Worldwide no-fly zone?

Harald_Lange · 02-21-12, 08:12 AM

I have GWX installed, with a handful of sound and realism mods. I'm playing February 1941. Other than the planes in port, I've not once seen any planes. At all.

I know it sounds daft, but I actually would like to see some enemy planes. Plenty of ships, but no death from above. Is it due to the early stage of the war? I'm getting radio messages about air raids all the time, so I'd expect to see a few at least.

(btw, the fix french mod was an oversight, I am turning it off next time I'm in port.)

Raticon · 02-21-12, 08:30 AM

If you are running at high TC, 256 or higher, no enemy planes will spawn near you and those allready in the air will "jump past" you becuase of their high speed and the high TC.

Also, ealy in the war the allies planes didn't have good range or detection, so you'll mainly encounter them close (very close!) to the british coast. merchants and escorts detecting you will sometimes call for their buddies in the RAF to come and ruin your day.

To experiment, i suggest you cruise towards the british coast, save the game and run in a pattern close to the british coast first at 256 or 512 TC, write down anything you see (or don't see!) and then repeat the same pattern in a TC of 64 or slower. Naturally, weather has to be fine and preferably daytime.

Report your findings, as i have "succeeded" in getting attacked by enemy planes when playing at low TC near britain, but had the "misfortune" of evading them while in the same waters running at higher TC. We could evaluate our findings together as my results mainly are Sep 1939 to January 1941 when i shifted from coastal britain to the high seas due to getting the VIIC.

I consider this a bug, or a consequence of game mechanics working as they do. Perhaps a mod exists to fix it?

u crank · 02-21-12, 08:34 AM

Feb. 1941 air cover was still limited. Go to f5 map view and look at pull down map. In 1941 areas around England, Gibraltar and Iceland had some air patrols but it's sparse. In my current patrol I've sailed from Lorient to Gibraltar area and have seen only one small float plane.

But don't worry, it will only get worse. By 1943 there are planes every where. They even bomb you in port!

Good hunting Harald and enjoy the clear skies while you can.

ReallyDedPoet · 02-21-12, 08:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by u crank

By 1943 there are planes every where. They even bomb you in port!

Above us hell

Captain Nemo · 02-21-12, 08:55 AM

High TC and spawning of aircraft was explained in a post by Letum back in 2006, he wrote:

"Aircraft spawn at high TC, the problem is that they miss the player. Here's the maths:

Units (Planes, ships, etc.) in the 3d world around the players boat have their positions calculated in real time. This does not change with TC settings.

Units Outside of the 3d world (about 32km away from your boat) units do not have their positions calculated in real time to save on CPU. It would be impossible to calculate the position of every single convoy, destroyer and plane constantly.

Insted the game works from the 2d map that mod makers will be familiar with. The game only updates a units position every "time step". If the unit's position falls within the 3d world round the u-boat the game will begin to calculate it in real time.

If it was possible to see a unit outside the 3d world you would see it move in jumps every time step. When you speed up TC these time steps do not speed up. This mean that the jumps these units make gets bigger.

If the time step happens every second, a aeroplane is moving at 1m per second will jump 1m every time step at 1xTC. At 2xTC it will jump 2m per time step. At x1024 TC it will jump 1024m. (numbers not accurate - I don't know how oftern the time steps are!)

The faster the unit's speed: The bigger the jumps are.
The higher the TC: the bigger the jumps are.

For a fast unit like a aeroplane the jumps get very big at high TC and the aeroplane can jump right past the 32km radius round the player's boat. Alto the planes path went right past the U-Boat, the computer never calculated it's position to be near the u-boat so the plane never got placed in the 3d world.

The computer and the player have no idea that a plane just passed them".

Nemo

Herr-Berbunch · 02-21-12, 09:18 AM

Go for a slow sail around Iceland, even in '41 they will come - and that's where I've seen most of my enemy aircraft. But, I think you're a fool for wanting such a death.

Obltn Strand · 02-21-12, 09:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Harald_Lange

I have GWX installed, with a handful of sound and realism mods. I'm playing February 1941. Other than the planes in port, I've not once seen any planes. At all.

Change to NYGM and you REALLY want to avoid british coast. Even during early war.

Brag · 02-21-12, 05:11 PM

Get within aircraft range from base in Gigraltar, plenty of airplanes fly from there.

VONHARRIS · 02-23-12, 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brag

Get within aircraft range from base in Gigraltar, plenty of airplanes fly from there.

Especially those Hurricanes with their 20mm cannons that can cause enough damage to a surfaced Uboot to abandon the patrol.

Sailor Steve · 02-23-12, 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Obltn Strand

Change to NYGM and you REALLY want to avoid british coast. Even during early war.

But then you'll never see any blimps.

Jimbuna · 02-23-12, 12:25 PM

Keep tc to 18x max and sail around the northern tip of Scotland and I guarantee you'll get almost repeatedly buzzed by Ansons and Swordfish.

Obltn Strand · 02-23-12, 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

But then you'll never see any blimps.

I hate those things. Always spoiling US east coast patrols. Especially when I engaged one thinking a hydrogen filled sack will come down with couple hits from 20mm AA

How much can kaleun be mistaken?

But I have learned to apperciate NYGM's very agressive AI. Both aircraft and escorts alike.

Sailor Steve · 02-23-12, 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Obltn Strand

I hate those things. Always spoiling US east coast patrols.

Good. They're doing their job.

Quote:

Especially when I engaged one thinking a hydrogen filled sack will come down with couple hits from 20mm AA

How much can kaleun be mistaken?

That's because they didn't use hydrogen. America had the world monopoly on helium (we were the first to discover a workable extraction method) and an embargo on Germany and Japan. No American airships could burn.

Quote:

But I have learned to apperciate NYGM's very agressive AI. Both aircraft and escorts alike.

Cool. This is why we have more than one supermod.

Gargamel · 02-23-12, 09:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

No American airships could burn.

:

They just make balloon farting noises around the room

Missing Name · 02-23-12, 10:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gargamel

They just make balloon farting noises around the room

A few 3.7cm AP rounds have a tendency to deflate any blimp commander's day... the fart noises do make it a bit better though.

02-21-12, 08:12 AM	#1
Harald_Lange Ensign Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: NY Harbour, Periscope depth. Posts: 235 Downloads: 160 Uploads: 0	Worldwide no-fly zone? I have GWX installed, with a handful of sound and realism mods. I'm playing February 1941. Other than the planes in port, I've not once seen any planes. At all. I know it sounds daft, but I actually would like to see some enemy planes. Plenty of ships, but no death from above. Is it due to the early stage of the war? I'm getting radio messages about air raids all the time, so I'd expect to see a few at least. (btw, the fix french mod was an oversight, I am turning it off next time I'm in port.)

02-21-12, 08:30 AM	#2
Raticon Seaman Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: The Arctic Posts: 38 Downloads: 4 Uploads: 0	If you are running at high TC, 256 or higher, no enemy planes will spawn near you and those allready in the air will "jump past" you becuase of their high speed and the high TC. Also, ealy in the war the allies planes didn't have good range or detection, so you'll mainly encounter them close (very close!) to the british coast. merchants and escorts detecting you will sometimes call for their buddies in the RAF to come and ruin your day. To experiment, i suggest you cruise towards the british coast, save the game and run in a pattern close to the british coast first at 256 or 512 TC, write down anything you see (or don't see!) and then repeat the same pattern in a TC of 64 or slower. Naturally, weather has to be fine and preferably daytime. Report your findings, as i have "succeeded" in getting attacked by enemy planes when playing at low TC near britain, but had the "misfortune" of evading them while in the same waters running at higher TC. We could evaluate our findings together as my results mainly are Sep 1939 to January 1941 when i shifted from coastal britain to the high seas due to getting the VIIC. I consider this a bug, or a consequence of game mechanics working as they do. Perhaps a mod exists to fix it? __________________ Ping.........Ping......Ping....Ping...Ping..Ping.P ingPingPing KABOOM!

02-21-12, 08:34 AM	#3
u crank Old enough to know better Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Prince Edward Island Posts: 11,747 Downloads: 136 Uploads: 0	Feb. 1941 air cover was still limited. Go to f5 map view and look at pull down map. In 1941 areas around England, Gibraltar and Iceland had some air patrols but it's sparse. In my current patrol I've sailed from Lorient to Gibraltar area and have seen only one small float plane. But don't worry, it will only get worse. By 1943 there are planes every where. They even bomb you in port! Good hunting Harald and enjoy the clear skies while you can. __________________ “Two possibilities exist: either we are alone in the Universe or we are not. Both are equally terrifying.” ― Arthur C. Clarke

02-21-12, 08:55 AM	#5
Captain Nemo Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: London, England Posts: 1,144 Downloads: 54 Uploads: 0	High TC and spawning of aircraft was explained in a post by Letum back in 2006, he wrote: "Aircraft spawn at high TC, the problem is that they miss the player. Here's the maths: Units (Planes, ships, etc.) in the 3d world around the players boat have their positions calculated in real time. This does not change with TC settings. Units Outside of the 3d world (about 32km away from your boat) units do not have their positions calculated in real time to save on CPU. It would be impossible to calculate the position of every single convoy, destroyer and plane constantly. Insted the game works from the 2d map that mod makers will be familiar with. The game only updates a units position every "time step". If the unit's position falls within the 3d world round the u-boat the game will begin to calculate it in real time. If it was possible to see a unit outside the 3d world you would see it move in jumps every time step. When you speed up TC these time steps do not speed up. This mean that the jumps these units make gets bigger. If the time step happens every second, a aeroplane is moving at 1m per second will jump 1m every time step at 1xTC. At 2xTC it will jump 2m per time step. At x1024 TC it will jump 1024m. (numbers not accurate - I don't know how oftern the time steps are!) The faster the unit's speed: The bigger the jumps are. The higher the TC: the bigger the jumps are. For a fast unit like a aeroplane the jumps get very big at high TC and the aeroplane can jump right past the 32km radius round the player's boat. Alto the planes path went right past the U-Boat, the computer never calculated it's position to be near the u-boat so the plane never got placed in the 3d world. The computer and the player have no idea that a plane just passed them". Nemo __________________ "I'm afraid there is no disguising the fact that King's obsession with the Pacific and the Battle of Washington cost us dear in the Battle of the Atlantic". Sir John Slessor GCB, DSO, MC, DL AOC-in-C Coastal Command RAF ___________________________________________

02-21-12, 09:18 AM	#6
Herr-Berbunch Kaiser Bill's batman Join Date: May 2010 Location: AN72 Posts: 13,203 Downloads: 76 Uploads: 0	Go for a slow sail around Iceland, even in '41 they will come - and that's where I've seen most of my enemy aircraft. But, I think you're a fool for wanting such a death. __________________

02-21-12, 05:11 PM	#8
Brag Navy Seal Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Docked on a Russian pond Posts: 7,072 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	Get within aircraft range from base in Gigraltar, plenty of airplanes fly from there. __________________ Espionage, adventure, suspense, are just a click away Click here to look inside Brag's book: Amazon.com: Kingmaker: Alexey Braguine: Books Order Kingmaker here: http://www.subsim.com/store.html For Tactics visit:http://www.freewebs.com/kielman/

02-23-12, 12:25 PM	#11
Jimbuna Chief of the Boat Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: 250 metres below the surface Posts: 190,712 Downloads: 63 Uploads: 13	Keep tc to 18x max and sail around the northern tip of Scotland and I guarantee you'll get almost repeatedly buzzed by Ansons and Swordfish. __________________ Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because they have to say something. Oh my God, not again!!

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