My expereince, living in a red state and a blue state.

All this back and forth political stuff made me want to share my story. I grew up republican, born in 1977 and supported Bush in 2000, because well, you vote for the republican in the south and that's all there is to it. No debate, no back talk, Jesus is a republican got it? I am a liberal now but it didn't happen overnight by any means.

I grew up in Virginia and I now live in Rhode Island. Virginia is a very red, red state. We're talking Jesus, potatoe salad, Wal-Mart and more Jesus. Rhode Island is not exactly the crown jewel of New England, but it's blue alright.

Well jobs in the south are scarce and low paying. I mean 30K a year is considered really good pay. Shopping is simple, there is Wal-Mart and nothing else in a lot of the small areas. In bigger areas there is a Target and the obligatory Best Buy strip mall. You can drive thru the ghost town that used to house shops in the downtown areas. In the name of the "free market" Wal-Mart was given millions by local government to bring in **** jobs and crush the competition. When it comes time after 5 years for Wal-Mart to start paying some taxes, they board it up and move the same Wal-Mart accross the city, town or county lines. When people would call foul on this we were given the impression that those liberal democrats were somehow to blame. But, but... Wal-Mart is a southern company, SILENCE! No more blasphemy.

Living in the south is a lot like living in a communist country. We didn't have much money or prestige, just some faded history and a big helping of nationalism. We were taught more or less our suffering was helping the country, you know the whole "greater good arguement". That was used in leiu of the good old fashion "the lord works in mysterious ways" line. The Horatio Alger myth is alive and well in the south. You even hear it comming from republican politicians. Basically if you don't have a pot to piss in you aren't "working" hard enough. Nevermind the fact that every job in town pays minimum wage. If you question your low pay you get a response like "that would be communist" or some nonesense. The right accuses anyone who breathes the word, union, higher pay or more benefits of SOCIALISM! Gasp! No one wants that do they? The south uses the word socialism like Mr. Jones is used in Animal Farm. When we protest we are told "you don't want Mr. Jones to come back do you?!" Of course not....

Southern people are nice, no doubt. They will help you change a tire in a heartbeat, but they trusted the government and the republican party to a point where they just robbed them blind. They left them with closed factories and McDoanld's or Wal-Mart for a career. They believe Bush is president because God wants that. They think Iraq is about "freedom". It's frustrating to say the least. I tried to tell people Bush is a third generation war profiteer. Grandpappy Bush made his money of the Nazi's in world war 2, Bush Senior off Desert Storm in 1991, and little Bush in the Orwellian named "Operation Iraq Freedom" .

The republican view is not to blame their own party but to blame those evil democrats. Most notably the lazy blacks, Mexicans and last but not least homosexuals. More on the homosexuals later.

Ok, so after I get out of the army I try college. The army was my one way ticket out of redneck America. There I got to play with the other poor people from all over the country. Blacks, whites, mexicans etc. Just good old fashioned dirt poor people, not the Band of Brothers cast I was expecting. I hung around college awhile and actually took some classes. I dated a LOT of liberal girls and it wore off on me. I tried it on hesitantly like a coat, and damn I liked it.

So I take off to Rhode Island. My fiance at the time got a scholarship to grad school here. Both our families more or less disowned us for trying to be "better than them". My sister is married to an officer who keeps getting sent to Vietraq and I am hanging out at the posh restraunts with my lawyer wife.

The blue state is different. No Wal-Mart anywhere near me. Instead there is a downtown with almost 100% of the shops open. There is even a mom and pop pharmacy! This place looks a lot like the Normal Rockwell painting the southerns wish their place was. There are more out of the closet gay men here. Not one has ever looked at me twice. The have not tried to hit on me once. I only got hit on by gay men when I was in the ARMY! Imagine. Up here, gay, black, green, no one could care less what you are or what you do. It's live and let live. So no, they don't try to "convert" you.

The minimum wage is like 7.25 here. Governement here doesn't sell it's citizens off to the Wal-Marts of the country. You can make money here by working hard. No really, you can. They have unions! I drove past the submarine used in the film K-19 widowmaker this morning. The one with Harrison Ford.

In short, I know a lot of people call blue states communist havens, but it's nothing like the right wingers said it would be like. I'll never go back south. THIS is America.

[Digital_Trucker]

I'm certainly happy that you like it where you are, but have you looked around at the rest of the country (including the states, and probably even cities bordering where you currently live)? Not to hijack your story, but I've seen little towns and big cities from Miami to Seattle and San Diego to Bangor and you can see all the good and the bad things you describe all over this country.

Thanks for sharing the beginning of your story

[Frame57]

Hey! If you are ever near the Sub base in Groton Conn. See if you can tour their museum there.

[Rockin Robbins]

What a crock of well-worn falsities. Where I live is nowhere near what you describe. Go to Birmingham, Alabama or Orlando, Florida and say that. Your characterization of the south is purposefully inaccurate, laughable even. Even your straw man pitting of north and south is ludicrous, considering that half of New York is living in Palm Coast, Florida. Why? Because it was their lifetime ambition, that's why!

People don't move out of paradise to live in hell. So you've got it very wrong, pal. The entire country is moving to the sun belt for some very good reasons. This will make the Yankee states, like Virginia, a better place to live by easing their overpopulation. Yankees is anyone living north of Jacksonville, by the way.:rotfl:You never did live in the south.

[Hylander_1314]

R R,

Which Jacksonville?

[Rockin Robbins]

Florida of course! All those others are imposters of the original (even if it wasn't first:rotfl and I think southernmost Jacksonville. If you live in Fernandina Beach you get to be a Reb by special exception... but all others are Yankees!

A friend of mine from Jacksonville is a Civil War reenactor. He's switched to the Yankees too (traitor!) because just about everybody who does Civil War reenactments is from former Rebel ("the Civil War warn't bout slavery, it was bout states' rights!" Reply, "Yeah, states' rights to have slavery...:rotfl states. As a Yank he actually got to take part in the battles. As a Reb he got to sit around all day in the reserves.

Can't even keep a pretend traitor loyal. What's this darn world coming to???

[Hylander_1314]

Been down that way a few times. Really liked it down there. Nice folks, and a real laid back atmosphere in the small towns. I like that better than the hussle and bussle of the big city. But I had to get back to mountains of Colorado, and I now really yearn for the waters of Huron and Superior where i originally came from.

[Rockin Robbins]

Yeah, in Florida rocks are against the law and we measure ant hills to find the highest elevation in the county. On the gulf coast near Tampa the ground is so level that if the ocean rises a foot, it can move over a mile inland. I'm not saying we're completely flat but people do play a lot of billiards on us.

Volusia County, Mosquito County until the dad blamed Democrats renamed it in the 1920's, is the sharkbite capital of the freakin' world! We're proud. I'd do a Rebel yell, but I don't know how.

[Hylander_1314]

Yeah, but you got palm trees. And the Everglades are a sight to behold. I really liked the mangroves from a boat. The clear water, and great fishing.

Originally Posted by Rockin Robbins

What a crock of well-worn falsities. Where I live is nowhere near what you describe. Go to Birmingham, Alabama or Orlando, Florida and say that. Your characterization of the south is purposefully inaccurate, laughable even.

Well with such a foolish knee jerk response I don't doubt for a minute you are in fact from FloriDUH. Why would I go to any of those dumps? I don't feel like going back in time, thank you. You need to stop attacking liberals and go learn spanish, because it's becomming the official language of FloriDUH. You can deny it if you want. I was even eating at Ruby Tuesday's in Lynchburg VA and saw Jerry Fallwell stuffing his fat face.

As for the snowbirds, well those are the ones who failed up north making their fortune and can't afford anything better than FloriDUH. Yes, retirement in Palm Springs is considered a failure by northern standards.

[LiveGoat]

Sounds like the OP is ashamed of his lineage. What happened between the early 90's and now to make liberals into such elitist snobs? This didn't used to be the norm.

I used to behave the same way. I couldn't wait to get out of Ohio (my family is from the south and we used to spend a lot of time there). I eventually made it to New York. I'm still fairly liberal but I don't associate much with the people here unless it's business related. I work in the theatre and film community here and believe me, the snobbery is thick as molasses. Anybody from outside of Manhattan (or the GOOD parts of Brooklyn) is a hick. They're mostly white and only have friends of color who are cool (i.e. wealthy or connected). Someone asked me where I worked for a day job and I said the Bronx and they looked at me like I said the sewers. They don't like religious people here, either unless it's something exotic that they can fetishize. Jews are okay if they wear baseball caps and act like Jerry Seinfeld but wo be to the one who wears a yamulka or (G-d forbid) look Hasidic.

All they do is talk about how screwed up everybody else is while holding wine glasses or lattes and never actually do anything. My favorite time of year is tax time, when they all scramble to get out of paying "their fair share". They bitch all year about how they're proud to pay taxes and would pay more if they could but about 2 weeks before the deadline, all I overhear at bars, restaurants and parties is people trading accountant recommendations as if they were acupunture therapists.

And yet I continue living here. Why? I love it here. There are good people here just like in Ohio, just like in the South. And come to think of it. I wouldn't be here if my white trash, unsophisticated,not-having-anything-to-do-with-the-theatre parents didn't slave away at their respective crappy jobs.

Originally Posted by LiveGoat

Sounds like the OP is ashamed of his lineage. What happened between the early 90's and now to make liberals into such elitist snobs? This didn't used to be the norm.

I hear you man. I will never be "one of them", they won't give you the time of day if you aren't at least in a BMW. Thing is though, it still beats the southern family screaming along with Bill O'reilly gorging on meat all night.

Personally I would rather be a slave up here in heaven than a king down there in hell. Being a nobody liberal up here is worth more than being a somebody in the south.

[Kapt Z]

Originally Posted by Rockin Robbins

What a crock of well-worn falsities. Where I live is nowhere near what you describe. Go to Birmingham, Alabama or Orlando, Florida and say that. Your characterization of the south is purposefully inaccurate, laughable even. Even your straw man pitting of north and south is ludicrous, considering that half of New York is living in Palm Coast, Florida. Why? Because it was their lifetime ambition, that's why!

People don't move out of paradise to live in hell. So you've got it very wrong, pal. The entire country is moving to the sun belt for some very good reasons. This will make the Yankee states, like Virginia, a better place to live by easing their overpopulation. Yankees is anyone living north of Jacksonville, by the way.:rotfl:You never did live in the south.

Neither do you. Florida is New Jersey with a sunburn and a Medicaid card.