[WIP] Psuedo Narwhal class Fleet boat

[Archie]

Porpoise, porpoise, porpoise, there you go Duci, three more votes

[Digital_Trucker]

Originally Posted by Ducimus

Porpoise 2
Sargo 0


Vote dammit.

Porpoise, dammit!:rotfl:

[leovampire]

And can do 9 knt's submerged. How is that for an answer?!

I love my Sargo but those are the only 2 laking thing's I wish it had.

[Ducimus]

Porpoise 5
Sargo 1


I can't make up my mind personally - hence my asking in poll fashion. Overall i think i like the Sargo more, but then, ive ALWAYS liked that model. If i could get rid of the tubes 7 and 8, id use it. But... porpoise seems a tad fatter, and its almost the same length as the sargo.

[WilhelmSchulz.]

I have to say Sargo. I know ill lose but I would give it 1 more week then switch to P-Class.

[Ducimus]

Was just thinking, I might make two versions, and let ppl use whichever one they want. I was trying to avoid that so i can focus on just one, but... the sargo version is 80% done already, whipping up a P-class version while its fresh in my mind won't take me long at all. Regardless of version, some files are interchangeable.

edit:
however, that said, when i intergrate this into Tmaru, ill have to make a choice. I can only have one narwhal in the main mod, not two different versions.

[DeepSix]

I don't know how much of this you already know (probably all of it). Porpoise is slightly farther back on the evolutionary chain than Sargo. The second batch of V-class boats (Argonaut, Narwhal and Nautilus) was produced in the late 1920s and led directly to the experiment with Dolphin; that, in turn, led to Cachalot and Cuttlefish, they led to the P-class around 1933, and soon after that the Salmon class was introduced (which included Sargo).

Argonaut was purpose-built as a minelayer; neither Narwhal nor Nautilus was ever able to maintain their 17-knot specified surfaced speed, and submerged they could just barely top 6.

Argonaut, Narwhal and Nautilus - 370-380 feet long, displ. 2,700 tons. 180,000 gallons.
P-class (Porpoise) - 300 feet/1,300 tons. 90,000 gal.
Salmon (Sargo) - 308 feet/1,450 tons. 110,000 gal.

So one's a little longer, one's a little heavier. One could make a case for Sargo since it's got slightly more range and the V-boats had lots o' that. On the other hand, I'm not sure which one dived faster or turned tighter. Bottom line, I don't really think it matters which one you use since it's a stand-in. I'll vote Sargo, but really I'm just looking forward to having a V-boat mod!

[Edit: Just saw your last post. If Sargo is that much done, I'd just stick with that (sorry to the Porpoise voters)]

[Ducimus]

Fuel, and diving times i can modded to be accurate if i use renamed dat files instead of just inheirting them. While displacement can modded as well, its a case of, "how does this change the physics of this model, for good or bad?".

[Ducimus]

The usual research.
Notes to self:


Displacement: 2,730 tons (surfaced); 3,960 tons (submerged)
Speed: 17 knots (surfaced); 8-1/2 knots (submerged)
Range: 25,000 miles
Torpedoes: 4-21" torpedo tubes (bow), 2-21" torpedo tubes (stern)
source: http://www.fleetsubmarine.com/narwhal-class.html


Displacement: 2730 tons surfaced, 4050 tons submerged
Speed: 17 knots (31 km/h) surfaced, 8 knots (15 km/h) submerged
Range: N/a
Torpedoes: six 21-inch (53cm) torpedo tubes (four forward, two aft; 24 torpedoes); 2 x 6 in (152 mm)/53 caliber guns, 2 x0.30" (7.62 mm) machineguns
Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Narwhal_(SS-167)


Displacement: 2730 (surfaced); 3960 (submerged)
Speed: Surfaced, 17.4, Submerged 8.5
Range: 18,000 miles at 8 knots
Torpedoes: 2 6-inch/53 Mk15 deck guns, 6 21-inch torpedo tubes (4 fwd, 2 aft), 4 external 21-inch torpedo tubes (2 fwd, 2 aft); 1942
source: http://www.globalsecurity.org/milita...-167-specs.htm


Displacement: Surfaced: 2,730 t., Submerged: 3,960
Speed: Surfaced 17 kts, Submerged 8 kts
Range: Fuel Capacity, 182,778 gal
Torpedoes: four 21" torpedo tubes forward, two 21" torpedo tubes aft, four 21" torpedo tubes topside, 24 torpedoes; two single 6"/53 deck gun, two 30 cal. mgs
source: http://www.navsource.org/archives/08/08167a.htm

[Peto]

I doubt this is possible but it would be cool if it would get Special Missions as pretty much a default. After the Argonaut was sunk by destroyers, Nautlis and Narwhal were pretty much regulated to moving troops etc.

Since the sargo is what you've been working with I'd recommend just going with that (reversing my earlier vote). It really doesn't matter as much to me as I disable external view.

Salute!

[Ducimus]

>>I doubt this is possible but it would be cool if it would get Special Missions as pretty much a default.

Located in Tmaru's support directory, is one of my repeat patrol fixes that has more special ops in it. Look closely at that, and you'll see that half my work is already done in this regard So yes, i can fix it to where all you do, is commando/spy drops or photo ops. Lifeguard will take more finageling though.

[Peto]

I'd leave the lifeguarding out. These boats didn't do that/were too clumsy. And it means less finageling for you !

[Ducimus]

Sargo model is functioning, and as so far error free. Half of this modding, is just setting up the missions.

Right now i have it to where, the only mission you'll get, is supply drops, spy insertions, and commando drops. Thats it. The missions rotate every 2 months. With alternating assigments to Pearl harbor command areas, and Fremantle command areas, with 1 commando insertion at Attu. So you'll be a regular globe trotter. The boat is stationed only in pearl at the moment. This is a test, im not going to flesh it out for the entire game just yet.

Physics wise, its behaving, pretty damn cool. Ive adjusted the fuel capacity to 25,000 NM @ 10 kts, lowered the top speed to 17, lowered floodrate, and adjusted displacement values to what was historically correct.. and.. the boat is behaving beautiflly, and noticeably different. As a nice side effect of lowering the top speed and upping the displacement, "ahead standard" comes out to be exactly 10 kts. 1/3rd comes out to be about 7 kts, and is still the most fuel effiecient setting.

Not releasing it yet. I want to backtrack, and create a 2nd version for the porpoise, then release both versions at the same time.

Im feeling pretty good about this.

[Ducimus]

Known issues:
1.) Game crash's when selecting sargo or porpoise in the museum.
I beleive this is because the game is loading duplicate nodes. The game reads nodes, regardless of where the node is stored (in dat files). This is proably why each and every node for a submarine, is uniquely named. In normal play, since the game only loads one player useable submarine, its not an issue. However, in any scenario where the game tries to load duplicate nodes (such as the Museum), it will probably crash. I imagine, in a multiplayer game if someone runs a narwhal, and another player runs a porpoise or Sargo (depending on which version of this mod they use), the game will probably crash.

2.) ideal Persiscope depth height changes for the sargo model. This is because of 3d modeling issues with the periscopes, load an early war, then load a late war, and watch how the periscopes behave. Nothign i can do to fix this. The end result ,is if your playing late war, you could probably lower the periscope height in the cfg to 18 meters.

3.) Inability to player control both deck guns. This is a User interface issue that cannot be resolved by modding. The game has a "cycle flak gun" functionalty. This functionalty does not exist for deck guns, since the game, being derived from SH3, doesnt normally expect multiple deckguns from the player.

Possible issues:

a.) Huge save game file size. Ive tested this once so far, by running a boat from pearl to empire waters, saving several times, and the file size only got to be about 1 meg. So its likely this wierd behavior won't happen, but its something im watching for, and hoping it never crops up.

b.) Porpoise model, i feel could probably use some minor physics tweaks, but its in the ball park.

c.) could possible tune down the engine power by a value of 1,000 on both versions.


Yes i know:

- Models are not the real narwhal. Just in case theres a captain obvious in the crowd. Note the title of this work in progress.... "psuedo".

- Sargo model has two, too many torpedo tubes. I did however reduce the total torpedo count to the historical 20 as a consolation prize.

- Porpoise version seems to rock a little more.

- Deck guns are not 6"50's., nor do the power of the shells reflect it. However, i garuntee you'll sink stuff alot faster with two 4'50's then with just 1.

- You can't select any deckguns except the narwhal version. I did this on purpose.

- Patrol assigments arent to historical areas where narwhal boats where, when they where there.... yeah yeah, this is a test. You do however get an assigment to Attu in jan 43.


What is implemented:

- Psuedo narwhal class boat, based on Porpoise or Sargo model.

- Narwhal is currently only available at pearl harbor.

- Patrols assigned alternate between fremantle command areas, and pearl harbor command areas. You'll be going all over the damn theater Captain globetrotter!

- All assigned patrol assigments should be one of the following: Insert spy, insert commando, deliver supplies. Repeat patrol fix in place, flotilla file used was the 3 month rotation file with two possible patrol areas. (Tmaru default). Patrol assigments for the narwhal however , are on a 2 month rotation with only 1 patrol area in that time period.


- Values used on Sargo and Plcass models:
Surface displacement of 2730
submerged displacement of 3960
top speed reduced to 17
Range increased to 25,000 NM @ 10 kts
ManBT_Flood_speed reduced from 35,000 to 26,000

- Additional values used on just the Pclass version

increased surface draft from 0 to 4.4 (zero draft?! WTF)

increased engine power from Pclass default to 6140 (sargo default)

increased submerged endurance from 64 @ 4 to 84@4, idea being to match the performance of the sargo varient. however there maybe a problem with this if the Pclass uses a different battery or energy consumption rate hidden somewhere.


installation
- whatever your doing in JSGME, enable this last

D/L links: - Pick your poision.

Psuedo Narwhal, using the P-class as model:
http://www.ducimus.net/sh4/release/W...PModel_ver1.7z

Pseudo Narwhal using the Sargo class as a model:
http://www.ducimus.net/sh4/release/W...oModel_ver1.7z




have fun, and let me know if you run into some form of buggery that im not aware of.

[elanaiba]

I think even with all the hacks I can easily remove the two extra tubes if you want me to, Ducimus

I mean they will still be there visually, just not working/available in interface.