So I'm planning a new mod...

vodkaphile · 06-24-11, 11:03 PM

I wouldn't consider it a supermod as of yet. I've very busy in life and will work on it during my spare time.

I still need to get permissions from a lot of people because it will be based on the many mods out there, GWX/NYGM and many of the smaller mods for those as well as some older out-dated mods that have features I like/liked.

I'll be doing this by myself for the time being but later on I may enlist willing mod makers. I want to get a groundwork laid first.

My major goals are simple -

Make the most realistic mod yet to date with all the graphical updates and great new UIs integrated but modified to remove gamey elements.

Also included will be hardcoded changes such as stieblers/h.sie etc but I'm attempting a work around as to not allow 'hacked' versions of the game to work. However seeing as the game is 11 years old...these may be necessary.

I have many books and research materials, I will be basing a lot of changes on these. This mod will focus on REALISM and not gameplay as much.

It will be for folks who desire 'true' realism and not abstract realism imposed by game changes to make it more difficult/easy based on gameplay.

It will include plenty of total re-writes but as I said it will be based heavily of what the community has already done, modified to introduce more realism based on my research.

Since I have figured out how to edit hardcoded values, a lot of work will be done there. Such as having to change vent/pump settings based on depth.

Example; When you are deep 230m for example depending on sub, your pumps cannot keep up and you will slowly take on water and slowly fall deeper as your sub gets heavier due to water accumulation.

My main limitation are graphics, I can code all day but I cannot do graphics.

Anyway this will be a LONG work in progress. I will also attempt to incorporate SHIV/V elements into the game.

Schwieger · 06-24-11, 11:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vodkaphile

remove gamey elements.

+1

Got my attention there. Good luck with this mate, nice to see some more serious interest in hardcore realism.

Myxale · 06-25-11, 01:41 AM

I think it's a good idea. Some kind of Mod-compilation with focus on Realism.

It'll be nice to have a Mod-pack that has the majority of smaller mods in it. Would save lots of time.

Keep us updated!

vodkaphile · 06-25-11, 02:51 AM

Progress so far....

Edited hydrophone contact ranges based on historically accurate data.

Your SO will be able to detect targets out to the maximum range of the given hydrophone you have installed.

The ranges are estimates, eg short instead of being stock 1000m is random up to a distance, same with medium and long. This prevents the player from knowing exact range on first contact if they know the .cfg files.

WO is affected by the same visual impairments of player, eg fog, etc reduces their detection range. Also their range estimates are not precisely accurate, off up to 500m. (Fixes WO night vision)

Adjusted and randomized SO contact speed, slow - medium - fast, previously it was a set speed.

Slowed merchants top speed to historical values, this can only be done via class...so some merchants that could travel slightly faster wont be able to but it is an average... no more merchants @ 35kts.

Slightly sped up aircraft maximum speed against had to average it. Based the data on ASW aircraft. So say, aircraft based fighters with bombs will be slightly slower but they are rarer.

Slowed convoy speeds - they had a max speed of 35kts, I felt that was WAY to fast. Esp when most merchants cant get near that. Including the fact that convoys travelled slower historically to stay together and organized etc...

Randomized convoy speed more from waypoint to way point. Without giving away information it was almost a constant speed for all convoys, especially the early years of the war.

Reduced number of early escorts, increased number of mid-late war escorts and adjusted types slightly.

Added dynamic shadows.

Lowered chance of being attacked at night from the air.

Increased the probability of being attacked by air after being detected (slightly)

Reduced probability of being attacked by air after being detected at night.

Slightly increased the probability of friendly airstrike being called in upon reporting a contact depending on year.

Added the probability of being attacked by enemy air on reporting a contact.

Changed the airstrike logic slightly and increased the time between 'attack runs' from already attacking aircraft.

Added randomized events without use of SH3 Commander, early stages not near fully functioning.

This is what I have so far after a night of working on mostly the .cfg files.

FAR from done with even the .cfg files.

EDIT: These .cfgs alone are going to take ages haha.
=================

25.06.2011:

Heavily modifying Scene.dat to improve weather, randomize it a bit, make storms shorter, storm waves smaller in general, not a lot smaller but I've been in the Atlantic during a hurricane and didn't see waves like I sometimes see in SH3.

Also increased the random wind change frequency and speed variables. Consider it wind gusts. These are very short duration.

Increased rain drops slightly in intensity and made variable size, decreased overall rain intensity very slightly.

Editing lightning flashes, some will appear a fair amount closer now and some more distant, decreased to min time between lightning flashes but increased the maximum possible time between them as well to create a more variable and random looking effect.

Begun work on weather algorithms.

Rickster1 · 06-25-11, 06:45 AM

Excellent, look forward to this mod

Wolfstriked · 06-25-11, 06:59 AM

Great stuff Vodkaphile! I love realism and wait to see what you bring.About the merchant knots.....really 35kts???

Will you add in a real navigation aspect to SH3

I do not want to have to use a sextant or whatever it is that was used to navigate but I find the sub icon on map moving along with the waypoint line to ruin immersion.Any chance to remove the subs icon and once a day you ask the NO to estimate location....with variances as to where you actually wanted to go?

vodkaphile · 06-25-11, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wolfstriked

Great stuff Vodkaphile! I love realism and wait to see what you bring.About the merchant knots.....really 35kts???

Will you add in a real navigation aspect to SH3

I do not want to have to use a sextant or whatever it is that was used to navigate but I find the sub icon on map moving along with the waypoint line to ruin immersion.Any chance to remove the subs icon and once a day you ask the NO to estimate location....with variances as to where you actually wanted to go?

This could be harder than it may seem.

It would also make judging enemy speed/course/aob etc from nav map extremely difficult.

It is a cool idea to be added for an ultra-hardcore optional pack but I suspect it will be extremely hard to implement.

If it is possible you could figure out your location by yourself just by using your speed over x amount of time travelled in @ y heading.

Now using time compression may make this more difficult but it could still be figured out using the methods above.

Actually adding a sextant too would improve the accuracy of your location.

It would definitely add a new challenge to the game, I suspect it would frustrate many people however.

It is also unrealistic in a way because your navigation officer would be keeping track of this data, so you shouldnt not know where you are.

Very cool idea, I'd love to try it myself! I will check into being able to change it but there are many variables involved and hardcoded issues that require a new set of changes- eg to sh3.exe which again go into copyright bs...etc.

Wolfstriked · 06-25-11, 03:09 PM

Here is a video from SH5 with real nav.He asks the NO to give location and it puts a dot on the map so you can work from there.

vodkaphile · 06-25-11, 08:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wolfstriked

Here is a video from SH5 with real nav.He asks the NO to give location and it puts a dot on the map so you can work from there.

Coding is different.

I can incorporate it but it requires me to edit sh3.exe.

Fish In The Water · 06-25-11, 09:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vodkaphile

It will be for folks who desire 'true' realism and not abstract realism imposed by game changes to make it more difficult/easy based on gameplay.

Caught my eye here...

Haven't given it much thought, so I'm uncertain as to how this could be fully implemented, but the goal seems laudable. Best of luck with the project!

vodkaphile · 06-26-11, 12:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fish In The Water

Caught my eye here...

Haven't given it much thought, so I'm uncertain as to how this could be fully implemented, but the goal seems laudable. Best of luck with the project!

Well I've already decided my mod wont be...super...

It is based on nygm/gwx and the older real uboot mod...as well as some great german mods.

If it contains any gfx extra it'll be hitman's opticz....

im modifying GFX and nygm based on research.

I've avoided as much as possible to edit hardcoded sh3.exe files but isnt possible to what i want to do ,,

The mod will be large howeve due to the fact that i intend to include the best of the community mods thus far as well as some code from SHIV/V that I've managed to work in.

I'm currently trying to combine MAgui with Hitman's. Because Ilike Magui's interface but I feel hitman's optics is more realistic.

Thats about as far as im going on interface/gfx.

The rest will be more subtle...

weather algorithms, dynamic campaign algorithms and editing of hard coded data.

I'd say my biggest achievement so far is the pump/venting system,,,,think aotd...

the deeper you go the higher speed ypu have to run to prevent depth loss///etc

As of current .....if you are running @ 160m you'll have to add more crew to maintenance to maintain that depth - this is abstract, I have figured out how to add crew to position to compensate. For now it is maint.

If you go silent running you will slowly always lose depth due to shutting off your pumps to be more silent.

The deeper you go the more you will slowly 'dive' due to these effects. Unless you speed up and/or change dive plane. Yes I've figured out how to adjust the planes, so instead of setting 15m depth, you can set fore plane 5dgrees and aft a different depending on rate of descent/ascent.

This has to be done from 1O position.

Fore and aft dive planes will not allow counter productivity.

eg fore 10 aft 10

which would = no gain or loss in depth but a general slowing of the sub.

cannot get around this.

Added commands to open/close vents and pumps.\\

Silent runnind shuts off each, depending on depth you will gain or lose depth.

You cannot open vent until 20m and if you do this causes cavitation and will cause you to be detected by 'elite' ai crews,

sitting idle causes you lose depth due to boency + 120m

vodkaphile · 06-26-11, 01:07 AM

Added thermal layers and games ability to recognize them.....the latter needs a sound or txt,. not added yet.

added randomization the sh3.exe w/o SH3 commander...bugged.

rewrote the entire weather algorithm (WIP)

The data is based on N,O,H,A archives...

The ultimate goal is RT weather/adjusted;;;

this will use an optional app to determine weather

SquareSteelBar · 06-26-11, 02:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vodkaphile

....However seeing as the game is 11 years old...

What game are you talking about?

vodkaphile · 06-26-11, 03:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SquareSteelBar

What game are you talking about?

SH3?

Wolfstriked · 06-26-11, 08:40 AM

Is it really true that a Uboat sinks when at zero speed.....I am asking about periscope depths mainly?I found this out about uboats and I would think that the DO would make exceptions for maintaining periscope depth and then blow negative tank when diving deeper for the safety reasons,so that they really would sink at slow speeds???

""n diving quickly, the negative tank is important. By flooding this tank the submarine becomes negatively buoyant. This gets the boat under water quicker. Once submerged, though, the negative tank will be blown or pumped out, to restore neutral buoyancy. You want to be heavier than water as you dive, but you don't want to stay that way once you're under. If the negative tank remained full and all power was lost the boat would quickly sink below crush depth and kill everyone aboard. The safety tank, which is normally kept fully flooded while submerged, is designed to hold the same volume of water as the conning tower. If the conning tower floods and has to be abandoned, the safety tank may be blown dry to compensate.""

Another point from same page

""Blow negative: When the depth is 15 feet short of the desired depth, the flooded negative tank is blown to restore neutral buoyancy. This tank is never blown completely dry at sea in order to avoid sending air bubbles to the surface. Once the flood valve is closed, the excess air pressure is vented into the hull.""

06-24-11, 11:03 PM	#1
vodkaphile Torpedoman Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Louisiana, USA Posts: 115 Downloads: 64 Uploads: 0	So I'm planning a new mod... I wouldn't consider it a supermod as of yet. I've very busy in life and will work on it during my spare time. I still need to get permissions from a lot of people because it will be based on the many mods out there, GWX/NYGM and many of the smaller mods for those as well as some older out-dated mods that have features I like/liked. I'll be doing this by myself for the time being but later on I may enlist willing mod makers. I want to get a groundwork laid first. My major goals are simple - Make the most realistic mod yet to date with all the graphical updates and great new UIs integrated but modified to remove gamey elements. Also included will be hardcoded changes such as stieblers/h.sie etc but I'm attempting a work around as to not allow 'hacked' versions of the game to work. However seeing as the game is 11 years old...these may be necessary. I have many books and research materials, I will be basing a lot of changes on these. This mod will focus on REALISM and not gameplay as much. It will be for folks who desire 'true' realism and not abstract realism imposed by game changes to make it more difficult/easy based on gameplay. It will include plenty of total re-writes but as I said it will be based heavily of what the community has already done, modified to introduce more realism based on my research. Since I have figured out how to edit hardcoded values, a lot of work will be done there. Such as having to change vent/pump settings based on depth. Example; When you are deep 230m for example depending on sub, your pumps cannot keep up and you will slowly take on water and slowly fall deeper as your sub gets heavier due to water accumulation. My main limitation are graphics, I can code all day but I cannot do graphics. Anyway this will be a LONG work in progress. I will also attempt to incorporate SHIV/V elements into the game. __________________ -VP Missing targets since 1990.

06-25-11, 01:41 AM	#3
Myxale Admiral Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: PQ AN 25 Posts: 2,178 Downloads: 70 Uploads: 0	I think it's a good idea. Some kind of Mod-compilation with focus on Realism. It'll be nice to have a Mod-pack that has the majority of smaller mods in it. Would save lots of time. Keep us updated! __________________ SH3+GWX SH5+WoS Still Sailing....still Deep

06-25-11, 02:51 AM	#4
vodkaphile Torpedoman Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Louisiana, USA Posts: 115 Downloads: 64 Uploads: 0	Progress so far.... Edited hydrophone contact ranges based on historically accurate data. Your SO will be able to detect targets out to the maximum range of the given hydrophone you have installed. The ranges are estimates, eg short instead of being stock 1000m is random up to a distance, same with medium and long. This prevents the player from knowing exact range on first contact if they know the .cfg files. WO is affected by the same visual impairments of player, eg fog, etc reduces their detection range. Also their range estimates are not precisely accurate, off up to 500m. (Fixes WO night vision) Adjusted and randomized SO contact speed, slow - medium - fast, previously it was a set speed. Slowed merchants top speed to historical values, this can only be done via class...so some merchants that could travel slightly faster wont be able to but it is an average... no more merchants @ 35kts. Slightly sped up aircraft maximum speed against had to average it. Based the data on ASW aircraft. So say, aircraft based fighters with bombs will be slightly slower but they are rarer. Slowed convoy speeds - they had a max speed of 35kts, I felt that was WAY to fast. Esp when most merchants cant get near that. Including the fact that convoys travelled slower historically to stay together and organized etc... Randomized convoy speed more from waypoint to way point. Without giving away information it was almost a constant speed for all convoys, especially the early years of the war. Reduced number of early escorts, increased number of mid-late war escorts and adjusted types slightly. Added dynamic shadows. Lowered chance of being attacked at night from the air. Increased the probability of being attacked by air after being detected (slightly) Reduced probability of being attacked by air after being detected at night. Slightly increased the probability of friendly airstrike being called in upon reporting a contact depending on year. Added the probability of being attacked by enemy air on reporting a contact. Changed the airstrike logic slightly and increased the time between 'attack runs' from already attacking aircraft. Added randomized events without use of SH3 Commander, early stages not near fully functioning. This is what I have so far after a night of working on mostly the .cfg files. FAR from done with even the .cfg files. EDIT: These .cfgs alone are going to take ages haha. ================= 25.06.2011: Heavily modifying Scene.dat to improve weather, randomize it a bit, make storms shorter, storm waves smaller in general, not a lot smaller but I've been in the Atlantic during a hurricane and didn't see waves like I sometimes see in SH3. Also increased the random wind change frequency and speed variables. Consider it wind gusts. These are very short duration. Increased rain drops slightly in intensity and made variable size, decreased overall rain intensity very slightly. Editing lightning flashes, some will appear a fair amount closer now and some more distant, decreased to min time between lightning flashes but increased the maximum possible time between them as well to create a more variable and random looking effect. Begun work on weather algorithms. __________________ -VP Missing targets since 1990. Last edited by vodkaphile; 06-25-11 at 02:16 PM.

06-26-11, 01:07 AM	#12
vodkaphile Torpedoman Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Louisiana, USA Posts: 115 Downloads: 64 Uploads: 0	Added thermal layers and games ability to recognize them.....the latter needs a sound or txt,. not added yet. added randomization the sh3.exe w/o SH3 commander...bugged. rewrote the entire weather algorithm (WIP) The data is based on N,O,H,A archives... The ultimate goal is RT weather/adjusted;;; this will use an optional app to determine weather __________________ -VP Missing targets since 1990.

06-26-11, 08:40 AM	#15
Wolfstriked Grey Wolf Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 756 Downloads: 230 Uploads: 0	Is it really true that a Uboat sinks when at zero speed.....I am asking about periscope depths mainly?I found this out about uboats and I would think that the DO would make exceptions for maintaining periscope depth and then blow negative tank when diving deeper for the safety reasons,so that they really would sink at slow speeds??? ""n diving quickly, the negative tank is important. By flooding this tank the submarine becomes negatively buoyant. This gets the boat under water quicker. Once submerged, though, the negative tank will be blown or pumped out, to restore neutral buoyancy. You want to be heavier than water as you dive, but you don't want to stay that way once you're under. If the negative tank remained full and all power was lost the boat would quickly sink below crush depth and kill everyone aboard. The safety tank, which is normally kept fully flooded while submerged, is designed to hold the same volume of water as the conning tower. If the conning tower floods and has to be abandoned, the safety tank may be blown dry to compensate."" Another point from same page ""Blow negative: When the depth is 15 feet short of the desired depth, the flooded negative tank is blown to restore neutral buoyancy. This tank is never blown completely dry at sea in order to avoid sending air bubbles to the surface. Once the flood valve is closed, the excess air pressure is vented into the hull."" Last edited by Wolfstriked; 06-26-11 at 08:51 AM.

06-25-11, 06:45 AM	#5
Rickster1 Chief Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 320 Downloads: 508 Uploads: 0	Excellent, look forward to this mod

06-25-11, 06:59 AM	#6
Wolfstriked Grey Wolf Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 756 Downloads: 230 Uploads: 0	Great stuff Vodkaphile! I love realism and wait to see what you bring.About the merchant knots.....really 35kts??? Will you add in a real navigation aspect to SH3 I do not want to have to use a sextant or whatever it is that was used to navigate but I find the sub icon on map moving along with the waypoint line to ruin immersion.Any chance to remove the subs icon and once a day you ask the NO to estimate location....with variances as to where you actually wanted to go?

06-25-11, 03:09 PM	#8
Wolfstriked Grey Wolf Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 756 Downloads: 230 Uploads: 0	Here is a video from SH5 with real nav.He asks the NO to give location and it puts a dot on the map so you can work from there.