Things that bother me about "Iron Coffins"

[Takao]

A little more from another board I am on

On 15 April, 1910, one of these boats was lost with Lieutenant Sakuma, its commander, and the crew of fourteen men, during maneuvers in Hiroshima Bay. Lieutenant Sakuma's story of the tragedy lay in the conning tower when it was raised by a wrecking party from the cruiser Toyohashi. This sailor's log, hereunder quoted, recorded the creeping approach of a slow but certain death between 10 A.M. (after total immersion) and 12:40 P.M., the lingering ordeal thus lasting two hours and forty minutes. It was addressed to the Navy Department as a confidential report:"

"
Words of apology fail me for having sunk His majesty's submarine No. 6. My subordinates are killed by my fault, but it is with pride that I inform you that the crew to a man have discharged their duties as sailors should with the utmost coolness until their dying moments.
"We now sacrifice our lives for the sake of our country, but my fear is that the disaster will affect the future development of submarines. It is therefore my hope that nothing will daunt your determination to study the submarine until it is a perfect machine, absolutely reliable. We can then die without regret.
"It was while making a gasoline dive that the boat sank lower than was intended, and in our attempt to close the sluice the chain broke. We endeavored to stop the inrush of water with our hands, but too late, the water entered at the rear and the boat sank at an incline of 25 degrees.
"When it touched the bottom it was at an angle of 13 degrees. The current submerged the electric generator, put out the light, and the electric wires were burned. In a few minutes bad gas was generated, making it difficult for us to breathe.
"It was at 10 A. M. on the 15th inst. that the boat sank. Surrounded by poisonous gas, the crew strove to pump out the water. As soon as the boat sank the water in the main tank was being pumped out. The electric light was extinguished and the gauge was invisible, but it seems the water in the main tank was completely pumped out.
"The electric current has become useless, gas cannot be generated, and the hand pump is our only hope. The vessel is in darkness, and I note this down by the light through the conning tower at 11:45 A. M.
"The crew are now wet and it is extremely cold. It is my opinion that men embarking in submarines must possess the qualities of coolness and nerve, and must be extremely painstaking; they must be brave and daring in their handling of the boat. People may laugh at the opinion in view of my failure, but the statement is true.
"We have worked hard to pump out the water, but the boat is still in the same position. It is now twelve o'clock. The depth of water here is about ten fathoms.
"The crew of a submarine should be selected from the bravest, the coolest, or they will be of little use in time of crisis - in such as we are now. My brave men are doing their best.
"I always expect death when away from home. My will is therefore prepared and is in the locker. But this is of my private affairs. I hope Mr. Taguchi will send it to my father.
"A word to His majesty the Emperor. It is my earnest hope that Your majesty will supply the means of living to the poor families of the crew. This is my only desire, and I an so anxious to have it fulfilled.
"My respect and best regard to the following: Admiral Saito, Minister of the Navy; Vice Admirals Shinamura and Fujii, Rear Admiral Nawa, Yama****a and Narita - the air pressure is so light that I feel as if my eardrums will be broken - Captain Oguri and Ide, Commander Matsumura, Lieut-Commander Matsumura (this is my elder brother), Captain Funakoshi, Mr. Marita, and Mr. Ikuta - it is now 12:30 P.M. My breathing is so difficult and painful.
"I thought I could blow out gasoline, but I am intoxicated with it - Capt. Makano - it is now 12:40 P. M.

"Here the record ended. The crew had been suffocated by carbonic-acid gas."

and Lieutenant Tsutomu Sakuma's Wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tsutomu_Sakuma

[jazman]

Originally Posted by sharkbit

I'm currently reading Clay Blair's "Hitler's U-Boat War: The Hunters, 1939-1942" and I'm constantly amazed at the over inflation(sometimes by a huge amount) of tonnage sunk by the individual commanders and the claims of ships sunk that never were sunk. I realize that the fog of war and human failings are a big part of those excessive claims. I think that, at least to some degree, that may be one of the reasons for Werner's "over claiming" in his book. I'd still bet there was a certain amount of embellishment on Werner's part to make for "a good read".

That overclaiming was called "Schepke Tonnage", since he was the worst of the offenders, and everyone knew it.

[Westbroek]

@Takao
That's such a haunting record. It's not much fun to read that, but I know that the people here at subsim will be interested to read it.
It's an interesting contrast: Being simultaneously repelled by such horrific understanding of the last moments of a life...of appreciating in a visceral way how fleeting life and our experiences on this planet are...and the desire to achieve that very understanding... man, it's near impossible to explain it in words, and I suppose that's why writings such as that need to be preserved.
Thanks to you, Mcarlsonus and Subnuts for piecing together the entirety of that posting... and I know eventually these goosebumps will go away...
Cheers,

[sharkbit]

"It is my opinion that men embarking in submarines must possess the qualities of coolness and nerve, and must be extremely painstaking; they must be brave and daring in their handling of the boat.

"The crew of a submarine should be selected from the bravest, the coolest, or they will be of little use in time of crisis - in such as we are now. My brave men are doing their best.

The whole passage was chilling, but these two lines really struck me. It seems to me that these lines ring true even today.

[kylania]

Originally Posted by Takao

A little more from another board I am on

and Lieutenant Tsutomu Sakuma's Wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tsutomu_Sakuma

Wow... that's just... wow. Supremely powerful.

[GoldenRivet]

Subnuts,

I don't disagree with your talking points.

However, they do not change the fact that i enjoyed reading the book.

If Werner's goal was to give the reader an anti war sentiment, he was successful with at least this reader.

I think that one must be careful how they approach books on the subject matters such as this one.

on the one hand, there are proverbial text books on the subject which contain a great deal of facts and very little fanfare... and the way they read is testament to that; what i mean is, they read like text books.

Homer Hickam's Torpedo Junction comes to mind, well written, not a lot of fluff, just the facts, informative, in depth - but not what i would call a page turner.

on the other hand, there are books like Iron Coffins.

While books of the Iron Coffins variety may not contain a great deal of fact, and may actually contain a lot of bovine scatology... they come across with dramatic flare and exciting tone.

as any writer knows, if you want to sell a book, you have to write the stuff that people will want to read.

somewhere in between those two categories, you have a respectable book which contains a myriad of facts and a great and entertaining story.

the name of this "in between" book is... Steel Boat, Iron Hearts by Hans Goebler.

In this reader's opinion, it contains just the right amount of story and fact to make it the front running U-Boat related book in my tiny and probably insignificant collection.

followed closely by Torpedo Junction... with Iron Coffins bringing up the rear.

but, like i said... Iron Coffins was a fun read.

[IanC]

Originally Posted by Subnuts

Whether or not the book is a "damn good read" or "somewhat fictionalized" doesn't absolve Werner from the fact that he outright lied throughout much of Iron Coffins, committing the cardinal sin of "making sh&t up" and coming across as a goody two-shoes throughout. I know all about fog-of-war and faulty memories - but how does one "remember" sinking six ships in a convoy attack that never really happened? Werner promoted this book as the Gospel Truth and we all bought it hook line and sinker.

One of these days, Iron Coffins is going to be raked over the coals in the same manner that John Parshall and Anthony Tully took Mitsuo Fuchida to task in Shattered Sword.

Subnuts I'm just wondering, what's with all the hate on a World War II veteran anyways? Werner survived The battle of the Atlantic, he brought his men home. He wrote a book that perfectly illustrated what the U-boat force went through and the tragedy of war. I don't care how many ships he said he sunk, the man was there.
Are you some kind of failed author with a bad case of 'book sales' envy?

[ajoleary]

What blasphemy!
Next you’re going to tell me that the movie U571 what not real either


Like many others though, I enjoyed the book regardless of its ‘embellishments’.
Being a massive WWII naval history buff, I only hope people continue to write, make films and docos about this incredible period of our history.

Lest we forget.

[LukeFF]

Originally Posted by IanC

Subnuts I'm just wondering, what's with all the hate on a World War II veteran anyways? Werner survived The battle of the Atlantic, he brought his men home. He wrote a book that perfectly illustrated what the U-boat force went through and the tragedy of war. I don't care how many ships he said he sunk, the man was there.
Are you some kind of failed author with a bad case of 'book sales' envy?

I think Subnuts makes his point quite clear: it's not that the book is not a good read; it's that Werner presented facts as truth when the patently are not.

I could write a book about what it's like to be a soldier in Iraq (because I was there). However, if I embellish what I write with a bunch of nonsense (but claim it is the truth), then I deserve to be called on the carpet for presenting out-and-out lies. Military veterans do not get carte blanche just because "they survived."

[IanC]

Originally Posted by LukeFF

I think Subnuts makes his point quite clear: it's not that the book is not a good read; it's that Werner presented facts as truth when the patently are not.

Gosh, big deal. Still doesn't explain to me why Subnuts wants to see it, quote "raked over the coals".
The book as a whole, is so much bigger and more important, than the inaccuracies.

[robbo180265]

Originally Posted by IanC

Gosh, big deal. Still doesn't explain to me why Subnuts wants to see it, quote "raked over the coals".
The book as a whole, is so much bigger and more important, than the inaccuracies.

I think he said that he was asked to write a review of it and decided to share his feelings with us.

I've read the book and whilst I thought it a jolly good read , I took some of what was written with a pinch of salt - as it would appear a few others did too.

I think a discussion about how we feel about a particular book is hardly "raking it over the coals" - just that , a discussion.

[daft]

Originally Posted by Subnuts

A few months ago, Neal asked me to write a review of Iron Coffins for the next almanac. As I'm not supposed to actually post the actual review on this forum, I thought I'd bring up some of the..."issues"...I have with Iron Coffins. In my view, this book is painfully overrated, factually dishonest, and shouldn't occupy the elevated position it holds in the U-boat "canon." So, here's a quick laundry list:

• It's ridiculously high standing. Iron COffins is often thought of as a crowning masterpiece in the genre of submarine literature, the definitive account of life on a German U-boat, and a 100% factual account. Hasn't anyone ever heard of looking into secondary sources? I can study translated plans of U-570, read through Donitz's war diary, and examine the results of every convoy battle, all without having to fly to Germany and dig through old records.

• The amount of blatant fabrication contained within. Werner has U-557 sinking seven ships on her first patrol, when only one was sunk in reality. He then has her sinking six ships on her third patrol, when again, only one was sunk. He then has U-230 attacking Convoy HX-229/SC-122, sinking seven ships of the 22 in total sunk from the two convoys. However, the boat never got close enough to either convoy to fire a single torpedo or shell at it! Finally, he describes attacking a convoy in January, 1945 near England, observing three distinct torpedo strikes. Official records fail to credit him with sinking or damaging a single ship during his career as a U-boat captain.

• Werner's depiction of the Allied ASW effort. Based on Iron Coffins, Werner survived hundreds of aerial attacks, and several 30-hour long depth charge barrages. He's so lucky, though, that the Allies never used air-dropping homing torpedoes, Hedgehogs, sonobuoys, or hunter-killer groups against him. Considering the Allies has turned anti-submarine warfare into an artform by war's end, I find this hard to believe.

• Werner's depiction of himself. He's a stereotypical "Good German" who happens to be politically neutral, has no opinion of the Nazis, stands up against the Gestapo when his father is arrested, and has only the classiest of affairs with French prost...I mean, ladies. Everything that goes wrong is someone else's fault, even when his boat gets sunk in harbor. He shoots down a plane single-handedly with an ancient machine gun and ends up in the French foreign legion. Seriously?

• The reactions of U-boat veterans to the book has been glossed over. Jurgen Rohwer said that if one were to underline all of the errors in this book in red, it would look like a blood bath. The Association of German Submariners called it a "hack work totally without foundation." Iron Coffins was just as controversial as Das Boot when it came out, but people accept Herbert Werner more readily then they would Lothar-Gunther Buchheim. Why ignore these very real criticisms?

• Werner's overall attitude. He wants us to pause and reflect on how horrible war is while embellishing on his wartime experiences. He writes a grim anti-war story while including exciting fabricated battle scenes to spice up the narrative and make it more palatable. I find this whole attitude condescending at best, and intellectually dishonest at worst.

Okay, you can all hate me now.

I good write up regarding some issues that has been there for quite a long while. It is at times glossed over since many see the book as something of an iconic work for anyone interested in submarine warfare during the Second World War. It is a very good thing that these issues are brought to the from, and they should always be kept in mind while reading.

[tater]

Fuchida was raked over the coals by the Japanese themselves long before Shattered Sword (which is a great book), it's just that it was in Japanese, and historians elsewhere just parroted previous acceptance of Fuchida's book.

Regarding Iron Coffins, it absolutely deserves to be "raked over the coals" and discredited if it was presented as history when in fact it was fiction. Firing 4 fish, hearing 4 booms, and claiming 4 sinkings when in fact all 4 hit one ship is one thing, making up entire convoys, etc is another.

If you make the claim that a book is true, then it deserves very harsh treatment if it is made up.

It deserves to be called "fraudulent" in fact if that is the case. I don;t buy ww2-themed novels for the most part (read maybe 2), so if I had bought IC I'd be pissed (I read it long ago, but it was lent by my uncle, and I was a kid at the time).

[Nordmann]

Originally Posted by LukeFF

I think Subnuts makes his point quite clear: it's not that the book is not a good read; it's that Werner presented facts as truth when the patently are not.

I could write a book about what it's like to be a soldier in Iraq (because I was there). However, if I embellish what I write with a bunch of nonsense (but claim it is the truth), then I deserve to be called on the carpet for presenting out-and-out lies. Military veterans do not get carte blanche just because "they survived."

QFT.

Anyone presenting fabrication as fact deserves to be raked over the coals, regardless of how well the book reads.

[mcarlsonus]

Thanks so much for fleshing out Lt. Sakuma's story. What a brave, selfless man - and what a loss to humanity! As mentioned, I remember reading this several years ago - and it stayed with me. But, I simply couldn't remember WHERE I read it - unlike an story I read in the old Omni magazine regarding time travel to pilfer resources from previous years and using motorcycle-riding Mongol Hoards - including Genghis himself - as, "enforcers!"