%$#@*^!@!!!!

[Angus89]

Btw, you mentioned LBO. It is included in Row. Might be a conflict there. Or just save you loading redundant files.

[DavyJonesFootlocker]

Yep, using Row Pitch and Roll mod. Somebody help! Damn waves stalling my sub! Talk about going nowhere fast! Think I'll take off LBO as mentioned above. The Row mod replaced some things from it. No kidding the waves are high enough to cover the whole boat.

[Angus89]

Just a small addition, but you are in a submarine. Dive below the storm as they did in reality. Storms also will wreak havoc on your fuel consumption.

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by Angus89

Just a small addition, but you are in a submarine. Dive below the storm as they did in reality. Storms also will wreak havoc on your fuel consumption.

From what I read, they road them out on the surface. I do not remember the reason.

[Nuc]

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

From what I read, they road them out on the surface. I do not remember the reason.

I don't think there was a hard and fast rule but the CO had to consider the ship's saftey. If there was a need to resurface before the weather cleared it was a risky operation. You can't see or hear if you are coming up under something. The boat is unstable and a severe roll or pitch could realese the high pressure air being blown in to the main ballast tanks allowing them to reflood and depleating the air banks for another try.

[DavyJonesFootlocker]

Well, Pv I think I have a right to complain. I bought this sim with hard-earned money. Not to complain means suffocating consumer's rights. Perhaps it's a fault of mine and I screwed up the mods order of installation. Take it back or I'll sic my chihuaua on you!

Ahem, anyway I loaded up all ROW files, then TM then RSRDC for TM then all the rest. The boat isn't that unstable anymore. Submerging may be fine but what if you're low on fuel? Not an option but to stay and fight the waves. My pet peeve is that the engines cut off when the props get airbourne and you can heear the powerplant wheezing. The speed goes from 5-3 knots at times.

[joea]

Originally Posted by DavyJonesFootlocker

My pet peeve is that the engines cut off when the props get airbourne and you can heear the powerplant wheezing. The speed goes from 5-3 knots at times.

How do you know it didn't happen to the real skippers? :hmm: Not the engines cutting off but the speed going down, a lot.

[SteamWake]

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

From what I read, they road them out on the surface. I do not remember the reason.

I was going to post "What the heck are you doing on the surface in this kind of sea state".

Now Im wondering... Ive always just dived when the seas were too rough and sleep through the storm at a few knots.

Wonder what the reason for taking a pounding like that is.

[seafarer]

Yeah, page 172 of the Fleet Tyle Submarine online mentions in the General Surface Operations, part B: Ship Handling

Possible hull distortion, and damage to bow tube shutters, diving planes, superstructure, and bridge strongly indicate that the submarine should not be pounded into heavy seas unless absolutely necessary.

Of course, it does not specifically say to dive...

[-Pv-]

"My pet peeve is that the engines cut off when the props get airbourne and you can heear the powerplant wheezing. The speed goes from 5-3 knots at times"

This is what's REALLY happening...

When the boat is at the bottom of a 20ft trough and the water barely covers your keel, the waves are towering over you, the sim considers that surfaced at 20+ ft depth. When you have waves crashing over the bridge and your bridge is covered, the sim considers that surfaced at @15ft depth.
The mystery of why the boyancy model reversers its sense of depth when the waves reach a certain hight is something CODED into the game. That's the flaw we've been living with for nearly a year now.

At times you may even get 24-27 ft excursions. When that happens, your boat temporarily transitions to electric power and back again. This takes time. You lose speed between each of these transitions. I really doubt you are hearing the engine/screws freewheeling because they are out of the water. To the sim, they are never out of the water because your boat never has less than a 14 foot draft (just watch the text readout of the depth in the lower right corner and you'll see what I'm talking about. It shows maximum depth when your boat is out of the water, and mimimum depth when your boat is nearly submerged.

The visual effect of the bottom of the boat being out of the water is cosmetic only. What you are hearing (if anything) is the switch between diesle and electric power. The next text/verbal call is something like 40 ft (I think) so you aren't made aware of the engine switch when too much water is over the bridge (which occurs at something close to 26 ft. on a fleet boat.)

Although you will travel less distance, submerging in rough weather using 2 knots will ultimately use less fuel than slugging it out on the surface switching propulsion constantly. Another clue is to watch your deck crew from the Crew Management screen. If they are blinking on and off the deck frequently, you should consider changing your mode of travel. Even though the boyancy model dosn't know what the depth of the water graphics engine is, the crew knows what the effective depth of the sub is for governing their behavior.

The technique I use is to do 2 knots submerged until battery is 1/2 then surface at 1/3 to recharge (this charges at the fastest possible rate and keeps my low battery exposure time to a minimum.) If I'm in enemy control areas, I only recharge at night so I won't get forced back down on a low battery.

Game design flaw or not, it's what we have. The boyancy model is coded into the game and anything the modders do that I've seen is cosmetic and so miniscule compared to the stock game as to be nearly indistinguishable to me. To the game engine, you are surfaced with your props in the water all the time. If the waves are high enough, you temporarily transition to electric power and back again to diesle. The engines shut off between each of these transitions.

Yelling at people to fix stuff is not going to get it fixed because everone has their own gripe. If UBI worked on everyone's gripe they would finish patching it to the next level in 2020. This particular boyancy behaviour has been in place through four patches now.
-Pv-

[DavyJonesFootlocker]

I wasn't yelling at anyone, just voicing my frustration. Good explanation. This is the negative part of games. Companies rush out half-baked games with bugs and the consumer pays high prices for them (at least down here). It isn't fair. Would one buy a new car with a set of flaws? I think not. Then why should video games be any different? Yes, they send out patches, but what if one has no internet connection? He has to either access one or pay to have one- an additional expense unfair to the buyer. One could argue, well don't buy any games, but I do enjoy games. SH4 survived I believe due to the modders who kept the game afloat (no pun intended). There are some really obvious flaws they haven't addressed yet:

1. The ocean movement in relation to the boat;
2. The dynamic wind direction in relation to national flags on ships;
3. Unrealistic aircraft characteristics;

Some may find I'm complaining and I know there's no 'perfect' game. But I do think I or any consumer has a right to do so. But you have to agree that at least the flaws mentioned above should've been addressed at least. I heard of an add-on so maybe it may be fixed. Let's hope.

[AVGWarhawk]

Here is the next headache and this really sucks. Some of the mods were found to have a letter capitalized in the file name. When JSGME looks to return the original file to it's stock place after deactivation, it does not move it as it is looking for the replacement with the same name. With the capital letter, JSGME will not return the file. Therefore it is lost. At least his is how it was explained in a thread a few weeks back. Therefore, I would (you do not have to) delete the entire game and make sure all files and folders are gone. Fresh install of game and mods. Just get the ROW files only. The new scene.dat file from Kriller will just be an addon. Do out at end of week he is hoping. Load, activate and you are set. It is up to you how you want to handle that.

[DrBeast]

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

Here is the next headache and this really sucks. Some of the mods were found to have a letter capitalized in the file name. When JSGME looks to return the original file to it's stock place after deactivation, it does not move it as it is looking for the replacement with the same name. With the capital letter, JSGME will not return the file. Therefore it is lost. At least his is how it was explained in a thread a few weeks back.

Yes, I still remember that blunder I had made. I had discovered this in an older version of JSGME, whereas there was a newer one out that took care of this (which I thought I had) Latest JSGME disregards upper/lower case and replaces/backups files properly.

ETA: Interesting topic title, DavyJonesFootlocker...very uh...descriptive :rotfl:

[-Pv-]

DJFL is getting a reputation as a complainer in my book. The cursing as the next level does not surprise me. 15m/sec is the maximum wind speed the game will produce which when sustained long enough WILL produce the maximum wave height of 20 ft. Ride it out surfaced or submerged. Just be glad your boat doesn't react the way real boats do in that weather and your crew so sick they are only 50% effective. Be glad you're not kissing the ocean as you rock back and forth and the ocean is not pouring into the hatch.
Be glad you can still use the deck gun in 15 winds and 20ft waves because UBI got so much flack in SH3 they stablised the boyancy model so you can do whatever you want all the time.
-Pv-

[Angus89]

Just a small addition, but you are in a submarine. Dive below the storm as they did in reality. Storms also will wreak havoc on your fuel consumption.