RMS Titanic Hit Points - Page 2

Sailor Steve · 12-05-12, 02:40 PM

According to reports, there were many factors contributing to the loss of Britannic, including such minor but avoidable things as the nurses leaving portholes open to ventilate the lower decks. Silly, but you never know.

As for the differences between Britannic and Bismarck, I don't know how hitpoints work in the game, but there are major differences. For a WW2-era battleship things are different. The armored belt is all but useless against torpedoes, first because despite being hardened armor where an underwater blast of that sizes is concerned it's just plain old steel, and second because the armor belt is heavy and its size has to be limited, so normally torpedoes can pass under it. Battleships carried special anti-torpedo bulges below the armor belt, which were designed to be frangible, and for the most part they did a pretty good job. Once hit they became useless against another hit at that same point, but that was unlikely. Yamato was observed to take two hits at the same point, the second of which damaged one of the engine rooms, so it could happen.

Ocean liners had nothing like that.

AndreasT · 12-05-12, 03:41 PM

But I would think a battleship is build to take a hit or two and survive, I mean they are build to get shot at. The Germans did regard the Bismarck as unsinkable, like the Titanic.

Sailor Steve · 12-05-12, 03:46 PM

Of course. I was just explaining the special bulges needed to protect against torpedoes. The armored belt protects against incoming gunfire (within certain limits), and does a great job, but not against torpedoes.

12-05-12, 04:16 PM

I've seen every ship in SH3 go down in mere seconds.
One thing we can never control is how the Game works EVERYTIME.
It's a trade off.
What you are free to do is mod things as you wish.
What we did was do a damage model VonDos liked.
I've seen reports that it took days in Game for it to sink to mere seconds in Game.
I can make it nearly impossible to sink but the facts say it was a rock to start with.

So the Nurses left ports open. That still does not cover the fact that that very situation was NOT supposed to happen after the re-design!
Not for a single hit!
And that was WWI explosives. Not WWII.

Sailor Steve · 12-05-12, 05:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by privateer

I've seen reports that it took days in Game for it to sink to mere seconds in Game.

And that's the best you can ever hope for, and as close to reality as it gets.

Jimbuna · 12-05-12, 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AndreasT

But I would think a battleship is build to take a hit or two and survive, I mean they are build to get shot at. The Germans did regard the Bismarck as unsinkable, like the Titanic.

As fine a design as the Bismarck was (and Tirpitz for that matter)...no ship is or ever was unsinkable.

AndreasT · 12-06-12, 09:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jimbuna

As fine a design as the Bismarck was (and Tirpitz for that matter)...no ship is or ever was unsinkable.

Well many things like that have been claimed in the past and will be claimed in the future. Although there is a crowd which claim the Bismarck was scuttled. Regarding the pounding she got she would have gone down one way or another.

Actually what I would like to know what does the "ArmorLevel" do in the ZON file?

Sailor Steve · 12-07-12, 12:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AndreasT

Although there is a crowd which claim the Bismarck was scuttled.

She was scuttled. She was also torpedoed. Both sides have claimed the other was wrong for the past seventy years. I've always like the words of Baron Von Mullenheim-Rechberg in the documentary I saw: "To both I say 'Yes, you sank us.'"

Quote:

Regarding the pounding she got she would have gone down one way or another.

Exactly. I once had a 'discussion' with one of those who believed Bismarck to be 'unsinkable'. I pointed out that the ship was a burning, listing wreck which would have gone down within hours anyway. The torpedoing and scuttling were both merely attempts to prevent the wreck from being salvaged by the other side.

Oh, and I have to thank you. In looking online to get the Baron's name right, I stumbled on the book written by himself. Now I have to buy it.

WOOHOO! $1.99 + shipping from Amazon for a collectible = $5.98 total!

AndreasT · 12-07-12, 08:34 AM

I will check up on Baron Von Mullenheim-Rechberg. I think often that people like to build up a kind of nimbus about certain thing like an unsinkable Bismarck, the 88mm Flak cannon, the Tiger and Panther tanks. The stronger the enemy the better the victors.

Sailor Steve · 12-07-12, 11:39 AM

Yeah. I had another "conversation" with a fellow American who insisted that the P-51. was absolutely the best fighter of WW2. I tried to show him that the Mustang's reputation came mainly from the fact that it was the only single-engine fighter that could fly from England to Germany and back, thus escorting bombers all the way. The latest marks of Spitfire, Bf-109 and FW-190 all had points in which they were superior. Of course he refused to give up the propaganda he had grown up with, and it was a lost cause.

Except in certain specific times, there is rarely an absolute "best" of anything.

12-05-12, 02:40 PM	#16
Sailor Steve Eternal Patrol Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: High in the mountains of Utah Posts: 50,369 Downloads: 745 Uploads: 249	According to reports, there were many factors contributing to the loss of Britannic, including such minor but avoidable things as the nurses leaving portholes open to ventilate the lower decks. Silly, but you never know. As for the differences between Britannic and Bismarck, I don't know how hitpoints work in the game, but there are major differences. For a WW2-era battleship things are different. The armored belt is all but useless against torpedoes, first because despite being hardened armor where an underwater blast of that sizes is concerned it's just plain old steel, and second because the armor belt is heavy and its size has to be limited, so normally torpedoes can pass under it. Battleships carried special anti-torpedo bulges below the armor belt, which were designed to be frangible, and for the most part they did a pretty good job. Once hit they became useless against another hit at that same point, but that was unlikely. Yamato was observed to take two hits at the same point, the second of which damaged one of the engine rooms, so it could happen. Ocean liners had nothing like that. __________________ “Never do anything you can't take back.” —Rocky Russo

12-05-12, 03:46 PM	#18
Sailor Steve Eternal Patrol Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: High in the mountains of Utah Posts: 50,369 Downloads: 745 Uploads: 249	Of course. I was just explaining the special bulges needed to protect against torpedoes. The armored belt protects against incoming gunfire (within certain limits), and does a great job, but not against torpedoes. __________________ “Never do anything you can't take back.” —Rocky Russo

12-07-12, 11:39 AM	#25
Sailor Steve Eternal Patrol Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: High in the mountains of Utah Posts: 50,369 Downloads: 745 Uploads: 249	Yeah. I had another "conversation" with a fellow American who insisted that the P-51. was absolutely the best fighter of WW2. I tried to show him that the Mustang's reputation came mainly from the fact that it was the only single-engine fighter that could fly from England to Germany and back, thus escorting bombers all the way. The latest marks of Spitfire, Bf-109 and FW-190 all had points in which they were superior. Of course he refused to give up the propaganda he had grown up with, and it was a lost cause. Except in certain specific times, there is rarely an absolute "best" of anything. __________________ “Never do anything you can't take back.” —Rocky Russo

12-05-12, 03:41 PM	#17
AndreasT Loader Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Berlin, Germany. Posts: 89 Downloads: 180 Uploads: 0	But I would think a battleship is build to take a hit or two and survive, I mean they are build to get shot at. The Germans did regard the Bismarck as unsinkable, like the Titanic.

12-05-12, 04:16 PM	#19
Madox58 Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	I've seen every ship in SH3 go down in mere seconds. One thing we can never control is how the Game works EVERYTIME. It's a trade off. What you are free to do is mod things as you wish. What we did was do a damage model VonDos liked. I've seen reports that it took days in Game for it to sink to mere seconds in Game. I can make it nearly impossible to sink but the facts say it was a rock to start with. So the Nurses left ports open. That still does not cover the fact that that very situation was NOT supposed to happen after the re-design! Not for a single hit! And that was WWI explosives. Not WWII.

12-07-12, 08:34 AM	#24
AndreasT Loader Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Berlin, Germany. Posts: 89 Downloads: 180 Uploads: 0	I will check up on Baron Von Mullenheim-Rechberg. I think often that people like to build up a kind of nimbus about certain thing like an unsinkable Bismarck, the 88mm Flak cannon, the Tiger and Panther tanks. The stronger the enemy the better the victors.