US Flagged Vessel Captured! UPDATE: Navy SEALS take out pirates

[Ishmael]

Originally Posted by nikimcbee

I like your idea. They should invoke the old pirate laws; No mercy, no quarter.

they should just create an exclusion zone, any ship not registered to be in there will be sunk on sight.

We should identify which ports haves pirates operating out of them, and level them.

Don't forget the financial incentive for anti-piracy. Any ship and cargo recaptured from pirates becomes a Prize ship and the property of the owners, Captain and crew of the ship who recaptures it under Admiralty and Maritime laws. The anti-piracy laws dealing with punishment for piracy are also equally severe.

[nikimcbee]

Originally Posted by Ishmael

Don't forget the financial incentive for anti-piracy. Any ship and cargo recaptured from pirates becomes a Prize ship and the property of the owners, Captain and crew of the ship who recaptures it under Admiralty and Maritime laws. The anti-piracy laws dealing with punishment for piracy are also equally severe.

I'm just saying, we sink thier boats and do not rescue survivors., there may be pirates in the area you know, can't stop.

I say, rearm the Iowa and lets level somebody's port. No nation building or democracy spreading; just unadulterated ass kicking.

[UnderseaLcpl]

Originally Posted by nikimcbee

I say, rearm the Iowa and lets level somebody's port. No nation building or democracy spreading; just unadulterated ass kicking.

[nikimcbee]

Originally Posted by Ishmael

Don't forget the financial incentive for anti-piracy. Any ship and cargo recaptured from pirates becomes a Prize ship and the property of the owners, Captain and crew of the ship who recaptures it under Admiralty and Maritime laws. The anti-piracy laws dealing with punishment for piracy are also equally severe.

Originally Posted by UnderseaLcpl

Or we could use one of our fancy subs to find the mothership, and a few Mk 48's later...
long-range pirate problem solved.

They were discussing it on the radio this afternoon, and it's just maddening to me how we are held hostage to the lawyers and PCness. It's just easier not to do anything because of the legal ramifications. We if that's the case, I'm gunna by me a boat and become a pirate, because I know nobody will do anything, just give me what I want and I'll go away until I spend the money.

[UnderseaLcpl]

Originally Posted by nikimcbee

Or we could use one of our fancy subs to find the mothership, and a few Mk 48's later...
long-range pirate problem solved.

They were discussing it on the radio this afternoon, and it's just maddening to me how we are held hostage to the lawyers and PCness. It's just easier not to do anything because of the legal ramifications. We if that's the case, I'm gunna by me a boat and become a pirate, because I know nobody will do anything, just give me what I want and I'll go away until I spend the money.

I thought you guys were joking about the battleship thing.

Dude, can you imagine the international ramifications of destroying Somalia's ports, no matter what methods are used? We might as well make a guest appearance on one of those "Save the Children" commercials and start punching starving babies. It would be an unjustified escalation of force, and it would harm civilians more than pirates.

I don't foresee any international objections to setting up private security firms in ports on either end of pirated routes. It wouldn't cost taxpayer money, it wouldn't be an escelation of force, it wouldn't disrupt shipping, it might lower insurance costs, and it would work wonders as a deterrant. After all, any ship could have security forces aboard.......
Better yet, maybe I could have a cool new job
Imo, we should focus on diplomatic efforts to allow such companies to operate.

The PCness and lawyers piss me off too but you can't just say "to hell with them!" The people behind legal entanglements and PC BS are masters at this game, because their livelihood depends on it. Why not pit them against professional-grade opposition?

[Dowly]

US flagged ship get's captured and everyone are screaming about it. What happened to the all the other ships that got captured? They dont deserve a thread? Fricking sick of this US this US that bull****. The sailors knew the risks of goin there, big farking thing.

[SteamWake]

Originally Posted by Dowly

US flagged ship get's captured and everyone are screaming about it. What happened to the all the other ships that got captured? They dont deserve a thread? Fricking sick of this US this US that bull****. The sailors knew the risks of goin there, big farking thing.

I raised the anti pirate flag years/months ago,. went un noticed. Im really curious to see how this one works out.

[Ishmael]

Originally Posted by Dowly

US flagged ship get's captured and everyone are screaming about it. What happened to the all the other ships that got captured? They dont deserve a thread? Fricking sick of this US this US that bull****. The sailors knew the risks of goin there, big farking thing.

There's a reason for my US-centroism. The US Navy is only obligated to protect and defend US-flagged ships and that's all they SHOULD protect. At the end of World War 2, the US had the largest merchant fleet in the world. Then steamship companies didn't want to pay US wages or obey US safety laws so they flocked to flags of convenience like Panama and Liberia. The final result is as you see it. The US warships should sink any pirate-controlled vessel that gets within 50 miles of the lifeboat, hostages or not. Piracy is a scourge to honest sailors everywhere and it will continue until it is stamped out. If these other ships want naval protection, they should contact the Liberian or Panamanian Navy, otherwise they should reregister under US flag with US crews. I note that it was ONLY the US crew who retook control of their vessel. As far as civilian casualties, the people who live in these pirate lairs are all making money off of the trade and are therefore complicit in it. As long as the benefits of Piracy outweigh the consequences, piracy will continue there as it did in the Caribbean and Madagascar in earlier times.

[nikimcbee]

Originally Posted by UnderseaLcpl

I thought you guys were joking about the battleship thing.

Dude, can you imagine the international ramifications of destroying Somalia's ports, no matter what methods are used? We might as well make a guest appearance on one of those "Save the Children" commercials and start punching starving babies. It would be an unjustified escalation of force, and it would harm civilians more than pirates.

I don't foresee any international objections to setting up private security firms in ports on either end of pirated routes. It wouldn't cost taxpayer money, it wouldn't be an escelation of force, it wouldn't disrupt shipping, it might lower insurance costs, and it would work wonders as a deterrant. After all, any ship could have security forces aboard.......
Better yet, maybe I could have a cool new job
Imo, we should focus on diplomatic efforts to allow such companies to operate.

The PCness and lawyers piss me off too but you can't just say "to hell with them!" The people behind legal entanglements and PC BS are masters at this game, because their livelihood depends on it. Why not pit them against professional-grade opposition?

The thing is, noone wants to make a move, because they don't want to beheld liable for anything. It's just embarassing, all these nations with a military force are cowering like a bunch of scared kittens and caving in to these guys. Maybe we could pay for some bounty hunters to go after these guys. With all of our technology and special forces, somebody should be able to track them then destroy them. Lets just say for fun, we (anybody frankly) aggresively go after them, what's the UN gunna do? Nuttin! They'll sit in the corner and bark.

[UnderseaLcpl]

Originally Posted by nikimcbee

The thing is, noone wants to make a move, because they don't want to beheld liable for anything. It's just embarassing, all these nations with a military force are cowering like a bunch of scared kittens and caving in to these guys. Maybe we could pay for some bounty hunters to go after these guys. With all of our technology and special forces, somebody should be able to track them then destroy them. Lets just say for fun, we (anybody frankly) aggresively go after them, what's the UN gunna do? Nuttin! They'll sit in the corner and bark.

I like your idea of hiring bounty hunters. Unfortunately, state-sponsored hiring of private entities to violate the sovereignty nations is frowned upon even more than direct state intervention. There's a lot of implied sneakiness to it. Even legitimate use of state-sponsored private entities to effect foreign policy is considered disdainful (by people I disagree with, I might add)
Just look at Blackwater or Executive Outcomes.

You and I both know that the state really only serves two interests; self-interest, and politics. They never do anything right. What they should be doing is empowering private entities to take care of the problem themselves, and stop trying to solve the problem with their PC BS.

The only real solution is to let people handle their own damn affairs. Which would you rather have if you were being assaulted, a gun or a phone? States around the world argue furiously that calling them will fix your problems, but they never do, and even when they do it's too damn late.
"But" they argue, "we'll prevent such things from happening!"
Yeah, they've done a bang-up job so far.
This applies to firms, as well as individuals, especially when international politics are involved. No state is going to pass a reasonable global solution through its' legislative bowels and come up with a golden egg that everyone will treasure. It has never happened, and it will never happen. Too many conflicting interests are at stake.

The only real answer is to let private firms select private firms to ensure their security in international waters, or not. Maybe they get lucky and the pirates don't attack their vessels. Maybe they aren't lucky and pirates do sieze their vessels. If that happens, it's their own fault for trying to cut corners. Who has a truly productive use for a company that cuts corners? Who chooses them to ship their goods? Who would insure them? Too bad for them.

As with many things, no one has a choice unless they choose choice. Our efforts should be focussed upon navigating international barriers to provide businesses with that choice.