Features in SH1 and Aces That Have Since "Disappeared"

[JScones]

Originally Posted by Nisgeis

Having a quick look at their site, it seems they were the ones responsible for SH2 as well, so past performance is no guarantee of future success.

Not quite. They started SH2, they didn't finish it. Development was taken over by Ultimation and they "completed" it - with "completed" being the debatable word (ie completed, or rewrote). You won't find Aeon in the game's credits (the credits exclusively list Ultimation as the developer and Ubisoft as the Publisher).

[AOTD_MadMax]

SH5 is an Grafikdemonstration, nothing else.

All important contents of an nice subsim are missed in the ocean of nowhere.
I stopped modding on sh5 cause this game should not be finished by the modders.
It has to be done by the devs and Ubi !

Why are the contents of the early subsimgames like Aces of the Deep and SH1 are missed in modern subsims like SH3, SH4 and SH5 ?

Its not an result of an poor Budget............................
Regards

Maddy

[Sonarman]

Originally Posted by JScones

You won't find Aeon in the game's credits (the credits exclusively list Ultimation as the developer and Ubisoft as the Publisher).

The credits do list Kim Biscoe who was the lead artist at Aeon along with other intersting people in the business like Larry Bond (Harpoon) & Matt Wagner (DCS Black Shark). But you are right (sadly?) Ultimation pretty much junked the original Aeon project and started anew with the nasty "Janus" Panzer Commander/Destroyer Command engine.

Kim Biscoe has a long involvement with naval games on the PC right back to Microprose check out some of his projects here

It would be interesting to see what our talented modders could do today if DC & SH2 were open sourced, they must be nearing the end of their commercial lifespan even at budget by now.

[Subnuts]

Allow me to belabor my point and explain to the youngins out there what some reasons why the original Silent Hunter so brilliant.


Bet you haven't seen anything like this in a while. Nothing remarkable, but wait - the variables in each of those 11 boxes could be changed. The quick mission creator was a powerful thing - one could change the date, crew and enemy experience, the weather, time of day, and enemy formation size, there were 10 boats to choose from, warship, ASW patrol, and submarine encounters, and lifeguard and photo recon missions. You didn't have to start a new campaign or muddle with the mission editor if you just wanted to sink a few ships.


Just take a gander at those gauges. On a 17-inch monitor, they were probably twice as big as what you're currently seeing. They weren't half an inch wide and hiding in the corner, they were right in your face and you knew what they were reading.


The Torpedo Data Computer screen. No background attack map here - it's all business. Everything is laid out nicely and easy to understand. You don't need to drag dials around until they're at the right setting - just click and you're done. Even if you're running in Automatic, you still get an idiot-proof indication of target range, speed, bearing, and course, the accuracy of the current solution, how long the torpedo has to run, and you can set spread angle and torpedo depth without having to re-input new settings into each tube.


A long time ago, someone actually made a subsim with a radar station that didn't require a manual to decipher, and actually worked in a reasonably accurate manner. One can instantly get the range and bearing to a target, the search mode is obvious, and the functions of the air and surface search radars don't overlap. Even if you've never played the original Silent Hunter, you can probably tell me what everything in this screen shot indicates with reasonable accuracy.


Many of the screens in Silent Hunter had multiple functionalities. Here we see the periscope showing position keeper data and the torpedo firing controls. Again, notice the readability of the gauges and the efficiency of the interface.


Here it is again, showing the maneuvering controls.



Finally, the same screen with the recognition manual open. Right away I know the target's displacement, maximum speed, what it looks like at different AOBs, what kind of weapons she'll open up on me if I get to close, and how deep I should set my torpedoes to run at. Also, I can click on the side tabs rather than clicking through each ship individually.

Feel free to gouge your eyeballs out now due the poor quality of the graphics.

[Schroeder]

The graphics were awesome for the time and I played SH1 for almost a decade (I shelfed SHII after a few months).
BTW the game worked out of the box. No patching required to enjoy it.

[Sonarman]

The ships of Silent Hunter were very much an evolution of those found in Silent Service II and the Great Naval Battles series as they were all the work of the same artist the aforementioned Kim Biscoe.

Makes you wonder what those guys could accomplish today given the much higher resolutions etc. That the original SH interface and ships still look pretty good even today and still warrant our praise is a testament to Kim's brilliant artistic talents. What a shame, given his amazing background that he is not using them for creating naval games any more...

[Takeda Shingen]

Oh, no doubt: Silent Hunter was and is magnificent. Whoever picks up the ball and develops submarine simulations in the future would do well to spend a few months playing it.

[sergei]

Originally Posted by Subnuts

Allow me to belabor my point and explain to the youngins out there what some reasons why the original Silent Hunter so brilliant.

WOW!

Lot's of thought went into making sure that UI was crystal clear and easy to use.

Looking at this set of pictures provides an object lesson in game GUI design.

By all means modern game designers, make your GUIs look pretty.
But please DO NOT forget that its main purpose is not to look pretty, but to provide easily accessible functionality.

[Takeda Shingen]

I remember when everyone was sitting around waiting for SH2 (and waiting, and waiting, and waiting some more) thinking that we were going to get the original with upgraded graphics. Boy were we excited. Boy were we wrong. We got the upgraded graphics all right, but the rest couldn't hold a candle to Silent Hunter.

[Sonarman]

Yes, Ultimation's stumbling block in both SH2 & DC was poor AI also apparent in their previous release "Panzer Commander". It's a shame that they didn't take the Aeon Programming staff onboard along with the art dept as in truth they were much better at coding the AI than the Ultimation guys. Ultimately the final DC & SH2 releases show that had their hearts in the right place but just couldn't come through with the goods at the end of the day.

I also think SSI pushed the games out of the door much too soon. I remember at the time of launch an Ultimation dev posting at one point the game would be out in "about four months time" literally within hours his wrist was slapped by SSI, an angry post was made here by an SSI producer trashing the Ultimation posting and the games were on the shelves about two weeks later in a total state. SSI was at the time in transition from the Learning company/ Mattel to Ubisoft and no doubt wanted to show a nice profit graph to their new bosses at both our expense and ultimately (sadly) the reputation and future of Ultimation.

It would be nice in a perfect world if Ubisoft would release the SH2 + DC code as open source as a final thank you to the community for all of the fixes & features our modders have freely done for their products over the years and in recognition of the help & advice Neal has freely given them. No doubt the many, many mods created for the game have swung many potential purchasers to the series and doubtless extended the product lifecycle considerably, generating many extra sales for Ubisoft. These games must now be reaching end of life even at budget price and with some work on the code could yet acheive their full potential particularly as they are the only games in the series to feature fully operable destroyer vs sub multiplayer capability. A gesture such as this could go along way to repairing the rift between the publisher & the community caused by the implementation of the new DRM system & the unfinished state of SH5.

[Subnuts]

I'm going to shamelessly bump this thread just so the Eye Candie Queens can read it.

Gameplay > Graphics.

[goldorak]

Originally Posted by Subnuts

I'm going to shamelessly bump this thread just so the Eye Candie Queens can read it.

Gameplay > Graphics.

You should have also posted images/scans from the SH I manual.
It was not very thick but boy did it deliver. The section dedicated to the geometry of torpedo firing was excellent. But these days the target demographic for these games is pre-school boys.
They wouldn't know a cos from a sin if it hit them hard on the forehead.

[goldorak]

Originally Posted by Platapus

Not really. In theory there is a work through to play SH1 on Windows XP, but I have not have much luck with it.

Then you are doing something wrong.
SH I installs completely and plays beautifully on dos box. No problems at all. Same thing with Sierra Fast Attack, another dos-era game.
Its runs full speed, graphics and audio.

Really dosbox is a godsend when trying to revive old dos games.
And its infinitely simpler than trying to get a real dos pc up and running.

[DavyJonesFootlocker]

Yes in those days I actually hit ships with torps. It's a pity they couldn't have included those fine features.

[John Channing]

Originally Posted by Subnuts

I'm going to shamelessly bump this thread just so the Eye Candie Queens can read it.

Gameplay > Graphics.

And you can be assured they speak highly of you, too.

Open-mindedness > Childishness

JCC