the early war surface attack

[cobalt]

So theres been a tutorial written about just about everything on this forum, but no one has written anything about my favourite part of SH3, surface attacks on covnoys.

I previously thought that convoy attacks on the surface were near impossible, as you would always get detected way too soon by the escorts. Since I started playing GWX ive noticed that the sensors were a lot better at night time, and the surface attack was possible. You no longer had to fire a salvo from 4000m out and hope you hit something.

this is a lot more tricky than creeping in at periscope depth. theres a few things you need to keep in mind

* Weather - The windspeed plays a big part in your attack positioning, the higher the windspeed, the closer you can slip in undetected. Fog is also important, light or medium fog is perfect for an attack.
* Preperation - Make sure you have everything that you're going to need, ready. IE your ship recognition manual prepared, Your TDC updated, all your officers ready, and your torpedo men ready to reload. You're going to have to make some very quick decisions
* Approach angle - Theres two differant ways that i've found to be effective. From the front of the convoy, or from the rear. the former being easier.

.

The trick is to get into a position where the lead escort can't see you. Once you get astern of the lead escort you need to move very quickly to the front of the convoy, so the escorts on the side don't spot you. Go ahead full and rush the front of the convoy.


Now you're going to pick what ships you're going to torpedo. Make sure you have your speed settings already in your TDC and the bow angle. Its tricky to get an accurate range, so try to get as close as you can. You'll be able to get within 800m in good conditions. aim for the farthest merchant first, and then the closer ones. OR aim for the lead merchant and turn hard into the the next ship in line behind him.


let em go! its time consuming but its a great feeling when your eels hit their mark

[Dantenoc]

good show

[EM2(SS)]

Right on Cobalt!


Fantastic pictorial there. Surface night attacks need a bit (well quite a bit) of planning, but can and do work. The best part about them is if you get the first one off and escape you can repeat it until the sun comes up. The only downfall is doing them with a VII is that you soon run out of torps. But at least you have a lot to show for it.

A thing I'd like to add is to come in decks awashed. I think this cuts down quite a bit on being visually detected. On a VII , 7 meter depth should do nicely.

Also before attacking watch the behavior of the flank escort. Many times they like to turn 90 degrees away from the convoy and shoot out 1000 to 2000 meters. Sometimes they also turn towards the aft end of the convoy for a bit before returning. This is a great time to make your dash toward some nice juicy merchants!

Once again thanks for the tutorial. I hope gets more kaeluns to give it a shot. By far the best part of SH3 is getting in close to a convoy at night on the surface sinkin 2 or 3 ships and getting away only seeing dim spot lights far away!

[TarJak]

Cobalt,

Nicely done. I'd agree with EM2 on coming in decks awash. It really does make you a bit more stealthy when trying to evade the escorts.

[cobalt]

i agree with the decks awash, thanks for pointing that out. When the sea is calm is the best time to do that though, otherwise you're underwater half the time

[Mooncatt]

nice read Cobalt. but very brave to attack on the surface

[Morts]

very nice read

[Abd_von_Mumit]

Impressive... but I wouldm't dare to do that. Too many bad experiences, when I raised my scope in a pitch black night and was spotted in 1940.

[melnibonian]

Good work

If the weather conditions are favourable (dark, a bit of fog etc) attacks like this are possible and quite profitable. If the weather doesn't help it's a bit more difficult

[Woof1701]

Thanks Cobalt,

A turtorial on suface attacks is exactly what I wished for

I'm still a little confused on how to know when the escorts can see me or not. In AOTD you could easily attack on the surface with impunity as long as there was little fog. Was almost too easy

In GWX I tried a few times with partly overcast and completely overcast sky and light fog, but the escorts always pinned me with searchlights shortly after I saw them. Once I even had them on my tail in pitch black night and really dense fog. I could barely see 500 meters and suddenly a mechant came out of nowhere and everywhere around me the searchlights went on and two DEs headed directly for me. Pretty shocking experience.

So there are a few questions left for me to ask

1. The schematic you provided also implies that while going around the lead escort you have to show her the complete broad side. I'm really impressed that they won't detect you. How does that work?

2. When getting past the lead escort, can you normally see the merchants already or are they still in the fog or darkness?

3. Could you be a bit more specific at about what speed you would approach from the front?

4. Approx. How far away can the escorts spot me in light or medium fog?

5. Is it possible to attack at night if the sky's not overcast or worse if there's moonlight? Or is that a big nono?


Thanks a ton Cobalt!!

[melnibonian]

Generally speaking evry ship has a detection range, that depends on the weather conditions and the crew status (green, average elite etc). In GWX if you pass anything between 5-10Km from a DD (without radar) in a night and at decks awash there is no way you can be detected. That way you can actually sneak inside the convoy and position your boat whenever you want. The visibility of your crew and the enemy's depends heavily on the weather conditions, but as a rule of thumb you can see at least a couple of Kms further than they can, as your siluette in the sea is too small.

Fog conditions are a bit more tricky. Usually heavy fog means visibility of about 300-500m, which means that as soon as you see them they see you. Medium fog is about 1-2Km (at night) so you're still slightly into the darger zone. In those conditions you have to be ready to submerge as soon as possible (plus under water you have better 'visibility' due to the hydrophones)

Light Fog is almost like no fog so as long as you keep within the 5-8Km distance you're OK. In clear nights you can still follow the same pattern but you have to be a bit more careful as your wakes are more visible.

Another issue you have to be careful with is your speed. If you travel at high speed (10 knts and above) you raise quite a bit of wake and you make a lot of noise, so you can actually be picked up by the escorts before they have visual contact with you.

[Woof1701]

Thx melnibonian,

But how do I get past an escort into the convoy if I have to keep at least 5 km away? And won't the merchants see me as well if I get too close? Cobalt wrote something about getting to a distance of 800 meters. Even in medium fog I would be in the detection range of the ships.

The other thing is noise. The DD's hydrophones can't detect me when I'm on the surface, and I strongly believe that hearing a uboat at 5 km distance is absolutely impossible on a DD that's making a lot of noise as well.

[melnibonian]

If you noticed there are some circles around the DDs in the graph. I haven't made that post so I don't want to talk about it but if I speculate I will say that they indicate the minimum detection range of the DDs. What do I mean with that:

The fact that if you're 5Km away they don't see you doesn't mean that if you come closer they will automatically see you. So you can actually close in to very small distances without being seen. It takes a bit of experience and loads of luck to perfect the move but it can be done. That's why I talked about weather conditions. If the weather is favorable (heavy seas, night and a light fog) you can approach far closer that you would in calm seas conditions. If the fog is heavy you're basically as blind as they are.

Does this make sence? If not tell me and I will elaborate more

[Brag]

Good-looking technique.
This is doable and daring. What is the life expectancy for daring Kaleuns? :hmm:

[Abd_von_Mumit]

After winning a gun duel with 3 frigates yesterday night (100% GWX) I'm so cocky I'll probably not try to avoid escorts any more in my career. Till my death, and that's going to visit me soon...

Thanks for the tutorial, seems useful!