Ford Taurus 2010

[MothBalls]

Originally Posted by XabbaRus

I was reaing an article on the BBC about it.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/8249530.stm

This is onething tha made me curious



Can anyone tell me how that is good? and is that for the V6 option. For a V6 that could be realistic but if that is supposed to be the fuel economy for the average normal engined one then that is shocking.

Because it's a full size sedan, not an economy car. Those numbers for a six passenger car really isn't that bad.

Did anyone catch this part?

Originally Posted by In the Article

Ford said the F22 radar technology which they took and built upon was all open source.

I seached sourceforge.net, couldn't find it. Anyone have a link to the SVN?

Because it's a full size sedan, not an economy car. Those numbers for a six passenger car really isn't that bad.

Well thats easy , go to the Ford UK and Ford US websites and look at the difference in fuel consumption for the full size sedan. You can also compare the Ford economy cars for the US and Euro market and see the difference in those too.

[MothBalls]

Originally Posted by Tribesman

Well thats easy , go to the Ford UK and Ford US websites and look at the difference in fuel consumption for the full size sedan. You can also compare the Ford economy cars for the US and Euro market and see the difference in those too.

Apples to oranges.

Apples to oranges.

No, its apples to apples.
Since the matter of dispute is fuel consumption in different markets then a comparrison of a large family sedan made by a firm for the US market with a large family sedan made for the european market by the same firm it is a perfect comparrison.
Just as doing the same for an economy car made by the same firm for the two markets is a perfect comparrison

[Prof]

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

The Jetta TDI is a great car. Yet we can not get the Passat TDI here in the state. Makes no sense.

The problem is that the US emissions standards for NOx are difficult to achieve with a Diesel without spending a lot of money on the exhaust aftertreatment system. New technologies like SCR are helping to an extent, but it all adds cost and complexity to the vehicle.

Current European emissions standards allow higher NOx for Diesel vehicles than for gasoline vehicles, though that will change in the next few years.

[Task Force]

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

I do not believe America is really ready to accept a diesel openly at present. There are a few certainly. Mostly pick up trucks and to be honest the early attempts at American diesels for cars were not the greatest from what I recall. If it did not pull a tractor trailer the diesel was not that great utilized in a car. I remember the first Rabbit diesels by VW. Darn thing made a racket but it chugged along for hundreds of thousand of miles. Hell, the car body would rust out around the motor and that motor would keep on turning. I do think with todays tech in diesels and specifically VW's version Americans would grow to like them. The Jetta TDI is a great car. Yet we can not get the Passat TDI here in the state. Makes no sense. I do not object to diesels but for every one of my there is 20 others who do not want a diesel. They say the engine smells. So does the fuel and exhaust. The engine sounds like a sewing machine, etc. To some extend they are correct.

... have you looked at the prices of diesel... its higher than the supreme fuel (dont know if they have that in europe.)... lol

[Schroeder]

Originally Posted by Task Force

... have you looked at the prices of diesel... its higher than the supreme fuel (dont know if they have that in europe.)... lol

Yes we have.
Over here Diesel is cheaper than gasoline and I don't see any reasons why it should be more expansive (except for that it is rather exotic in the US).

[Prof]

Originally Posted by Tribesman

No, its apples to apples.
Since the matter of dispute is fuel consumption in different markets then a comparrison of a large family sedan made by a firm for the US market with a large family sedan made for the european market by the same firm it is a perfect comparrison.
Just as doing the same for an economy car made by the same firm for the two markets is a perfect comparrison

Actually, it's more like Bramleys to Granny Smiths. Even though the cars might be roughly the same size and weight, cars in the US are certified on a different driving cycle to cars in the EU. The EU cycle is much less aggressive than the US cycle, so I'd expect that if you took a car and tested it on both cycles, the US cycle would indicate higher fuel consumption.

Still, that doesn't account for the inexcusably bad fuel efficiency of US vehicles.

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by Prof

The problem is that the US emissions standards for NOx are difficult to achieve with a Diesel without spending a lot of money on the exhaust aftertreatment system. New technologies like SCR are helping to an extent, but it all adds cost and complexity to the vehicle.

Current European emissions standards allow higher NOx for Diesel vehicles than for gasoline vehicles, though that will change in the next few years.

That I did not know. Let see, we have VW and Mercedes that offers the diesels. I can not think of another other than the domestic car makers but these diesel are offered in pick up trucks. Even if the price was good and NOx standard reduced I believe the acceptance would not be quite there for a while. Personally I would take one. Others though see an electical plug for heating the block and wonder what the heck it is. American's just want to turn and burn. No fuss no muss cars.

[VipertheSniper]

Originally Posted by Schroeder

Yes we have.
Over here Diesel is cheaper than gasoline and I don't see any reasons why it should be more expansive (except for that it is rather exotic in the US).

The reason why diesel is cheaper than gasoline here is because it's taxed lower than gasoline, because as far as I know producing diesel is actually a more expensive process than making gasoline.

[Torvald Von Mansee]

Wrong thread?

The reason why diesel is cheaper than gasoline here is because it's taxed lower than gasoline

It works differently in different countries.
Lower taxation on diesel plus better fuel consuption led to a large switch in some places so the governments hiked duty on diesel to make up for their resulting lower tax reciepts from petrol.
Other governments view it in relation to the proportion of diesel/petrol users who are claiming fuel as tax deductable and adjust their fuel duty accordingly as there is no point taxing something when people can not only claim the fuel tax back but also write off the whole fuel cost as a deductable expense against income and business tax.

Still, that doesn't account for the inexcusably bad fuel efficiency of US vehicles.

There are a lot of factors , the driving cycle you mention is just one , others that are often thrown in are transmission and A/C but both of those you can compare with comparable automatics with all the extras you could possibly contemplate ...none of which accounts for the bad performance of cars on the US market in terms of fuel consumption

[Onkel Neal]

Whoo hoo!!

[SteamWake]

Originally Posted by Neal Stevens

Whoo hoo!!

Not a big supprise but good for them.

Some of that profit margin is attributed to the cash for clunkers program.

Now the question is that because Ford choose not to accept stimulus money will the fed's make them give up some of that profit?

After all its not 'fair'.

[AVGWarhawk]

Ford should be there. The Taurus will re-invent the sedan...AGAIN! The Focus is a nice subcompact and the Fusion is a direct poke in the eye for Toyota and Honda. As for the F150...no contest out there.