~ Sail away ~

[Sailor Steve]

The problem I have with that philosophy is that (to my mind at least) it can lead to what I described earlier, that is people creating taxes for all the wrong reasons and then trying to convince others that it is their "duty" or their "moral obligation" to pay them. I feel a moral obligation to help maintain freedom, as well as the means to secure it. It could even be argued that it is my moral obligation to help those who cannot help themselves. It is, however, not my job or my place to take from someone else and use that to pay for what I think is right.

You can argue "civic duty" and "moral obligation" 'til the cows come home, but taxation is still extortion. You can argue that I should pay willingly, but the fact is that someone else takes it without asking, and my opposing that, or hiding from it, doesn't make it immoral, only illegal.

[gimpy117]

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

You can argue "civic duty" and "moral obligation" 'til the cows come home, but taxation is still extortion. You can argue that I should pay willingly, but the fact is that someone else takes it without asking, and my opposing that, or hiding from it, doesn't make it immoral, only illegal.

then vote libertarian if you're so up in arms. Our government decides taxation. If you vote out people who support taxation we'll have no tax. (lets hope libertarian magic dust actually exists...because the police, fire dept. 911, national defense and a host of other programs won't.)

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by gimpy117

then vote libertarian if you're so up in arms. Our government decides taxation. If you vote out people who support taxation we'll have no tax. (lets hope libertarian magic dust actually exists...because the police, fire dept. 911, national defense and a host of other programs won't.)

I don't vote any party, and I'm not up in arms at all. I do take exception to people who blindly support the government in everything they do, but I also stand against people who deride the government for no good reason.

But I'll play your game, and see what you think.

I started a thread a couple of days ago about my new bass guitar. The price was $399.99, with state sales tax the total came to $427.39. I cheerfully pay the state sales tax, not only because I don't have much of a choice, but because they have to get operating money from somewhere, and as you say police and fire services, parks, construction and the people to run everything have to get paid, and as I've said government has no means for raising revenues, so it has to come from somewhere.

Two nights ago at a party I let a friend of a friend play it for almost an hour. When he handed it back he said "I'll give you $500 cash for it, right now."

I said "Sure, why not?" He said he was just testing me, but if I did decide to go with the other one I wanted he would gladly take it off my hands. For $500 on the spot I was willing to let it go, but the other one is also $399+tax, so the actual profit I made would only be $46, so I probably wouldn't go for it.

Here's the clincher: If I had sold it for cash, according to you...

Paying your fair share of taxes is your civil duty. Even if it's not technically illegal to tax shelter it's immoral and hurting america. The USA loses a lot of tax revenue a year because some selfish citizens and companies try to get around taxes any way they can. People would say it was wrong if you got up from church and left every time the offering plate was passed around...so why do this when america passes it's plate to you?

...the right thing to do would be to go to the Utah Tax Commission, tell them exactly what had transpired and offer to give them $34.25 on the spot.

Are you saying I should do this every time I buy or sell something from another private party? Do you?

[nikimcbee]

Oh, he doesn't want to talk about it...

poor baby doesn't think he should pay... oh..
http://wbztv.com/local/john.kerry.yacht.2.1825558.html

[SteamWake]

Originally Posted by nikimcbee

Oh, he doesn't want to talk about it...

poor baby doesn't think he should pay... oh..
http://wbztv.com/local/john.kerry.yacht.2.1825558.html

He says he pays his taxes !

Cmon give the gazzilionaire a break.

Originally Posted by Kerry

"Let's get this very straight, I've said consistently we will pay our taxes, we have always paid our taxes. It's not an issue period," he said.

[nikimcbee]

Originally Posted by SteamWake

He says he pays his taxes !

Cmon give the gazzilionaire a break.

I call BS on that.

[SteamWake]

Originally Posted by nikimcbee

I call BS on that.

No weawy Bawny Fwank is his accountant

BTW your image in your sig is broken.