Bermuda Triangle

[GoldenRivet]

There have been many theories over the years about the triangle. Some of them plausible others down right insane.

You really could fill a small library with all of the printed material written just on the subject of the Bermuda triangle alone.

I think there are a lot of things we dont understand about our world, and the Bermuda triangle is just one of them. I mean... 75% of our planet is ocean... and only something like 1% of it is explored (exact figures anyone?)

That said, you sure hear a lot of strange stories and reports dating back to the days of Christopher Columbus and the ages of the tall sailing ships all the way up to the modern times with flight 19 and the other oddities.

one thing i would like to point out about the triangle:

If you take two areas of the world (we'll call them Area A and Area B, both roughly the same sized areas, both see roughly the same amount of traffic activity etc both areas have roughly the same number of lost aircraft, sunken ships and small boats and other disappearances etc.

but lets add this to the dynamic...

Area "A" has had a mystique about stories told for many many generations about strange occurrences, sightings, disappearances etc.

Area "B"... well, its just some unassuming place, like Delaware... or Nebraska

Which one are people more likely to take notice of when something like a ship or an airplane or some other craft goes missing without a trace, no distress call, no wreckage... the damn thing is just gone?

of course people are going to pay more attention to such occurrences in Area A!

however, i personally believe that something strange is going on in the triangle. Be it some sort of underwater release of gasses, or some sort of strange magnetic anomaly. Who knows. God knows i have had my share of strange experiences while piloting an airplane - nowhere physically near the triangle. Some of those experiences... had they not occurred over dry land in an area familiar to me, who knows? i might have been part of the triangle lore myself!

I dont necessarily buy the underwater UFO base garbage.

I dont buy the lost city of Atlantis' ancient power chrystal BS either.

Truth of the matter is, you have to consider that there is a massive difference between "A person" and "People"

a person - is an individual... usually quite intelligent to some degree.

People - is a grouping of individuals... the larger this group becomes, the more ignorant and gullible they are collectively.

"people" love a good mystery, even if it means they buy this UFO / abduction /ghost stuff wholesale

part of the problem we run into is the nature of the losses.

Flight 19 as an example.

you have a chain of "unknowns" which makes the whole thing a damn good mystery.

Was there malfunctioning equipment?

Was there some sort of emergency?

Did someone have a problem that required them to ditch and the rest of the flight circled thinking help was on the way?

Was some hostile force of some sort encountered?

break one link of the chain by making it a "known variable" and the mystery has a significant chance of no longer being a mystery at all.

truth is, with virtually no substantial or meaningful communications, flight 19 took off, headed out on a routine flight... and never came back.

for the most part, thats all we really know for a fact. even the navy board of inquiry basically openly said "We cant even guess what happened"

Any pilot who tells you he has never been lost is a God Damned liar.

i would rather be kicked squarely in the balls than be lost in an airplane... especially over water. The problem with flying over open water is that it all looks the same. no landmarks

if you make one error in heading, wind correction angle, Time - speed - distance computation, magnetic variation correction... anything - you run the risk of being completely and permanently lost to everything and everyone but God himself.

i believe that flight 19 is a tragedy of human error... but as yet we do not understand the circumstances which caused the loss of the entire flight, we shall continue to blame the Bermuda Triangle.

she is an enigmatic bitch than triangle.

but i end this post with one question; out of all the UFO sightings, and all the claims of fishy activity in the Bermuda Triangle - 99% of them might be BS... but what about that 1%?

[SteamWake]

I spent quite a deal of time sailing in those waters and I'm still here

[Dowly]

Shame.

[Reece]

Originally Posted by SteamWake

I spent quite a deal of time sailing in those waters and I'm still here

Originally Posted by Dowly

Shame.

[Castout]

Okay I admit it. It's me (now hide from Jimbuna).


Umm I'm more interested in crop circle phenomenon.

Because I think those are Jimbuna's graffitis after a few beers.

Many things we don't know. The most important thing on these things is never to assume that we do know while in fact we're lacking knowledge.

Our economies and technologies are so dependent on dead animal extract that happens to be volatile that when they're depleted we're going to have big big problems. I sigh every time seeing the space shuttle. Its fuel tanks are bigger than the actual craft. If there were aliens out there I hope they don't find us until much later.

[Feuer Frei!]

Originally Posted by Castout

Many things we don't know. The most important thing on these things is never to assume that we do know while in fact we're lacking knowledge.

Agree, i just wish some of this would be applied to the "why is the patch late" threads.

[SteamWake]

No... more like this wise guys

[STEED]

Originally Posted by Castout

Okay I admit it. It's me (now hide from Jimbuna).


Umm I'm more interested in crop circle phenomenon.

Because I think those are Jimbuna's graffitis after a few beers.

Flipping heck...jim, a artist!

Modern Tate the next stop.

[STEED]

I think the Bermuda Triangle is all tosh.

[Weiss Pinguin]

Originally Posted by SteamWake

I spent quite a deal of time sailing in those waters and I'm still here

That explains a lot

[SteamWake]

I said I'm still here not all there

[GoldenRivet]

Well i started researching flight 19's disappearance.

It would appear that flight 19 was radio located to be somewhere in position 29° 0′ 0″ N, 79° 0′ 0″ heading west toward the coast of Florida at about 6pm. The transmission that helped radio locate the flights position was a broadcast order from Flight 19s leader to "tighten up the formation" Though the flight was still more or less unaware of their position, several of the pilots in the formation insisted "If we just head west we will find Florida. From this radio located position, flight 19 would have made landfall just before 8pm

about an hour and a half later a PBM-5 search and rescue aircraft (similar to a PBY) was dispatched out of Banana River NAS and took up an approximate intercept course to locate flight 19 and guide them to land.


20 minutes later, and exactly west of Flight 19s radio located position, the PBM-5 search and rescue airplane explodes for an unknown reason. witnesses aboard a cargo ship said the explosion was massive temporarily lighting up the sky, debris fell into the ocean and burned for about 10 minutes.


Because the wreckage fell into the area of the 5 - 6 MPH current of the gulf stream, the wreckage remained afloat for a short time and sank. Any surface wreckage or sinking wreckage would have been dispersed over the course of the current, perhaps by a distance of a couple of miles.

The cargo ship diverted to look for survivors, found an oil slick with all fire extinguished on heavy seas, and no survivors.

It is very rare for airplanes to spontaneously explode, though has happened to a couple of airplanes through history.

It is my belief that the PBM-5 mariner, tasked with locating flight 19 did just that.

With the PBM-5's 13 man crew looking for possibly ditched aircraft, i would assume that a fair amount of the eyeballs aboard the PBM-5 were focusing on the surface of the sea searching for any signs of flames, wreckage or distress flares.

combined with...

Flight 19 trying very hard to navigate, most of their aviators possibly heads down trying to locate radio aids to navigation on their paper work, or trying very hard to peer toward the west fro any sign of lights indicating land. (the sun had been set for over an hour and a half)

I think that the cause for the massive explosion aboard the PBM-5 was a multi-aircraft mid-air collision between the PBM-5 and the tightened formation of flight 19.

If Flight 19 was within visual range of the coast of florida, it is plausible that they had lights in sight in the near pitch dark. If this is the cause it is completely possible that any lights on the PBM-5 would have blended right in with the coastal lights, and would have probably gone mostly un-noticed by flight-19

IMHO, searchers are not looking for intact Avenger bombers resting neatly on the sea floor as if they were ditched.

the should be looking for large pieces that would survive collision, such as engines or large pieces of the empennage of the aircraft.



I think Flight 19, very nearly out of fuel, collided with the nearly fully fueled PBM-5 search plane.

[SteamWake]

I dunno GR I think the flight leader was in way over his head and would not listen to advice. Simple as that.

I suppose its possible that one of them if not the leader doinked the PBM and it went from bad to worst.

[Rhodes]

In a documentary about the triangle and the Flight 19, they said they are many more triangles out there. Ocean area's that a number of ships dissapered unexplain during decades. But only the bermuda has fame and spotligh. I remeber that the did the same shame in the coast of Africa with cabo verde islands or canaries as one triangle point.

[GoldenRivet]

Originally Posted by SteamWake

I suppose its possible that one of them if not the leader doinked the PBM and it went from bad to worst.

One thing comes to mind.

Rammstein airshow - frecce tricolori.

a single small jet plowed through a tight formation of other small jets of the same type causing the loss of 3 of the aircraft.

now

imagine a tightly grouped formation of TBMs... in a similar spread and formation size of the Frecce Tricolori chrash.

now, instead of plowing another TBM avenger through the formation, lets take an aircraft roughly 80 feet long, with a wingspan of almost 120 feet and plow it through the formation.

even if one Avenger bomber from flight 19 survived with light damage... he would have been flying a crippled aircraft in the dark, in less than ideal weather conditions, lost over rough seas... a sure recipe for disaster.

sure, the flight leader lost his situational awareness - possibly due to some equipment malfunctions. I further notice through research that not one of the aircraft in flight 19 was equipped with a functioning clock... an essential piece of navigational equipment.

things snowballed on the flight leader (who at one time placed another pilot in command of the flight) - this hints to me that they had finally talked him into heading west against all of his instinct.

unfortunately - and this is only my theory - but the flight headed west right into the point of collision with this PBM.