Fiscal Cliff..

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

Hence the problem with society today. Everything is fatalism, gloom and doom. For decades men have stood on street corners with signs reading the end is near. Yet here we are. The media if full of nothing but bad news. How deep are we really in a mess? Has there been a time when the world was not in a deep mess? Major conflict and drama. There is always major conflict and drama. The only thing that has changed is we get fed the major conflict and drama instantaneously via the internet. Within in seconds the drama can be pumped to your desktop from hundreds of sources. In short, the world probably does not look very different from years ago with exception of us getting to see more of it at light speed as it streams to our monitors. The world has lived through depressions, wars, feast and famine. The only difference today, IMO, is we get to see it all in the comfort of our homes behind the warm glow of a monitor.

A guy holding up a booklet by The Watchtower I certainly do not take serious. But a history book on the hyperinflation of the 20s or the break-down of currency unions in Europe of the past 800 years - and how they all failed - I do take serious.

You see, some sectarians hiding in the cave because they predict the sky is falling, is one thing. Me being able to understand in reasonable terms and concepts today's economic links and ties, modern fiscal system etc, that is something different.

Or The Romans and ancient Greeks fearing the gods would punish them by destroying man's world - and 10,000 MIRVs in the multi-megaton range as we have had in the past couple of decades. It does not compare.

The threat of thermonuclear war is real, not just a sick psyche or superstitious hear-say. So is today's economic and financial system - it's real.

[geetrue]

Europe can learn from our mistakes not to hire young black men in their 40's with no prior business experience to run their country

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

Well, the age old argument is SS was not to be the sole form of your retirement funding. That is all well and dandy but I was told if I contribute it will be there for me. So like I said, were is my dough Mac?

Chris....we got fed the same crap in the UK, my retirement age was to be 65 and the wifes 60 but they have both been rounded up to 66 each....I give thanks my police/government pension remained untouched (I received mine at the age of fifty....five years ago) but my wife is understandably 'pissed off'.

I had one year added but she had six....so much for equality

[AVGWarhawk]

I remember the conversation about it a few months ago Jim. They jacked up your requirement. Age 62 I call it quits. Working the extra years for full benefits of SS is not worth the aggravation. I have saved on my own and still continue to do so. I did not and do not depend on anything coming from the government.

[August]

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

So you think we should just roll over and let them take it?

[Onkel Neal]

Originally Posted by mookiemookie

It's because the political spinmeisters have abused the term. The definition of an "entitlement" program is a program that is automatically funded without Congress reauthorizing it every year. Politicians have corrupted the meaning of the term to mean any program that the lazy (blacks/hispanics/leftists/union members/teachers/hippies/Democrats/communists/whatever the group of the week to hate/etc.) feel like they're "entitled" to.

It's the same way the creationists have tried to corrupt the word "theory" when referring to a scientific explanation for something.

I'm just wondering, is there a difference between a program that you pay into and are supposed to receive benefits; and a program that you receive benefits without making any contributions?

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by August

So you think we should just roll over and let them take it?

At our advanced age are we really going to storm Capitol Hill in our Hovarounds? They expect you to roll over and take it. Millions of folks just rolled over and took 2% off the top of each pay check. I got my first tax hike showing in my pay stub today. They wasted no time in the massive cash grab. I just rolled over and took it.

[August]

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

I just rolled over and took it.

Did you bother to write your congress critters and complain? Letter to the editor of your local newspaper? Do anything but roll over and take it?

Our system only works when we let our elected officials know our minds in no uncertain terms. Maybe they'll ignore it but your opinion still has to be made known to them and in no uncertain terms or else they'll figure you agree with their direction and ram it to you even more.

[geetrue]

Originally Posted by August

Did you bother to write your congress critters and complain? Letter to the editor of your local newspaper? Do anything but roll over and take it?

Our system only works when we let our elected officials know our minds in no uncertain terms. Maybe they'll ignore it but your opinion still has to be made known to them and in no uncertain terms or else they'll figure you agree with their direction and ram it to you even more.

That's good advice August ...

Trying to convince people online of anything is a waste of time

I'm going to do just that ... sit down and write someone that cares a letter.

You should be a teacher August

Wait a minute ... you are a teacher

[mookiemookie]

Originally Posted by Neal Stevens

I'm just wondering, is there a difference between a program that you pay into and are supposed to receive benefits; and a program that you receive benefits without making any contributions?

If you pay any kind of taxes at all - payroll, SS, medicare, state, local, excise taxes, sales taxes, property taxes, income taxes - you're making contributions to those programs.

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by mookiemookie

If you pay any kind of taxes at all - payroll, SS, medicare, state, local, excise taxes, sales taxes, property taxes, income taxes - you're making contributions to those programs.

And you are entitled to receive a return of services or monetary compensation.

[August]

Originally Posted by mookiemookie

If you pay any kind of taxes at all - payroll, SS, medicare, state, local, excise taxes, sales taxes, property taxes, income taxes - you're making contributions to those programs.

Yeah but only Social Security is funded by a tax created for that specific purpose.

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by August

Did you bother to write your congress critters and complain? Letter to the editor of your local newspaper? Do anything but roll over and take it?

Our system only works when we let our elected officials know our minds in no uncertain terms. Maybe they'll ignore it but your opinion still has to be made known to them and in no uncertain terms or else they'll figure you agree with their direction and ram it to you even more.

I wrote my Congressman once. I was told they are "looking into it". I also caught our county executive in a lie. Our creek has high ecoli content. After "five years" of "study" it was determined the neighborhoods surrounding the creek has dog crap run off that is the cause for high ecoli content in the creek. In the meantime the county quietly repaired the cities main crap pipe that was cracked and feeding a tributary to the the creek for years. Not to mention the crap pump station that overflows crap when it rains. The pump station is just yards from the creek. You know what the country answer was for the "doggie crap" run off? Crap collection bags and a trash can. The real answer was the city crap pipe spilling gallons of raw sewerage in to the creek. The creek feeds the Chesapeake Bay. Does the county want that plastered all over the newspapers? Not really. Blame it on Fido.


I can go into detail on a certain road in Stewartstown PA that was fought tooth and nail but the citizens lost the battle because the road was more convenient for the city offical who's house just happened to be at the end of the newly opened road.


In short, I have little faith in our government. Letters are nice. They get things off your chest. IMO not much more.

[August]

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

In short, I have little faith in our government. Letters are nice. They get things off your chest. IMO not much more.

A lack of faith does not justify giving up and writing one single letter to one congressman is not a serious effort. It takes many letters to officials and the media, speaking up at town meetings, complaints to state ethics boards, in other words being a general pain in the butt (and this is the important part) being one that won't go away.

Those are the tactics that can and do bring results.

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by August

A lack of faith does not justify giving up and writing one single letter to one congressman is not a serious effort. It takes many letters to officials and the media, speaking up at town meetings, complaints to state ethics boards, in other words being a general pain in the butt (and this is the important part) being one that won't go away.

Those are the tactics that can and do bring results.

is not a serious effort.

Sorry dad.

It takes many letters to officials

It should only take one letter. Period

in other words being a general pain in the butt

This should never be necessary. Pandering to be heard is nonsense. The last time I checked the elected officals work for the citizens. Unfortunately the self-serving elected officials believe it is the other way around.

I still have little faith.