Clearing the TDC

[Fearless]

Eventually I may get the answer I want re Auto TDC but do I press the PK button a few times to make sure the data is cleared before targetting the next ship and that the RM is also not ticked?

[Rockin Robbins]

Sometimes I wonder.....

Pressing the PK button clears nothing. It is a meaningless gesture which is as useful as..... well, it isn't useful. In order to target another ship you MUST replace the four data items, one by one, with range/bearing last, into the TDC. You may do anything else you wish, including meditation, but it will not contribute to hitting your target. Please go to the end of WernerSobe's Advanced TDC/PK Video Tutorial Thread. Watch the six movies and have the CORRECT information proved and demostrated.

Early attempts at tutorials were done before WernerSobe determined the sometimes surprising facts about what is necessary and what is not in manual targeting. Some of the procedures in the original stuff was just superstition, like throwing salt over your left shoulder for good luck. (or is it right?)

At any rate, after watching the six videos you will have a complete understanding of how the process works in several variations. You will no longer have any questions, nor will you be victim to bad advice again.

You have given me a great idea to do a tutorial movie where I demonstrate each of these erroneous procedures and show what they actually accomplish. For instance, turning the PK off clears nothing. Often if I find that my course and speed inputs are good enough but my aiming point is ahead of the actual target, I will turn off the PK for a few seconds (letting my target catch up) and turn it back on when the target gets to the aiming point. Since pressing the button clears nothing at all, the aiming point then resumes with but now on top of the target and I'm ready to shoot.

[banjo]

I started reading thru all the above but gave up. The answer maybe there but here it is again. If you are using autotargeting you do not need the PK. I never use it, never select it. Just point and shoot. Be aware, with some mods, for some reason, your first shot will hit a little behind your aiming point so allow for that. Your others will hit where you cross hairs are when you shoot.

[Q3ark]

Originally Posted by Fearless

Eventually I may get the answer I want re Auto TDC but do I press the PK button a few times to make sure the data is cleared before targetting the next ship and that the RM is also not ticked?

?? you are not using manual targeting? So then it's all done for you, all you have to do is leave the scope crosshairs on the target and shoot. Do you even need to engage the PK when using auto targeting? I have never used it so can't help you there. Manual targeting is so much more satisfying when you slam three torpedos into the side of an oil tanker

edit.

Ah Banjo you beat me to it, will have to learn to type faster

[Mush Martin]

Originally Posted by banjo

I started reading thru all the above but gave up. The answer maybe there but here it is again. If you are using autotargeting you do not need the PK. I never use it, never select it. Just point and shoot. Be aware, with some mods, for some reason, your first shot will hit a little behind your aiming point so allow for that. Your others will hit where you cross hairs are when you shoot.

Upon reflection the above is correct never use the PK and
each torp is independently aimed use the pk and the torps track
a set target together(ish)

M

[Rockin Robbins]

Hey, I'm going to have to play with autotargeting to see exactly how it works. It's been a year since I did that! I'll bet nobody has ever done a tutorial on autotargeting. Hmmmmmmm...:hmm: Sounds like fun.

[Seminole]

:hmm: As long as I have been reading threads on Subsim ...this one I think deserves an award... just for what I can't say...

[Rockin Robbins]

It's called brain damage. For some obscure reason involving a defective brain I didn't catch on that he was using auto targeting. But he gave me a great idea for a new tutorial video, because auto targeters never get any attention with how-tos.

I know just about all the wrinkles in manual targeting but I'm not an expert on automatic targeting. I'll just have to brush up on what works and what doesn't. That means that I not only have to explain what does work, but what doesn't and why, with demonstration. Should be fun.

It stands to reason that what I posted before: turning PK on and off doesn't reset anything should work out the same way for manual targeting. But that's just logic, which fails the reality test about half the time.

These are computers we're working on, not submarines. It is entirely possible that the same button behaves in two completely different and wacky ways depending on whether manual targeting is on or off.

[Captain Vlad]

Never had that problem with auto-targetting unless I forgot to 'lock on' to the ship before I fired or if I had been locked on, then lost the lock and fired.

What kind of weather conditions has this been occuring in? Is it dark enough that you lose your lock/visual every few seconds?

[Fearless]

Originally Posted by Captain Vlad

Never had that problem with auto-targetting unless I forgot to 'lock on' to the ship before I fired or if I had been locked on, then lost the lock and fired.

What kind of weather conditions has this been occuring in? Is it dark enough that you lose your lock/visual every few seconds?

Perfect conditions. All that the torpedos do after they've been fired is do a sharp turn to the left irrespective what I do with locking and the supposed resetting of the TDC.

[Captain Vlad]

Okay, this is just a wild-ass guess, but try this: Lock onto the target with the 'L' button. Do not hit a single button on the TDC...PK, dials, anything.

I think what's happening is you're somehow overriding the data the auto-target sends to the TDC when you turn on the PK after a lock.

[Zero Niner]

Fearless
I can't explain the strange behaviour of your torpedoes, but like you I use auto targeting. Trying to figure out all the parameters needed for a manual solution is just too much hassle, I'm not as "hard core" as some others. Let me give you my understanding of how it all works and my experience with SH4.

The only time I really use the PK is when I'm manoeuvering submerged to get into position. What it does is that it gives me a real time "update" on the target's course, bearing and position relative to me via the attack map. However the information remains valid only if the ship does not change course or speed, so every once in a while I pop my scope up, find the target, turn off then turn on the PK again to refresh the data and update the firing solution.

The only situation when the PK has screwed up my firing solution is when I forget to turn it off before firing. You may know this already, but if the PK is left on then all the data the TDC needs to generate the firing solution is taken from the PK. Your scope could be pointing to a different ship or even 180 deg around but it makes no difference. If the target has not altered course or speed then there shouldn't be any problems, but there are times, like firing on a second ship, when I find my torps are headed for the 1st target and then I realise that the PK is still on .

Now, if the PK is turned off, the TDC gets its information from wherever your scope is pointed and continously updates the firing solution. That's how I spread my shots along the length of the ship. If the target is locked, then all shots will be aimed at the centre where the triangle is. In other words locking the target forces the scope to be locked in position relative to the centre of the ship, hence all firing soultions generated will be for shots hitting the centre of the ship.

Hope this is of some help.

[Zero Niner]

:hmm:
Something in Capt Vlad's post made me think of something. At the risk of sounding condescending, you did turn on the PK *after* locking the ship, right?

Let me explain - before you lock, the TDC info is set according to wherever your scope is pointing. Once you lock, the TDC has one final set of info taken from the ship you were looking at the moment you locked, which it continuously updates, and when you turn on the PK (which is really a predictor, really), the PK uses that info from the TDC to continue to update the firing solution even though your scope is now looking somewhere else.

[Zero Niner]

:hmm: :hmm:
The torpedo swinging off to the left suggests to me that the TDC is not capturing data correctly. If I bring up the attack map without a target designated, the line that show's the torp's current track is also off to the left (or was it to the right?) by almost 90 deg.

[Fearless]

Originally Posted by Zero Niner

:hmm:
Something in Capt Vlad's post made me think of something. At the risk of sounding condescending, you did turn on the PK *after* locking the ship, right?

Let me explain - before you lock, the TDC info is set according to wherever your scope is pointing. Once you lock, the TDC has one final set of info taken from the ship you were looking at the moment you locked, which it continuously updates, and when you turn on the PK (which is really a predictor, really), the PK uses that info from the TDC to continue to update the firing solution even though your scope is now looking somewhere else.

Thanks Zero Niner for the well described method. Yes, I turn on PK after locking the target so it begs the question whether the previous locked ship remained in the TDC instead of the new locked target when I turned the PK on.