NCAA Come Down Hard On Penn State

kraznyi_oktjabr · 07-23-12, 11:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NBC News

Sanctions include $60 million fine, 4 -year bowl ban, vacating wins from 1998-2011

ARTICLE

Last updated: 23 July 2012 at 10:53 EST

Takeda Shingen · 07-23-12, 12:57 PM

I thought they should have shut down the program, but still good on the NCAA. Cutting the 'scholarships' (as if those were in any way related to scholarly activities) is pretty much like a de facto shutdown, and they've already got most of their big-name players jumping ship, so I am pleased. Paterno is now #12 on the official all-time winning list and his statue is gone. Penn State can clean house and move forward.

Stealhead · 07-23-12, 04:47 PM

What amazes me are the Penn State fans that still idolize Paterno even though we all know that the man lacked any shred of integrity.

August · 07-23-12, 08:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stealhead

...even though we all know that the man lacked any shred of integrity.

Do we know that? I'm no Penn state fan and i'm not excusing anyone's role in this sordid affair but maybe there is good reason for those many fans feeling like they do. I don't think it's just about school pride.

Stealhead · 07-23-12, 09:00 PM

Uh yes we do know that the man lacked integrity;

"Sandusky, a former member of Paterno's coaching staff, was found guilty in June of sexually abusing 10 boys over 15 years, sometimes on campus. An investigation commissioned by the school and released July 12 found that Paterno, who died of lung cancer in January at age 85, and three other top officials at Penn State concealed accusations against Sandusky for fear of bad publicity."

from http://sports.yahoo.com/news/attenti...35--ncaaf.html

Maybe people just refuse to accept that a person they admired was not so grand.

August · 07-23-12, 09:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stealhead

Maybe people just refuse to accept that a person they admired was not so grand.

And maybe the whole story isn't being told in this rush to judgement, at least some folks feel that way and the family in particular is mad they didn't have a chance to answer these serious charges. Now you can call it denial and maybe it is but we'll see once the dust settles from all the torn down statues and championships. He wouldn't be the first convenient scapegoat. Dead men fit that role quite well.

RickC Sniper · 07-23-12, 09:51 PM

Regardless, it was one of Paterno's coaches and it went on when he was responsible for the football program. If he knew, shame on him. If he didn't know he is still accountable.
Same as a senior officer being held responsible for a junior officer's behavior.
Or a ship running aground while the Captain sleeps. He was not steering the ship and he wasn't the navigator, but he is still held responsible.

I'm glad the sanctions on Penn State were harsh. They needed to be.

Takeda Shingen · 07-23-12, 10:11 PM

While teaching elementary school I had a student who confided to me that her grandfather was touching her. I had her come with me to see the principal and sat with her while she repeated her story to him. We both stayed in that office as we called her mother first, and the police right after that, and remained there until both entities were present and the girl was interviewed. A substitute was called in to cover my classes.

This is how you handle a sexual abuse claim. You stand up and do the right thing, and you do it right then and there. You do not pass it off to your superior the next day and then not bother to see things through. Paterno practically ran that school. Curley, Schultz and the others would have done anything he said. All he had to do was say that he wanted the police contacted right then and there, and wasn't going anywhere until they all met and told the story of what happened.. A man of integrity would have done just that.

sharkbit · 07-23-12, 10:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Takeda Shingen

While teaching elementary school I had a student who confided to me that her grandfather was touching her. I had her come with me to see the principal and sat with her while she repeated her story to him. We both stayed in that office as we called her mother first, and the police right after that, and remained there until both entities were present and the girl was interviewed. A substitute was called in to cover my classes.

This is how you handle a sexual abuse claim. You stand up and do the right thing, and you do it right then and there. You do not pass it off to your superior the next day and then not bother to see things through. Paterno practically ran that school. Curley, Schultz and the others would have done anything he said. All he had to do was say that he wanted the police contacted right then and there, and wasn't going anywhere until they all met and told the story of what happened.. A man of integrity would have done just that.

I admire your integrity sir.

mookiemookie · 07-23-12, 10:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by August

And maybe the whole story isn't being told in this rush to judgement, at least some folks feel that way and the family in particular is mad they didn't have a chance to answer these serious charges. Now you can call it denial and maybe it is but we'll see once the dust settles from all the torn down statues and championships. He wouldn't be the first convenient scapegoat. Dead men fit that role quite well.

Rush to judgement? Are you kidding? There was a YEAR LONG formal independent investigation that involved 400 people interviewed and 3.5 million documents reviewed. I hardly think that could be defined as a rush to judgement in any reasonable mind.

My only hope is that the demons in hell took a break from torturing Paterno so that he could watch the press conference today.

August · 07-23-12, 10:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mookiemookie

Rush to judgement? Are you kidding? There was a YEAR LONG formal independent investigation that involved 400 people interviewed and 3.5 million documents reviewed. I hardly think that could be defined as a rush to judgement in any reasonable mind.

My only hope is that the demons in hell took a break from torturing Paterno so that he could watch the press conference today.

Yeah whatever. I don't have a dog in this hunt is I don't particularly care but even Sanduski got a trial. Where is Paternos trial?

Stealhead · 07-24-12, 12:01 AM

Well he will never get one seeing as he died I do not think that he could have been punishable by law.Bottom line is the man was the head of a department and he was made aware of an a crime possibly committed by a former coach and person that had regular access to the team facility and a member of his staff witnessed Sanduski having anal sex with a child.Pretty serious stuff there and they pretty much did nothing Paterno was the person in charge so if they did as they did and swept it under the rug that implies that this was the attitude of the team to hide anything tarnishing such a thing is a sign of dishonesty.

Not to nit pick August but why did you post three times in this thread if "your dog in not in the hunt and you do not care"? Your first two posts seem to imply that have some interest.

Personally I think mookies statement that Paterno should rot in hell or that he is in hell is overly harsh.He made a very very poor choice at one point in his life I do not think that is worthy of going to hell.That is a rush judgment seeing as according the bible only god says who goes to hell and heaven not a mortal man.The man is dead and the things that occur on earth have no relevance to Paterno.

August · 07-24-12, 07:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stealhead

Not to nit pick August but why did you post three times in this thread if "your dog in not in the hunt and you do not care"? Your first two posts seem to imply that have some interest.

Just making conversation Stealhead. Oops, that's four times now huh? Well we have a six page thread on the use of the quote function. That ought to prove to you that we'll talk about nearly anything.

nikimcbee · 07-24-12, 08:59 AM

Now if the university of ore-gone could just get these sanctions.

nikimcbee · 07-24-12, 09:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sharkbit

I admire your integrity sir.

You're legally required to report abuse (as a teacher) or you'll be held libel.

07-23-12, 09:51 PM	#7
RickC Sniper Undetectable Join Date: Sep 1999 Location: Colorado Posts: 1,221 Downloads: 132 Uploads: 0	Regardless, it was one of Paterno's coaches and it went on when he was responsible for the football program. If he knew, shame on him. If he didn't know he is still accountable. Same as a senior officer being held responsible for a junior officer's behavior. Or a ship running aground while the Captain sleeps. He was not steering the ship and he wasn't the navigator, but he is still held responsible. I'm glad the sanctions on Penn State were harsh. They needed to be. __________________ Support Subsim http://www.subsim.com/store.html

07-24-12, 08:59 AM	#14
nikimcbee Fleet Admiral Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Patroling the Slot. Posts: 17,952 Downloads: 90 Uploads: 0	Now if the university of ore-gone could just get these sanctions. __________________

07-23-12, 12:57 PM	#2
Takeda Shingen Navy Seal Join Date: Mar 2000 Posts: 8,643 Downloads: 19 Uploads: 0	I thought they should have shut down the program, but still good on the NCAA. Cutting the 'scholarships' (as if those were in any way related to scholarly activities) is pretty much like a de facto shutdown, and they've already got most of their big-name players jumping ship, so I am pleased. Paterno is now #12 on the official all-time winning list and his statue is gone. Penn State can clean house and move forward.

07-23-12, 04:47 PM	#3
Stealhead Navy Seal Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Kentucky Posts: 5,421 Downloads: 85 Uploads: 0	What amazes me are the Penn State fans that still idolize Paterno even though we all know that the man lacked any shred of integrity.

07-23-12, 09:00 PM	#5
Stealhead Navy Seal Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Kentucky Posts: 5,421 Downloads: 85 Uploads: 0	Uh yes we do know that the man lacked integrity; "Sandusky, a former member of Paterno's coaching staff, was found guilty in June of sexually abusing 10 boys over 15 years, sometimes on campus. An investigation commissioned by the school and released July 12 found that Paterno, who died of lung cancer in January at age 85, and three other top officials at Penn State concealed accusations against Sandusky for fear of bad publicity." from http://sports.yahoo.com/news/attenti...35--ncaaf.html Maybe people just refuse to accept that a person they admired was not so grand.

07-23-12, 10:11 PM	#8
Takeda Shingen Navy Seal Join Date: Mar 2000 Posts: 8,643 Downloads: 19 Uploads: 0	While teaching elementary school I had a student who confided to me that her grandfather was touching her. I had her come with me to see the principal and sat with her while she repeated her story to him. We both stayed in that office as we called her mother first, and the police right after that, and remained there until both entities were present and the girl was interviewed. A substitute was called in to cover my classes. This is how you handle a sexual abuse claim. You stand up and do the right thing, and you do it right then and there. You do not pass it off to your superior the next day and then not bother to see things through. Paterno practically ran that school. Curley, Schultz and the others would have done anything he said. All he had to do was say that he wanted the police contacted right then and there, and wasn't going anywhere until they all met and told the story of what happened.. A man of integrity would have done just that.

07-24-12, 12:01 AM	#12
Stealhead Navy Seal Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Kentucky Posts: 5,421 Downloads: 85 Uploads: 0	Well he will never get one seeing as he died I do not think that he could have been punishable by law.Bottom line is the man was the head of a department and he was made aware of an a crime possibly committed by a former coach and person that had regular access to the team facility and a member of his staff witnessed Sanduski having anal sex with a child.Pretty serious stuff there and they pretty much did nothing Paterno was the person in charge so if they did as they did and swept it under the rug that implies that this was the attitude of the team to hide anything tarnishing such a thing is a sign of dishonesty. Not to nit pick August but why did you post three times in this thread if "your dog in not in the hunt and you do not care"? Your first two posts seem to imply that have some interest. Personally I think mookies statement that Paterno should rot in hell or that he is in hell is overly harsh.He made a very very poor choice at one point in his life I do not think that is worthy of going to hell.That is a rush judgment seeing as according the bible only god says who goes to hell and heaven not a mortal man.The man is dead and the things that occur on earth have no relevance to Paterno. Last edited by Stealhead; 07-24-12 at 12:12 AM.