The proposed health care bill thread (merged) - Page 6

AVGWarhawk · 07-16-09, 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buddahaid

A visit to the ER for a non life threatening injury involving a couple of x-ray images will cost about $2,000.00 to $3,000.00, even if there are no broken bones. We need a system that gives people who can't afford insurance somewhere to go other than the ER. This plan will have faults and will need much tweeking, but the current system is also expensive due to situations like the above, and the lack of latitude given doctors to treat patients in order to fit the insurance coding. Not to mention the gold digging lawyers fighting for the compensation you really "don't" deserve.

Buddahaid

Question is, why all the x-rays and test if not necessary? Easy. Lawsuits. Sue happy America. The hospitals cover all the bases, plus the stands, hot dog and beer booths. Tort reform and frivolous lawsuits. If the current system was overhauled, tort reform really enacted there might be a better picture drawn. However, DC has decided to dump 1.7 trillion on it and then go fix the system

Buddahaid · 07-16-09, 03:05 PM

But as I pointed out, you already do pay for the uninsured through increased costs and insurance premiums. You have the freedom to join the uninsured and become part of the problem, or be insured and pay for the uninsured. Hospitals do not have an option to turn away emergency patients. It's a catch 22 which why I want some form of universal wellness care, perhaps not this one, but something.

You have nothing without your health, and people with nothing become desperate and more criminal. How about a real world alternative suggestion that balances individual responsibility with social responsibility.

Buddahaid

Buddahaid · 07-16-09, 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

Question is, why all the x-rays and test if not necessary? Easy. Lawsuits. Sue happy America. The hospitals cover all the bases, plus the stands, hot dog and beer booths. Tort reform and frivolous lawsuits. If the current system was overhauled, tort reform really enacted there might be a better picture drawn. However, DC has decided to dump 1.7 trillion on it and then go fix the system

The x-rays are needed to determine if there is or is not a fracture.

Buddahaid

AVGWarhawk · 07-16-09, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buddahaid

The x-rays are needed to determine if there is or is not a fracture.

Buddahaid

Understood.

mookiemookie · 07-16-09, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sea Demon

Screw your government run healthcare if it infringes on my liberty. And as things look....it does.

If personal liberty is so important to you, then pledge to never ever use any kind of government service. Someone breaks into your house? You don't get to call the police. Stay off of my roads if you resent having to pay taxes for the upkeep of them. And dig your own well and get off of my municipal water grid. Hope you have a fire extinguisher or 10 around in case your garage catches fire.

We have these things because we as a society have decided it's good for our society to be safe and healthy. Healthcare is no different. The societal benefits of a healthy population are argument enough for universal healthcare.

To quote someone more eloquent than me:

Quote:

“some societies, ours included, from time to time decide that its citizens, or certain groups of them, should be entitled to certain benefits. Sometimes this [is] justified by the common good -- a well-educated populace serves society well, so we guarantee an education to all children. Sometimes this is derived from humanitarian principles -- children should not go hungry, so we create childhood nutrition programs. Healthcare would, in my estimation, fall into the category of an entitlement rather than a right..."

AVGWarhawk · 07-16-09, 03:45 PM

Mookie,

Quote:

I am for doing good to the poor, but I differ in opinion of the means. I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it.

Ben Franklin

Our nation is making it to easy. Want to succeed is becoming a thing of the past. Why bother if only I'm only paying for someone elses good time sitting on the couch?

BTW, superstucture, ie, water utilities, roads can not be compared to healthcare provided by the government IMO. Really, renters do not pay property taxes so why do they enjoy these roads and water paid by tax payors?

mookiemookie · 07-16-09, 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

Mookie,

Ben Franklin

Our nation is making it to easy. Want to succeed is becoming a thing of the past. Why bother if only I'm only paying for someone elses good time sitting on the couch?

BTW, superstucture, ie, water utilities, roads can not be compared to healthcare provided by the government IMO. Really, renters do not pay property taxes so why do they enjoy these roads and water paid by tax payors?

If the property taxes on a rental property go up, you can bet that the rents will increase soon after.

If you want to bring the founding fathers into it..."Life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness"...how can you have any of them if you're seriously sick?

AVGWarhawk · 07-16-09, 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mookiemookie

If the property taxes on a rental property go up, you can bet that the rents will increase soon after.

If you want to bring the founding fathers into it..."Life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness"...how can you have any of them if you're seriously sick?

Oh, I'm sorry bro, did I get you sick? Is this somehow my problem? Communial living? I have had three collapsed lungs. Did I show up to your house for cash for doctor bills so I could have life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness? Well, no! I was not your problem. I'm sure you feel for me though but you ain't cracking out the checkbook now are ya?

07-16-09, 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mookiemookie

If you want to bring the founding fathers into it..."Life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness"...how can you have any of them if you're seriously sick?

Is it genetic, or lifestyle? Remember how many children are obese and how many are starving(food deficient) in the US.

AVGWarhawk · 07-16-09, 03:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CastleBravo

Is it genetic, or lifestyle? Remember how many children are obese and how many are starving(food deficient) in the US.

Yes but you should pay for it damn it. I do not care that I feed my kids McDonalds 24/7. Just pay up.

Buddahaid · 07-16-09, 04:00 PM

I forgot to add the amount of your tax dollar that goes to medicare already and if your worried about fraud, digest this. Habitual hard drug users and alcoholics go to your friendly local ER when they feel bad. They know all they have to do is complain of chest pain to get attention, very expensive attention that has to be taken seriously. Delaying the health care for those who pay for their insurance and using materials and bed-space, plus often police and paramedic resources as well if they are violent or abusive. Sometimes they even begin destroying equipment. Sure they get in trouble but they will be back, or in prison using up more of your hard earned money. Any good ideas of how to fix that?

Buddahaid

mookiemookie · 07-16-09, 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

Oh, I'm sorry bro, did I get you sick? Is this somehow my problem? Communial living? I have had three collapsed lungs. Did I show up to your house for cash for doctor bills so I could have life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness? Well, no! I was not your problem. I'm sure you feel for me though but you ain't cracking out the checkbook now are ya?

It depends. If you're with the same insurance company I'm with, then I'm sure part of my premiums went for your care.

07-16-09, 04:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

Yes but you should pay for it damn it. I do not care that I feed my kids McDonalds 24/7. Just pay up.

Are you saying that the nanny state is wrong in all its forms, because it disallows choice? I thought only religions disallowed choice.

Sacraledge. (Religious term), Racist, (Secular term)

Buddahaid · 07-16-09, 04:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CastleBravo

Are you saying that the nanny state is wrong in all its forms, because it disallows choice? I thought only religions disallowed choice.

Sacraledge. (Religious term), Racist, (Secular term)

You confuse the hell out of me.

That is the most socialist thing I've read from your posts.

I'm getting seasick.

Buddahaid

07-16-09, 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buddahaid

You confuse the hell out of me.

That is the most socialist thing I've read from your posts.

I'm getting seasick.

Buddahaid

Sorry if I confused you. I don't know how to think for ya. I'm so insensitive.

07-16-09, 03:05 PM	#77
Buddahaid Shark above Space Chicken Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 9,330 Downloads: 162 Uploads: 0	But as I pointed out, you already do pay for the uninsured through increased costs and insurance premiums. You have the freedom to join the uninsured and become part of the problem, or be insured and pay for the uninsured. Hospitals do not have an option to turn away emergency patients. It's a catch 22 which why I want some form of universal wellness care, perhaps not this one, but something. You have nothing without your health, and people with nothing become desperate and more criminal. How about a real world alternative suggestion that balances individual responsibility with social responsibility. Buddahaid

07-16-09, 04:00 PM	#86
Buddahaid Shark above Space Chicken Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 9,330 Downloads: 162 Uploads: 0	I forgot to add the amount of your tax dollar that goes to medicare already and if your worried about fraud, digest this. Habitual hard drug users and alcoholics go to your friendly local ER when they feel bad. They know all they have to do is complain of chest pain to get attention, very expensive attention that has to be taken seriously. Delaying the health care for those who pay for their insurance and using materials and bed-space, plus often police and paramedic resources as well if they are violent or abusive. Sometimes they even begin destroying equipment. Sure they get in trouble but they will be back, or in prison using up more of your hard earned money. Any good ideas of how to fix that? Buddahaid