What 'Lincoln' misses and another Civil War film gets right

Hottentot · 01-09-13, 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

A first-generation slave like Kunta Kinte would certainly have welcomed the opportunity to be reunited with friends and family in his home village.

On the other hand many slaves were fourth-generation or more, and knew nothing of Africa at all, except for oral and musical folk traditions.

That, plus seeing how the slaves were taken from many different locations in Africa by huge numbers, returning them all to where they came from would have been a pretty huge operation logistically, especially back then. Furthermore, it might have been tricky, in some cases impossible, to determine exactly where each slave came from. Just asking them would not have done it.

Sailor Steve · 01-09-13, 02:00 PM

Good point! I can see it now:

"We want to take you home. Where are you from?"

"Mberte village."

"Where is that?"

"By the Mberte River."

"Where is that?"

"It flows from the Gerhale Mountains."

"And where are they?"

"Where the Gerhale people live."

"Dear Mr Secretary; I think I see some problems with this plan."

Jimbuna · 01-09-13, 04:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

Good point! I can see it now:

"We want to take you home. Where are you from?"

"Mberte village."

"Where is that?"

"By the Mberte River."

"Where is that?"

"It flows from the Gerhale Mountains."

"And where are they?"

"Where the Gerhale people live."

"Dear Mr Secretary; I think I see some problems with this plan."

LOL....but true

August · 01-09-13, 04:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hottentot

That, plus seeing how the slaves were taken from many different locations in Africa by huge numbers, returning them all to where they came from would have been a pretty huge operation logistically, especially back then. Furthermore, it might have been tricky, in some cases impossible, to determine exactly where each slave came from. Just asking them would not have done it.

I don't believe that was the proposal. What Lincoln envisioned I think was creating a new country in Africa that would be peopled by former slaves.

01-09-13, 04:27 PM

Quote:

I've always enjoyed reading about Lee's military record, but this is the first time I've read about his views concerning slaves. The article has several references to letters he wrote explaining his thoughts on the subject.

Don't forget that Lee had an uncle that was involved in the ACS and the settlement of Liberia, which was also something Lincoln was involved in 20 years before the south had a thing about "taxes"

AVGWarhawk · 01-09-13, 04:29 PM

I find the Grimke sisters more interesting concerning this subject.

Penguin · 01-09-13, 06:38 PM

The ACS is a good point to Neal's question why the resettlement idea is seen in a negative light today.

What makes the ACS pretty interesting is that is was not a heterogene club. On the one hand there where those folks who didn't want freedmen living in their land for mostly racist reasons, one the other hand those with good intentions. Well, we know what's paved with it.

In hindsight we know that Liberia didn't work out too well. One reason is tribalism, as those people who settled there were not native to this area, the other is that the guys from America formed an elite themselves and were not to keen sharing their power.

Platapus · 01-09-13, 08:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by August

I don't believe that was the proposal. What Lincoln envisioned I think was creating a new country in Africa that would be peopled by former slaves.

I think we tried that with Liberia in the 1820's. Of course that experiment did not work out quite as well as some wished.

Sailor Steve · 01-09-13, 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by August

I don't believe that was the proposal. What Lincoln envisioned I think was creating a new country in Africa that would be peopled by former slaves.

My fault for forgetting. Since 1820 there was already Liberia.

August · 01-09-13, 11:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

My fault for forgetting. Since 1820 there was already Liberia.

Ok so not so new.

Hottentot · 01-10-13, 12:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by August

I don't believe that was the proposal. What Lincoln envisioned I think was creating a new country in Africa that would be peopled by former slaves.

That's like taking a piece of land, throwing a bunch of Finns, Romanians and Spaniards there and saying "be people now!"

Oh wait, that has been tried already. It's called the EU.

Penguin · 01-10-13, 02:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hottentot

That's like taking a piece of land, throwing a bunch of Finns, Romanians and Spaniards there and saying "be people now!"

Oh wait, that has been tried already. It's called the EU.

No, it's the exact opposite. The former slaves had rights after the country was founded, we had them before.

No get off my lawn you dirty Finn or I'll call Europol!

I am sick of you people who ride on rendeers on our Autobahn, and do nothing for Europe besides producing undestroyable Nokia phones, ridiculously hot women and weird music. And your saunas contribute to global warming!

Hottentot · 01-10-13, 09:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Penguin

No get off my lawn you dirty Finn or I'll call Europol!

Duh, you know the Europol is too busy investigating the speeding offences on your Autobahns to care.

Quote:

I am sick of you people who ride on rendeers on our Autobahn

It's the Sami who ride the reindeers, you silly ethnocentric escargot eater.

Quote:

and do nothing for Europe besides producing undestroyable Nokia phones

Get on with the program, Nokia is Japanese. I read it in the Internuts, so it must be true and our media trying to tell us otherwise is a lie!

Quote:

ridiculously hot women

Beg to differ.

Quote:

and weird music.

I'll have you know, our have long traditions and the nonsense words are not a bug but a feature. Stop oppressing my culture or I'll tell a mod!

Quote:

And your saunas contribute to global warming!

Yeah, but they also contribute on decreasing the world population by natural selection.

nikimcbee · 01-10-13, 07:55 PM

Quote:

Beg to differ.

aka "The Ferret Krusher."

Cybermat47 · 01-10-13, 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nikimcbee

aka "The Ferret Krusher."

IT BURNS!

01-09-13, 02:00 PM	#2
Sailor Steve Eternal Patrol Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: High in the mountains of Utah Posts: 50,369 Downloads: 745 Uploads: 249	Good point! I can see it now: "We want to take you home. Where are you from?" "Mberte village." "Where is that?" "By the Mberte River." "Where is that?" "It flows from the Gerhale Mountains." "And where are they?" "Where the Gerhale people live." "Dear Mr Secretary; I think I see some problems with this plan." __________________ “Never do anything you can't take back.” —Rocky Russo

01-09-13, 04:29 PM	#6
AVGWarhawk Lucky Jack Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: In a 1954 Buick. Posts: 28,253 Downloads: 90 Uploads: 0	I find the Grimke sisters more interesting concerning this subject. __________________ “You're painfully alive in a drugged and dying culture.” ― Richard Yates, Revolutionary Road

01-09-13, 06:38 PM	#7
Penguin Ocean Warrior Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Rheinische Republik Posts: 3,322 Downloads: 92 Uploads: 0	The ACS is a good point to Neal's question why the resettlement idea is seen in a negative light today. What makes the ACS pretty interesting is that is was not a heterogene club. On the one hand there where those folks who didn't want freedmen living in their land for mostly racist reasons, one the other hand those with good intentions. Well, we know what's paved with it. In hindsight we know that Liberia didn't work out too well. One reason is tribalism, as those people who settled there were not native to this area, the other is that the guys from America formed an elite themselves and were not to keen sharing their power.