Into the Storm - AAR

[p7p8]

Some screens from playing. (At beginning I forgot to make screens - sorry)

My loadout:





After start I've increased altitude for better radar range detection.
I also made some ploting around interested area (I assumed target speed around 15 kts - but it was 20!)

Finally I found first 50 Hz contact form deep sonobuoys. Target was outside ploted circle!





Predicting target speed:



I hadn't permission to attack. My task was to track target. After some time i've recived permission for attack and for droping DICASS.



My 2 mines splash water too far from target. Yankee was only damaged! (I didn't know how badly).

So I made another approach:





Yankee was deadly hit!





Mission sumary:




Some words after game. This is very nice scenario. Not too hard but very immersive.

Props:
- good map
- immersive messages, weather and "cold war" climate
- tracking target before attack permission (really good idea)
- many "contacts" on way to OPAREA
- good idea for scenario

Cons:
- civilian traffic is to heavy for stormy weather
- lack of other (civilian) 50 Hz contacts near target
- player is "untouchable" all the time (some russian small warships would be nice)
- lack of allied SSN (british HMS Spartan submarine) who "lost contact" with soviet sub.
- soviet sub starts too far from "last known position".
- lack of information what was course of soviet submarine (W, SW etc.)


Of course this is my opinion. All cons are minor, because mission is very fun for playing.

I recommend this mission to all DW players, not only Orion drivers.

Good work NippleSpanner


(sorry for my bad english)

Originally Posted by p7p8

Some words after game. This is very nice scenario. Not too hard but very immersive.

Props:
- good map
- immersive messages, weather and "cold war" climate
- tracking target before attack permission (really good idea)
- many "contacts" on way to OPAREA
- good idea for scenario

Cons:
- civilian traffic is to heavy for stormy weather
- lack of other (civilian) 50 Hz contacts near target
- player is "untouchable" all the time (some russian small warships would be nice)
- lack of allied SSN (british HMS Spartan submarine) who "lost contact" with soviet sub.
- soviet sub starts too far from "last known position".
- lack of information what was course of soviet submarine (W, SW etc.)


Of course this is my opinion. All cons are minor, because mission is very fun for playing.

I recommend this mission to all DW players, not only Orion drivers.

Good work NippleSpanner


(sorry for my bad english)

Thank you for your kind words and the feedback - it helps a lot and gives me a few ideas I'll try to implement/change - like not allowing mines altogether, since they are just an uncontrollable hazard in civilian waters, torpedoes not so much.

- good map

All hail Stewy1 for his template-pack!

- civilian traffic is to heavy for stormy weather

Can you elaborate?

- lack of other (civilian) 50 Hz contacts near target

Good point! I wanted to adjust the difficulty anyways - the mission is too easy, I was aware of that, but figured to release it anyways and wait for response.

- player is "untouchable" all the time

And it will stay that way, at least in this scenario. It's not meant as a "challenge" in regards of survivability, it's your typical "cold war gone hot POSSUB hunt"

- lack of allied SSN (british HMS Spartan submarine) who "lost contact" with soviet sub.

Thanks for the salt in the wound, haha.
Here's the reason: The AI sub sends link-contacts all the time, which I do not want for this scenario, I want the player to be the sole hunter-
I had the Spartan ingame initially, but it caused only problems and I couldn't figure out a workaround that's worth it.

- soviet sub starts too far from "last known position".

How do you know?
The player has no information what the enemy sub (there are 4 random ones, picked at mission start btw.) has done in the hour after HMS Spartan lost contact.
It can spawn relatively close, or rather far away - simulating slow/fast speed, and to help with replayability.

- lack of information what was course of soviet submarine (W, SW etc.)

On purpose. Let's assume HMS Spartan did not had contact long enough to really determine this, or let's assume the soviet sub changes course etc.
Additionally, the briefing does mention the sub is heading for the Denmark Strait, which is due West, roughly.

I'm sorry it was ultimately way too easy for a seasoned player like you, the AAR clearly shows you know the drill and I actually want to design missions for players like you, the type that plays "thoroughly"... if that makes any sense.

[p7p8]

- civilian traffic is to heavy for stormy weather

Sea state in this mission is 5 (maximum from editor). When weather is so bad, most of ships are in safe place like port. Especially very small like this one:



and this one:



In your mission you have 31 civilian ships in the middle of heavy storm.

The AI sub sends link-contacts all the time, which I do not want for this scenario, I want the player to be the sole hunter-
I had the Spartan ingame initially, but it caused only problems and I couldn't figure out a workaround that's worth it.

You can give HMS Spartan separate side and add alliance with your side. Allied platforms don't link. It would be fun to detect HMS Spartan instead Yankee

- soviet sub starts too far from "last known position".

My target was "SovSub 3. Sub was 10 nmi from edge of circle, so speed for him should be minimum 20 kts (30 minutes and range 10 nmi). But Yankee had speed only 11 kts! Of course we don't know how fast he goes before Orion start but HMS Spartan shouldn't lost track of very noisy (20 kts!) sub like Yankee.

I think better solution is give player quite correct last position of soviet sub but increase time for since contact lost. (Weather is so bad, Orion couldn't start earlier)

On purpose. Let's assume HMS Spartan did not had contact long enough to really determine this, or let's assume the soviet sub changes course etc.
Additionally, the briefing does mention the sub is heading for the Denmark Strait, which is due West, roughly.

Sorry i've missing that information.

Like I said before, this scenario is very good and nice for playing.

Originally Posted by p7p8

When weather is so bad, most of ships are in safe place like port.

Yes, but ingame the weather isn't even that bad, despite the official sea state, that's why I left the fishers out there. But you raise a point worth thinking about!

Originally Posted by p7p8

In your mission you have 31 civilian ships in the middle of heavy storm.

Most are blue water vessels, though, they're build to withstand rough seas.
The fishermen, however...

Originally Posted by p7p8

You can give HMS Spartan separate side and add alliance with your side. Allied platforms don't link. It would be fun to detect HMS Spartan instead Yankee

Now that information is gold. Thank you!
Spartan will be back soon.
Overzealous players attacking this, instead of the enemy sub, was my original reason to add it besides immersion in the first place.

Originally Posted by p7p8

My target was "SovSub 3. Sub was 10 nmi from edge of circle, so speed for him should be minimum 20 kts (30 minutes and range 10 nmi). But Yankee had speed only 11 kts!

Ahh, of course! I didn't think about that when selecting the 4 random subs, good point! Expect this to be fixed in the next version.

Originally Posted by p7p8

I think better solution is give player quite correct last position of soviet sub but increase time for since contact lost. (Weather is so bad, Orion couldn't start earlier)

Again, very good point and idea, it suits the scenario perfectly.

Alright, I edited the mission according to your feedback.
I can't edit my original release-post, so I'll post the mission here for you in case you want to give it another go, and simply abuse you as a test-subject.
I'd sure appreciate it.

Changelog:
- Enemy sub(s) now have 3hrs headstart instead of 30min
- Fishing vessels removed / approaching Reykjavik to evade the storm
- HMS Spartan (SSN 111) is back in
- Yankee-class spawn position fixed
- Other subs spawn positions adjusted
- Civilian and fauna traffic redone from scratch
- Mines are prohibited, orders adjusted accordingly
- If player drops torpedoes or mine, mission will abort
- adjustments to, hopefully, raise the difficulty of the mission
- Penguin 2 -> Penguin 8 - whydidn'tidosointhefirstplace?

Raw Mission:

 

VERSION 3
OWNALLIANCE 0
DIFFICULTY 3
TOTALNUMSIDES 3
NUMDRIVEABLES 1
MONTH 7
WORLDGRID 2
LATLONG 66.325714 -13.221366
;
SEASTATE 5
MDR 0 0 0
BOTTOMTYPE 1
TIMEOFDAY 5
WEATHER 2
CLOUDHEIGHT 1000
SSP 0
PEACETIMESIDE 0
PEACETIMESIDE 1
PEACETIMESIDE 2
PEACETIMESIDE 3
PEACETIMESIDE 4
PEACETIMESIDE 5
PEACETIMESIDE 6
PEACETIMESIDE 7
DESCRIPTION
BEGINTEXT
On a stormy November day in 1984, Penguin 8 (VP-11) is taking off at Naval Air Station Keflavik after receiving orders to find and track a possible soviet submarine contact heading for the Denmark Strait...<R>

<R>

<R>

Designed by Nippelspanner (v1.1, 2017)<R>

Created f
or Reinforce Alert<R>


ENDTEXT
MISSIONTITLE
BEGINTEXT
[NS] P-3C Orion #01: Into the Storm
ENDTEXT
ALLIANCETEAM "NATO" 0 2
GROUP "SSBN 1" 3 25 3 3 7 -1
GROUP "SSBN 2" 4 25 3 3 7 -1
GROUP "SSBN 3" 5 25 3 3 7 -1
GROUP "SSBN 4" 6 25 3 3 7 -1
GROUP "Subs" 7 0 1 1 -1 -1
GROUP "Change ROE" 9 100 1 1 -1 -1
GROUP "DICASS penlty" 11 0 1 1 -1 -1
GROUP "Kill sub goal" 13 0 1 1 -1 -1
GROUP "Order RTB" 16 0 1 1 -1 -1
GROUP "Await orders" 18 0 1 1 -1 -1
GROUP "Await Orders2" 20 0 1 1 -1 -1


LOCATIONPARENT
BEGIN
ID 1
MIN 5
MAX 5
LOCATION "Location 1" 1 181202.031250 841291.312500
LOCATION "Location 13" 13 194460.671875 806566.312500
LOCATION "Location 14" 14 206772.265625 774998.125000
LOCATION "Location 15" 15 180570.671875 765212.000000
LOCATION "Location 16" 16 168259.078125 797411.562500
LOCATION "Location 17" 17 153421.703125 833241.812500
LOCATION "Location 18" 18 125957.375000 824718.375000
LOCATION "Location 19" 19 136848.406250 787941.437500
LOCATION "Location 20" 20 148528.625000 753847.812500
LOCATION "Location 21" 21 122011.359375 743903.875000
LOCATION "Location 22" 22 107489.992188 780838.625000
LOCATION "Location 23" 23 95020.562500 817142.000000
LOCATION "Location 24" 24 74185.562500 810354.875000
LOCATION "Location 25" 25 86339.312500 772315.187500
LOCATION "Location 26" 26 99440.109375 735538.250000
LOCATION "Location 29" 29 167785.218750 819667.437500
END
WINDREGION Wind
RECT 9871.319336 1060867.500000 1063833.625000 12826.333008
WINDSPEED 18
WINDDIR 55
WINDGUSTSPEED 24
MINMAXHT 5 11000
END
WATERREGION Water
RECT 1063833.375000 1052972.625000 43424.367188 46379.558594
WATERCURRENTSPEED 1.200000
WATERDIR 55
MINMAXHT 150 0
END


ENTITY 1308 BUILDINGENTITY
HULLID 16
ALLIANCE 0
POS 100253.171875 329022.375000 0
POINTS 500
COURSE 0
SPEED 0
PROB 100
UNIQUENAME "+ NAS Keflavik"
AUTODETECT 1
AIRLOADOUT -1
AIRCRAFT 261 0
END

ENTITY 261 AIRENTITY
HULLID 127
ALLIANCE 0
POS 100193.625000 329238.593750 220
POINTS 100
COURSE 179
SPEED 160
PROB 100
DRIVEABLE 1
PLAYERTASKING
BEGINTEXT
Z180445ZNOV<R>

<R>

FM NASKEF<R>

TO PENGUIN 8 (VP-11)<R>

SUBJ PATROL ORDERS<R>

BT<R>

RESTRICTED<R>

1. HMS SPARTAN (SSN 111) LOST CONTACT WITH A POSSIBLE SOVIET SUBMARINE CONTACT IN HEAVY WEATHER CONDITIONS 3 HRS AGO.<R>

ASSUME POSSUB IS HEADING FOR DENMARK STRAIT AT BEST TACTICAL S
PEED.<R>

2. HEAD TO LAST KNOWN POS AND TRY TO REESTABLISH CONTACT.<R>

3. CONFIRM CONTACT VIA MAD AND TRACK UNTIL FURTHER NOTICE.<R>

4. SSQ-62 DICASS USAGE PROHIBITED UNTIL FURTHER NOTICE.<R>

5. EXPECT LOW CIVILIAN MARITIME TRAFFIC IN OPAREA DUE TO SEA STATE 5..<R>

6. PEA
CE TIME ROE IN EFFECT.<R>

BT<R>

NNNN<R>

<R>


ENDTEXT
UNIQUENAME "P3C Orion (Penguin 8)"
LOADOUTTYPE "ASW"
IFF 0
SOURCEOBJHULLID 16 INFLIGHT
TACTIC TRANSIT
WAYPOINT 100195.414063 325368.062500 500 350 -1 0.000000
AIRLOADOUT -1
END

ENTITY 2216 SUBENTITY
HULLID 180
ALLIANCE 2
POS 183655.796875 822492.125000 -750
POINTS 750
COURSE 212
SPEED 7
PROB 100
UNIQUENAME "HMS Spartan (SSN 111)"
COMMSINTERVAL 0.000000
RANDOMSTARTBOX 176948.093750 829669.375000 190363.484375 815314.875000
TACTIC TRANSIT
WAYPOINT 166820.453125 796474.875000 -500 8 -1 10.000000
WAYPOINT 129592.906250 833367.062500 -1000 10 -1 10.000000
WAYPOINT 129458.757813 777693.187500 -800 7 -1 10.000000
WAYPOINT 73784.906250 777693.187500 -500 10 -1 10.000000
AIRLOADOUT -1
END

ENTITY 2364 SUBENTITY
HULLID 19
ALLIANCE 1
POS 131434.625000 833969.062500 -900
POINTS 750
COURSE 269
SPEED 8
PROB 100
UNIQUENAME "SovSub 1"
COMMSINTERVAL 0.000000
GROUP 3
RANDOMSTARTBOX 130495.539063 834891.375000 132373.703125 833046.750000
TACTIC TRANSIT
WAYPOINT 92758.960938 833465.375000 -900 10 -1 10.000000
WAYPOINT 55590.453125 814718.562500 -900 8 -1 10.000000
WAYPOINT 28960.085938 785438.187500 -900 10 -1 0.000000
AIRLOADOUT -1
END

ENTITY 2337 SUBENTITY
HULLID 22
ALLIANCE 1
POS 148729.859375 797059.562500 -1200
POINTS 750
COURSE 212
SPEED 6
PROB 100
UNIQUENAME "SovSub 2"
COMMSINTERVAL 0.000000
GROUP 4
RANDOMSTARTBOX 147786.390625 798003.062500 149673.328125 796116.062500
TACTIC TRANSIT
WAYPOINT 133272.890625 773191.562500 -1200 6 -1 10.000000
WAYPOINT 92786.851563 796244.062500 -600 10 -1 10.000000
WAYPOINT 54627.585938 757235.875000 -800 10 -1 0.000000
AIRLOADOUT -1
END

ENTITY 3990 SUBENTITY
HULLID 23
ALLIANCE 1
POS 157816.562500 812059.750000 -500
POINTS 750
COURSE 265
SPEED 7
PROB 100
UNIQUENAME "SovSub 3"
COMMSINTERVAL 0.000000
GROUP 5
RANDOMSTARTBOX 156909.015625 812967.312500 158724.109375 811152.187500
TACTIC TRANSIT
WAYPOINT 113703.906250 808402.375000 -250 5 -1 10.000000
WAYPOINT 92385.656250 759471.062500 -500 6 -1 10.000000
WAYPOINT 74270.882813 722486.812500 -350 10 -1 0.000000
AIRLOADOUT -1
END

ENTITY 380 SUBENTITY
HULLID 24
ALLIANCE 1
POS 170504.000000 771431.437500 -1000
POINTS 750
COURSE 252
SPEED 7
PROB 100
UNIQUENAME "SovSub 4"
COMMSINTERVAL 0.000000
GROUP 6
RANDOMSTARTBOX 169531.468750 772349.937500 171476.515625 770512.937500
TACTIC TRANSIT
WAYPOINT 132860.171875 759584.375000 -800 5 -1 10.000000
WAYPOINT 111602.585938 740922.187500 -1200 10 -1 10.000000
WAYPOINT 74031.039063 740922.187500 -628 7 -1 0.000000
AIRLOADOUT 227
AIRCRAFT 1722 1 Alert5 0 : Alert15 1 : 0 Alert30 0 :
END

GOAL 370441.250000 704059.937500 0.000000
BEGIN
GOALNAME "Reestablish POSSUB contact"
GOALID 3
PARENTGOALID -1
GOALTYPE 3
TRIGGERTYPE 2
STARTTIME 0
ENDTIME 0
POINTS 25
MAXSPEED -1
MINDEPTH -1.000000
MAXDEPTH -1.000000
RETURNTOBASE 0
CRITICAL 1
AUDIO E_Misc_27.wav
CREATEGROUP 18
ACTION 1
GOALDOCTRINE
BEGINTEXT
IF ( CompletedGoal -1 4 ) and<R>

( TimeSinceGoalTriggered 4 > 5 ) then<R>

GoalTriggered <R>

ENDIF
ENDTEXT
MESSAGETYPEID 1
MESSAGETOHULLID 127
BEGINTEXT
TACCO: I think we got something here guys! Possible submerged contact reestablished! Let's track that guy until we hear from NASKEF!
ENDTEXT
END
GOAL 407545.593750 648410.062500 0.000000
BEGIN
GOALNAME "Kill the Soviet submarine"
GOALID 11
PARENTGOALID -1
GOALTYPE 6
GROUP 13
TRIGGERTYPE 2
GOALAGGDEPENDENT -1 8
GOALAGGMIN 1
STARTTIME 0
ENDTIME 0
POINTS 50
MAXSPEED -1
MINDEPTH -1.000000
MAXDEPTH -1.000000
RETURNTOBASE 0
CRITICAL 1
CREATEGROUP 20
ACTION 1
GOALDOCTRINE
BEGINTEXT
IF ( CompletedGoal -1 15 ) or<R>

( CompletedGoal -1 16 ) or<R>

( CompletedGoal -1 17 ) or<R>

( CompletedGoal -1 18 ) then<R>

GoalTriggered <R>

ENDIF
ENDTEXT
MESSAGETYPEID 1
MESSAGETOHULLID 127
BEGINTEXT

ENDTEXT
END
GOAL 388762.500000 648252.250000 0.000000
BEGIN
GOALNAME "Penalty for using SSQ-62 DICASS! "
GOALID 13
PARENTGOALID -1
GOALTYPE 3
GROUP 11
TRIGGERTYPE 2
STARTTIME 0
ENDTIME 0
POINTS -50
MAXSPEED -1
MINDEPTH -1.000000
MAXDEPTH -1.000000
RETURNTOBASE 0
MESSAGETYPEID 0
BEGINTEXT

ENDTEXT
END
GOAL 100314.062500 329032.906250 0.550000
BEGIN
GOALNAME "Return to NASKEF"
GOALID 24
PARENTGOALID -1
GOALTYPE 0
GROUP 16
TRIGGERTYPE 2
STARTTIME 0
ENDTIME 0
POINTS 25
MAXSPEED -1
MINDEPTH -1.000000
MAXDEPTH -1.000000
RETURNTOBASE 0
CRITICAL 1
AUDIO E_Misc_06.wav
OBJTOPROSECUTECOUNTRY 16
OBJTOPROSECUTECLASS 22
GOALDOCTRINE
BEGINTEXT
IF ( CompletedGoal -1 25 ) then<R>

GoalTriggered <R>

ENDIF
ENDTEXT
MESSAGETYPEID 1
MESSAGETOHULLID 127
BEGINTEXT
Mission accomplished. Report for debriefing.
ENDTEXT
END
GOAL 351579.468750 686815.062500 0.000000
BEGIN
GOALNAME "[ACTION] Spawn ENY sub"
GOALID 1
PARENTGOALID -1
GOALTYPE 3
TRIGGERTYPE 1
STARTTIME 0
ENDTIME 0
POINTS 100
MAXSPEED -1
MINDEPTH -1.000000
MAXDEPTH -1.000000
RETURNTOBASE 0
CREATEGROUP 7
ACTION 1
MESSAGETYPEID 0
BEGINTEXT

ENDTEXT
END
GOAL 6024.830078 710802.812500 50.000000
BEGIN
GOALNAME "[ACTION] Soviet Sub Escapes"
GOALID 2
PARENTGOALID -1
GOALTYPE 0
TRIGGERTYPE 1
STARTTIME 0
ENDTIME 0
POINTS 100
MAXSPEED -1
MINDEPTH -1.000000
MAXDEPTH -1.000000
RETURNTOBASE 0
AUDIO ns_sfx_message_beep.wav
OBJTOPROSECUTECOUNTRY 14
MESSAGETYPEID 1
BEGINTEXT
Return to base, looks like the Soviet sub escaped... if it ever was here in the first place.<R>

<R>

== END OF MISSION ==<R>

<R>


ENDTEXT
END
GOAL 351814.343750 703813.250000 0.000000
BEGIN
GOALNAME "[ACTION] SovSub detected"
GOALID 4
PARENTGOALID -1
GOALTYPE 3
TRIGGERTYPE 1
STARTTIME 0
ENDTIME 0
POINTS 100
MAXSPEED -1
MINDEPTH -1.000000
MAXDEPTH -1.000000
RETURNTOBASE 0
GOALDOCTRINE
BEGINTEXT
IF ( CompletedGoal -1 19 ) or<R>

( CompletedGoal -1 20 ) or<R>

( CompletedGoal -1 21 ) or<R>

( CompletedGoal -1 22 ) then<R>

GoalTriggered <R>

ENDIF
ENDTEXT
MESSAGETYPEID 1
BEGINTEXT

ENDTEXT
END
GOAL 351814.375000 666806.187500 0.000000
BEGIN
GOALNAME "[ACTION] ROE Change (MSG)"
GOALID 8
PARENTGOALID -1
GOALTYPE 3
GROUP 9
TRIGGERTYPE 1
STARTTIME 0
ENDTIME 0
POINTS 100
MAXSPEED -1
MINDEPTH -1.000000
MAXDEPTH -1.000000
RETURNTOBASE 0
CREATEOBJECT 2 0
ACTION 3
GOALDOCTRINE
BEGINTEXT
IF ( CompletedGoal -1 4 ) and<R>

( TimeSinceGoalTriggered 4 > 1999 ) then<R>

GoalTriggered <R>

ENDIF
ENDTEXT
MESSAGETYPEID 0
MESSAGETOHULLID 127
BEGINTEXT
FM NASKEF<R>

TO PENGUIN 8 (VP-11)<R>

SUBJ ROE CHANGED<R>

BT<R>

RESTRICTED<R>

1. CLEARED TO ENGAGE SUBMERGED SOVIET CONTACTS INSIDE OPAREA ICELAND/GREENLAND EEZ.<R>

2. CLEARED TO USE SSQ-62 DICASS SONOBUOYS.<R>

3. USAGE OF MINES PROHIBITED.<R>

<R>

BT<R>

NNNN<R>

<R>


ENDTEXT
END
GOAL 352906.125000 648558.500000 800.000000
BEGIN
GOALNAME "[ACTION] DICASS deep used"
GOALID 9
PARENTGOALID -1
GOALTYPE 0
TRIGGERTYPE 1
STARTTIME 0
ENDTIME 0
POINTS 100
MAXSPEED -1
MINDEPTH -1.000000
MAXDEPTH -1.000000
RETURNTOBASE 0
AUDIO ns_sfx_message_beep.wav
OBJTOPROSECUTEENT 1756
CREATEGROUP 11
ACTION 1
GOALDOCTRINE
BEGINTEXT
IF not ( CompletedGoal -1 8 ) then<R>

GoalTriggered <R>

ENDIF
ENDTEXT
MESSAGETYPEID 1
MESSAGETOHULLID 127
BEGINTEXT
TACCO: Err, NASKEF didn't want use to use DICASS until further notice. You know, "save the whales" 'n all that...
ENDTEXT
END
GOAL 370435.156250 648379.625000 800.000000
BEGIN
GOALNAME "[ACTION] DICASS shallow used"
GOALID 10
PARENTGOALID -1
GOALTYPE 0
TRIGGERTYPE 1
STARTTIME 0
ENDTIME 0
POINTS 100
MAXSPEED -1
MINDEPTH -1.000000
MAXDEPTH -1.000000
RETURNTOBASE 0
AUDIO ns_sfx_message_beep.wav
OBJTOPROSECUTEENT 1645
CREATEGROUP 11
ACTION 1
GOALDOCTRINE
BEGINTEXT
IF ( CompletedGoal -1 8 ) then<R>

GoalTriggered <R>

ENDIF
ENDTEXT
MESSAGETYPEID 1
MESSAGETOHULLID 127
BEGINTEXT
ACCO: Err, NASKEF didn't want use to use DICASS until further notice. You know, "save the whales" 'n all that...
ENDTEXT
END
GOAL 220124.656250 745058.125000 120.000000
BEGIN
GOALNAME "[MSG] LINK11 reminder"
GOALID 12
PARENTGOALID -1
GOALTYPE 0
TRIGGERTYPE 1
STARTTIME 0
ENDTIME 0
POINTS 100
MAXSPEED -1
MINDEPTH -1.000000
MAXDEPTH -1.000000
RETURNTOBASE 0
AUDIO ns_sfx_message_beep.wav
OBJTOPROSECUTECOUNTRY 16
OBJTOPROSECUTECLASS 22
MESSAGETYPEID 1
MESSAGETOHULLID 127
BEGINTEXT
TACCO: Recommend activating LINK 11.
ENDTEXT
END
GOAL 134268.625000 831202.125000 0.000000
BEGIN
GOALNAME "SovSub 1 killed"
GOALID 15
PARENTGOALID -1
GOALTYPE 2
GROUP 3
DAMAGE 100
TRIGGERTYPE 1
STARTTIME 0
ENDTIME 0
POINTS 100
MAXSPEED -1
MINDEPTH -1.000000
MAXDEPTH -1.000000
RETURNTOBASE 0
ATTACHEDTARGETOBJ 19
MESSAGETYPEID 0
BEGINTEXT

ENDTEXT
END
GOAL 151579.156250 794285.750000 0.000000
BEGIN
GOALNAME "SovSub 2 killed"
GOALID 16
PARENTGOALID -1
GOALTYPE 2
GROUP 4
DAMAGE 100
TRIGGERTYPE 1
STARTTIME 0
ENDTIME 0
POINTS 100
MAXSPEED -1
MINDEPTH -1.000000
MAXDEPTH -1.000000
RETURNTOBASE 0
ATTACHEDTARGETOBJ 22
MESSAGETYPEID 0
BEGINTEXT

ENDTEXT
END
GOAL 160579.828125 809323.562500 0.000000
BEGIN
GOALNAME "SovSub 3 killed"
GOALID 17
PARENTGOALID -1
GOALTYPE 2
GROUP 5
DAMAGE 100
TRIGGERTYPE 1
STARTTIME 0
ENDTIME 0
POINTS 100
MAXSPEED -1
MINDEPTH -1.000000
MAXDEPTH -1.000000
RETURNTOBASE 0
ATTACHEDTARGETOBJ 23
MESSAGETYPEID 0
BEGINTEXT

ENDTEXT
END
GOAL 173241.484375 768585.875000 0.000000
BEGIN
GOALNAME "SovSub 4 killed"
GOALID 18
PARENTGOALID -1
GOALTYPE 2
GROUP 6
DAMAGE 100
TRIGGERTYPE 1
STARTTIME 0
ENDTIME 0
POINTS 100
MAXSPEED -1
MINDEPTH -1.000000
MAXDEPTH -1.000000
RETURNTOBASE 0
ATTACHEDTARGETOBJ 24
MESSAGETYPEID 0
BEGINTEXT

ENDTEXT
END
GOAL 128667.695313 831202.125000 800.000000
BEGIN
GOALNAME "SovSub 1 detected"
GOALID 19
PARENTGOALID -1
GOALTYPE 0
GROUP 3
TRIGGERTYPE 1
STARTTIME 0
ENDTIME 0
POINTS 100
MAXSPEED -1
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FM NASKEF<R>

TO PENGUIN 8 (VP-11)<R>

SUBJ ORDERS<R>

BT<R>

RESTRICTED<R>

1. GOOD KILL. RETURN TO NASKEF AT BEST SPEED.<R>

BT<R>

NNNN<R>

<R>


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TACCO: That's a kill! I can hear the boat breaking up. May God have mercy on their souls...
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ENDTEXT
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SetROE 0 1 <R>

SetROE 1 1 <R>

CreateGroup 13 <R>


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LINE 353.251007 115.212822 321.593048 104.165024
LINE 321.593048 104.165024 298.569092 104.350700
LINE 298.569092 104.350700 292.163239 116.883919
LINE 292.163239 116.883919 253.170990 133.780548
LINE 253.170990 133.780548 245.558228 135.544479
LINE 245.558228 135.544479 209.444016 150.027298
LINE 209.444016 150.027298 112.149147 176.671982
LINE 112.150879 176.671402 45.119667 198.674744
LINE 45.119667 198.674744 16.339697 207.958603
LINE 16.339697 207.958603 1.864509 215.496582
LINE 1.864509 215.496582 0.077768 216.506470
LINE 487.922180 325.455292 525.237915 330.079956
LINE 525.237915 330.079956 532.604492 331.269958
LINE 532.604492 331.269958 567.170776 342.263153
LINE 567.170776 342.263153 598.903748 357.449677
LINE 598.903748 357.449677 598.994934 357.495300
LINE 449.788971 214.689285 465.477325 209.642593
LINE 465.477325 209.642593 496.272247 191.284073
LINE 496.272247 191.284073 505.352783 183.782745
LINE 505.352783 183.782745 512.901733 180.012390
LINE 512.901733 180.012390 540.864746 156.648499
LINE 540.864746 156.648499 563.860779 130.157166
LINE 563.860779 130.157166 581.889587 100.630371
LINE 581.889587 100.630371 583.913269 94.007538
LINE 583.913269 94.007538 594.167297 67.115356
LINE 594.167297 67.115356 596.758118 55.641617
LINE 596.758118 55.641617 598.906311 46.205650
LINE 298.569122 104.350334 290.934692 84.816399
LINE 290.934692 84.816399 303.218414 2.486076
LINE 303.218414 2.486076 303.364655 1.096843
LINE 296.786041 586.964905 291.030579 598.308472
LINE 291.030579 598.308472 290.684448 598.985168
END
MAPCIRCLES
CIRCLE 1 179598.296875 819227.375000 1.000000 255 0 0 -1
END

[p7p8]

New version completed.

This time my target was Delta III.


Getting high speed and altitude after start.




Decreasing atlitude near OPAREA (visible ploted circles and planed places for sonobuoys)




Sonobuoy plan




Sonobuoy work




Visible civilians from low altitude




First 50 Hz detected (sonobuoy #7)




Identification




Attack (after permission)







Going home




...going home




Risky landing




Summary





Nice work Nipplespanner

BTW do you know, all MPA's can start directly from airfield? (on the ground)

Uh, nice, I gotta try that buoy circles tactic!

What are MPA?
(oh, Maritime Patrol Aircraft I assume?)
And no, I did not know that, but I'm gonna check it out for future missions.

[p7p8]

MPA

For starting from ground, change this:

 

ENTITY 261 AIRENTITY
HULLID 127
ALLIANCE 0
POS 100190.921875 328277.343750 210
POINTS 100
COURSE 0
SPEED 160
PROB 100
DRIVEABLE 1
PLAYERTASKING
BEGINTEXT
Z180445ZNOV<R>

<R>

FM NASKEF<R>

TO PENGUIN 8 (VP-11)<R>

SUBJ PATROL ORDERS<R>

BT<R>

RESTRICTED<R>

1. HMS SPARTAN (SSN 111) LOST CONTACT WITH A POSSIBLE SOVIET SUBMARINE CONTACT IN HEAVY WEATHER CONDITIONS 3 HRS AGO.<R>

ASSUME POSSUB IS HEADING FOR DENMARK STRAIT AT BEST TACTICAL S
PEED.<R>

2. HEAD TO LAST KNOWN POS AND TRY TO REESTABLISH CONTACT.<R>

3. CONFIRM CONTACT VIA MAD AND TRACK UNTIL FURTHER NOTICE.<R>

4. SSQ-62 DICASS USAGE PROHIBITED UNTIL FURTHER NOTICE.<R>

5. EXPECT LOW CIVILIAN MARITIME TRAFFIC IN OPAREA DUE TO SEA STATE 5..<R>

6. PEA
CE TIME ROE IN EFFECT.<R>

BT<R>

NNNN<R>

<R>


ENDTEXT
UNIQUENAME "P3C Orion (Penguin 8)"
LOADOUTTYPE "ASW"
IFF 0
SOURCEOBJHULLID 16 INFLIGHT
TACTIC TRANSIT
WAYPOINT 100204.046875 333664.406250 500 350 -1 0.000000
AIRLOADOUT -1
END

...or, you can manualy change position for P3 Orion:

1) Place airplane on South end of airstrip, heading North
2) Give altitude 200-210 (on 3d view half of airplane should be under airstrip concrete)


Starting procedure:

1) Set gear down! - most important thing
2) press "3" (high speed)

(I didn't see your edition before. Long time for postin was caused chcecking changes for Penguin 8 in mission editor)

Ah, so the takeoff-feature is more or less a glitch/workaround, not intended?
At least it sounds like it (having to lower the gear while...being on the ground lol).
In that case I'd rather stick to the current way of just getting airborne, I find it immersive enough.

So, since you really seem to master that P3, do you have further recommendations for future P3 missions?
I'd like to create more of them, but I'm not too sure what to do - and how to balance it so it is challenging but not frustrating (searching for 10 hours, nothing's happening...)

Any input is very welcome, and thanks again for playing - glad you enjoyed it!

[p7p8]

Originally Posted by Nippelspanner

Ah, so the takeoff-feature is more or less a glitch/workaround, not intended?

I don't think so. In my opinion it was "undone feature" because game engine recognizes specific position for aircrafts. Vanila DW had many bugs - too early relased

Originally Posted by Nippelspanner

So, since you really seem to master that P3, do you have further recommendations for future P3 missions?

Oh no! I am surface and sub player. MPA is only "anomaly" because nobody makes "non-training" missions for sub and surf unit

What do you mean, non-training missions?
As in war-scenarios?

Most DW scenarios are live combat scenarios?

[p7p8]

I wanna fight! But many latest community missions are for training: detection/TMA/maintaining speed/depth and other ridiculus things. Those kind of missions i can make in 5 minutes. Only writing descriptions takes lots of time.

DW is simulation on tactical level! I don't care about my boat crew needs, and what knob should be on "5 degree value"
I have knowledge "how to kill" enemy and I am very good at this.

I wanna FIGHT against good and experienced enemy - not against scripted AI
This is main reason why I make only MP missions.

My favourites platform:
1) all surface units
2) almost all SSN/SSK submarine units

Hated platforms (for playing, not for oponent role):
- Seawolf, Virginia, Akula III, Lada, chinese KILO


Personal ranking for MPA
1) Il-38 May
2) S-3 Viking
3) Atlantic MK III
4) P-3 Orion (little too powerfull)

Helo - I don't like to play.
(most players like helo because they play ONLY missions, where Helo is safe all the time - without enemy SAM's or surface unit's with long/medium range missiles)

Unbalanced/useless platforms:
1) Tu-142 (unrealistic weapons, overpower)
2) Ghost (...)



I love Los Angeles Flt I/II/III - this is my favourite "all the time" platform.

====

Before you design new mission, please to remember this words, my friend:

I wanna fight

Originally Posted by p7p8

I wanna fight! But many latest community missions are for training: detection/TMA/maintaining speed/depth and other ridiculus things. Those kind of missions i can make in 5 minutes. Only writing descriptions takes lots of time.

Mh, easy there.
Personally, I can see why people are tired of "find X, kill X" missions.
They did that since 2003.
If a training scenario is well made, it can be quite immersive, at least in my opinion.
More importantly, you say all this as if the majority of stuff (be it recently or at all), are training scenarios like you described. Though I only know a handful - in total, and if at all. If you check Subguru.com, or Subsims archive, most missions are indeed "go and kill" - so I'm uncertain about your problem?
On top, these missions are more difficult/time consuming to create than the usual combat scenario - because you need to work a lot with triggers, scripts, custom SFX and usually more radio messages, really.

Originally Posted by p7p8

DW is simulation on tactical level! I don't care about my boat crew needs, and what knob should be on "5 degree value"
I have knowledge "how to kill" enemy and I am very good at this.

I wanna FIGHT against good and experienced enemy - not against scripted AI
This is main reason why I make only MP missions.

Crew needs?
Are we playing the same game?

Originally Posted by p7p8

Helo - I don't like to play.
(most players like helo because they play ONLY missions, where Helo is safe all the time - without enemy SAM's or surface unit's with long/medium range missiles)

Maybe, I never asked most players why they play what...
However, why is it a problem, assuming that is true?
Dangerous Waters is a sandbox, everyone can play as he pleases, no?

Originally Posted by p7p8

Unbalanced/useless platforms:
1) Tu-142 (unrealistic weapons, overpower)
2) Ghost (...)

Well, it's a Russian-made mod, with the usual "Uraaa!" bias. Check the database, you'll see.
As for that joke being 'Ghost, why even list it?
It's obviously not meant serious and, I guess, was more a proof-of-concept, whoever plays with that thing? And even if... you'd never know.

Originally Posted by p7p8

I love Los Angeles Flt I/II/III - this is my favourite "all the time" platform.

Same here, even prefer FLT I for 'nostalgic' and 'romantic' reasons (yes, Dallas, because Red October, I am that original...)

Originally Posted by p7p8

Before you design new mission, please to remember this words, my friend:

I wanna fight

Well, message received, but I really don't create missions for you personally, I follow my own taste, which so far was a mixture of scenarios and platforms, with one thing in common: All of them are late cold war period, except one (none released anyways, yet).

[p7p8]

First: my comment had facetious character, so don't be too serious.

If you check Subguru.com, or Subsims archive, most missions are indeed "go and kill" - so I'm uncertain about your problem?

Those missions aren't compatibile with newest RA.
Let's see, missions from last 5 years
- Stewy's Map pack1/2 - no comments
- NLL FONOPS - not for RA
- OHP work up training - and not for RA
- Seawolf work-ups training - and not for RA
- Cripple the Nevada
- OKHOTSK ASW - probably not compatibile
- INVINCIBLE SABOTAGE - probably not compatibile
- St. Petersburg Blockade - probably not compatibile
- all rest are too old

So, here we have only ONE non-training mission and TWO training missions. All missions on Subguru are not compatibile and too old.
All missions upgraded by RA team (in Scenario folder) are very old -all of them i have completed years ago.

Missions from Discord community are in most cases training or "sub-domination" - just bunch of submarines with random locations without any story or interesting task.

Crew needs?
Are we playing the same game?

That was joke about Silent Hunter style of "simulation"

About helos:

Maybe, I never asked most players why they play what...
However, why is it a problem, assuming that is true?
Dangerous Waters is a sandbox, everyone can play as he pleases, no?

I agree with you, that everyone play what he want. Problem is in MP. Many Helo/MPA players can't play well in dangerous zone - they are shooted down during first 15 minutes. Of course not all of them but too many

Well, message received, but I really don't create missions for you personally, I follow my own taste, which so far was a mixture of scenarios and platforms, with one thing in common: All of them are late cold war period, except one (none released anyways, yet).

Your taste is quite similar to my taste but i prefer MP scenarios. For example:
in your mission tracked sub don't make any evasive maneuvers! It is not too wise, because after some time sub is attacked. Human player can detect droped sonobuoys and change depth/speed before you drop first torpedo. Human player can surface own boat and shoot you down! MAD search is much more risky against human player.

If you still prefer play against AI i recommend add some scripts for simulation more smart behaviour. Maybe trigger "approach" with sono detection zone with script "change speed and depth to (...")? I don't really know how to simulate human behavior when "tactic" for AI sub is "transit".

Your mission is very good technicaly and with nice task and story. I also likes Cold War (not only late) era scenarios. Keep up your work

I really don't create missions for you personally

I know, but you asked me before:

(...) do you have further recommendations for future P3 missions?

... yes, i have recommendations:

I wanna fight




Thx for nice disscussion

Ah, that explains a thing or two.

Regarding evasive maneuvers for simple, that's possible, but rather difficult/time consuming to do, but I'll see if I can implement that.

As for old scenarios being incompatible with current RA, you're mistaken.
There are is just one case where a mission can be incompatible. FFG missions (because RA did changes in that regard). Besides that, missions may(!) play differently due to adjusted sensor values - but they are perfectly playable, technically.

For example, all of Bill Nichols missions work fine on my end, except one FFG mission that needed fixing.
Besides that, I play(ed) lots of missions I picked up at his page, some being 10 years old, or more.

What gives you the idea they are automatically incompatible?