Question about Balao Class and torpedoes

[Red October1984]

Im running TMO and RSDRC....(looks down at my sig..) and I just recieved the USS Balao in the middle of 1942...Is that historical? I had thought that the Balao was introduced in 1943. I had taken the new boat out to see how deep I could dive...I was all fine and dandy until I got to 800 feet. So am I good to 750? Everytime I get a new command, I always try to learn the ins and outs of each class of boat.

When do my torpedoes get fixed? I am sick of these faulty Mk 14s...In the book I am reading, War In The Boats: My WW2 Submarine Battles, the USS Crevalle didnt get orders to remove the magnetic detonator until 1944.

Which are better? The Mk 14 or the Mk 23?

[fireftr18]

Originally Posted by Red October1984

Which are better? The Mk 14 or the Mk 23?

That's really kind of a difficult question.
Early war, the Mk14 was riddled with problems. Stock models the problems to a degree, but not nearly at historical levels. TMO models them closer to historical levels, but my experience still not to the true historical level. From what I understand, if they had as much as a 25% success rate with the torpedoes, then they were doing very well.
The Mk23 was essentially a Mk14 with the problems corrected and the long range removed. When the Mk23 came out, they used them until the Mk14s were repaired, then went back to the Mk14s because of the long range option. I'm not sure of the specific dates.
I know someone else here can give better detail.
TMO adds a good description of torpedoes in the appropriate screens.

[magic452]

Red you got another year to go with the duds.

After the five or six careers I just turned duds off.
I like to hear BOOMS not bonks


I stick with the Mk14s, the 23 seems to get more circle runners and I like the slow speed setting for convoys, easier to get near simultaneous hits.

Mid 42 seems a little early for a Balao but I'm no historian.

Magic

[ColonelSandersLite]

Originally Posted by fireftr18

The Mk23 was essentially a Mk14 with the problems corrected and the long range removed. When the Mk23 came out, they used them until the Mk14s were repaired, then went back to the Mk14s because of the long range option.

This is completely incorrect. The *only* difference between the mark 14 and the mark 23 was the removal of the speed selection system. This was done to make the torpedo cheaper and easier to manufacture.

This can easilly be verified as far as tmo is concerned by checking values in Torpedoes_US.sim, they are identical with one exception. I noticed that the mark23 has a slightly higher chance of depth keeping problems. This is probably because either the mark 14 or 23 got changed and ducimus forgot to change the other value.

[TorpX]

Originally Posted by Red October1984

Im running TMO and RSDRC....(looks down at my sig..) and I just recieved the USS Balao in the middle of 1942...Is that historical? I had thought that the Balao was introduced in 1943. I had taken the new boat out to see how deep I could dive...I was all fine and dandy until I got to 800 feet. So am I good to 750? Everytime I get a new command, I always try to learn the ins and outs of each class of boat.

According to Wiki, the Balao was launched Oct. 27, 1942, and started it's first war patrol on 25 July, 1943. (I know, it's Wikipedia, but this seems about right.)

Either the shipyard really, really likes you, or there is a slight flaw in the game.

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by TorpX

(I know, it's Wikipedia, but this seems about right.)

There is absolutely nothing wrong with using Wiki as a quick reference source. It's no less accurate than half the books out there. If you need to make a specific point, then use other sources, two or three if possible, and make sure they aren't just repeating each other; but for the service date of a famous ship? Double-check if you like, but I'll bet ten bucks right now that it's correct.

[troopie]

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

There is absolutely nothing wrong with using Wiki as a quick reference source. It's no less accurate than half the books out there. If you need to make a specific point, then use other sources, two or three if possible, and make sure they aren't just repeating each other; but for the service date of a famous ship? Double-check if you like, but I'll bet ten bucks right now that it's correct.

+1

As a bit of a hobby I've been compiling a spreedsheet comparison of (for now) post Dreadnought battleship classes and I've found Wiki to be by far the most practicle starting point. My cross-referancing has certainly showed up a few errors, mostly in commision dates and (naturally) tonnage, but for the most part it's been fairly reliable

[BigWalleye]

Several independent websites (fleetsubmarine.com, hullnumber.com, uboat.net) show the commissioning date of Balao as 4 Feb 1943. None of them gives any accreditation, though, so it is conceivable that they are all citing the same source and that that source could be incorrect. The only accredited source that my Google search turned up was factualworld.com. Factualworld also gives the commissioning date as 4 Feb 1943, and cites: Friedman, Norman (1995). U.S. Submarines Through 1945: An Illustrated Design History. Annapolis, Maryland: United States Naval Institute. pp. 285–304. ISBN 1-55750-263-3. uboat.net, while not directly citing the Friedman book as a source, does list it in a brief (2 books) bibliography. The Friedman book is not available on-line. I presume its source is US Navy records, but can not confirm this from the available on-line material. So, well into the 21st Century, we are still faced with having to consult <gasp> books to get an authentic answer.

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by BigWalleye

The Friedman book is not available on-line. I presume its source is US Navy records, but can not confirm this from the available on-line material. So, well into the 21st Century, we are still faced with having to consult <gasp> books to get an authentic answer.

Norman Friedman started off teaching physics at the Naval Academy at Annapolis. He always goes for primary sources, and is famous for his books. I have a few of them, but not US Submarines (yet). Though anybody can occasionally make a mistake, I would put his research up against anybody's.

[aanker]

War Patrol reports are *mostly* all online at http://issuu.com on hnsa pages in PDF format. It is possible to do some real detective work which is fun. TS ops can be deduced sometimes.

Happy Hunting!

[Red October1984]

Originally Posted by TorpX

Either the shipyard really, really likes you, or there is a slight flaw in the game.

I knew it was a bit early... The shipyard must love me. I've sank probably 100K in my 7 other patrols.

[Hinrich Schwab]

The Navy's historical page on the Balao indicate February 43 as her commissioning date. http://www.history.navy.mil/photos/s...sh-b/ss285.htm any earlier is a game flaw.

[captgeo]

following is a link to site found right here in our fourm,sub web sites, found in general disscusion section.

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=197714

[aanker]

According to Clay Blair Jr's, "SILENT VICTORY" the first BALAO class patrol was early summer 43.

Happy Hunting!

[TorpX]

Originally Posted by Red October1984

Im running TMO and RSDRC....(looks down at my sig..) and I just recieved the USS Balao in the middle of 1942...Is that historical?

I should have asked this before, but when you say you "recieved" the USS Balao in '42, do you mean you and the Balao are heading out on your first patrol today, or you and the Balao are starting a period of training?

I was under the impression Duci put something along those lines in his campaign.