How is the DW Sim working with the new 1.03 Beta patch?

[Ghost Dog]

Yeah, i'd say its a bit too slow. Submarines use thier planes to 'fly' underwater while maintaining neutral bouyancy. Most modern subs might go as much as +20/-20 degrees in angle to change depth, probably more in emergencies.

So, whats the deal? is this a game balance issue to keep us from changing depth too fast in MP games?


coming to periscope depth is becomming a pain in the a$$.

[LuftWolf]

It's almost certainly not the way now that it was intended to be.

[Fandango]

Originally Posted by Amizaur

Try to dive a sub from the surface and you'll see

But again, is it too slow for "our" tastes or is it not consistent with a a "real" behaviour?. I assume subs are not stones and I assume that even speed is important when changing depth...

P.S. Please, indicate in bold your opinions...it's difficult to tell what an opinion and what the stating of a real fact is especially if you express your opinions as if they were the ABSOLUTE truth...

[teeps]

I think Ron's post above is the answer as far as real life behaviour goes.

[stormrider_sp]

Make my depth 800ft, 0 degree down bubble!

[Sub Sailor]

My comment on changing depth is based on actual experience.
Nuke boats don't usually do the crash dive of the old WWII movies or that were real back then. We were never really on the surface that much, besides the boats true element is underwater, and it rides a heck of a lot better.
You can and do change depth quickly, read the things people have written about torpedo evasion. The present setup makes that impossible.
Also you have to be able to deploy or retrieve the Towed Arrays and the antenna just as fast for the same reason.
consider this order-all head flank, make my depth 1000 feet do not cavitate, that means you go down really fast. Right now DW can do that.

Respectfully,

Ron Banks MMCM(SS), USN(Ret)

[sonar732]

Don't forget the angles and dangles evolution Ron!

[moose1am]

Just wondering outloud here.

If you can change the size of the propeller to increase the thust in the game can you then DECREASE the size of the rudders to make the ship turn less to keep the speed up and increase the turn radius? Just wondering if you thought of this and secondly if it's possible to do in the data base. Again just thinking out loud.

Originally Posted by LuftWolf

Goldorak, I am no expert in sonar either... however, the sonar model in DW 1.01 was a very simple model that did not account for environmental conditions in precise ways, instead by only adding fixed modifiers to detection ranges, and in some cases this worked to produce the feeling of sonar operation and in some cases it didn't. The effect was to have sonar model that was very predictable. You could look at three or four simple variables and be able to detect just about any detection range for any situation, because that was essentially how the model worked: x+y-z/a=d.

However, now what we have is an actual, functional model of how sound propagates in various environmental conditions and the ways in which this effects sonar. So it is no longer possible to simply have a few pieces of information and be able to figure out exactly what will happen. Now, even if you have a lot of information, the actual game effect will be not nearly predictable in the way it was previously. In short, the game now has a sonar "model" rather than a sonar "approximation."

Mau,

I have increased the FFG acceleration by fixing its prop size to the proper diameter. The physics model still effects it the way it should, but you no longer have a weak propeller, meaning that the thresholds that slow the FFG down have been raised, so, for example in Sea State 3, you can still achieve flank, as with stock 1.03 you were only able to go about 24kts in moderate seas, which seemed too slow to me anyway for a ship such as the OHP. Also, during turns, the FFG would lose more speed than even in 1.01.

My logic for making these corrections was that since the physics engine was changed, but the database was left the same, there was no necessary connection between what was in the database and what is now in the game. I'll say that I believe it was simply an oversight by the developers and I have reported it as a "bug." So they can take care of it, or not, but the fix is very easy, so I have gone ahead and taken care of it in the Mod BETA.

In terms of the turn performance you are talking about, if you set the FFG to make a 600 to 800 yard circle, you will get the performance you describe. This has been the same since 1.01. However, when you set 25 degree rudder in DW at flank, you get a circle of about a boatlength in diameter and the speed drops to 9kts. Now, I find it very hard to believe that such a circle is possible to make at 24 kts, and what you say seems to confirm this. So, the issue here seems to be that the rudder is way too efficient in creating a turn, and the FFG decelerates because of that. However, like I said, if you set the FFG to make a 600 to 800 yard circle, you will maintain the speeds you are describing.

So I believe the issues is that the handling of the FFG has been simplied somewhat. Perhaps you can make such a tight turn in the FFG at 8-9kts, but you need to have a different real life setting than flank and 25 degrees rudder. In the game you can make a 600 to 800 yard circle at 22-24 kts, but not with the settings you would use in RL.

So you can do everything you are describing, but the in game inputs are different than what a real FFG helmsman use to make those maneovers.

I think that makes sense.

[moose1am]

Try this. Delete the game from you computer using the add remove programs in the control panel. Check the hard drive using the Explore from the right click start menu and check for any directory's that are left on your hard drive. Delete any DW directories. Check the registry with regedit and make sure that you do a system restore before you make any changes. ie back up your registry in case you screw anything up. Now look for any DW related entries in the HKEY_Local_Machine\Software registry key. Hopefully there won't be any DW keys left after you removed the game with the control panels add/remove function. But just in case the programmers didn't program the delte game to remove this item from the registry you can remove it manually.

Now do a search for any *.TMP files on your hard drive. Start-Search-All files and folders- Enter the value *.tmp in the search box and then press the enter button. Highlight all temp files found using the mouse to click and highlight one of the tmp files in the list then use Shift A to highlight all the tmp files found. Delete any and all tmp files that are found. Some may not be deleted so don't worry about them. They could be part of your firewall. ZAP won't let me detete some tmp files for that program this way.

Go to any program that is setup to start automatically on your computer at boot time. Try to disable any download accelerator programs, firewalls or virus checking software so that the next time you boot up it's not in memory.

Reboot. Check to see if any programs are running in memory. If so shut them down using the tast manager. Ctrl Alt Det ONE TIME ONLY to open the task manager.

Now go and redownload the patch from a safe download site. The reason for this is that sometimes if you have a virus checking program, firewall or other software running when you download a file it can corrupt the file download. By shutting down all the running applications before you download the file you eliminate this problem.

Now install the DW game from the Game CD. Reboot. Make sure that all if off. ie shut down any programs that turned on after the reboot.

Now install the newly downloaded patch 1.03. Reboot.

Now you should be good to go.

The reboots are important so don't skip them.


I learned these procedures a few years ago when I was a member of the microsoft gaming zone. The Zone Sysops drilled this into my head. I have downloaded so many games over the years and patchs that I have learned to take my time and install them properly the first time. Even if it takes a bit longer it can help insure that you get a good install the first time.

Remember that program A running on your windows systsem has no idea that program B may want to use some of program A's memory when it's installs. So why take a chance to ruin program B's install by keeping A in memory?

Originally Posted by Fandango

I've installed Patch 1.03BETA from a FRESH reinstall of DW and I get version 1.00 in the starting screen. I believe SCS will change that number when the official version of the patch will be out... :hmm:

[Fandango]

Originally Posted by moose1am

I solved my problem: my hard disk is divided in two parts (C: and D and the patch was installing on disk C: while the game is installed disk D:...

[Deathblow]

Love the new accelerations.

One bug I noticed in my official test run of the patch was that a sailboat was partial submerged, with only a portion of its sail out of the water, and was streaming ahead at a odd angle to the bow.

Anyone else confirm or refute this bug?

ps) Is there an offical 1.03beta bug thread?

[LuftWolf]

In moderately high seas, that can happen to sailboats and other very small craft.

I've seen that sort of stuff fairly commonly in all DW versions.

[Sub Sailor]

Sonar I had forgotten, dam they were fun. We all use to really enjoy them. Ah the good old days. They were one of the first things we do when leaving on deployment, you would sure find out if you had everthing stowed. Also who could take the biggest angle without spilling your coffe.

Thanks for the memories shipmate


Ron Banks MMCM(SS), USN(Ret)

[MaHuJa]

I don't think they had yet tested the ffg when they released the beta patch. Among the things that's screwed over completely, is TMA.

AutoTMA seems to have all targets locked at 10 knots, 10000 yards. There is no lock option for speed in the tma screen, and the range is off.

Once the tma plot is cleared, manually or reaching the edge on auto, the tma won't accept new lines from contacts existing before then. You have to drop and reassign.

[Mau]

That is pretty bad then.

I am playing mainly with the FFG.
Won't install the 1.03b then

Please SCS, fix this!!
Anybody else noticed that

LF, you saw the same thing with your 3.0 Mod on top of this Beta 1.03?