Obama: spineless

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by Platapus

Where are they pretending that they don't do it themselves?

Tacit acceptance. Side D calls side R names. When side R calls side D names, side D screams "name-calling!" Accusing someone of doing something implies you don't do it yourself. It works for both sides.

[Platapus]

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

Tacit acceptance. Side D calls side R names. When side R calls side D names, side D screams "name-calling!" Accusing someone of doing something implies you don't do it yourself. It works for both sides.

Sorry, your inference is not logical.

Accusing someone of doing something does not mean that you are claiming you don't do it. The two really don't have any causality relationship (or even much of a correlation relationship). An accusation, itself, does not reduce any uncertainty in the hypothesis that the accuser is equally guilty of the same action being accused.

Accusing someone of "A" may or may not indicate that you are also doing "A". The accusation does not influence the hypothesis. Without other information, it is simply unknown.

Politics is full of examples of people accusing others while doing the same thing themselves. The logical term is Tu quoque fallacy.

But you have the right to your inferences. But an inference is not a fact. However you have not demonstrated that any politician (from either side) has ever "pretend[ed] they don't do it themselves." which was the question I had for your post.

If you can find such a citation, I will gladly recognize your inference as being valid and humbly admit I was wrong. I do not claim to be all-knowing about every single quote from a politician.

[Growler]

Plat, the party in power doesn't always need to resort to name calling, since they're in power. That's my interpretation of Steve's remarks, anyway.

The Dems screamed like scalded cats when Bush II was in power, just like the Republicans did when Clinton I was in power. You didn't hear much from the other side because it was in power and didn't need to yell to make changes.

[Platapus]

Originally Posted by Growler

You didn't hear much from the other side because it was in power and didn't need to yell to make changes.

I disagree. During the Bush Administration there was name calling from both sides. I remember name calling from both sides during the Clinton Administration.

In reading my political history books, there was name calling even in Washington's time.

I don't see any correlation between name calling and which party is the majority.

[Growler]

Oh, I'm not saying it wasn't there; I was only providing my interpretation of Steve's comments.

In my experience, the party in power tends to make less noise than the one that isn't; wait four-to-eight years for the power to shift, and notice that, during that time, as one side wanes, they get louder as they get weaker. It's cyclic. The Dems are falling out of favor, so they're making more noise.

It wasn't Democrats that made Rush Limbaugh popular in the Clinton 90's, just like it wasn't Republicans that did the same for Olbermann in the Bush 00's.

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by Platapus

Sorry, your inference is not logical.

Accusing someone of doing something does not mean that you are claiming you don't do it.

I think it is. Of course I was influenced by my older daughter. When she was four or so we used to babysit the children of friends. One day when we had several over I noticed that Bethany and her friend JK were sitting on the couch throwing little rubber balls at the opposite wall. I told them at least once to stop, and when I saw them doing it again I went into the living room. JK had just thrown his ball, and he froze in apparent terror. Bethany quickly dropped hers and said "JK was throwing balls inside."

I let him off with a warning, but made her sit in the corner for awhile, then tried to explain to her that tacitly lying is still lying. Accusing him of doing it was implying that she didn't, which of course was a lie couched in the truth.

That's how I see this. When GR said "and the dems say republicans apply labels to people ", it was with the same idea. If I accuse you of doing something wrong, and I do it myself, I'm either trying to divert attention away from myself or trying to convince people that you are the bad guy and I'm the hero, who never does anything wrong.

But of course that's my perception, and I'm hardly an authority on these things.

[August]

Both sides engage in name calling.

It just seems lopsided at times because the side that is presently in power doesn't have as much opportunity to criticize their opponent and when they do it can easily sound hypocritical.