Mark 27 Cutie Torpedo

Thrair · 10-09-10, 10:22 PM

I've begun to play later in the war than I did before. One benefit of these is access to more equipment. Noticing the Cutie, I decided to do a few tests with it.

First thing I noticed is it's actually got quite decent homing abilities.
Second thing I noticed is that it's a snail.

Indeed, while the description states it was intended for self-defence against ASW, I've found it's actually more useful when attacking convoys.

I aim the cutie at a large ship in the convoy as I would a normal torpedo, then dive to avoid detection (aided by the cuties being electric and not giving your position away as readily).
Frequently, the cutie will blow the prop/rudder off the target vessel, leaving it dead in the water, which allows you to finish off the crippled vessel with mark 14s once the escorts leave.

However, I cannot get it to be of use against destroyers that are actively hunting me. My initial plan was to load cuties in the aft tubes and launch them at chasing destroyers if I couldn't escape them, but the cuties just don't move fast enough to catch them in most cases. This is rather disappointing, as a standard "oh crap" spread of Mk 14s is a better option for self-defense.

Anyone have any suggestions on it's use? Again, I've found them moderately useful for disabling large ships in a convoy, but can't really find much use for them aside from that.

NorthBeach · 10-09-10, 10:31 PM

When we return from a successful patrol, I have the XO crack open a few cases of beer for the crew. There are a bunch of pallets of Cuties over by Building C that the guys use to set their beers on while they're tossing around a baseball. That's a good use for them.

On board, they'd take up space that a torpedo that could sink something could use.

Armistead · 10-09-10, 11:24 PM

Depends, they work and are somewhat overpowered in stock. With mods like TMO...as stated, make good beer crates. The only use in TMO is sometimes if you have a damaged ship you need to slow down is to use them why you evade.

They run about 12 kts. In stock really better to use them on escorts before your spotted why they're running slow, may atleast slow them down. Try to run them below the keel for more damage.

Do be careful, they can home in on you. Sometimes if they're off track, you can get them to home in on you and you can steer them towards the enemy, stop engines and dive deeper, they'll go right over and hopefully home in on the enemy.

The only time I carry them is late war in the shallows of the Formosa. Some big convoys, but protected by Type AB's, pure suicide to get trapped by those in shallow water. I once shot 10 at a convoy in 70ft of water from 4000 yards and ran...they did some damage, but pulled the escorts way off and I got my real attack off.

NorthBeach · 10-10-10, 02:23 AM

Armistead- You loaded up your boat with 10?

Wait, you were goofin' on a save, weren't you!

For a while, I would carry a couple, jic. When forced, you can get the right set up so that two will isolate a single target. But, the tonnage per tube payoff just isn't there. WAY more times than not they would still be on board when I would finish a patrol. Now, just beer coasters.

WernherVonTrapp · 10-10-10, 07:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NorthBeach

Armistead- You loaded up your boat with 10?

Wait, you were goofin' on a save, weren't you!

For a while, I would carry a couple, jic. When forced, you can get the right set up so that two will isolate a single target. But, the tonnage per tube payoff just isn't there. WAY more times than not they would still be on board when I would finish a patrol. Now, just beer coasters.

Hey, I loaded my boat up with a half dozen of them. Of course, we removed the warheads and now use them as bar stools for the officers mess. The remaining explosives from the warheads were packed into extra life vests that the requisition officer applied for. We then removed the blow tubes on the vests and replaced them with waterproof fuses and that's what we toss to the Imperial Survivors before speeding off to the distant sounds of dull thuds.

torpedobait · 10-10-10, 08:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WernherVonTrapp

Hey, I loaded my boat up with a half dozen of them. Of course, we removed the warheads and now use them as bar stools for the officers mess. The remaining explosives from the warheads were packed into extra life vests that the requisition officer applied for. We then removed the blow tubes on the vests and replaced them with waterproof fuses and that's what we toss to the Imperial Survivors before speeding off to the distant sounds of dull thuds.

I met an ex-Marine (if there is such a thing as an "Ex" Marine), who told me a story of shark hunting in a lagoon. They took raw meat from the galley, wrapped it around a grenade, and attached a wire leader to the grenade's safety pin. Once the shark took the bait he said they just pulled the pin with the wire and waited for the lever to release as the shark chewed or just swallowed...sometimes it took hours for a mystery "boom" and a newly dead shark to float up.

Armistead · 10-10-10, 08:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NorthBeach

Armistead- You loaded up your boat with 10?

Wait, you were goofin' on a save, weren't you!

For a while, I would carry a couple, jic. When forced, you can get the right set up so that two will isolate a single target. But, the tonnage per tube payoff just isn't there. WAY more times than not they would still be on board when I would finish a patrol. Now, just beer coasters.

More or less, late 44-45, large jp convoys run right off the coast in about 70ft of water in Formosa....Decided to have some fun with them and maybe.....live.

NorthBeach · 10-10-10, 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WernherVonTrapp

Hey, I loaded my boat up with a half dozen of them. Of course, we removed the warheads and now use them as bar stools for the officers mess. The remaining explosives from the warheads were packed into extra life vests that the requisition officer applied for. We then removed the blow tubes on the vests and replaced them with waterproof fuses and that's what we toss to the Imperial Survivors before speeding off to the distant sounds of dull thuds.

Gives new meaning to, "Thar she blows"!

Armistead- Creativity points to you, sir. I'm on my way up there for the umteenth time, after making reefs out of Nishimura's Fusos in the Surigao Strait during the wee hours of 24 Oct (the trick being to get to them far enough south, before Oldendorf's BBs get to them). Also manged to sink one of the CAs and the CL. There's a convoy that scoots south out of Formosa in a couple of days that I may try to intercept. If I do, I'll have to refit before going into the Strait. But, I won't be loading up with Cuties...

Armistead · 10-10-10, 04:38 PM

Oldendorf's BBs, the old gals from Pearl..Yep, clobbers them, but I try to time that one to strike after he leaves them dead in the water, save torps..

Have you tried attacking the northern carrier force instead. Time it right you can watch Halsey's planes attack, just be in the mix, cuz it don't take long.

Bubblehead1980 · 10-10-10, 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Armistead

More or less, late 44-45, large jp convoys run right off the coast in about 70ft of water in Formosa....Decided to have some fun with them and maybe.....live.

Thats why IJN radar effective range should be lowered, so can pull off surface torpedo attacks in later war if diving isnt an option as they could in RL.Now the IJN radar didnt have the best range but also did not have a PPI scope so often couldnt tell if the contact which was a sub was actually an intruder or one of the other ships.Also, subs were not easy to pick up on radar.Lowering their effective range to say 4,000 or 3500-3800 yards would be a fair trade off, you could get withing torpedo range but not too close,

To me its very ahistorical to not be able to pull off a night surface attack in later war because escorts have radar, they did it plenty in RL.

NorthBeach · 10-10-10, 04:57 PM

The closest I've gotten is on the fringe. What little I caught was fun to watch. I've had all of the involved race by me, out of range, several times. And once, I sailed with Halsey's TF when he was on the way. But, broke off before realizing where he was going.

I have the time and place plotted, now. So, I'll try and get into the mix at some time in the future. I also would like to try and catch Kurita's TF as it makes its way east, before he gets to SB Strait. Have you been there to see his loop back? The way the game renders, I can only imagine it's a Keystone-Kop drill waiting for a Fleet Boat to take shots.

tater · 10-11-10, 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bubblehead1980

Thats why IJN radar effective range should be lowered, so can pull off surface torpedo attacks in later war if diving isnt an option as they could in RL.Now the IJN radar didnt have the best range but also did not have a PPI scope so often couldnt tell if the contact which was a sub was actually an intruder or one of the other ships.Also, subs were not easy to pick up on radar.Lowering their effective range to say 4,000 or 3500-3800 yards would be a fair trade off, you could get withing torpedo range but not too close,

To me its very ahistorical to not be able to pull off a night surface attack in later war because escorts have radar, they did it plenty in RL.

The surface search radar is the Type 22.

Make a modlet with just the AI_sensors in it, and mess with the surface factor, perhaps. Not hard with s3d, and then YOU can be part of the solution. What is the major PITA is all the TESTING. Making the changes is trivial.

Armistead · 10-11-10, 01:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bubblehead1980

Thats why IJN radar effective range should be lowered, so can pull off surface torpedo attacks in later war if diving isnt an option as they could in RL.Now the IJN radar didnt have the best range but also did not have a PPI scope so often couldnt tell if the contact which was a sub was actually an intruder or one of the other ships.Also, subs were not easy to pick up on radar.Lowering their effective range to say 4,000 or 3500-3800 yards would be a fair trade off, you could get withing torpedo range but not too close,

To me its very ahistorical to not be able to pull off a night surface attack in later war because escorts have radar, they did it plenty in RL.

No one replied to my thread on radar, but I wonder if their radar can pick you up decks awash. With a Gato in calm waters at 28 ft engines will engage, not as fast, but least your faster than dived and charging. I also wonder if like sonar if angle matters with radar. I also wonder how good and what distance they pick up your radar. Sometimes it's hard to know if they're chasing your radar transmissions or have you on radar. Do you know if picking up your transmission is directional. Either way they come right at you. I know they got me early 42 from 7nms, night with light fog.
Get's a little old seeing them come to your position from that far like you have a light on.

tater · 10-11-10, 02:13 PM

The type 22 in TMO has a range of 8000, and a min surface of 1.5m^2.'

Aha.

In TMO, ALL the radars have a minheight of zero. By far the most common IJN radar is the Type 13, and it is longer ranged than the 22. The thing is that the Type 13 is ONLY air search radar. The 21 is DP.

RFB properly sets the min height on the type 13 at 500 (or any height greater than a ship). The 21 should probably be set lower in RFB, but higher than the 0 in TMO. Maybe 5-7m so that there is a chance at detecting a surfaced sub (area will still be small, so detection hopefully unlikely).

Set this on the type 13 and 21 and things will improve a great deal.

tater · 10-11-10, 02:40 PM

BTW, I have no idea about stock (and don't particularly care, so I won't be waiting for TMO to unload and reload to tell you). I'll leave fixing stock as an exercise for the reader. It was broken in 1.4, though (type 13 working vs ships/subs), so it is likely broken in 1.5, too.

10-09-10, 10:22 PM	#1
Thrair Helmsman Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 102 Downloads: 16 Uploads: 0	Mark 27 Cutie Torpedo I've begun to play later in the war than I did before. One benefit of these is access to more equipment. Noticing the Cutie, I decided to do a few tests with it. First thing I noticed is it's actually got quite decent homing abilities. Second thing I noticed is that it's a snail. Indeed, while the description states it was intended for self-defence against ASW, I've found it's actually more useful when attacking convoys. I aim the cutie at a large ship in the convoy as I would a normal torpedo, then dive to avoid detection (aided by the cuties being electric and not giving your position away as readily). Frequently, the cutie will blow the prop/rudder off the target vessel, leaving it dead in the water, which allows you to finish off the crippled vessel with mark 14s once the escorts leave. However, I cannot get it to be of use against destroyers that are actively hunting me. My initial plan was to load cuties in the aft tubes and launch them at chasing destroyers if I couldn't escape them, but the cuties just don't move fast enough to catch them in most cases. This is rather disappointing, as a standard "oh crap" spread of Mk 14s is a better option for self-defense. Anyone have any suggestions on it's use? Again, I've found them moderately useful for disabling large ships in a convoy, but can't really find much use for them aside from that.

10-09-10, 10:31 PM	#2
NorthBeach Torpedoman Join Date: May 2008 Location: San Francisco Posts: 112 Downloads: 216 Uploads: 0	When we return from a successful patrol, I have the XO crack open a few cases of beer for the crew. There are a bunch of pallets of Cuties over by Building C that the guys use to set their beers on while they're tossing around a baseball. That's a good use for them. On board, they'd take up space that a torpedo that could sink something could use.

10-09-10, 11:24 PM	#3
Armistead Rear Admiral Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: on the Dan Posts: 10,880 Downloads: 364 Uploads: 0	Depends, they work and are somewhat overpowered in stock. With mods like TMO...as stated, make good beer crates. The only use in TMO is sometimes if you have a damaged ship you need to slow down is to use them why you evade. They run about 12 kts. In stock really better to use them on escorts before your spotted why they're running slow, may atleast slow them down. Try to run them below the keel for more damage. Do be careful, they can home in on you. Sometimes if they're off track, you can get them to home in on you and you can steer them towards the enemy, stop engines and dive deeper, they'll go right over and hopefully home in on the enemy. The only time I carry them is late war in the shallows of the Formosa. Some big convoys, but protected by Type AB's, pure suicide to get trapped by those in shallow water. I once shot 10 at a convoy in 70ft of water from 4000 yards and ran...they did some damage, but pulled the escorts way off and I got my real attack off.

10-10-10, 02:23 AM	#4
NorthBeach Torpedoman Join Date: May 2008 Location: San Francisco Posts: 112 Downloads: 216 Uploads: 0	Armistead- You loaded up your boat with 10? Wait, you were goofin' on a save, weren't you! For a while, I would carry a couple, jic. When forced, you can get the right set up so that two will isolate a single target. But, the tonnage per tube payoff just isn't there. WAY more times than not they would still be on board when I would finish a patrol. Now, just beer coasters.

10-10-10, 04:38 PM	#9
Armistead Rear Admiral Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: on the Dan Posts: 10,880 Downloads: 364 Uploads: 0	Oldendorf's BBs, the old gals from Pearl..Yep, clobbers them, but I try to time that one to strike after he leaves them dead in the water, save torps.. Have you tried attacking the northern carrier force instead. Time it right you can watch Halsey's planes attack, just be in the mix, cuz it don't take long.

10-10-10, 04:57 PM	#11
NorthBeach Torpedoman Join Date: May 2008 Location: San Francisco Posts: 112 Downloads: 216 Uploads: 0	The closest I've gotten is on the fringe. What little I caught was fun to watch. I've had all of the involved race by me, out of range, several times. And once, I sailed with Halsey's TF when he was on the way. But, broke off before realizing where he was going. I have the time and place plotted, now. So, I'll try and get into the mix at some time in the future. I also would like to try and catch Kurita's TF as it makes its way east, before he gets to SB Strait. Have you been there to see his loop back? The way the game renders, I can only imagine it's a Keystone-Kop drill waiting for a Fleet Boat to take shots.

10-11-10, 02:13 PM	#14
tater Navy Seal Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: New Mexico, USA Posts: 9,023 Downloads: 8 Uploads: 2	The type 22 in TMO has a range of 8000, and a min surface of 1.5m^2.' Aha. In TMO, ALL the radars have a minheight of zero. By far the most common IJN radar is the Type 13, and it is longer ranged than the 22. The thing is that the Type 13 is ONLY air search radar. The 21 is DP. RFB properly sets the min height on the type 13 at 500 (or any height greater than a ship). The 21 should probably be set lower in RFB, but higher than the 0 in TMO. Maybe 5-7m so that there is a chance at detecting a surfaced sub (area will still be small, so detection hopefully unlikely). Set this on the type 13 and 21 and things will improve a great deal.

10-11-10, 02:40 PM	#15
tater Navy Seal Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: New Mexico, USA Posts: 9,023 Downloads: 8 Uploads: 2	BTW, I have no idea about stock (and don't particularly care, so I won't be waiting for TMO to unload and reload to tell you). I'll leave fixing stock as an exercise for the reader. It was broken in 1.4, though (type 13 working vs ships/subs), so it is likely broken in 1.5, too.