State Lawmakers Propose Mandatory DNA Samples

[antikristuseke]

Originally Posted by Dowly

Sounds good to me. Maybe it would help lessen the crimes if the baddie knows his DNA is stored and he could get caught if he wouldnt be veeeery careful to not leave any of his DNA around the crimescene.

It will probably have the same deterrent value as the death penalty, none.

[Dowly]

Originally Posted by antikristuseke

It will probably have the same deterrent value as the death penalty, none.

Partypooper.


Well, atleast it makes the police's job easier if they find DNA from the scene.

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by antikristuseke

It will probably have the same deterrent value as the death penalty, none.

I do not believe it is being peddled as a deterrent.

[antikristuseke]

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

I do not believe it is being peddled as a deterrent.

Neither do I, was adressing Dowlys post.

[August]

Originally Posted by antikristuseke

It will probably have the same deterrent value as the death penalty, none.

Now don't be too hasty. I don't know of any criminal who ever committed a crime after suffering the death penalty...

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by antikristuseke

Neither do I, was adressing Dowlys post.

Dowly has one good point, perps now might use gloves and chemicals to cover their DNA track. Some of these guys are damn smart.

[antikristuseke]

Originally Posted by August

Now don't be too hasty. I don't know of any criminal who ever committed a crime after suffering the death penalty...

True enough, yet the death penalty ha no effect on overall crime rates which warrant the death penalty.

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by antikristuseke

True enough, yet the death penalty ha no effect on overall crime rates which warrant the death penalty.

True, most sit on death row for decades anyway. Read up on the Broomstick Killer who did his whacked out crimes in TX. I was a damn shame what happened to the young women after he was released in error. What good is the death penalty if the perp sits for decades?

Human piece of trash:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenneth_McDuff
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Ramirez STILL WAITING ON DEATH ROW

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

Man, nice write up Mothball on the DNA. As for Skybird, were are these corporation going to get the DNA? There is no abuse if they do not have your DNA.

Yes, where are all those hackers getting their data, since they have not been given access to it? Mysterious. And non-authorized cross-office exchange of personal data - why does it exist if law does not allow it?

This is food for very hard thought.

Or sorry - but is it really? Haven't we had enough data scandals on the past 12 months already?

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

I do not see it happing IMO. It would be overstepping the bounds of privacy. Sure it does exist as Skybird points out. I have not experienced any corporation looking to collect DNA. This would be called predetermination based on DNA.

Ah yes, it is illegal by law, that's why nobody will do it. Isn't this a happy and honest planet we live on.


Don't get me wrong, I absolutely see the ebenfit of datastoring DNY smaples for law enforcement, and in an ideal world I would not think a second on objecting to it. But this world is not honest, but bad. I also the see the risks - which you still seem to minimise although reality already has overtaken you.

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by Skybird

Yes, where are all those hackers getting their data, since they have not been given access to it? Mysterious. And non-authorized cross-office exchange of personal data - why does it exist if law does not allow it?

This is food for very hard thought.

Or sorry - but is it really? Haven't we had enough data scandals on the past 12 months already?

Well, lets start with were and why your DNA got into a data base If it is not there then why worry?

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

Well, lets start with were and why your DNA got into a data base If it is not there then why worry?

For the same reason why fingerprints are kept in databases as well - to make them accessible for data processing - mass comparisons, for example.


Security interests and freedom onterests need to be balanced against each other, you just can't have both maxed out. The more the slider moves toeards security, the more control there is, and the less freedom, the more freedom the slider indicates, the less control and the less control you get. - That'S what all these anti-terror laws we got in the past 9 years - try to hide from public discussion. But total security means total control and total loss of freedom and private sphere.

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by Skybird

For the same reason why fingerprints are kept in databases as well - to make them accessible for data processing - mass comparisons, for example.


Security interests and freedom onterests need to be balanced against each other, you just can't have both maxed out. The more the slider moves toeards security, the more control there is, and the less freedom, the more freedom the slider indicates, the less control and the less control you get. - That'S what all these anti-terror laws we got in the past 9 years - try to hide from public discussion. But total security means total control and total loss of freedom and private sphere.

But you did not answer the question. How and where did your DNA get into the data base? I have not been anywhere were DNA was asked for. In law enforcement your DNA might end up in the data base as a result of a crime. Again, if your DNA is not in the data base why worry? I just do not see company X raiding my hair brush for a sample or getting taken to the ground only to find a cotton swab in my mouth for sample off my inner cheek.

[MothBalls]

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

Well, lets start with were and why your DNA got into a data base If it is not there then why worry?

Did you read the original article? The whole point of this discussion is the legislation they want to pass will let the police take samples without a warrant. This means they can just make you a suspect, collect the DNA and record it, nothing you can do about it. That's the part I object to.

I agree with Skybird as well. Once the data exists it is at risk of being stolen. It happens all the time. You can't tell me you don't see the stories about data comprimises. Add to that, the corporate risk. Eventually the corporations will use their influence to get the data legally. That scares me more than hackers do.

However, some are raising concerns about the proposal.

"Innocent people frequently are arrested, and so there's no more reason to have their DNA in the databank than yours and mine and anybody else's who's not committed any crime," said Keith Findley, co-director of the Wisconsin Innocence Project.

[AVGWarhawk]

Did you read the original article? The whole point of this discussion is the legislation they want to pass will let the police take samples without a warrant. This means they can just make you a suspect, collect the DNA and record it, nothing you can do about it. That's the part I object to.

This is were we part agreement. For starters, the police will not be entering your home for a sample nor will they call you in. We also have to consider probably cause. The there is illegal search and seizure. If your in the pokie you ended up there for a reason. Wrong spot at the wrong time only flys so far. I do not see this DNA issue going above law enforcement usage only...warranted or not.

[MothBalls]

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

The there is illegal search and seizure.

Bingo! That's the whole point. I consider it to be illegal search and seizure to collect my DNA without a court order signed by a judge before I've been charged with a felony. The legislation they are trying to pass will give them that right, before any charge is filed, without a court order. It's a violation of the 4th amendment.