Obama’s Path From Critic to Overseer of Spying

[Wolferz]

Originally Posted by Ducimus

Personally, I didn't even bother to listen to Obama. There really is no point. You know when he's lying if his lips are moving.

I was however, watching user commentary on the major news sources following his speech and thankfully, it doesn't look like too many are being fooled by the Liar N Chief anymore. Maybe there's hope yet for this nation.

It makes you thankful that presidents are limited to two terms.

[Oberon]

Originally Posted by Wolferz

It makes you thankful that presidents are limited to two terms.

And this makes a difference, how?

Originally Posted by Oberon

And this makes a difference, how?

It makes the difference of them not caring about anything
relating to re election during their second term.
In the first term they have to maintain the pretence of doing good stuff, or just hope that their opponents run a complete muppet as a candidate

[Dread Knot]

Looking at his rather morose demeanor, I do wonder if our current president doesn't have a calendar tucked away in some back office of the White house, where he's frantically marking off the days until he's free at last to pursue a more lucrative and less stressful career, play golf and bask in the Hawaiian sun.

To enjoy the job of being an American president anymore, it seems you either have to be a political masochist or have an acute Messiah complex. Neither portends well for the future.

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by Ducimus

Personally, I didn't even bother to listen to Obama. There really is no point. You know when he's lying if his lips are moving.

An old joke usually used to refer to all politicians, and all lawyers. Considered funny because of its truth.

Originally Posted by Wolferz

It makes you thankful that presidents are limited to two terms.

Originally Posted by Oberon

And this makes a difference, how?

Originally Posted by Tribesman

It makes the difference of them not caring about anything
relating to re election during their second term.

Actually it makes a difference because the time in which we have to listen to his horrible lies is limited. All to soon we can elect someone who claims to be completely different, so we can listen to his horrible lies for awhile.

Originally Posted by Dread Knot

To enjoy the job of being an American president anymore, it seems you either have to be a political masochist or have an acute Messiah complex. Neither portends well for the future.

That's nothing new. It's my understanding that most ex-presidents have said they wouldn't wish the job on their worst enemy.

[Oberon]

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

Actually it makes a difference because the time in which we have to listen to his horrible lies is limited. All to soon we can elect someone who claims to be completely different, so we can listen to his horrible lies for awhile.

I stand corrected.

I do ponder though, Skybirdian daydreams aside, what the solution for modern politics could be, a realistic and plausible one, not the usual kneejerk 'hang them all' or 'ban them if they say they want to be a politician'.
And furthermore, who is to blame? The politicians for saying what they think we want to hear, or us for only wanting to hear what we want to hear?

[Wolferz]

Let us sit and talk of cabbages and kings.

At least something good can be made of a cabbage.

[Oberon]

Originally Posted by Tribesman

It makes the difference of them not caring about anything
relating to re election during their second term.
In the first term they have to maintain the pretence of doing good stuff, or just hope that their opponents run a complete muppet as a candidate

That's true, but the overall mood of the posting seems to indicate that some people are under the impression that come 2016 things will change. I think they may be in for a disappointment no matter who wins.

Originally Posted by Oberon

That's true, but the overall mood of the posting seems to indicate that some people are under the impression that come 2016 things will change. I think they may be in for a disappointment no matter who wins.

Well that's just the latest dose of a recurring fantasy hopey changey election situation some people already got sold in '12 and '08, though of course they only followed on from those of the election before that, who followed on from the election before, who followed on.....

But this time it is going to be different, honestly, I heard it from a politician

[Ducimus]

Originally Posted by Wolferz

It makes you thankful that presidents are limited to two terms.

Now if we can only get the same limitation imposed upon congress.

[Wolferz]

Originally Posted by Ducimus

Now if we can only get the same limitation imposed upon congress.

I agree. We need to stop giving these people lifetime paid vacations in DC.

[Platapus]

Originally Posted by Ducimus

Now if we can only get the same limitation imposed upon congress.

They already have it. 2 years for Representatives and 6 years for Senators, unless the citizens of the respective states use their constitutional authority and re-elect them.

We may not agree with the decisions of the voting public, but I really don't want to place more restrictions on our dwindling civil rights.

Realize that the term "term limitations" really means that the government is telling the citizens who they can and can't vote for in an election. Is this really what we want?

A better solution is to educate the citizens so that they make informed decisions when it comes to voting. It is not an easy solution, but one I believe is the best.

Term limitations for congress sounds attractive as a short term solution, but I fear that it may be a cure worse than the disease.

What we really want is term limitations for those members we don't like, but no term limitations for those members we do like.

I don't like term limitations for the president, but I understand the historical and practical differences between a president and a member of congress.

Given the choice of one or the other, I would rather eliminate term limitations for elected positions.

[Ducimus]

Originally Posted by Platapus

They already have it. 2 years for Representatives and 6 years for Senators, unless the citizens of the respective states use their constitutional authority and re-elect them.

If they are still electable then there is no real term limit is there?

We may not agree with the decisions of the voting public, but I really don't want to place more restrictions on our dwindling civil rights.

Career politicians are one reason why our civil rights are dwindling.

Realize that the term "term limitations" really means that the government is telling the citizens who they can and can't vote for in an election. Is this really what we want?

I don't see it that way. Term limitations exist to limit or reduce power and corruption in the government. There is something inherently wrong when one can say that presidents come and go, but some congressman are always there. It's a good ole boys club on capital hill, and many times, they act in a way that is summarized as "I know what's best for you". That in my view, is dictatorial.

A better solution is to educate the citizens so that they make informed decisions when it comes to voting. It is not an easy solution, but one I believe is the best.

That is part of the solution, but not "the" solution. Sometimes I don't know what is worse, the politicians, or the idiots who elected them.

Term limitations for congress sounds attractive as a short term solution, but I fear that it may be a cure worse than the disease.

I strongly disagree here. Term limits are part of a long term solution to put the government back in control of "We the people", in this fast fading constitutional republic. We need to irraticate the truth that we have the best government money can buy, and getting rid of career Politicans is part of that solution. We do not need the situation where public officials can be bought and paid for in order to maintain power of office; which coincidentally makes voting, more often then not, illusionary.

What we really want is term limitations for those members we don't like, but no term limitations for those members we do like.

Can't do that without having a double standard. I think one standard will do, besides, resting our well being on the shoulders of an aging politician sounds like a very bad idea to me.

I don't like term limitations for the president, but I understand the historical and practical differences between a president and a member of congress.

Speaking of historical contexts of No term limits, "President for life" or "Congressman for life" is no different then "Dictator for life". Power corrupts, its a truth as sure as we are human.

Given the choice of one or the other, I would rather eliminate term limitations for elected positions.

I think you'd be trying to put a fire out with gasoline by doing so. We need congressional term limits, and we needed them yesterday. We don't need anymore Feinstien's or McCain's.

[Platapus]

I don't see how having "amateur" members of congress will automatically be an improvement.

If a congresscritter knows he or she only has short time in office, what is to prevent them from just doing what will benefit them in the short term and then leave the problems to the next "amateur"?

It is not the length of the term/terms that is the problem. The problem is the person.

[Ducimus]

Originally Posted by Platapus

I don't see how having "amateur" members of congress will automatically be an improvement.

If a congresscritter knows he or she only has short time in office, what is to prevent them from just doing what will benefit them in the short term and then leave the problems to the next "amateur"?

It is not the length of the term/terms that is the problem. The problem is the person.

I would say that it is partially because of the length of terms and near unlimited time to hold the power of office, is one reason why we get the people we do in office. I've heard all the "amature" and "continuity" arguments before and I am unconvinced. I would give senator's like Feinstien as a great example why. The power someone like her wields through committee is frightening, and she or someone like her is at the center of our dwindling civil rights and liberties. Furthermore, the longer someone is part of the washington club, the more locked in to party politiics and ideology they seem to become.

Overall, all arguments considered, I think a maximum of 4 two year terms for a Representative, and a maximum of 2 six year terms for a Senator, is quite reasonable.