Neo-Nazis Reportedly Take Over East German Village

[Growler]

Vielen dank, Kongo. I was under the impression that anything that could even remotely be associated with Hitlerian Nazism was verboten. Clearly, I was mistaken - I appreciate your help!

[Skybird]

Neonazism and antisemitism is on the rise again in Germany, as is left extremism too. Especially in Eastern Germany, there are more thna just Jarmel, more villages and small towns, where Neonazis have taken over control, even have become the dominant political faction town withz shares of around one third, and I seem to remember that in some very few villages they even have the support of a majority of local villagers, but this I quote from memory and am not totally certain that it does not fool me.

Crime associated with right extremism still has the edge over crime associated with lkeft extremism, but the balance is shifting rapidly. Last year, right-winged crime has been found to decvline a little bit, while leftist crime has doubled.

With many areas especially in the East being disconnected from any economic perspective and sopcial developement for a diversity of reasons, the East is a strong breeding ground for extremism. Nazism, Leftism/Communism and Islamism are the three dominating representatives of this trend. the onme thing they all have in common is a strong anti-Israel and anti-USA bias and a strong antisemitic sentiment.

[Schroeder]

Originally Posted by Growler

Vielen dank, Kongo. I was under the impression that anything that could even remotely be associated with Hitlerian Nazism was verboten. Clearly, I was mistaken - I appreciate your help!

It is. They always have to watch their words and symbols they use. It's a balance between freedom of speech and protection against the Nazi ideology.

[Growler]

Originally Posted by Schroeder

It is. They always have to watch their words and symbols they use. It's a balance between freedom of speech and protection against the Nazi ideology.

Can you explore this further for me, Schroeder? Are the guys being called NeoNazi flagrantly violating the law, or using a legal hole to avoid prosecution? I would think that any resurgence of something approximating "power" in the hands of people like this would be cracked down upon very swiftly, yet it appears not to be the case.

[Schroeder]

As I said, it's a difficult act of balancing. As long as they don't use swastikas and keep their rhetoric free of direct Nazi propaganda there is nothing the law can do against them. That's the downside of freedom of speech. They still do have the same view of the world as the original Nazis but have to hide it behind nicer words and other symbols as the original Nazis. They always try to get as close to the border of what's legal and sound as much as the "originals" as possible without violating laws. Sometimes however they do cross the line and that's when they can be prosecuted. For example for inciting hatred against minorities, glorifying / denying the holocaust (they should really finally make up their minds about that... ), direct praise for nazi leaders etc.

[Growler]

Originally Posted by Schroeder

As I said, it's a difficult act of balancing. As long as they don't use swastikas and keep their rhetoric free of direct Nazi propaganda there is nothing the law can do against them. That's the downside of freedom of speech. They still do have the same view of the world as the original Nazis but have to hide it behind nicer words and other symbols as the original Nazis. They always try to get as close to the border of what's legal and sound as much as the "originals" as possible without violating laws. Sometimes however they do cross the line and that's when they can be prosecuted. For example for inciting hatred against minorities, glorifying / denying the holocaust (they should really finally make up their minds about that... ), direct praise for nazi leaders etc.

Ok, I think I follow. Same thing as here in the states with groups like the KKK - we KNOW you're a bunch of basic thugs, but you've yet to actually cross the line to thuggery, so we have to let you be. And when a member of your group DOES cross, we'll treat that member as the lawbreaker, rather than the group as a whole.

Germany needs to open its society and allow those whose opinions diverge from the usual. What is the fear? That they get trampled again? Don't forget the Mouse that Roared.

[Gerald]

Originally Posted by The Third Man

Germany needs to open its society and allow those whose opinions diverge from the usual. What is the fear? That they get trampled again? Don't forget the Mouse that Roared.

Germany is an open country like many other west countries, and every country has its defects just like humans

[Schroeder]

Originally Posted by Growler

Ok, I think I follow. Same thing as here in the states with groups like the KKK - we KNOW you're a bunch of basic thugs, but you've yet to actually cross the line to thuggery, so we have to let you be. And when a member of your group DOES cross, we'll treat that member as the lawbreaker, rather than the group as a whole.

That sums it up perfectly.

[Growler]

Originally Posted by Schroeder

That sums it up perfectly.

As much as I am grateful for our freedoms, sometimes it feels like a rotten way to do business. Nothing like letting the hate build up and fester just because they know how to avert legal catastrophe - then the hate boils over and it's too hard to contain.

But, truth be told, I guess, I would rather deal with it this way than have any dissenting opinion at all squashed by authoritarian governments.

Thanks, Schroeder and Kongo both, for the opportunity to learn a little more.