America's fundamental change

Digital_Trucker · 08-15-08, 09:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skybird

.blah blah blah, I cannot form any real vision of what america will be like in 40, 50, 60 years. But it won't be the traditional America of the proverbial WASP anymore.

I don't know what America you speak of, but the one I live in is not "the traditional America of the proverbial WASP" now.

Schöneboom · 08-15-08, 09:48 AM

What matters in the long run is not the ethnic mix, but how well the immigrants assimilate into the culture, esp. in terms of adopting the language & values. So far we've been fortunate that our immigrants have been motivated to adapt out of self-interest. Actually some of our native-born population needs to achieve fluency in English!

We could have a population as mixed as Brazil's and still be American as ever. And dare I say we have a bit more experience in absorbing waves of immigration than Europe. Having visited several times (UK, France, Spain, Germany, Italy), I reckon it's the EU that could have a problem with rapid demographic changes.

Ciao,
Wayne

Skybird · 08-15-08, 10:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Schöneboom

What matters in the long run is not the ethnic mix, but how well the immigrants assimilate into the culture, esp. in terms of adopting the language & values.

That is precisely the point I am pointint at. For the most, your goals have not been questioned, and they derive from a cultural heritage formed by white christian europeans. And this dominance of cultural values and a national tradition deriving from these - is to be expected to chnage. that was different in the past waves or constant processes of immigration. It also means that ethnic patterns on the ground are changing. Some weeks ago for exaple there was a documentary essay about how the ethnic structure of inhabitants in Miami has massively changed over the past 60 years (people with a white european background moved away, hispanics massively replacing them, I think), and how this is reflected in changes of local policies, and chnaging focusses of local political projects.

Frame57 · 08-15-08, 01:45 PM

It already looks like Mexico here in California. But the politics of the Country will resemble the feminized socialistic Europe we see today. Yes, America is following its ancestor into the future. Morals are now immoral, Illegals are now legal, Churches will only be of historical value, economic and political policies will be unified, Women will now wear the pants, diversity has become perversity, the people have become the sheeple.... I pray as long as there is patriotic blood flowing through the veins of men, that this will not be. If this does unfold in the course of human events, then I will know that the last patriot has died.

John Lennon can shove his song "Imagine" where the son does not shine. Sure, imagine there is no country..... that is what will happen if things do not change.Progressiveness is just another "buzz" word for socialism. Some people want that and that is fine. But the concept of American Independance is what America is all about. Free trade does not have to be socially engineered to bring America to a 2nd or 3rd world country. There is no logical sense to have a North American Union. Only to the few who would become even wealthier, would such nonsense make sense. If we are at that point then we have arrived to enact our constitutional right to take the affairs and direction of our Country out of the hands of the bums in Washington and steer this ship of the shoals. But the people are asleep still and Nero fiddles while Rome burns. Someday soon the alarm clock will ring and all the bums in Washington D.C. will reason with their treason. Because they are guilty of it.

heartc · 08-15-08, 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Digital_Trucker

I don't know what America you speak of, but the one I live in is not "the traditional America of the proverbial WASP" now.

He speaks of Spiegel's America...

UnderseaLcpl · 08-15-08, 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by heartc

He speaks of Spiegel's America...

:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:Good one!

Konovalov · 08-15-08, 04:34 PM

I think that one gains a better knowledge and understanding of a country and it's people by travelling throughout it and meeting it's people over an extended period of time.

August · 08-15-08, 04:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Konovalov

I think that one gains a better knowledge and understanding of a country and it's people by travelling throughout it and meeting it's people over an extended period of time.

I agree. I learned a lot about Germany during the three years i lived over there.

jeremy8529 · 08-16-08, 07:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Konovalov

I think that one gains a better knowledge and understanding of a country and it's people by travelling throughout it and meeting it's people over an extended period of time.

I would strongly agree with you, call me weak at soul, but I was actually offended by someone who lived in Holland when I having a chat over ventrilo (yes I know he didn't mean anything by it and no i wasn't pissed, I was more... hurt... perhaps?)

" Your not like most Americans"

"How so?"

"Well, most American's seem to think they own the world and that they are superior"

" What would give you that impression?"

"The news mainly, CNN and the such."

Now, you must think, is it our fault people see us this way? The average American Cit? Are we really that arrogant of a people as a whole?

Perhaps, the newscasters don their cloak of super American patriotism, and prepare to march across other country's feelings in their steel plated boots.

Perhaps even, and most likely in my opinion, it is our current administration, maybe the fact we can't keep our fecking hands to our selves so to say, maybe the fact the dragged several other nations into a war that is mostly un-popular,

Let me tell everyone this here, let me tell everyone something they already know, that perhaps they forget it whenever it is convienant, but we don't vote on these conflicts, we are not a true democracy, we are more akin to a republic, or as they sugar coat it in my school books today, " Represntive Democracy"

We did not vote to go to Iraq! We did not elect a presedent with conquest on our mind! We did not say, "Let's vote for someone who will crusade in foregin lands for us to bring us more oil!"

As I see it, we vote for someone we think will behave a certain way, in a certain situation, and we pray for the best.

Sorry for the soapbox speech

Digital_Trucker · 08-16-08, 08:34 AM

No need to apologize, Jeremy. This country is not a democracy at all. It is a Republic. Our government is the same as any government on this planet. It is run by human beings, and as such, is fatally flawed. If anyone can think of one, I'd like to know which government on this planet is perfect and totally reflects the feelings and wishes of its average citizen.

Associating the characteristics of a people with the actions of it's government is dangerous. It's been done many times, and, evidently continues unabated. Using that type of logic, the average German citizen under Hitler would have been a megalomaniacal racist. I don't believe that was the case any more than I believe that the average American is whatever the hell George Bush is.

Whether you want to believe it or not, all governments are the same. They are run by out of touch, elite, power hungry people. It's the nature of government. The power attracts the type of people that you see leading us now. The concept of a "public servant", one who strives to do what's best for their people, is a thing of the past.

Edit : As for the graphics not degrading the written work inside the magazine, I agree. The written work inside of any publication isn't worth the paper it's printed on.

Frame57 · 08-16-08, 12:17 PM

Agreed! We have had popular vote over ruled by our own apponted judges on various propositions in this country. Which to me is treasonous! Our representatives often do not do their job and cater to their party rather than the people. The question is what can we do about it? No one seems to know. The system is in need of reformation. Perhaps amendments need to be made to limit terms of the senate. All Judges should be voted in and not appointed to clearly be party biased. The will of the people is what needs to be acted upon and not the will of bankers and other selfish entities.

kiwi_2005 · 08-16-08, 10:39 PM

The two young germans at work here hate their country they always putting it down, Germany is to angry place to live, they make everything hard for us young ppl, here in NZ we can get work anywhere with the skills we have, NZ is a great place to live i want to settle here one day. Ah yeah but theres a catch, here we employ foreigners cause most skilled kiwis head to Aussie where the money is we are becoming a nation short of skilled New Zealanders. Once the two germans realise they can make 3 times as much in aussie with the programming skills they be off. We wont tell em yet we need them to finish the software first!.

1480 · 08-17-08, 12:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kiwi_2005

The two young germans at work here hate their country they always putting it down, Germany is to angry place to live, they make everything hard for us young ppl, here in NZ we can get work anywhere with the skills we have, NZ is a great place to live i want to settle here one day. Ah yeah but theres a catch, here we employ foreigners cause most skilled kiwis head to Aussie where the money is we are becoming a nation short of skilled New Zealanders. Once the two germans realise they can make 3 times as much in aussie with the programming skills they be off. We wont tell em yet we need them to finish the software first!.

Actually I figured out SB: he is Rick (or a wannabe) of the Young Ones, I'm going to come up with Cliff Richard quotes, just to see if I'm correct....

Digital_Trucker · 08-15-08, 05:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by heartc

Quote:

Originally Posted by Digital_Trucker

I don't know what America you speak of, but the one I live in is not "the traditional America of the proverbial WASP" now.

He speaks of Spiegel's America...

<pic snipped to save bandwidth>

Thanks for clearing that up, heartc

Sure am glad I don't live in that America

August · 08-15-08, 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Digital_Trucker

Thanks for clearing that up, heartc

Sure am glad I don't live in that America

I tried to tell Skybird how off base he was but he wouldn't listen.

08-15-08, 09:48 AM	#2
Schöneboom Seasoned Skipper Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: San Francisco, CA Posts: 651 Downloads: 36 Uploads: 0	What matters in the long run is not the ethnic mix, but how well the immigrants assimilate into the culture, esp. in terms of adopting the language & values. So far we've been fortunate that our immigrants have been motivated to adapt out of self-interest. Actually some of our native-born population needs to achieve fluency in English! We could have a population as mixed as Brazil's and still be American as ever. And dare I say we have a bit more experience in absorbing waves of immigration than Europe. Having visited several times (UK, France, Spain, Germany, Italy), I reckon it's the EU that could have a problem with rapid demographic changes. Ciao, Wayne __________________ Dietrich Schöneboom, U-431 "Es wird klappen, Herr Kaleun. Ganz sicher."

08-15-08, 04:34 PM	#7
Konovalov Ocean Warrior Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: High Wycombe, Bucks, UK Posts: 2,811 Downloads: 9 Uploads: 0	I think that one gains a better knowledge and understanding of a country and it's people by travelling throughout it and meeting it's people over an extended period of time. __________________ "In a Christian context, sexuality is traditionally seen as a consequence of the Fall, but for Muslims, it is an anticipation of paradise. So I can say, I think, that I was validly converted to Islam by a teenage French Jewish nudist." Sheikh Abdul-Hakim Murad (Timothy Winter)

08-16-08, 08:34 AM	#10
Digital_Trucker Silent Hunter Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: The Peach State Posts: 4,171 Downloads: 141 Uploads: 10	No need to apologize, Jeremy. This country is not a democracy at all. It is a Republic. Our government is the same as any government on this planet. It is run by human beings, and as such, is fatally flawed. If anyone can think of one, I'd like to know which government on this planet is perfect and totally reflects the feelings and wishes of its average citizen. Associating the characteristics of a people with the actions of it's government is dangerous. It's been done many times, and, evidently continues unabated. Using that type of logic, the average German citizen under Hitler would have been a megalomaniacal racist. I don't believe that was the case any more than I believe that the average American is whatever the hell George Bush is. Whether you want to believe it or not, all governments are the same. They are run by out of touch, elite, power hungry people. It's the nature of government. The power attracts the type of people that you see leading us now. The concept of a "public servant", one who strives to do what's best for their people, is a thing of the past. Edit : As for the graphics not degrading the written work inside the magazine, I agree. The written work inside of any publication isn't worth the paper it's printed on. __________________ RSM-GIEP-Killflags-LV Tribute-Playable Elco __Peace be with you, Dave.

08-16-08, 10:39 PM	#12
kiwi_2005 Eternal Patrol Join Date: May 2004 Location: Aeoteroa Posts: 7,382 Downloads: 223 Uploads: 1	The two young germans at work here hate their country they always putting it down, Germany is to angry place to live, they make everything hard for us young ppl, here in NZ we can get work anywhere with the skills we have, NZ is a great place to live i want to settle here one day. Ah yeah but theres a catch, here we employ foreigners cause most skilled kiwis head to Aussie where the money is we are becoming a nation short of skilled New Zealanders. Once the two germans realise they can make 3 times as much in aussie with the programming skills they be off. We wont tell em yet we need them to finish the software first!. __________________ RIP kiwi_2005 Those who can't laugh at themselves leave the job to others.

08-15-08, 01:45 PM	#4
Frame57 Sea Lord Join Date: May 2008 Location: 1300 feet on the crapper Posts: 1,860 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	It already looks like Mexico here in California. But the politics of the Country will resemble the feminized socialistic Europe we see today. Yes, America is following its ancestor into the future. Morals are now immoral, Illegals are now legal, Churches will only be of historical value, economic and political policies will be unified, Women will now wear the pants, diversity has become perversity, the people have become the sheeple.... I pray as long as there is patriotic blood flowing through the veins of men, that this will not be. If this does unfold in the course of human events, then I will know that the last patriot has died. John Lennon can shove his song "Imagine" where the son does not shine. Sure, imagine there is no country..... that is what will happen if things do not change.Progressiveness is just another "buzz" word for socialism. Some people want that and that is fine. But the concept of American Independance is what America is all about. Free trade does not have to be socially engineered to bring America to a 2nd or 3rd world country. There is no logical sense to have a North American Union. Only to the few who would become even wealthier, would such nonsense make sense. If we are at that point then we have arrived to enact our constitutional right to take the affairs and direction of our Country out of the hands of the bums in Washington and steer this ship of the shoals. But the people are asleep still and Nero fiddles while Rome burns. Someday soon the alarm clock will ring and all the bums in Washington D.C. will reason with their treason. Because they are guilty of it.

08-16-08, 12:17 PM	#11
Frame57 Sea Lord Join Date: May 2008 Location: 1300 feet on the crapper Posts: 1,860 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	Agreed! We have had popular vote over ruled by our own apponted judges on various propositions in this country. Which to me is treasonous! Our representatives often do not do their job and cater to their party rather than the people. The question is what can we do about it? No one seems to know. The system is in need of reformation. Perhaps amendments need to be made to limit terms of the senate. All Judges should be voted in and not appointed to clearly be party biased. The will of the people is what needs to be acted upon and not the will of bankers and other selfish entities.