Clinton: "We Just Have to Slow Down Our Economy" to Fight Global Warming

Skybird · 01-31-08, 05:41 PM

Let's keep it in relation.

The USSR did it's part to sometimes counter American first efforts, sometimes moving ahead and triggering America to counter Soviet first efforts (remember, the cold war was carried out by TWO opponents, and regarding nuclear technology many firsts in weapons were developed and fielded by america first, not russia, which often more or less reacted to SSBNs, ICBMs, MIRVs, Kennedy's monumental nuclear arms program).

Penelope probably did not refer to such an obvious crisis like Cuba, but to the fact that many Americans almost go hysteric when Communism is mentioned. Heck, america already goes crazy when some body is mentioning "social" (not to mention "socialism", which is even something different). This antipathic hype concerning the class enemy of capitalism, communism that is, gave us not only worries about nukes on Cuba - but McCarthy's witch hunt as well. And today's massive undermining of basic rights in the name of security and countering terror, shares quite some similiarities to MyCarthy's paranoia in the meaning of going beyond what is reasonable and helptful, and demanding total control for the purpose of itself - not just for countering communist traitors, or terrorists.

And this forum itself has seen a lot of fury about terms like communism and socialism as well, so... leave it in perspective, guys.

and silentrunner, AVGwarhawk, , do you really thinkm the US navy did not conduct subamrine exercises offshore of Russia, and carried out other acts regarding Russia that you would not be shy to list here if it would have been the russian doing it with regard to America? the cold war was a game of mutual cold agressions. It was not just russia violating america's security interests, and it was not that America never responded on equal terms. In fact, many first steps were beeing taken by america, not Russia. Stop being blind on one eye.

Regarding the NATO expansion right up to russian borders of today, opposite to the deals and promises that were given to them before and that the Russian trusted into (a betrayal by NATO for which they see themselves paying a high price now, and thus they are so angry at NATO), and regarding the planned missile sites in Poland and the Czech Republik, america is continuing the cold war game right until today - and then is lamenting over the logical and angry reactions and chnages in Russian policies. When you feel tempted to ventilate about how Putin could dare to do like he does, and to confront the West and give no more cheap presents, do not forget that this is in direct reaction to NATO's behavior of the past 15 years, and the broken promises in these years. Putin once was totally commited to the idea to bring Russia closer to europe, he is a great admirer of Alexander the Great and wanted to continue where alexander had to stop. It's just that the West showed him that such good will would be deliberately exploited for selfish Western interests. what is it wonder then if now he uses the same kind of behavior agaimst the West, not wanting to see his country getting exploited once again?

01-31-08, 05:41 PM	#16
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 42,707 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	Let's keep it in relation. The USSR did it's part to sometimes counter American first efforts, sometimes moving ahead and triggering America to counter Soviet first efforts (remember, the cold war was carried out by TWO opponents, and regarding nuclear technology many firsts in weapons were developed and fielded by america first, not russia, which often more or less reacted to SSBNs, ICBMs, MIRVs, Kennedy's monumental nuclear arms program). Penelope probably did not refer to such an obvious crisis like Cuba, but to the fact that many Americans almost go hysteric when Communism is mentioned. Heck, america already goes crazy when some body is mentioning "social" (not to mention "socialism", which is even something different). This antipathic hype concerning the class enemy of capitalism, communism that is, gave us not only worries about nukes on Cuba - but McCarthy's witch hunt as well. And today's massive undermining of basic rights in the name of security and countering terror, shares quite some similiarities to MyCarthy's paranoia in the meaning of going beyond what is reasonable and helptful, and demanding total control for the purpose of itself - not just for countering communist traitors, or terrorists. And this forum itself has seen a lot of fury about terms like communism and socialism as well, so... leave it in perspective, guys. and silentrunner, AVGwarhawk, , do you really thinkm the US navy did not conduct subamrine exercises offshore of Russia, and carried out other acts regarding Russia that you would not be shy to list here if it would have been the russian doing it with regard to America? the cold war was a game of mutual cold agressions. It was not just russia violating america's security interests, and it was not that America never responded on equal terms. In fact, many first steps were beeing taken by america, not Russia. Stop being blind on one eye. Regarding the NATO expansion right up to russian borders of today, opposite to the deals and promises that were given to them before and that the Russian trusted into (a betrayal by NATO for which they see themselves paying a high price now, and thus they are so angry at NATO), and regarding the planned missile sites in Poland and the Czech Republik, america is continuing the cold war game right until today - and then is lamenting over the logical and angry reactions and chnages in Russian policies. When you feel tempted to ventilate about how Putin could dare to do like he does, and to confront the West and give no more cheap presents, do not forget that this is in direct reaction to NATO's behavior of the past 15 years, and the broken promises in these years. Putin once was totally commited to the idea to bring Russia closer to europe, he is a great admirer of Alexander the Great and wanted to continue where alexander had to stop. It's just that the West showed him that such good will would be deliberately exploited for selfish Western interests. what is it wonder then if now he uses the same kind of behavior agaimst the West, not wanting to see his country getting exploited once again? __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert.