Missed..again

[ghostdave]

Now that I'd love to see... maybe with little shark faces sceaming 'loser'... or maybe not... the flattening of spirits as yet another 'perfect' broadside completely fails if enough I reckon.

Thats the first post done, now where are those mods

[BillBam]

To see if it is a dud problem uncheck DUD Torpedoes in your game settings before starting. If you star getting hits this way you have your answer.

[Gangrene]

It could be any number of things...

1. Are you getting "torpedo missed" or "dud torpedoes'?

Without a recording... any number of things could be happening. If you are a beginner turn the realism way down so you can watch the torpedoes and that should help you figure out the problem.

It could be that you are being spotted and the ship is using evasive maneuvers. If the ship is changing speed and turning not following a straight path it doesn't matter if you have a "green pointer" you're still likely to miss at any distance or speed. If that is the case close for a shot at 600m or less. I use the german Uboats so I set the torpedo to fast so they have even less time to evade.

You could be firing at too far a range, too steep an angle, etc., etc., etc...

I pilot german submarines... but I typically set the depth one meter below the bottom of the ship unless it is a TIII Tanker, which I set the depth at 11.5. I also set the torpedo to magnetic detonation. IMO, there are a lot of advantages to the this method.

[Ewall007]

Hi, I started playing SH4 about 2 years ago and had the same problem. Couldn't hit an island with a full torp spread! Now I'm almost ready for trying out manual targeting in the game.

Here is what I do using auto targeting.

1. When lining up any ship try to get a bow angle of no less than 40 degrees on the ship that your trying to sink. Reason being the more toward 90 degrees or (what is called crossing the T) the less chance the torp will deflect off the hull (good when using early torps 1941 and 1942 type).

2. Close with in a good firing range; Even though your using automatic targeting I sitll use the Sonar to TDC range reason being that Radar doesn't pick up most targets untill your at around 12 to 10 miles. If you ping at 3 minute time space you can get a rough estmate of there speed, and you will have the range also. (1st ping write down the range, wait 3 minutes, 2nd ping write down the range, subtract 1st ping from 2nd ping and you end up with the distance the target travled in that 3 minute time.) There is a map mod that has a time, speed, and distance calaculator I use to get there rough speed. I found that all parts of the ocean have what is called a thermal layer, you can use that to run at FULL or even FLANK speed to close the range. The when your within say 2000 to 1500 yards pop up to 60 feet and fire your torp.

3. Alway open the doors first the time lag will throw you shoot off.

4. Check that the torp your firing speed is set to fast. I use both fues depending on the range and type of ship I'm trying to sink.

5. When trying to sink 2 ships at almost the same time fire on the one that is second (or farther in distance) you can use that extra time to line up on the closer ship. When your torps hit the first ship the second ship will not have the time to turn away from you shot (your torps are already on the way)

In Closing; Remember AoB (Angle of Bow) is the most important aspect of you firing soultion. Then its distance, to get in close you use stelth. Open the doors early so not to forget. Once you have knock down some ships you can start messing with spread and time lag.

Hope this helps

Ewall007

[Julie Whitefeather]

Thank you for your kind advice. I am still learning the game...and even the game is getting better with the help of all those here.

Julie

[Diopos]

Originally Posted by Ewall007

...
2. Close with in a good firing range; Even though your using automatic targeting I sitll use the Sonar to TDC range reason being that Radar doesn't pick up most targets untill your at around 12 to 10 miles. If you ping at 3 minute time space you can get a rough estmate of there speed, and you will have the range also. (1st ping write down the range, wait 3 minutes, 2nd ping write down the range, subtract 1st ping from 2nd ping and you end up with the distance the target travled in that 3 minute time.) ...

Ewall007

1. Nope, subtracting 1st and 2nd ping range from the target is not equal to the distance the target traveled in the interim.
2. You radar should start to pick targets at ~35km (~18 miles). What version are you using?

.

[TorpX]

Originally Posted by Ewall007

Here is what I do using auto targeting.

1. When lining up any ship try to get a bow angle of no less than 40 degrees on the ship that your trying to sink. Reason being the more toward 90 degrees or (what is called crossing the T) the less chance the torp will deflect off the hull (good when using early torps 1941 and 1942 type).

This isn't correct. The U.S.N. torpedos were more likely to fail with impact angles near 90 degrees. The greater impact force tended to bend guide pins causing the firing pin to miss the detonator. German torpedos had the opposite problem; sharper angles tended to result in failures.

[denny927]

Originally Posted by Ewall007

2. Close with in a good firing range; Even though your using automatic targeting I sitll use the Sonar to TDC range reason being that Radar doesn't pick up most targets untill your at around 12 to 10 miles. If you ping at 3 minute time space you can get a rough estmate of there speed, and you will have the range also. (1st ping write down the range, wait 3 minutes, 2nd ping write down the range, subtract 1st ping from 2nd ping and you end up with the distance the target travled in that 3 minute time.) There is a map mod that has a time, speed, and distance calaculator I use to get there rough speed. I found that all parts of the ocean have what is called a thermal layer, you can use that to run at FULL or even FLANK speed to close the range. The when your within say 2000 to 1500 yards pop up to 60 feet and fire your torp.




Ewall007

i think is better avoid tips like this for a beginner like Julie, sonar and radar for the moment is useless, maybe you want scary Julie right?

I dont understand if Julie use the auto targeting, how is possible missing a ship...maybe that AutoTargeting can miss one ship, but not more than two in a row, or those destroyers accelarate like dragsters?
I used the AT in the beginning of my patrols and is very boring, since for the fact is a point and shoot system, with a 99% torpedo impact without a minimum of fun and human tactics....but wait, is a good tool for a beginner, but dont abuse, switch sometimes from AT to MT(i dont talk about cars), and have fun, choose your maps contacts on like Torpx just said, and like I use too

is very hard from here found a definitive solution for you, only I can say that a lot of tutorial and a great support is here, so have a good hunting and dont desperate

sorry if I say something wrong

[Harmsway!]

Hello Julie, I'm a long time sub simmer with many years of manual targeting. But I've been away from it for almost a year and last night was my first sighting after days of game play hunting. I fired three torps one at a time and all of them missed. I'm so frustrated I will have to re-set up my attack. And that brings me to my point.

The step you didn't mention and may be what you're missing is setting up the attack. Whether you are manual targeting or using Auto you should get in the habit of setting up properly. This is done before you mess with the TDC, triangles or firing solutions either manual or auto. To set up the first thing that comes after a ship spotting is determining its course. From there determine its speed either from ship ID or stop watch method. Then you adjust your own course to intercept. Try to intercept so your course is perpendicular to the enemy course. Otherwise you may find that just being in range of the target gets you a firing solution for the aft torpedoes when you didn't plan it that way.

As you will learn charting skills are just as important as firing solutions. In my case since I missed my target I will have to spend a few hours running out ahead of him while keeping out of sight. Then reset my position to lay in wait. If by chance he spots me he will change his course. Then all bets are off. It will be hours until he returns to his original course again.

It sounds like you are already using auto targeting. That is good because knowing his course, your own course and his bearing is enough to wrap your head around for now.

[Harmsway!]

Originally Posted by Julie Whitefeather

The odd thing that happened late this evening is I had a merchant ship at 10 degrees off the starboard bow. I stopped dead in the water. I was an automatic firing. Then the odd thing happened.

The triangle would only light up for the aft torpedo and not the forward torpedo that were facing the merchant ship.

And this time I knew to open all the torpedo doors.

Thanks.

Well...at least I'm not as bad as the captain of the U.S.S. William D. Perry.

Let's talk about this for a moment and pretend that the two of you are traveling on the same course. Unless he is directly behind you he (target) would be on a parallel course. Like the rails on a train track. The target on one rail and you traveling on the other. Now let say you wait for him to catch up and lay along your left side of your position. At this point if you fire out the bow the torpedo would have to make a sharp turn, 90 degrees in fact to hit the target. That would be outside the turning range of the torpedo and the firing solution would not allow it.

You could of course angle the bow of your boat facing him enough to allow for a firing solution. This causes the torp to head straight out a little then make a sharp turn to hit the target. Even when these solutions are possible they greatly diminish the possibility of a hit. Straight on shots (your course 90 degrees to his course) to small angle shots have the best chance of success.

In your case the firing solution aft was possible. It may need to take a sharp turn but it was possible. Also if you select an aft tube to be ready it will try to set up a solution for it.

Therefore I set up a course 90 degrees to target course while I'm waiting. I then fire when his bearing is a few degrees before zero, at zero (dead ahead) and a few degrees past zero. This is a broadside hit. Of course with auto targeting the green triangle indicator will be ready long before this. Just because the shot is possible doesn't mean it is the best shot. Wait for it. Even with the target locked, wait for the broadside shot.

One last thing. The targeting computer will take into account not only the target speed but your sub speed and come up with a solution. However if your sub is still moving it complicates the solution enough to lesson your chance of a hit. So your best chance is to lie in wait with little to no speed of your own. Another reason why setting up is so important. You want to be there long before he is.

[TorpX]

Originally Posted by Harmsway!

In your case the firing solution aft was possible. It may need to take a sharp turn but it was possible. Also if you select an aft tube to be ready it will try to set up a solution for it.

This is what I was thinking.

It is possible to have a target 10 deg. off the bow and have a solution for the stern tubes, if the target is close and moving rapidly past you. But, as you said, the TDC will compute a solution for the tubes selected, without regard as to the quality/efficacy of the solution.

[VonGlaus]

Originally Posted by I'm goin' down

Learning how to hit a target is like dance class in elementary school. Your brothers and sisters did it, so did your parents. and now it is your turn. It is a right of passage. Once you hit the target, you won't look back.

Now that is worthy of a sig line...

[Ewall007]

Originally Posted by TorpX

This isn't correct. The U.S.N. torpedos were more likely to fail with impact angles near 90 degrees. The greater impact force tended to bend guide pins causing the firing pin to miss the detonator. German torpedos had the opposite problem; sharper angles tended to result in failures.

I was not quoting history, just game play. I have found in the game that if you shot a dud it happens (to me) at 45 degree angles on both sides of the 90 degrees port or starbord. I'm not saying that your wrong about the U.S.N. torpedos I totaly aggree with you on the breaking of firing pins at 90 degrees. I just have, to this point never seen a 85 to 90 degree shot go bad for me. Of couse I using automatic targeting too.

I'm having issues with understanding manual targeting so I have not got up the guts to try it in a game. (and that's why I'm here)

I didn't mean to give out faulse information either, I still learing a lot about SH4.

Ewall007

[Ewall007]

Originally Posted by Diopos

1. Nope, subtracting 1st and 2nd ping range from the target is not equal to the distance the target traveled in the interim.
2. You radar should start to pick targets at ~35km (~18 miles). What version are you using?

.

Your right there will always be an interim doing it that way, but on the other hand I have got really good rough estimates real quick that were not that far off when your auto targeting anyway. I have read the proper way to find the speed of your target using the map. I was just trying to give a little tips on auto targeting to knock down some of the varables that might be causing her problems.

As for the version I have 2 running now:
1. SH4 patched to v1.4 with the OTC for v1.4
2. SH4 Patched to v1.5 with the OTC for v1.5 (just got that running tonight)

As for the radar; I will have to recheck to see if I'm getting what you are saying I should get! The radar was changed by the OTC setup so it is different from the stock game I've been use to playing. In fact I downloaded that mod so I could start learing how to do manual targeting but I'm having problems.

Ewall007

Adding; I just checked the radar range in the game I'm running on SH4 v1.5 OTC I'm getting (in good weather) around 15 miles, and in bad weather 10 to 12 miles.

[Bubblehead1980]

Sounds like your speed calculation may be off or failing to open the tubes before hand.Also, try aiming one fish at the center, one at the forward mast, one at the aft mast.