Sun comes up too soon?

scott10301 · 07-24-14, 09:15 PM

Hello,

I've noticed lately that the sunrise/sunset gets out of sync with the current time in my game. I started a campaign yesterday at 11:30 local time in St. Nazarene and the sun seemed in the right location in the sky. The first 2 days of the voyage were fine and I used TC from time to time. The last time I'd used TC it was early morning of the third day, 03:30 local time, and the sun had already begun to rise over the horizon. I'm about 200km east of St. Naz and it's May 1st.

I'd had this problem with my last campaign as well. It seemed to get progressively worse as I was coming up on sunrise at 02:30 near the Canary Is. in early March. Sunset was at least 2-3 hours early as well.

I'm using GWX 3.0 and the flags and pennants mods.

Thanks,
Scott

vanjast · 07-25-14, 02:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scott10301

I'm about 200km east of St. Naz and it's May 1st.

Do you mean Saint-Nazaire. ?

On the same latitude

?
I'm not sure if you're aware of the stuff below.

https://answers.yahoo.com/question/i...8235321AAwJA3Z

http://www.skwirk.com/p-c_s-16_u-182...orld/our-world

http://oceannavigation.blogspot.com/...longitude.html

captgeo · 07-25-14, 07:44 AM

welcome

RConch · 07-25-14, 08:35 AM

Welcome and good hunting!

HW3 · 07-25-14, 09:21 AM

Your in game clock stays on the time of your home base.

Welcome Aboard!

scott10301 · 07-25-14, 10:58 AM

Hi vanjast, yes I was aware of content in those articles. I'm currently in BF44, which is a little over 1000km east of St. Nazaire and just slightly south. I'm aware that the ship time is GMT, but if you hover your mouse over the clock, it also shows local time. I'm currently -1 GMT. It's May 2nd, 1941 and the sun came up this morning around 4:30 GMT. Seems too early for this latitude/time of year. As I mentioned before, I was experiencing this problem in the last campaign. Early March, pulling out of Las Palmas, 2:30am local time and the sun is almost over the horizon.

Gala Kav- I had this problem when I first installed GWX about 6 months ago. It was weird in that I loaded a save that had me at 4:15am, but the sky looked like high noon. Even if I reloaded it would stay that way. The odd thing was that it slowly self-corrected. The sun was going backward for about an hour before it settled into the right position. It's like it's doing the same thing, but this time its not correcting.

It seems to encounter this problem whenever I leave the GMT time zone. I'll have to play around with it a bit more this weekend to see if i can get more detailed info.

vanjast · 07-25-14, 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scott10301

I'm currently in BF44, which is a little over 1000km east of St. Nazaire and just slightly south.

Never had/noticed this problem.. I'll keep an eye out for it.
It might have something to do with the clocks Local-vs-Base when loading a saved game - Here I do notice the clock changes, where both have the same time... nothing in the sky though.

scott10301 · 07-25-14, 12:52 PM

Oops.... Yes, WEST of St. Naz...

UKönig · 07-25-14, 04:26 PM

The clock aboard your average u-boat is working on GST or German Summer Time. I guess it was too difficult or time consuming to keep adjusting the figures or values, so they just established a baseline, and made the CO and NA work out the differences in time zone in their heads...

Sailor Steve · 07-25-14, 04:30 PM

Actually in SH3, and only in SH3, if you hover the cursor over the time you'll get a popup with the local time.

Pisces · 07-26-14, 08:03 AM

The timezones in SH3 are not as in the real world. In the game they flip 1 hour over when you cross the 7.5 degrees east and west meridians. All other timezones are ofcourse offset from this by multiples of 15 degrees. In other words the timezones are centered on GMT and multiples of 15 degrees. Where as in the real world the beginning and ends of the timezone regions are more or less aligned with the multiples of 15 degrees.

Dig deep into the forum. It has been extensively researched to try to make celestial navigation work in the game. So far, trying to make a high enough resolution sextant/octant (for km/nm preciscion) has failed due to the game's limitations.

Rammstein0991 · 07-27-14, 11:48 AM

Also I am not sure about SH3, but in SH4 it seems like if you frequently run TC at high values (like 3500+) the times of sunset/rise seem to get wonky.

CaptBones · 07-29-14, 12:05 PM

SH3 is highly accurate in regard to time zone changes and as accurate as a virtual "flat" world can be regarding the changes in sunrise/sunset at high latitudes. As Sailor Steve pointed out, the clock keeps "Z" (Greenwich Mean Time) and displays local time when you roll the cursor over it. Since all Log entries are made in GMT, I keep my hand-written "Rough Log" in GMT also.

World time zones are centered on principal meridians at 15 degree multiples east and west of the Prime Meridian; they start and stop at 7.5 degrees east and west of their respective principal meridians.

Deviations from that scheme exist almost everywhere due to political boundaries and cultural differences, but to a real mariner/navigator, those deviations mean nothing until you enter or leave port. At sea, a real navigator (not the putz with only a GPS for a tool-set) goes strictly by the longitude difference from Greenwich. That's why accurate celestial navigation was not possible until good chronometers were available; you can easily determine how far E/W you are from the Prime Meridian by comparing Local Apparent Noon with a clock keeping Zulu time.

vanjast · 07-30-14, 06:22 AM

Started tracking my nav with sunrise/sets, with that almanac I made.

I know that my times are approx. 4 minutes out at higher latitudes... and found my way to BE61 no problem.

I must do 'in-game' test mission almanac times, as i took the times from the US almanac.

Here's a plan..
Need 12 people to record sunrise/set times (when the interior light changes colour).
Each person will do on a particular month, from equator to 80 degrees North at 5 degree latitude increments = 31 days x 17 positions
The year will be 1943 - mid war, hopefully to average out any shifts in the 'universe and time continuum.'

Who's game ?

Pisces · 07-30-14, 12:58 PM

No time for me. No pun intended.

The sunrise/sunset indicator/redlight is also different from real-life procedures. In the game the sun disk is midway on the horizon when this happens. Sunset and sun rise in reallife is considered when the sun's disk is touching the horizon from below (most of the sun is covered by the horizon).

Something to keep in mind when comparing with real almanacs.

07-24-14, 09:15 PM	#1
scott10301 Watch Join Date: Feb 2014 Posts: 15 Downloads: 40 Uploads: 0	Sun comes up too soon? Hello, I've noticed lately that the sunrise/sunset gets out of sync with the current time in my game. I started a campaign yesterday at 11:30 local time in St. Nazarene and the sun seemed in the right location in the sky. The first 2 days of the voyage were fine and I used TC from time to time. The last time I'd used TC it was early morning of the third day, 03:30 local time, and the sun had already begun to rise over the horizon. I'm about 200km east of St. Naz and it's May 1st. I'd had this problem with my last campaign as well. It seemed to get progressively worse as I was coming up on sunrise at 02:30 near the Canary Is. in early March. Sunset was at least 2-3 hours early as well. I'm using GWX 3.0 and the flags and pennants mods. Thanks, Scott

07-25-14, 07:44 AM	#3
captgeo Samurai Navy Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Ontario,Canada Posts: 550 Downloads: 105 Uploads: 0	welcome __________________

07-25-14, 08:35 AM	#4
RConch Captain Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: No. Virginia Posts: 619 Downloads: 518 Uploads: 0	Welcome and good hunting! __________________ "Noch und Noch" Prowling the Nord Atlantik with GWX 3.0.

07-25-14, 09:21 AM	#5
HW3 Navy Seal Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Gresham Oregon Posts: 6,574 Downloads: 458 Uploads: 0	Your in game clock stays on the time of your home base. Welcome Aboard! __________________ "Some ships are designed to sink...others require our assistance." Nathan Zelk

07-25-14, 04:26 PM	#9
UKönig Captain Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: Victoria, British Columbia, Canada Posts: 495 Downloads: 1 Uploads: 0	The clock aboard your average u-boat is working on GST or German Summer Time. I guess it was too difficult or time consuming to keep adjusting the figures or values, so they just established a baseline, and made the CO and NA work out the differences in time zone in their heads... __________________ Because I'm the captain, that's why!

07-25-14, 10:58 AM	#6
scott10301 Watch Join Date: Feb 2014 Posts: 15 Downloads: 40 Uploads: 0	Hi vanjast, yes I was aware of content in those articles. I'm currently in BF44, which is a little over 1000km east of St. Nazaire and just slightly south. I'm aware that the ship time is GMT, but if you hover your mouse over the clock, it also shows local time. I'm currently -1 GMT. It's May 2nd, 1941 and the sun came up this morning around 4:30 GMT. Seems too early for this latitude/time of year. As I mentioned before, I was experiencing this problem in the last campaign. Early March, pulling out of Las Palmas, 2:30am local time and the sun is almost over the horizon. Gala Kav- I had this problem when I first installed GWX about 6 months ago. It was weird in that I loaded a save that had me at 4:15am, but the sky looked like high noon. Even if I reloaded it would stay that way. The odd thing was that it slowly self-corrected. The sun was going backward for about an hour before it settled into the right position. It's like it's doing the same thing, but this time its not correcting. It seems to encounter this problem whenever I leave the GMT time zone. I'll have to play around with it a bit more this weekend to see if i can get more detailed info.

07-25-14, 12:52 PM	#8
scott10301 Watch Join Date: Feb 2014 Posts: 15 Downloads: 40 Uploads: 0	Oops.... Yes, WEST of St. Naz...

07-25-14, 04:30 PM	#10
Sailor Steve Eternal Patrol Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: High in the mountains of Utah Posts: 50,369 Downloads: 745 Uploads: 249	Actually in SH3, and only in SH3, if you hover the cursor over the time you'll get a popup with the local time. __________________ “Never do anything you can't take back.” —Rocky Russo

07-26-14, 08:03 AM	#11
Pisces Silent Hunter Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: AN9771 Posts: 4,904 Downloads: 304 Uploads: 0	The timezones in SH3 are not as in the real world. In the game they flip 1 hour over when you cross the 7.5 degrees east and west meridians. All other timezones are ofcourse offset from this by multiples of 15 degrees. In other words the timezones are centered on GMT and multiples of 15 degrees. Where as in the real world the beginning and ends of the timezone regions are more or less aligned with the multiples of 15 degrees. Dig deep into the forum. It has been extensively researched to try to make celestial navigation work in the game. So far, trying to make a high enough resolution sextant/octant (for km/nm preciscion) has failed due to the game's limitations.

07-27-14, 11:48 AM	#12
Rammstein0991 Engineer Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: NC USA Posts: 219 Downloads: 164 Uploads: 0	Also I am not sure about SH3, but in SH4 it seems like if you frequently run TC at high values (like 3500+) the times of sunset/rise seem to get wonky.

07-29-14, 12:05 PM	#13
CaptBones The Old Man Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Rockton, IL Posts: 281 Downloads: 208 Uploads: 0	That's not correct... SH3 is highly accurate in regard to time zone changes and as accurate as a virtual "flat" world can be regarding the changes in sunrise/sunset at high latitudes. As Sailor Steve pointed out, the clock keeps "Z" (Greenwich Mean Time) and displays local time when you roll the cursor over it. Since all Log entries are made in GMT, I keep my hand-written "Rough Log" in GMT also. World time zones are centered on principal meridians at 15 degree multiples east and west of the Prime Meridian; they start and stop at 7.5 degrees east and west of their respective principal meridians. Deviations from that scheme exist almost everywhere due to political boundaries and cultural differences, but to a real mariner/navigator, those deviations mean nothing until you enter or leave port. At sea, a real navigator (not the putz with only a GPS for a tool-set) goes strictly by the longitude difference from Greenwich. That's why accurate celestial navigation was not possible until good chronometers were available; you can easily determine how far E/W you are from the Prime Meridian by comparing Local Apparent Noon with a clock keeping Zulu time.

07-30-14, 06:22 AM	#14
vanjast Sea Lord Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Somewhere else now Posts: 1,733 Downloads: 825 Uploads: 4	Started tracking my nav with sunrise/sets, with that almanac I made. I know that my times are approx. 4 minutes out at higher latitudes... and found my way to BE61 no problem. I must do 'in-game' test mission almanac times, as i took the times from the US almanac. Here's a plan.. Need 12 people to record sunrise/set times (when the interior light changes colour). Each person will do on a particular month, from equator to 80 degrees North at 5 degree latitude increments = 31 days x 17 positions The year will be 1943 - mid war, hopefully to average out any shifts in the 'universe and time continuum.' Who's game ?

07-30-14, 12:58 PM	#15
Pisces Silent Hunter Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: AN9771 Posts: 4,904 Downloads: 304 Uploads: 0	No time for me. No pun intended. The sunrise/sunset indicator/redlight is also different from real-life procedures. In the game the sun disk is midway on the horizon when this happens. Sunset and sun rise in reallife is considered when the sun's disk is touching the horizon from below (most of the sun is covered by the horizon). Something to keep in mind when comparing with real almanacs.