Report: Israel attacks flotilla, 10 die

[Dowly]

Originally Posted by GoldenRivet

Im waiting to go to work... so every day life is on hold.

ie... i got nothing better to do than sit here and laugh at the inability of others to respond to simple questions.

even when they get a multiple choice !!!

Rgr that!

[GoldenRivet]

well on that note i'm outta here, but ill be checking back later to see if we managed to get anywhere.

$100 on "no"

"Eyewitness accounts from ships raided by Israeli commandos have cast doubt on Israel's version of events that led to the deaths of at least 10 people."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/world/mid...t/10208027.stm

Bit of a cluster****, eh?

[pipin]

Originally Posted by Molon Labe

When you're at war, you can do a lot of things that would otherwise be illegal. Like fly into another state's airspace and drop bombs on their territory.

A blockade in international waters is an act of war. Usually, that's a reason for calling it illegitimate. Except when there is already a war on.

Here lies the problem... right! it's an act of war! the problem is that it's agaist Turkey... a NATO member and a formal ally

Remember the Lousitania...

[Bilge_Rat]

Originally Posted by OneToughHerring

"Eyewitness accounts from ships raided by Israeli commandos have cast doubt on Israel's version of events that led to the deaths of at least 10 people."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/world/mid...t/10208027.stm

Bit of a cluster****, eh?

hmmm, lets see, "eye-witness testimony" of an interested party or actual video of the attack which we have all seen?

man, what a difficult choice!

Originally Posted by Bilge_Rat

hmmm, lets see, "eye-witness testimony" of an interested party or actual video of the attack which we have all seen?

man, what a difficult choice!

I'm sure you don't need anything to be convinced of the fact that Israel can do no wrong, and that the lives lost were worthless.

[Dowly]

Originally Posted by OneToughHerring

"Eyewitness accounts from ships raided by Israeli commandos have cast doubt on Israel's version of events that led to the deaths of at least 10 people."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/world/mid...t/10208027.stm

Bit of a cluster****, eh?

You can just watch the video on top of the article and see that what is written below the vid is BS. 2 and a half wooden sticks? Rrrright.

Furthermore, there's a video floating around with aftermath footage of metal rods lying around aswell as somekind of homemade slingshots.

And lastly, they say they were going to Gaza, inside the blockade zone. That's like pleading guilty in court, now isn't it.

They had plenty of warnings to not go there, they didn't listen and people died. They can only blame themselves of what happened.

[Schroeder]

Originally Posted by Foxtrot

This is the version of Israelis. The folks who were on ship they had white flags weaving.

Perhaps time to read from unbiased sources?


I would trust on the Israeli version. They already screw up their reputation after forging passports in Dubai. (what happened to those so-called "investigations" by the way?)

http://www.democracynow.org/2010/6/1...i_armed_attack

Did you notice that the video was cut when the first Israeli soldier boarded the ship, right before he was clubbed down? This isn't exactly what I call unbiased.
Did you see any white flag while the soldiers landed aboard the ship? I did not but maybe they were just not captured on film, however do you start clubbing away on boarding soldiers after having set a white flag? If someone rises a white flag and then starts attacking isn't that regarded as illegal as well?
The reporter claimed that shots could still be heard even though a white flag was raised. So? Rising a white flag is a sign of surrender. If you rise it you signal that you give up. If you give a sign that you surrender but actually keep fighting then your white flag has the same meaning as a piece of toilet paper.
I love it how they are trying to hide behind the white flag as if rising it is enough. No, you also have to stop fighting to give any meaning to a white flag.

You might call the Israeli side propaganda or biased (and it surely is) but your link is so blatantly biased as well that I don't consider this to be any proof.
Why did they cut the video when the first soldier boards the ship just before he gets attacked? Why don't they show how one of the Israeli soldiers was thrown over the railing on a lower deck? Because they are pushing their agenda and aren't interested in showing you the truth!
Not that the Israeli side would be either, but from the videos I've seen so far it seems clear that the activists started the violence and are now crying that they had a white flag.

[Cambaz]

Originally Posted by Skybird

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7...896611,00.html

Also, "help" organisation Free Gaza, which is asscociated with this flotilla, refused to rule out that they were transporting weapons, too.

I also read about the chants of the Turkish crowds when the waved farewell to the Turkish ship leaving the Turkish harbour for Cyprus and Gaza:

"Intifada! Intifada! Intifada!
Khaybar, Khaybar, oh Jews!
The army of Muhammad is coming upon you!”

Aid organisation, yeah sure. Peace activists, they say - useful idiots, I say.

Turkey since longer time now has lined up with rogue states like Syria and Iran, and tries to sharpen its profile within a coalition of Islamic and Palestinian terror organsiation, heading them and rivalling with Iran in trying to influence them. It's for no reason that since some time now I say that Turkey is no longer a trustworthy NATO ally and that both Washington and Europe would be well-adivsed to understand that Turkey since quite some years now is our enemy, comparing to the way Pakistan also tries to betray the world while boosting and cooperating with Islamic terrorism, and djihad ambitions. I personally think that Turkey must be kicked out of NATO. It was a solid and reliable ally during the cold war, I give them that - but that was a laizistic, Kemalistic Turkey. That experimental Turkey is almolst dead now. With the fundamental religious AKP taking over, it changed drastically, making it not only a rival or opponent, but an enemy to everthing we in the West try to defend in values, culture, and what NATO was founded for.

Wow Israel attacked a natural Turkish Supply ship in international waters and killed 9 but you are saying Turkiye is guilty, Turkey suppose to keep away their ships from Gazza shouldn't sent any supply to Gazza hmm, I think this is a little awkward and sounds like a little racist my German friend you are very far away from Middle East and please go read some history first, than make comments about Turkiye and its Honorable Kemalist Military, M. Kemal ATATURK raised this nation on 1923 and we create miracles against wolds super powers UK, France, Italy, Japan and many more countries I dont give a s**** about fundemental islamist AKP but you have to know this Kemalist born Army and nation still supporting Republic, Democracy and Law let me tell you something if u are a ship owner and you are sailing in Mediterranean international waters than a group of Israeli, Trinidad Toboggan, Palestinian, Spanish marines or Navy Commandos started to board your ship without your permission what will you do ? try to defend your ship carrying your flag or watch what will happen ? please stop talking c*** about Turkiyes position in this situation and stop making propaganda against Turkish Armed Forces and Turkiye and its citizens... Turkiye is the closest Ally to Israel in Middle East but they did that because of AKP you can't say to kick of a Nation from anywhere, they did a big mistake and they will understand what they did, Turkiye don't declare war against Israel or grow a hatred against Israel like other things like Germany did when in WW II,besides Turkish diplomats were worked to save Jewish People from Germay, maybe you don't know about "Behiç Erkin" who was saved 20.000 Jewish lives form Germany, just AKP did something in its own rights but this Democratic and secularist "Nation" doesn't support any movement of AKP so please do not say Turkiye should be kicked of from NATO or any other things, making generalization only shows your low knowledge, Turkiye is secularistic and will stay secularist and democratic, its Kemalist army defend our Fatherland from anything wants to break or damage this rule...

Schroeder,

are you aware that the attack took place in international waters? And that it's legal to defend yourself, especially with non-lethal force?

[tater]

OTH, answer a simple question.

Confronted with military or police anywhere on earth while unarmed and well overpowered, under any circumstance you wish, do you cooperate with them, or attack them?


We'll take no clear answer as the "cooperate with them" that it clearly is and should be.

You cooperate, then fight the boarding in the world court.

BTW, Democracy Now! is extremely biased, that's the left equivalent of sending us to Rush Limbaugh's page as a reference for something.

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by GoldenRivet

well on that note i'm outta here, but ill be checking back later to see if we managed to get anywhere.

$100 on "no"

I'll add another $100 to that John

Originally Posted by Dowly

You can just watch the video on top of the article and see that what is written below the vid is BS. 2 and a half wooden sticks? Rrrright.

Furthermore, there's a video floating around with aftermath footage of metal rods lying around aswell as somekind of homemade slingshots.

And lastly, they say they were going to Gaza, inside the blockade zone. That's like pleading guilty in court, now isn't it.

They had plenty of warnings to not go there, they didn't listen and people died. They can only blame themselves of what happened.

Pretty much the way it was IMHO

[tater]

Originally Posted by OneToughHerring

Schroeder,

are you aware that the attack took place in international waters? And that it's legal to defend yourself, especially with non-lethal force?

The legality of self-defense doesn't matter. A guy with a gun asks you to cooperate illegally. You can legally attack him, but you are guaranteeing that someone is going to get shot. The only reason to attack is then if you WANT someone to get shot.

The appropriate response in a protest situation would have been non-violent, non-cooperation. Assuming you do not want lives lost, that is.

[SteamWake]

Originally Posted by OneToughHerring

Oh hi Steamwake, how's that oil slick - thing going? Sucessfull?

Nah they shifted from trying to find a solution to litigation.. but thats another topic.

Originally Posted by tater

OTH, answer a simple question.

Confronted with military or police anywhere on earth while unarmed and well overpowered, under any circumstance you wish, do you cooperate with them, or attack them?


We'll take no clear answer as the "cooperate with them" that it clearly is and should be.

You cooperate, then fight the boarding in the world court.

BTW, Democracy Now! is extremely biased, that's the left equivalent of sending us to Rush Limbaugh's page as a reference for something.

Anywhere on earth? I don't trust all cops, I mean there are a lot of crooked police forces on this planet.

And btw, why are you, the freedom-lovin' Ah-mu-ri-cans all of a sudden in favour of commissars coming and taking away your precious freedom? Can I send cops take away your freedom?