (Longitde/Latitude). There are areas in the north atlantic where no wolfs are available for certain reasons.

From your description my first idea was, that you have no "Wolfs" scripted in Campaign.scr or something went wrong while adding them to Campaign.scr. But then, the LITE version would also not work properly.

You may not change the initial position (Longitute/Latitude) of the scripted Wolfs!

Look at the report of DepthCharger: He played with realistic-setting and had success.

[Depth Charger]

@hsie and stiebler

I agree with Stiebler and also queried this as well in my post the other day.

I have only had the one successful run in alpha 1 after i sorted my contact issues but since then, I had no more either. (NE of Canaries if I recall correctly but i could be wrong.) I assumed it would be ok and that all my hassles were because of lock-on issues but those are sorted now and am still getting attack alone msgs almost always.

Sorry if I was not clear and for not noticing but have not been playing much since due to work. Am also switching to A2 lite now.

Update - A2 lite working well and just tracked a convoy and sent plenty msgs before getting told "full freedom of manoeuvre granted" which means its working fine for me now.

[h.sie]

@DepthCharger: Sorry, I had very little free time the last week and thus I obviously missed some information you wrote. I apologize and shall re-read your posts.

Does Alpha 2 work for you without LITE setting?

[Stiebler]

@H.sie,

As far as I can recall, I receive always the 'attack alone' (or similar) message in 'realistic setting' as the first message received from BdU.

For test purposes, I have been attacking convoys close to grid squares AM12 and DH18.

I have cut-and-pasted your campaign_SCR entries for the VIIF U-boats to the NYGM full campaign_SCR.mis file. I have placed the entries at the end of the list of ship units, and before the beginning of the ordinance units. Naturally, I have remembered to renumber the units! (to units 1018 - 1029).

The presence of the VIIF U-boats can be seen in the Canadian/USA great lakes with Mission Editor, in exactly the same place as with your original campaign_SCR.mis files. The VIIF U-boats are correctly installed in the data\submarine folder.

I have played with several successive patrols from June 1942 to June 1943 in the same single test career. Most recently, I have been deliberately trying to follow convoys in broad daylight, good visibility and low wind speeds to raise the chance of a pack attack. But no success. And almost every attempt to approach the convoy to make the first contact report results in the U-boat being detected, under these fine weather conditions.

Of course, in campaign mode there is always a big problem with locating convoys under suitable conditions. As I type these words, I am waiting for a 15m/s foggy-storm to die away and the weather to return to calm. I have predicted previously, that it is very likely that most users in campaigns are going to choose to use the 'lite' wolfpack version (even if the 'realistic' version functions correctly), because otherwise it is so difficult to establish the right conditions for a pack attack.

Stiebler.

[Stiebler]

Finally I succeeded to get a message from BdU asking me to send hourly contact reports in career mode, with the 'realistic' settings for the wolf-pack alpha-2 mod. (August 1942, wind 12m/s, medium fog.)

This was achieved with a new career, not a new patrol within my existing test career. Possibly the old career had become corrupt.

So I am glad to be able to report that there is no problem with H.sie's code, after all. Also, I never had any CTDs after saving, and reloading, countless saved games, so the code appears to be very stable.

Well done, H.sie!

Stiebler.

[h.sie]

@Stiebler: NOW I know the reason why you have always been ordered to attack alone in your old career but not in the new one:

The number of wolfpack-attacks per career is restricted to a certain value (this is not intended but necessary to make programming easy). Thus, for testing, better use a new career!

Sorry that this idea came soooo late!

h,sie

[h.sie]

I have now tested in career mode:

Daylight. Wind: 1m/s. Visibility: Good. Clear Sky.

Environment: OLC Gold MkII, 16k

1. As far as I have one ship in visible range, I can send a contact report.

2. It is not hard to hold contact, even at TC=32. I can see the ships at a distance of about 14km and I can reduce range to about 10km without being seen. That is enough to hold contact, but one has to take care that distance is not getting too small.

What did I do wrong that I had no problems?

[h.sie]

@DepthCharger: There were some items I did not understand from your posts:

I can already do it from 20k's plus

You can see/lock 20km in a 16km environment??

Firstly, paint the target at 20k's by locking on via your uzo.

What do you mean with PAINT?? I cannot lock at 20km in 16km environment.

Is this true, if I go bust on the first convoy, then will none of the others work in that mission?

There are more than one wolfpack attacks possible per campaign / career, but the number of attacks is indeed restricted, thus, you better start a new career every time for testing purposes.

After a wolfpack attack - or after having been ordered to attack alone, there are no wolfpack Uboats available. This state (no Uboats available) stays unchanged for some days. Thus, in order to save time, you better start a new career for testing purposes.

H.Sie

[Depth Charger]

Really enjoying Alpha 2 now in lite mode. Agree with Stiebler, I want lots of unrealistic wolf packs. Have still only had the one contact in realistic but who cares, I got lite now! :)

In reply - To "paint" a target is to highlight it with a laser so that an aircraft from out of sight can target it. I use the term because I have found that in SH3, if you get within about 20k's of your target, you then point the uzo in the direction of the ships and even though you cant see them, click the lock-on button and move it around a bit and it should select a target. If you then go and check quickly on your map, you can see it as though it was in sight. Sometimes you can send the contact report straight away but not always, other times I use it to help with my approach in the dark if I have to go closer. LGN has also picked up on this and mentions it in his posts.

If you do it this way, you can TC at 128 from hour to hour while sending contact reports!

Kindest and thanks for the testing tips.

[Robin40]

Is this Wolfpack mod working also on this environment?

M.E.P v3
M.E.P v3-Patch
MEP v3 VisualSensors for gwx3

[h.sie]

@DepthCharger: Thanks. I think all is sorted now!

@Robin40: Makman94 tested the Wolfpack Mod with MEPv3 with success.

[SquareSteelBar]

...I have cut-and-pasted your campaign_SCR entries for the VIIF U-boats to the NYGM full campaign_SCR.mis file. I have placed the entries at the end of the list of ship units, and before the beginning of the ordinance units. Naturally, I have remembered to renumber the units! (to units 1018 - 1029)...Why don't you use the 'Merge' function in MissionEditor? It saves time and more important: it prevents renumbering faults... ;)

[Stiebler]

@SSB:
Why don't you use the 'Merge' function in MissionEditor? It saves time and more important: it prevents renumbering faults... ;)I have found in the past that saving the file so created can have an odd effect on generic entries. For example, I have seen generic escorts for convoys replaced with generic battleship escorts!

True, this will not have an effect on the campaign_SCR.mis file. But I have got out of the habit of adding ships in Mission Editor now. I use it only to check files for problems.

@H.sie:
I have now tested in career mode:
Daylight. Wind: 1m/s. Visibility: Good. Clear Sky.
1. As far as I have one ship in visible range, I can send a contact report.
2. It is not hard to hold contact, even at TC=32. I can see the ships at a distance of about 14km and I can reduce range to about 10km without being seen. That is enough to hold contact, but one has to take care that distance is not getting too small.
What did I do wrong that I had no problems? Now try in light fog or at night!

Stiebler.

[Rhodes]

@Rhodes: If you have NYGM text in your GWX installation, then you didn't follow the install instructions correctly. You have overwritten your en_menu.txt file with an invalid one, instead of appending only Stieblers new messages to your GWX en_menu.txt.
h.sie

Sorry for the late update. First: :oops::oops::oops::oops: But I did follow the instructions, but did not removed the txt files from SSSC mod. I did that but I still get CTD. The alterations of the en_menu.txt that I did, was in the same file of my last mod, that is constituted by a single en_menu. Since it's the final file to be enable, I did the changes there. As I already did it with the prior messages of fog and the oxygen suplly.

[Depth Charger]

@ Stiebler

I agree, easy to lock on when clear but hard when in reduced visibility or the dark.

This is what I am doing to get my convoy identified as a convoy in poor vis -
1. Draw up on the side of the convoy until your chaps can see the outer escort. He still cant see you, turn to same heading as him.
2. ID the escort - and check it in the little book. You will see that you have done this correctly if you see it's visual radius displayed in dotted lines on the map and you will be just outside of it. If not, then you have got the wrong ship in the book, search until you get a match.
3. Pull ahead and then gradually turn in front of the escort taking care not cross over the visual outline in front of it.
4. As you get directly ahead of it, your chaps will start to call out that they can now also see the lead escort in front of the convoy which will be about 90 degrees on your side and the side escort you pulled ahead of will now be about 180 degrees behind you. By then, you will also start to see a ship or two on the top side corner of the convoy which is the weak spot you are moving into.
5. Move as close as possible to the side of the lead escort and then reduce power so as to slowly slide as deep as possible back into the weak spot minding the ship behind you. (This is really cool if you it do from the tower with your WO calling the range and you manually adjusting speed and direction as you go.)
6. Shortly after, your men will start to call out that they can see more and more ships in the top side corner of the convoy and you will also note that if you zoom out on the map, you can see the large convoy symbol meaning that you can then send your contact report.
7. You can then pull ahead by up to 20k's and it will still keep the convoy id when you lock on to any ship in that convoy meaning you can tc at 128/256 for the rest. (Might not be same for you but works for me.)

Also, I struggle in fog as you just cant get close enough to get them to id enough ships without blundering about. The maneuver also stops being effective when radar appears. However, I think that this was historically accurate in that surface attacks ceased with the advent of radar and getting lost in the fog sounds realistic to me as well.

Am enjoying your guys mod tremendously, thank you!

DC

[h.sie]

@Rhodes: If V15G2 works, but - according to your observation - the Stiebler-Addon causes a CTD, then one has to focus on the Addons. I have not looked into his according soucecodes yet and also think that Stiebler is surely more competent to find a possible bug (if existent), but as a starting point you can do the following:

1) Tell us whether the CTD is reproduceable or not. If so, when exactly does it occur?

2) Disable all Fixes that come with the Addon. Does the CTD still occur?

3) Then enable one of them you like most. Does the CTD occur?

4) Continue with the other 3-4 fixes - one by one ......

[Rhodes]

1.The CTD occurs when loading the mission or patrol, when the red bar reaches almost the "final section".

2.I disable almost all of the right colun in the options selector and still occur, but did not disable all, will do that today and see what the result.

3. idem But I like all, :DL.

In the afternoon I will get some time to do this, then I post here what I got.
Thank you and sorry for all this! :salute:

[h.sie]

CTD during game load for me often occurs when game engine tries to load files / objects which are missing, incomplete or corrupt. I suggest also to try a fresh install (make a backup copy of your current install).

Most of the CTD in relation with our hardcode fixes were related to corrupt installs.

[Rhodes]

But if that was the problem, shouldn't also happend when loading the game with out Stiebler-Addon. With all the fixes disable, got CTD. Possibly it may be some conflict with some mod I got.
My list mods:
skin_VII_Hellgrau_50_COBAT
GWX - Enhanced Damage Effects
Lutzow's Officers - SET6
GWX - Captain America's Officer Icons
GWX - 20km Atmosphere (Unofficial Mod)
Conus' Historically Accurate U-boat Emblems 1.2
WB's Decks Awash
LifeBoats&Debris_v4
BritishAsdicMkIFinal
GWX_DFa-Flag&Pens_2010
FM30_UpDown_final
Waterstream+Exhaust Combi V2.3 for GWX3
Torpedo damage Final ver2.0
b25_ConningTower_Mid
Wooden_Lifeboats_Mod_1.1
DasBootSehrohr
Real Depth Charge
GWX - No Medals on Crew
Foam
FM_NewInterior_V1.0
FM_NI_Fix_for_Anvart_FM30_UpDown
Conning Tower open Hatch TestFMfood
Q Ship mod GWX3.0
OLC's Modified Searchlight Beams for GWX3
New Uboat Guns 1.2
Aces' Combined SH3.SDL Files
Damage_caused_by_fires_TheDarkWraith_v1_2
MaGui F
optional-ALTERNATIVE SCOPES with speedlines stopwatch for MaGui F
TorpedoSolutionButton for MaGui F (NYGM-GWX-WAC)
Type VII salvo selector
CT_FM_NI_Fix_for_MaGui F
O2-Gauges
Supplement to V15G2 (JSGME)
EngToGerNamesForMaGuiFGWX3

[h.sie]

I don't know most of your mods.

I think: mod salad or corrupt install. I often corrupted my installs when frequently enabling/disabling mods (anyway, JSGME is a genious tool!).

One of the CTDs even corrupted an .act file.

Try to do a fresh install of your supermod without any other mods and then apply Stieblers Addon, including the patched sh3.exe. If that works without CTD, add the other mods - one by one - and see, which of them causes the problem.

[rik007]

My experience with CTD was lack of memory. Typically irregular campaigns crashes during loading. I now use 4Gb + Patch + 64Bits Os and all problems disappeared.

[Rhodes]

Try to do a fresh install of your supermod without any other mods and then apply Stieblers Addon, including the patched sh3.exe. If that works without CTD, add the other mods - one by one - and see, which of them causes the problem.

Will do!:salute:

[h.sie]

@Stiebler: I made some more tests in career mode:

Visibility = 2 (reduced visibility, medium fog) AND darkest night in GWX environment.

As soon as the watch officer reports the first convoy escort that comes in visible range, I can send a contact report. (I turned on map contacts for testing purposes and there was really only one contact shown).

I couldn't even see the ship with my own eyes at the first moment, I had to switch off the light of my room and turn my monitor more bright in order to see it.

I still have no problems sending contact reports - even at bad conditions.

Then, I set a course in parallel to the convoy - same speed and same course. All the time during shadowing I had only one (or sometime two) escorts in visible range, but never the merchants. Anyway, I could always send hourly contact reports. Wasn't hard, even at TC = 8 ... 32.

So I guess there are some differences regarding contacts in your and my sh3-installation. Maybe in Contacts.cfg ??

[Jaeger]

@Stiebler: I made some more tests in career mode:

Visibility = 2 (reduced visibility, medium fog) AND darkest night in GWX environment.

As soon as the watch officer reports the first convoy escort that comes in visible range, I can send a contact report. (I turned on map contacts for testing purposes and there was really only one contact shown).

I couldn't even see the ship with my own eyes at the first moment, I had to switch off the light of my room and turn my monitor more bright in order to see it.

I still have no problems sending contact reports - even at bad conditions.

Then, I set a course in parallel to the convoy - same speed and same course. All the time during shadowing I had only one (or sometime two) escorts in visible range, but never the merchants. Anyway, I could always send hourly contact reports. Wasn't hard, even at TC = 8 ... 32.

So I guess there are some differences regarding contacts in your and my sh3-installation. Maybe in Contacts.cfg ??

Perhaps both of you are testing in different years?

[Stiebler]

@H.sie:
Probably differences in scene.dat between NYGM and GWX.

Although I believe that both files were made by OLC (OneLifeCrisis).

I think I shall try again with the GWX scene.dat in NYGM.

Of course, differences in crew ratings between U-boats can also make a big difference. An experienced and decorated crew can see much more than a crew on its first patrol.

Stiebler.

[h.sie]

If you have no problems with the LITE version, why don't you stick at it and keep NYGM environment unchanged.

[Stiebler]

@H.sie:
I shall stick with the LITE.

But what puzzles me is why you are able so easily to send convoy contact reports, when it is harder for me.

This issue affects my 'Smoke-on-Horizon' mod too.

I have now tried the GWX3 scene.dat file with my NYGM set-up, but it makes the problem of sending contact reports even worse! I had to get close enough to a convoy in darkness/light mist in order to throw a stone at the ships, before I could send a contact report.

There are no significant differences between the NYGM and GWX3 sensors.dat files, and I know that you are using the NYGM file anyway with your GWX set-up.**

Therefore I cannot understand why you find it so easy to send contact reports in campaign mode, while I find it usually requires several ships in sight before I can send the report. Especially in light fog or at night.

Has anybody else got any ideas?

**[Or are you using the NYGM sensor file for your wolf-pack testing? Sudden thought: a lot of people have complained that the GWX sensors persistently give reports of 'Ship in sight' as it moves in and out of view in light mist, whereas the NYGM sensors.dat file does not, with slightly altered settings. Could this be the explanation?]

Stiebler.

[h.sie]

@Stiebler: Really funny, these differences.

Yes, earlier I made a mod against these "Ship spotted, ship spotted" in GWX, based on NYGM settings, but I didn't use that one during my tests.

The settings Light-Factor and Fog-Factor in Sim.cfg strongly affect enemy sensors depending on light/fog. Have you tried to change them?

[Depth Charger]

@H.sie:
I shall stick with the LITE.

But what puzzles me is why you are able so easily to send convoy contact reports, when it is harder for me.

This issue affects my 'Smoke-on-Horizon' mod too.

I have now tried the GWX3 scene.dat file with my NYGM set-up, but it makes the problem of sending contact reports even worse! I had to get close enough to a convoy in darkness/light mist in order to throw a stone at the ships, before I could send a contact report.

There are no significant differences between the NYGM and GWX3 sensors.dat files, and I know that you are using the NYGM file anyway with your GWX set-up.**

Therefore I cannot understand why you find it so easy to send contact reports in campaign mode, while I find it usually requires several ships in sight before I can send the report. Especially in light fog or at night.

Has anybody else got any ideas?

**[Or are you using the NYGM sensor file for your wolf-pack testing? Sudden thought: a lot of people have complained that the GWX sensors persistently give reports of 'Ship in sight' as it moves in and out of view in light mist, whereas the NYGM sensors.dat file does not, with slightly altered settings. Could this be the explanation?]

Stiebler.

I must confess that I have also come across some convoys that are a nightmare to identify. However, the other day I dove so that my sound man got pretty much all the contacts and then when I surfaced and locked on again, it was good.

I have only tried it once and it seemed to clear the problem but I dont know if it will work again.

It's almost like you need to clear some sort of recognition threshold to get a convoy locked on. However, worst case scenario is to break off and go and find another convoy.

It happens...

[Stiebler]

The sim.cfg file of NYGM is considerably different from that of GWX (and stock SH3).

However, attempts to use the GWX sim.cfg file, or to alter the settings, resulted only in the enemy detecting my U-boat more easily. It had no effect on the U-boat's ability to send a contact report about the convoy - perhaps made things worse.

I am beginning to wonder if the problem lies with default crews for the U-boat when the game is started. In NYGM, the default crew is poorly trained. Perhaps with GWX the default starting crew in career mode has better training, which is why it is better in trials at detecting convoys in less than perfect visibility.

This has become a baffling puzzle. I shall try Depthcharger's idea of diving to locate the convoy by hydrophones, before making surface contact.

H.sie, I know you have an NYGM set-up. Could you perhaps try a career patrol to see if you have the same difficulty as me in sending contact reports for convoys?

Stiebler.

[Magic1111]

Realism- and Gameplay-related hardcode fixes for SH3.EXE
...

Wolfpack Mod - by h.sie (programming) and LGN1 (idea) (V16A or later)
When you find a convoy, you should inform BDU about details. Thus, roughly estimate the convoy's course and speed and put these two values into the two TDC dials "Bearing" and "Speed" (German: Zielrichtung & Gegnerfahrt). If the convoy is heading north, set course to 0°, if it's heading east, set course to 90° and so on. Then, press 'M' key in order to send the contact report. You'll see these two values for course and speed in the contact report. Sh3 no more calculates them for you. It's your job now. After some time, you'll receive a response from BDU. If no other Uboats are available, you'll be ordered to attack alone. If other Uboats are available, BDU will order you to shadow the convoy and send contact reports every hour, if possible. (Note: Time between two reports isn't allowed to be lower than 55 minutes). Your speed and course estimations are necessary to lead the wolfpack into the operation area to intercept the convoy. The time between your first contact report and the wolfpack attack depends on the initial distance between the Uboats and the convoy. During shadowing, you'll get some orders from BDU. Follow these instructions. But sometimes BDU messages get lost or come too late - chaos, as in real life. If the wolfpack reaches the operation area, BDU will wait for good attack conditions (dark and no fog) and then order to attack. Then, some time later, the convoy battle (hopefully) begins. But it is possible, that the order to attack does not come in time or even gets lost. Bad luck, as in real life. The time period influences the availability of wolfpacks: In 1939, no wolfpack Uboats are available. In 1942 the chance is very high that a wolfpack is available to help you. From 1943 on, the chance strongly rises, that hunter-killer groups sink/damage the wolfpack Uboats, so that they don't reach their operation area. Then, BDU orders to attack alone. Your position also influences the availability: Wolfpacks are available in the north- and south atlantic, but not near land. It is important to send contact reports on a regulary basis - every hour, if possible, in order to lead the wolfpack to the convoy using the shortest route. Otherwise the chance rises, that the wolfpack isn't able to reach the interception point in time. Then, you have to attack alone. Weather also has an impact: The higher the windspeed, the higher the chance that the wolfpack Uboats get fuel problems or similar and don't reach the operation area in time.

...



Hi!

Where can I find V16A? It´s not on h.sie´s MediaFire Page...:hmmm:

Best regards,
Magic:salute:

[h.sie]

@Magic: V16A2 will come soon. Only some documentation left to do. I hoped nobody will discover the change I made to the first post, before release day.

[Magic1111]

@Magic: V16A2 will come soon. Only some documentation left to do. I hoped nobody will discover the change I made to the first post, before release day.

Okay, thx h.sie! :up:

Best regards,
Magic:salute:

[SquareSteelBar]

...Where can I find V16A? It´s not on h.sie´s MediaFire Page...It's named 'Wolfpack Alpha2 Patch-Kit.7z' in 'Testing' folder...

[h.sie]

Funny: my sh3 install (green pepper) does not need this huge sh3.dll to run. So I deleted it. sh3 still runs fine. Seems it contains only this starforce crap.

Edit: Looking with a debugger into the PE header of sh3.dll shows that it contains a code section named .sforce. This confirms my assumption.

[SquareSteelBar]

Interesting...

Version Info:


VALUE "BuildSignature", "3.04.076.000, 14.06.05"
VALUE "ProductGuid", "{EEA317B05D6EB2C5FFBDD5B59470FB4F}"
VALUE "BuildGuid", "{6914a155-be7d-4c8c-85b6-0a410a8478ef}"
VALUE "FileDescription", "Protection Library"
VALUE "FileVersion", "3.04.076.000"
VALUE "InternalName", "PROTECT.DLL"
VALUE "LegalCopyright", "(c) Protection Technology, 2000-2005"
VALUE "LegalTrademarks", "StarForce (R)"
VALUE "OriginalFilename", "PROTECT.DLL"
VALUE "ProductVersion", "3.04"
VALUE "CompanyName", "UbiSoft EMEA"
VALUE "ProductName", "SILENT HUNTER 3 PC DVD"
VALUE "HomePage", "http://www.star-force.com"

[h.sie]

The Green Pepper version doesn't even load sh3.dll into RAM. Thus, it seems to be redundant and does no harm.

[PapaKilo]

I'm using the latest stable version of H.sie patch. Not sure was it a stock bug or the patch, but when I go deeper than 160 m, my sonar guy stops responding to my nearest contact commands, it feels like all those commands stuck somewhere, cuz when I go up to about 150 m he then gives all requested answers that I was asking before. :shifty:

What is the DD radar detection range ? I'm in 1943 March. Seems the DD do not react unless I'm at 6 km or less than 6 km away from him ?

I was at night while testing how close I can get to the convoy on surface..

[h.sie]

I did not change this, thus, it's stock behaviour very likely.

[PapaKilo]

I'm with GWX, using all these mods:

http://img411.imageshack.us/img411/4697/clipboardm.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/411/clipboardm.jpg/)

With your latest stable patch + 4 GB switch on XP64bit

I always wonder is the 4 gb switch for SH3 works well if physically system has only those 4 GB, not more ?


And what about destroyers radar detection range ? I find it too short, as from documentary movie: "Convoy War for the Atlantic Eps2.The Hunt.avi"

I know that radar effective range was 16 km radius that were equiped on destroyers ?

[Dani]

@Stiebler
Regarding the problem of sending contact reports.

Last night I was playing a NYGM career with the V15G2 and your patch. Without the wolfpack patch.
The WO reports smoke on the horizon and I thought, great a convoy.
A look with the uzo shows it's a destroyer and around him I spot two more destroyers,so I lock on them, so that they show up on nav map. Then I send contact report and everything is working fine. It was a task force. I even think that it was possible to send the raport without spoting the other destroyers.

Now,later on I found a convoy(proper one,with merchants). The WO is reporting a ship or two and was locking on the others(as many as I can see) to speed things up. But when I wanted to report, NOTHING. I mean I get the message "Report send", but it didn't show in the message list. The command isn't functioning even if had 6-8 MERCHANTS in sight.
Only after a escort was reported I could suddenly send the contact report.

Sorry, if you had to read all this just to hear my idea.

What if the game is not recognising a group of merchants as a convoy until a escort is also present and spoted.I now you can't report a pair of lone merchants, but if you add a escort?
What are actualy the conditions you must meet so you got a working contact report button? Is there a limit of maybe 3 merchants and 1 escort? Or the merchant are actualy not important, since I could report the task force.
Can you maybe change this parameters and are there accessible?
Maybe one more proof for this theory, from hsie's post:

"As soon as the watch officer reports the first convoy ESCORT that comes in visible range, I can send a contact report."

Maybe I'm way off with this, but since you asked for an idea and I can't shake this one out of my head, there you go. :salute:

[rudewarrior]

Not sure was it a stock bug or the patch, but when I go deeper than 160 m, my sonar guy stops responding to my nearest contact commands...

When this starts happening, try removing your sonar guy into another slot, then place him back in. I have the same problem sometimes, and this fixes it. You will see the SO dump the list of contact commands all at once. That's what works for me.:up:

[reaper7]

@Stiebler
Regarding the problem of sending contact reports.

Last night I was playing a NYGM career with the V15G2 and your patch. Without the wolfpack patch.
The WO reports smoke on the horizon and I thought, great a convoy.
A look with the uzo shows it's a destroyer and around him I spot two more destroyers,so I lock on them, so that they show up on nav map. Then I send contact report and everything is working fine. It was a task force. I even think that it was possible to send the raport without spoting the other destroyers.

Now,later on I found a convoy(proper one,with merchants). The WO is reporting a ship or two and was locking on the others(as many as I can see) to speed things up. But when I wanted to report, NOTHING. I mean I get the message "Report send", but it didn't show in the message list. The command isn't functioning even if had 6-8 MERCHANTS in sight.
Only after a escort was reported I could suddenly send the contact report.

Sorry, if you had to read all this just to hear my idea.

What if the game is not recognising a group of merchants as a convoy until a escort is also present and spoted.I now you can't report a pair of lone merchants, but if you add a escort?
What are actualy the conditions you must meet so you got a working contact report button? Is there a limit of maybe 3 merchants and 1 escort? Or the merchant are actualy not important, since I could report the task force.
Can you maybe change this parameters and are there accessible?
Maybe one more proof for this theory, from hsie's post:

"As soon as the watch officer reports the first convoy ESCORT that comes in visible range, I can send a contact report."

Maybe I'm way off with this, but since you asked for an idea and I can't shake this one out of my head, there you go. :salute:

Possibly the easiest way to test if this is the case is to remove the escorts from the test mission and see if contacts can still be sent.
I may try that now and report back. :salute:

EDIT: Just tried that and had no problem sending a contact report. There were no Escorts in the Fleet.
So can safety say that Escorts are not required to be detected as a Convoy at least in single mission - maybe campaign uses different rules. (Using easy version).

[Stiebler]

@Dani, Reaper7:

Many thanks for your feedback.

I can confirm that it is not necessary to have an escort present in order to detect a convoy. In fact, some of my testing has been with two-ship 'convoys' that one can see sometimes in NYGM (also in stock SH3). These are always detected properly.

I have carried out a lot of testing on contact reports in NYGM recently, in connection with H.sie's Wolf-Packs mod. The results are very erratic; sometimes it is easy to report a convoy, sometimes not, and I do not understand why not. This is, however, an old problem that has been described many times by players of SH3 (not only with NYGM). With NYGM, I have found that there must always be at least one merchant ship in sight, before the first contact report can be sent. Afterwards, one needs only any single ship of the convoy in order to send a second report.

I have reinstalled NYGM completely for these tests - in three steps (NYGM_2.5, NYGM3_New, NYGM_3.5A), testing after each step, but again it is very hard to predict when the convoy report will be allowed.

All these same problems affect my 'Smoke-on-the-Horizon' mod, which uses the same code as that for Contact Reports.

Stiebler.

[PapaKilo]

When this starts happening, try removing your sonar guy into another slot, then place him back in. I have the same problem sometimes, and this fixes it. You will see the SO dump the list of contact commands all at once. That's what works for me.:up:


Thanks for the tip, will try this trick the next time on deep evasion :)

Edit:

Can somebody pls explain to me why radar of the destroyers has so short effective range ?

[Depth Charger]

@Dani, Reaper7:

Many thanks for your feedback.

I can confirm that it is not necessary to have an escort present in order to detect a convoy. In fact, some of my testing has been with two-ship 'convoys' that one can see sometimes in NYGM (also in stock SH3). These are always detected properly.

I have carried out a lot of testing on contact reports in NYGM recently, in connection with H.sie's Wolf-Packs mod. The results are very erratic; sometimes it is easy to report a convoy, sometimes not, and I do not understand why not. This is, however, an old problem that has been described many times by players of SH3 (not only with NYGM). With NYGM, I have found that there must always be at least one merchant ship in sight, before the first contact report can be sent. Afterwards, one needs only any single ship of the convoy in order to send a second report.

I have reinstalled NYGM completely for these tests - in three steps (NYGM_2.5, NYGM3_New, NYGM_3.5A), testing after each step, but again it is very hard to predict when the convoy report will be allowed.

All these same problems affect my 'Smoke-on-the-Horizon' mod, which uses the same code as that for Contact Reports.

Stiebler.

Am using GWX and agree contacts erratic, I am seeing the same thing but I don't mind it at all - My best shot now if I cant get a lock on, is to go ahead of the convoy and line myself up almost like for an attack except I let them pass and only take a look with the periscope from very close and that normally sorts it. After that, I back away and can get a lock. Sometimes, I can also achieve this just by submerging and getting enough sound contacts. Its almost like you need to pass some sort of arbitrary threshold to get a lock-on. Worst case scenario if it wont, I just find another convoy. Have also engaged smaller convoys successfully.

Also agree that once you have the convoy "painted", then you can lock on easily for the rest of the reports. I pull back quite a bit and can TC at 128 in between reports and to pull ahead so I can meet the pack when it gets dark.

One thing I have also noticed that is that I cannot send a report if I am in radar range from 1943 onwards. I need to back off and wait until the lines clear off the map before taking a lock-on and then sending the contact report. Have you also seen this?

I must be clear though, Alpha 2 on lite, is working like a dream for me. Not every convoy is a hit and successful runs only happen a few times in a normal campaign from about mid 42 to mid 43 and even then, less than half of those mature into an actual strike.

But when they do, oh man, then it is magic! Earlier tonight, I had a wolfpack take down 9 ships in a large convoy and I got two as well. I honestly thought and hoped that it would actually break up at one stage but the last few ships doggedly kept on going in formation when we finally broke off and I assumed that the AI simply doesn't go that far. It's also great to see a whole clump of sunk ships on the map when you have a lead a good strike although you only get credit for your own hits which is fair...

As far as I am concerned, You and H.Sie can take the cake for this one.

DC

[h.sie]

Seems that Stiebler has found a solution for the "3-contacts-required-to-send-contact-report" - problem. If tests work without side-effect, I'll include his fix into the upcoming wolfpack mod.

[difool2]

But when they do, oh man, then it is magic! Earlier tonight, I had a wolfpack take down 9 ships in a large convoy and I got two as well. I honestly thought and hoped that it would actually break up at one stage but the last few ships doggedly kept on going in formation when we finally broke off and I assumed that the AI simply doesn't go that far.

I've never seen a convoy scatter in SH3 (tho I have in SH4)...

[h.sie]

V16A3 with Wolfpack Mod Beta released !

http://www.mediafire.com/?vkz5l6n1069693q

What's new compared to V15G ?



Wolfpack Mod Beta. For details see 1st post of this thread. Also contains Stieblers Fix for the "Send contact report"-problem. From now on it is sufficient to have only one convoy ship or escort in visible range in order to send a contact report. Should make shadowing easier.



Bugfix: CTD when Radar Fix disabled.



Bugfix: Periscope Fix not working properly for Type IIA.



The SilentRunning-SlowSinking FIx is no more included. From now on it is part of Stieblers Add-On that will follow in the next time.



Note: Installation procedure has changed and became more tricky than before. Carefully read the README.doc containd in the Patch-Kit. Most important change: 12 AI-Subs have to be included correctly into your Campaign_SCR.mis file. Do not change their position (Longitude/Latitude value):

But: The wolfpack action and the convoy battles are worth the little effort!

Request: There are surely people who are unable to install the patches due to lack of computer skills. Would be very kind if some experienced guys offer help.

Idea: If the Wolfpack Mod is accepted by the mayority of the players, the Supermod creators could include the 12 AI-Subs directly into their Campaign_SCR.mis.

Hope you like it!

[Depth Charger]

I've never seen a convoy scatter in SH3 (tho I have in SH4)...

It kinda looked like this... And if you look carefully, this all happened within a few thousand meters... :)

Had to find someone after I docked to slap the smile off my face...

http://img593.imageshack.us/img593/8449/sh3img21102011.png

[Rubini]

seams that youre about to open Pandora`s Box :D

nice that you are kind enough to find this, man what other bad things are waiting for you in it...:03:

Hi h.sie,

Seems that Stormfly, the first to reply when you start this work, defined as a prophet what was to happen: just brilliant! Awesome work!

Thanks to you&Stiebler; we can´t stop to play sh3 anymore!:rock::rock::rock:

Cheers!

Rubini.

[Fish In The Water]

V16A3 with Wolfpack Mod Beta released !

And a huge thank you for all the work involved in this project. Congratulations on a terrific accomplishment! :salute:

[reaper7]

Idea: If the Wolfpack Mod is accepted by the mayority of the players, the Supermod creators could include the 12 AI-Subs directly into their Campaign_SCR.mis.

Hope you like it!

Brilliant H.sie, look forward to using this.
I'll make sure to merge the Campaign_SCR.mis in to the upcoming U-Boot_HAHD :yeah:

[Depth Charger]

I've never seen a convoy scatter in SH3 (tho I have in SH4)...

And this is what a 14 hour marathon chase looks like without map updates and steering completely manually from the first contact I got. (Am still using the alpha 2 wolfpack patch but will switch to Beta tomorrow.)

If you follow from the bottom left, you can see that I had a run in with a destroyer and took damage when I broke off. Attacked twice by aircraft and I still managed to come back, re-establish contact and successfully lead the pack into battle and bag myself a large tanker to boot. You can also see the impact of the mod to make the distance reports you get a little bit inaccurate, if you follow my contacts going up and towards the top right denoted by the little compass circles. Each was a successful contact report but having slightly inaccurate data adds to it and keeps you right on your toes all the way through the tracking phase.

Bullets flying, ships sinking, flares and depth charges going off look awesome but wait until your hear things on the hydrophone! Without contacts switched on, you are forced to sit glued to your headset waiting for your turn to loose your torps and the sound effects of the actual battle starting are simply brilliant. It started slowly with a few depth charges, and then the guns on a few ships opened up, and then on more and more as it spread across the contacts on the hydrophone, until all descended into the chaos of battle. And all of a sudden, you are there in the middle of the Atlantic and the titanic clash unfolding before you is one of your very own making. It's 1942 and you are too scared to raise your periscope for fear of detection and so all you can do is listen to the battle unfold while you hope and wait for the convoy to slowly move into the range of your solution. After 10 to 12 hours of tracking that convoy and having endured 3 attacks to get there with damages and repairs, it becomes very personal... Stuff the crew, you should have heard me shouting when the torpedoes went in! :)

Who would have thought this possible in SH3? I never had a mission last much more than a few hours in the past but today, I spent 14 on one convoy...

Magic! LGN, Stiebler and H.Sie have reason to be proud.

DC

http://img59.imageshack.us/img59/8384/sh3img231020113385672.png

[Robin40]

Hi H.sie!

In your Installation Manual you write

Append the new messages to the en_menu.txt / de_menu.txt files

However the last lines of my en_menu.txt file are the following

4812=Could not send report!

;Sonar
4900=Sweeping!
4901=Sweeping ahead!
4902=Sweeping ahead port!
4903=Sweeping ahead starboard!
4904=Sweeping abeam port!
4905=Sweeping abeam starboard!
4906=Sweeping astern!
4907=Sweeping astern port!
4908=Sweeping astern starboard!
4909=Sonar is off!
4910=Ship sinking!
4911=Ship breaking up!
4912=Nearest sound contact: %s %s! %s Bearing %03.0f! %s;type,speed,aspect,bearing,range
4913=No sound contact!
4914=No target selected!
4915=Range to target is %d!
4916=Short range!
4917=Medium range!
4918=Long range!
4919=Following contact %s! Bearing %03.0f! %s! %s; type,bearing,speed,aspect
4920=%s now on Bearing %03.0f, %s! %s; type,bearing,speed,aspect
4921=%s lost on Bearing %03.0f!; type,bearing
4922=Nearest warship sound contact: %s %s! %s Bearing %03.0f! %s;type,speed,aspect,bearing,range
4923=No warship sound contact!
4970=No officer at helms station!
4971=No officer at charts!
4972=No weapon officer at station!
4973=No radioman at station!
4974=No crew at sound station!
4975=No watch officer on bridge!
; last index is given by MaxStrings entry (at the begining of this file)
; if you add new items here, over the last entry, MaxStrings should be updated accordingly

so I think that it is necessary to insert the
_Append_to_en_menu.txt

between line 4812 and line 4900

[Dani]

@Robin40
It's not necessary to insert the messeges in the corect order. Just copy them after :
; if you add new items here, over the last entry, MaxStrings should be updated accordingly

@h.sie and all others involved
Just amazing. :rock::rock::rock::rock::rock:

One question.
During one patrol, can we expect more then one wolfpack assembly, or just one? And how does this applies to saved/load games?

Thanks again for you hard work!:up:

[h.sie]

Guys, thanks very much for this positive responses! Especially to DepthCharger for his detailed descriptions.....makes me curiuous to start to play myself. Never heard the "sounds of the battle". should try it myself with the hydrophone.

The advantantage of the new install procedure: All your changes are made in the Supplement-Mod and not in your sh3-installation. If something went wrong: Just disable the Supplement Mod and your sh3 is in its former state.

@Robin40: As Dani says: It's sufficient to append the new messages to the end of the en_menu.txt file. No need to insert them. No need to update MaxStrings variable, since I try to use unused numbers lower than 5000.

@Dani: In one patrol there can be more than one wolfpack attack. The number is indeed restricted, but to a (non-critical) value greater than 1.

The mission is saveable & reloadable, as long as you follow the rules for saving/reloading. See 1st post.

h.sie

[LGN1]

And this is what a 14 hour marathon chase looks like without map updates and steering completely manually from the first contact I got. (Am still using the alpha 2 wolfpack patch but will switch to Beta tomorrow.)

If you follow from the bottom left, you can see that I had a run in with a destroyer and took damage when I broke off. Attacked twice by aircraft and I still managed to come back, re-establish contact and successfully lead the pack into battle and bag myself a large tanker to boot. You can also see the impact of the mod to make the distance reports you get a little bit inaccurate, if you follow my contacts going up and towards the top right denoted by the little compass circles. Each was a successful contact report but having slightly inaccurate data adds to it and keeps you right on your toes all the way through the tracking phase.

Bullets flying, ships sinking, flares and depth charges going off look awesome but wait until your hear things on the hydrophone! Without contacts switched on, you are forced to sit glued to your headset waiting for your turn to loose your torps and the sound effects of the actual battle starting are simply brilliant. It started slowly with a few depth charges, and then the guns on a few ships opened up, and then on more and more as it spread across the contacts on the hydrophone, until all descended into the chaos of battle. And all of a sudden, you are there in the middle of the Atlantic and the titanic clash unfolding before you is one of your very own making. It's 1942 and you are too scared to raise your periscope for fear of detection and so all you can do is listen to the battle unfold while you hope and wait for the convoy to slowly move into the range of your solution. After 10 to 12 hours of tracking that convoy and having endured 3 attacks to get there with damages and repairs, it becomes very personal... Stuff the crew, you should have heard me shouting when the torpedoes went in! :)

Who would have thought this possible in SH3? I never had a mission last much more than a few hours in the past but today, I spent 14 on one convoy...

Magic! LGN, Stiebler and H.Sie have reason to be proud.

DC



Hi Depth Charger,

thanks for your kind words and the detailed report. Such a response shows me that the work was worth it. I hope that h.sie, who did practically all the work, feels the same.

Cheers, LGN1

[Depth Charger]

[QUOTE=h.sie;1772892]V16A3 with Wolfpack Mod Beta released !

Read through this. One thing though, don't you also need to have Sergbato's wolfpack 2 mod installed due to the fact that the new lines in the campaign_scr calls for these boats? Or am I silly?

Kindest

DC

PS - About the sounds - you can actually track this by ship and hear on which side of the convoy the battle is starting. You can even hear individual escorts engaging and the shots they fire to release the depth charges followed by them splashing into the water with the the explosions about a minute later, if you close enough. Which you are... Spent last night tracking one of the pack submerged as well.

[urfisch]

sounds really great! seems i have to give this a serious try! thanks a lot, h.sie!

great.

:salute:

[Robin40]

V16A3

and

Stiebler Surrender_Smoke_CAM addition to H.sie's V15G2 patch of SH3.exe

Are they compatible?

I assume they aren't or

Do you have to change V15G2 with V16A3 in

Purpose:
An update of H.sie's V15G2 patch, with Surrender and "Smoke on Horizon" patches made by Stiebler.
Requirements:
A version of SH3.exe which is ALREADY PATCHED with H.sie's V15G2 patch.
No alternatives!
Method:
Create a new folder somewhere, preferably in your silenthunteriii\mods folder, and place this complete 7z file in it. Unzip the file into the same folder. It should contain these items:
bspatch.exe
patch_SH3.bat
V15G2_Stiebler (a data file)
Surrender_Smoke (folder)
[You will have also the three files of the Options Selector, described above.]
You MUST have already a copy of SH3.exe patched with H.sie's V15G2 patch. Rename this patched file to SH3_V15G2.exe. Place this file SH3_V15G2.exe into the same temporary folder that you have just created.
Double-click on the batch file, and the patching process should proceed smoothly, to create a back-up file of your HSIE V15G2 file, and also of a new SH3.exe. Then use the Options Selector (double-click on it) to choose which options you require from those provided.
Finally move the new SH3.exe into the provided folder SurrenderMod. That is, when you click on the Surrender_Smoke folder, you should see:
a) SH3.exe;
b) Data (folder).
Now enable the whole Surrender_Smoke Mod with JSGME.
Well tested with NYGM, seems to be stable. Should work well with stock SH3.
NOT tested with GWX, I think that probably it will work well.
?

[Dani]

We must wait for Stiebler to release a update/new version of his Stiebler Surrender_Smoke_CAM addition for h.sie's new V16A3 patch.
Knowing Stiebler, we won't wait long.:03:

[h.sie]

@DepthCharger: All you need is contained in the Supplement-Mod

@Robin: Dani is right. You have to wait until Stiebler made his Addon compatible. His Addon is only compatible to one specific version of my hardcode fixes.

[BogdaNz]

i am not sure if i did well.
what i did i download V15G2 patch kit i followed instruction of readme.it's works part with oxigen,repair...but the part with surrender ,wolfpack i am not sure.

[Stiebler]

I can confirm that the new patch system works well for me.

I have had no difficulties with any of V16A3's functions.

However, the two options in the Options Selector are a little confusing:
17. Wolfpack Mod
18. Wolfpk less contact reports.

These look like alternatives. However, they are not alternatives. If you wish to play the 'less contact' option (easier, for wolfpacks), then you must tick BOTH options. If you want the harder version, tick only option (17).

Stiebler.

[fitzcarraldo]

I´m trying now the new wolfpack patch, with the WP test Mission:

- I added the AI Boats correctly, all they appears after my last [Unit] (6621).

- I added the lines in de_menu and eng_menu.

First, some of the text in my interface (I use Magui 3.4 WS), are changed to german.

Second, I sighted the convoy, send the report, BDU answer is an "attack alone" variant (attack at discretion, attack on your own...), but nothing about "shadow the convoy" or so. I shadowed the convoy day and night, after two days, nothing about order of shadowing or wolfpack attack.

What I doing wrong? I think my installation is well done, but I make some wrong playing the mission...

My JSGME List:

Generic Mod Enabler - v2.6.0.157
[C:\SH3\MODS]

GWX - Late War Sensors Snorkel Antennas
GWX 3 Wilhemshafen,St Naz,Schluese and xtra ships V6
LifeBoats&Debris_v4
Rbs1_SH4_Effects_GWX_30_71
Rbs2withbuoyance
Rbs3withlifeboat
Wooden_Lifeboats_Mod_1.1
New Uboat Guns 1.2
Waterstream+Exhaust Combi V2.3 for GWX3
GWX_DFa-Flag&Pens_2010
FM30_UpDown_final
FM_NewInterior_V1.0
Conning Tower open Hatch TestFMfood
Depthcharge Shake v2.01
WAC4.1 SubPen_animated_18.02.2010
Aces' Multimod compatability fix release v1.3 public beta
Aces' Super Turms v6 for GWX
MaGui 3.4
Widescreen MaGui v3.4
optional-blue recmanual for Widescreen MaGui v3.4
optional-stopwatch with speed lines for Widescreen MaGui v3.4
Type VII salvo selector
Aces' Super Turms v6 Damo's Type 7 Atmospheric Interior lighting add-on
Aces' Super Turms v5.1+ GWX all U-Boats Bearded Crew On Deck Add On
GWX_SH4StyleFlag_fullModel
Pascal_Port_People
BMW-R75 v.1 by TP
Dönitz Aces - Custom Emblems
Merchant_Fleet_Mod_3.2
Aces' MaGUI v3.4 (Widescreen version) add-on v3 for Super Turms 5+ & Multimod compatability Fix v1.3
Q Ship mod GWX3.0
Combat Radio Frequency
Thomsen's Sound Pack V3.2cg
Rapt0r's DBSM Addon Yes Sir Patch
B25_Deck_Crew_Ambient
BritishAsdicMkIFinal
Haunting Atlantic Wind
Karle's_Crash_Dive_Mod
Scirè-Tikigod- repeated order
Real Depth Charge
Fubars crew skins 2+3+4+Elite II+Bärte
No Medals On Crew [Patch]
Aces' Modified Headphones
Das_Boot_Besatzung_v2.1-Stations-ohne_Kaleun
Compulsory U-boat Headdress - GWX 2.0
Carotio_SH3_Seafloormod - 256mb
Ice Age
Rbs10-enhancedoilexplosion
TheDarkWraith_Ship_Plane_Fire_Damage_v1_4_SH3
Torpedo_HAHD_1024_GWX
Rapt0r's Das Boot Interior
Rapt0r's Instruments V3.5
OLC's Modified Searchlight Beams for GWX3
Sub Image mod
SH3 GWX Night Map
M.E.P v3
M.E.P v3-Patch
FSF for M.E.P v3-Patch
MEP v3 VisualSensors for gwx3
optional-Intro Screen for Widescreen MaGui v3.4
DD_VisibleMines_V1.0
GWX - Merged Campaign Wilhelmshaven v6
Supplement to V16A3 (JSGME)
O2-Gauges v2
Rapt0r's Das Boot Skin


The text from the Campaign_SCR included in the Supplement and applied via JSGME:

(The lines from my last [Unit]: 6621)

[Unit 6621]
Name=HMS Bonaventure
Class=SD
Type=12
Origin=British
Side=1
Commander=0
CargoExt=1
CargoInt=1
CfgDate=19400201
DeleteOnLastWaypoint=true
DockedShip=true
GameEntryDate=19440828
GameEntryTime=0
GameExitDate=19451231
GameExitTime=0
EvolveFromEntryDate=false
Long=18148906.000000
Lat=-4062495.000000
Height=0.000000
Heading=45.000000
Speed=0.000000
CrewRating=3
DelayMin=0
ReportPosMin=-1
ReportPosProbability=100
RandStartRadius=0.000000
NextWP=0

[Unit 6622]
Name=Wolf1
Class=SSTypeVIIF
Type=200
Origin=German
Side=2
Commander=0
CargoExt=-1
CargoInt=-1
CfgDate=19380101
DeleteOnLastWaypoint=false
DockedShip=false
GameEntryDate=19380101
GameEntryTime=0
GameExitDate=19451231
GameExitTime=0
EvolveFromEntryDate=false
Long=-10000000.000000
Lat=7000000.000000
Height=0.000000
Heading=0.000000
Speed=0.000000
CrewRating=4
DelayMin=0
ReportPosMin=-1
ReportPosProbability=100
RandStartRadius=0.000000
NextWP=0

[Unit 6623]
Name=Wolf2
Class=SSTypeVIIF
Type=200
Origin=German
Side=2
Commander=0
CargoExt=-1
CargoInt=-1
CfgDate=19380101
DeleteOnLastWaypoint=false
DockedShip=false
GameEntryDate=19380101
GameEntryTime=0
GameExitDate=19451231
GameExitTime=0
EvolveFromEntryDate=false
Long=-10000000.000000
Lat=7000000.000000
Height=0.000000
Heading=0.000000
Speed=0.000000
CrewRating=4
DelayMin=0
ReportPosMin=-1
ReportPosProbability=100
RandStartRadius=0.000000
NextWP=0

[Unit 6624]
Name=Wolf3
Class=SSTypeVIIF
Type=200
Origin=German
Side=2
Commander=0
CargoExt=-1
CargoInt=-1
CfgDate=19380101
DeleteOnLastWaypoint=false
DockedShip=false
GameEntryDate=19380101
GameEntryTime=0
GameExitDate=19451231
GameExitTime=0
EvolveFromEntryDate=false
Long=-10000000.000000
Lat=7000000.000000
Height=0.000000
Heading=0.000000
Speed=0.000000
CrewRating=4
DelayMin=0
ReportPosMin=-1
ReportPosProbability=100
RandStartRadius=0.000000
NextWP=0

[Unit 6625]
Name=Wolf4
Class=SSTypeVIIF
Type=200
Origin=German
Side=2
Commander=0
CargoExt=-1
CargoInt=-1
CfgDate=19380101
DeleteOnLastWaypoint=false
DockedShip=false
GameEntryDate=19380101
GameEntryTime=0
GameExitDate=19451231
GameExitTime=0
EvolveFromEntryDate=false
Long=-10000000.000000
Lat=7000000.000000
Height=0.000000
Heading=0.000000
Speed=0.000000
CrewRating=4
DelayMin=0
ReportPosMin=-1
ReportPosProbability=100
RandStartRadius=0.000000
NextWP=0

[Unit 6626]
Name=Wolf5
Class=SSTypeVIIF
Type=200
Origin=German
Side=2
Commander=0
CargoExt=-1
CargoInt=-1
CfgDate=19380101
DeleteOnLastWaypoint=false
DockedShip=false
GameEntryDate=19380101
GameEntryTime=0
GameExitDate=19451231
GameExitTime=0
EvolveFromEntryDate=false
Long=-10000000.000000
Lat=7000000.000000
Height=0.000000
Heading=0.000000
Speed=0.000000
CrewRating=4
DelayMin=0
ReportPosMin=-1
ReportPosProbability=100
RandStartRadius=0.000000
NextWP=0

[Unit 6627]
Name=Wolf6
Class=SSTypeVIIF
Type=200
Origin=German
Side=2
Commander=0
CargoExt=-1
CargoInt=-1
CfgDate=19380101
DeleteOnLastWaypoint=false
DockedShip=false
GameEntryDate=19380101
GameEntryTime=0
GameExitDate=19451231
GameExitTime=0
EvolveFromEntryDate=false
Long=-10000000.000000
Lat=7000000.000000
Height=0.000000
Heading=0.000000
Speed=0.000000
CrewRating=4
DelayMin=0
ReportPosMin=-1
ReportPosProbability=100
RandStartRadius=0.000000
NextWP=0

[Unit 6628]
Name=Wolf7
Class=SSTypeVIIF
Type=200
Origin=German
Side=2
Commander=0
CargoExt=-1
CargoInt=-1
CfgDate=19380101
DeleteOnLastWaypoint=false
DockedShip=false
GameEntryDate=19380101
GameEntryTime=0
GameExitDate=19451231
GameExitTime=0
EvolveFromEntryDate=false
Long=-10000000.000000
Lat=7000000.000000
Height=0.000000
Heading=0.000000
Speed=0.000000
CrewRating=4
DelayMin=0
ReportPosMin=-1
ReportPosProbability=100
RandStartRadius=0.000000
NextWP=0

[Unit 6629]
Name=Wolf8
Class=SSTypeVIIF
Type=200
Origin=German
Side=2
Commander=0
CargoExt=-1
CargoInt=-1
CfgDate=19380101
DeleteOnLastWaypoint=false
DockedShip=false
GameEntryDate=19380101
GameEntryTime=0
GameExitDate=19451231
GameExitTime=0
EvolveFromEntryDate=false
Long=-10000000.000000
Lat=7000000.000000
Height=0.000000
Heading=0.000000
Speed=0.000000
CrewRating=4
DelayMin=0
ReportPosMin=-1
ReportPosProbability=100
RandStartRadius=0.000000
NextWP=0

[Unit 6630]
Name=Wolf9
Class=SSTypeVIIF
Type=200
Origin=German
Side=2
Commander=0
CargoExt=-1
CargoInt=-1
CfgDate=19380101
DeleteOnLastWaypoint=false
DockedShip=false
GameEntryDate=19380101
GameEntryTime=0
GameExitDate=19451231
GameExitTime=0
EvolveFromEntryDate=false
Long=-10000000.000000
Lat=7000000.000000
Height=0.000000
Heading=0.000000
Speed=0.000000
CrewRating=4
DelayMin=0
ReportPosMin=-1
ReportPosProbability=100
RandStartRadius=0.000000
NextWP=0

[Unit 6631]
Name=Wolf10
Class=SSTypeVIIF
Type=200
Origin=German
Side=2
Commander=0
CargoExt=-1
CargoInt=-1
CfgDate=19380101
DeleteOnLastWaypoint=false
DockedShip=false
GameEntryDate=19380101
GameEntryTime=0
GameExitDate=19451231
GameExitTime=0
EvolveFromEntryDate=false
Long=-10000000.000000
Lat=7000000.000000
Height=0.000000
Heading=0.000000
Speed=0.000000
CrewRating=4
DelayMin=0
ReportPosMin=-1
ReportPosProbability=100
RandStartRadius=0.000000
NextWP=0

[Unit 6632]
Name=Wolf11
Class=SSTypeVIIF
Type=200
Origin=German
Side=2
Commander=0
CargoExt=-1
CargoInt=-1
CfgDate=19380101
DeleteOnLastWaypoint=false
DockedShip=false
GameEntryDate=19380101
GameEntryTime=0
GameExitDate=19451231
GameExitTime=0
EvolveFromEntryDate=false
Long=-10000000.000000
Lat=7000000.000000
Height=0.000000
Heading=0.000000
Speed=0.000000
CrewRating=4
DelayMin=0
ReportPosMin=-1
ReportPosProbability=100
RandStartRadius=0.000000
NextWP=0

[Unit 6633]
Name=Wolf12
Class=SSTypeVIIF
Type=200
Origin=German
Side=2
Commander=0
CargoExt=-1
CargoInt=-1
CfgDate=19380101
DeleteOnLastWaypoint=false
DockedShip=false
GameEntryDate=19380101
GameEntryTime=0
GameExitDate=19451231
GameExitTime=0
EvolveFromEntryDate=false
Long=-10000000.000000
Lat=7000000.000000
Height=0.000000
Heading=0.000000
Speed=0.000000
CrewRating=4
DelayMin=0
ReportPosMin=-1
ReportPosProbability=100
RandStartRadius=0.000000
NextWP=0


The lines of the en_menu from the Hsie. patch:


;------------------------------------
; Messages for h.sie sh3.exe patch
; -----------------------------------
; Simply append the following lines
; to your en_menu.txt.
;------------------------------------

4814=Fog disappears.
4818=Fog sighted.

4815=Oxygen: %02.0f Percent.
4816=Oxygen back to normal: 21 Percent.
4817=Oxygen too low. Using oxygen supply.

4819=Reloading external torpedoes.
4820=External torpedoes reloaded.
4821=Bad weather. Cannot reload external torpedoes.
4822=Alaaaarm! We must wait %2.0f minutes to dive.
4823=We must wait %2.0f minutes to dive.
4824=We can dive now, Sir.

4825=;
4826=Reloading torpedoes.
4827=Sea state too harsh. We must dive deeper to reload torpedoes!

4830=Repairs and refuelling at U-Tanker finished. %1.0f Torpedoes loaded.
4831=Weather too bad. Docking not possible.
4832=Repeated docking not possible.
4833=Docking not possible for Uboat types II and XXI.


; BDU-Messages
;-------------
; General
4835=Don’t sink neutral ships, you amateur!
4836=Error in transmission! Repeat last message!
4837=Start return! Home base as directed!

; Congratulations for achievement of new tonnage-category
4838=Very good results! ; 20000- 40000t
4839=Congratulations! Excellent results! ; 40000- 60000t
4840=Germany salutes you and your crew! ; 60000- 80000t
4841=That is worth an award! ; 80000-100000t
4842=Congratulations - new wearer of the Knight’s Cross! ; > 100000t

; For sinking >15000t
4843=Great work! That will hurt the enemy!
4844=Bravo! Excellent shooting!

; For sinking >10000t
4845=Very good work! A decisive blow!
4846=Bravo! But next time near enemy destroyers!

; For sinking >2000t
4847=Nice work! Carry on!
4848=Good work! Continue search for single ships.
4849=Well done! Keep at it!
4850=Sinking registered. Report any survivors immediately!

; Occasional communications
4851=Message received. Continue as ordered!
4852=Signal received.
4853=Short-signal received. Expect next status- and weather- news in 24h.
4854=Signal acknowledged. Stay alert.
4855=Message acknowledged. We have high expectations!
4856=Message received. Beware of aircraft!
4857=Message acknowledged. All further transmissions on long-wave 20.4kHz.
4858=Signal acknowledged. Use short-wave until further notice.

; For motivation
4859=Be more aggressive! We need better results!
4860=Show more courage! Charge at the enemy!
4861=You can’t come home with fully-loaded torpedo-tubes!
4862=Attack! Shoot! Sink!


;-------------------------------
; Wolfpack Mod
;-------------------------------

; BDU orders to attack alone
4863=Full freedom of manoeuvre granted.
4864=Individual attack recommended.
4865=Attack at discretion.
4866=Attack on your own. Good luck.

; BDU responses on 1st contact report
4867=Good work! Maintain contact. Homing signals every hour.
4868=You are the contact holder. Transmit hourly. Other boats on way.
4869=Curb your impatience! Support is on way. Hourly transmissions needed.
4870=At last a convoy! Stick with it until pack arrives. Request hourly updates.

; BDU responses on 2nd and later contact reports
4871=Signal received. Continue hourly transmission.
4872=Signal acknowledged. Continue holding contact.
4873=Good work. Hourly transmissions needed.
4874=Continue holding contact.
4875=Shadow the convoy. Transmit hourly.
4876=Signal received. Hold contact. Good luck.
4877=Hold contact. Beware of escorts.
4878=Contact report received. Hourly transmissions needed.
4879=Pack is on the way. Homing signals every hour.
4880=Other boats are on the way. Continue hourly transmission.

; Wolfpack in position. Attack will come soon.
4881=Pack has assembled. Expect joint attack tonight. Radio silence from now on.
4882=Pack reports contact. You are released for attack. Radio silence from now on.
4883=Other boats in interception position. Attack at will. Radio silence from now on.
4884=Boats in position. Commence operation tonight. Attack! Sink!

; Wolfpack has problems to reach operation area. BDU orders to attack alone.
4885=Pack is low on fuel. You are on your own - good luck!
4886=Pack reports local fog. You are cleared for solo attack.
4887=Weather expected to deteriorate. Attack at dusk.
4888=Pack unable to reach operation area. Attack alone!

; Wolfpack cannot reach operation area due to massive enemy activity.
4889=Enemy reinforcements will join convoy tomorrow. Don’t wait for others, attack tonight.
4890=Pack has disbanded. Attack at will.
4891=Pack reports strong enemy activity around convoy. Assume you must attack alone.
4892=Contact to pack lost. Attack alone!

The mod is a great achievement and I want to play with it!!! :wah:

Congratulations, Hsie!!! :yeah:

Best regards.

Fitzcarraldo :salute:

[Depth Charger]

I can confirm that the new patch system works well for me.

I have had no difficulties with any of V16A3's functions.

However, the two options in the Options Selector are a little confusing:
17. Wolfpack Mod
18. Wolfpk less contact reports.

These look like alternatives. However, they are not alternatives. If you wish to play the 'less contact' option (easier, for wolfpacks), then you must tick BOTH options. If you want the harder version, tick only option (17).

Stiebler.

Ditto from me. Stiebler's fix works like a charm. Press contact - Get Convoy...

Oh, and best of all - you can now send contact reports from the radio man's contact button while looking through the Uzo.

Another great hunt today but told to attack alone in the end which was cool.

DC

[Depth Charger]

i am not sure if i did well.
what i did i download V15G2 patch kit i followed instruction of readme.it's works part with oxigen,repair...but the part with surrender ,wolfpack i am not sure.

Hi

I dont think that the surrender bit works yet but you need to download version V16A3 for the wolfpacks.

Kindest

[h.sie]

@Fitzcarraldo:

1) German text: This indicates that something went wrong / messed up with your en_menu.txt. You should have copied the en_menu.txt from your MaGUI into the appropriate folder (data/Menu) of the Supplement Mod. Then, append the english messages from file named _Append_to_en_menu.txt to the en_menu.txt located in the Supplement-Mod. Please look into the en_menu.txt of the Supplement-Mod: Does it contain german text???

2) Shadowing. If you are ordered to attack alone, no wolfpack is available. This situation does not change, even if you shadow the convoy for 2 days. Instead, load the same mission again. Then, a new situation is randomly created, and it's likely that now a wolfpack is available. If not, try again and load the mission.

3) Your campaign_src.mis looks okay.

[h.sie]

@BogdaNZ: DC is right. For the wolfpacks you need V16A3, and the surrender option will work, as soon as Stiebler releases his Add-On for V16A3.

[Missing Name]

Uh, sorry if this has been asked before, but does this work with the 4 gigabyte patch?

[fitzcarraldo]

@Fitzcarraldo:

1) German text: This indicates that something went wrong / messed up with your en_menu.txt. You should have copied the en_menu.txt from your MaGUI into the appropriate folder (data/Menu) of the Supplement Mod. Then, append the english messages from file named _Append_to_en_menu.txt to the en_menu.txt located in the Supplement-Mod. Please look into the en_menu.txt of the Supplement-Mod: Does it contain german text???

2) Shadowing. If you are ordered to attack alone, no wolfpack is available. This situation does not change, even if you shadow the convoy for 2 days. Instead, load the same mission again. Then, a new situation is randomly created, and it's likely that now a wolfpack is available. If not, try again and load the mission.

3) Your campaign_src.mis looks okay.

Many thanks, H.sie. I add the Append_to_menu_text to the en_menu from the data\menu folder after the application of MaGUI AND Thomsen´s Sounds. The en_menu.txt is from Thomsen´s sounds (the last applied). I´ll check the en_menu for any mistake.

OK...I was thinking the WolfPack Mission EVER put a wolfpack in the vecinity of me or the convoy...I load the mission in three occassions and - ever - I obtain a "do it yourself"...When I sent the contact, ever I received the radio message, but no wolfpack in the vecinity.:damn


Best regards.

Fitzcarraldo :salute:

[h.sie]

@fitzcarraldo: Everytime you start that specific single mission, chance is 80% that wolfs are available, and 20% that they are not available. Thus, the chance that no wolfs are available in 3 consecutive single-missions is

0,2 * 0,2 * 0,2 = 0,008 = 0,8% -> Very unlikely.

Thus, it's very likely that something went wrong.

After activating your individual Supplement Mod, please go into your sh3-installation, folder /data/Campaign/Campaigns, open Campaign_SCR.mis and look whether the 12 AI-Subs really have found their way into your sh3-installation.

If you don't succeed, we'll surely find someone to help you. If not, I'll help.

Please, remove the long file listings from the thread and send them via PM, since they are not of interest for the other people.

[h.sie]

Anyone interested to program an 'App' :) that automatically does the required changes. Seems that some are overstrained.

[reaper7]

Easiest way to add them is via the Mission editor.
Open up the mission editor (Sh3MissionEditor.exe) in the SH3 directory.
Select open scripted layer from the menu:
Browse to the directory that contains the Append_to_Campaign_SCR.mis for the Wolfpack V16A3 that you extracted and select it.


The campaign will load and shall contain only the 12 U-boats in an American lake - this is all the will be on the map.

Now go to File -Merge...
In the popup tick the Make savable box and hit ok.
And browse to the current campaign folder in Sh3 and select this file:
Campaign_SCR.mis.
The current campaign will merge with the wolfpack campaign.

You can check this by opening Campaign_SCR.mis with notepad and you will see the 12 uboats listed from unit1 to unit12, after that the units in the campaign will be listed from unit13 on to unitxxxx.

Now goto file Save As: and overwrite the original campaign. Congrats your finished.
:up:

[fitzcarraldo]

@fitzcarraldo: Everytime you start that specific single mission, chance is 80% that wolfs are available, and 20% that they are not available. Thus, the chance that no wolfs are available in 3 consecutive single-missions is

0,2 * 0,2 * 0,2 = 0,008 = 0,8% -> Very unlikely.

Thus, it's very likely that something went wrong.

After activating your individual Supplement Mod, please go into your sh3-installation, folder /data/Campaign/Campaigns, open Campaign_SCR.mis and look whether the 12 AI-Subs really have found their way into your sh3-installation.

If you don't succeed, we'll surely find someone to help you. If not, I'll help.

Please, remove the long file listings from the thread and send them via PM, since they are not of interest for the other people.

H.sie, thanks for the support. My Campaign scr file include the 12 AI boats, no problem in it.

I use MEP v3 with the sensors.dat for 20 Km. Problems with it?

I played another two missions (five in total), and ever I had messages of "do it yourself".

Now, I´m changing the order of the mods, I´ll put MaGUI after Thomsen´s sounds, and add the append to en_menu.txt of Thomsen´s sound mod.

Also I use the Wilhelmshaven Merge Campaign for GWX mod (v6), in her campaign_SCR I put the 12 AI boats.

I´ll test the installation and will return with my feedback.

Best regards.

Fitzcarraldo :salute:

P.D.: List removed.

[SquareSteelBar]

Uh, sorry if this has been asked before, but does this work with the 4 gigabyte patch?The 4 GB patch is included in h.sieOptionSelector wherein you can apply it to the sh3.exe

[h.sie]

@fitzcarraldo: This won't solve your problem, I guess.

Offer: Activate all your favourite MODs using JSGME, and then go into your installation, search for en_menu.txt, de_menu.txt and Campaign_SCR.mis and send me these 3 files. I'll create the Supplement Mod for you.

[rowi58]

Best Patch ever :up:.

ATM - there are no problems with it. Please continue in this ultimate way:yeah:.

Greetings
rowi58


BTW - see PM (and PM in "MarineSims").

[h.sie]

I'm glad that alrealy two supermod creators/modders are planning to directly apply the necessary changes (to Campaign_SRC.mis and menu.txt) into their supermod. That means: Patching will become more easy in the future for the players of those supermods. Details will follow...

[Missing Name]

The 4 GB patch is included in h.sieOptionSelector wherein you can apply it to the sh3.exe

This just made my day :DL Who cares about that statics test I just failed?

[PapaKilo]

I'm glad that alrealy two supermod creators/modders are planning to directly apply the necessary changes (to Campaign_SRC.mis and menu.txt) into their supermod. That means: Patching will become more easy in the future for the players of those supermods. Details will follow...

Good news but not for GWX users I assume ? :)

Does the wolfpack mod requires 4 gb switch to be enabled ?

Will the guys be able to run it with 2 GB Ram in their rigs ?

[Depth Charger]

Unrelated question but this forum appears to be where answers are found...

I am having a hassle every now and then with the little "Multi choice" screen that sets your default response to certain threats and you can choose whether to dive, or continue etc.

Where can I edit these values directly? This thing removes control from you at the worst of possible times when it displays and if you get a wrong value in, then it can lead to collisions later on at high TC when you least expect it. It's a remarkably silly piece of code to put in a game.

Pressing escape and resetting the defaults is total waste of time as it will ultimately come back to haunt you. I have tried to find a related cfg file for this but got nowhere. Anyone know where they hid it?



Thanks

[frau kaleun]

Pressing escape and resetting the defaults

Do the reset thing so that it removes all "default" actions that were previously selected.

After that, when the box pops up, make the new "default" action the option that says "do nothing" or "maintain current orders" or whatever it is that causes *no* action to be taken automatically.

There are relatively few situations in which the box pops up, once you've done the above for each of them (enemy ship spotted, enemy aircraft detected, yada yada yada) it will not pop up again and the default action for all those situations will be to do nothing until you give a specific order.

OTOH if there is some file that can be edited to set the default action to the "do nothing" one before you ever start playing, that would be awesome since every time you reinstall the game and start playing again you have to wait for the box to pop up so you can set it in the game itself. :hmmm:

[rowi58]

I'm glad that alrealy two supermod creators/modders are planning to directly apply the necessary changes (to Campaign_SRC.mis and menu.txt) into their supermod. That means: Patching will become more easy in the future for the players of those supermods. Details will follow...


Hi h.sie,

it will be a great pleasure to embed your Patch V16xx to any so called "Super-MOD". I'll do that - and i know some of the missing there will do so, too.

It is great to see, that some one still is doing some elemamtarie work on this - good old game - as you do. Keep on,:yeah:

We need it. And SH3 is becoming better and better with every - soundless - MOD.

In this way. Greetings
rowi58

[Missing Name]

Well... sh3.exe crashes whenever I get 20km away from Wilhelmshaven (yes, I am using a brand new campaign). I'm going through the whole thread looking for a solution, but I'm only on page 100 or so. Also experimenting with the patcher to find out what is causing the problem.

Would SH3 commander cause issues?

I am running Windows 7, 64 bit. I bought my copy of the game from the Ubisoft website and is patchable using the .bat The version I downloaded is v 1.5G2.

Options enabled via Option Selector:
- 4 GByte Version
- Realistic Repair
- WO range fix
- WE range fix
- Oxtgen Supply
- Snorkeling fix
- Periscope fix
- Hydrophone Fix
- Fog warning
- CrashDive Blues Fix
- External reload fix
- Move 1WO
- War News fix
- U-Tanker fix
- BdU Messages
- Radar bugfix

[h.sie]

@MN: In the past, 98,5% of the CTD have been caused by corrupted installations. You are the first one reporting that specific problem with wilhelmshaven. If it were a programming bug, others surely would also have reported that error before you, I believe. V15G2 is online for 4 months now.

What lets you think that my patch causes the CTD?

Is the CTD reproduceable? If yes, please describe exactly, how it can be triggered.

Unfortunately, since I cannot look into your system (forgot to include a trojan in the exe), I can only suggest to make a backup of your current installation. then, make a fresh install with your supermod, and apply all your favourite mods one-by-one and find out which of them causes the problem.

SH3-Commander can cause corrupted installs if one forgets a roll-back. I have a corrupted install every 14 days in average, due to heavy modding and testing.

More I cannot do ATM I fear.
h.sie

[h.sie]

...we have now 3 supermod - creators who plan to include the necessary changes in Campaign_SCR.mis and menu.txt directly into their supermod. patching will become more easy in the future I think. thanks, guys.

thus, all people who have problems fiddling around in the files: please be patient....

[urfisch]

great...

:salute:

[Missing Name]

What lets you think that my patch causes the CTD?


The game ran fine before I attempted to use the patch. I disabled it and it seemed to work fine. Re-enabled it... and crash.


SH3-Commander can cause corrupted installs if one forgets a roll-back. I have a corrupted install every 14 days in average, due to heavy modding and testing.
Possibly the case? I have auto rollback turned on. Had to do a full system restore a couple weeks ago, but I didn't see anything out of the ordinary until now.

I will let you know if I can either trigger the error in other ways or if I find which component (if any) seems to be causing the problem.

[h.sie]

@MN: Ok, then it would be very helpful if you disable all non-relevant mods (for bug-searching) like GUI and eye-candy and so on and enable as few as possible mods plus wilhelmnshaven. then, try to reproduce the CTD and make a savegame before game crashes so that I can reproduce the CTD.

If there is really a bug, I can only fix it, if I can reproduce the CTD!

For analysis, I need a list of enabled mods and the savegame.

please upload them and send me the link.

[Rhodes]

Sorry for the following question, but after reading the readme file, I still have this doubt.
I patch Sh3 to the V16A3. Then I need to do all what the readme file says and I activate the patched sh3 together with the suplument mod. But what sh3.exe file is in the main game directory? A unpatched one?

[h.sie]

@Rhodes: If you follow the instructions step-by-step, the unpatched sh3.exe in the main game directory will be replaced by the patched one, when you activate the supplement mod (because the supplement mod contains the patched one - provided you made no mistake).

[Rhodes]

@Rhodes: If you follow the instructions step-by-step, the unpatched sh3.exe in the main game directory will be replaced by the patched one, when you activate the supplement mod (because the supplement mod contains the patched one - provided you made no mistake).

Care to bet 5 cents that my previous CTD is due to something similar, but with the previous version! I understand what the mistake I made, will try tomorrow and see. Thank you H.sie!:yeah::salute:

[Missing Name]

This is weird... I uninstalled all of my mods. Re-enabled them one by one. And now the game works fine. :06: The game crashed, but that has a loooong story behind it and is completely unrelated to this mod.

And now, I can say THIS MOD IS AWESOME.

[Schöneboom]

Guten Tag, h.sie,

It looks like I'll have to buy a newer copy of SH3 to use this patch (mine is the original Starforce version) -- but it sounds totally brilliant, so thanks in advance.

One aspect of escort tactics in the game always looks unreal to me -- after they force down my boat and depth-charge me, they give up and leave in 2 hours or less. I never see a very long siege where I risk running out of battery power or oxygen, ever. Is that something you can fix? Maybe it happens more often later in the war, so that might be part of it.

Ciao, best wishes,
Wayne

[Dani]

In post #1 you said there are no wolfpacks in 1939 and high chances in 1942.
In 1940 and 1941 wolfpacks are available, only the chances are lower then 1942, right?

[BogdaNz]

when i try to patch V16A3 it's say no compatible version of sh3 found.
is there anything can be done?

[h.sie]

@BogdaNZ: Seems you have 4GB-patch applied. Try original sh3.exe without 4GB-patch. If still no success, please send me the exe via PM.

@Dani: You are right.

@Schoeneboom: Starforced sh3.exe (without 4GB patch) should be compatible.

I think your problem can be solved by enlarging "LostContactTime" in Sim.cfg, but I'm not sure.

[Rhodes]

No CTD with V16A3, tested in two single missions, all :yeah:!

In my actual career, I am in november 43. Should I activate the wolfpack lesser contacts option? Even if a find a convoy in late 43/early 44, shadowing it is impossible or extremaly difficult, due to large number of escorts with radar, plus aerial coverage.
Or one should, if a convoy is found, attack with out sending contact to BDU?

[Flyingsub]

I've got v16a3 installed in LSH3 and NYGM with no ctds. However in the wolfpack mission in NYGM I cannot get the shadow orders. It keeps telling me to attack alone. The only other extra mod is mep3+fixpacks. Lsh3 gives me the shadow orders after the first report. Both installed according to the instructions. Regards:up:

[h.sie]

@flyingsub: try 5 times. if no success: please look into your nygm-installation and find out whether the 12 ai-subs really found their way into nygm campaign_scr.mis.

@rhodes: due to lack of gameplay experience i cannot say what tactic is better. try out and tell us. the "less contacts" option shortens the time between 1st contact report and wolfpack attack. it's mainly for arcade players (hehe, hope to get new friends with this statement)

[Flyingsub]

I've tried calling at least 5 times and have re-started the mission a few times to double check. The U-boat entries seem to be in order. They are in the end of the unit listings and re-numbered. SH3 editor show them on the campaign map. Do any of the realism settings affect the mod?

[h.sie]

@flyingsub: no. i guess something went wrong when the wolfpack mod tries to read in the AI subs. they are identified by their unique position (long/lat). even one millimeter change in their position would result in an error during read in. did mission editor change their position a little bit?

did you restart the mission from a savegame?

Do you use the same "sh3" folder in "own documents" for NYGM and LSH?

[Roland_RU]

@h.sie
Thanks for fine stuff!:yeah:

At me one question. Is it possible to add others AI u-boats except 12 standard?

[h.sie]

@Roland_RU: I havn't tried it out, since it makes no sense in my eyes and I'm satisfied with the current solution. But if someone manages to create Subs with a better AI, these could eventually replace the current VIIF.

[Flyingsub]

Nygm and LSH3 have separate folders in my documents and I didn't restart the mission from save games. Will run more tests and double check everything again. Regards.

[Flyingsub]

Uninstalled Mep-3 and tried the mission again, and now get the shadow orders on first call followed by the pack assembled message.

[h.sie]

@FlyingSub: Weird, I have no explaination why it works without MEP3 and it doesn't work with MEP3. On the other hand: Makman94 successfully tested the Wolfpack Mod with MEP3.

[frau kaleun]

No clue if it would matter, but doesn't MEP change the sensors.dat and some related files?

[don1reed]

Salute H.sie.

Just wanted to drop by and give you a big thanks for your work and the great new challenges it gives us. I play multiSH3: WAC, GWX, LSH3, NYGM, and one SH3 with your mods alone. I've added V16 to all five and I wish to report that all are working great.

Tnx agn.

[h.sie]

@frau: true, but the AI-Subs do have their own file for sensors. I made this to prevent file conflicts due to overwriting.

@don: thanks for your report.

[fitzcarraldo]

@H.sie: I sent you a PM with my Supplement files, for revision. No wolfpacks in my installation...:wah:

Best regards.

Fitzcarraldo :salute:

[Flyingsub]

@H.sie: Maybe not Mep 3 but starting date of the mission. Starting it in default 1942 got no orders . With the date set to 1941 it works fine.

[reaper7]

@FlyingSub: Weird, I have no explaination why it works without MEP3 and it doesn't work with MEP3. On the other hand: Makman94 successfully tested the Wolfpack Mod with MEP3.

All my Tests have also been with MEP3 Installed -had no problems at all. :up:

[Flyingsub]

After a mornings testing I can confirm Mep 3 is the issue with the mission in NYGM. I also tried MEP 2.1(16km) and LSH3 MEP (16km) with negative results. In all cases the the other U-Boat shows up on the map but can't get the orders. I have not tried MEP in campaign mode yet.Regards

[h.sie]

Fitzcarraldo: I have tested your Supplement-Mod you sent me. It worked well for me. The debugger showed that the AI-Subs are loaded correctly and I was ordered to shadow the convoy.

But different to you I used a fresh GWX install, only with Wilhelmshaven campaign.
Please try with a fresh install - without that huge MOd list.

Note: My description in the README wasn't clear. I changed it as follows:

Do the following procedure:



Load Single-Mission "Wolfpack".



Set time compression to a high value and wait until you see a convoy.



Send a contact report, keep the distance to the convoy and wait for the reply of the BDU.



If you are ordered to attack alone, try again: Load Single-Mission "Wolfpack" and....(see above)

An order to shadow the convoy shows, that the AI-Uboats are installed correctly. If, even after 5 or 6 attempts, you always received the order to attack alone, the installation of the AI-Uboats went wrong very likely. Reread chapter 3.2).

That means: If you once are ordered to attack alone, this won't change. Start a new mission instead of sending multiple contact reports.

[h.sie]

FlyingSub: MEP3 works for Makman, reaper, h.sie

[fitzcarraldo]

Fitzcarraldo: I have tested your Supplement-Mod you sent me. It worked well for me. The debugger showed that the AI-Subs are loaded correctly and I was ordered to shadow the convoy.

But different to you I used a fresh GWX install, only with Wilhelmshaven campaign.
Please try with a fresh install - without that huge MOd list.

Note: My description in the README wasn't clear. I changed it as follows:

Do the following procedure:



Load Single-Mission "Wolfpack".



Set time compression to a high value and wait until you see a convoy.



Send a contact report, keep the distance to the convoy and wait for the reply of the BDU.



If you are ordered to attack alone, try again: Load Single-Mission "Wolfpack" and....(see above)

An order to shadow the convoy shows, that the AI-Uboats are installed correctly. If, even after 5 or 6 attempts, you always received the order to attack alone, the installation of the AI-Uboats went wrong very likely. Reread chapter 3.2).

That means: If you once are ordered to attack alone, this won't change. Start a new mission instead of sending multiple contact reports.

Many thanks, Hsie. I have a lot of mods...I´ll make a new installation with GWX only, and I´ll post the feedback.

My campaign SCR file (original), is from Wilhelmshaven v6, Merged Campaign.

Best regards.

Fitzcarraldo :salute:

[h.sie]

@Fitzcarraldo: Sorry, it will be some work for you, but I see no other chance. If it works, add your favourite mods one-by-one in order to see which of them could be the cause of the problems in conjunction with the wolfpacks. I'm very much interested to find out the reason......

Also, please try a new "SH3" folder in "own documents" (make a backup of the old one, in case it contains saved careers).

Always enable the Supplement-Mod at last.

[Roland_RU]

@Roland_RU: I havn't tried it out, since it makes no sense in my eyes and I'm satisfied with the current solution. But if someone manages to create Subs with a better AI, these could eventually replace the current VIIF.

No. Maybe my English is too bad.:damn: I'm not talking about the type of AI-boats, but about their number. For example instead of 12 to insert 24 or 6?:)

And is it possible to ever simulation of real position of real wolfpacks?

[fitzcarraldo]

@Fitzcarraldo: Sorry, it will be some work for you, but I see no other chance. If it works, add your favourite mods one-by-one in order to see which of them could be the cause of the problems in conjunction with the wolfpacks. I'm very much interested to find out the reason......

Also, please try a new "SH3" folder in "own documents" (make a backup of the old one, in case it contains saved careers).

Always enable the Supplement-Mod at last.

I made two test with a fresh installation of SH3 plus GWX plus Wilhelmshaven mod v6, and Supplement. Wolfpack Mission played.

First test: Individual attack recommended, abandon mission, reload.

Second test: I obtain the messages of shadowing, send hourly reports, pack on the way. All OK. At 5:07 AM, I received a message: individual attack recommended. Abandon mission.

Is a carachteristic of the mod, to receive orders of shadowing and, after some time, the pack don´t arrive and receive orders of attack alone, or ever - when shadowing orders received - the pack arrives?

New tests in progress...

Best regards.

Fitzcarraldo :salute:

[Flyingsub]

FlyingSub: MEP3 works for Makman, reaper, h.sie

Thats good for you and your friends. Wish I could do it. Thanks for the very fine:salute: mod. Regards

[h.sie]

@FlyingSub: I only wanted to say that MEPv3 cannot be the (only) issue, since it works for other people.

@Roland: Changing the number of AI-Subs makes no sense. What is your intention behind that? All is possible. But we must first find someone with assembler skills who is willing to program that. the following link would be a good starting point in case you are interested:

http://www.arl.wustl.edu/~lockwood/class/cs306/books/artofasm/toc.html (http://www.arl.wustl.edu/%7Elockwood/class/cs306/books/artofasm/toc.html)

@fitzcarraldo: You have bad luck. If you are once ordered to shadow, the AI-Subs are installed properly. Congratulation!

The state of the BDU-AI cannot go directly from SHADOWING-state into ATTACK_ALONE-state without a transition state inbetween and informing you about the reason. This state inbetween could be: 1) a wolfpack attack, 2) wolfpack cannot assemble for some reason, 3) wolfpack sunk / damaged by enemy. AFTER that transition state, you will be ordered to attack alone for a couple of days, because no wolfpack is available.

BUT SOMETIMES, this important message, informing you about 1), 2) or 3) is lost. This is a stock sh3 issue, which I didn't change, since I think it is realistic that some messages get lost and the kaleun is confused. Attacks, coordination and communication were chaotic, if I am informed correctly. Please be patient. Try again.

[h.sie]

Customizing the strength of the wolfpack attack.

If you want to reduce the power of impact of the wolfpack attack, because you think the amount of ships sunk is unrealistic and too high, you can try to do the following (not tested yet):



Open the .sim file of the Type VIIF AI-sub and reduce the amount of AP ammo.
Use a lower crew competence (veteran instead of elite) for the VIIF


DO NOT:



Change the number of scripted AI-subs
Change the sensor settings of the AI-Subs
Change the range setting in the .sim file of the AI-Subs
Change any other setting in the .sim file except for the AP ammo.

[urfisch]

BUT SOMETIMES, this important message, informing you about 1), 2) or 3) is lost. This is a stock sh3 issue, which I didn't change, since I think it is realistic that some messages get lost and the kaleun is confused. Attacks, coordination and communication were chaotic, if I am informed correctly. Please be patient. Try again.

later in the war, you are right. as to the high amount of air attacks all boats stayed a lot of time under water, without beeing able to send a radiosignal/homesignal. so coordinating a wolfpack attack was not really possible later in the war. after 1943, when the allies used better technologies, like radar or hf/df to detect german radiosignals, the boats tried not to send more, than neccessary and combined attacks got extremly hard to set up.

but normally communication was fine. every bdu message for the boats was send in a routine, which repeated the message all the day through. so the boats could catch their signals, even they might have been a lot of time under water.

a lot of info is from the book "feindfahrten - erinnerungen eines ubootfunkers, written by hirschfeld".

:salute:

[h.sie]

@THOSE WHO MADE NUMEROUS (MORE THAN 20) TESTS:

What is your experience regarding the lost messages? Does it happen often to you that important messages (wolfpack assembled / wolfpack cannot reach convoy in time / wolfpack damaged or sunk) got lost???

If you decide to answer, please tell me the approx. number of tests you made. This is important, because we are talking about a statistical problem here, and a low number of tests cannot be considered as relevant.

(Background: The BDU response to your, say, 5th contact report will get lost, if you send the 6th contact report BEFORE you have received the response to your 5th report. The chance of lost messages could be reduced by lowering the response-time (time between contact report and BDU response)).

[makman94]

After a mornings testing I can confirm Mep 3 is the issue with the mission in NYGM. I also tried MEP 2.1(16km) and LSH3 MEP (16km) with negative results. In all cases the the other U-Boat shows up on the map but can't get the orders. I have not tried MEP in campaign mode yet.Regards

hello Flyingsub,

MEP (it doesn't matter what version) or ANY environment mod can't be an issue for the wolfpacks mod . the env mod files are totally indepedent and are not effecting the wolfpack 's critical procedure by any way that i can think.
of course this game is full of 'surprises' so if ,indeed, it is an env issue then ,surely , this will be a big...'wow' !

i believe that you were just ...unlucky or you didn't do something correct at procedure becuase it works also on NYGM (at least on my pc)

bye

[Flyingsub]

hello Flyingsub,

MEP (it doesn't matter what version) or ANY environment mod can't be an issue for the wolfpacks mod . the env mod files are totally indepedent and are not effecting the wolfpack 's critical procedure by any way that i can think.
of course this game is full of 'surprises' so if ,indeed, it is an env issue then ,surely , this will be a big...'wow' !

i believe that you were just ...unlucky or you didn't do something correct at procedure becuase it works also on NYGM (at least on my pc)

bye

@ Makman, Thanks for the input. I Agree that MEP should not affect the mod unless its some issue with scene.dat and NYGM being sensitive to it's change in my install ,which is unlikely. Regards

[Dani]

Tested with NYGM 3.5a. Total of seven tests.

1. Attack alone response
2. Attack alone response
3. Attack alone response
4. 3-4 shadowing responses , then fog problem for the pack
5. 3-4 shadowing responses , then fuel problem for the pack
6. Attack alone response
7. 5 shadowing responses, between the first and the second one 3 or 4 (not sure) unanswered reports. Between the forth and fifth 2 unanswered.
The pack attacked, sunk 4 ships(1 escort) and damaged 2 more.

[h.sie]

thanks dani. very helpful. i am astonished about the high amount of attack-alone orders, since i programmed a chance of 20% for them for that specific mission date. but according to probability calculation, your results are not unlikely.

you conclusion about lost messages ?

[Dani]

I forgot to say that I was playing with less contact reports checked. From first contact report to the attack 11-12 hours passed. So I'm guessing at least 1 day of shadowing with the harder version is required.

I don't know for sure,yet. The lost messages are giving the chase a "realistic" taste and should stay in the patch. Maybe reducing the response time just a little bit.
I like the extra feel it gives to the shadowing, the anticipation, will BDU response? Do they got my message? What are the orders?
I like it.
(I probably will regret these words when facing later in war, increasing number of aggressive escorts with radar.:DL)

[fitzcarraldo]

thanks dani. very helpful. i am astonished about the high amount of attack-alone orders, since i programmed a chance of 20% for them for that specific mission date. but according to probability calculation, your results are not unlikely.

you conclusion about lost messages ?

I continue to have high amount of attack-alone orders. I made 23 tests with Wolfpack Mission, in only seven I obtain the order of shadowing, and four with pack attacks.

Regards.

Fitzcarraldo :salute:

[h.sie]

@Dani: Thanks for your helpful comments. I am currently thinking about making the response time shorter (-> less lost messages) for the time until end of 1942 and using the standard response time (more lost messages) for 1943 and later.

-> in accordance to urfisch's input:



early war: Uboats have no problem relaying messages



late war: Uboats forced to dive more often - messages can get lost.

[h.sie]

@fitzcarraldo: This shows that the mod works in principle, but I am astonished about the high amount of "attack-alone" orders.

I shall try to find the reason for that behaviour.

Thanks for your patience.

[Stiebler]

I have tested an uncounted number of wolfpack requests (probably around 50) in campaign mode with NYGM 3.5A.

The testing has been south of Iceland or near the Canary Islands, mostly in late 1942, some in late 1940, early 1941, early 1943.

As expected, there are very few wolf-pack attacks in late 1940/early 1941. The player is ordered to attack alone.

However, in late 1942, it seems that a wolf-pack is ordered to attack nearly every time that the weather is good (no fog/light fog and winds <8 m/s). However, if the weather is worse, wolf-pack attacks are rare.

In early 1943, the number of wolf-packs ordered to attack seems to be fewer than in late 1942. (But not much tested.)

In particular, in all cases, if first contact with the convoy is reported late in the afternoon (close to darkness), then the player is always (? - in my experience) ordered to attack alone. Contact reports do not seem to be required during the night in this circumstance.

I am using the 'less contact reports' option for testing purposes.

Most of the above has been in connection with testing of an upgraded version of my Surrender-Smoke-CAMship overlay patch for H.sie's V16A3.

Stiebler.

[h.sie]

Hi Stiebler,

thanks for your numerous testing and the report. All seems to work as expected, except:


In particular, in all cases, if first contact with the convoy is reported late in the afternoon (close to darkness), then the player is always (? - in my experience) ordered to attack alone.

This behaviour is not intended and I have not (knowingly) programmed it. But such a behaviour is of course possible (but unlikely) due to the usage of random numbers. ATM I cannot say whether this behaviour is really only the result of (bad) random numbers, OR, the result of a methodical error in the algorithm of the BDU-AI code.

I shall look into it.

[Dani]

In particular, in all cases, if first contact with the convoy is reported late in the afternoon (close to darkness), then the player is always (? - in my experience) ordered to attack alone. Contact reports do not seem to be required during the night in this circumstance.

Less contact reports means also less time is needed to form a pack. About 11-14h,right? Is this limited with time? If this time runs out, no wolfpack can be formed?

If h.sie programmed the pack to attack only at night, maybe the problem is that after your contact late afternoon, the pack don't have time to be formed that night, but also can't be formed (attack) after 11-14 hours because it's day.
So you get only attack orders.

Maybe by unchecking 'less contact report' and playing the harder version, you will be able to send reports in the afternoons, so the pack have enough time to be formed and attack the next night.

English is not my native language, so I hope you understand what I was trying to say.

[h.sie]

After a PM with Stiebler it's clear that his discovery is no problem at all. He told me that he was ordered to attack alone in high storms after several contact reports. This is as intended, because in high storms chance rises that wolfpack can have fuel problems or similar.

So there remain 2 issues I have to look into:

1) High amount of "attack alone" after the 1st contact report (fitzcarraldo)

2) Less lost messages in early war, more lost messages in late war.

[Depth Charger]

[QUOTE=h.sie;1775195]@THOSE WHO MADE NUMEROUS (MORE THAN 20) TESTS:

Hi

I been struggling with something else the last few days and a clean install was needed.

Cant give exact numbers but I have done a few campaigns now starting in June 42 and from there on into 1943, I will get at least 3 or 4 chases out of about 5 or 6 missions. It is odd for me to have a mission where I cannot initiate a chase. It would also be fair to say that I am observing a median of about 80% in the field for being able to start a chase within a mission. It wont be every convoy, but I will find one if I look. (In the AL sweet spot)

Also, in regards comments re lost messages. I would say that about 15% of them are getting lost for me. I am assuming that your range runs to about 70/75 minutes because I have learned that late at night after about 10pm, the attack order will normally arrive and so if it is late, I delay sending the next contact report until I first get the reply to the previous contact report I sent, just in case it is the actual attack order. (I missed one once, only to watch my own party start without me...)

Lastly, turning a chase into a successful attack is about a 50/50 thing for me dependent upon things like when I pick up the convoy's trail, course changes, the weather, or me just being stupid by sending the wrong speed and heading data in the contact report.

So far the balance seems about right for me. As much as, I am loving the wolf-packs, the most important lesson that I am learning is that the workload for an attack is also enormous.

Now that I am used to it, an order to go in straight away and attack alone is just as good as an order to start shadowing the convoy. I would hate it if every convoy I found needed to be tracked for hours and hours and making every other sighting a chase could backfire...

Other than that, oh man, what a pleasure!

Kindest

DC

[h.sie]

@DeptchCharger: Thanks for that detailed report. Anyway, I like the idea to make the probability of lost messages dependent on year.

Your are right to simply wait for the BDU response before sending the next contact report, but it is risky, since response times of more than some hours are possible.

[Rubini]

Hi h.sie,
(excuse me by my english, its worse than ever)

I know that probably isn´t the best moment to give/ask you about new ideas to the hardcode fix mode wish list...but after think about all what you and Stibler have bring to life I come with some ideas (well, i guess that you already have a lot of them, by yourself or by all this entire community at once...:DL). Anyway take a look (I guess that these ones are in the exacty line on what you want/look for: gameplay fixes for the game) and excuse me if someone already put here these ideas:

1. Sh3 allow us to sail all the time with the engines at ahead full/ahead flank without any overheat. I can remember in Sh1 where we had an advice from chief enginner about the risk of overheat after some (not long) time in quick speed. For sure in real life this was (and yet is) a big issue for any machine. So, this could be a very good addition to realism and strategy to Sh3. A simple feature absolutelly absent !

2. Now that you knows how to put a unit into the game - Wolfpack - an old wish of all us here could finally come to life: Resupply on demand, I mean, you can ask to BDU about a resupply and if you are lucky you could have one somewhere. Another idea on the same line, is to just simulate a last chance for a very damaged/without_fuel uboat (perhaps before Stiebler´s surrender, as a prior last chance). In this situation the kaleum could ask BDU for a emergence repair ship; then, if you are a lucky kaleum, perhaps BDu have one on that region where you are almost "lost" on the ocean, take some repair and go back home. Perhaps we could also have some chance (a bad one in truth) to have also a enemy patrol (navy or airforce) nearby to just push the danger factor of repair on ocean.

Thanks again by your great effort on all this! This mod rocks!:rock:

Rubini.

[h.sie]

Hi Rubini,

Thanks for your kind words.

Yes, my todo list is growing and growing, and (...weird...) the better my fixes are, the more wishes arise. The consequence from this process is that I will never be finished. Thus, I must set a stop-point somewhere.

The wolfpacks took 4 months, and at the moment I am 100% exhausted. Your wish #2 is very complex to program, similar to the wolfpacks - but ATM I'm not in the mood for complex projects.

Your wish #1 is different. It's not hard to do and a small project. I have already started to program that one some months ago. But it needs some work. This is what I can do in the next time if I feel bored.....

Sorry for not being more cooperative ATM,
H.Sie

[Fish In The Water]

The wolfpacks took 4 months, and at the moment I am 100% exhausted.

Sorry for not being more cooperative ATM...

No need to apologize. We all have to guard against burnout and in your case you've more than earned a little recovery time. Better to slow down now and recharge your batteries so we can all look forward to more wolfpack type projects in the future. Thanks again for all the hard work and take care my friend! :salute:

[h.sie]

@Fish: :DL

[Rubini]

Hi Rubini,

Thanks for your kind words.

Yes, my todo list is growing and growing, and (...weird...) the better my fixes are, the more wishes arise. The consequence from this process is that I will never be finished. Thus, I must set a stop-point somewhere.

The wolfpacks took 4 months, and at the moment I am 100% exhausted. Your wish #2 is very complex to program, similar to the wolfpacks - but ATM I'm not in the mood for complex projects.

Your wish #1 is different. It's not hard to do and a small project. I have already started to program that one some months ago. But it needs some work. This is what I can do in the next time if I feel bored.....

Sorry for not being more cooperative ATM,
H.Sie

We all understand mate. I know very well the hard part of be (and to like to be) a modder.:up:

Anyway, at the time (if this time really happens one day:DL) to mod and test the engine overheat and/or the resupply/rescue on demand please contact me and I will be glad in help you with pleasure. I can't stop mod too, I'm always making something on my Sh3.:DL:damn:

[Jaeger]

there is one point, hitman pointed out multiple times regarding to the chance of meeting a convoy: in sh3, all enemy shipping has the same noise level. in reality, single merchants made noise in a 20 km radius, a convoy was hearable up to 100 km. this would it make much more easy to find convoys. my idea is: put one shipinto each convoy, which has an louder engine. would this be possible?

[Rubini]

there is one point, hitman pointed out multiple times regarding to the chance of meeting a convoy: in sh3, all enemy shipping has the same noise level. in reality, single merchants made noise in a 20 km radius, a convoy was hearable up to 100 km. this would it make much more easy to find convoys. my idea is: put one shipinto each convoy, which has an louder engine. would this be possible?
This will not work, Sh3 limits the sound (and all it's live world) to IIRC ~30km (that magic bubble). What can be done is to raise the radio report probability and the frequency of this report to minimize this convoy issue. And this is doable just adjusting these settings on RND. I made this fine tune on my rnd file, the game is much more fun and playable IMHO.

[Robin40]

First mission test

convoy successfully shadowed

wolfpack attacked

Going to career mode....this mod is awesome

Thx hsie:up:

[Jaeger]

This will not work, Sh3 limits the sound (and all it's live world) to IIRC ~30km (that magic bubble). What can be done is to raise the radio report probability and the frequency of this report to minimize this convoy issue. And this is doable just adjusting these settings on RND. I made this fine tune on my rnd file, the game is much more fun and playable IMHO.

Can you adjust the convoy report frequency without touching the single merchant frequency? if so, can you tell me how to do this or release it as a mod? i have a nygm campaign file with zig zag mod by lgn1.

[Rhodes]

Got two situation to report:
1: When sending a patrol report, the reply come back blank. Just "From: BDU, To U-297" but to message to read. Got that 2 times. Since I have WB's Mid-Patrol Radio Orders mod in sh3 commander, I'm thinking that it may some conflit with this but only after I finish my patrol I can disable the mod and see.

2: I lost the sounds of "new message received" when geting one. Can be because of the fixes for SH3?

[Rubini]

Can you adjust the convoy report frequency without touching the single merchant frequency? if so, can you tell me how to do this or release it as a mod? i have a nygm campaign file with zig zag mod by lgn1.
It´s absolutelly possible and Nicolas (IIRC) released a small tool that changes these(and others) settings on RND. But let´s not hijack h.sie thread, try to open a new thread on the forum about this issue or make a search or contact me by PM.:up:
Let´s return here to help h.sie with our experiences with wolfpack.

[h.sie]

@Fitzcarraldo: I have tested your Supplement-Mod you sent me some days ago. I installed it using JSGME into a fresh GWX3 with 16km environment, loaded the Wolfpack mission 10 times and waited until the convoy was in visible range. Then I sent a contact report and waited for the reply of the BDU. Result:

7 times I was ordered to shadow
3 times I was ordered to attack alone.

I was not able to find any problem in the code. All worked as intended.

In the next time, I will reduce the response-time for BDU messages and thus reduce the chance for lost messages for the time-period until 1942. For 1943 and later chance for lost messages will rise.

[fitzcarraldo]

@Fitzcarraldo: I have tested your Supplement-Mod you sent me some days ago. I installed it using JSGME into a fresh GWX3 with 16km environment, loaded the Wolfpack mission 10 times and waited until the convoy was in visible range. Then I sent a contact report and waited for the reply of the BDU. Result:

7 times I was ordered to shadow
3 times I was ordered to attack alone.

I was not able to find any problem in the code. All worked as intended.

In the next time, I will reduce the response-time for BDU messages and thus reduce the chance for lost messages for the time-period until 1942. For 1943 and later chance for lost messages will rise.

Hsie: I have two questions about your test:

1 - When you tell "waited until the convoy was in visible range": I load the Wolfpack mission and I have the convoy visible from the start of the mission. Only a few seconds (without time compression), and the convoy is visible; I sent the contact report no more of one minute from start the mission, without TC. Do you wait some time before the convoy is visible? I think in MEPv3 20 K environment I use; the range for visual detection is greater than others atmospheres.

2 - I made several test in a paralell installation of SH3 plus GWX plus MEPv3 20k only. I have more packs in this configuration than in my normal heavy moded installation. I´ll load mod-to-mod the pure GWX installation, there is a mod or mods altering the pack patch, evidently.

Please, I request more feedback from the mates using a heavy modded SH3 and the results of the wolfpack pack patch.

Another question: I obtain, in the pure GWX installation (plus MEPv3), more packs attacks with the option "less contacts" active.

Many thanks for your support!

Fitzcarraldo :salute:

[h.sie]

@fitzcarralo:

1) Yes, it takes some time until the convoy comes in visible range. But environment should not influence the mod behaviour.

2) what was your question here?


Answer to "Another question": Yes, if less contact reports required, of course you get more attacks. That's exactly the intention of that option

[h.sie]

Reducing the chance of lost messages isn't as easy as I initially thought, but it's possible. Thus, it seems to make sense to first ask for your opinions, BUT: I ask only those who already tested the wolfpack mod.

POLL:
Do we need to reduce the chance of lost messages or not?

Note 1: Poll will end at Wednesday!

Note 2: I can only reduce the chance of lost messages by reducing the average response time of the BDU to your contact reports.

Note 3: I will especially consider the votes of people who helped in the past with testing and reporting and so on.

Note 4: A special option "Reduce chance for lost messages" in the Options Selector for individual configuration is not planned.

[PapaKilo]

Chance of lost messages should not be too often or every third that is lost..
You could expect bigger chaos in messages of land battles rather than in oceans.

[Robin40]

strange

I tested Wolfpack mission....very well!

Now I am on career
GWX
Dec 1940
soutwest of Cadiz

Convoy
Report contact sent

CTD:wah:

This is how I edited the Campaign_SCR file

[Unit 5695]
Name=GE Medium Hansa Combifreighter#3
Class=KMSSHansa
Type=102
Origin=German
Side=2
Commander=0
CargoExt=1
CargoInt=0
CfgDate=19380101
DeleteOnLastWaypoint=true
DockedShip=true
GameEntryDate=19400404
GameEntryTime=0
GameExitDate=19410101
GameExitTime=0
EvolveFromEntryDate=false
Long=978516.000000
Lat=6421465.000000
Height=0.000000
Heading=322.899689
Speed=0.000000
CrewRating=3
DelayMin=0
ReportPosMin=-1
ReportPosProbability=100
RandStartRadius=0.000000
NextWP=0
[Unit 5696]
Name=Wolf1
Class=SSTypeVIIF
Type=200
Origin=German
Side=2
Commander=0
CargoExt=-1
CargoInt=-1
CfgDate=19380101
DeleteOnLastWaypoint=false
DockedShip=false
GameEntryDate=19380101
GameEntryTime=0
GameExitDate=19451231
GameExitTime=0
EvolveFromEntryDate=false
Long=-10000000.000000
Lat=7000000.000000
Height=0.000000
Heading=0.000000
Speed=0.000000
CrewRating=4
DelayMin=0
ReportPosMin=-1
ReportPosProbability=100
RandStartRadius=0.000000
NextWP=0

As you see, there is no
last waypoint of the last Unit 5695

The convoy was signalled to me from BdU at 14.00
I interceptrd the convoy at 16.00 and I sent contact message...CTD

[h.sie]

@Robin: Did the CTD occur in the same moment you pressed the "Send contact" button, or some time later?

Please, try to REPRODUCE the CTD. If that is possible, I need details of your Mod setup.

I guess you have a HUGE Mod-List - right?

[Robin40]

@Robin: Did the CTD occur in the same moment you pressed the "Send contact" button, or some time later?

Please, try to REPRODUCE the CTD. If that is possible, I need details of your Mod setup.

I guess you have a HUGE Mod-List - right?

send contact button pressed...CTD

reloaded the game

send contact button pressed...CTD

Mod list not so HUGE
GWX 3 Wilhemshafen,St Naz,Schluese and xtra ships V6
GWX - Axis Mediterranean Aircraft Skins
GWX - Enhanced Damage Effects
GWX - Integrated Orders
GWX - Late War Sensors Snorkel Antennas
GWX - Main movie - 'Das Boot'
GWX - No Medals on Crew
GWX - Open Hatch Mod
LifeBoats&Debris_v2_A
WideScreen_SH3_V1
Loading Screens Mod 2
MFM-Interim-Beta
MFMBeta-EnglishNames
MFM-EnglishNames
USS_LongIsland
OLC's Modified Searchlight Beams for GWX3
OKW_Funkmod_v_1_2
EAX_Sound_Sim_SH3
SH3_oggvorbis3
Hitler Speaks
M.E.P v3
M.E.P v3-Patch
MEP v3 VisualSensors for gwx3
SH-5 Water for GWX 3.0 V0.9 20 Km Atlantic campaign (default)
Damage_caused_by_fires_TheDarkWraith
Aces' Crew On Deck - Stand alone mod v1 GWX Version
GWX-SmartKeys
Rbs1_SH4_Effects_GWX_30_71
Rbs10-enhancedoilexplosion
Rbs2-Forsoundsandstarshells
O2-Gauges v2
Bad Weather Fix V1.1 (FORTE)
MFM-v3-Neutral-Skins-1940
Supplement to V16A3 (JSGME)
MFM-v3-US+UK_Skins19401101


I think that it is not the mod list to cause ctd as Wolfpack mission works fine

[h.sie]

@Robin40: CTD is reproduceable - very good.

Again: Does the CTD occur IN THE SAME MOMENT you press the button or some seconds later?

Does the game show a CTD window "Program has caused an error and must be closed" or similar? If so, please send me the additional detailed information of that window: Module, Offset and so on. Screenshot for example.

Could you also send me your savegame?

"Hitler speaks mod" isn't supported by me.

[Robin40]

@Robin40: CTD is reproduceable - very good.

Again: Does the CTD occur IN THE SAME MOMENT you press the button or some seconds later?

Does the game show a CTD window "Program has caused an error and must be closed" or similar? If so, please send me the additional detailed information of that window: Module, Offset and so on. Screenshot for example.

Could you also send me your savegame?

"Hitler speaks mod" isn't supported by me.

Hitler mod disabled...always CTD

CTD after some 5 secs

CTD window "Windows is searching for a solution"

No additional detailed info

Give me your e-mail in order to send you the save file