~ Sail away ~

[SteamWake]

From taxes !!!

Pepole have been doing this for decades. I have personally shuttled some boats for 'wealthy' socialites from one state to another for this very reason.

Originally Posted by Boston Herald

Could the reason be that the Ocean State repealed its Boat Sales and Use Tax back in 1993, making the tiny state to the south a haven - like the Cayman Islands, Bermuda and Nassau - for tax-skirting luxury yacht owners?

http://bostonherald.com/track/inside...icleid=1269698

[nikimcbee]

what a hypocrite.

what a hypocrite

It is everyones right to pay no more tax than they are legally required to.
Besideswhich Kerry and his wife are both trustafarians which means the legal teams have the big say on how to manage the funds and assets for the benefit of their clients.

Now you could make a story about Kerry having a boat that wasn't registered there,but that story would be "WTF are those highly paid accountants and lawyers playing at"......

[gimpy117]

Paying your fair share of taxes is your civil duty. Even if it's not technically illegal to tax shelter it's immoral and hurting america. The USA loses a lot of tax revenue a year because some selfish citizens and companies try to get around taxes any way they can. People would say it was wrong if you got up from church and left every time the offering plate was passed around...so why do this when america passes it's plate to you?

Paying your fair share of taxes is your civil duty.

Is there any suggestion that they didn't pay taxes that were due?

The USA loses a lot of tax revenue a year because some selfish citizens and companies try to get around taxes any way they can.

It is everyones right to [pay only the taxes they have to pay,, are you suggesting people and companies should just become charitable donors to the government?
....hold on , would that be deductable?

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by gimpy117

Paying your fair share of taxes is your civil duty. Even if it's not technically illegal to tax shelter it's immoral and hurting america. The USA loses a lot of tax revenue a year because some selfish citizens and companies try to get around taxes any way they can. People would say it was wrong if you got up from church and left every time the offering plate was passed around...so why do this when america passes it's plate to you?

No, it's not anyones "civil duty" to pay taxes. When people in government create taxes that are wrong, it is our civic duty to oppose them. People have rights. Government does not.

The true purpose of taxation is that government has no means to create revenue, so if we want something from government we have to empower the government to take what is necessary for it to run.

Now we have people in the government who think it is their job to support everything they can imagine, and when anyone points out that they wrong to do so, they cry "immoral" and "not paying their fair share". All taxes are evil, but they are a necessary evil. When people like you start claiming that taxes are good, and avoiding them is bad, then America has already gone far too far in the wrong direction.

The personal income tax was created in the first place because self-righteous control freaks in the government wanted to stop the rich from "getting away with it". We create government to protect our rights, and we make laws to protect ourselves from each other. Just because you believe that someone having more money than someone else is evil, doesn't make it so. The purpose of taxation is to keep the government running, not because you or anyone else thinks it's "right", or "moral".

[gimpy117]

okay...then explain to me how having the money to buy a multi million dollar yacht but then taking it somewhere so you don't have to pay taxes upon it is ok? sure you shouldn't have to pay an unfair tax (thats why we have a representative democracy) but when you have that kind of money you should contribute to society. Theres a lot of good average Americans who pay all of their taxes and are barely scraping by. Why can't they do their part?

[August]

Well there is a little more to the story.

Under Massachusetts law, "if a boat owner berths the vessel in Massachusetts waters within six months of purchasing the boat, there’s a “presumption of use,” and the owner must fork over the 6.25 percent sales tax to the commonwealth. Local excise taxes also are due."

Apparently the good Senator has been seen tying the boat up in Martha’s Vineyard and Nantucket waters within six months of buying her. Oops.

http://www.bostonherald.com/track/in...69894&srvc=rss

[Sailor Steve]

A state assigns a sales tax. Someone avoids paying it by taking it to another state. This does indeed hurt the state, and can be considered wrongful practice. But if the state doesn't have a law against it, too bad. Here in Utah you can go to jail for that. I could argue that the sales tax is wrong, or excessive, but in this case it exists specifically to keep the government running, so I have to agree it is acceptable, and even necessary.

My problem here is that I see both sides. Kerry is indeed a hypocrite, because he thinks taxes are good, and insists on raising them, but then avoids them. On the other hand, tax-dodging is an old game, and the very drive that carries people to get rich also makes them want to hang onto it. It's up to the state to curb it if they can.

Oh, and that particular tax supports the State of Massachussets. The USA doesn't come into it.

[gimpy117]

I don't believe we should even have to go to the letter of the law, People should be decent Americans and pay the taxes they know they ought to be paying, it's an honor system you know. And if it's a sate in america paying taxes in that state is helping america.

[Sailor Steve]

The problem I have with that philosophy is that (to my mind at least) it can lead to what I described earlier, that is people creating taxes for all the wrong reasons and then trying to convince others that it is their "duty" or their "moral obligation" to pay them. I feel a moral obligation to help maintain freedom, as well as the means to secure it. It could even be argued that it is my moral obligation to help those who cannot help themselves. It is, however, not my job or my place to take from someone else and use that to pay for what I think is right.

You can argue "civic duty" and "moral obligation" 'til the cows come home, but taxation is still extortion. You can argue that I should pay willingly, but the fact is that someone else takes it without asking, and my opposing that, or hiding from it, doesn't make it immoral, only illegal.

[nikimcbee]

This guy is a C.S. for voting for this tax, and then doing everything to get out of it. This kind of political action drives me crazy. I think R I should charge him some sort of out of state mooring fee to feed hungry kittens.

[nikimcbee]

...but then again, look who we're talking about. I was for this tax before I was against it.
What a chump.

[gimpy117]

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

You can argue "civic duty" and "moral obligation" 'til the cows come home, but taxation is still extortion. You can argue that I should pay willingly, but the fact is that someone else takes it without asking, and my opposing that, or hiding from it, doesn't make it immoral, only illegal.

then vote libertarian if you're so up in arms. Our government decides taxation. If you vote out people who support taxation we'll have no tax. (lets hope libertarian magic dust actually exists...because the police, fire dept. 911, national defense and a host of other programs won't.)

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by gimpy117

then vote libertarian if you're so up in arms. Our government decides taxation. If you vote out people who support taxation we'll have no tax. (lets hope libertarian magic dust actually exists...because the police, fire dept. 911, national defense and a host of other programs won't.)

I don't vote any party, and I'm not up in arms at all. I do take exception to people who blindly support the government in everything they do, but I also stand against people who deride the government for no good reason.

But I'll play your game, and see what you think.

I started a thread a couple of days ago about my new bass guitar. The price was $399.99, with state sales tax the total came to $427.39. I cheerfully pay the state sales tax, not only because I don't have much of a choice, but because they have to get operating money from somewhere, and as you say police and fire services, parks, construction and the people to run everything have to get paid, and as I've said government has no means for raising revenues, so it has to come from somewhere.

Two nights ago at a party I let a friend of a friend play it for almost an hour. When he handed it back he said "I'll give you $500 cash for it, right now."

I said "Sure, why not?" He said he was just testing me, but if I did decide to go with the other one I wanted he would gladly take it off my hands. For $500 on the spot I was willing to let it go, but the other one is also $399+tax, so the actual profit I made would only be $46, so I probably wouldn't go for it.

Here's the clincher: If I had sold it for cash, according to you...

Paying your fair share of taxes is your civil duty. Even if it's not technically illegal to tax shelter it's immoral and hurting america. The USA loses a lot of tax revenue a year because some selfish citizens and companies try to get around taxes any way they can. People would say it was wrong if you got up from church and left every time the offering plate was passed around...so why do this when america passes it's plate to you?

...the right thing to do would be to go to the Utah Tax Commission, tell them exactly what had transpired and offer to give them $34.25 on the spot.

Are you saying I should do this every time I buy or sell something from another private party? Do you?