Encountering ships with pre-existing damage.

in_vino_vomitus · 07-30-13, 04:38 AM

Made first contact with a convoy in OM. and noticed that there appeared to be ships in it with fires. I thought it was a nice touch. I'm told that you can't spawn ships with pre-existing damage, so I'm now wondering if that's actually what I saw. As luck would have it, I managed to get some screenshots. The smoke looks different and there's a faint orange dot, that could be fire, although it's not visible through the binocs. I didn't see any damaged ships once I was in amongst the convoy, but I was submerged and it was a big convoy. They could have been there without me seeing them.

The real bummer was that I didn't save after attacking [or during] and the game crashed on my way home through the Dover Straits, so I ended up going back to a previous position and I never saw this bunch again

Anyway, here are the screenshots. To me they look like ships are on fire, but I concede it's far from conclusive - What do people think?

fireftr18 · 07-30-13, 09:54 AM

It does look like ships can be on fire. I would say that the smoke is from the smoke stacks and the glow is a searchlight from a destroyer.

07-30-13, 01:29 PM

ships don't spawn with damage but they can receive damage when spawned if they are too close to something.

I have even seen ships spawn on top of each other or land or even a dock and cause one to sink as a result.

ships do sink with different damage so I think some ships are spawned "weaker" then normal but I have never seen one spawn with visible damage

in_vino_vomitus · 07-30-13, 01:36 PM

Well - that could be the case with the smoke, but whatever else the orange dots were, I'd say there was no way they were searchlights - But the smoke seems different in density from the trails from the smokestacks. I shall definitely be looking out for confirmation if I ever see this again....

BrucePartington · 07-30-13, 09:41 PM

I know I may not be adding anything to really clarify this mystery.
But FWIW, I have come across damaged ships in convoys, more than once. Some with flames and smoke and/or w/ decks awash.
Only in one instance it made sense to me, since before getting any closer to the convoy, my lookouts spotted allied aircraft flying over, and later on red plumes were spotted on the ocean, towards which I ordered Ahead Flank.
Such sightings have been rare though.

in_vino_vomitus · 07-31-13, 04:52 AM

It goes some way towards convincing me I don't have an overactive imagination - I mean I do, but it's nice to know it might not be fabricating this. - The first time I saw dense smoke coming from a ship in a convoy, just over the horizon, I thought it was an authentic touch. then, someone who knows, said that you can't spawn ships with damage and, to be honest, that makes sense. Then I saw the convoy in the screenshots below, and it really doesn't look like smoke from funnels. Also it turns out that ships can get damaged by other things that players don't control. So now I'm wondering if the damaged ships in convoys are there because somebody thought it would add to the realism, or if it's just an accidental feature of the way that the convoys are spawned.

Either way it's a nice touch....

TorpX · 07-31-13, 10:59 PM

I hadn't thought of it before, but it's possible they could also be damaged when their convoy takes a zig and they bump into each other. I don't know how likely that is, but it is possible.

Armistead · 07-31-13, 11:11 PM

Any damaged ships would have to happen after they spawn in your contact zone. Either they ran into each other or hit by US planes, etc. However, I have seen rare bugs where ships are damaged.

Cybermat47 · 07-31-13, 11:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Armistead

Either they ran into each other or hit by US planes, etc.

Why would US planes attack British ships? Is this a glitch of some kind?

Admiral Halsey · 08-01-13, 12:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cybermat47

Why would US planes attack British ships? Is this a glitch of some kind?

No they would be German planes.

Bubblehead1980 · 08-01-13, 03:05 AM

Most of the time, it's prob from a spawn bug or a collision while you were closing.I was recently in luzon straits in 1944 and moving ahead one afternoon to attack a convoy, a convoy from the north came into radar range, they were going to come awful close, in fact, both had about 12 ships each(large by IJN) standards.I closed and soon saw them running into one another, one small merchant was rammed by a large tanker, it caught fire and went down.Checked the nav map, there was a sunken ship icon.

I have also seen a heavy cruiser run over a small escort before and slice it in two.I've seen collisions cause damage and fire but not a sinking.Unseen attacks is also possible.I know for a fact in the solomons where I put PT boats patroling at nights, they use their guns to shoot up the small japanese ships, when i arrive on scene some are on fire. Translate this over to the ATO, there are many likely causes.Enemy action is possible but more than likely from collisions etc

in_vino_vomitus · 08-01-13, 03:48 AM

It's interesting to me on a couple of levels. The game is pretty immersive anyway, and so seeing smoking ships in a convoy, my first thought was a difficult one to verbalise. When you hear e.g. gunfire from another company's patch, there's a feeling of connection. Your teammates are at work out there somewhere - anyway, I had a flash of that when I saw the smoke, and then I thought about having that feeling in response to pixels in a game, and I grinned and thought it was a clever touch on the part of the modder. After reading the replies here, I'm wondering if it's not an emergent phenomenon - an unintended consequence of a complex simulation, and it's interesting how that gets woven into the storyline that we create for the game we're playing - I mean, I do that and I'm assuming at least one other person does....

The last person to fire me said, on more than one occasion that I think too much about things. He may have had a point

merc4ulfate · 08-04-13, 05:02 PM

nein nein nein

This has to do with the sea state. Ships can be damaged by sea states and I have seen this a lot off shore of England with the UBoat Add on. Most of the time, if not all of them, I have seen this the sea state is extremely rough.

Even during a surface attack I am constantly be submerged and have to run back and forth from below decks to top side for firing or using the deck gun. The ships have sustained damaged due to the extremely rough sea, especially in shallow water. This also makes them quite vulnerable to single torpedo sinking ... which I take full advantage of.

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in_vino_vomitus · 08-04-13, 07:10 PM

That's a very good point - Have just come across another convoy and this time got right in the middle of it - one tanker was definitely burning and the sea was pretty rough............

grislyatoms · 08-04-13, 11:47 PM

Approaching ports (Iwo, Chichi?, and Haha? Jima for example) at night I have seen ships at dock. Drop periscope to plan attack, raise periscope again and...

fires on the beach, ships sunk at their moorings. Space of a few minutes.
Always puzzled over that.

07-30-13, 04:38 AM	#1
in_vino_vomitus XO Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Preston, Lancs, UK Posts: 418 Downloads: 137 Uploads: 0	Encountering ships with pre-existing damage. Made first contact with a convoy in OM. and noticed that there appeared to be ships in it with fires. I thought it was a nice touch. I'm told that you can't spawn ships with pre-existing damage, so I'm now wondering if that's actually what I saw. As luck would have it, I managed to get some screenshots. The smoke looks different and there's a faint orange dot, that could be fire, although it's not visible through the binocs. I didn't see any damaged ships once I was in amongst the convoy, but I was submerged and it was a big convoy. They could have been there without me seeing them. The real bummer was that I didn't save after attacking [or during] and the game crashed on my way home through the Dover Straits, so I ended up going back to a previous position and I never saw this bunch again Anyway, here are the screenshots. To me they look like ships are on fire, but I concede it's far from conclusive - What do people think? __________________ Forget death - I'll take dishonour! [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] TMO 2.5 1.5 Optical Targeting Correction 031312 for TMO 2.5 1.5 OTC Realistic Scopes for TMO TheDarkWraith_DC_Water_Disturbance_v2_0_SH4 Improved Stock environment v3_TMO&RFB TMO_Alt_engine-sounds TMO_Alternate_JS_Radar_performance TMO17_19_different_smoke

07-30-13, 09:54 AM	#2
fireftr18 Ocean Warrior Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Kentucky Posts: 2,528 Downloads: 77 Uploads: 0	It does look like ships can be on fire. I would say that the smoke is from the smoke stacks and the glow is a searchlight from a destroyer. __________________ Of all the forms of Martial Arts, Karaoke causes the most pain!

07-30-13, 01:36 PM	#4
in_vino_vomitus XO Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Preston, Lancs, UK Posts: 418 Downloads: 137 Uploads: 0	Well - that could be the case with the smoke, but whatever else the orange dots were, I'd say there was no way they were searchlights - But the smoke seems different in density from the trails from the smokestacks. I shall definitely be looking out for confirmation if I ever see this again.... __________________ Forget death - I'll take dishonour! [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] TMO 2.5 1.5 Optical Targeting Correction 031312 for TMO 2.5 1.5 OTC Realistic Scopes for TMO TheDarkWraith_DC_Water_Disturbance_v2_0_SH4 Improved Stock environment v3_TMO&RFB TMO_Alt_engine-sounds TMO_Alternate_JS_Radar_performance TMO17_19_different_smoke

07-31-13, 04:52 AM	#6
in_vino_vomitus XO Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Preston, Lancs, UK Posts: 418 Downloads: 137 Uploads: 0	It goes some way towards convincing me I don't have an overactive imagination - I mean I do, but it's nice to know it might not be fabricating this. - The first time I saw dense smoke coming from a ship in a convoy, just over the horizon, I thought it was an authentic touch. then, someone who knows, said that you can't spawn ships with damage and, to be honest, that makes sense. Then I saw the convoy in the screenshots below, and it really doesn't look like smoke from funnels. Also it turns out that ships can get damaged by other things that players don't control. So now I'm wondering if the damaged ships in convoys are there because somebody thought it would add to the realism, or if it's just an accidental feature of the way that the convoys are spawned. Either way it's a nice touch.... __________________ Forget death - I'll take dishonour! [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] TMO 2.5 1.5 Optical Targeting Correction 031312 for TMO 2.5 1.5 OTC Realistic Scopes for TMO TheDarkWraith_DC_Water_Disturbance_v2_0_SH4 Improved Stock environment v3_TMO&RFB TMO_Alt_engine-sounds TMO_Alternate_JS_Radar_performance TMO17_19_different_smoke

07-31-13, 11:11 PM	#8
Armistead Rear Admiral Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: on the Dan Posts: 10,880 Downloads: 364 Uploads: 0	Any damaged ships would have to happen after they spawn in your contact zone. Either they ran into each other or hit by US planes, etc. However, I have seen rare bugs where ships are damaged. __________________ You see my dog don't like people laughing. He gets the crazy idea you're laughing at him. Now if you apologize like I know you're going to, I might convince him that you really didn't mean it.

07-30-13, 01:29 PM	#3
Webster Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	ships don't spawn with damage but they can receive damage when spawned if they are too close to something. I have even seen ships spawn on top of each other or land or even a dock and cause one to sink as a result. ships do sink with different damage so I think some ships are spawned "weaker" then normal but I have never seen one spawn with visible damage

07-30-13, 09:41 PM	#5
BrucePartington XO Join Date: May 2013 Location: KM AM99 Posts: 405 Downloads: 33 Uploads: 0	I know I may not be adding anything to really clarify this mystery. But FWIW, I have come across damaged ships in convoys, more than once. Some with flames and smoke and/or w/ decks awash. Only in one instance it made sense to me, since before getting any closer to the convoy, my lookouts spotted allied aircraft flying over, and later on red plumes were spotted on the ocean, towards which I ordered Ahead Flank. Such sightings have been rare though.

07-31-13, 10:59 PM	#7
TorpX Silent Hunter Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 3,975 Downloads: 153 Uploads: 11	I hadn't thought of it before, but it's possible they could also be damaged when their convoy takes a zig and they bump into each other. I don't know how likely that is, but it is possible.

08-01-13, 03:05 AM	#11
Bubblehead1980 Navy Seal Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Florida USA Posts: 7,107 Downloads: 605 Uploads: 44	Most of the time, it's prob from a spawn bug or a collision while you were closing.I was recently in luzon straits in 1944 and moving ahead one afternoon to attack a convoy, a convoy from the north came into radar range, they were going to come awful close, in fact, both had about 12 ships each(large by IJN) standards.I closed and soon saw them running into one another, one small merchant was rammed by a large tanker, it caught fire and went down.Checked the nav map, there was a sunken ship icon. I have also seen a heavy cruiser run over a small escort before and slice it in two.I've seen collisions cause damage and fire but not a sinking.Unseen attacks is also possible.I know for a fact in the solomons where I put PT boats patroling at nights, they use their guns to shoot up the small japanese ships, when i arrive on scene some are on fire. Translate this over to the ATO, there are many likely causes.Enemy action is possible but more than likely from collisions etc Last edited by Bubblehead1980; 08-04-13 at 06:55 PM.

08-01-13, 03:48 AM	#12
in_vino_vomitus XO Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Preston, Lancs, UK Posts: 418 Downloads: 137 Uploads: 0	It's interesting to me on a couple of levels. The game is pretty immersive anyway, and so seeing smoking ships in a convoy, my first thought was a difficult one to verbalise. When you hear e.g. gunfire from another company's patch, there's a feeling of connection. Your teammates are at work out there somewhere - anyway, I had a flash of that when I saw the smoke, and then I thought about having that feeling in response to pixels in a game, and I grinned and thought it was a clever touch on the part of the modder. After reading the replies here, I'm wondering if it's not an emergent phenomenon - an unintended consequence of a complex simulation, and it's interesting how that gets woven into the storyline that we create for the game we're playing - I mean, I do that and I'm assuming at least one other person does.... The last person to fire me said, on more than one occasion that I think too much about things. He may have had a point __________________ Forget death - I'll take dishonour! [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] TMO 2.5 1.5 Optical Targeting Correction 031312 for TMO 2.5 1.5 OTC Realistic Scopes for TMO TheDarkWraith_DC_Water_Disturbance_v2_0_SH4 Improved Stock environment v3_TMO&RFB TMO_Alt_engine-sounds TMO_Alternate_JS_Radar_performance TMO17_19_different_smoke

08-04-13, 05:02 PM	#13
merc4ulfate DILLIGAF Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: florida Posts: 2,058 Downloads: 210 Uploads: 0	nein nein nein This has to do with the sea state. Ships can be damaged by sea states and I have seen this a lot off shore of England with the UBoat Add on. Most of the time, if not all of them, I have seen this the sea state is extremely rough. Even during a surface attack I am constantly be submerged and have to run back and forth from below decks to top side for firing or using the deck gun. The ships have sustained damaged due to the extremely rough sea, especially in shallow water. This also makes them quite vulnerable to single torpedo sinking ... which I take full advantage of. Generic Mod Enabler - v2.6.0.157 OpsMonsun_V705 OMv705_to_V720 OMv720_Patch5 OMEGU_v300 OMEGU_v300_Patch7 OM_Med_Env OM_Harder_Escort_L2 UBM Missions Popular German Music From The 30´s

08-04-13, 07:10 PM	#14
in_vino_vomitus XO Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Preston, Lancs, UK Posts: 418 Downloads: 137 Uploads: 0	That's a very good point - Have just come across another convoy and this time got right in the middle of it - one tanker was definitely burning and the sea was pretty rough............ __________________ Forget death - I'll take dishonour! [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] TMO 2.5 1.5 Optical Targeting Correction 031312 for TMO 2.5 1.5 OTC Realistic Scopes for TMO TheDarkWraith_DC_Water_Disturbance_v2_0_SH4 Improved Stock environment v3_TMO&RFB TMO_Alt_engine-sounds TMO_Alternate_JS_Radar_performance TMO17_19_different_smoke

08-04-13, 11:47 PM	#15
grislyatoms Medic Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 169 Downloads: 31 Uploads: 0	Approaching ports (Iwo, Chichi?, and Haha? Jima for example) at night I have seen ships at dock. Drop periscope to plan attack, raise periscope again and... fires on the beach, ships sunk at their moorings. Space of a few minutes. Always puzzled over that. __________________ "Na Männer...alles klar?"